Hayato Tips and Tricks by Higher-Jin

[Higher-Jin]

Alright I've been messing with hayato alot lately so I'll make a small thread with a few tips and tricks on who I consider to be a pretty underrated character.

Tip # 1:
Know when to use the command throw and how to do the command throw.

First execution wise the command throw is tricky, and if you fuck up you'll do a plasma sword super with a pretty laggy recovery at the end. Here's my break down on the throw:

Execution:

B, F + PP. Sounds simple right? Except if you're sloppy you'll get FUCKED UP. My advice is to think of the command as almost a back, up, foward + PP. Really all you want is the control not to get a down input when you do the throw. This method probably works better for people using controls and not joy sticks. Remember to only graze (if that) the up, you don't actually want to input a up command, you just want to stay the hell away from down.

Landing the Throw:

It's pretty hard. Three things are going against you: 1) The throw is close range 2) Hayato is a poking character, so it's odd for him to be at such close range.
3) The throw has some start up.

It's still pretty useful, especially as a surprise move. However, getting in throwing range can be tricky. Here are my favorites:

a) Dash in standing lk, throw
b) Fake jump in HP or HK, throw
c) After assist, dash in throw
d) After flying screen, throw (BEWARE OF ASSISTS!)
e) Dash jump over opponent, Sword Dive (D+HK) miss and throw. (use assist for coverage)
f) In corner, HP Throw, (wait till they land) command throw

Most of the other ones are pretty assist dependant, and involve throwing them right before the assist hits.

Comboes After Throw

A) Go straight into qcf+KK super
B) Dash, d.hk (juggle otg), qcf+HP (one hit) xxx qcf+KK super (recommended)
C) Walk foward, c. HP (launch) into magic series ending with HP --> HK
D) Same as C. but end with LP or HP uppercut xxx qcb+KK super
E) (Corner Only) walk foward, c. HP (launch) into j. lk, j. mp, j. mk, HP uppercut
xxx qcb+kk super (HP uppercut hits them up higher and lets you juggle them upon landing) when they land do c. hk (juggle) into B. Hayato (lp, hp, back, lk, hk)

Those are the main comboes and I'll talk about execution tricks for doing the b. hayato during a hard combo next.

Tip # 2: This isn't really neccesary, but some people want to be flashy and for that I suggest learning how to do B. Hayato in comboes. It can be hard for some people, I personally was having quite a bit of trouble with it, but you really don't even need to be exceedingly fast to pull it off. However, B. Hayato comboes are tricky enough that I would not rely on them and would limit my use of them as much as possible.

First combo:
b+hp, lp, hp, lk xxx light double slash (one hit) xxx b. hayato

This one is kinda tricky, but there's a easier way to do it other than frantically pressing buttons. There's a reason why we're using the light double slash and that's because we are going to use the lp from that input to finish the b. hayato button sequence (lp, hp, back, lk, hk). However, the trick here is to use the negative edge of the lp and not the lp itself to do it.

[Quick definition for those who don't know what negative edge is:
Negative Edge - In capcom games when you press a button it counts as a input. However, when you hold down and then let go of a button it counts as another input.

For those of you new to the concept try this in training mode:

Pick Ryu, hold down lp, do qcf then let go of the lp. A hadouken should come out as if you pressed it.]

Anyways, the way the combo will go is like this:

<plasma string> lp double slash (hold down the lp) a half second after you input the command you let go of the lp button and input the rest of the command ( hp, back, lk, hk. )

It should come out more reliably then.

Second combo:
(Corner Only) walk foward, c. HP (launch) into j. lk, j. mp, j. mk, HP uppercut
xxx qcb+kk super. When they land do c. hk (juggle) into B. Hayato


This is mainly about the sweep into b. hayato part, which is also useful if you're in infinite super mode and happen to land a command throw. Basically the trick is to input the b. hayato command immediately after pressing hk. With most moves, you can usually see some kind of hit confirmation or at least the start up of a move. Not in this case. Maybe I'm just slow, but the only way I can do it is if I assume the c. roundhouse will hit and start inputing the b. hayato command before the c. hk even starts up.

If you can land it after a qcb+kk air combo though, you can easily net damage of about 125 pts. on someone with 100% stamina.


Tip # 3: General gameplay.

As with any low tier you need patience and good blocking skills. Use your long reach and moderately strong air normals to your advantage. Know your character in and out and play to his strenghts. A good chain is: b. hp (plasma chain), lp, hp, lk. If you don't hit and want to be completely safe you can just stop right there or even after a lp double slash in most cases, if you do hit you can do a lp double slash into a qcf+kk super for around 73 damage.

Another good bnb is max range c. lp, c. mp, lp double slash. If it's blocked no big deal, but if you hit you can cancel the first hit of the slash into the qcf+pp super at max range.

That's all I got for now, good luck!

[DAWOLF57]

I just started using this character, I like he's range on normals and his QCF+KK.
I had a question, is the double slash move you're talking about the QCF+P move?
Also I was trying out his dash-in HP cross-up thing, I dashed, called tron then pressed HP, it seems to work well on the computer.

[white shadow]

QCB+KK is a good DHC move, esp. with Storm and Sent.

[Ephidel]

I always pick hayato as my lead off guy and know quite a few chains/combos/etc.

Sent is my back up but I can never find that "third guy" to complete my team. Ideas?

[Alucard20]

capcom or cyke works good with sent.

[Ephidel]

capcom or cyke works good with sent.

What bout' hayato? He's my lead off guy - I dunno if they work well with em'.

I'm thinking about using Jin...

[DAWOLF57]

Capcom should work fine with Hayato. Just use him to keep people off of you and use sent drones or RP for combo's and setups. You can still use Capcom for combo's though I just haven't tryied these two yet.

[Ephidel]

ok, I'll start using capcom aa along with drones.

anybody got any other people list em' lol.

[Alucard20]

well you could use tron or doom aswell.

[Ephidel]

tron sounds like a good choice - don't know bout' doom cause hayato got insane lag in his moves/supers.

wondering if I should give cable a go.

[B&B]

he can also hit b.hayato after the command throw.

Byakkou hou, before they hit the ground s.hp xx b.hayato.

c.lk,c.mk,c.hk xx engetsu is a good combo overall.

[SammyJ]

I've been using Hayato for awhile, but I put him on the backburner to work on improving my Jill.

My Hayato team is:
Hayato-Expansion
Juggernaut-Dash
Sentinel-Ground

Hayato's "slow" combos allows you enough time to slap an assist button, which connect.

With Sentinel:
Dash in, c.lk, s.hk, call sent, hp shinden(hits once), PP super. In the middle of Hayato's rushing combo, the drones hit for some extra umph. Hayato tends to be realllyyyy laggy and the drones cover you really well. With Sentinel on point, Hayato's expansion assist starts on one side of the screen and goes juusstt about to the other side. If it hits, you'll have plenty of time to pull off HSF and do the juggle pattern that everyone seems to be so fond of (or a rocket punch, or a hp laser, whatever you want.)

With Juggernaut:
(Hold back for plasma string combo) and do the following:
Hp, lp, hp+call Juggs, lk, Juggs hits. If Juggernaut is glitched, even better. If they're blocking and Juggernaut's attack is blocked, you'll have a nice, ready Hayato waiting to cover for your assist. With Juggernaut on point, same story goes for Juggs as for Sentinel. Hayato's expansion assist sets you up perfectly for a across-the-screen headcrush. It can be tricky with the heighths, cause if they're too low they'll block halfway through the headcrush and you'll be sorry.

Hayato's engetsu juggles your opponent across the screen. DHC into a headcrush and the opponent is at the PERFECT height for the most brutal headcrush. Make sure you mash for insurance.

The BIGGEST problem I have with Hayato is that I'm plasma combo happy. If the opponent is not completely on the ground when you tag em with the first hit of a plasma chain, they will be able to punish you EVEN ON HIT. You're at a disadvantage if you connect a back+HP with an opponent not completely on the ground.

P.S. I also like Hayato with Cyclops/AA and Gambit/Proj.

[Ephidel]

My timing is a bit rusty when it comes to B.Hayato combos, I especially have to work on the corner ones harder after connecting a plasma field super.

[B&B]

hmmmmnnnnn.............an easy way to combo b.hayato would be s.lp,s.mp,s.hp xx b.hayato. This combo gives u more time then the rest of the ground ones or u can do shirotora hou, wait hp xx b.hayato. It all dependes on the timing.

[B&B]

I've been using Hayato for awhile, but I put him on the backburner to work on improving my Jill.

My Hayato team is:
Hayato-Expansion
Juggernaut-Dash
Sentinel-Ground

Hayato's "slow" combos allows you enough time to slap an assist button, which connect.

With Sentinel:
Dash in, c.lk, s.hk, call sent, hp shinden(hits once), PP super. In the middle of Hayato's rushing combo, the drones hit for some extra umph. Hayato tends to be realllyyyy laggy and the drones cover you really well. With Sentinel on point, Hayato's expansion assist starts on one side of the screen and goes juusstt about to the other side. If it hits, you'll have plenty of time to pull off HSF and do the juggle pattern that everyone seems to be so fond of (or a rocket punch, or a hp laser, whatever you want.)

With Juggernaut:
(Hold back for plasma string combo) and do the following:
Hp, lp, hp+call Juggs, lk, Juggs hits. If Juggernaut is glitched, even better. If they're blocking and Juggernaut's attack is blocked, you'll have a nice, ready Hayato waiting to cover for your assist. With Juggernaut on point, same story goes for Juggs as for Sentinel. Hayato's expansion assist sets you up perfectly for a across-the-screen headcrush. It can be tricky with the heighths, cause if they're too low they'll block halfway through the headcrush and you'll be sorry.

Hayato's engetsu juggles your opponent across the screen. DHC into a headcrush and the opponent is at the PERFECT height for the most brutal headcrush. Make sure you mash for insurance.

The BIGGEST problem I have with Hayato is that I'm plasma combo happy. If the opponent is not completely on the ground when you tag em with the first hit of a plasma chain, they will be able to punish you EVEN ON HIT. You're at a disadvantage if you connect a back+HP with an opponent not completely on the ground.

P.S. I also like Hayato with Cyclops/AA and Gambit/Proj.


I usually use iron man (Beta) as my main assist for hayato. It pulls u closer and u can do engetsu or c.hp and take 'em to the air. B+hp is faster but i use b+lp cause of its range.

[Ephidel]

hmmmmnnnnn.............an easy way to combo b.hayato would be s.lp,s.mp,s.hp xx b.hayato. This combo gives u more time then the rest of the ground ones or u can do shirotora hou, wait hp xx b.hayato. It all dependes on the timing.

Timing is something I'm flat with hayato but this appears to be pretty easy.

I'll try it out soon.

[B&B]

IMO, hayato's a pretty good character. I don't know why he is referenced as a low/bottom tier in the tier lists?

[Ephidel]

IMO, hayato's a pretty good character. I don't know why he is referenced as a low/bottom tier in the tier lists?

Well he has lag, and lag spells death.

His supers aren't the best in world and his defense sucks (not as bad as striders though)

If your looking to kick somebody's ass in style he's your guy.

:)

[B&B]

if u miss rasetsu zan then..................................

ohhhh wel, btw..............if ur using sentinel, DDoom or Iron Man i suggest u to do shirotora hou during their assist and while their in the corner is the best.

[SammyJ]

if u miss rasetsu zan then..................................

ohhhh wel, btw..............if ur using sentinel, DDoom or Iron Man i suggest u to do shirotora hou during their assist and while their in the corner is the best.

OR engetsu in a corner. OR whiff a shinden. OR a guren.

DO NOT miss with Hayato. His combos give you enough time to think "am I hitting the enemy or am I whiffing" to stop doing them in the middle of your normals so you don't have to continue your laggy specials and worry about them missing or being caught in lag.

Shinden is surprisingly fast and covers a nice amount of range. You'd be surprised what you can punish with it.

[Ephidel]

if u miss rasetsu zan then..................................

ohhhh wel, btw..............if ur using sentinel, DDoom or Iron Man i suggest u to do shirotora hou during their assist and while their in the corner is the best.

Not just the rasetsu zan, but the engetsu, plasma field, LP Plasma Series, and more. They almost HAVE to be combo'd in to are face the possibility of getting tossed early.

[B&B]

request this thread to be sticked.

So, ephidel.......................did u try that out?

[Ephidel]

request this thread to be sticked.

So, ephidel.......................did u try that out?

I did a couple of days ago.

My timings better than normal with the b.hayato combo you gave me. I haven't actually tried it on a real player though - just through training sims.

I also practiced some engetsu combo's, my goal is to average at least 50% damage from some of the one's listed above.

[B&B]

Yeah, i had a hard time against the com to for a while but it became easy.

Take a look at this vid:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=5UtVZ5b2MjU

[Ephidel]

Yeah, i had a hard time against the com to for a while but it became easy.

Take a look at this vid:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=5UtVZ5b2MjU

I'm getting the timing down more and more - It really does become easy after practicing for hours.

[ShoryuSwordsman]

???MY vid??? i'm sooo proud of myself lol but anyway, as u guys can see, i use mag hay psy. u can tell tho, hayato's my tru main. i was a scrub with magz then (well im not much betta now...) but he's okay with his mixups n watnot now. but i digress. b.hayato combo's are easiest when bufferred. b+hp,lp,hp,hp, qcf lp,hp, b, lk, hk. corner combo, magic series xx plasma, otg c.lk, lp,hp, b,lk, hk. that combo's a little harder than the first , but it's a guaranteed hit if u time it rite. hp plasma string=great punishment, cuz it's a free combo into almost anything u can think of, and when blocked, just stop at the next-to-last hit of the string(that's considering u dont use the string finisher, which you shouldnt...) lp plasma string has more range, but more lag. use it for jump in's and wakeup. once again, safe if blocked, just stop at the near last hit(same as hp string...dont use the finisher, that is unless your tryna look flashy...but then again, there's flashier things if u didnt, like b+lp, lp,hp,hk,lp, switch out, combo/rom/fly unfly, considering u can do all of that, which i cant lol.

Psylocke-AAA
just plain gud. lol
Magneto-Projectile
decent for rushdowns, and watnot. cuz of the fact that hayato has no projectile attack, and EM dis. attacks the entire horizontal area almost instantaneously, so it allows for a bit of rushdown game to keep the opponent either blockin' or guessin. eventually they'll pushblock, tho...still workin on a solid strategy of wat ta do after that

[B&B]

understood..................thanks for the info SS.

[Ephidel]

I'm looking for a good capture type helper for my hayato.

I know Trons a good choice, just lookin for more.

[Ephidel]

Could the LP plasma series work well in corners? I know unlike the HP version the LP PS has low range and extreme lag start-up. Main reason why I'm experimenting with good capture types like tron against low tiers.

Of course, I'll never use LP PS against the high tiers.

[gouki10]

i would think that hayato is good with doom's rocks

i would use Hayato/sentinel-Drones/Doom-Rocks

why?

with plasma combos + rocks u get either damage or chip/lockdowns that set up either for a command grab and push the oppenent into the corner if you do the qcf lp move with the rocks backing you up.

me and a friend where comming up with a couple of combos with hayato with these team, i'll post some when i get time to practice them again.

In my opinion hayato needs an assist to keep the oppenent block for him work well vs top tiers.

Dooms rocks gives alot of cover and can help extend combos very easily, i believe remember hearing a glitch where if you hit someone with d.hk in the air while they block, it causes them to go into a Guardbreak state regardless if you sj, i remember hereing combos like, launch, magic series, wait, d.hk hits them while they block, Air super(don't remember the name), dhc into Proton Cannon then dhc into HSF for instant kill.

i think hayato is a really underrated character, his Strength is his ability for lockdowns due to his range, and the lag on his moves can be canceled out with with well placed assist. Of course this can also become his weakness due to Guard Canceling being the equalizer for lockdowns/keep characters in the game.

of course people can Push block to mess up your string, but you can also anticipate that, and use the extra lag of thier Push block to just let your move recover then get a free command grab since they can't block instantly after the Guard Cancel of the Push block. Of course you have to be close, but i think he gets pushed close to the person quick with his Plasma chains.

Combine that with a good lockdown assist, and a good middle character for Dhc, counter match ups, and also assist, and i think hayato is a really good character.

Biggest obstacle he has is characters that can play the game at a distance.

Cable
Spiral
Sentinel
Storm

but regardless of that there are players that get around these problems with other characters like wolverine, coughJoeZazacough

[Ephidel]

In terms of flat out damaging an opponent, Doom's assist really does help hayato with chips and combo's. Since the HP PS has almost no lag at all it is easy combo'ed into for nice damage, chips, and range. Downside to the HP PS is that the sequence isn't as long as the LP - so if you want to use the LP PS against low tiers or style points drones or capture.

[xxphilopiaxx]

random corner hayato combo...

j.fp, land, b + lp, lp, fk, fp, lk, pause, j.lk, lk xx plasma field, land, c.lk (juggle), c.lpc.fp + thanos capture, sj.lp, fp, assist hits, falling fp, land, (slowly) b + lp, lp, fk, fp, lk, c.fp, sj.lp, lk, lp, lk, DP + lp xx plasma field, land, s.fp xx B. hayato.

[Ephidel]

random corner hayato combo...

j.fp, land, b + lp, lp, fk, fp, lk, pause, j.lk, lk xx plasma field, land, c.lk (juggle), c.lpc.fp + thanos capture, sj.lp, fp, assist hits, falling fp, land, (slowly) b + lp, lp, fk, fp, lk, c.fp, sj.lp, lk, lp, lk, DP + lp xx plasma field, land, s.fp xx B. hayato.

Awesome.

If you got anymore submit them.

[Ephidel]

I tried Psylocke and Sent with Hayato and did pretty well. Not a combination I regularly use, but effective.

[BlakHayato]

j. lk, j. fp guard breaks when blocked in the air.

I wish I had equipment to record some of Hayato's greatness. Not many play MvC2 around here anymore, so I let some of my skills slip. But I still brush up on stuff now and then.

I suggest getting good enough to fight with him solo (enough that he can almost hold his own) then adding in assists.

[Ephidel]

j. lk, j. fp guard breaks when blocked in the air.

I wish I had equipment to record some of Hayato's greatness. Not many play MvC2 around here anymore, so I let some of my skills slip. But I still brush up on stuff now and then.

I suggest getting good enough to fight with him solo (enough that he can almost hold his own) then adding in assists.

Cool guard break.

I use hayato as my lead off guy so unless its practice I never use him solo.

[BlakHayato]

I'm just saying get good with him on his own, because you won't always have the luxury of an assist. You could get snapped out and/or your other characters die first. If you don't know what you are doing, Hayato can be helpless without an assist (sometimes even when you know what you are doing). Its easier to figure out his basic strengths/weaknesses this way too.

Of course you can only do this if you got this on DC/PS2... Kinda hard at a arcade...

[Ephidel]

^I agree, I just start out as hayato because...well...he kicks ass with style.

I'm quite good with him individually though.

[BlakHayato]

Try this and let me know how it works out.

Snap out / kill character close to corner -> wave dash to corner right before they come out -> j.lk j.fp -> Land -> Command Throw. (j.lk j.fp is a normal 2 hit combo, but if j.lk is blocked j.fp will also guard break). When I used psylocke, I would AA + free combo after the j.fp.

Ahh.... when in Plasma mode, if B.Hayato is blocked you can do another one almost instantly right after block stun and catch some people sleeping or command throw if you cool like that.

Ending HP Plasma combo series after the third hit is the safest (nearly instant recovery/block). The low kick may be just as close. You can also poke to death with HP PS"stutter step" sorta speak, by stopping at third slash or low kick then doing it almost instantly again... watch out for assists/guard push though. When I have drones, I can do this basically for free...

Here's a question. How do you kill Cable/Magneto/Sentinel/Storm?



Check out this thread if you haven't seen it already. http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=52330 it needs updating and I'm too lazy to make a new thread. It has some good stuff posted by Tron Jon. (Somehow that account got screwed up btw, if you wondering why the name change.)

[Ephidel]

^Great, I'll see if I can pull it off and thanks for the link.

[VVILD]

I been playing hayato from when I first started.. about 3-4 yrs ago...

I usually have tron as an assist to because if hayato has them in a plasma combo or any combo for that matter she can combo in for damage... and you know trons projectile assist is quite strong...

If I have their main and assist in a combo, I summon tron to come out and then I dash foward, s.lp, s.lp, s.hk (1hit) xx Snap out. The snap combos after the hk, you have to cancel quick enuf so the hk doesn't push you back to far...

and dash c.lk to try to get the assist and keep launching them.

[Tron Jon]

About the question about the LP Plasma combo. I've played Hayato for years, even though I haven't had the chance to for a while. In my experience, the LP Plasma combo is good in two situations. You can buffer an opponents land, or dash-in, into the lag. It has enough range to actually catch a lot of people, and I frequently found it useful when people were attempting to protect or hiding behind an assist, since it passes through the assist, combos on the assist, and breaks super armor.

When people are landing, they're pretty easy to hit with the LP Plasma because they don't have moves with enough range that will execute falling fast enough, and the opening to counter on the ground is nonexistant.

The LP Plasma is somewhat good for pressure or if you're doing a pincer with Tron Bonne or possibly Doom. I used to use it all the time. The biggest risk with the LP combo is ending it on the stab (use the low kick, not the stab, if it's blocked)... and getting Guard Impacted. If someone knocks you far enough away, you whiff and they punish.

HP is better for countering dash-ins, but if someone's getting predictable, LP works and combos into everything.

Favorite Plasma Field combo: c.lk, c.mk, s.hp, HP Guren, Field (Sends 'em to the top, wavedash to meed 'em.)

Favorite RZ combo: c.lk, s.mp, s.hk, HP Shiden (1 hit), RZ.

And that will be my small contribution to the topic.

[Ephidel]

^Oh shit you're not dead! Glad to see ya Tron Jon *READS*

:D

[Tron Jon]

::laughs:: No, not dead. Just been retired for a while. Job got in the way of games. Still, though, I do know Hayato pretty well, even though it seems like Jin's got the throw down better.

I've seen that throw reset to make a 100% combo that had Plasma Field, but no Black Hayato. I wish I knew the guy, or I'd write it down.

[Ephidel]

Oh man I wish I could locate some of your old guides.

They were very knowledgeable - I've been searching like crazy lol.

[B&B]

Favorite Air to GC:

j.lk, j.mk, land, c.lk, c.mk, c.hk, engetsu (chips off some good damage)

[ShoryuSwordsman]

okay, thanks to higher jin and blackhayato, i've been messin around a little more with hayato's commandgrab. i've thought of corner rushdown/pressure, it may be team specific tho, as far as the follow up goes. anyway, since i play mag/psy/hay, this is how it goes.

get em to the corner, i usually catch em with a c.lk, c.mk hitconfirm, then s.hk, RZ, since it brings them damn far. they recover, then hp plasma series(1st 3 hits)mag proj. asst, dash-in, repeat, dash in again, command grab. theroetically it should work, depending on the person ur playing. com wont fall 4 it tho lol. but anyway, after command grab, stall for a bit, jump(not super jump) j.lk, .mk+mag asst, stall, j.hk, assist hits, land, c.hp, magic series ending in hp guren XX plasma field. when i looked solely at the combo damage, with magic series xxplasma replaced w/ lp, lk, mp, hp, hk, it does 80 damage on cable. that's a little more than half life, with no meter used, not to mention the fact that it can become the blackhayato for one meter if one so chooses. but i would like to know if anyone has any other somewhat safer ways to utilize his command grab? aside from the guard break that is

P.s. i've also accidentally landed a dashing fierce from landing after the assist hits. so it may lead to even more comboability. i would appreciate if sum1 could help me confirm this....even tho dashing fierce doesnt show much potential i'd like to be able to utilize all of hayato's moves

[Ephidel]

I've controlled hayato's LP plasma series so that it doesn't lag as much via start-up.

Updating that I'm still working on the execution of the dark hayato combos.

[Tron Jon]

Played around with Hayato. Definitely like the lk->mk->hp->HP Guren->Plasma ball combo best for corners... So much time to get ready for OTG, or set up an assist, etc. Gotta get my mixup goin' better, tho'.

[Ephidel]

Haven't played in sometime, but I'll get around to mastering all of the D.Hayato combo's submitted here.

I got like two down so far. :p

[Tron Jon]

Black Hayato isn't all that important to Hayato's game, though. It's definitely a welcome addition to the arsenal, and gets more cool points than any other super in the game, however, its damage isn't really all that impressive for a third level super. Amazingly, the 100% combo someone random pulled on me with their Hayato involved two resets (one involving Psy), Plasma Field but no Black Hayato. Made me sad.

And jealous. Oh, so jealous. I think his most easy-damage super is Engetsu, even if it's tricky to get to land right 100% of the time.

[SammyJ]

i would think that hayato is good with doom's rocks

but regardless of that there are players that get around these problems with other characters like wolverine, coughJoeZazacough


The only way I've been able to beat Zaza is with Rogue, not Hayato. He makes very quick work of my Hayato... =(

[Ephidel]

Usually I plasma field before attempting any B.hayato combos. Of course the Engetsu super is a nice addition for chipping and ending combos over the Ratsu-zan so it's better overall. It has lag, but Ratsu-Zan has more lag - one of the biggest in the game if you miss.

[Tron Jon]

True, Rasetsu Zan has lag, but if it's comboed into correctly, it doesn't matter, and it DHCs better than any of his other supers. Anything will combo off of it, while Engetsu requires ranged supers, and risks dropping them (although a DHC will usually make this impossible. I'd be interested in seeing DHC to drones, if that'd work.)

[Ephidel]

I pretty much have the same knowledge when comes to all of hayato's supers. The lag can't be helped and hayato has A LOT of slow start ups, but combo's (emphasis on the PS) work well when chained together with supers. Normally I wouldn`t B.Hayato in a real battle, just for show off - he doesn't have the best defense in the world but it's not as bad as strider's is.

[Tron Jon]

I might B. Hayato in a real battle, actually. I'd need to go ahead and be doing it as an extension to a corner air combo, though. It's the only one of his supers that can continue in the corner from an OTG... Engetsu needs space or the wave leaves you waiting to die... Rasetsu Zan lets them block. I need to test on a real opponent (read, wait a week), but I believe you can pre-OTG c.HK xx Black Hayato guaranteed off the Plasma Field combo I've already worked on.

You can also snap-out and potentially guard break at that point. I'm interested in seeing if I can reset into Black Hayato for more damage, or reset into anything, honestly. Getting a few good resets worked out, even assist based ones, would do wonders for him. I'm betting Byakko Hou is key, since it goes to everything.

[Ephidel]

Cool, I'm looking foward to the results. Most people find a way to dodge my B.Hayato combos, I would love to have better execution but I guess I need to brush up on the little things that lead up to that point.

[Tron Jon]

Still gotta see if this can be rolled (if I time the c.HK right, supposedly it can't, but I gotta test). But my goofy-ass team now has a Black Hayato combo that might be worth being very, very afraid of, worth doing in matches. OF course, it includes Tron, so go figure, right?

In Corner:
(Tron) c.lk, c.mk, s.HP, HP Guren xx Plasma Field... wait, wait, wait, c.HK xx B. Hayato.

1 super level, 1 Black Hayato, 1 assist, 113 points (full) damage on Cable.

Mmmm... Fun times. Lemme get to testin' this. (By the way, this still leaves you with enough time for another super (50%), and plenty of time to get back over there and maybe guard break / reset, if you have the right assist. But it's a dash, alright.

[Ephidel]

Est. 113 damage on Cable? Sweeeet, nothing is annoying than having somebody roll out of an attempted B.Hayato combo. I've had my fair shares of miss judging the timing of a plasma field-b.hayato super connection with a standard move.

[Tron Jon]

Well, it works on the same concept as Tron's unrollable corner throw (throw, c.lk (saw)): c.HK connects before they hit the ground, so it's not an OTG, but their hit-frames are still the same as if it was an OTG. I guess it's an as-they're-landing move.

Anyway, I like the c.HK better in concept than any other OTG into B. Hayato because it's slower (more frames of opportunity), and has a greater hit-zone vertically and horizontally. It doesn't work well for the air combo -> LP Guren -> Field, because its windup is too long and the opportunity too small. That's why this has to involve the grounded HP Guren... you have enough time to switch characters and taunt before they land.

[Ephidel]

Oh, ok I see. I was wondering why my small window of time involved the LP Guren>field because that's what I was executing. It's a habit I can break easy if I constantly abuse the HP Guren via combo's. I figured the LP Guren was faster so I kept going along with it...

[Tron Jon]

Oh, ok I see. I was wondering why my small window of time involved the LP Guren>field because that's what I was executing. It's a habit I can break easy if I constantly abuse the HP Guren via combo's. I figured the LP Guren was faster so I kept going along with it...

Not lecturing, just experimenting. Helping keep Hayato's forum the most active low-tier out there. Anyway, you come up with anything, lemme know... he's got some potential that's not tapped yet, I think. Anyway, the LP Guren is definitely the better Air Combo ender... it just has less window. I don't have anything against it, it just is a lot sharper timing.

For me, in my lazy, old man (24) way, I've traded my flash, maximum length combos for the less flashy, maximum damage combos. Hayato hits hard, so he doesn't have to hit lots, and given his less than stellar rushdown, the less execution is necessary to bring that damage, the better. Play around with him, he's a lot better than he's generally tiered.

[Ephidel]

Np man.

If something I notice comes up I'll contribute right away. Probably won't be anything new since I have a lot to learn.

[Tron Jon]

Yuck. It's rollable with c.hk, meaning you really need to hit with s.hk (so tight, timing wise!) since c.lk, while easier to hit with, doesn't lead to a universal combo (pre-OTG c.lk, c.lp, s.hp B. Hayato works on light - normal characters. Heavy characters bounce too high or too low to have that work. A decent reset is probably in order.).

Of course, I may just try snapping people out and B.Hayatoing their weakest assist. Pre-OTG c.lk-> snapout is universal, and combos off Byakko Hou.

Any help? Would it make sense to:

c.lk, c.mk, s.hp, HP Guren xx Plasma Field, wait, pre-OTG c.lp, snapout to primary assist...
break or force landing, dash-in s.lk (while standing - tic throw) xx Byakko Hou, pre-OTG c.lk, s.lp, s.hp, B. Hayato?

On Sent / Cable to Commando, or the like? Do we need to establish what top - to - god tiers & common assists this works on?

x_x

Of course, for storm / commando / various others, you can:

c.lk, c.mk, s.hp, HP Guren xx Plasma Field, pre-OTG c.lk, s.lp, s.hp, Black Hayato

And you might be able to (with Psylocke or equivalent) universally.

(Plasma Field Combo), Assist, pre-OTG s.hk xx B. Hayato

[VVILD]

If you have sent drones.

After Plasma Field, dash, Assist, HP <drones are hitting, your lag is gone> dash in and combo.

If you have tron projectile assist, it works if you make sure that tron only hits with the second wave of her attacks and not the first. Because if the first hits they will be blocking the second attack and Psy AA will punish you.

Zangief Throw assist gives hayato a free corner reset, <Edit> it does work non-corner but it takes timing.

On cable:
s.jp, s.jp, s.fp, HP Guren (2hits) xx Plasma Field, pre-OTG Assist, dash fp, c.lk, s.lp, Black Hayato 100%.

Of course the problem is you have to have Zangief

[xxphilopiaxx]

midscreen...Kill Cable Resets

1. Back + lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, call in sent proj, dash xx fp (juggle) assist hits, wait for opponent to bounce twice, command grab > dash in, call in sent proj, c.fk (juggle), assist hits xx qcf + KK

2. B+ lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, call in sent proj, dash xx fp (juggle), assist hits, during the second bounce, dash under, c.fp, sj.lp xx D+ fk, land, command grab > dash in, call in sent proj, c.fk (juggle), assist hits xx qcf + KK

3. C.fp, sj.lp xx D+fk, land, then...

....command grab
....sj xx D+fk (over head)
....sj xx D+fk + doom AAA xx DP FP. DP FP forces opponent to turn around eat dooms assist sandwiches the opponent between you and doom.

in corner

1. B+lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, j.lk xx D+fk, land, command grab > follow up

2. B+lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, j.lk, j.lk xx plasma ball, land, call in sent, c.fk(juggle) -assist hits- xx B. Hayato (whiff), command grab after bounce, c.fk (juggle) xx B.Hayato.

[Tron Jon]

midscreen...Kill Cable Resets

1. Back + lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, call in sent proj, dash xx fp (juggle) assist hits, wait for opponent to bounce twice, command grab > dash in, call in sent proj, c.fk (juggle), assist hits xx qcf + KK

2. B+ lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, call in sent proj, dash xx fp (juggle), assist hits, during the second bounce, dash under, c.fp, sj.lp xx D+ fk, land, command grab > dash in, call in sent proj, c.fk (juggle), assist hits xx qcf + KK

3. C.fp, sj.lp xx D+fk, land, then...

....command grab
....sj xx D+fk (over head)
....sj xx D+fk + doom AAA xx DP FP. DP FP forces opponent to turn around eat dooms assist sandwiches the opponent between you and doom.

in corner

1. B+lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, j.lk xx D+fk, land, command grab > follow up

2. B+lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, j.lk, j.lk xx plasma ball, land, call in sent, c.fk(juggle) -assist hits- xx B. Hayato (whiff), command grab after bounce, c.fk (juggle) xx B.Hayato.

Jeez! Nice stuff. Can you make a video or point me to one?

[DAWOLF57]

Someone should definitly make a video of this stuff.

[xxphilopiaxx]

Jeez! Nice stuff. Can you make a video or point me to one?

I dont have any videos out, but if ever go home and pick up my digi-cam, ill make one.

glad you like it, ill try to find and post more hayato stuff.

[ShoryuSwordsman]

midscreen...Kill Cable Resets

1. Back + lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, call in sent proj, dash xx fp (juggle) assist hits, wait for opponent to bounce twice, command grab > dash in, call in sent proj, c.fk (juggle), assist hits xx qcf + KK

2. B+ lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, call in sent proj, dash xx fp (juggle), assist hits, during the second bounce, dash under, c.fp, sj.lp xx D+ fk, land, command grab > dash in, call in sent proj, c.fk (juggle), assist hits xx qcf + KK

3. C.fp, sj.lp xx D+fk, land, then...

....command grab
....sj xx D+fk (over head)
....sj xx D+fk + doom AAA xx DP FP. DP FP forces opponent to turn around eat dooms assist sandwiches the opponent between you and doom.

in corner

1. B+lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, j.lk xx D+fk, land, command grab > follow up

2. B+lp, lp, fp, fk, lp, pause, j.lk, j.lk xx plasma ball, land, call in sent, c.fk(juggle) -assist hits- xx B. Hayato (whiff), command grab after bounce, c.fk (juggle) xx B.Hayato.

omgf godlike godlike
im gonna try these rite now
you've opened up a new page in the hayato usage list...i knew u could combo with his dashing fierce, and force them into stun for a moment, but i never thought to use an assist after that makes them bounce and command grab....damn

[Ken34]

omgf godlike godlike
im gonna try these rite now
you've opened up a new page in the hayato usage list...i knew u could combo with his dashing fierce, and force them into stun for a moment, but i never thought to use an assist after that makes them bounce and command grab....damn

if you can do them all, come over my crib, lets make a vid for them.

[ShoryuSwordsman]

if you can do them all, come over my crib, lets make a vid for them.

i plan on it!!!i'll be sure to give credit to philophia of cource :wgrin:

[xxphilopiaxx]

i plan on it!!!i'll be sure to give credit to philophia of cource :wgrin:


That'll be cool. I'll try and find some more stuff, too.

Random combo I do with my team of Hayato/Juggs/xxx

B+lp, lp, lp, fk, fp, lk, pause, call in juggs dash, dash xx FP, assist hits, qcf + fp(otg) xx qcf + KK, dhc Headcrush.

[B&B]

That's crazy.........

Thanks Philopia.

[ShoryuSwordsman]

started the vid yesterday, oughta be round soon

[xxphilopiaxx]

any luck with the vid?

[Ken34]

any luck with the vid?

my computer is currently shot, so it may take me some time to upgrade and get it back up and running.luckly the hard drives are ok, so all the stuff we need for the vid should still be ok. it may take me a week or 2 to get the parts i need to upgrade my computer.

[xxphilopiaxx]

cool. good luck with the vid.