War Stories from Japan

[zass]

awesome posts zass, keep em comming, i wish i could go to Japan and play some ST, btw did you play in any X-Mania?

Ahh, X-Mania. Yes, I did play. Either twice or three times, I can't actually remember.

The way X-Mania worked (back in 2000 or so) was a 3-on-3 team tournament. You see, in Japan, tournaments aren't run like in the US. In the US (at least back in my day -- mid 90s), you'd generally double blind pick characters. Then, the person who lost would get to change characters while you'd be stuck with yours. This led to a lot of metagaming, and counter character strategies.

In Japan, you picked ONE character and you got ONE game. Needless to say, tournaments were pretty brutal and unforgiving. So the game in Namiki weekly tournaments were a pretty fast affair. Depending on the size, it would either be single elimination or round robin. Game in Namiki tourneys usually had a dozen people attending. With three head to head machines, you'd play everyone else once, and the person with the most wins won the tournament. A very fair system (unlike double elimination, which really only places 1st and 2nd accurately). Brutal, but fair.

So X-Mania was a huge tournament, and worked a little bit differently. You had a team of three players. Every player had one character, and you could order your team however you wanted. Whoever won the game would stay on the machine, and would fight another player from that team. The first team to lose all of their players would lose the game. The tournament was single elimination, so if your team lost, it was sayonara.

I played one year with Kuni, and another gaijin named Joe. I had Boxer, Kuni had Zangief, and Joe had O. Ken.

That year, we did pretty poorly. I went first, with Boxer against the other team's Honda. This is a match I would rate as advantage Boxer -- but it's very easy to lose. Jumping back fierce hits all torpedoes, and you can do a dashing kick rush to knock any jump in out of the air. Low strong hits the HHS. The main risk is ending up cornered having to block a series of flying "superman" moves, with the threat of oochio throws. So position is the key to the game (imho), and it's much better to be safe and do blocked damage than to do the risky move and go for big damage. For those of you who play Magic: The Gathering, Honda is the "beatdown" and Boxer is "control".

Anyways, this was my match to win, and I lost it. I felt really bad about this. Kuni had Zangief next, and as we all know, even the most valiant Zangief is no match for Honda. I'm not sure if Joe won or lost, but we lost the match, and that was it for that X-Mania. I felt so bad -- I felt like I had let my team down, and put them in a losing situation. Kuni, if you're reading this, I'm so sorry for letting you down!

Anyways, despite the sour feeling in my stomach, I stuck around to watch the rest of the tournament. It ended up being won by a team with YuuVega playing Dictator, and I'm not sure who else. YuuVega was very good, and deserved to win.

After the tournament, there is a tradition at X-Mania where Kanto and Kansai play against each other in a giant team battle. For those of you unfamiliar with Japan, Kanto and Kansai are where the two largest cities in Japan are located, Tokyo and Osaka respectively. There is a huge rivalry between the two cities/regions, in everything from sports, to politics, to culture. This rivalry extends very much to games, and Street Fighter was no exception!

So after X-Mania, the tradition is that each region forms a giant team. Then the teams go head on in one giant elimination bout. So basically, imagine all the players from the Kanto, and all the players from the Kansai standing in line to play on a machine. All Kanto is on the left and all Kansai is on the right. When a player lost, he was out for good. The battles are projected on a gigantic screen that everyone can see. So each player has his own private machine, and there's a huge screen towering over everything so that everyone can watch.

Now obviously, in such a situation, you've got your great players (Kurahashi, Shooting D, etc), and your "randoms" (Beasley, girls, eight year olds, trained monkeys, etc). The line was more or less mixed, and so you'd get fairly large win streaks when a top player would hold the machine for his side for a large number of games.

Now there is a Kansai player named Tsuji who has a very good Boxer. He's probably the best Boxer in Kansai, if not Japan. I won't say the best in Japan, because in my very humble opinion, Tama-chan (Tamashima) and Kurahashi are both incredible. Of course, both Tama-chan and Kurahashi are from Kanto, and I tend to rate the Kanto players higher since I've played them and lost first hand :lovin:

Anyways, Tsuji got on the machine, and he started a rampage. He started winning a few games, and then all of a sudden it was a lot. Kurahashi's turn came up, and there was a huge "oooooohh" from the crowd as the Great One approached the machine. I was sure that that would be the end of Tsuji's reign. This was a master of epic skill! But, to my dismay, Kurahashi lost. Arrgh! Tsuji was beating everyone, even our best players! His win streak was something like 15.. at this rate, it wouldn't even be a contest. It was unthinkable that Kansai rip through our entire team with ONE PLAYER. I was shocked.

And then, my turn came up. As my name was called, there were a few smattered claps from those that knew me (thanks whoever clapped! Kuni probably :rofl: ). I was a "random", certainly not Tokyo's best. I took a deep breath and sat down on the machine. I wasn't really nervous. I had lost to some random Honda, not even made it past round one, and I didn't have any illusions. I just figured I would try to not embarrass the Kanto area.

So the game started, and I just went for the attack. Standing fierces, low strongs into rushes, and ticks without mercy. Hell, if I couldn't win I would at least throw the hell out of him! I was doing ok, and before I knew it, I had won a round! Yay!! I won a round! I was officially not an embarrassment to Kanto. I could now leave with my head held high.

Round two started, and I don't remember much except that I lost. I didn't get creamed, I did some damage, and I felt like I did okay. At this point, the battle was to save face, and lose in dignity, not ignominy.

Round three. Again, I don't remember much, but I know I hit him with a few standing fierces, and got him cornered. At this point, I went for the trap I had learned from Kurahashi. Jumping strong, low jab x 2, jow strong, dash upper-> buffalo headbutt. It worked! Then I did it again, except that after the dash upper, I just threw. And then I just did a low forward, throw (my favorite! What can I say, the basics work!). I then looked at his lifebar. Oh my god, he had almost no life left! Holy shit!! I dawned on me that I could win this!

Trembling, I stepped back, and did the super motion. Please jesus, don't screw it up. Don't screw it up. The super came out in slow motion.

BLARG (4 ticks of life)
BLARG!! (3 ticks)
BLARG (2)
BLARG (1)
BLARG!!!

The screen went bright yellow. My hands were shaking, my arms were shaking. And then I heard it.

A huuuuge cheer came up from the Kanto team. I saw in my peripheral vision arms being raised, and people clapping. I had won! I'd beaten the huge win streak! I couldn't believe it. I felt like I had represented the Kanto side.

After that, I played a Chun Li player, whom I beat, and then another one, whom I lost to. It didn't matter. I had done well for my team this time. I felt this sense of euphoria. It was silly, this was just an exhibition "fun" game, but I really felt like all of those countless hours playing had paid off. I had done well.

Julien

[EveryFlowerFlow]

i want moar!!

good read :tup:

[ytwojay]

Dope read. More please~

[scum gale 88]

good story, I liked it. a david/goliath scenario

[zass]

I thought I'd add some of the posts from another thread, to consolidate these war stories"

Here's some Japanese players that weren't on nohoho's list:

Claw:

MORE Vega. This is the best Claw player I've ever seen, period. I used to think that Claw vs Boxer was an unwinnable fight for Claw. I fought him 20 games in a row and didn't win a round. He also decimates Dictator players.

Chun Li:

Akishima. I saw you mentioned he retired?? Please say it ain't so. My sempai :sad:

Blanka:

I don't know his name, but he's a very very famous and good Blanka player in Tokyo (I met him around 1999). He had a very detailed Japanese web page on Blanka. He has (or had) long shaggy hair.. kind of looked like Blanka :)

T Hawk:

I've forgotten his name, but I'm sure Japanese players will know who I'm talking about. He was staple of the Shibuya Kaikan arcade, along with Yoshimi and Tencho. Student at Todai. We'd play Hawk vs Hawk for hours.. always a fun match!

Ken:

Yoshimi. How in the hell can Yoshimi be missing from this list! I remember explaining to the American delegation how brutal new ken was before SBO1. No one believed me! And then Yoshimi/Akishima/KKY made it to 2nd place. Yoshimi went from a random Ken that one day told me "Mou dame. Kattenai. ZETTAI kattemasen" (after I'd beaten him about 10 games in a row with Boxer) to someone I considered lucky to win a round from. I also consider him a great friend :)

Dictator:

Makoto. A clothes designer and another staple of Shibuya Kaikan. A great Dictator player, who played tirelessly with Yoshimi and Tencho. I must have played at least a thousand games of Dictator vs Boxer with him.

Then, my reply to Nohoho


Kind of crazy that you mention this, because a Blanka strategy guide with Harahi's web page as a base is a future project for my blog. Moreso than Komoda vids that Harahi page was my inspiration for trying to put together a serious Blanka game.


Yes! Harahi, that's him!! A really nice guy with a perfect knowledge of Blanka. So quiet, so unassuming, and yet he rips through people like wet toilet paper. That's so great that you know who he is! This sounds silly, but it makes me really happy to meet another person who knows about him!! I really feel that he is an unsung hero of Japan. Boxer vs Blanka is one of the easiest fights for Boxer to win, but Harahi wins it!
Now that I think about it, I think I always called him Hirahi. I guess he was such a nice guy that he never corrected me.


MORE Vega. [more bal? sky high claw?]


More Balrog, yes. A very quiet guy, and despised (in the Shibuya Kaikan crowd). But an amazing Claw player. I don't know the nickname Sky High Claw. He was called More Balrog.



Inomata? He might have been the third O.Hawk (w/ Toutanki and K) but couldn't make it to X-Mania 7 because of a schedule conflict.


This player (that I'm thinking of) played new Hawk. It's very possible he's not active anymore.

Thank you for the post. I can't tell you how many memories this is bringing back. I feel this fire in my belly.. I have this absolutely burning desire to play ST now. I wish there was a place I could play it. In Seattle, arcades are dead!

Ouroborus asks why Claw is despised:
whys he despised??

Well, when I lived in Japan, playing Claw or O. Sagat was considered "weak". I guess it's pretty close to being considered "cheap" in the US.

Time out
Way back in the mesozoic era (1994), there were big debates on a.g.sf2 about "cheapness". After many many arguments, it was agreed that nothing is cheap, and no character is cheap, except for Akuma (for reasons outside the scope of this post). I agreed with this philosophy, and happily repeated tick threw opponents over and over again over the years.
Time in

When I moved to Japan, I found to my suprise that no one played O Sagat! There was a couple of new Sagats, but no old ones. Also, no Claws! None except one who was really good at MORE arcade.

For my first year or two in Japan, I didn't really speak to Japanese players or know them very well. I played some A3, some A2, a bit of ST, but most of my time was spent playing Everquest :). Finally, after several years, I found a little arcaded called Shibuya Kaikan, safe from the ravages of Kurahashi and More Balrog, and I started playing there regularly. I know this sounds like a scrubbish thing to say, but at this arcade I could win 5 or 6 games in a row without too much work, unlike MORE where every single round had to be won from blood, sweat, and tears. Anyways, I started to recognize the players there, and they me. The first one to talk to me was a ken player called Yoshimi, who kept trying this incredibly annoying trap based on jumping jab.

After a few weeks, I knew most of the regulars by name, and I started talking to them. I also noticed that if I played Boxer, Hawk, Chun Li, or Ryu, people would play against me a lot. However, when I played Claw, I didn't get a lot of competition. Usually I'd win and then people would play on another machine (there were 2-3 head to head machines). So I'd win the game with Claw, and then move to another machine.

I finally asked Yoshimi what was going on. When I mentioned the name "Claw", he got this grimace on his face. He explained that Claw was an easy character to play, and not fun to play against. I thought this was a little wierd, because I don't think that ken's jumping jab, low short x 2, and then either DP or knee bash trick is very fun either. And I actually thought that Claw required skill. After all, I won a tournament at Game in Namiki with him.

Time out
To this day, this is the achievement I am the most proud of in SF. Not B2, or B3, or Sunnyvale Golfland tourneys, or any of the money matches or road trips or anything that I did in the US, but winning the weekly ST tournament at this arcade called Game in Namiki. I'm sure no one has heard of it, but this was the arcade where I met Tamashima, and he worked with me on my Boxer. It's the arcade where Akishima showed the US delegation how to do walk up, low forward, super with Chun li. This arcade had weekly ST tournaments, and I usually finished smack dab in the middle of the pack. But I won it once!!
Time in

Anyways, I felt that Claw required skill. Especially when I saw More Balrog dominate matches that I had thought were impossible (Claw vs Dictator, Claw vs Boxer). But I was also a stranger in a strange land, and I didn't want to disrupt the "wa" with my play. I was happy that I had found an environment with dedicated ST players, players that knew me, talked to me, and discussed strategy with me (Unlike MORE arcade where I was a quiet observer). I did not want to jeopardize this just to win more games with Claw. So I quietly retired my Claw and focused on Boxer, and, with the help and encouragement of the most amazing Chun player (Akishima) I had ever seen, Chun Li.

I never saw anyone play Claw except for MORE Balrog at MORE. Whenever he did well at tournaments, I would hear a kind of "meh" reaction from other players. "After all, he's playing Claw". I didn't really hear the same from O. Sagat, but there was only one O. Sagat player, a friend of Daigo's. Maybe it was because he played with Daigo, or because he was a regular at a different arcade, but I never heard the same *explicit* derision towards O. Sagat that I heard towards Claw. But in general, there were no more than one Claw or O Sagat players at X-Mania, the major ST tournament.

Looking back, I have to say that this play environment was much more enjoyable than the US play environment. When I played in the US, there was invariably a Boxer, Dictator, or O. Sagat dominating the machine. I actually learned Boxer because I felt I had no other choice. Most of my ST play was focused on these matchups.

In Japan, the lack of O. Sagat was a very nice experience (for me). I felt like I could play Hawk and be "only" an underdog, instead of having no chance at all. I felt like I could experiment with new characters from time to time. Getting raped by Kurahashi's guile was more of an educational experience like "Oh, I can't use my stand fierce here because I get hit by this move", as opposed to the US where it felt like "Yep, had to block a low tiger again. Now that's an expected loss of 10% life before I can get a blocked rush". I came to appreciate this "lower powered" environment. I felt like I got to explore the game space of all the middle tier and lower tier matchups. I liked it, beacause I got to appreciate how interesting and fun these matchups were, and I could pick a character without thinking about the O. Sagat factor.

O. Sagat was my bugbear, but I can see how Claw would be for others. I don't know why people didn't have this reaction with Boxer. When I asked Yoshimi about it, he said that it took skill to win with Boxer, a lot more skill than O. Sagat and Claw. Personally, I didn't mind.. it gave me a character I could win with when I was sick of learning with Chun :).

Sorry for the long winded answer! I guess it turned into more an old man's diatribe. I can see myself in a nursing home, in my rocking chair, mumbling about ST and Game in Namiki tournaments from 1999 :rofl:

I realize that was a very long winded answer, sorry!

Nohoho asks about more Japanese players

zass - Thank you for dropping more knowledge! Fascinating stuff.


Thanks for listening. I didn't realize anyone actually played ST anymore. I would have posted long ago if I thought this game was still played at all in the US.


Could you post a little more Namiki scoop? Did you get a chance to play against Tanaka O.Ryu, Takiba Dhalsim, Bonus Blanka (how did he compare to Harahi?), Ken-O/Gian (how much has his Dhalsim matured since way back then?), Hamaki Honda, etc.?


Tanaka Ryu: Oh my god, you know about Tanaka's old ryu! This is just awesome, I didn't think anyone else actually knew him.

Tanaka played all the time at Namiki. I actually made fun of him a little bit, because he used jump roundhouse so much. We called him "Dai jump kick ryu" (jump RH ryu). He never used the DP, just jump RH.

I actually liked playing Tanaka, because he was a great person to play against. I would pick O. Ryu or O. Hawk, and it felt like super again. I never talked to him but I liked playing against him, since his style was very safe. The worst thing that would happen to you playing against Tanaka was that you'd just eat a jump RH :). I don't think I ever said a word to Tanaka, he probably has no idea who I am, but I was always glad to have him as an opponent.


Tanaka won one of the namiki weekly tournaments once when I was there. I have to say I was a little suprised, because he's not top tier (normally Tama-chan [Tamashima's nickname], Akishima, or someone like that would win). On the other hand, if this hairy uncouth barbarian can win it, Tanaka certain can.

There was another player at Namiki that maybe you'll know. We called him SenretsuChun. I don't know his real name, but I'm sure you can guess what he did. Jump forward, lightning kick. That's it! That's all he EVER did. He was easy to beat, but every so often he'd kill someone that thought he might try something else. So the game would go something like this.

SenretsuChun: Jump forward
Player: (Thinks: hmm, he's done lightning kicks the past 499 times in this situation. Maybe he's going to try to throw?). Tries counter throw
SenretsuChun: Lighning kick
Player: GODDAMMIT. AGAIN!!!

I would always get a chuckle whenever that guy won a game. Obviously he's not one of the top tier players.

Ken-O/Gian: Yes, of course I know Ken-O. He's a great guy. I think I may have talked to him all of five times, but he's a really nice guy. Before I left Japan we had a large street fighter "nomikai" for me where a ton of Tokyo area ST players came to drink and say goodbye. I felt very touched. Anyways, Ken-O, whom I had played for years and never really talked to, started talking to me, and suggested we go out together. He also said hi when I came back to Japan in 2004 to visit.

That said, Ken's dhalsim is top notch. According to Kuni, Ken-O won the all-japan CE tournament with his dhalsim. I wouldn't be suprised. I beat almost every dhalsim I ever met with Claw or Chun, but not Ken-O's dhalsim. I would be suprised if it took more than the fingers on one hand to count the number of games I ever took from him

Takiba Dhalsim: Are you talking about T. Akiba? He usually played new Ken. If not, I don't know who that Takiba is. There was KKY, Ken-O, and another regular at Shibuya Kaikan, he had a beard (pretty unique in Japan), and was a professional pachinko guide writer.

Bonus Blanka: Don't know who that is. I did play once against Komoda, and he was very good, but in my (humble gaijin) opinion, Harahi is the best. Harahi was simply inspiring. Harahi disappeared sometime around 2000, and I never saw him again. Does he still play? Do you have a link to his Blanka web page?

Hamaki Honda: Again, I don't know. There were honda players at Namiki, and Makoto (see above post) would pull out honda every so often. I personally always hated honda as a character. He just seemed like he brutalizes anyone without a FB (except Boxer), and dies to anyone with one. Bob Painter showed us all the power of Honda at the first Vegas ST tournament by winning the whole thing with the sumo (Great quote from that tournament: "I can't believe I lost to fucking BOB PAINTER" -- Mike Watson). But I never liked Honda, and perhaps my dislike of the character prevented me from really noticing good players. I did learn some very fun (for me) and very annoying (for him) anti honda tricks with Boxer and Chun.


Did you play claw vs. Harahi or Bonus Blanka at all? How did this go? Any tips for a Blanka player? (heh, I lost this match at the finals of a local tourney last weekend)


Are you living in Tokyo now? I did play against Harahi a lot.. Kuni knew him, but as I said, he disappeared around 2000. What I would suggest is (cue A Team music): If you have a Blanka problem, if no one else can help you, and if you can find him, maybe you can get Harahi's help. :lovin: I played Harahi quite a few times with Boxer. I can win it, but I'd have to play _perfectly_. You screw up once and you're dead. What I can do ist list some of the things I remember him doing (this is like 8 years ago).

* hop past you, cr forward, cr forward, ball, which dizzies.
* short ball into either bite or electricity.
* repeated crossovers with jump forward. Really annoying on boxer because he leans so far back, he's easy to cross up that way.
* very very precise with his combos. Jump fierce, low forw, stand strong, ball every time, never missed it.
* good use of straight jump fierce as anti air.
* his own version of the new ken "mix up". Jump forward as you are getting up, then low forward. Then either bite, or low foward + ball combo. Repeat.

As for Claw, yes I did play him against Harahi. I think he pretty much raped me straight up and down.


You don't have any video from those days, do you?


I wish...

Thanks for letting me ramble :sweat:

I just thought I'd start posting these stories. I had no idea that ST was still played at all in the US. Back around 2000, it just seemed that a.g.sf2 was all about MVC, and I just thought that ST was a Japan only thing. Anyways, thank you all for your patience in reading this. It feels really nice to be able to tell these stories and have people know what I'm talking about!

[goodm0urning]

This thread is sexcellent. Thank you for taking the time to type all this stuff up.

[9TNine]

Sorry to highjack the thread really quick...

Holy crap, had no idea you moved to Seattle. I'll fill you in on what I know of the ST scene in Seattle.

There pretty much is none.

Preppy, used to I think, and may still own a ST machine at his house, and I know Airthrow and XTG are trying to find some ST players, but it may be console, not sure. The only arcade that people really even go to in Seattle is Gameworks, and Marvel or 3S are the only Capcom Fighters there.

You might want to try posting in the Northwest section if you want to try and find some ST comp. I would think some people would be eager to play an ST Old-schooler such as yourself.

I suppose I could've just PMed you about it, but...

-9

[nohoho]

re: X-Mania. Were you wearing a grey shirt that day?
http://kahyuu.ld.infoseek.co.jp/xmania2001.6.htm

[zass]

re: X-Mania. Were you wearing a grey shirt that day?
http://kahyuu.ld.infoseek.co.jp/xmania2001.6.htm

Holy shit!!! I can't believe it!

Yes, that's me!

http://kahyuu.ld.infoseek.co.jp/koma078.jpg

I had no idea that pic was there. That's awesome! I think that's Otochun holding the camera. That's my Balrog with the super there, against Tsuji :).

[ThisGuileKillYa]

<standing O>

[Jr7891]

Excellent read. Nice work winning for Kanto.

[sir_arthur]

awesome work winning for Kanto,
and how was your second X-Mania? you did better?

[nothingxs]

This thread needs stickied.

[zass]

Wierd, it seems like part of this thread got eaten by the forums :). I do have more stories, I will write them as soon as I can.

[ThisGuileKillYa]

It got deleted with a bunch of the other posts, but I was curious how that hawk technique works with honda since someone in that old thread said it does. I'm just wondering which are the exact moves to use since i dont know if Honda's jumping jab is a safejump. the other dude mentioned "crossing up" so I was confused how Honda's splash worked with that technique unless you just press and hold jab during the splash.

Also wondered if that guy who said he was going to make an in depth ken guide translated by you and/or kuni ever did, and if so, where it is :)

Keep up the great work, I could read this shit all day!

[zass]

It got deleted with a bunch of the other posts, but I was curious how that hawk technique works with honda since someone in that old thread said it does. I'm just wondering which are the exact moves to use since i dont know if Honda's jumping jab is a safejump. the other dude mentioned "crossing up" so I was confused how Honda's splash worked with that technique unless you just press and hold jab during the splash.


I don't have any personal experience with Honda, but from my understanding of the game mechanics I don't see why not. It seems like Honda's command throw can be used without a miss animation, so the only question is whether or not he has a same jump. I'm afraid I don't know the answer to that. Perhaps Bob Painter would know (I don't know if he still posts here).


Also wondered if that guy who said he was going to make an in depth ken guide translated by you and/or kuni ever did, and if so, where it is :)


You know, I forgot about that. I kept Yoshimi's email address but I never really kept in touch with him about that guide. At this point, I don't know if my Japanese is even good enough to translate.. I tried going to T. Akiba's forums the other and I had a really hard time with them. Sigh, and to think I used to post there.

It sounds like nohoho or NKI are in Japan now? They might be able to see if Yoshimi still plays, and if so, get in touch?

[ThisGuileKillYa]

thats cool. im not crazy into ken really, i just love and study every character, so ill read a detailed guide on old dj if someone wants to write it lol any cool techniques you can think of youve seen for cammy, dictator, ryu, or zangief? man, if something akin to that hawk technique DOES apply to honda, may have to give him some attention too hehe

It's like chess openings and magic colors(havent played that in forever, but saw you reference it).. I cant just focus on one or two.. theyre all too great not to learn!

[stream3]

bump

[shadowcharlie]

http://kahyuu.ld.infoseek.co.jp/koma070.jpg
zass who are these 3 people? i see them alot in various japan tourney results

[Corner-Trap]

Quite honestly, this is the best thread I have ever read on any forum.

[geadom]

http://kahyuu.ld.infoseek.co.jp/koma070.jpg
zass who are these 3 people? i see them alot in various japan tourney results

The left one is Tsuji (Boxer player). Chamu (Chun player)is in the middle, and idonno who's the other one.

[Gouki7]

Wow, it seems like ST has such deep roots compared to any other fighting game.

[nohoho]

Geadom - close but no cigar:
http://curryallergy.blogspot.com/2007/02/japanese-ssf2t-player-report-part-5.html

I posted this link in that other thread. Video of USA, Ashitana*, T.Akiba vs. Inro from X-Mania 2000.
* - Aka Good-foot Tanaka, that zass discussed above.
http://www.wikiupload.com/download_page.php?id=134237

EDIT: btw, the end of the third video features a nice example of the "iron" jumping short mentioned on the blog

[Ouroborus]

yo, zass, how do you feel about thawk vs ryu?

[VPT]

I'm not a hardcore ST player, but that was still fun to read nonetheless. Good stuff :tup:.

[sir_arthur]

my question was deleted, so here it goes again.. what about your second or third entry to X-Mania? any better?

[NKI]

It sounds like nohoho or NKI are in Japan now? They might be able to see if Yoshimi still plays, and if so, get in touch?Nah, I'm back in the states now. I was there in 2004/2005. I really wanna go back though...:sad:

[Jida]

Fantastic thread. Shame I didn't read sooner.

[sir_arthur]

so no more war stories?? :sad:

[ToyRobotTerror]

Good read

[Ryu & Ken]

?

dude do you remember a JPN player called Zenji I think and he used to use boxer in SF Dash/champion edition.

what ever happened to him

[zass]

so no more war stories?? :sad:

Sorry for the delay in posting. There are certainly more war stories. I _will_ post them.

In the meantime, I thought I'd start a super turbo blog. I've been getting back into the game since I started this thread. I'm posting how I'm trying to improve and get better.

http://tea-hawk.blogspot.com/

comments welcome.

Julien

[zass]

Around 2000 or so, there was a big 3 on 3 team tournament for Alpha 3. Now I had never really been a big fan of A3 -- to me it just seemed like A2 with harder to execute custom combos. At least in A2, anyone could pick chun li, mash the CC activation, and do upkicks. That's how I took 3rd at B2. But in A2, you had to really time the combos. So it was everything that I hated about a game. Execution heavy, you had to be really precise, and there was one dominating strategy that beat everything else. I'm sure I'm oversimplying, but that was my opinion of A3.

Anyways, I played it, because no one played A2, and I didn't know about the dedicated ST arcades. Believe it or not, I played for years in Japan without touching ST! I just didn't know that there were entire arcades dedicated to ST. If you think about it, it's not as wierd as it sounds that I wouldn't know. You had to talk to players, and get into the gaming community -- at the time, I would just stop off at random arcades after work. I knew some players (I made friends with a couple of Japanese people through A3), but I really didn't know about tournaments. I was basically a random gaijin that would pop his head in an arcade every week or so. Most of my free time was spent on everquest anyways :wgrin:. In fact, it was Kuni that got me into the gaming community there.

One day, I was playing in Akihabara, which was an area of town I almost never went to. As a quick aside, Akihabara is the famous "electronics disneyland" of tokyo. It's where you go to find any kind of electronic piece you want. For example, when I first moved to japan, I didn't know that my computer, which ran on 110 volts, would also run on the Japanese 100 volts. This might be obvious to most of you, but I was in an foreign country with a brand new computer (it could play Unreal 1 almost lag-free, a real powerhouse :rofl: ), and I did _not_ want it to explode when I plugged it into a socket. So I went out looking for a 110->100 volt transformer. Believe me these are not easy to find. I went to Akihabara, with my pitiful second year Japanese skills, and asked around. I got a lot of blank stares, and "what the hell do you need that for???", but I was persistent, and eventually found a back alley that looked like what you see in Jackie Chan movies full of old men and bins of shady and unreliable looking equipment. And one of these old guys had a 110->100 volt transformer!

Anyways, I never went to Akihabara unless I wanted to buy something, because it was pretty out of the way of where I normally went (Shibuya or Shinjuku). TZW's arcade, the famous TRI amusement tower was there, and there was also a SEGA arcade near the station. I was playing at the Sega arcade, and this Japanese guy with big hair is staring at me. We play a couple of games and he keeps looking at me right in the eye! I can tell you this is pretty damn unusual in Japan. This guy eventually starts talking to me, in English, and asks me if I know about US street fighter players. I say yes, and it turns out his name is Kuni, and he used to play with the LA crowd! Cool! So once I got to know Kuni, he introduced me to the tournament scene. I learned about the Game in Namiki tournaments, and it's through those that I started playing regular ST at the Shibuya Kaikan arcade. So thanks Kuni! If it wasn't for him, I would have just played the occasional game of A3 or whatever at random arcades, and never really gotten to know all the people I got to know.

With all of this said, I learned through Kuni that there was going to be a big 3 on 3 Alpha 3 tournament. Now as I said at the beginning, I wasn't super hot on A3, but I didn't play much ST at the time, and there wasn't much else to do. Plus, it turned out that some US players, namely John Choi and Alex Valle, were going to show up. This was going to be a big tournament, not just run at an arcade, but at an exhibition hall, with seats, and a big overhead screen. This sounded pretty exciting! Remember, the biggest tournaments I had been to was B2 (which was in the basement of the MIT arcade), and B3 (much bigger, at SVGL, but still at an arcade). This was at a convention center!! I knew John from B3, B2, and random SVGL tournaments I had gone to over the years, but I didn't know Alex too well. I had seen him win B3, and I had stopped once through LA, where we played a couple of games on A2. But to tell you the truth, I had never really talked to either of them other than the "good game" you give your opponent after a tournament match. Anyways, both of them were giants of the game. The unquestioned #1 and #2 players in the US (at least that I knew of). This was after the famous Daigo exhibition ("push some buttons, Cole!"), so I knew that the Japanese top tier was at its own level, but I was excited to see how these two would do.

I came to the tournament site, and said hi to them with Kuni. We talked a little bit, it turns out that Alex had passport problems and had almost been unable to come. And there was a problem. Well, the problem was that these two were just that -- two. This was a 3 on 3 team tournament. They needed a third player. All of a sudden all heads turned to me. Why not have Julien as the third? My first reaction was of dismay. I felt like I could hold my own in A2, but A3? I'm worse than a random scrub in that game! I played X-Sodom for god's sake! My second reaction was "wow, I get to represent team USA with JOHN CHOI and ALEX VALLE.. wooooooow". My second reaction won over my first. I was in!

I did the obligatory prep talk where I explained to John and Alex that I sucked and wasn't prepared. I explained that I had no idea that I would be in this, and if I had, I would have practiced, etc, etc, ad nauseum. No problem! They laughed it off and said it would be fun. We joked that all the members of "team USA" had a non USA passport! I had a French one, John had a Korean one, and Alex a Peruvian one. No actual USA in team USA! Funny! I guess we were really representing the "melting pot". These two giants of the game were actually pretty cool guys in person! I felt a lot better about it. I ended up going with X-Rolento instead of X-Sodom. I figured I can always catch a scrubby ryu with the super, right? Also he had a decent keepaway game with low fierce. Basically I was playing my A2 characters in A3 without CC's and level 1 or 2 supers. Rolento's level 1 and 2 supers suck anyways.

So our first game came up, and we played against some team. I honestly don't even remember who they played, but we all got skunked. Yep, team USA, flown in from abroad, got skunked in round 1. Well, maybe that's not so bad. Maybe we lost to a really good team, right? Maybe it was the equivalent of Daigo-Kurahashi-YuuVega? Haha, I only wish. I followed the progress of the team that beat us, and on their next round they lost to a team whose captain was a girl. Not only did they lose, but they all lost to the girl. The girl did a once character victory on them!

So let me break this down. Team USA, with supposedly the top US players, lost to a team who in turn lost their entire team to a GIRL. I had to laugh. That was about as bad as it got. I remember thinking of Seth's classic line to Stiltman:


I'm going to get a shirt made up for your inagural tournament
appearance: "I'm the guy who *gives the most trouble* to a player who
was once mentioned favorably by ARTURO SANCHEZ! (the guy who got 4th
at the tournament in question!)". Wear it with pride, Stilt. Your
years of relentless SF play have finally been vindicated. Welcome
to the winners circle- you've earned it, baby


We should have gotten our own t-shirt made. "Team USA: We give minor trouble to teams that get skunked by girls in Japan!". Powerful stuff.

Anyways, the tournament organizers figured we deserved a second chance. We had come all this way.. I think they were expecting some kind of epic USA vs Japan finals, Rocky style, with the crowd cheering. So we got a second chance. I'm not sure how, but we were allowed back in with "an extra life", later in the tournament. I'm sure this would cause a huge outrage at an American tournament. Can you imagine clawing your way up the ranks to the top 8, only to have some random team from Swaziland in the top 8 with you? A team that hadn't made it past round 1? I'd be pretty pissed :mad:. But I appreciated the second life!

Well, needless to say, we got raped again. We all had a good laugh about it. Obviously we weren't top tier in this game. Kuni was a great translator, and we probably have him to thank for our second shot. Kuni was a great proponent of the american "killer" style of street fighter (playing mercilessly, like repeat ticking). I'm sure he was out there telling the tournament directors how great we were.

So that's my story of how I represented the US in the first USA-Japan team tournament. There was another one a couple of years later where the teams were much larger, and it was across various games like ST, MvC2, 3rd strike, etc. But as badly as we lost, I still feel honored that I had the chance to represent the US with two of the greatest players to have ever played the game.

[kane_warhead]

nice read man


post more

[omni]

This was the first time American players had ever gone over to Japan. At this point and it may sound naive - but we didn't really know about Japanese vs. American joysticks let alone buttons and what it all meant. American's hadn't used a ball top joystick since the days of Ms. Pac-Man. No one could have seen that one coming!

I remember talking to Choi over IRC a lot at this point. Alex going had been planned but not for very long. Maybe a month at the latest? Choi going was VERY last minute. The Cannons bought Choi the ticket if I remember right - unfortunately Choi checked his passport and it had already expired. So he had to rush to Kinko's at like midnight then rush to embassy then basically hopped on the plane with nothing more but Gunter's phone number. Kuni picked them both up and as far as I remember they went straight from Narita to the arcade to enter the tournament.

At this point there was the realization of American players not really being able to use Jpnese sticks. So they spent like an hour trying to come up with some solution. At one point I remember Gunter telling me it was like a Jpnese stick with the ball removed and some crazy cylindrical metal piece put on top. Pretty sure that everyone agreed (even Julien) that it was worse than a Jpnese stick.

So they opted to play on Jpnese sticks and no one could dragon punch let alone execute customs. The Chun Li that they lost to however was a pretty famous chun li player - Maki. She used to have a website dedicated to her - The Chun Princess. I'm sure it was some ghetto jpnese geocities website but she wasn't just some random girl.

Everyone left the tournament and basically got back on the plane. I'm like 90% positive that Choi/Valle flew out on Friday here in America and arrived back on Monday morning to go to work. In fact I know Sirlin picked up Choi to take him to work on Monday morning.

So yeah - Daigo came to America and now Choi/Valle have gone to Jpn at this point. Now we learned about the importance of equipment and how it changes everything. After this is when a lot of things changed - like getting the jpnese a cabinet for when they came for B5, etc.

Derek Daniels
http://lowfierce.blogspot.com

[b00mshakalaka]

good read.

[zass]

Also, I found a link to the Kanto vs Kansai results page that I posted in my first post in the thread:

http://kahyuu.ld.infoseek.co.jp/xmania2001.9.htm

ジュリアン（バイソン）
２－１○
２－１○
１－２×

Looks like I won 2 games, then lost to someone :)

[Harem]

Posting in a legendary thread.

[Fuzzy_Snugs]

That was one of the greatest things I have read, ever.

[CaliPower]

LoL.... Ahh the glory days of trial and error :)

[sir_arthur]

awesome story as usual :tup:
keep em coming :lovin:

[BEWD]

Really great read, inspired me to keep playing(had really fallen out of playing fighting games, got Street Fighter Anniversary Collection 2 months ago, but had all but given up on learning 3rd strike after the CPU ripped me several new ones)Hopefully I'll get better with more practice, keep posting man!

[Supremo]

Awesome stories... I couldn't stop reading.
thanks a lot zass

[ToyRobotTerror]

I just read this again and it deserves a bump because i want more stories. This thread really inspired me to take st more seriously. Thanks zass, you rock.

[EveryFlowerFlow]

never knew about the maki ocv, good shit :lol:

[Jimmy Bones]

Best 08 thread yet, could be the best ever.
Great info, good knowledge and good reading.

Witness.

:tup:

[dog-face]

This thread kicks ass.

[sir_arthur]

bump, more ppl got to read this. :lovin:

[Duckdee]

bump, more ppl got to read this. :lovin:

Thanks for doing so! It may sound weird, but this thread got "inside" me.

[Kyokuji]

Old topic, but Maki also had a pretty nasty Chun' in Alpha 3.

Well, when I lived in Japan, playing Claw or O. Sagat was considered "weak". I guess it's pretty close to being considered "cheap" in the US.

I knew about O. Sagat, but I thought the whole Claw thing was just a rumor. Wonder how they feel about O. Sagat getting so much play in the states? Are they all muttering under their breath when they fight them at EVO? Or has this sentiment decreased in recent years?

I know Talbain/Gallon players had a similar stigma attached to them in Vampire Savior.