Optimists vs Pessimists

[Lebowsk1]

Are you full of hope, expectant for the next installment of the legendary series to be the best yet, certain that Capcom can muster the skills neccesary to produce an epoch-shattering gaming experience?

Or are you resigned to the inevitable dissapointment that will come with the selling out of a once worthy franchise, now watered down to please the 'casual gamer' masses?

Here are the rules:

- no fence-sitting. Decide how you feel and pick a side.
- you are only allowed to switch sides after an official announcment. So, lets say you started optimistic but then learnt that SFIV was set to be a split-screen first person fighting game. This could lead you to switch sides and become a pessimist.
- you must provide reasons for your acceptance of one side over the other.

[drobizh]

cause i cant see it turning out any other way.

[Dencore]

Where's the "I don't know enough about the game so I'm deciding to not judge it yet" option?

[True Grave]

Here are the rules:

- no fence-sitting. Decide how you feel and pick a side.
- you are only allowed to switch sides after an official announcment. So, lets say you started optimistic but then learnt that SFIV was set to be a split-screen first person fighting game. This could lead you to switch sides and become a pessimist.
- you must provide reasons for your acceptance of one side over the other.

I'm fairly optimistic right now but if i heard that split-screen crap officially announced, that would easily throw me onto the side of the pessimists. Yikes...(imagines SF4 playing like DBZ Tenkaichi 2).

For now i am Optimistic, until i hear such a dreaded announcement.

[deadfrog]

- you are only allowed to switch sides after an official announcment.

I officially announce I'm switching sides. :rofl:

[Piglets Ghost]

You can't disappoint pessimists.

So I choose number 2.

[SuicidalGrandpa]

I'm hopeful but not expecting much. So...optimist I guess.

[Spin Drive Smasher]

I've liked all of the games from the Street Fighter II series, Alpha 3 (which is the only Alpha I've played), Third Strike (which is the only SFIII installment I've played) and X-Men vs. Street Fighter (which is the only crossover game involving SF characters I've played). Capcom generally has not let me down when it comes to versus fighting games, so I'm feeling pretty optimistic about SF4. And even if the original SF4 is mediocre, I'm sure we'll probably get an improved upgrade or two like we did for all of the other main SF games.

[woof]

shits gonna rule

[snakedizzle209]

Optimistic. Nobody knows much about SF4 yet, but at least we know it's coming now. One minute everybody is waiting for what they think will never come. Then all of a sudden they're bashing it once it finally gets announced.

[polarity]

wasnt this exact thread already psoted

[Lebowsk1]

wasnt this exact thread already psoted

It got deleted in the Great Cull, so now it is back in poll form. :wgrin:

I think it will be most interesting to see how different people react after official announcements from Capcom, but unfortunately you can't retract votes on SRK?

[thedude.com]

i'd be pessimistic when there's only 1 character able to use CC in the game ...

[Rioting Soul]

I'm optimistic that SF4 will be a tournament-worthy fighter that gains the attention a true Street Fighter title deserves.

But I'm sure it will still fulfill the fears of some pessimists on this forum. It will definitely be more noob-friendly than past SF titles.

[alchemist78]

pessimistic, because Im scared it could be 3D.

[Rioting Soul]

pessimistic, because Im scared it could be 3D.

3D graphics or 3D gameplay?

[Pablo_the_Mex]

Optimistic, no way it could possibly be any more shitty than 3s.

[LelandStanfordJr]

I'm not sure how innovative Capcom will be with SF4, given its endless lack of innovation in remaking the same series over and over again (Megaman, 2d fighters). It all rests in the gameplay design. I'm not sure how SF4 will top the likes of DOA4 or Soul Calibur.

The new King of Fighters 3d games tend to suck because gameplay design hasn't really expanded. You do pretty much the same 2d moves with the added option of some sidestepping. I hope SF4 doesn't turn out that way, but it's hard to be innovative with fighting games (Smash Bros. is a good example of creativity).

Remember how the Street Fighter EX series kinda flopped? Hopefully SF4 isn't just SFEX with better graphics and some sidestepping. A new parry system MIGHT put it on the same level as DOA (but then you also have to think about stage design).


I'm keeping my hopes up for Smash Bros. Brawl instead.

[scum gale 88]

A new parry system MIGHT put it on the same level as DOA (but then you also have to think about stage design).


I'm keeping my hopes up for Smash Bros. Brawl instead.
there is something about that sentence that made me feel so....dirty.

[terracotta]

it's going to be good. it's going to be good because if it blows so hard it can't be fixed by the third upgrade, they're not gonna release it.

i'd rather see SF4 delayed indefinitely than the name tainted by a piss poor engine.

[Bobbypigo]

My super combo meter is half full.

[Helter Skelter]

I'm optimistic (ironic, I'm pessimistic by nature).


My reason. Well too be honest, if you voted pessamistic. You probably just want the game to play how you want. That's selfish.

It's the same reason why very few people like all real competitive Street Fighter games.

Basically I'm optimistic that it will be good, even if I don't like it.

[Khentimentiu]

the game will suck, its the dredded 4, no fighting game to date has a 4th title that dident blow, its the curse of the 4 i tell thee, mortal kombat 4, tekken 4, bloody roar 4.. they all sucked, mark my words 4 is the devils mark the game will be a disaster inless they rename!

[hellhound]

I wanna see SF4 break that curse. Of course soul calibur 4 might be able to do it too.

[Lebowsk1]

I was wondering how many people may have switched 'sides' since the release of the screenshots.

[polarity]

I don't really care about the screenshots but I can't say the system information has thrilled me.

[Atb_555]

But you dont know for sure if that shit is all true or not.

[polarity]

Sure, I mean presuming it is.

[Ashenwraith]

Worst comes to worst they put some really weird stuff in there that just doesn't make it street fighter, but I'm optimistic that no matter how they paint the polys, or what game design system they come up with that we are all getting a revamped Street Fighter EX 4.

Its a 'new beginning' for EX and the end for the real series.

A fat girl in a $100 dress is still a fat girl in a $100 dress.


But if you like fat girls then its all gravy...


If you didn't get the analogy just be careful not to get any gravy on yourself or fat girls will eat you... :p

[Snowe]

I vote number 2 because every new street fighter installment simply sucked!


street fighter 1
street fighter alpha
super street fighter 2
Street fighter 3

[Kataklysmic]

Worst comes to worst they put some really weird stuff in there that just doesn't make it street fighter, but I'm optimistic that no matter how they paint the polys, or what game design system they come up with that we are all getting a revamped Street Fighter EX 4.

Its a 'new beginning' for EX and the end for the real series.

A fat girl in a $100 dress is still a fat girl in a $100 dress.


But if you like fat girls then its all gravy...


If you didn't get the analogy just be careful not to get any gravy on yourself or fat girls will eat you... :p

Capcom didn't make SFEX.

[Johneh]

I'll keep my hopes high and let them be let down. I did it for Halo 3, even though I KNEW it was gonna play like beta and I KNEW it's graphics were going to be below par.

But in the end I had fun, and if SFIV offers a good time then y'know maybe it's not so bad if Capcom totally fucks it up and rapes our wallets.

[Cascade]

The vast majoirty of the capcom fighting community are pessimistic and the minority optimistic. I understand that pessimists want capcom fighters like street fighter to remain in 2d graphics and 2d gamplay where the mind games, positioning on basics, projectiles, and etc is best for them even though it has been that way for about 15 years.

Obviously, they are incontrol of Capcom, which makes them dictators over their company. Basically, Capcom isn't an independent thinking company when it comes to a fighter. A canceled game like Capcom All Stars is proof of that. Pessimists judge that game as if it was a rip off of sfex series, which was created by Arika. CAS was canceled without them actually playing it, except for the Japanese. They are bias intensely to the point that street fighter can't be done in 3D. They either dislike or fear change.

Real optimists don't assume the worst for a game by looks or when it's not released. They are open to change of graphics and gameplay depending on what degree of how optimistic they are, which are real fans that don't consistently stay in their old ways.

The way that the community is, I wouldn't be surprised that sf4 was pushed back for years up until now. Looking at the screenshots, I'm only assuming that they want to keep it anime like as the previous street fighter games just for the fans despite having it kind of 3D. However, they could very much do far better on the graphics that could rival vf5, doa4, t6, and sc4 if they choose to make future sf games realistic, because they have the talent to do so if they wanted to. Either they want to take that extra step on rivaling those fighters in terms of graphics, gameplay, or they are hindered on what pessimists want and what they will think of their decisions. If they aren't doing it for them, then I'll take it back.

My conclusion, is that capcom should get out of the traditional way of thinking just for the pessimists and have the graphics where it can be just as stunning as any popular fighter, but if that's not their approach and they want to further improve on the quality they have now, then I'm for it. I'll still end up buying this regardless. Gameplay changes can or cannot remain the same, especially for those who wouldn't mind adapting to something new. But then again, why should capcom care about pessimists? Why not have their street fighter games attract new players and the crowd that actually have an open-mind? The bias crowd should be strayed from to the point that capcom should be apathetic towards them. Products should be sold by decent customers not those who provoke you into canceling them or not buying from you, because they didn't have their way. The classics will always be respected, but that shouldn't discourage capcom from doing something new. After all, they are just pessimists. They don't rule their company.

[Kataklysmic]

Good thing somebody mentioned CFAS. I think it's ridiculous that game was never given a chance, yet SF4 is lucky to earn any positive feedback at all.

[Ashenwraith]

Capcom didn't make SFEX.

I know capcom didn't make SFEX.

SFEX is getting a 'new beginning' from capcom.

[Ashenwraith]

The vast majoirty of the capcom fighting community are pessimistic and the minority optimistic. I understand that pessimists want capcom fighters like street fighter to remain in 2d graphics and 2d gamplay where the mind games, positioning on basics, projectiles, and etc is best for them even though it has been that way for about 15 years.

Obviously, they are incontrol of Capcom, which makes them dictators over their company. Basically, Capcom isn't an independent thinking company when it comes to a fighter. A canceled game like Capcom All Stars is proof of that. Pessimists judge that game as if it was a rip off of sfex series, which was created by Arika. CAS was canceled without them actually playing it, except for the Japanese. They are bias intensely to the point that street fighter can't be done in 3D. They either dislike or fear change.

Real optimists don't assume the worst for a game by looks or when it's not released. They are open to change of graphics and gameplay depending on what degree of how optimistic they are, which are real fans that don't consistently stay in their old ways.

The way that the community is, I wouldn't be surprised that sf4 was pushed back for years up until now. Looking at the screenshots, I'm only assuming that they want to keep it anime like as the previous street fighter games just for the fans despite having it kind of 3D. However, they could very much do far better on the graphics that could rival vf5, doa4, t6, and sc4 if they choose to make future sf games realistic, because they have the talent to do so if they wanted to. Either they want to take that extra step on rivaling those fighters in terms of graphics, gameplay, or they are hindered on what pessimists want and what they will think of their decisions. If they aren't doing it for them, then I'll take it back.

My conclusion, is that capcom should get out of the traditional way of thinking just for the pessimists and have the graphics where it can be just as stunning as any popular fighter, but if that's not their approach and they want to further improve on the quality they have now, then I'm for it. I'll still end up buying this regardless. Gameplay changes can or cannot remain the same, especially for those who wouldn't mind adapting to something new. But then again, why should capcom care about pessimists? Why not have their street fighter games attract new players and the crowd that actually have an open-mind? The bias crowd should be strayed from to the point that capcom should be apathetic towards them. Products should be sold by decent customers not those who provoke you into canceling them or not buying from you, because they didn't have their way. The classics will always be respected, but that shouldn't discourage capcom from doing something new. After all, they are just pessimists. They don't rule their company.

The problem is that the '2D style' is just window dressing.

Its a game with street fighter characters and street fighter themes, but visually its not street fighter.

That's why EX and CFA bombed.

You could make a good sf in real 3D WITH side stepping, it's just a matter of visual style and finesse.

Its sort of like Ninja Gaiden for xbox vs Ninja Gaiden for NES.

The graphics looked pretty good, but the style and clunky 3Dness just made it like a 3D adventure with similar characters and themes - it wasn't a real ninja gaiden.

At least Ninja Gaiden for xbox looked good and was fun to play, I think that's the best you can hope for with SF4.

[KindredSpiritz]

I really wanna say I'm an optimist but I'd be lying, I'm not looking forward to the whole SF IV Brazillian info. I want SF IV to be a true sequel.

[Cascade]

The problem is that the '2D style' is just window dressing.

Its a game with street fighter characters and street fighter themes, but visually its not street fighter.

That's why EX and CFA bombed.

You could make a good sf in real 3D WITH side stepping, it's just a matter of visual style and finesse.

If repetitive rehashes is what make a fighter, then that's an opinion. Sf can be much more than rehashes let alone keeping it 2d. There's nothing with taking a different approach, but unfortunately, people who can't agree with that couldn't or choose not to play sf any other way. That's why cfa was canceled and the animosity for ex.

Even sf games have different opinions, like sf3 with the parrying issue or should I stay sfa2 with acs and ccs, not to mention sfa3 with vism? Guess those games aren't sf either other than hsf. I guess this what happens when capcom does something different despite keeping those games 2d. Everything always have to remain the same to please pessimists. I'm glad that Capcom is actually thinking for themselves this time.

Its sort of like Ninja Gaiden for xbox vs Ninja Gaiden for NES.

The graphics looked pretty good, but the style and clunky 3Dness just made it like a 3D adventure with similar characters and themes - it wasn't a real ninja gaiden.

At least Ninja Gaiden for xbox looked good and was fun to play, I think that's the best you can hope for with SF4.

To compare Ninja Gaiden on NES and the sequel on the xbox version and assert that the newer Ninja Gaiden isn't a real one is illogical. It's the same title and same main character by the same developers. For you to say that NG on the xbox is not ninja gaiden is an epic fail. Temco took it a step beyond taking not only the advantage of the graphics and relation to doa but some of ryu's doa character movements to be transfered to be on Ninja Gaiden with a varies of other moves and a new storyline. It's called advancing your way of thinking, not remaining in the stone ages when their efforts paid off with a nearly perfect score since temco's fans are far more optimistic.

[Ashenwraith]

If repetitive rehashes is what make a fighter, then that's an opinion. Sf can be much more than rehashes let alone keeping it 2d. There's nothing with taking a different approach, but unfortunately, people who can't agree with that couldn't or choose not to play sf any other way. That's why cfa was canceled and the animosity for ex.

Even sf games have different opinions, like sf3 with the parrying issue or should I stay sfa2 with acs and ccs, not to mention sfa3 with vism? Guess those games aren't sf either other than hsf. I guess this what happens when capcom does something different despite keeping those games 2d. Everything always have to remain the same to please pessimists. I'm glad that Capcom is actually thinking for themselves this time.



To compare Ninja Gaiden on NES and the sequel on the xbox version and assert that the newer Ninja Gaiden isn't a real one is a illogical. It's the same title and same main character by the same developers. For you to say that NG on the xbox is not ninja gaiden is an epic fail. Temco took it a step beyond taking not only the advantage of the graphics and relation to doa but some of ryu's doa character movements to be transfered to be on Ninja Gaiden with a varies of other moves and a new storyline. It's called advancing your way of thinking, not remaining in the stone ages when their efforts paid off with a nearly perfect score since temco's fans are far more optimistic.

I'd say it's a fair comparison of what happens when you go from 2D to 3D and how that shifts the game from what it was.

As fun as ninja gaiden is for xbox it doesn't have that badass-acrobat-running-through-a level-and-carving-up-anyone-in-his-path feel to it.

It's an adventure game more related to tomb raider.... you find keys and fight the boss, inbetween here and there you dispatch some roaming enemies.

Even on the hardest mode, the game just gives the enemies a ridiculous amount of life and numbers so you feel like your pounding on punching bags that just won't die - a stark contrast to the quick one-hit kills of the original.

Oh yeah, and don't even get me started on the story, cut scenes, boring music, or the fact that Tecmo didn't have anyone from the original working on it.

Its fun for what it was, but it's no epic ninja action.


I don't feel bad that CFA was canceled because here is Capcom thinking 'time' has made everything better and they can basically go 3D and get away with whatever they want.

The fans have a certain expectation and if the game does poorly its because Capcom decided not to do enough R&D.

It would be different if Capcom had already made another attempt at producing a quality 2D Street Fighter, but they haven't.

As cool as HD Remix is, an XBL game with a recycled engine and asset cutbacks is obviously a toenail clipping of effort when you factor in the might of Capcom.

And like I said, the whole 'it takes too long to make a 2D game' is pure BS.

You can render out 3D sprites a billion times better than you can display them in real-time, and that's not even factoring in touch ups from 2D artists.

You don't need pixel artists - you don't need an animation studio.

Look at this guys work from Assassin's Creed: http://mojette.deviantart.com/

One guy textured and modeled at least 4 high poly/quality characters by himself - damn if one guy can do that you only need like maybe 5 artists and maybe 3 animators to do an HD 2D street fighter game or less.

That's it - 8 people - that's not an army.

Its all just a tired excuses to keep ignorant people in the dark.

[Cascade]

If you knew more about action adventure games and the ninja culture, you would accept the fact that they don't involve hack and slash all the time, they also explore that involves strategy. Not only that, every difficulty above average should be a challenge or more so. This isn't the late 80s or 90s anymore where you kill easy enemies non-stop in multiple stages for nes, sega, and snes. Get with the times.

Opinions don't count, facts do. Your opinion on Ninja Gaiden doesn't counter the fact that it was a nearly perfect score and the millions of copies sold on the year that it was released.

You talk about poor when the fans way of thinking is poor when they can't even decide which 2D sf game is more creditable than the other. No where did I say that 2d takes too long. Read my previous posts and pinpoint where did I say that. I don't expect much for 2d games, since it's nothing I haven't seen before for the past 16 years.

Capcom apparently is tired of recycling. If they want to develop something new, then it's their decision. You have no say in it. And if they want to get new fans with this game, then I don't blame them.

[polarity]

please tell me more about the ninja culture cascade

[Ashenwraith]

please tell me more about the ninja culture cascade

lol, that just killed me

If you knew more about action adventure games and the ninja culture, you would accept the fact that they don't involve hack and slash all the time, they also explore that involves strategy. Not only that, every difficulty above average should be a challenge or more so. This isn't the late 80s or 90s anymore where you kill easy enemies non-stop in multiple stages for nes, sega, and snes. Get with the times.

Opinions don't count, facts do. Your opinion on Ninja Gaiden doesn't counter the fact that it was a nearly perfect score and the millions of copies sold on the year that it was released.

You talk about poor when the fans way of thinking is poor when they can't even decide which 2D sf game is more creditable than the other. No where did I say that 2d takes too long. Read my previous posts and pinpoint where did I say that. I don't expect much for 2d games, since it's nothing I haven't seen before for the past 16 years.

Capcom apparently is tired of recycling. If they want to develop something new, then it's their decision. You have no say in it. And if they want to get new fans with this game, then I don't blame them.

Your point of 'this isn't the 80/90's' really just put you in the dumpsters as far how your opinion or sense of taste goes.

I don't know how old you are, but it seems you haven't come to appreciate the term 'classic' and many games from the 80's and 90's are just that.

Hardly anyone will be playing NG for xbox in 5 years, however many people still play the original NES game and its sequel.

You want to go off about how 'this isn't the 90's' at EVO?

I'm sure then you'd get your 3D street fighter with new bruiseware as plenty of people proceed to kick your ass back to the 90's.

[hanz0]

OG NES Ninja Gaiden > xbox Ninja Gaiden:rofl:

[The Illuminati]

As long as Capcom remains the way they are, then I will be a Pessimist.

[TS]

Optimistic, but it will have silly broken stuff.

I like some of the ideas so far, they could be interesting (I swear the unblockables sound just like the stagger moves from EX, but whatever....). However...first version of everything is broken and has silly stuff in it. CotA, the first Marvel game, SF2:WW, SF3:NG, SFA1 etc etc. It will probably be fun, and I have higher hopes for what I hope turns into a series like the other SFs before it, but I mean...

[KrsJin]

Highly optimistic. More-so now than before this update too.

[Meynizzle]

I'm not gonna judge until I see a gameplay movie.

[bokchoy]

Sometimes, you can't really tell how good a SF game is until months after it's been released. Too early to judge now. I'm optimistic, but at the same time, I wouldn't be shocked if the game was a garbage.

[n8archer_XI]

I'm on the line; Capcom isn't doing much to stick with what Street Fighter should be, except for 2D gameplay...

[KrsJin]

Street Fighter "should" be? Why limit what the game could be by placing predetermined demands on it?

[Dai_]

Optimistic, no way it could possibly be any more shitty than 3s.

or CFJ ....... also i'm in the optimistic side.

[jabhadouken]

Optimistic, no way it could possibly be any more shitty than 3s.

Mark me down as optimistic as well.

:lovin: