Best single player joystick for PC, Sanwa sticks?

[Kremlar]

I'm looking to purchase a couple single-player joysticks to hookup to my PC running MAME, primarily for Street Fighter games.

I always preferred the joysticks with a "notch" in the corners at the arcades, and from reading around the web those are sticks which have a "square gate" from what I understand. I also am under the impression that Sanwa sticks come with these.

So, I'm looking for a couple single player units with Sanwa sticks.

What is my best bet - any suggestions?

Thanks!!

[JackTenrac!]

PC wise...not sure. Gambling wise you should take in a PS 2 stick and a converter. Helpful section.

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=109037

...but I'm having fun with my Tekken 5 HORI Arcade stick and Sector 7 converter combination. It's a square gate one that has an eight button layout. Pretty good with an emulator because your setup is a WYSIWYG layout. Well, on Winkawaks. Once you understand which button goes where, you will be able to set it up without any difficulty.

[Jake]

Your problem shouldn't be what joystick you wish to use but finding a converter that has good response and doesn't lag like shit.

I've tried about 3 PS to USB converters and they were all horrific. Half circle moves will simply not come out and the lag is just too noticable. That was awhile ago so maybe now there is something better but I don't know.

[Cowdisease]

If you can find a DOA4 stick, you can connect it to a PC via USB. It has a cheapo square gate though, so folks here have done the infamous "Jumpsuit mod" to put in a Sanwa square or octagonal gate. The Hori stick has a shorter throw than a Sanwa stick.

Your other option is very expensive (http://gopodular.com/swappable_cartridge_encoders/computer_pc_mac_linux_arcade_controller_cartridge. htm).

[Kremlar]

I don't mind spending some cash on a joystick as long as it's a good one. I was actually considering a SlikStik from www.slikstik.com, but after talking with them I don' t think any of their sticks have a square gate.

I wasn't thinking PS2 to PC adapter, I was hoping to find a native USB joystick.

I'd appreciate any advice.

Thanks!

[codyk]

Errrm . . . why not an HRAP3 or a VSHG once the fixed ones are available? Both are standard usb HID devices and work fine for mame . . .

[E-bortion]

Just order a custom stick from DreadedFist, finkle, or one of the other makers here. Also, just get the radioshack psx to usb. You guys are trying to make this too complicated :confused: You have choices on the stick though, but I say stick with Sanwa sticks (the end all be all stick, the jlf) and sanwa buttons. Shouldn't cost you over $160. Also, that "gopodular" stuff is a goddamn ripoff. :rofl: Custom ftw.

[Kremlar]

Errrm . . . why not an HRAP3 or a VSHG once the fixed ones are available? Both are standard usb HID devices and work fine for mame . . .

Do both of these have square gates?

I found the Hori Real Arcade Pro Stick 3 on play-asia.com but it's out of stock right now. I assume the PS3 versionis USB? I saw a thread saying to hook it to a PC you need to hold the HOME button for 5 seconds so it's detected - is this a one-time thing? I wouldn't want to do it every time... Also, is there anyone that has this in stock??

Also I looked at the Virtua Stick High Grade, but couldn't find one that said USB specifically.

What "fixed ones" were you referring to?

[Axel Kelly]

Go with a custom. If you're willing to thrown down some cash, it's really the only way to go.

finkle (http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=90296)
dreadedfist (http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=35226)

EDIT:oh, use these with the radioshack PSX -> PC converter. you'll be good to go :D

[Matarick]

Am I the only advocate for the Real Arcade Pro 3 here? It is better than using a Dualshock pcb since it is USB native, doesn't lag, comes with a Sanwa stick, and it is compatible with Sanwa/Semitsu buttons. Not only it is arcade style, it comes with turbo autofire and simulated analog stick controls just in case if you want to play PS3 games on it.

It may be more costly than using a PSX stick but since you want a PC stick; this is the best you can get with a warranty.

[Axel Kelly]

He said that he didn't want to have to hold the home button for 5 seconds every time, which I believe you must do each time you plug it in.

The HRAP3 is a great stick though, and if you can find it in stock anywhere, go for it. :tup:

[chippermonky]

get one from finkle or DF (i'd reccomend finkle). Just ask for a sanwa stick w/ square gate and you'll be good to go...

[Jake]

Radio shack converter is pure shit if I'm not mistaken, I know I've tried the smartjoy, random converter from Fry's and I think the radioshack one was just as bad. If you are serious about playing on mame I'd spend the money on a USB native rather than going the converter route, trying them and end up canning the idea like I did after seeing how terrible the stick becomes on a usb converter. I seriously would rather use my keyboard than my stick on a converter.

HRAP3 looks like a good option, it's a good stick.

[Axel Kelly]

Hm, the radio shack converter has never had any problems or lag for me. Using a PS1 DS pcb probably helped in that too.

I'm sure people can back me up on this.

[tl613]

I use the Radio Shack converter with a HRAP2 on MAME and it's given me no problems, no lag at all.

[koi]

I can make you one with a square gate sanwa & sanwa buttons specifically for PC for something like $135-140 before shipping. PM me if interested.

[Dummy Account]

He said that he didn't want to have to hold the home button for 5 seconds every time, which I believe you must do each time you plug it in.

The HRAP3 is a great stick though, and if you can find it in stock anywhere, go for it. :tup:

Haven't had to do that in a long time myself.

[Kremlar]

I think I'm going to go with a couple HRAP3s - thanks for the advice!!

However - I can't seem to locate any in-stock.

I'm not familiar with vendors to purchase this from - can anyone give me a few places to check?

Thanks!!

[GoPodular.com]

Also, that "gopodular" stuff is a goddamn ripoff. :rofl: Custom ftw.

Ever see or use one? I doubt it because then you would see it isn't some cheap painted box. Make a parts list then guesstimate the amount of time to build it.

Our stuff is expensive because it takes a lot to build it and we don't skimp out on anything. Hardly a "ripoff" when you're getting your moneys worth.

[Decoy]

Ever see or use one? I doubt it because then you would see it isn't some cheap painted box. Make a parts list then guesstimate the amount of time to build it.

Our stuff is expensive because it takes a lot to build it and we don't skimp out on anything. Hardly a "ripoff" when you're getting your moneys worth.

I own 7 arcade sticks for multiple systems - both off-the-shelf and custom. My GoPodular stick is by far the best in terms of build quality, responsiveness and durability. I do not hesitate to recommend the GoPodular stick to anyone looking for a stick.

I've owned mine for 5 months now and I think it's terrific.

~Decoy

[E-bortion]

I didn't appreciate your comment about our controllers being a "ripoff". Have you ever seen or used one of ours?

Ever see or use one? I doubt it because then you would see it isn't some cheap painted box. Make a parts list then guesstimate the amount of time to build it.

Since you decided to pm me I'll make my opinion known to other srkers. I'd also like to say that your previous comment is an insult to the other stick makers on the forums and your pot-shots won't get you any more sales.

Any stick maker will agree the $225-$250 price tag is a bit much. Not to mention I feel that the

overall look isn't with the times so your claims of style don't hold much ground (to each their own on that one.) Also having a "swappable cartridge controller" isn't necessary, especially with many lag free converters available on the market at less than $20. Also, I see nothing of Happ P-360s which would tack on a little to the overall price of a stick (this stick is the more preferred of American sticks) but if you're using Ultimate or Competitions, the sticks aren't that costly. Happs in general are very affordable. It costs around $14 for one competition stick and $2 a pushbutton, if you order in bulk (seeing as how you do, you are a "company") the price scaling makes it even cheaper. Same for the buttons. So, let's say you order hundreds of units of competition buttons and sticks, you're paying about $1.50 a button and $11 a stick... So, let's do the math. 9 Comp buttons, 1 stick... That comes to about $24.50, minus the other "assignable" buttons (useless outside of emulation.) All you have left is the PCB, some laminate, and other cheap things to build the box itself. So, where is this extra $100 coming from? Well, I can see the construction is rugged in appearance, so I guess you could con someone by saying they're paying for "durability" or something. However, your prices are ridiculous and I will say nothing other than your sticks are a ripoff. You con people that know little about arcade sticks.

I'd also like you to take a look at

http://www.massystems.com/ProStick.html

To say your sticks have the legacy and uphold to the standards of mass-systems sticks would also be laughable ...look at the price on those. $150 for a stick that includes a P360 and $100 FOR ONE WITH THE EXACT SAME PARTS AS YOURS :rofl:

There are also a few complaints I have with a few of the things you have said on your site.

"No other manufacturer offers this flexibility in this neat of a package. Search the internet for examples. The only great looking controllers are custom built, by hand, by the person using it. That requires a TON of research, a TON of planning and a TON of construction time. There are several pitfalls to fall into while building a real arcade controller. That is the advantage of the Podular System."

What, are you trying to scare people away from building sticks? What kind of pompous ass tells someone "no, you can't do it, it's too complicated." That's just bad business.

"With GOPODULAR! controllers, you can turn your PC into the ultimate console system. Want to use your controller with a game that only takes keyboard inputs? Then use a software program like "Joy2Key" or "RB-Joy" (part German, part English site). These programs let you map the gamepad inputs to whatever keystroke you need. That makes almost any game compatible with our controllers!"

Oh, so you don't have to use an adapter... You just have to use a program for keyboard-only games. That's not exactly user-friendly for the crowd you seem to be targeting (the uneducated) Not to mention, it's not really 100% pc-compatible if you have to use input-mapping programs. Also, you could at least host the programs on your site as opposed to forcing consumers to navigate through a german site.


"GOPODULAR! does not use substandard "imitation" controls. Some manufacturers are using joysticks and buttons coming out of Korea & China that just DO NOT have the quality and longevity of American, European, and Japanese arcade parts."

What's wrong with Fanta parts? Some people actually prefer them...


"There are very few manufacturers that support cross-platform use, and when they do, they only support it through various adapters. This method "works", but can cause lag and/or button translation. GOPODULAR! offers the only true solution... swappable encoders"

Aside from the bad English, you're yet again deceiving and confusing your customers. The SFAE stick for example is multi-platform. Also, newer ps3 sticks and xbox360 sticks can be used on both pc and their respective consoles. There are also many lag-free converters out there for each console (the innovation for ps2 to dreamcast for example.)

I honestly just see it as gimmicky, overpriced, and a bit misleading. You are not Sharper Image.

I'm sure they are quality controls, I can't say otherwise. However, I refuse to accept the price-tag and the presentation. :tup:

[Taiki]

Words words words

I really don't give a shit. A well built stick is worth the money. Whether it be 100 bucks for whatever MAS is putting out or 220 for a stick GoPodular is putting out. Yeah, it's expensive, but that doesn't mean it's a rip off. I don't like the fact that the things are pretty tiny, but i'm not going to call it a rip off. It's not like he's selling rebranded X-Arcade stuff.

Beyond that, I've seen this guy give advice and tips to stick builders that may or may not try to butt in on his business. Bad for business, maybe, but he's a decent guy. Lay the fuck off man.

[E-bortion]

It's not about the person, it's about the business. Cut the price a lot (at least $80-$100) and you have a fine product. Just don't make so many unfounded claims. Tough love. :wink:

[GoPodular.com]

You can't compare our stuff to Mass anymore than you can compare a Civic to a Ferrari. They're two completely different animals. If I compared a parts list between the two, I'd bet our panels have at least twice as many. If you don't like how they look, that's one thing. Everyone has their own opinions. To say they are a ripoff and a con... you better be able to back that up because I will respond. Since you have never actually seen one of our panels, I don't understand how you can expect your comments to be accurate, much less noteworthy to others. Anyhow...

It is a business. I guess I don't even understand where that's coming from? I own a registered Corporation in the State of Minnesota. I also hold a registered trademark with the US Patent and trademark office for "GOPODULAR!". That's why I had to go through the site and add that little "R" with a circle around it. I run it, my family helps out.

I've never said anything bad about any other builder. In fact, I've made it a point to try and list other builders when replying in threads.

The paint comment is because paint IS cheap. I use it myself on the insides of our panels and on the bottoms. Plus it is 1000x faster to do than apply laminate. Extra time = extra cost.

Please post your information about $20 lag-free converters in one of the many threads discussing that topic. Everyone would appreciate it.


However, your prices are ridiculous and I will say nothing other than your sticks are a ripoff. You con people that know little about arcade sticks.

Quite the contrary. I won't sell a panel until the buyer knows WHY he's choosing the parts he is. That's why there isn't a shopping cart on the website. To buy one, you HAVE to talk to me personally first. That way people can ask questions immediately and I can help them choose parts based on their playstyle. I've had people who have used a variety of joys/buttons and knew exactly which parts they wanted and I've exchanged 25+ emails with individuals where we've tried to determine which parts best suit their playstyle.

Basically, I did my first countertop over 15 years ago and I've been building arcade stuff for 10 years. I've done everything from controllers to full scratch-built cabinets. People liked what I was doing and asked me to make them stuff. Last year I decided to put it online. Each one of our panels are built exactly how I would build it if I was keeping it. There aren't any shortcuts. Each panel has to be wired for for every console even if it's only being purchased for use on a single console. Look at how much of a PITA it is to do a Xbox 360 controller because you can't use a common ground. Everyone of our panels are wired that way. There are 34 soldered quick disconnects inside each box so it's easier to switch a micro if one goes belly-up. The design keeps evolving based on customer feedback and we're trying to streamline the build process. We started a different joystick mounting process about six-months ago. Now we use a studded plate similar to a trackball mounting plate so if you buy a panel with a Happ joystick, you can easily swap it out for a Sanwa or a Seimitsu later. All panels now ship with that custom plate. It has a Happ bolting pattern, so we also have to make custom mounting plates for Sanwa sticks to switch them to a Happ pattern. Sanwa sticks also have to have their grounds split before they can be used with an Xbox 360. Again, ALL panels we ship containing Sanwa stick have to be modified so they are ready for an Xbox 360 cartridge.

We don't use Happ P360 joys because they aren't compatible with all consoles. We did design a circuit so it would work with a PS1/2, but it added too much to the cost. Due to the constraints on the cartridge size, it would need to be mounted within the panel itself, so everyone would have to pay for it. *I* decided it wasn't worth it because the P360 needs modification before it meets *my* quality standards anyhow. I didn't think it was worth it, so out the window it went.

Console specific controllers are easier to make, therefore it should be obvious they will be cheaper. Certain enclosure designs are also easier to make (Mass), and some materials are easier to work with and/or cheaper (paint, melamine). I've made the decisions regarding design, material choice, etc based on feedback from other arcade-nutty family members and previous customers. I'll be honest and say our panels are a PITA to build, but they're built how I think they should be built, and they're built so I'm confident we can provide support for future consoles.

If that's what you meant by calling our stuff a ripoff and a con, then sure. Con me up. :rock:

[GoPodular.com]

If I cut the price $80, I wouldn't cover my costs.

---

Sorry for the derailing of the thread btw

---

[E-bortion]

I'm curious as to what the insides of one of these looks like. Care to post a picture or two?

[Toodles]

Jesus, you got and Xbox 360 controller in a project box? Damn, that couldn't have been easy. You got a pallet of DOA4 controllers you're gutting for that?

Edit: Oh you sneaky bastard. You're not using grounds, you're giving everything its own wire. That's why the high pin IDC connectors. Nice.

[GoPodular.com]

Full wiring is the only way to ensure future compatibility. It requires "extra" work though.

I'll see if I can get some interior pics up on the website over the next couple days.

I have a note about the 360 controller working on the PC on the X360 cart page. "Note: The Xbox 360 encoder can work with Windows, but we do not officially support it in that respect. The direction pad is recognized by Windows as a HATSWITCH. If the program / game title you are trying to use it with does not recognize hatswitch inputs, it will not work." (the bold is on that page as well). I also notify people that they can do that if they are asking about both the PC and X360 cartridge. I've also posted about using the 360 controller on a PC in these forums. It works well, but some people don't like messing with drivers.

If I was trying to scare people away from building their own sticks, I wouldn't be posting here or on BYOAC helping people do it.

Why do I keep switching between "adapters" and "adaptors"? Do the brits spell it with an "o" or something? It drives me nuts and I'm the one doing it.

[Toodles]

That's cool. I'm suprised you haven't offered up PS3 and Wii attachments (using the gamepad attachment) yet. Good work.

[E-bortion]

I guess we can agree to disagree? I still can't add up the price to that amount. One thing though, I'll give you props for supporting a charity (Child's Play) :tup: That's respectable no matter who you are. Trying to decide, but I think I'm gonna buy a kid Bomberman. :rofl: :tup:

[GoPodular.com]

I can flush $75.00 real quick to help balance the numbers:

$250.00 - assumed sale price
($50.00) - federal income tax (assume 20% tax bracket)
(~$17.50) - state income tax (Minnesota is around 7%)
($7.50) - Paypal fees (3%)
----------
Down to $175.00

[Kremlar]

You're taxed on profit, not sales.

[GoPodular.com]

When you sell it, isn't it all "income" under the tax code? Then you work backwards trying to claim some of that money back by justifying costs. At least that's how the tax guy explained it to me. With this type of stuff being manual work, you get burned because you can't write it all off.

Plus with Social Security tax, unemployment tax, medical, and all that other garbage, it's probably in the ballpark. I'll find out soon enough how bad the tax implications really are. :sweat:

[Kremlar]

It's profit, plain and simple. So - your selling price, minus costs (parts, equipment, medical, utilities, rent, etc.).

[E-bortion]

Bump.

[GoPodular.com]

For pics?

They're up on the website in the gallery.


edit to add link -> Photo Gallery (http://www.gopodular.com/gallery/index.htm)

[Cowdisease]

For pics?

They're up on the website in the gallery.


edit to add link -> Photo Gallery (http://www.gopodular.com/gallery/index.htm)Cool pics. Will the disconnect collars that you soldered the wires to fit into to the prongs of Sanwa and Seimitsu buttons?

Also, I have a minor usability suggestion for that page. Make the images link to their larger counterparts as well.

[GoPodular.com]

We use a smaller size disconnect for Sanwa/Seimitsu. The hole diameters are different, so if you wanted to switch from Happ -> S/S, you'd have to come up with a way to "collar" the button so it doesn't slop around in the hole, and then squish the disconnect slightly to make it work. If you wanted to go S/S -> Happ, you'd need to bore the holes larger and replace the disconnects/harness. The wiring harness can be unbolted from the panel, so you wouldn't need to solder inside the box.

Yeah, that is stupid not to have the pics linked as well.