CvS2 - Doc B's S-Groove Thread

[eightysix]

Originally posted by topknot
SNIP

Dude, stop beasting with your psychiness. I always gotta fucking trick you into doing your psychic shit. Just stop! :mad: :lol:

And yes, you can C.HP after a dodge. That's AFTER. Not DURING. East Bay S-Groove is too good. :confused: :eek:

[PrAiSeThEwHoRe]

Originally posted by topknot
maybe if you watch me play, you will call me psychic like everyone else :) . if you don't know how to bait people to attack or to play mind games in cvs2. plz quit quickly. s-sagat is a rush down character and you mix in the dodging and charging to throw people off their game. if you are a good player you can make the other person try to poke you so you can punish it really easy. and yes you can c.fp after a dodge, maybe you just too stupid to know how to. let me explain it to you, first thing you do is press down and you hold it. then you press the fierece punch while! holding down! maybe that will help you figure it out. hey do you need me to explain running too? here i'll do it anyways, you tap forward twice and hold on teh 2nd tap. OMG Its so hard.

what are you gonna do to punish a bait with s sagat. were talking about s groove not sagat in general. and no you cannot c.fp after dodge, physically its possible, but practically no. but dont question my poking games of cvs2, because all that your saying about S sagat is wrong. be ignorant.

and mix dodging and charging to throw off their game? whatever man, sagats dodge is worthless. whats there to mix

and your psychic dp's says enuff about your playing

[eightysix]

Man, someone has a huge stick stuck in their ass with the inability to be open to suggestions and take jokes. :confused:

Seriously though, just calm down cuz there's no need to get all worked up over nothing. We're all here to learn, right? And I'm sure you just haven't seen some of the charge/dodge mixups so it's pretty hard to imagine in theory fighter. But come Evo, you're gonna see some crazy shit with S-Groove. :eek:

[Peachy]

S-Sagat

I, for a long time thought he didn't benefit much from S-groove, but it all depends on how you play. S-Sagat is good, basically because it is Sagat, he does gain a little from S groove and if used right it can be good.

His punch dodge attack should only be used on characters that can't duck it. (GREAT! In Sagat vs Sagat matches)

His kick dodge attack is a bit more risky to use, be sure you know the range of it, and if you are rushing down right you should be able to dodge when they stick an attack out and punish with it and cancel into super low tiger shot. (If you have no level I don't reccommend relying on it, unless you feel safe using the regular low tiger shot.)

In critical mode Sagat can pretty hazardous, but it can get you killed as well if you don't know how to use it. Unlimited d.fierces/d.forwards XX super low tiger shot is really good but don't run in with it if you are playing someone who turtles or has someone that has a fast outranging poke. (Cammy's s.roundhouse) Not to mention when he is low on life opponents will come to you, because they are scared of Sagat getting that level 3.

Sagat is just good overall, S gives him some stuff to mix into his game, but he definately benefits from other grooves more. Either way he is good. Just my 2 cents.

[forgenjuro]

Originally posted by PrAiSeThEwHoRe


*snip

i will whole heartly back up topknot's abilities as i have seen him play in person. he knows what hes talking about. im sure Dr b will too. why dont yah have some grudge matches with b and top. they both use sagat (i think). youll see what we're talking about.

[misconceptn]

Originally posted by forgenjuro


i will whole heartly back up topknot's abilities as i have seen him play in person. he knows what hes talking about. im sure Dr b will too. why dont yah have some grudge matches with b and top. they both use sagat (i think). youll see what we're talking about.



Ok well I have had grudges matches and against B and i will say that it can go either way. as far as Top goes.. I don't even know who he is I never seen him play and I yet have seen him place in a tourney any where. I even went to svgl tuesday(last nite) just to play him and he wasnt there.. I should just have stayed @ mgl to play Brandon. But as far as s sagat. peachy does bring a good point, he is a good character but u really shouldn't abuse his dodge much.. It's not very good and can be ducked against small characters.. But when he does have desperate supers he is scary becasue u can rush down with him and attack a lot... Oh yea Peachy Ricky told me u had a pretty good S-chun li so i kinda went back to pick her up.. She dies 2 p tho.. ehh :( .. ANd everyone forgot to add in their list of top s player S eagle, s-kyo and s-rock.. they're all very good in s.. but then against most people only use the top tiers in s groove..hmm

[topknot]

i never said i will be at svgl on tuesday :|
if you wanna play i'll be at tourney this weekend at tilt
word.

[*InVeRs3*]

topknot: i want to play you in the tournament, but i can't make it. i want to play you on p360s , last time those sticks were just blah. I think that W i got against you in the 707 tournament was BS. I have trouble on the sticks (my yama kept jumping straight up point blank range, i was supposed to be cloud super) and so did you. I think the p360s @ NPT will let us play to our fullest.

[misconceptn]

Originally posted by topknot
maybe if you watch me play, you will call me psychic like everyone else :) . if you don't know how to bait people to attack or to play mind games in cvs2. plz quit quickly. s-sagat is a rush down character and you mix in the dodging and charging to throw people off their game. if you are a good player you can make the other person try to poke you so you can punish it really easy. and yes you can c.fp after a dodge, maybe you just too stupid to know how to. let me explain it to you, first thing you do is press down and you hold it. then you press the fierece punch while! holding down! maybe that will help you figure it out. hey do you need me to explain running too? here i'll do it anyways, you tap forward twice and hold on teh 2nd tap. OMG Its so hard.




i CHALLENGE YOU.. I WOULD LOVE TO SEE HOW PSYCHIC YOU ARE.. BUT SINCE I CAN'T MAKE IT TO THE NPT TOURNEY MAYBE I CAN PLAY YOU BEFORE THE TOURNEY IF YOU GO BEST OF 5.. BUT HEY ITS UP 2 U!

[*InVeRs3*]

What do you guys think of S-Joe?


and topknot, read my post up there if you didn't see it.

[topknot]

i accept :)

[misconceptn]

Originally posted by *InVeRs3*
What do you guys think of S-Joe?


and topknot, read my post up there if you didn't see it.



Here are the basic things I think people need 2 remember in order to use S.

1. The dodge attacks.. Are they good or not
2. When they have supers is the supers worth it.
3. charcater(s)..


S joe is a good character but has a lot of hard match ups.. maybe playing him in s groove may make him better or worse but if it comes down to, where he had all lv1 supers would it make him more deadly? I was planning on tryin out joe to see how well he may play, but against p/k i think he has a huge disadvantage.. his supers would be useless and he wouldnt be able to inflict a lot of damage.. his range is ok @ best, But against those 2 grooves i see him having alot of trouble.

[Peachy]

Originally posted by misconceptn
Oh yea Peachy Ricky told me u had a pretty good S-chun li so i kinda went back to pick her up.. She dies 2 p tho.. ehh :( Really? Hrm.. I only picked her that tournament because I couldn't (and still can't) figure out my 3rd character for my team. :( She seems pretty good, maybe I will try to use her more often and see how I do. Yeah, she definately dies against P with LTB up here I kind of know who works against P and who doesn't. Actually P pretty much owns S groove, dodge attacking against P groove is very dangerous. That's a warning to all S groovers out there, a lot of the time you think you can punish a move with a dodge attack, but P groovers parry it almost everytime. (Since you can parry before you can block, it's hard to know when to dodge attack and when to just block)

[misconceptn]

Originally posted by Peachy
Really? Hrm.. I only picked her that tournament because I couldn't (and still can't) figure out my 3rd character for my team. :( She seems pretty good, maybe I will try to use her more often and see how I do. Yeah, she definately dies against P with LTB up here I kind of know who works against P and who doesn't. Actually P pretty much owns S groove, dodge attacking against P groove is very dangerous. That's a warning to all S groovers out there, a lot of the time you think you can punish a move with a dodge attack, but P groovers parry it almost everytime. (Since you can parry before you can block, it's hard to know when to dodge attack and when to just block)

haha yea i have much experience against p n k with s and i dont think p owns s as much as people think.. i honestly think it depends on who u r using and etc.. because i wouldnt use li against p/k ..but she is on my second best team consisting of li/eagle/sagat.. but i love s eagle he saves my life a lot hahha.. lol .. n ur downe? haha should have figured lol neways hope to play u in mwc or evo..

[PrAiSeThEwHoRe]

ok the whole arguement was about top s groove characters.
and peachy was right sagat does benefit a little from s groove.
but not nearly as much as other characters. sagat is a solid character. but that doesnt mean hes a top s groove character.

[Peachy]

He's near the top of the list for S groove characters, but not near the top of the list for characters that benefit most from S groove. (Not like Cammy is :D ) She is one of my favorite characters in S and I seriously can't play her in any other groove. (cause I suck :lol: )

[forgenjuro]

Originally posted by misconceptn




were you that black guy recently that went to svgl who used chun/eagle/sagat team and one like 16 times? that was i think.... tuesday

[misconceptn]

Originally posted by forgenjuro


were you that black guy recently that went to svgl who used chun/eagle/sagat team and one like 16 times? that was i think.... tuesday



yes why? that's my second best or favorite team for s groove so i been trying to pratice them more.. since i feel my best team isnt really fun and should only be used on top tier or high tier players..but i sub chunli out for a few differnt characters and keep eagle and sagat... N yea its been like 4 months since i been able to play @ svgl.. .been workin so much so yea.. ANd you were?

[forgenjuro]

Originally posted by misconceptn

yes why? that's my second best or favorite team for s groove so i been trying to pratice them more.. since i feel my best team isnt really fun and should only be used on top tier or high tier players..but i sub chunli out for a few differnt characters and keep eagle and sagat... N yea its been like 4 months since i been able to play @ svgl.. .been workin so much so yea.. ANd you were?

I dont know if you saw but i was watching you play right behind you. I would have played you but i had to go home and start my school ish. It was amazing because you were messing up on pretty much all or most of your combos and you STILL won like double digit games. next time im there ill be sure to play you:cool: .

[misconceptn]

Originally posted by forgenjuro


I dont know if you saw but i was watching you play right behind you. I would have played you but i had to go home and start my school ish. It was amazing because you were messing up on pretty much all or most of your combos and you STILL won like double digit games. next time im there ill be sure to play you:cool: .


I dont remember anyone behind me... but yea i did mess up pretty bad.. but it also cuz i know how to play matchups.. I'm not a scrub player and i play against top-tiers and high tiers all the time... my defense makes up for my mess ups n if u wanna play me thats fine 2... I just play for the comp..

[AshramTI]

word

[evilmelvin]

ok fellow s-groovers, can you give me some advice? i have a tournement i want to win so i need some help. for my team i use s-sakura or ken/sagatR2/rock. i was wondering who should i use instead, sakura or ken. my skill is about equal with both but i was thinkin s-sakura might have a harder time against tougher opponents, more than an s-ken would. and how should an s-groover fight against a k-sagat,blanka,cammy? k and well p groovers give me a real hard time. cause every time i bait then dodge then dodge attack, instead i eat a parry/jd.

[Dr.B]

I would advize using S- Sakura/Rock/Sag2 or Rock/Sak/Sag2....put Sag on the end he can hella come back....Just keep good charge fake mind games...dont dodge too much just when u need it or to bait an attack. Always keep alpha counters near charged or charged up for A groove Sak/Bison/Blanka or any A groove team for that matter. When fighting K-C/B/S wait for their attack and dodge it to punish with your dodge attack move and or dodge knock down move....just be aware of JD'z and parry. Think out your moves and remember you are using S groove so many peeps instantly that they will win thats your weapon..And half of the time they dont know what the hell you are doing. Good Luck and put the "S" in Wins.

-B.:cool:

[Senor Payaso]

Use Sakura instead of Ken. Ken without a potential super threat (like C-Groove) is a weaker Ken. Ken still has his dodge attack xx lk funky kick but thats about it for guard crush. Sakura has her dodge attack xx fireball/hurricane kick for better pressure. Additionally, Sakura still has more opportunity to get her cr.lk x3 into dragon punch for better damage than Ken. Her dodge knockdown is much faster than Kens and the range of it is very good.

Who is your best character on that team? is it Sagat? If so, you should put him in the back like Brandon says and finish people off with him. If not, give the ratio to Rock, dont waste it on Sagat. Also, be aware of your opportunities to get in while using Rock. There arent many, so putting him at the back of the squad could be detrimental.

Just remember, every dodge you make doesn't constitute a dodge attack or knockdown. When your opponent attempts a cross up, a simple dodge gives you the free throw when they land. Also, for ground dodges against K or P groovers, if you notice them waiting for your dodge attack each time, you can do to dodge fairly close and then trhow them instead, or just not dodge at all. The same weakness for P and K groovers apply to S groovers; if you try to overuse the unique move of the groove, you will get hurt, so dont dodge all the time. The character you choose should be able to fight well even if they don't have the opportunity to dodge. (ie. Sagat)

S-Sakura can beat Cammy pretty well. Bait her st.rh and dodge it for a free knockdown...and if you are in range and dodge, but Cammy doesnt throw the kick out and is walking to you instead, you have time to react with the dodge attack xx mp fireball..dont do the fp fireball because it is not as definite of a connecting attack. cr.fp for anti air from afar and an early st.fp as anti cross up.

Sagat vs Blanka is always Sagat vs Blanka..just dont dodge to much because Blanka can always take advantage. Blankas will bait the dodge by doing a lp blanka ball and when you dodge, they'll be on their feet to bite you.

Rock on Sagat is complicated. Use Rock primarily to zone Sagat with fireballs and get him to jump at you over them so you can st.rh anti air him. There should be no reason for you to be rushing a Sagat down, unless you can utilize the Rock corner trap mixup pretty well.

There is always stuff left out, but you get the idea evilmelvin
~Tony

[evilmelvin]

thanks for your help dr.b and senor payaso. oh one more question, how do you put the beat down on nakoruru? its damn tough to fight back when she is pushing you in the corner with her slides. i'll dodge but mostley all dodge attacks(well the ones i can think of) go over her. cough sagat cough, and if i dare jump BOOM i eat her diagonal slide, which seems to have godly priority. so could someone give me some help in how to beat her?

[Senor Payaso]

Nakoruru?..there should be no reason her slides are putting you in the corner.

A good Nak player shouldnt be doing random slides in the first place. If you are close to her and she slides, just block and then sweep. Dont dodge it. Then play the wake up/cross up/meaty game. If the slide is from far away, dp (dragon punch) it. If you want to be a little flashy, you can empty small jump her slides at the right moment and then get a regular combo in while she is in recovery. Her anti-airs are pretty good, so there shouldnt be a reason for you to be jumping at her (since you are in S groove). You should only jump over her when you are crossing her up.She only has a couple of blocking string combos to worry about. Her cr.lk x2, st.mp XX bird dive has a delay in between that enables you to dodge the bird. She also has the pseudo overhead (similar to Haohmaru) Hers is the cr.lk x3 xx hcb+k (when she gets on the bird), hcb+p (when she dives at you) all you have to do is stand up to block that, then punish her.

If she is in a dashing groove, she can ground cross you up on the wake up, so watch out. She is quick, but doesn't dish a lot of damage, so if you figure out what tricks your opponent knows with her early on, you can kill her before she gets too annoying

Unless cocoumi has something to add, thats Nak (basic), in a nutshell

[Dr.B]

Senor Payaso is the truth.....He is not only a good friend of mine but High LEVEL comp. Thx for your input glad to see you stopping by.....Peace!!!

-B.

[cocoumi]

Originally posted by Senor Payaso


Unless cocoumi has something to add, thats Nak (basic), in a nutshell

The only thing I have to add is that the ground slide manuver isn't even used very much by good nak players becuase it's very punishable. Beware of the ground slide when...

A) it's used after the opponent throws a fire ball

or

B) it's used in a combo like standing mp, or standing fp, two in one into slide (both difficult to do), she can low jump OR dash to the other side of you for more combo frenzies if she's in the right hands.

The only way she is punishable is when a player abuses her mix ups and crosses up like mad. SHE'S GOT A GREAT DEAL OF MOVES TO PLAY MIND GAMES WITH! Throw her into S-groove, and I'd argue that this is when she can be at her best !!!

[mukai]

Originally posted by cocoumi


The only thing I have to add is that the ground slide manuver isn't even used very much by good nak players becuase it's very punishable. Beware of the ground slide when...

A) it's used after the opponent throws a fire ball

or

B) it's used in a combo like standing mp, or standing fp, two in one into slide (both difficult to do), she can low jump OR dash to the other side of you for more combo frenzies if she's in the right hands.

The only way she is punishable is when a player abuses her mix ups and crosses up like mad. SHE'S GOT A GREAT DEAL OF MOVES TO PLAY MIND GAMES WITH! Throw her into S-groove, and I'd argue that this is when she can be at her best !!!



good shit!!! post some more i been playing with her for sometime now she's nice

[epsilon_]

I think K Nak is the best.

[cocoumi]

Originally posted by mukai
good shit!!! post some more i been playing with her for sometime now she's nice
For basic and advanced Nakoruru stratagies, for any groove, check out the character section in the CVS2 thread. ?


K Nakoruru has the potential to do a lot of damage. However, her super combos aren't all that. Her blanket whip super does more damage than the flame Mamahaha, but it's very difficult to use at the right time. Doing regular button combos into super combos with Nakoruru is even harder:

C. roundhouse into flame bird
S. fierce 2 in one into blanket (YES IT COMBOS)

The timing for these are really difficult! Check out some of the vids though! There are some rapists who CAN use them and HAVE abused them!

Give her a dodge and a charge! That just adds to her mix up game! I'm discovering that Nakoruru is a character who requires a player to depend on strategy and mix ups more so than supers.

For anything S-groove Nak I guess you can ask me... Anything else with that?

:cool:

[Dr.B]

Just wanted to give support to the fellow S groovers out there..and to never give up playing it...if you keep playing it u'll get stronger...see you guys at Evo..

-B.

[FullMetalRoss]

Ok so I have decided to use S-groove as my sand bagging groove and I was just wondering how do most of you play. I have had the oppurtunity to see two really good S-groove players, Peachy and JJJ, peachy is more offensive while JJJ is more turtley. Which do you guys think is a better way to play? Oh and my S-groove team is SagatR1,KenR1,BisonR2,

[topknot]

good team my friend

[forgenjuro]

what are ken's dodge attack like? i would substitute ryu in for ken cuz he fits into S very well. ryu's dodge punch is pretty damn good and low forward into super will pin anybody down thats not k groove. i really wish i had the game and working sticks to practice on.....

[LiSyaoran3063]

I like Dodgeing, and then Qct.K, Qct.P and do a Shinku Hadouken that way. Its Hot shit!

Ryu is defenitely My best S-Groove character. and then Kyosuke :lol: . I don't like Cammy, and I've had some bad experiences with people ducking Sagats dodge Attacks. I'm actually thinking of working on S-Dhalsim :lol:, He's not bad in S

[Nick T.]

Originally posted by KabukiMono
Ok so I have decided to use S-groove as my sand bagging groove and I was just wondering how do most of you play. I have had the oppurtunity to see two really good S-groove players, Peachy and JJJ, peachy is more offensive while JJJ is more turtley. Which do you guys think is a better way to play? Oh and my S-groove team is SagatR1,KenR1,BisonR2, Play both ways.

With Ken you can do like..
run in cr. short, cr. jab, run in cr. forward, short funky kick.
Then...
Walk back and forth, st.RH, walk back and forth, cr. forward, haduken.
Then...
run in cr. jab x2, run in st. short, wait, dodge/block, dp.
or...
run in cr. jab x2, run in st. short, wait, counter hit cr. short, st. short, short funky kick.

Do you see what i'm getting at?

[topknot]

s-ken is pretty snappy
s-ryu is tight too :)

[LiSyaoran3063]

Well, I might play in TTFZ2 this time, and I'm pretty sure I'm going to go S-Groove all the way.

I'm playing as my Ryu and Kyosuke, and I'm looking for a good 3rd character. Someone say a/some character(s) that are good in S-Groove.

[cocoumi]

Originally posted by LiSyaoran3063
character(s) that are good in S-Groove.


CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY CAMMY




:p

[Kataklysmic]

Rolento.

He's so good, you don't even HAVE to dodge!

[Nick T.]

Cammy, Blanka, Sagat, Vega, Chun, Hibiki.

[Shin Ace]

terry, rugal, wolverine...

[topknot]

cammy is a must :)
she is life insurance in s-groove

[LiSyaoran3063]

I don't play as Cammy, Blanka, or Sagat.

I think I'm going with Chun-Li

[topknot]

and still a very good character for the mighty s-groove ^_^

[FullMetalRoss]

yeah chunli's crazy damage makes her uber good with infinite super. If your good at landing crouching medium to super when someone jumps in you get a huge chuck of damage on every jump in.

[LiSyaoran3063]

When she's not in Red, how do you all seggest[sp] I play her like?

[DooM]

Play like Bouya, he has her as his R2 for his P-groove team... he just walks about, chipping with overheads and lightning kicks and stuff... just like you would normally play her -> pure footsies

[LiSyaoran3063]

Hot shit.

I'm going to TTFZ2 playing as Chun-Li/Kyosuke/Ryu-2

:lol:
This is going to be wack.

[topknot]

not wack but wise :)
random those fools

[LiSyaoran3063]

Nevermind. I'm not going to play in TTFZ2 this time. I don't think they need a 16th player for each game.
Anyway. I'll up date you if I play :grin:

[topknot]

:(

[LiSyaoran3063]

I might play. Ill just see how eny peeps we have coming

[RagingStormX]

I went to Fubarducks house to play some CvS2, and I represented some S-groove big time, even though we were both out of practice. I swear his RCing skills are perfect, I think he messed up RCing like 2 times the whole night. Anyway I just got my internet back so anyone feel free to PM me.

[LiSyaoran3063]

RCing is gay.

[RagingStormX]

Hey misconceptn, hit me up on AIM sometime my SN is JeffHizzle.

[kcxj]

Originally posted by LiSyaoran3063
RCing is gay.
:lol:

You died to some cheese didn't you?

[LiSyaoran3063]

All most.
I just don't like how some damn glitch that wasn't intindied[sp] to be in the game can be a huge part of it. I fucking hate it.
If the game didn't have RCing, It would be a much better game.
Well then people would say K-Groove is broken :lol:

[RagingStormX]

S-groove owns RC whores though, the peeps who can hop RC electricity and other stuff perfectly but when it comes down to it they suck at the game. Fubarduck can play the characters as well as RC godly. I hate his damn Vega.

[kcxj]

dash, dash, *zap!*.... repeat x n

Yeah, I hate all that dumb shit too. hmm... we should make a thread on how to counter all that stuff. Take away the RC scrub's best strength, THEN see what he can do from there.

Blanka can b+KKK, d.MP xx super for example. Sagat can roll through and combo from the back. With Kyo I stay out of range and look to counter the whiff electricity with far s.MP xx combo. I don't let myself get knocked down because I'm constantly looking for the sweep and slide (know your ranges...) and am always ready to counter with far s.HK. Probably a lot more stuff I don't know about too...

Anybody else interested? (not in this S-groove thread btw... make a new one.)

[LiSyaoran3063]

It looks like I have to play in TTFZ2 now. I think Im going with Rock instead of Kyosuke. :lol:

[Dr.B]

Its almost Evo....Team Wildcard baby!!! S-Groove madness...ah....let's GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


-b.

[Jeffzorz]

Originally posted by Dr.B
Its almost Evo....Team Wildcard baby!!! S-Groove madness...ah....let's GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


-b.

sup b saw u at svgl las fri, sorry for not talkin but i had really bad sore throat, almost lost my voice.

[Peachy]

Happy Birthday Dr. B!

Hope you have a great birthday! :)

[Jeffzorz]

Originally posted by Peachy
Happy Birthday Dr. B!

Hope you have a great birthday! :)

[Dr.B]

Thanks Everyone!!!! You guys are hella cool..nice playing with U Jeff...i knew that was you and the Fresno Krew...U guys got alot better..nice shit!

-B.:cool:

P.S- Peace to Northwest..Seattle and Portland!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Nick T.]

Dr.B:

Got to give me your number so I can call you when I get to Cali.
K?

[LiSyaoran3063]

I got 4th in TTFZ2 with my S-Groove team.
Chun-Li / Rock / Ryu-2

I can't make to EVO this year, so I hope you S-Groovers, and mainly you Dr. B, kick so High Tier ass!

[Dr.B]

Congrats LiSyaoran3063 !!!!!

Thats some tight shit to place so well with your S -Team!!! Good shit...gotta give u props on that.

-B.:cool:

[topknot]

yah man good shit, keep up the s-groove beat downs. :)

[topknot]

THATS RIGHT FELLAS ITS UPON US AND I WILL BE IN POMONA AROUND 4 OR 5 AND WE WILL SEE SOME GOOD MATCHES. brandon hit up my cell when you arrive too, my friend. lets make this a historic event where cali takes over :). ( love the east too )

[mukai]

he yeah it's up to yall to show these fool's the power of s groove. yo dr. b i just got my boi the S GROOVE DEMON pjc back in playin cvs2 his s groove is the shit man i would love to see yall play

[shinobi00]

Originally posted by topknot
THATS RIGHT FELLAS ITS UPON US AND I WILL BE IN POMONA AROUND 4 OR 5 AND WE WILL SEE SOME GOOD MATCHES. brandon hit up my cell when you arrive too, my friend. lets make this a historic event where cali takes over :). ( love the east too )

Hey whats up topknot we had some really good S-groove matches in byoc. I played S-Terry,whatever, R2-Bison. Anyway good games, late.

[topknot]

yah man those were fun, you played your bison well. keep it up :)

[Ouroborus]

that 30+ level 1 scissor kick super durin the match between dr b vs LTB was crazy.:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Peachy]

Hey Brandon, great hanging out with you once again. I learned lots again this Evo, I m really going to try to practice and get better now, next year I hope I do even better than this year. Until next time, keep repping S groove. ;)

[topknot]

peachy is a beast!

[mukai]

did any of yall rec the matches if so post those bad boi's?

[Dr.B]

ust the kickin it at Shilo and all the groups of people at 409....everyone came together that night and had too much fun..egos aside...just chillin. Thats what I feel Evo is truly about...players coming together..new rivals are made...friends that you havent seen in so long...new friends that just pop up.

And the reation of the crowd was intense this year...people really love this fighting game shit. I know i do...so i'll be back...

I really think the CvS2.Team tourney should have a rematch next year when everyone is into it.I heard no team showed up on time .and maybe big screen or something....just a thought...

The console room was a great idea...

Thats about it from the Doc...Peace to all those players that I met and kicked it with...and to all I already knew....

-B.

Edit: Here's the shout out list!!!!

Oliver,Daneil Tran,Jason Cole,Combofiend,Lax- Tactics,Fatbear,Ricky,Marneto,Sparatik,Buktooth,Ma

nny,Jhamal,Jon B.,Josh from Alaska,Chaotic Blue,Magus1234,S-Clubber,E-mittens,J-Gravity,Fresno Dennis,Brood,Kennywood,Toodles,Jeffzorz,Laostyle,B


moreChun,LifetimeBoy aka "LTB", Moe Powell, Josh P., Jason Nelson, Sac Players,
Kyohiryu, Chiti, Popo187,Dj-B13, PopoBlo, RayBladeX, Team Portland, Buktooth, Skisonic, Som D., Roger Williams aka Ratio1 aka "Daigo Killer", C-Royd,FubarDuck, Team Canada,Tragic,Venkat aka Opera, King Low Tier,JaHa, Ross from Oregon aka KabukiMono. ALL of OCV Krew !!!! last but not least Topknot and 86 two dope ass players!!! Nick T. that guy is insane!!! Ouroborus a classic old school friend...Apoc of course....Peachy as well as all of Portland and Seattle. Cant forget OBot64. Eric Leezy..Eric Choi...IKeith...Steve Yoo...Eric Wang...UCB...Ricky O....Choiboy...ZuggZugg..Mike Watson..Amir..Frankie3S...Philth...The Lew Brothers...Mikey Ras..from Sac..Larry from Sac...Orochi....Japanegro.....and all else i missed!!!

[Obot64.com]

Yo Dr-B i'ma straight up represent by giving these Detroit peeps a sample of that west cost style S-Grove rush down.

B, you rekindled my love 4 s-grove

[KING]

Any recent S-groove vids floating around?:confused:

i'd like to see some more, since nobody here has the ballz to play s-groove, besides me.:(

[Dr.B]

Obot64: Thanks man..your S groove is good too...keep at it and fools wont know whats up...U got that pic we took???

And yeh imma be putting up some S vids real soon..even one of my matches from EVo!!!!!! It will be in here when its ready.

-B.

[Nick T.]

OMG , I learned SOOOOOOOOoo much out there.

After playing alot of WC ppl and Kindebu for about an hour, i've come to the conclusion that cvs2 is nothing but setups for everything that can possibly be done.

Good meeting all of you.

[RagingStormX]

Oringinally posted by KINGDOM
Any recent S-groove vids floating around?

i'd like to see some more, since nobody here has the ballz to play s-groove, besides me.


Your not the only one in Texas who plays S. Are you going to the Austin TGA tourny? I'll be there reppin' S, so if you wanna see some S-action go there. Yo B! How was evo? Get on AIM sometime, lol!

[topknot]

as soon as i get the tapes from 86 i will be making a s-groove video from evo. trust me there will be some shit on there where you see things not to do in s, and the things to do in s.

[mukai]

orochi hades: sup how was evo
KCXJ: I couldn't beat dr b... lol
orochi hades: lol
orochi hades: his s groove is godly
orochi hades: did u rec it
KCXJ: obot recorded a ton of matches
KCXJ: oh, shankar too
orochi hades: for real
orochi hades: how did ricky lose
KCXJ: he kept trying to punch blanka's electricity
KCXJ: losing on the trade
KCXJ: plus he was totally nervous and messing up his CC's
orochi hades: ic
orochi hades: that sucks for him
KCXJ: ricky and eddie lee play mad gay
orochi hades: what groove did u play when you played dr.b
orochi hades: like what
KCXJ: I didn't even want to watch cvs2 after choi, buk, and dan lost
KCXJ: I played Choi's team
KCXJ: C-guile, ken, sagat
KCXJ: S-Sagat is mad hard to fight against with C-sagat
KCXJ: really bad counter
KCXJ: everytime I try to s.HP him, I got hit by dodge, punch
orochi hades: yup
orochi hades: s groove is really good
KCXJ: then when I tried to stuff him, he would hit me with dodge, dodge, punch instead
KCXJ: it's cheap
orochi hades: alot of people sleep on it
KCXJ: mad range, and a knockdown too
KCXJ: wtf?


dr.b your just to much for motherfuckers

[Dr.B]

http://shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=1740564#post1740564


Go check it out Evo Pics!!!!! GO GO GO!!!!


-B.

[RagingStormX]

I wish I would've gone, oh well. Southwest regional in Austin, September 18-19, I got a while to practice, gotta represent.

P.S. Ok, I know alot of muthfukas had to have recorded an assload of S-matches. Where they at?

[topknot]

S-Madness
coming soon to a server near you....

[*InVeRs3*]

WHEN

[topknot]

give me a server :X

[*InVeRs3*]

Originally posted by topknot
give me a server :X

You can try Direct Connect. It's easy to set up. goforbroke.no-ip.com is the server most SRKers go to.

And how was evo??

[topknot]

the problem with direct connect is the fact that i upload hella slow. i'll find a server sometime soon hopefully and you guys can rape the hell out of it for a week.

evolution was tight btw, i haven't had that much fun sober in a while. i learned a lot and had a lot of great matches. i'll write up a summary in a week or so of my experience.

[LiSyaoran3063]

What do you guys think. Whos better, S-Sagat, or A-Sagat?

[Dr.B]

Hey guys.....look out for my interview on G4 it aired on TV already....on a show called Pulse...If anyone saw it or knew when it was on let me know...thx.

-B.

[Nick T.]

Pulse is on in about 15 minutes over here. Its a news show.


EDIT:

Just saw it. They put it at the end of the show. Like the last 10 minutes of it.

Brandon, what you said was THE TRUTH. Thats all it should've been about since day 1. Community and people helping each other get better.

[Dr.B]

Topknot: Where is the Evo footage???? Lets get some of it up online asap.

-B.

[topknot]

86 still hasn't gotten it to me. he be slacking my friend

[enygmacuzz]

i am also a an s-groover in learning stage. I've can say i am almost a complete expert with every groove except S...so..^^..i was hoping anybody that happens to be an s-groove expert or near can give me some MFin pointers :o

-SF veteran since '92

[enygmacuzz]

s: Ken, Kyor2, Cammy, Rock, Hibiki, Athena or Rugal (occasionally)
k: Ken, Kyor2, Iori, Yuri, Joe
n: Ken (are u seein a pattern?), Rock, Yamazaki or Ryo
c: Morrigan, Ryu, Yamazaki, Ken
a: Ken, Sakura, Ryo
p: Guile, Iori, Ken or Morrigan

[mukai]

Topknot: Where is the Evo footage???? Lets get some of it up online asap.

-B.


yeah u need to post tha issh

[Dr.B]

Post from a previous thread: N-Ken vs. S-Ken


I disagree..if you take a high level S ken player...( there arent too many)...S ken has alot of advantages against N ken...For one if N-Ken gets roll happy then just grab him...or short,short super his ass..there are many things you can do to N ken for his lack of air defense and rolling. As far as RC is concerned just dodge that shit..thats what dodge is for to counter RC..think about it...If Ino can win with K and no RC you can win with S and no RC...Charging up gives you damage bonus..plus a really long meter for alpha counter...and when u get a combo u super them...You can also do a level 1 drill uppercut super to a level 3....(its really hard and situational)....you still have small jump and run to rush it down...and u can play run away turtle S groove too...it really gives you many options. The key to winning with any S character is faith in the groove...people think that you learn it over night it actually takes some wins and losses to fully understand it. I hope this shines some light on the subject, and I hope I could help.

-B.

[pitbull]

hey! i wanna play S-Groove too ! is my team for S ok ?? (look at avatar)

i think chun and morrigan are ok but what do u say to a s hibiki??

bad or not!! b, or somebody else please help!!!!
thx :clap:

[Dr.B]

That team is dope...I would sub in someone for morrigan time to time for even more brutality in the match....I say pick Hibiki Chun and a top tier...Blanka,Sag,Bison,Sak,Honda...then you have a new school totally original team with some back bone..if you need any mix up tips just ask.

-B.

[Nick T.]

Use Hibiki, Chun, Yama r2 or Hibiki r2

They all have solid keep away strategy. Good AA's, solid pokes. Can combo into super off a poke. Can have good mixups if done right. You can also build meter while keeping away.

[RagingStormX]

Damn, I just realized Terry can do 10000+ in S, lol. Yo Enygmacuzz, what city you from? I am probably the best S-groover in Texas, mainly cause no one else plays it, lol.

[pitbull]

please gimmi links to s-groove vids!! i never saw people who played s ! anybody knows?? it would be very interesting!!
thx

[Ranevski]

Damn, I just realized Terry can do 10000+ in S

Pleaqse explain. What does more damage than j.rh, s.hp xx lvl3 Buster, lvl1 Geyser?

[enygmacuzz]

I am from Galveston (With no arcades :sad: ) so that means I have to travel to test my skiils which is excellent I might add!!. :dp: :hp: :karate:

[enygmacuzz]

Hibiki does more damage with a combo I made up in training mode: Jump in RH, FP, Going my Way Root 3, lv. 1 Heavenly Spirit of Victory! :clap: :encore:

[JeffHizzle]

Pleaqse explain. What does more damage than j.rh, s.hp xx lvl3 Buster, lvl1 Geyser?
All I did was s.fp, df+fp, lvl 3 buster wolf, power geyser. I just actually saw how much is does, 10038. That's alot. Also, you aren't you gonna get a jump in roundhouse to fp combo alot, compared to hitting the close s.fp, so I can see getting that 10000+ comb in an actual match.

[A New Nightmare]

Hey any one got any good S-groove vids, it would be cool to see some really good S-groove players, and it would be a nice to see how it is done.

[Gwai Lo ½]

Pleaqse explain. What does more damage than j.rh, s.hp xx lvl3 Buster, lvl1 Geyser?

Yo, I just saw you were from sydney.. im going there in january.. is there anywhere to play?

[DooM]

Hey any one got any good S-groove vids, it would be cool to see some really good S-groove players, and it would be a nice to see how it is done.



*shrug* you can hit me up on aim aswell if you want, i will send you some vids


O yea: I got some japanese s-groover vs Iyo :| SICK shit, the s-groove is called ummm Izumi?

[Dr.B]

Doom: Pm me...i never see you online...but yeh I wanna get that latest vid...is the vid with Dj-B13 an S groove match?

-B. :s:

[Semp]

Hey folks, great thread, just read all 866 posts... stupid brother took the PS2 back so I just get to sit here and play theory fighter/CvS1 on PS1. I'm pretty scrubby, playing with just a few friends and never at arcades, and mostly in C groove. I'd like to get better (I know practice and all) and C groove just doesn't suit me well I don't think... Air guard is keeping me scrubby I think, I jump in WAAAAAAAAAAY too much.

I'd like to keep my old team of Guile/Eagle/Blanka(2), I enjoy playing them and was thinking of either trying out P or S grooves. I don't have sticks...yet... so still playing on PS2 pads, I fiddled around with both grooves a little and P just doesn't suit me with those characters. S groove is fun as hell though, and just a day or two ago I caught a download of Doc B vs Daigo and instantly got wood.

If anyone can give me some basic tips with those 3 characters (Guile/Eagle/Blanka) to get me started (I'd just play a bunch and figure shit out myself, but like I said my bro has the PS2 and I don't get much play time in) I'd really appreciate it. I've been keeping up with the Eagle/Guild/Blanka character forum/threads but there isnt much in there about S groove, and the stuff that was in this thread about those characters... unfortunatly, after reading that many posts, I've forgotten already :( Just a quick rundown of basically what their dodge attacks do and the strengths and weaknesses of both, and possibly a quick dodge attack combo that I can try out is all I'm looking for.

Also looking to train up my Bison, Mai, and Dan... for simply aesthetic reasons... Bison and Dan are pimps in the Dodge and from what I hear Mai has a nice charge graphic... I'm pretty good with Mai and ok with Dan (Though my favorite thing to do with him is R4 Dan vs R4 Ryo matches with my friend's little brother, non stop laughs, we're both so scrubby with those characters), but I'm not quite that good with Bison, my friend plays a mean C Bison so I think I'll pick up some tips from him.

Sorry for being longwinded, lots of time on my hands these past few days when I'm not out drinking. Great thread, albeit excessively long lol, and good lord where are all the S groove vids everyone keeps talking about posting?

This is the only vid I could find in all 866 posts lol...

Wow. Very different views of top tieringness. Though we can't agree on who's top tier, we can agree that this is top tier:

http://www.media.ebaumsworld.com/in...asianarcade.wmv

[Nick T.]

Doom:
I'll IM you for that Japanese S groove vid. Sounds beastly.

Dr. B:
Next time you're on AIM i'll tell you some odd, possibly good news.

[DooM]

Dr. B: yea, it was ncr2k3 if im correct *it says so in the filename?* so... yea :P

Nick: pretty sick, he uses S-Ryu/Benimaru/Raiden, can you imagine :P


edit: btw, a new nightmare: were you suddenly offline when i talked back? because it gave me an error saying the message could not be sent? not an error that you were offline? =/

[RagingStormX]

I use S-Raiden ^_^

[Dr.B]

Doom can u get me that match footage??? Ummm...E-mail it to me or send a link to my pm..thx i dont know when ur on aim ...

-B.

[DooM]

dr.b: ok, i dnot have much time now (6:40am, anyone?) so Ill hit you up later in the afternoon (for me then, europe blabla)

*who here btw has gmail? 10mb attachments means i can send the djb13 vs dr.b and the japanese one over mail, which is alot easier*

[topknot]

i got one, send it over here and i'll get it to brandon

[Semp]

Finally snagged a few more Dr.B vids off DC GFB... at least they say its Doc and they S groovers...

062603 naps drb (C Sagat Cammy Blanka) (S Athena Sagat Cammy)
062603 van drb (A Rugal Athena Balrog) (S Blanka Cammy Sagat)
062603 ericChoi drb (C Sakura Chun Li Sagat) (S Athena Cammy Sagat)

Some pretty good matchups, a few kinda so so ones, but still a learning experience for me... if you're interested sheppy33 on GFB.

BTW Doc if that ain't you let me know so I can change your name off it... still S groove vids at any rate :)

[DooM]

topknot: i need your email then :P

and semp: thnx alot =) leeching as we speak ;)

[Jaguarandine]

If you already uploaded the video could you send it via email?
Jaguarandi@gmail.com Thanks.

[DooM]

hmm im sending it you guys ways, but my gmail has been fucking up: new nightmare, if you got an email, plz let me know, coz it said it didnt send and now i dont know

jag: coming your way aswell =) Ill do it tomorrow or tonight =)

[topknot]

s.topknot@gmail.com is my email address

[A New Nightmare]

DoctorOctavious6@gmail.com

[Dr.B]

Uh oh its almost coming.....the S footage you have all been waiting for...stay tuned...

-B.

Obot64: Check ur G-mail and pms thanks buddy and pm me back!

[topknot]

86 should have the footage for me to edit soon hopefully and i will release one of the dopest videos around. oh yah i need some of you guys to give me some ideas on what kind of music you would like in the videos, i will start the intro work next week with the footage i have right now and a few new ones i will be capturing from my saved replays.
give me a month and i will have the movie done and you guys will see some of the dopest s-groove players from the bay area.

[enygmacuzz]

Maaannn! I got just the type of music. Try the Fat Joe's Lean Back song. U get it Dodge/Lean Back. 4 real, partna.

[Dr.B]

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71640

What you have been waiting for....and more to come!!!

Up next: Topknot's S Groove Video , and my new article " S groove advanced training"

-B. :d: :hp:

This has been brought to you by the:

:snkb: - :snka: - :s: - Groover Foundation

[RagingStormX]

Note to self: Don't pick Raiden versus any Mai. Fuck that bitch. Especially P-Mai.

[Dr.B]

Alright :s: - Groovers...some important news that you might like to know...

Level 1's can beat Level 3's...!!! How you say??? Its simple...for example : Two days ago I was playing an opponent and it came down to S-Sagat2 vs. K-Blanka2...my opponent grabbed me with HK grab that threw me toward the corner. At this point he was raged and about 75% screen away from from me...he waited for me to get up and did Blanka's :r: :l: :r: :p: super level 3. I waited until the ball super got super close to me...about a uppercuts range or a little more...and I did Level 1 Tiger Genocide super suicidally into it...and mine beat it with NO EXCHANGE and finest K.O.!!! My opponent was furious and said "That shit shouldnt have happened" and in a sense it shouldnt have but it did.

Also I was in the training room I was using S-Sakura vs C-Sagat...he did a low tigershot super Level 2 and I did her hurricane kick super level 1 through it no exchange...so I thought lets try that with Level 3 tigershot....and sure enough I went through it as well...Its very situational and hard to do...and I have also found that doing Level 1's through supers and moves is very much based on the range of a super or move,it's start up time..and "invincibility"...doing a level 1 to beat a higher level super is risky and not encouraged unless YOU REALLY need it...and always do yours after they do theirs to make sure you dont exchange or die...I'll be providing a vid to show this real soon..Thanks and remember:


:snkb: - :snka: - :s: - Groover Foundation

[Nick T.]

I've been noticing something similar to that for a while. I honestly think and am willing to believe that lvl 1's in S have more invincibility than lvl 1's in other grooves. But also, in the first example, Blanka was 3/4 screen distance away, so the invincibility is definitely gone by the time it reaches you.

The Sakura/Sagat example im a tad confused about. Did you do the supers at the same distance or up close?

[Guardcrush]

That S-Athena was fucking sick.

[Dr.B]

t's about time to Go....
Its been fun but I got to Go...
This may or may not be a shock but it's long over due for me...I have been deciding to annouce it or not for a while...and it hurts to say that I'm heading into early RETIREMENT from the fighting game scene.

I have been wanting to do this since I got back from Evo but my love for the game kept me playing. And just all the friends I made and kicked it with and had fun battling it out with.

I trully feel that streetfighter takes up too much of my time, and I have alot of things that I need to finish up on including my music. Sometimes I feel like I go out and it's the same power struggle between the same players, and many have the same style.

It kinda kills the game for me and makes it boring, I need to play new people,try more characters...shit anything would help. I just know Im not falling into my addiction of playing anymore...

At one point I had a "Prime" when my love for the game was stronger and I put more time into practice and what not. Now I really could care less win or lose...and it really just doesnt matter. I guess people let this shit get to them..or it makes their day knowing they are good and or have respect.

Well you guys can have the respect, have the fame, I feel I have had my time....I know I'm a great player..and a damn strong one...so I feel Im leaving on a good note...

So if you have gotten a victory on me recently great!!! Now you have something to brag about . Some of you were way over due of evening the score with me...so im glad you did...maybe it gives you some closer in your life.

And last but not least I would like to thank all of the cool players I have met from all over...to The OCV Crew...and all of Pac-North and Northwest....to my fam down in So Cal...and my EC peeps...my Midwest folks and Down South Country muthafuckas...I'll be back...I await your return....Warrior

-B.

P.S - I'll still drop some dope match footage and shit like that...I wont be a complete stranger to the boards....Ahhhhh much better...feels good letting go.....

[Ranevski]

And S-Groove was never heard of again.

*Sheds a tear* :(

ggpo B.

[Dr.B]

S will not fade away....we dont die we multiply...

-B.

[topknot]

bebe's kids 4 life :P

[Peachy]

Sorry to hear you leave B, I've learned so much from you and I thought it was so cool when we could just play games and talk about S groove. It was nice having someone to talk about it with. Hopefully you will still be around to play casual games and all that. I know how you feel man, I have been making games lower in my priority list. Sadly to say too that I have been playing A groove, and not S. :sad: I was planning on playing A next year at Evo, but if you're not there, I will definately have to play some S, in memory of you! :tup:

Anyway goodluck to you and hopefully see you again sometime.

[popoblo]

dr. B is the hotness. all the props he gave me at evo are is one of the biggest reasons i'm even still playing. hopefully you'll be at the next evo dr. B so we can kick it more.

peace

[RagingStormX]

Looks like I will have to keep S on the map, lol.

[Dr.B]

Thanks for the support guys...all of you have been cool friends and good fighters...keep at it...im sure you'll see my face again to the least...never give up....FIGHT!!!

-B.

P.S - New vidz of the week this friday !!! More S groove madness!!!

[Dr.B]

Vids of the week are up....and Kim Infinite tutorial...go check it out...New S-groove match is up too!!!!

-B.

Never give up.....Fight!!!!


Obot64.com > media section

[Dr.B]

Check out OBOT64.com for Obots new movie....Bang the Console 2!!!! It's dope...so get on it..and all S groovers Charge it up!!!

-B. :clap: :tup:

[Dr.B]

New footage up at OBOT64.com.....It's S groove so I hope u guys like it...fellow S-Groovers let me know what u think of the recent matches we have posted up...

-B.

[*InVeRs3*]

S is a hard groove, it's kind of a gambling groove because it's random, and confuses you and your opponents. So how do you control it's randomness?

[ragnafrak]

Always block while charging/dodging, it makes you look retarded when you get hit after your dodge. Also, know that you can let go of charge (HP+HK) and cancel it with moves, I don't know the exact properties but I know that it's relatively safe if you learn the timing, definitely comes out of the animation faster than N-groove pop->super.

[RagingStormX]

Anyone want to try to explain why S-Nak is suppose to be good. I just don't see why. Her bird super give alot of frame advantage though

[Jaguarandine]

I've been into S-Groove heavily lately, so I though I'd bring back the thread that started it all. Are there still any S players out there? Don't tell me that all you fools have quit or switched to A-Groove.

I'll be posting my S-Groove 101 strategies that I've been working on over the next several days. Until then, what teams have you been playing and why? What advantages does the S version of your character have over the established best version?

Characters that I've been thinking could be pretty good in S:
Kyo, Ryu, Akuma, Todo, Rock, Vega, Ken, Guile
Top tier: Bison, Cammy, Blanka, Sagat

[shinobi00]

Ken & Akuma are pretty lame in S, but thats just from my experience. Ryu is definetly the best shoto to us in S-goove.

Actually S-ryu is one of the only chars in the game that could use s-groove to it's fullest potential. He has a safe super when comboed into, good range and speed on his linker and knockdown attacks, an invincible move from the dodge, just to name a few. S-ryu is top tier S imo.

[Dr.B]

Im back bitches!!! More S madness to come....and who knows what other grooves!!! Stay tuned!!!

-B.

[Nick T.]

I told you that you wouldn't be quitting for long. :tup: :clap:

[ragnafrak]

yay, your s-groove is great to watch

[CrotchMonkey]

Im back bitches!!! More S madness to come....and who knows what other grooves!!! Stay tuned!!!

-B.
oh yeah welcome back :tup:

[Dr.B]

Thanks for the support...Whats been up Nick T. been a while since we chated I need to catch up with you..holla at me on myspace...And thanks to everyone keeping S alive and the Street Fighter scene period.

-Brandon

P.S - If anyone needs to contact me hit me up on my page on myspace.com...Peace...

http://profiles.myspace.com/users/1934691

[epsilon_]

Anyone want to try to explain why S-Nak is suppose to be good. I just don't see why. Her bird super give alot of frame advantage though
Dodge Kick is good. It s.rh, with knockdown. Lv 1 Kick super is annoying.

[popoblo]

dr. b is the truth, retiring from cvs2 is impossible, i've tried too:karate:

[*InVeRs3*]

Is S-Sim useless? I'm thinking of picking him up.

[RagingStorm101]

Is it true you can completely dodge a sonic hurricane? Some guy told me that but i dunno if it has any truth to it. Oh and when i play S, I use Terry,Bison (i'm just rippin of off Dr.B lol) and Sagat 2.

[ragnafrak]

u can completely dodge anything, dodging is invincible throughout the animation, so you would need reversal timing (or luck) between each dodge

[Higher-Jin]

can anyone direct me to some doc b match vids where he uses s groove

or any good s groove matches?

[KING]

can anyone direct me to some doc b match vids where he uses s groove

or any good s groove matches?
obot64 had some great Dr.B matches on his site... :confused:

[MrSNK]

dr. b is the truth, retiring from cvs2 is impossible, i've tried too:karate:


Prech it brotha, preach it.

[Dr.B]

Just getting back to posting...been super busy with musical collaborations and school...work too...but despite the fact im back ho made muthafuckas!!!

Still S-Groovin...dont play as much...but I'm always in the background of someone's stage..lol...so yeh I have picked up some new tricks if anyone would like to know lemme know and I'll post it up...and drop some more of your S groove setups and tricks as well so The S Groove Nation will rise again.

-B.

[RagingStormX]

I suck on jap sticks, check out my match here: http://hosted.tribalwar.com/tekno/ in the vids section. I'm rusty on S-guys, lol.

[Dr.B]

Thanks for supportting the S nation RagingStormX u have always been a S believer and supporter of this thread..again thank you.

-B.

[Guardcrush]

I'll let you know what I think when it's done downloading (download time sucks hard :tdown: ).

[RagingStormX]

Ryan aka Laugh from SoCal was in Killeen for the night, vids of casual with him will be up sometime. The next batch of vids should be 4-5 megs a piece.

[Dr.B]

RagingStorm: I like your S groove alot..you do some nice mixups..I have a piece of advice for you...use more charge...if you do your closer to an alpha counter,powered up hits,and a level 1 at your disposal for combos or to punish them...Charge fakes help alot you can do it for grabbing,combos,to bait for anti air...But good shit though man keep it coming!!!

-B.

[RagingStormX]

Oh I know, but that was the first time in months I played it, but I am practicing again.

[Ouroborus]

that was a dope bison

[RagingStormX]

Wait til you see my Bison with super, lol.

[topknot]

i will be back ^_^
catch you all on the FLIP SIDE
new tricks coming soon :O

[RagingStormX]

New S-groove vid up, me vs Laugh catch that shit here son!http://hosted.tribalwar.com/tekno/vids.htm

[Dr.B]

RagingstormX: Nice work once again..your Raiden is hella dope....i like your patience...and good cammy too....your S style is on the come up...I cant wait until we can get some S and S...

But until then go to OBOT64.com's media throwback vid section for the weekly throwback vids including this weeks vid featuring

Dr.B vs Eric Choi

Go go go!!!! S is for the true Jedi ...

[RagingStormX]

Thanks, hopefully the next vids will be better.

[Dr.B]

Go hit up Obot64.com/Media new old throwback vids...3 Vids for your watching pleasure...including DJ-B13 vs Me....that guy is hella good in all games...and a cool dude on top of that...Im outty...S-Nation suckas!!!

-B.

[Neo Odin]

Lately i've been messing with S-yuri/ryu/yama, hopefully with a little more practice it will improve. I only play A and S, so I still got your back son.:tup:

[Buktooth]

Ok this is getting out of hand. The last like 500 replies in this thread have all been meaningless bumps to keep the thread alive. Either let the thread die, or post some useful info that hasn't been posted before in this thread. If you guys insist on bumping this thread for no reason I'm gonna have to close it.

[Dr.B]

Buktooth: We go way back..some people post useless things but I continue to post strats and opinions..not to mention links to S-Groove matches...and some of my other personal vids...In the next week or so more footage will be uploaded directly to this thread...S-Groove will not die...

-B.

P.S - I just got back from the FINAL Lanwerx tourney in Seattle...Vids will be up soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dr.B]

Sups all??? Im back in Kali from the trip to Portland and Seattle...I enterend the final lanwerx tourney..here are the results....pics and vids will be posted soon...

-B.

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83553

[Dr.B]

You guys wanna see a crap load of vids??? Do you wanna see a crap load of S-Groove??? Go peep these vids brought to you by Preppy.


http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83737

[Dr.B]

http://photobucket.com/albums/v632/Sagat05/?start=0

For pictures from the LanWerx Tourney...

[Dr.B]

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84078

S-Groove takes top 3 nor cal baby!!!!!!!!!!

[Jaguarandine]

Hey Doc B, great job at the tourney. You want to tell us how it went, how hard your matches were, who you played? How are you managing to get past A-Groove? Again, great placing man; inspiring s-groovers as usual.

[Dr.B]

Hey Doc B, great job at the tourney. You want to tell us how it went, how hard your matches were, who you played? How are you managing to get past A-Groove? Again, great placing man; inspiring s-groovers as usual.


Sup man long time no see I used team Doc B ( S-Groove Bison/Cammy/Sag)I played Ed Ma,Charlie,Van,Josh,Ricky,etc...

Nor Cal has alot of good comp so everyone you have to play solid against...I just stick to basic anti air tactics and mix in random S madness...Against A groove just bait out RC's..grab when you know they want to RC...remember they dont have air block...watch out for open shots for them to Custom Combo your ass...and stick to an original style of fighting...and that should get you through....

-B.

[RagingStormX]

Sup guys, just wanted to say this has been a great thread and has taught me alot, but I'm giving up S-groove. Props to all who use it, but it ain't for me anymore. I'll still drop by and give help/tips and whatever. Just remember use who you like, keep the game fun.

[Dr.B]

RagingStormX: I'm sorry to see you leaving the S - Society...you have always been a steong force in the S groove community and have contributed many good strats...hate to see you go...but as the Clone Wars continue
fewer Jedi are to be seen...but they will be found for the final battle...

-B.

[Ouroborus]

join the world famous A groove association Jeff. :smile:

[Higher-Jin]

Sup man long time no see I used team Doc B ( S-Groove Bison/Cammy/Sag)I played Ed Ma,Charlie,Van,Josh,Ricky,etc...

Nor Cal has alot of good comp so everyone you have to play solid against...I just stick to basic anti air tactics and mix in random S madness...Against A groove just bait out RC's..grab when you know they want to RC...remember they dont have air block...watch out for open shots for them to Custom Combo your ass...and stick to an original style of fighting...and that should get you through....

-B.

Man thanks for the matches.

The match i saw where you fake charged like 5 times then psycho crusher that vega on wake up was hilarious and kick ass dude i had to see it like 3 times.

Why do you use Bison in s groove?

what does he bring that someone like yamakazi or even ryu doesn't .

You use him well but is there a reason you use him?

Also can you list the s groove tiers or acn you tell me around what page they are at on this thread?

I know cammy is no.1 but that's about all i know.

thanks man

[Dr.B]

Thanks Higher Jin....

Lets see 1st off...I like S-Bison because he is real mobile...he has small jump...run..dodge..and charge fake at his disposal...Characters like S Yama and S Ryu are really solid...but they have some openings that are fixed quick by Bison's over all top tier ability...when you go into blink life aka desperation Bison can be real scary with level 1 kick supers....what can I say Shadaloo Signed me up...

My tier list over all:

1)Cammy
2)Bison
3)Blanka
4)Sagat
5)Ryu

The SNK list:

1)Yamazaki
2)Athena
3)Geese
4)Iori
5)Terry

just my recent updated tier list...please post your agrees and disagrees and holla back....peace!!! Below is a link to a recent tourney I fought in...Dont mind it...I always post them here...

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85876

-B.

[RagingStormX]

join the world famous A groove association Jeff. :smile:

Hahaha, No, A-groove is evil, lol. I'm gonna start using A-Nak/Sim/Sagat for fun, lol.

Dr. B: I'd put raiden on the list instead of Terry, but good list otherwise. I'll still be here to support the thread.

[Guardcrush]

I'd say put Chun-li somewhere in the top five at least. I like Sagat higher then Bison. Gat is awesome against fatter characters in S. S - Sagat > any other Sagat. Plus I like him in desperation mode better . . cr.fp xx Low Tiger super for chip damage. I think Athena sucks hard in S. I've seen DrB's videos while using her and it just looks like it takes to much work. Sakura has to be somewhere in the top 5 too.

1. Cammy
2. Sagat
3. Ryu
4. Chun
5. Sakura

[Dr.B]

GuardCrush: Good point..S-Sakura is evil...so has so many mix ups with her charge fake game..plus she's sakura...solid anti airs and great cross ups with combo ability...

-B.

[popoblo]

S - Sagat > any other Sagat.

come on, at least be realistic. C/N/K/P sagat's are all better than S-sagat. some may even say putting S-sagat in front of A-sagat is a stretch, but i'll give it to you.

[Dr.B]

Popoblo it all really comes down to who is using S-Sagat...I have seen K/C/N/P Sagat loose to S-Sagat..but they have won in more cases since barely anyone uses S Sag..that and only that is why I feel what you say is true...

-B.

[mukai]

yo dr.b post some issh about s. sagat.

[Jaguarandine]

S-Sagat's dodge attacks are weaker due to both being duckable by all expect big characters.

[NoiNoiPinoy]

Sup guys, just wanted to say this has been a great thread and has taught me alot, but I'm giving up S-groove. Props to all who use it, but it ain't for me anymore. I'll still drop by and give help/tips and whatever. Just remember use who you like, keep the game fun.

Damn, I guess i'll be the only one that uses S in Killeen anymore huh. Heh, i was thinking about dropping it too when David Hem OCVed my S-team at TX Showdown. Hey Jeff pick up Sakura, Bison, Blanka........in N-groove, lol.

Well, i need some advice. I used to use S-Ryu, Cammy, Sagat but i really dont have an effective shoto rushdown so im dropping Ryu. I tried S-Vega but i really dont know what to do if im getting pressured. I would use Nakoruru or Mai since i use them in N, but im thinking that winning with those 2 would be a lot of work in S. Im thinking Blanka, but how do u play S-Blanka?

[RagingStormX]

Damn, I guess i'll be the only one that uses S in Killeen anymore huh. Heh, i was thinking about dropping it too when David Hem OCVed my S-team at TX Showdown. Hey Jeff pick up Sakura, Bison, Blanka........in N-groove, lol.

Well, i need some advice. I used to use S-Ryu, Cammy, Sagat but i really dont have an effective shoto rushdown so im dropping Ryu. I tried S-Vega but i really dont know what to do if im getting pressured. I would use Nakoruru or Mai since i use them in N, but im thinking that winning with those 2 would be a lot of work in S. Im thinking Blanka, but how do u play S-Blanka?

Use him like N-Blanka minus RC. Both supers are abusable as hell.

[Guardcrush]

Well yeah there are better grooves to put Sagat in for sure, but my point is when you have a Sagat vs Sagat match-up I'd take S against any other version of him.

[Kataklysmic]

come on, at least be realistic. C/N/K/P sagat's are all better than S-sagat. some may even say putting S-sagat in front of A-sagat is a stretch, but i'll give it to you.

How is C-Sagat > S-Sagat realistic? Tell me. He's used a lot more in C, but it's most often for team filler. Everyone knows he's more potent in running grooves. Besides Lv.2 cancels, C-Sagat doesn't have shit. And P-Sagat's horribly limited.

How S-Sagat compares to N and K is in the air, but his guard crushing ability's as good as ever, and infinite c.FP >> Lv.1 supers in desperation is nothing to scoff at.

[Ouroborus]

rolling and stored level 2s are as good as it gets.

[Kataklysmic]

Sagat's roll sucks, + running, low-jump and infinite Lv.1s are as good as it gets.

[RagingStormX]

Sagat's roll sucks, + running, low-jump and infinite Lv.1s are as good as it gets.

Sagats roll is good as hell.

[vasAZNion13]

didn't every top player already state that C-sagat is the best sagat(vs non-sagat characters that is)

i think somewhere on this forum, buk posted how important lvl 2 cancels were. i believe, in short, it was because you get lvl 2 often , allowing sagat to land huge damage anytime, anywhere...

but whatever...i suck with sagat..it's all about K-sagat with raged throws.

[kcxj]

Koko Desuka!

[popoblo]

Popoblo it all really comes down to who is using S-Sagat...I have seen K/C/N/P Sagat loose to S-Sagat..but they have won in more cases since barely anyone uses S Sag..that and only that is why I feel what you say is true...

-B.

i wasn't limiting it to just S-sagat vs C-sagat. C-sagat is the BEST sagat BY FAR. come on, think about it.

C-sagat can convert ANY mistake into half life damage. if you jumped, rolled, whiffed a poke, anything, you're eating a fierce or low forward into level 2 into tiger uppercut or tiger shot FOR HALF LIFE.

S-sagat can just throw a fierce back or tiger uppercut or something that doesn't equal nearly as much damage.

and if you're in desperation mode, you're already not doing too hot in the match. sure, run up crouching fierce into level 1 is nice to have, but it won't hit many times and the chip damage isn't amazing or anything.

and sagat has one of the best rolls in the game.

peace

[Kataklysmic]

Sagats roll is good as hell.

There are eight characters that beat Sagat in roll quality. The most exceptional off the top of my head being Kim, King, Athena, and Benimaru. Sagat can't abuse his roll as well as they can. It's a frame longer in total and has more frames of vulnerability when it's ending. For a medium distance span, that counts for a lot. I usually don't have a hard time hitting him.

Frankly, rolling is the most overused and anticipated tactic. I admit, saying Sagat's roll sucks is a bit much, but if it isn't among the safest of rolls, why should I care? Sagat shouldn't be dependant on rolls anyway, much less RC, and SNK grooves still give him more critical mobile options.

didn't every top player already state that C-sagat is the best sagat(vs non-sagat characters that is)

If the other Sagats could beat C-Sagat, what makes them any less effective against other characters?

i think somewhere on this forum, buk posted how important lvl 2 cancels were. i believe, in short, it was because you get lvl 2 often , allowing sagat to land huge damage anytime, anywhere...

So what if he doesn't have Lv.2 cancels? S gives Sagat enough shit to compensate for it. With so much priority in his moves, building meter is not that important. Sagat does plenty of damage on his own, and besides, S and K charge up the fastest (I don't give a fuck what anyone says; if you're smart, manual charging with S is not dangerous in the slightest). Fact, people neglect that meter can be stored in S too. Just charge up to like a pixel before going into MAX, and it's up to them to give it to you.

And before you go bashing Lv.1s, S-characters gain 15% damage output for a full meter, and almost double the amount with red life. I know this means nothing to C-Groove players, but in playing as you normally would without meter, it all adds up. You can whore this until the meter's almost depleted and use it for a Lv.1 super, or save it for an AC. It's like a toned down K-Groove, but for Sagat, it's no less dangerous.

and if you're in desperation mode, you're already not doing too hot in the match.

You're right. But if you're any good, you shouldn't be in desperation until you're, say within the end of the second or beginning third round. Once you're there, it becomes another good asset for Sagat to use. It does help turn the match around, you know.

sure, run up crouching fierce into level 1 is nice to have, but it won't hit many times and the chip damage isn't amazing or anything.

If you can land that fierce consistently, why does the hit count matter? Chip damage is no excuse. Nobody's going to suck it up even if you are chipping them with a Lv.3.


Oh yes. Another thing.

S-Sagat's dodge attacks are weaker due to both being duckable by all expect big characters.

When you dodge something, they shouldn't be in a ducking position most of the time. They still have to get in. If they can't, there's no sense in dodging is there?
If you know they're gonna stick out a low hitting poke just to evade your dodge attack, don't stick it out. Simple.

[Ouroborus]

rolling makes sagat that much better. without rolls, sagat has a much harder time against runaway characters and characters that can outpoke him like vega and sakura.

those 8 characters you mentioned are no where as good as sagat. sure sagat can't abuse his rolls as much as theirs but the combination he has with rolling, stored level 2s, great normals, why would he need to abuse his roll like the other 8?

C groove also gets damage bonus, 3% on level 2, and 5% on level 3. Pretty much the same concept as S groove except you can sit on your meter and turn any mistake into 60% damage.

by your same logic, sagat doesnt have the safest of dodge moves in the game, why should i care?

[Guardcrush]

"and if you're in desperation mode, you're already not doing too hot in the match. sure, run up crouching fierce into level 1 is nice to have, but it won't hit many times and the chip damage isn't amazing or anything." - popoblo

Just because you're in desperation mode it doesn't meen you're not doing good in the match. If you're in desperation mode and so is your opponent then that's an advantage for you.


"S-sagat can just throw a fierce back or tiger uppercut or something that doesn't equal nearly as much damage." - popoblo

Well with C-Sagat vs S-Sagat I'm not even really going to argue. I just like S Sagat over any other grooved Sagat because you can dodge a fierce and dodge punch them back with a free knock down and then rush down or what have you.

[Kataklysmic]

rolling makes sagat that much better. without rolls, sagat has a much harder time against runaway characters and characters that can outpoke him like vega and sakura.

Characters that outpoke him can still bait his roll. When they see that he has meter, why should they even attempt playing footsies when they can revert to something that retracts before Sagat can recover and catch them?

I'm afraid I have no clue how rolls help against runaway. My runaway Rolento's been stopped several times by Sagat before, but never because of his roll. Please enlighten me.

those 8 characters you mentioned are no where as good as sagat. sure sagat can't abuse his rolls as much as theirs but the combination he has with rolling, stored level 2s, great normals, why would he need to abuse his roll like the other 8?

If he could, he'd be a lot harder to counter. Those eight characters aren't wholly as good, but their rolls are ANNOYING. Do you know how troublesome it'd be if Sagat could cover less distance with a shorter roll?

C groove also gets damage bonus, 3% on level 2, and 5% on level 3. Pretty much the same concept as S groove except you can sit on your meter and turn any mistake into 60% damage.

In S, you keep 15% for the full duration of MAX time, which obviously beats C's 3-5%. In contrast to doing 60% off of one mistake, you can do up to 30% or more for every opening you get without using a super until your meter's depleted. Once it's gone, all it takes is a knockdown and you can charge it all back up. With C, unless you had 3 levels to start with, you'd need to wait it out before getting another Lv.2.

by your same logic, sagat doesnt have the safest of dodge moves in the game, why should i care?

Who says you have to attack out of a dodge?

[Ouroborus]

Characters that outpoke him can still bait his roll. When they see that he has meter, why should they even attempt playing footsies when they can revert to something that retracts before Sagat can recover and catch them?

sagat without rolls gets trapped by characters like chun, sakura, and guile pretty badly. also, hes more prone to crossup into super like kens. also vega cant do too much after he bait sagats roll. best option he has is throw.

I'm afraid I have no clue how rolls help against runaway. My runaway Rolento's been stopped several times by Sagat before, but never because of his roll. Please enlighten me.

because his roll is faster than his run. characters like vega and bison can stop sagat in his tracks for running. vega has to think twice before he throws out a c.mp vs a roll groove sagat because vega will get dp'ed, thrown, etc. sagats run is not even close to being one of the best, and his low jump is easier to anticipate than someones like rocks, rolentos, vega, etc.


If he could, he'd be a lot harder to counter. Those eight characters aren't wholly as good, but their rolls are ANNOYING. Do you know how troublesome it'd be if Sagat could cover less distance with a shorter roll?

and he is not hard enough to counter already? do all rolls have to be abusive or annoying to be usable? infact, the only annoying rolls are iori and kim.


In S, you keep 15% for the full duration of MAX time, which obviously beats C's 3-5%. In contrast to doing 60% off of one mistake, you can do up to 30% or more for every opening you get without using a super until your meter's depleted. Once it's gone, all it takes is a knockdown and you can charge it all back up. With C, unless you had 3 levels to start with, you'd need to wait it out before getting another Lv.2.

and how would you do 30% or more in one mistake without super? i guarantee you will not land that so called 30% damage combo in every opening you see nor will you have a level 1 charge with you at all times. everything you said sounds theory. kyosuke can land an 8K combo in an opening but you dont see that happening often because its not easy nor is it too practical. sagat on the other hand is. one of the reason hes the best C character because its much easier landing his stored level 2's compared to any other characters.

[epsilon_]

yamazakis roll is pretty annoying too.

[Jaguarandine]

Kataklysmic: No need to get so worked up man. We're both s-groovers here. Someone asked the weaknesses of S-Sagat in relation to the other S characters. The only way I would throw out his dodge kick attack was if I was sure the first it was going to be blocked, so I could cancel into a low tiger shot or dp if in range (basically like you said). That's limited use compared to say S-Bison or Blanka, whose dodge attacks always hit mid and can be abused. No doubt he's still top tier of S; his keep-away abilities allow him to charge up more easily and he's got great abusable supers.

As far as him being better than C-Sagat, that's kinda pushing it a little. However, since this is the S groove thread, we should be able to discuss whatever we want about S-Groove. So of course there's going to be bias toward S a bit in here. With that said, desperation S-Sagat>C-Sagat in terms of power.:karate: lvl 3 meter lasts longer in S than in K, so low jump roundhouse is more deadly than ever. In addition to the damage boost S has over C (more than evened out by super cancels, but not in terms of poking), infinite lvl 1s and s-sagat's great charging ability seal the deal.

[noodleman]

With a 15% attack bonus I can see st.fp xx dp doing heavy amounts of damage. 30% seems too theory as Ouroborus said, with that or st.jab xx dp i can see a regular MAX mode sagat doing somewhere between 20-25% damage on one mistake.

if you're in MAX mode, you can alpha counter out of some traps (like chun's or sak's). Before i get flames, I stress "if". But either way, rolling out of traps isn't always the only/best option. people who use the traps know where the gaps are, and if you just blindly roll, you'll get thrown all the time. Lastly, Sagat still has dodge that he can use during these traps. Sure he's not moving anywhere, but he's not getting hit, meaning you may be able to create big enough gaps to punish (with a dp or something).

Lvl2 Cancels make Sagat good, but doesn't really make Sagat bad if he doesn't have it. K-Sagat is just as fearsome raged.

Kataklysmic has a point in terms of charging your bar. One tiger uppercut/sweep and you're good for building at least half of your bar. So in place of walking back and forth and whipping random stuff like C-Sagat would do, you can walk back and forth charging every so often, dodge, whiff moves or whatever and you'll be in max mode in no time. This is especially the case vs. turtles.

From the Dr.B vs LTB match, the first match LTB didn't know what to do vs S. He kept letting Dr.B charge his bar for free supers, which lead to guard crushes to free damage. A charged S groove and guard crush like raged k-groovers, if not better.

As for his run, it's infinitely better than his dash. Sagat's roll is good, but I would put it on par with his run. And in S-groove, you can run xx dodge to stop ppl like vega to poke out random stuff when you run. With run dodge, you can also control the amount of space you want to cover, unlike a roll.

I think the problem is the S-groove is like the theory groove. Everything ppl have said are possible, but no one actually tries it. Very little ppl actually tries to use S-groove competitively, so it's hard to gauge which sagat is better if the players are at and equal level.

[Dr.B]

i wasn't limiting it to just S-sagat vs C-sagat. C-sagat is the BEST sagat BY FAR. come on, think about it.

C-sagat can convert ANY mistake into half life damage. if you jumped, rolled, whiffed a poke, anything, you're eating a fierce or low forward into level 2 into tiger uppercut or tiger shot FOR HALF LIFE.

S-sagat can just throw a fierce back or tiger uppercut or something that doesn't equal nearly as much damage.

and if you're in desperation mode, you're already not doing too hot in the match. sure, run up crouching fierce into level 1 is nice to have, but it won't hit many times and the chip damage isn't amazing or anything.

and sagat has one of the best rolls in the game.

peace

I use both S/C/A/K Sagat...here is my thoughts...about C and S

C-Groove Sag:

Yes he has level 2 cancels...RC at disposal...roll...and air block....but sometime C Sag can be real dry....you pretty much have to go turtle or cross up crazy and wait out a moment to get the poke for a super...or to look for a dumb mistake...C sag has great mobilty but parry grooves can get him if he gets too offensive...and good blanka and cammy players match up real well against him...I'd say super cancels is his best feature besides his basic anti airs and normals...


S-Groove Sag:

S sag has alot of mobility...you can land a nice combo..charge up a level 1 super...and go for a nice combo into or just hit them for extra damage like a mini form of K rage...you have small jump at disposal...dodge...and charge fakes to make people do stupid shit...now he has downfalls like no airblock...or JD...or Parry...but when you are in desperation you can do some crazy shit...its not ONLY run up crouching fierce...you can connect some crazy shit....and the S level 3 is one of the most high damaging...imagine getting between 2-4 supers off a round even when you miss it doesnt take as long to build meter like C/A/N/P groove do....

All in all I feel I have matched C sag on C sag and done real well...but when I have S sag it feels way more in my favor...

-B.

[Peachy]

(Opponent near corner) c.fierce XX Super Low Tiger Shot (lvl 1 or 3) wait a bit, lvl 1 Tiger Raid. :razzy: :clap:




I think in our enviorment C Sagat is best suited, since there's lots of turtling. Lol, don't listen to me though, I'm too much of a scrub to know which is better.

[RagingStormX]

yamazakis roll is pretty annoying too.

I believe it exactly the same as Sagat's. Also, Sagat's dodge kick is pretty good, the first hit can't be ducked by alot of characters and is cancellable, good range on it too, about the same as s.mp.

[Kataklysmic]

sagat without rolls gets trapped by characters like chun, sakura, and guile pretty badly. also, hes more prone to crossup into super like kens. also vega cant do too much after he bait sagats roll. best option he has is throw.

The point I was making here is that if your Sagat's getting pressured to death, chances are your fingers will be sitting on LP+LK, which in some cases is what they'd have been hoping for. Your continual emphasis on rolling is an underscore of this error. Watching for an attempt like this is an essential component of what a good trap really is. Variation is key. If you do manage to roll without getting punished, let alone consecutively, they're not putting in enough.

Dodging's always been safer anyway. It doesn't move you within throw range, plus you can dodge attack to trade out of most guard crush traps, or wait out the dodge/cancel into another dodge, and throw. The latter has especially been applied against cross-ups.

because his roll is faster than his run. characters like vega and bison can stop sagat in his tracks for running. vega has to think twice before he throws out a c.mp vs a roll groove sagat because vega will get dp'ed, thrown, etc. sagats run is not even close to being one of the best, and his low jump is easier to anticipate than someones like rocks, rolentos, vega, etc.

You don't know what you're talking about. Runaway characters are supposed to turtle until you make a mistake. That includes rolling. Rolento can grab you out of a roll with a Lv.1 tripwire, and Mai can hit you with her air super.

If you're getting stopped for running with S-Sagat, that's your fault. Like noodleman said, dodging prevents that, plus it controls space better than his roll and allows you to continue getting in. It's the one clear advantage that S has over K and N.

His run by itself isn't the best, but it's a much better alternative than his dash, meaning at point blank range, you can just tick at them all day. His low-jump, while not as useful, is still a good mixup. They're not always going to anticipate it, not to mention jumping in with nothing and landing a throw or Tiger Raid super.

and he is not hard enough to counter already?

No. I think he's the most predictable of the top-tier.

do all rolls have to be abusive or annoying to be usable?

Every roll has its uses, but Sagat's just has one too many limits to make it a favorable point for C-Groove. If all rolls were equally abusable, you'd see more people doing them spontaneously in top play. Maybe then I'd say C-Sagat > S.

infact, the only annoying rolls are iori and kim.

This statement is a lie.

and how would you do 30% or more in one mistake without super? i guarantee you will not land that so called 30% damage combo in every opening you see nor will you have a level 1 charge with you at all times

You're discounting the fact that Sagat is among those with the second highest vitality in the game, following behind Chang, Zangief, and Raiden. He should have no problem doing nearly that much damage on weaker characters when he's on the offensive, or even up to 25% after a dodge (no, not dodge attack). With a super, it's a given. You're not going to have meter at all times, sure, but S builds meter faster than other grooves, bottom line. Since CvS2 is a rather turtle-friendly game, there's simply no excuse why you shouldn't.

everything you said sounds theory. kyosuke can land an 8K combo in an opening but you dont see that happening often because its not easy nor is it too practical. sagat on the other hand is.

What I said then and now about S is very basic. It's nowhere near theoretical as what you're comparing it to. It's obvious you lack experience with S, so your arguments are flawed.

one of the reason hes the best C character because its much easier landing his stored level 2's compared to any other characters.

Yes, landing his Lv.2s easier than other characters makes Sagat one of the better picks in C, but S-Sagat's still a more aggressive character, and a better turtler at that.

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snip

Sorry that I mistook what you said man. I just get tired with all the anti-S sentiment that goes on. I should've read more thoroughly to understand.

Peace.

[Legendary Gokou]

The point I was making here is that if your Sagat's getting pressured to death, chances are your fingers will be sitting on LP+LK, which in some cases is what they'd have been hoping for.

Just so you know, I'd be favoring doing a counter attack instead of a roll if I was being pressured. Because then Sagat gets the pressure off of him in addition to getting a knockdown.

C groove gets meter very quickly. 1 level won't matter.

[vasAZNion13]

LG made a good point. plus if what's the difference between pressing lp+lk(during pressure) if you're S-sagat compared to C-sagat?

[Dr.B]

Originally Posted by:
VasAZNion13

LG made a good point. plus if what's the difference between pressing lp+lk(during pressure) if you're S-sagat compared to C-sagat?

VasAZNion13: for one when you roll you can get punis