Behold Abel

[ToyRobotTerror]

http://cheats.ign.com/dor/street-fighter-iv/768984/images/street-fighter-iv-20080214072246497.html
http://cheats.ign.com/dor/street-fighter-iv/768984/images/street-fighter-iv-20080214072247450.html
http://cheats.ign.com/dor/street-fighter-iv/768984/images/street-fighter-iv-20080214072248247.html
http://cheats.ign.com/dor/street-fighter-iv/768984/images/street-fighter-iv-20080214072248997.html

I've summarized some info:

Movelist:

Best normals:

C.fierce: One of his best normals. It hits for two hits, and knocks them in the air for a juggle on the second. The first hit can be cancelled into a rekka. The second hit can be comboed into his anti-air grab, or linked into one hit of rekka while they're in the air.

f+forward: Awesome poke because it can be normal dash cancelled. Try cancelling for pressure strings, mix up with throw/command grab/more pressure strings. If it hits, the dash cancel combos. (e.g. s.forward, dash, s.fierce)

c. forward: decent poke, can be used an anti air. Can be comboed into rekka.

c.strong: good poke, can be comboed into rekka

j.fierce: his best air to air

j.fwd: his best crossup/jumpin

Specials:

"Terry Kick" (qcb + kick): One of the safest specials in the game it seems. It hits high, and is safe if the correct strength is used. (e.g. use qcb+rh where you should have used qcb+fwd, and you can get punished). Ex version goes through fireballs.

Rekka (qcf+p, f+p/k, f+p/k): His foundation. This is how you will be doing most of your damage. Combos off most of his normals, and ex absorbs a hit i think. It can be SADC'ed into a c.fierce.

anti air grab (srk+p): better used in combos than anything else. Angle is awkward for anti air, and gets stuffed/trades a lot. Don't depend on it too much

Roll: Very useful move. Use this for positioning, escaping, roll/throwing noodleman, roll command grab etc. Note that you can be swept or thrown out of it.

Main combo that seems to be floating around:

st.fwd, dash cancel, st.fierce, rekka, SADC, c.fierce, roll, c.fierce anti air grab

[Icege]

bumping this thread for Abel gameplay discussion

His c.hk looks really good, but punishable. So far I'm hearing c.hp hits twice, the 2nd hit can allegedly combo into his ex anti-air grab while the first can be canceled into the rekkas.

c.mp is cancelable into rekkas as well.

[UltraDavid]

Crouching roundhouse is cancelable into whatever, so if it is punishable (don't know if it is), don't expect it to be punished very often. And yeah, both hits of crouching fierce are cancelable, and you don't have to use the ex version of his antiair grab to combo out of it, you can do the regular one.

He also has a super strong crossup in jumping forward. Sanchez was doing this really well Friday, with crossup jumping forward into whatever, hit confirmed into longer combo or throw if the opponent blocks.

[Icege]

Could I get a description on his normals please, aside from c.hk and c.hp?

Is his c.mk the one that looks like Blanka's s.mk in World Warrior?

Can he chain c.lk or link c.lks? From what I'm seeing, he doesn't have any actual lows to combo into aside from c.hk. Maybe c.lpx2, c.lk xx Rekkas?

Is any rekka string completely guaranteed?

Is the heel kick safe?

What's the range like on Tornado Throw?

What about his air normals? j.mk is the one that looks like Shooto j.hk kind of? I'm guessing j.mk is the one that looks like his c.mk but airborne while the knee is j.lk. How good is the knee? I like the way it looks :)

Sorry about all the questions, I'm just irking to get some actual gameplay info on somebody aside from Shootos and Rufus >.>

[Kunai]

I have a lot of good Abel vids that I will post later. In the process of converting all of them to Youtube. Please check the video section later.

[UltraDavid]

Don't know, ATB, those were just random things I picked up from watching my friend play. But I can tell you that once the canned mixup string is started, the whole thing is guaranteed, even the throw at the end, and I can also tell you that I couldn't figure out a way to punish heel kick in the 2-3 matches I had against Abel, so it might be totally safe. Looks like it is.

[Gasp]

i saw someone doing his j.mk crossover into the 2 hit elbow (c.hp?) into his antiair grab repeatedly

[Sanchez]

Might as well do my Abel work here--

Most of his normals are like classic Shoto normals. Think CVS2 Ryu. Cl. MK is a kick to the balls.

Cr.MK, Rekkas works. If the 1st hit for the Rekka connects it all goes through. EX Rekkas can take one hit for the 1st part of the move and keep going.

For AA options he has Cr.Fierce, AA grab, and maybe far MK. Far MK looks like the old Shoto MK. I'm not sure if EX AA Grab has any other property to it besides the different animation.

Cr. LK x2 into Rekkas MAY be possible. I saw Combofiend do cr. LK x 2 into Super.

Wheel Kick looks pretty safe. Hard to tell this early on.

I didn't get a chance to test the max range on his command throw. I was doing the EX version most of the time. I know that it probably falls somewhere between his the reach of his Jab and his Stong.

Jumping RH is angled upwards. Kind like the jump straight up Shoto RH is 3S. Jumping MK is a good cross up.

Cr. Fierce is cancelable on both hits. The second hit is the one that launches.

At one point I did Cr. Fierce and canceled the 2nd hit into the Super. The Super continued on like it hit on the ground. It may be like Iori's Maiden Masher is CVS2.

Ultra has pretty good reach but, like most Ultras, it isn't instant. Easy to jump over after the flash.

More after I recover from FFA SBO quals fatigue...

[Sanchez]

EX command roll is possible! No idea wtf it does.

I tried sweep, EX roll, cancel into saving attack for the worlds slowest ground cross up... AND IT WORKED. I love Abel. Shenanigans all over the place.

Using EX Tornado Throw on the opponents wake up is mad juice. I saw a Ryu try for wake up DP and Abel was like "pfft, fuck that" SPIN SPIN SPIN SLAM. Get people scared of the EX throw and they'll start jumping out. You got a nice mix up game with Falling Sky and the Wheel Kick to fuck that option up.

My goal with Abel is to get someone to jump on wake up so I can use the roll and get behind their jump. LET'S HOPE THIS WORKS.

Seth's suggestion if you get someone stunned is to go for a level 3 Focus Attack and continue your business from there. About the same damage as doing a jump in. Maybe more.

Claw seems like an awkward match up.

[humbag]

Yeah I have seen some vids where post stun they go for lv3 FA->combo.

Level 3 FA seemed to do a LOT of damage.

[Icege]

From what I've read, you can do lv3 FA->dash cancel, c.hp xx anti-air throw (EX or reg)

I wonder if s.hp into rekkas would work afterwards. Damage would be better?

I saw Ken DPing between the rekkas on block. Bait?

How effective is it to Tornado Throw whiffed normals? I find that really funny :P

[Sanchez]

Sanchez' 2nd match playing Abel. You can hear me explain focus attacks and random Abel shit to Gootecks. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhsqlBv6ysM)

Dash up Cl. fierce x Rekkas works post focus.

Sadly, I don't think the match where I perfected UltraDavid was recorded.:sad: Our last match of the night was epic. We double KO'ed and then David went ST on me and closed the match with cross up splash, jab tick into 720 super only to follow it up with and immediate dash up jab into ULTRA 720!

Abel screams some long phrase when he loses. Probably Japanese, but it sure does sound like AYYY MOTHERFUCKAAAAAA.

[humbag]

Id imagine the c.fp->air grab does more damage.

just c.fp->grab by itself did a lot of damage. After lv3 FA anything into rekkas would work or like

lv2/3 FA->dash->whatev into first rekka hit->super.

Anyone know if FA combos scale? If so I bet doing the super wouldnt be worth it unless to kill.

[Atb_555]

Awesome shit guys :tup:


I have a lot of good Abel vids that I will post later. In the process of converting all of them to Youtube. Please check the video section later.

So looking forward to it thanks dude :tup:

[Ultima]

Rekka chain damage got raped. :(

[humbag]

Rekka chain damage got raped. :(

What it looks like.

So c.hp->air grab is his best bnb?

[Tizoc]

What do the follow-ups to his QCF+P do exactly? IIRC F+P does an overhead punch while F+K does a grab right?

[Sanchez]

What do the follow-ups to his QCF+P do exactly? IIRC F+P does an overhead punch while F+K does a grab right?

:qcf:+:p:, :r:+:p:/:r:+:k:(Overhead punch/Low Kick), :r:+:p:/:r:+:k:(High unblockable*?* grab/Low blockable grab)

[Atb_555]

Entire move list for Abel is here: http://www.capcom.co.jp/sf4/command/index2.html

Scroll down a bit

[UltraDavid]

Sadly, I don't think the match where I perfected UltraDavid was recorded.:sad: Our last match of the night was epic. We double KO'ed and then David went ST on me and closed the match with cross up splash, jab tick into 720 super only to follow it up with and immediate dash up jab into ULTRA 720!Haha douche! It's true though. The super and ultra did just about all the damage I dealt that round, I don't remember if I even hit you outside of those two moves.

[JohnMc]

Entire move list for Abel is here: http://www.capcom.co.jp/sf4/command/index2.html

Scroll down a bit

Thanks. I was worried when I first saw him that he would be another 360 guy.

[-=KOH=-]

Damn, after watching the few videos in this thread, I went from despising Abel's character design to actually liking it, don't understand why. Wonder how he'll tier relative to alex in 3s

[Atb_555]

Thanks. I was worried when I first saw him that he would be another 360 guy.

Originally he was in earlier builds. Im glad he isnt, 1 frame half circle command throw looool.

Fun times to come!

[deadfrog]

On paper, Abel's COD sounds absolutely crazy, maybe even nuttier than El Fuerte's run moves. I'm sure in practice it's not as bad but just written like that it screams ez-mode mixup, haha.

Both characters seem like they'll be a blast to play, though. :smile:

[humbag]

WAIT...

Abels command grab is a HCB motion like Alex in SF3?

...FUCK YES!

It better be one frame too. Confirmation?

[Atb_555]

According to this hombre it is: http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=160422

Loool

[Golden_Gunman]

The grab was changed from 360 motion to Half Circle in one of the latter loke tests.

[SN3S]

The grab was changed from 360 motion to Half Circle in one of the latter loke tests.

WOOO!

:woot:

Makes it so much better for my scrubby hands. :rofl:

[Icege]

So all of Abel's crouching pokes can be canceled?

Does he have any links or chains?

Any word on c.lk, c.lk xx rekkas being possible?

Which does more damage: c.hp (2 hits) xx dp+hp or close s.hp xx rekkas?

What does the EX anti-air grab do? Anything special? Can you dash cancel it into other stuff? Maybe dash cancel into a super/ultra?

Would cross-up j.mk, land, close s.hp xx qcf+PP, f+P xx Focus Attack xx dash cancel, c.hp xx EX dp+hp or Rekkas again work?

[RagingStormX]

how safe are rekkas when blocked, which hit do you stop at?

[Sanchez]

Gief can SPD your ass for every hit blocked past the 1st. Everyone else can sneak in a cr. lk or anything fast enough.

EX air grab has a different animation for the hit. I didn't check to see if he had armor or anything special for it.

[JohnMc]

Damn, after watching the few videos in this thread, I went from despising Abel's character design to actually liking it, don't understand why. Wonder how he'll tier relative to alex in 3s

So did I. Plus since his style is Combat Sambo which is MMA with wearing a Judo style Gi top there is alot of stuff that Capcom can be do with him as far as future releases go [Ie. adding extra submissions [assuming he has them already] adding additional Judo style or even wrestling style throws and/or improving his punches and kicks.

[Rojo]

What does the EX anti-air grab do? Anything special? Can you dash cancel it into other stuff? Maybe dash cancel into a super/ultra?


I only played him once. But sometimes EX AG would trade hits, and you just now gave me an idea. I wonder if you can ultra after, since they fly up in the air on trade?

You can do cross up j.mk,c.fp (2hits) ultra. In truth, I think thats the only time his ultra should be used. Unless you're great at reading your fireball happy opponent.


Gief can SPD your ass for every hit blocked past the 1st. Everyone else can sneak in a cr. lk or anything fast enough.

EX air grab has a different animation for the hit. I didn't check to see if he had armor or anything special for it.

Gief can also spd your ass if your stop rekkas on hit and try to go for a command throw mix up. It's as if you have to finish the rekka series on him.

[FullMetalRoss]

The Ex anti-air has some invincibility.

Everybody can throw the rekka's inbetween the first and second hits on block.

Couldn't find any focus attack cancel combo. But I heard that one hit rekka focus attack cancel dash foward cr.mp into rekka's does work.

EX roll seems more invincible and way faster. still not unthrowable though.

Abel is tight. Tons of fun to play.

[burn piano isle]

Can Abel's HCB+P throw catch crouching opponents?

[FullMetalRoss]

Can Abel's HCB+P throw catch crouching opponents?

yeah its a regular command grab.

[CFAY]

here's some stuff i know about abel......

he can c+hp to ultra but timing is key

he can also c+hp, roll, c+hp again but nothing else

also c+hp, roll , anti air grab or super or rekka but only the first hit from the rekka will connect. i tried to cancel that first rekka hit to super but the super just missed completely

c+lp, c+mp works like 10% of the time

that ex flip over kick move is very useful even as an anti air if youre quick enough. it'll go through fireballs and its fast enough to catch people off guard as an overhead.

B+mk is a good set up for command grab. its basically one of those attacks that whiffs on crouching characters and advance you forward a bit

he can spam real good with standing LK. a lot of good abel players like to spam stand LK into random dash forward grab or c+hp since people like to try to jump away.

his anti air sucks

[FullMetalRoss]

here's some stuff i know about abel......

he can c+hp to ultra but timing is key

he can also c+hp, roll, c+hp again but nothing else

also c+hp, roll , anti air grab or super or rekka but only the first hit from the rekka will connect. i tried to cancel that first rekka hit to super but the super just missed completely

c+lp, c+mp works like 10% of the time

that ex flip over kick move is very useful even as an anti air if youre quick enough. it'll go through fireballs and its fast enough to catch people off guard as an overhead.

B+mk is a good set up for command grab. its basically one of those attacks that whiffs on crouching characters and advance you forward a bit

he can spam real good with standing LK. a lot of good abel players like to spam stand LK into random dash forward grab or c+hp since people like to try to jump away.

his anti air sucks


SRK ate my post....

Anyways a few questions

so I'm guessing after the cr.hp, roll, cr.hp even if you cancel the second cr.hp the grab won't connect? thats what it sounds like you are implying but I just wanted to know.

Perhaps does cr.lp, cr.hp have to be ch cr.lp? Or I guess it could just be a really tough link.

Also for anti-air if you get a chance could you try close rh? it seems like it might work but I don't know if its fast enough...

[dominic]

Hey folks, we dont have any machines in Aust yet but I have a few niggling questions.

What are Alex's main anti air options?

Is the rolling move effective against fireball spammers? Or are there alternatives?

What does the EX change with his command throw? Is it faster? More damaging?

Does he have any bread and butter combos outside of his special moves?

Thanks guys.

[CFAY]

SRK ate my post....

Anyways a few questions

so I'm guessing after the cr.hp, roll, cr.hp even if you cancel the second cr.hp the grab won't connect? thats what it sounds like you are implying but I just wanted to know.

Perhaps does cr.lp, cr.hp have to be ch cr.lp? Or I guess it could just be a really tough link.

Also for anti-air if you get a chance could you try close rh? it seems like it might work but I don't know if its fast enough...


ok just to make things easier, its the LK roll which will get you in the right location to drop another c+hp. even if you cancel the first c+hp, after the second one the grab will miss but i wouldnt waste my bar for that even if it was possible. maybe if the opponent gets hit from only the second hit of the c+hp, the grab might work after the second c+hp but i havent tried. i'm trying to find a way to get a level 2 SA in one of his juggle combos to deliver more damage.

never tried c+lp, c+hp. i'll try it out later if i play. i would prefer c+p though just because its more safe. his c+hp leaves you open just as bad as urien. you can always rekka after a blocked but watch out, every time he does a rekka and its blocked, it seems like a DP will hit him before he can block or follow through with the second overhead hit. no doubt that a super will hit him also.

his c+mk is a strange anti air with works on some attacks. his b+mk also works sometimes and then there is the usual c+hp but all these like to trade. his anti air grab is no KOF goro daimon air throw so relax and get it off your mind. even the ex version is likely to trade. its best used to grab people who try to jump away when expecting a regular command grab. basically you get more free jumps on abel than viper.

i really dont know what ex changes about his command throw but it seem more invincible so more than likely itll grab you out of some special moves better than the normal version would. not sure if range is affected but damage surely is.

dont know of an bread and butter without special moves but multiple c+lk into standing lk is cool, good SA killer and a good set up.

[Edpachi]

so how many supers abel have

[FullMetalRoss]

like everyon else he has two. The regular super and his ultra.

[1der]

I know its been mentioned before, but even though Abel is French he is inspired by Fedor Emelianenko. I've seen alot of other people mention Zidane and rugby and savate, etc. He's none of the those. No doubt the reason his country of origin is France is the same reason Dictator is called M.Bison and Boxer is called Balrog in the States.

I did a quick Photoshop of the two and the overlay of their faces was so easy.
[IMG=http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/7576/fedorabelcopyid4.th.jpg] (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=fedorabelcopyid4.jpg)

Original Fedor Pic I used just for reference and testimony to the poor quality of my ps skills.
http://members.tripod.com/thechamp97/FedorEmelianenko.bmp

im looking for one of Fedor's combat sambo expedition videos where hes wearing the blue sambo gi and the shorts and the resemblance is clear.

the lead overhand right for his change of direction moves is another staple of Fedor. Toss in the power double leg and i think i've seen a judo style trip. MMA hits fighting games, hopefully to wipe out the bad taste of Marduk from Tekken.

Blah blah blah...I could go on like a pompous windbag but check it out for yourself. Look up Fedor "the Last Emperor" Emelianko.

I look forward to playing Abel in SF4.

couple of questions...how punishable is his change of direction swing if the first hit is blocked? how about if the first hit isnt blocked?

can you hit confirm the string to some degree?

I keep see his poor AA game, what his AA throw like? is the EX windmill/overhead kick his best AA?

[Sanchez]

I'm willing to bet I've clocked in the most Abel hours in America.

A lot of these questions have already been answered... BUT FUCK IT!

On the Rekkas(Change of Direction)
-If the 1st hit connects the :p:,:p: follow goes through without fail.

-If the 1st hit is blocked, but the second :p: hit connects the last :p: will connect.

-EX rekkas will take one hit and keep going. You still take damage.

-On block you can get thrown and poked with jabs/shorts before the last hit connects.

On the AA Grab(Falling Sky)
-It looks like the move is active before the animation of his hand extending even happens. Really need to us the move preemptively for maximum effectiveness.

-I don't think EX the move does anything more than change the damage and the animation of the follow up. It traded with Zangief's jumping MK(BTW THAT MOVE IS FUCKING BULLSHIT:arazz:FUCK YOU MIKE Z) which made Gief fall to the ground with no grab follow up by Abel.

-AA grab whiff recovers quickly. I was using the AA grab canceled from blocked sweeps to get better recovery. Using the EX rekkas afterwards to punish counterpokes.


On the Command Grab(Tornado Throw)
-Ticks off cr. LK nicely.

-Is pretty fucking fast.

-EX version takes one hit and keeps going. Actually a good wake up move!


On the Sean Kick(Wheel Kick)
-Pretty fucking safe. You can annoy the shit out of Gief with the move.

-Hits overhead.


On the Roll(Roll)
-It goes through things.

-It can be grabbed.


On the Super(Heartless)
-Cr. Fierce into Super works.

-Two hit standing fierce into Super works.


On the Ultra(Soulless)
-Like every ultra it's SLOOOOOOOOOWW.

-Plows through fireballs and other moves nicely.

-Cr. Fierce Ultra works.

-Looks like it loses to lows.


On random shit(ETC.)
-Far standing MK is a pretty good anti air.

-Sweep cancels into specials.

-Jump MK is his only good jump in. Crosses up nicely.

-Other air normals better suited to AIR TO AIR situations.

-Close MK, Close MP, Cr.MP, Cr.MK, and Cr.HP all cancel into specials.

[dominic]

Wow Sanchez that was pretty much everything I wanted to know about Abel. I am glad he has two EX moves that ignores hits, thats pretty special.

As soon as this game hits Australia I am going to be going crazy with Abel, I can't wait.

[Don Mack]

Whats wrong with Marduk?

[JohnMc]

im looking for one of Fedor's combat sambo expedition videos where hes wearing the blue sambo gi and the shorts and the resemblance is clear.



I think you're better off using Abel's seconday costume. Fedor usually comes out to the ring wearing a Red Kurta [or Gi top if you prefer] Abel's secondary is a Red Kurta and black mma shorts [I'm not including the purchasable wrestling singlet btw] Most of the videos I've seen of Fedor in Combat Sambo have been of him in Red.

[1der]

I think you're better off using Abel's seconday costume. Fedor usually comes out to the ring wearing a Red Kurta [or Gi top if you prefer] Abel's secondary is a Red Kurta and black mma shorts [I'm not including the purchasable wrestling singlet btw] Most of the videos I've seen of Fedor in Combat Sambo have been of him in Red.

All that stuff is correct, but this is the video i was talking about. 15 seconds in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StE8YrNjFGo

[JohnMc]

All that stuff is correct, but this is the video i was talking about. 15 seconds in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StE8YrNjFGo

Thank 1der. Great find. Most of the videos I've seen of him he's always seems to be wearing the Red Kurtka. Fedor is a great fighter to base a character on.

[shoo]

Sanchez best abel in america?

we have fun

[1der]

Whats wrong with Marduk?

Snakeskin vests and leather pants. Also I never liked his groundwork mechanics especially when compared to King's combo throws. I don't really know the character all that well though since I don't play him.


Thank 1der. Great find. Most of the videos I've seen of him he's always seems to be wearing the Red Kurtka. Fedor is a great fighter to base a character on.

No prob. My MMA library is comprehensive.

Sanchez: Thanks for all the info you've provided.

[dominic]

-Sweep cancels into specials.


I am not sure I understand, if you sweep somebody dont they fall to the ground? How can you hit somebody with a special if they are on the ground? I remember hearing that you can combo from the sweep into the Sean kick but again I had the same problem with that idea.

Am I misunderstanding something?

[humbag]

I am not sure I understand, if you sweep somebody dont they fall to the ground? How can you hit somebody with a special if they are on the ground? I remember hearing that you can combo from the sweep into the Sean kick but again I had the same problem with that idea.

Am I misunderstanding something?

You cancel his sweep into a special to cut the recovery down on the sweep or if the sweep is blocked: sweep->axe kick/rekka would be good pressure.

[catalyst_nc]

Hey all, I've updated the Abel guide on my site with some new information.

http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/jul/08/abel-street-fighter-4-character-guide/

I've also taken stuff guys said on this thread and added it in there. I've given you credit down on the bottom of the guide.

If you notice anything that's off, or you'd like me to add in, just let me know.

And thanks for all of the information.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Just tried Abel out today, he's a BEAST. I'm going again tomorrow.

SF4 is 5 mins from my work :D

[dominic]

Just looking for some clarification guys on the Change of Direction move (Rekkas?).

So as long as the first overhead hit is not blocked then the rest of the moves (the directions and kicks or punches) will always connect?

And if the first overheard hit is blocked is the only way you can be punished is after the first mix up just before the second (grab) one? Or can you be punished before the first mixup?

thanks guys.

[FullMetalRoss]

I don't hink the overhead is safe. Especially not from reversal spds. Only thing that combos after the overhead is the b+P everything else has a gap that is punishable.

[changuillo]

Is is posible to use Abels Sean kick to hit the opp as a cross-up while he is getting up???

[FullMetalRoss]

I highly doubt it. But I am not 100% the move just hits way to far out in front for me to think that works.

[dominic]

I have been thinking of Abel's Change of Direction some more and some possible mix up situations. Could you mix it up a bit by deciding not to continue with the f.p or f.k after the initial hit or block and instead just do his command throw?

surely this would mess with somebody used to the normal combo.

[changuillo]

I have been thinking of Abel's Change of Direction some more and some possible mix up situations. Could you mix it up a bit by deciding not to continue with the f.p or f.k after the initial hit or block and instead just do his command throw?

surely this would mess with somebody used to the normal combo.

acording to what ive read, the rekkas are kind of unsafe, though if someone who has actually played abel can answer it would be great.

I was asking about his sean kick, because if it can cross-up, you could do it a bit early and when the opp rises, give him a command grab.

[CFAY]

acording to what ive read, the rekkas are kind of unsafe, though if someone who has actually played abel can answer it would be great.

I was asking about his sean kick, because if it can cross-up, you could do it a bit early and when the opp rises, give him a command grab.

rekkas are all unsafe. after the first hit, you can hit him whether he does the overhead/sweep or not. if he does the overhead and decides not to follow up with the throw, he can still get hit but you rarely see any good player block the whole rekka sequence. just dont think you'll be taking off too much life with straight rekka mix ups.

its hard to know for sure if that sean kick crosses up since all abel knock down moves give you just about enough time to get back on your opponent right before they recover. i've noticed that with the ex version, no matter where on screen i do it, he never goes behind the opponent but even if he does, you'll not have priority to attack first. his roll is his true get behind the opponent move. you can simply sweep, roll.....he has three ranges of rolls so you can decide where you want to end up.

[dominic]

I just watched this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQwYVNE-6g4

and it seems that the first blow of Change of Direction was blocked, but the second mix up was not, however then the third mixup was dodged. Look at about 50 seconds in.

I thought as long as the second hit connects, regardless of the first one, the final mixup grab thing will always get in.

[CFAY]

I just watched this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQwYVNE-6g4

and it seems that the first blow of Change of Direction was blocked, but the second mix up was not, however then the third mixup was dodged. Look at about 50 seconds in.

I thought as long as the second hit connects, regardless of the first one, the final mixup grab thing will always get in.


he has two final grabs to end that move, one with K and one with P, the one with K seen in that vid can be blocked even if the overhead connects but if he had done the one with P then it would connect once the overhead connects. the grab seen in that vid is best used in conjunction with the low sweep and not the overhead.

[DaDesiCanadian]

<--- Best Abel user in Canada.


<--- .... only Abel user in Canada.

Ok, someone needs to explain CoD to me. After the first hit, punch or kick makes a hit which connects normally.. but then he seems to get into lag frames, where he can be hit/SPD'ed. Unless I press K/P again, which he can be hit out of. Explain.

[changuillo]

<--- Best Abel user in Canada.


<--- .... only Abel user in Canada.

Ok, someone needs to explain CoD to me. After the first hit, punch or kick makes a hit which connects normally.. but then he seems to get into lag frames, where he can be hit/SPD'ed. Unless I press K/P again, which he can be hit out of. Explain.

In other words, his rekkas are unsafe on block.

But if you hit them with the first or second rekka, the third imput (the throw) will combo normally.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Abel's ultra actually seems to be one of the most useful in the game. Here's why:

- Goes through fireballs at any stage of the animation. That means if the fireball still hasn't left the guys hand, or if it's about to hit you, or if it's halfway to you, you will hit the guy clean.

This means you can input the motions WHILE Ryu's doing the chargeup for his ultra, and you will hit Ryu clean. But, it has pretty bad range.

- It's unblockable in the air, so if you zone it right, you can hit people as they're landing.

Now here's the stupidest part: I'm not sure whether i'm right about this or not, but i'm about 80% sure. Abel is GUARANTEED all hits, if the first hit lands. So it doesn't matter where the person is, in the air, if it just catches his tip, etc... but that's not the stupid part.

The stupid part about this is, if Abel trades, you still land all the hits. So this is what I saw: Someone did a shoryuken (if i remember correctly), as I did Ultra, and they traded. So Ryu got knocked back, and so did Abel - he actually got into his hit animation... then bounced right back and finished the Ultra.

It also seems to be one of the highest damaging ultras. The only one that does more is Gief I think.

[changuillo]

I think his ultra its a ranbu...so it makes sense it connects all hits if abel gets you

Capcom is playing snk games too often

[SLICK RICK]

Ok, Abel seems fuckin PIMP! Definitely cant wait to get my hands on him (no homo).

Need more vids!

Also, what's his alt costume? Link please?

[DaDesiCanadian]

It's just a red version of his normal costume.

[SLICK RICK]

gtfo...i thought that was just an alt color O_o :lame:

[FullMetalRoss]

gtfo...i thought that was just an alt color O_o :lame:

thats incorrect. I don't know what his alt-costume is. But his kicks color (for those who don't start a profile to buy the alt costume or extra colors) is the red gi.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhLNzqD__JY&fmt=18 = abel's alt. wrestler singlet.

[SLICK RICK]

thats incorrect. I don't know what his alt-costume is. But his kicks color (for those who don't start a profile to buy the alt costume or extra colors) is the red gi.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhLNzqD__JY&fmt=18 = abel's alt. wrestler singlet.
oh ok, thanks for clearing that up. i like the fit and that was a good match! i'm wondering what could have juggled after that anti-air c.fp at 1:28. seemed like ken was a little too far for dp+p to connect...would ultra work there?

[dominic]

We finally have some SF4 in Melbourne and I had a good bash with Abel today. Few questions, can somebody suggest some AA options that actually work? His AA grab seems to be pretty iffy.

And I know you can cancel from the Rekkas into his Super Combo but is there anything that can easily and reliably link into his Ultra?

Also if somebody could outline some of his good pokes that would be great too.

He is great fun, thanks guys.

[changuillo]

oh ok, thanks for clearing that up. i like the fit and that was a good match! i'm wondering what could have juggled after that anti-air c.fp at 1:28. seemed like ken was a little too far for dp+p to connect...would ultra work there?

According to this : http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/jul/08/abel-street-fighter-4-character-guide/ the super and ultra works but requieres good timing

[DaDesiCanadian]

We finally have some SF4 in Melbourne and I had a good bash with Abel today. Few questions, can somebody suggest some AA options that actually work? His AA grab seems to be pretty iffy.

And I know you can cancel from the Rekkas into his Super Combo but is there anything that can easily and reliably link into his Ultra?

Also if somebody could outline some of his good pokes that would be great too.

He is great fun, thanks guys.

His best AA so far i've found is c.fierce. The spacing on it however is very awkward, so you need to be at the right distance. It seemed to trade more often than it clean hit, but I had more success with it than his grab.

Jump and pressing fierce early also seems to work. Especially against Gief.

[SLICK RICK]

According to this : http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/jul/08/abel-street-fighter-4-character-guide/ the super and ultra works but requieres good timing
oh i c...nice!

question: when u cancel the first rekka into super, do you have to double fireball the super? or is the rekka counted as the first fb motion like in 3S for ex.?

Desi, is his j.fierce the one where he punches straight out to his side at 90 degrees?

[RagingStormX]

Abel seems very popular, look at the post count for this thread vs the other ones. So any bad matches for the big guy?

[changuillo]

Abel seems very popular, look at the post count for this thread vs the other ones. So any bad matches for the big guy?

he might have problems against characters that doesnt rush that much and have good defense options like Guile.

[dominic]

he might have problems against characters that doesn't rush that much and have good defense options like Guile.

this is exactly what I experienced last night. Defensive characters like Guile, as soon as they worked out the timing for the roll, were pretty difficult to take down.

Sagat with his Tigers was also painful.

Theres only so many times you can nail them with the Ultra before they start being very very careful.

Also does Abel have any regular combos? Outside of the special moves?

[changuillo]

Sagat with his Tigers was also painful

I think you can pass through the Tigers with EX sean kick



Also does Abel have any regular combos? Outside of the special moves?

Cr.MP into rekkas.


cr.HP into Sky fall(DP + P) or Super or Ultra

[FullMetalRoss]

I think you can pass through the Tigers with EX sean kick




Cr.MP into rekkas.


cr.HP into Sky fall(DP + P) or Super or Ultra

cr.short, cr.short xx super
cr.fwd xx rekkas
cr.hp xx roll, cr.hp
cr.short x4

[humbag]

http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2008/jul/08/abel-street-fighter-4-character-guide/

lol I feel honored to be mentioned at the end

[dominic]

I had another bash this morning and I am getting the c. mk into Rekka's combo pretty easily and even the cancel into the Super as well.

I am yet to figure out any way to get into Ultra other than slamming them with a lvl 3 Focus attack. Most times I just time it as a counter attack.

Do we have any pokes or normals that people like?

Does the AA grab beat most air attacks?

Finally, do we have any good suggestions for setting up tick throws? Particularity his command throw.

Thanks guys,

[humbag]

I believe you can dash cancel his s.mk. I have seen a blocked s.mk->dash (not a FA cancel)->command throw in a vid.

s.lk into command throw is a good tick as well

3 GREAT Abel vs Sagat matches are up here: http://www.irika.net/movie/sf4_select.html. Check it out. s.mk dash canceled is seen in these as well as: c.mp->rekka->FADC->c.hp->airgrab move

in the third vid third round: s.mk->dash cancel (just ff to cancel?)->s.hp->1rs hit rekka->FADC->c.hp->rolling->s.mp/s.hp air reset->opponent lands into a throw.

Awesome mixup potential shown here.

[DaDesiCanadian]

That combo was crazy. I will try it out tomorrow and report.

I think the dash is just regular ff.

[CFAY]

in one of those vids sagat won a round off straight tiger knees

[FullMetalRoss]

the first vid looks like

cr.lp, st.mp xx rekkas. Good to know for a hit confirm.

I can't believe mk is dash cancelable and you can combo after it on hit. That is fucking sick.

[SLICK RICK]

yeah that is sick...anyway, how's the priority on that far s.mk?

[*Onslaught*]

The Sagat/Abel videos were just beastly, especially the 3rd one where he does his combo and finishes it off with an air throw. Fucking monster.

[dominic]

So if I wanted to simplify those combos to start learning them I could do something like

c.mk, rekkas, FADC, command throw?

That's simple enough and should work to teach me the basic use of FADC right?

Hopefully it actually works. It will be a lot of damage if so.

[CFAY]

So if I wanted to simplify those combos to start learning them I could do something like

c.mk, rekkas, FADC, command throw?

That's simple enough and should work to teach me the basic use of FADC right?

Hopefully it actually works. It will be a lot of damage if so.

you cant combo into a command throw, you play too much KOF j/k.......but seriously you cant.

[dominic]

So just a regular throw then? Or should I wait for the reset so its a tick instead?

[Tizoc]

Abel is one mean combo machine-
http://big.freett.com/msc_movie_002/sakura_sf4_005.wmv
http://big.freett.com/msc_movie_002/sakura_sf4_006.wmv

[FullMetalRoss]

I don't like damage scaling in this game. Its wayyy to intense. Did you see how little damage that combo into ultra did? Jeezus. When I get this game I have to test out if its ever worth it to do more complicated combos.

[Atb_555]

he might have problems against characters that doesnt rush that much and have good defense options like Guile.

Basically thats pretty much all the charge characters baring Boxer. I fucking hate charge characters :arazz:.

Except for Urien lol

[humbag]

I don't like damage scaling in this game. Its wayyy to intense. Did you see how little damage that combo into ultra did? Jeezus. When I get this game I have to test out if its ever worth it to do more complicated combos.

In vid 5 it did so little damage because the ultra bar was barely above the line.

If it was full that combo would have easily killed him (round 2 match 5).

People always seems to overlook the ultra bar in that you can do it at a certain point its just that it does much less damage unless the bar is full (or near full not sure).

[*Onslaught*]

http://www.irika.net/movie/sf4_select.html

A whole bunch of new videos are up. 9 and 10 feature Rufus vs Abel. Rufus is too much. . .

[FullMetalRoss]

In vid 5 it did so little damage because the ultra bar was barely above the line.

If it was full that combo would have easily killed him (round 2 match 5).

People always seems to overlook the ultra bar in that you can do it at a certain point its just that it does much less damage unless the bar is full (or near full not sure).

even still in the match against rufus, the combo didn't do enough damage to actually kill him... I wasn't really overlooking it.

Plus sagat was getting so fresh with all those tiger shots, a few times abel could have just blown through and hit him if he would have just used the ultra.

[CFAY]

even still in the match against rufus, the combo didn't do enough damage to actually kill him... I wasn't really overlooking it.

Plus sagat was getting so fresh with all those tiger shots, a few times abel could have just blown through and hit him if he would have just used the ultra.

the reason the ultra did that little damage is because of damage reduction whever you combo into an ultra. depending on the level of the ultra bar, a straight up abel ultra can take off close to 50% life. it happens to every character who can combo into an ultra.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Findings today (I played only Abel):

- Blanka can crouch under Abel's ex-command grab. So dirty.
- Abel can ex-air throw a whiffed hurricane kick
- Dash cancelling fwd+mk is easy... getting a hit after the dash is what's hard. I only managed it once. That combo is much harder than I thought.
(f+forward , DC, s.fierce, rekka, SADC, roll, c.fierce, airthrow, or roll, c.fierce)
- The cvs1 terry poke string works fine, and is completely safe - c.jabx3 , s.fwd, qcb+lk

c.fwd is awesome - i discovered some crazy shenanigans with it

You can combo rekka from c.fwd, or you can cancel it into crossup rol.

So, crossup j.fwd, and if they block, c.fwd, roll, command grab, or roll, low attack into rekka. It's almost like a hit confirm.

- s.strong is a good poke - it can be cancelled on whiffed recovery frames into ex-grab. it's a decent baitout if they try to move in to punish you for the whiffed poke - your ex grab will usually eat their punishing normal.

[Sanchez]

- Blanka can crouch under Abel's ex-command grab. So dirty.


Regular crouch or command crouch?

[FullMetalRoss]

Just be careful with roll shennanigans you will get thrown if you try it to much. Or sometimes even for trying it the first time.

[Tizoc]

Does the Roll give you meter BTW?

[ninja_velmor]

http://www.irika.net/movie/sf4_select.html

A whole bunch of new videos are up. 9 and 10 feature Rufus vs Abel. Rufus is too much. . .
fuck you Rufus. those last to matches made me so mad, the Abel seemed to be trying to hard, but Rufus was just all over him

[humbag]

Regular crouch or command crouch?

What I would like to know as well.

I imagine since his command roll is a special move it gives you super meter? Ill look at those latest vids and then post up.

Abel just kept getting owned by the ex kick thingy Rufus was doing. That thing is too damned safe.

Edit: after watching a vid yes rolling does give you meter as i expected. So adding it to combos like whatev into c.fp-> roll->air grab is pretty good for getting a little meter.

[SLICK RICK]

in vid 8 of that series, abel killed sagat with about 45%(!!!) left with:
s.mk->DC->cl.mp->1st rekka->FADC->c.fp->ultra O_O

brought a tear to my eye...:lovin:

[dominic]

I had another bash today and had a few 4 - 5 win streaks with Abel. I adore him.

What are some good tick throws?

I get the feeling I am not using my command throw enough.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Regular crouch or command crouch?

Seemed to be just a regular crouch.... but then again i'm not sure what his command crouch looks like.

[humbag]

Seemed to be just a regular crouch.... but then again i'm not sure what his command crouch looks like.

I think he means his df+hp slide.

[DaDesiCanadian]

No, I think he meant his d+3p.

[Sanchez]

Yeah, Down+3P.

It looks like Blanka just shrinks into the ground. Kinda hard to see since it pretty much his crouch animation just "flatter". I'm assuming it allows Blanka to evade most if not all high attacks.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Then yeah, that might have been it. No way to tell unless someone else voluntarily picks Blanka, which is rare. Plus at a dollar a game, it's hard to convince someone to be a punching bag.

[The Juicebox Abel]

I am 99% sure that Abel vs. Blanka is completely in Abel's favor. Cr.jab negates rolls and cr.fierce beats or trades with all of Blanka's jump-ins except the crossup (which you shouldn't be hit with).

So Blanka's forced to stand in the middle of the screen poking at you with slide or whatever. Use that to land safe Sean kicks and follow up with roll shenanigans.

BTW, I played SF4 at EVO, loved it, and decided to try learning Abel. After I learned he was Sean + Alex I was hooked.

Let me follow with a question: What's Abel's best damage without meter? I believe it's either cr.fierce into air grab or crossup MK, cr.mk xx rekkas.

[Leebee Link]

cr. fierce to airthrow does more than fierce into rekkas

[FullMetalRoss]

I am 99% sure that Abel vs. Blanka is completely in Abel's favor. Cr.jab negates rolls and cr.fierce beats or trades with all of Blanka's jump-ins except the crossup (which you shouldn't be hit with).

So Blanka's forced to stand in the middle of the screen poking at you with slide or whatever. Use that to land safe Sean kicks and follow up with roll shenanigans.

BTW, I played SF4 at EVO, loved it, and decided to try learning Abel. After I learned he was Sean + Alex I was hooked.

Let me follow with a question: What's Abel's best damage without meter? I believe it's either cr.fierce into air grab or crossup MK, cr.mk xx rekkas.

Wellllll best damage is lvl3 focus attack combo, dash foward, cr.fp air grab.

Only practical thing that might do more than what you posted is the fact that after cr.mk you can do cr.lp, st.mp xx rekkas

[DaDesiCanadian]

Yeah, c.fierce into rekka is best way to land damage, since the mixup potential is much more than a simple fierce into airthrow.

[CFAY]

I am 99% sure that Abel vs. Blanka is completely in Abel's favor. Cr.jab negates rolls and cr.fierce beats or trades with all of Blanka's jump-ins except the crossup (which you shouldn't be hit with).

So Blanka's forced to stand in the middle of the screen poking at you with slide or whatever. Use that to land safe Sean kicks and follow up with roll shenanigans.

BTW, I played SF4 at EVO, loved it, and decided to try learning Abel. After I learned he was Sean + Alex I was hooked.

Let me follow with a question: What's Abel's best damage without meter? I believe it's either cr.fierce into air grab or crossup MK, cr.mk xx rekkas.

i doubt a good blanka would lose to abel that easy. what do you mean by someone shouldnt be hit with a cross up? how would abel stop blanka from crossing him up a few times in a row? sure a jab will stop his roll but its not something youll be doing on the regular unless the blanka youre playing is just rolling senseless from half screen. thats just what a good blanka wants, you to sit there and mash jab thinking he's going to roll. if anything blanka got a better chance of jumping on abel than abel jumping on blanka. remember abel has one jumping attack, MK. you'll come across a good blanka one day.....

best damage depends on the condition. for B&b its c+lp, mp, rekkas. c+hp is not safe on block so its not something you'll be using too much unless you know its a sure hit.

[The Juicebox Abel]

i doubt a good blanka would lose to abel that easy. what do you mean by someone shouldnt be hit with a cross up?

If Blanka's attack would crossup, he'd need to be be 3 inches from Abel's face before the jump. If Blanka somehow gets to this range (a range where Abel should be using command-grab//poke xx rekkas mind games), Abel can still simply roll on reaction when Blanka jumps. Heck, Abel could jump and peg Blanka with his own CvS2 jumping fierce if he wanted to.

[DaDesiCanadian]

This theory fighter is dumb. In all the games i've played, Blanka seems to have had the edge.

[CFAY]

If Blanka's attack would crossup, he'd need to be be 3 inches from Abel's face before the jump. If Blanka somehow gets to this range (a range where Abel should be using command-grab//poke xx rekkas mind games), Abel can still simply roll on reaction when Blanka jumps. Heck, Abel could jump and peg Blanka with his own CvS2 jumping fierce if he wanted to.

ok you've seen those sagat vs abel vids, how many times did you see sagat cross up abel? i guess that abel player sucked because he didnt roll or command grab on any of those cross ups.

im just saying, play against some people who actually know how the play the game before you say who cant beat who. the game is barely out in the US but youre already pointing out who cant beat abel based on just watching vids and guessing.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Wait, I just read this.. he's just basing this off a weekend playing it at Evo? :confused:

[The Juicebox Abel]

I don't think that Abel should ever be crossed up except after getting knocked down. His anti-air options are beyond excellent.

Granted, I don't live near a SF4 machine and my observations are indeed based on Evo. At the very least, I want my Abel to be a powerhouse in this game and I intend to have the full repertoire of knowledge at my disposal. If I'm wrong, I want to be corrected. But I could do without the disrespect.

[CFAY]

I don't think that Abel should ever be crossed up except after getting knocked down. His anti-air options are beyond excellent.

Granted, I don't live near a SF4 machine and my observations are indeed based on Evo. At the very least, I want my Abel to be a powerhouse in this game and I intend to have the full repertoire of knowledge at my disposal. If I'm wrong, I want to be corrected. But I could do without the disrespect.

da hell are you talking about anti air beyond excellent? his anit air moves are almost useless. watch the rufus vs abel videos, how many times did you see abel anti air? hopefully youll see a good blanka vs rufus vid and watch how rufus game changes. it doesnt take much to cross up any character in any SF game, you simply bait a bait a poke then cross up. itll happen so fast you'll not know what to do but block.

i'm not trying to disrespect you but you need to chill with the ignorance. i am indeed trying to correct you but you're sticking with what you gathered from watching a few matches at evo. i've been watching/playing the game since its been released and even to this day i would never say something like xxx cant beat yyy because yyy can always zzz whenever xxx does www. why you think you can make that call after watching the level of play at evo?

[DaDesiCanadian]

Abel's c.fierce gets cleanly stuffed by almost every jump in. Half the time, I don't even see an animation. On crossups, he can do absolutely nothing except block it.

His ex-anti air throw (is there a name for this, it's a pain typing it out every time), trades on a whole bunch of normal. I don't think i've ever landed this as a true anti-air, except on an empty jump in.

[ILL_BILL]

I can only seem to DC Abel's mk when im using his f+mk. Can it not be done with his normal close s.mk? Or am i just useless? (Im guessing the latter)


His ex-anti air throw (is there a name for this, it's a pain typing it out every time), trades on a whole bunch of normal. I don't think i've ever landed this as a true anti-air, except on an empty jump in.

I believe the name of his AA throw is "Falling Sky" or "Skyfall" or something.

And yea, i have yet to find a reliable anti air with abel, besides a well timed j.hk or j.mk.

On a totally different note, I seem have a lot of trouble fighting people that use pokes a lot. (ie. vega, and one person i fought today that was using bison's middle kick like the button was vibrating) I jump and get hit, i roll and get hit, i dash and get hit. Im just having trouble getting in close enough to really do anything. Though admittedly, when i do get in close, i have a tendancy to screw up anyway.

I figure "suck less" is a way around this, but im having trouble getting it down.

[DaDesiCanadian]

No you're right, only fwd+mk is cancellable. People seem to be doing the close s.mk as a meaty a lot. Any ideas as to why?

Yeah, j.fierce is my best anti air so far.

Sean kicks (is that what they're called? fuck that, i'ma call them terry kicks :mad: :rofl:) seem to be a decent counter against pokes. Usually varying strengths. Abel also has the ability to outpoke, try your different options imo. Use s.mp to bait a counter poke, and ex-grab them. Not gonna work more than once though.

[dominic]

I use his Sean Kick as a fair anti air.

And if I have been knocked down and crossed up I just roll out from it.

In fact I would saw that Abel's roll is probably one of his best moves as its faster than a dash and can get you out of a lot of pressure situations. Just don't roll into a grab.

[CFAY]

I can only seem to DC Abel's mk when im using his f+mk. Can it not be done with his normal close s.mk? Or am i just useless? (Im guessing the latter)



I believe the name of his AA throw is "Falling Sky" or "Skyfall" or something.

And yea, i have yet to find a reliable anti air with abel, besides a well timed j.hk or j.mk.

On a totally different note, I seem have a lot of trouble fighting people that use pokes a lot. (ie. vega, and one person i fought today that was using bison's middle kick like the button was vibrating) I jump and get hit, i roll and get hit, i dash and get hit. Im just having trouble getting in close enough to really do anything. Though admittedly, when i do get in close, i have a tendancy to screw up anyway.

I figure "suck less" is a way around this, but im having trouble getting it down.

you got to find out what poke beat what poke. there is usually at least one poke that'll beat another poke. his standing LK can be used as a good poke too. you also got SA, sweep, sean kick and ex rekkas will take a hit and keep going. of course its up to you to know when to use which.

[humbag]

I think its funny but in any vids i havent seen an ex rekka once.

Please tell me it at least does more damage?

[dominic]

I use Ex Rekka when I have to do damage to finish them off and can't afford to be subtle. Usually I prefer to save the ex bar so I can cancel into his Super.

[AtTheGates]

i've been wondering.

does anyone know yet what the difference between his ex command throw and his normal command throw is? both have crappy damage (1/6th health bar), and i can't see the EX version doing more. Is it faster?

[Atb_555]

I believe you can dash cancel his s.mk. I have seen a blocked s.mk->dash (not a FA cancel)->command throw in a vid.

s.lk into command throw is a good tick as well

3 GREAT Abel vs Sagat matches are up here: http://www.irika.net/movie/sf4_select.html. Check it out. s.mk dash canceled is seen in these as well as: c.mp->rekka->FADC->c.hp->airgrab move

in the third vid third round: s.mk->dash cancel (just ff to cancel?)->s.hp->1rs hit rekka->FADC->c.hp->rolling->s.mp/s.hp air reset->opponent lands into a throw.

Awesome mixup potential shown here.

Page has been updated with more Abel vs Rufus matches.

[Yamato]

I use his Sean Kick as a fair anti air.

And if I have been knocked down and crossed up I just roll out from it.

In fact I would saw that Abel's roll is probably one of his best moves as its faster than a dash and can get you out of a lot of pressure situations. Just don't roll into a grab.

For the Anti Air, it depends, if the opponent is jumping on you, but not crossing up, crouch MK works fine, if he wants to cross up, Got to "Marseille Roll" this shit, and you can often grab him with a qcb lp.
Marseille Roll works well against bad wake up game cross up too, but beware of well timed cross up when you get up.

Been playing Abel for 2 weeks now, and it's very fun.
Somebody was asking his best damage without EX, j. mk cross up d. HP 2 hits, cancel qcf lk dragon lp. Yeah, the marseille roll isn't necessary at all, BUT, if your EX bar is full, it is the only way to link with his super, crouch HP Super doesn't work (And for the Ultra, just do d. HP, wait a little then Ultra, hop, nice juggle, believe me, you WANT to place it.)

And for the f. mk, you can can cancel it by a dash only by pressing f one time, the basic pattern for pressing with Abel is as follow :
jump mk cross up d. lk d. lk lk f.mk dash. After, you can grab (basic or qcb), press again with the same pattern. but, to be honest, since i eat an "organic" dragon each time i do that against a scrubby ken or Ryu, i tend to do it less (Damn, dragon are mad in this game.)

For the EX command throw, it seems it have some invicibility frames, and it's as quick as the lp one imo, but i'm not sure AT all, i just know the startup is mad ahah, crappy dommage hell yeah, but if you want a real command Throw, just pick Gief.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Great stuff Yamato. :tup:

You say c.mk can be used as an anti-air? How reliable is this? I'm guessing it needs a very shallow angle to hit. How does it fare against say... shoto jumping roundhouses?

[Yamato]

it's reliable, because the hitbox is very strange, Abel put himself in a weird position, but lift his foot up, i've seen a very good Abel do this, and tested, it works everytime, but it's a bit slow.

PS: your avatar is just utterly MAD, i'm fan.

[SLICK RICK]

for anti-air, has anyone tried FA and immediately back dash cancel? no damage but i would imagine this would give you some space. let me know how this does!

[DaDesiCanadian]

it's reliable, because the hitbox is very strange, Abel put himself in a weird position, but lift his foot up, i've seen a very good Abel do this, and tested, it works everytime, but it's a bit slow.



Ok wow, YOU ARE MY NEW HERO. Sorry CFAY, you are relegated to secondary SFIV hero now.

I'd like to confirm c.mk's awesomeness as an anti-air. It beat out all of Ryu's jumpins cleanly about 80% of the time, and traded with the rest. For straight up anti air, jumping fierce works wonder.

c.mk basically forced the Ryu I usually play against to completely switch his playstyle, and making the match much easier in my favour.

[FullMetalRoss]

Im glad this move does work like that. I didn't get time to try it at EVO cause usually I was the one crossing people up.

I also like blocking jump ins into EX grab in this game, that shit is good.

[CFAY]

Ok wow, YOU ARE MY NEW HERO. Sorry CFAY, you are relegated to secondary SFIV hero now.

I'd like to confirm c.mk's awesomeness as an anti-air. It beat out all of Ryu's jumpins cleanly about 80% of the time, and traded with the rest. For straight up anti air, jumping fierce works wonder.

c.mk basically forced the Ryu I usually play against to completely switch his playstyle, and making the match much easier in my favour.

:sad: :rofl: good stuff, i mentioned that c+mk anti air on page 14. i feel you though, any good anti air is a savior. was able to beat a good abel yesterday just jumping around with chun HK. then again, not many normals can clean anti air chuns jumping HK.

a good unexpected anti air that works with abel is also simply SA. he has one of those quick reaction SAs. you pretty much use SA as if it was a parry. wait until youre about to get hit from the jumping attack then hit SA. dont charge it to level 2, just hit it once. you'll absorb the hit then do a quick level 1 SA counter. the trick is to make it seem like youre going to block so your op will try to follow up with a ground attack and if he does, he'll get stunned.
the down side is when you get predictable. you can get grabbed after you absorb the jump in or your op can land and hit you with a super.

someone mentioned SA and dash back for anti air, not a good idea since youll be vulnerable for a sec after the back dash. eg, i jump in with ryu with a HK, then hit c+jab...you'll absorb the jump in HK, jab will miss on your invincible frame back dash but then i could easily sweep on reaction since i know that you cant block instantly after a back dash. you can use this to get out of cross up mix ups though.

[humbag]

theory time:

c.mk anti air->1rst rekka whiff-> they land into overhead/low into grab.

Reset from the c.mk into the high/low hijinks? Or does the c.mk pop them up to far for the second rekka part to begin to hit.

[DaDesiCanadian]

That sounds mad risky. First rekka has some serious lag if it doesn't hit.

[CFAY]

theory time:

c.mk anti air->1rst rekka whiff-> they land into overhead/low into grab.

Reset from the c.mk into the high/low hijinks? Or does the c.mk pop them up to far for the second rekka part to begin to hit.


the second rekka overhead will hit but you could probably easily eat a throw.

[RushedDown]

i just roll and dp as they are on the other side
and jump mp as they are trying to jump on me for a crossup seems to work nice

or u can just block the jump in and jump back mp when they try to do it again

[Yamato]

didn't know you could juggle after d mk, thanks for the tips !

Also, his d hk is cancellable ahah, learned it by chance yesterday against computer, it rocks.

[CFAY]

i dont think you can juggle after the d+mk. he meant someone actually landing after the d+mk and getting hit with the rekka overhead while trying to low block...........atleast i think thats what he meant.

[DaDesiCanadian]

didn't know you could juggle after d mk, thanks for the tips !

Also, his d hk is cancellable ahah, learned it by chance yesterday against computer, it rocks.

What is a practical usage? If blocked, roll/rekka for mixups?

And you can't juggle after c.mk. Opponent flips and is invincible.

[Yamato]

that's what i thought for the crouch mk, Good player tend to use grab if you roll on wake up game.
for the d HK, you can rekka or "Marseille roll", but, you have to be careful.
Good player tend to use grab if you roll on wake up game.

played against a goob Boxer today, man, it's hot against this character, trying to get close was really a pain in the ass, Chunli as well. People say she's low tier, ahahah, that must be a joke, she pokes so much ...

PS: Sorry, i can't stop myself using the "Marseille" for roll, but even we french consider this name to be awfully gross we use it everytime since it's so funny ahah. Also, why japanese tend to make french look like even Gay (Remy, or Ash Crimson) or German (Abel, or remember the French team in Captain Tsubasa Road to 2002, the captain : "Napoleon" ...), i'm "unabel" to understand this.

[SLICK RICK]

when rufus does that ugly ass jumping spiral move can abel dp or ex dp and snatch that asshole outta the flash kick extension?

[Goukisan]

when rufus does that ugly ass jumping spiral move can abel dp or ex dp and snatch that asshole outta the flash kick extension?

probably better to ask here rather than the vid thread, but in video 13 or so he ex rolls before the extension but is too far away to get anything. Could you normal roll before either extension or does flash kick eat it up?

[UltraDavid]

Zangi can do lariat in between those hits, so it's definitely possible to hit Rufus out of it. Obviously Abel can roll, but I don't know if he can hit Rufus.

[1der]

PS: Sorry, i can't stop myself using the "Marseille" for roll, but even we french consider this name to be awfully gross we use it everytime since it's so funny ahah. Also, why japanese tend to make french look like even Gay (Remy, or Ash Crimson) or German (Abel, or remember the French team in Captain Tsubasa Road to 2002, the captain : "Napoleon" ...), i'm "unabel" to understand this.

Don't know why they make the French look gay, in this Abel's case they seemed to have based him off a Russian MMA fighter.

this guy
http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Fedor-Emelianenko-1500

I think its just happen stance that the French flag and Russian Federation Flag bear the same colors....sorry.

Also thanks for all the good info man

[Tizoc]

@Yamato- Umm I thought Ash was Japanese...oh wait....
..and I thought we already cleared that Abel is based off Fedor...

At any rate, has anyone seen or found any use to his Super, or rather see a need to do his Super in any possible situation?

[DaDesiCanadian]

It's useless. It's an easy cancel off his rekka, but just use the bar for ex instead, so much more useful.

[Yamato]

For the super, hmmm, i tend to use EX command throw a lot, also, his qcb k EX dodge fireballs.
i never use Ex roll besides (nggggh must ... stop ... using ... the ... "M" ... word). I rarely get the occasion to have a full gauge. You can do nice damage out of his cross up d HP roll super.
BUT, on the over hand, you can place the Ultra juste after the d HP, against a fireball (but that one is not easy), so i would rather rely on the ultra and keep my EX gauge for EX moves.

PS: I know that Abel is based on Fedor, as well as Marduk is based on Bob Sapp, but well, after all, it doesn't matter where does he come from after all, he just rules ahah.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Can f+mk be backwards dash cancelled? Would that be useful in any way?

[CFAY]

when rufus does that ugly ass jumping spiral move can abel dp or ex dp and snatch that asshole outta the flash kick extension?

you do have an attack advantage before he does that flash kick, overhead drop down kick or sweep but most normals and special moves will not stop the flash kick and overhead drop kick. dont think you can air grab it since he'll be in the air after you block. you could probably roll but then again remember that rufus dont to even end that move with anything so he can bait with the first part and watch you make a fool of yourself :rofl:. he can even SADC to grab or SADC to ultra on hit but weird how i havent seen anyone do SADC to ultra in those rufus vids even though they connect with that ex kick move so many times.

[polarity]

In match 25 of these (http://page.freett.com/msc_movie_002/sf4_index.htm) vids, you can see Abel do a SICK reset in the last round. It goes like this (if I got any of the normals wrong, my bad):

variety of combos into cl.st.Fierce xx Rekka (1 hit) xx EX FADC, cr.Fierce xx Roll, cr.Jab xx Roll

At this point they're reset and crossed up, and you can mix up with some combo into the reset again, or 360 them.

If there's a way to land the low fierce without having to EX FADC the Rekka (maybe just off a DCed f+fwd?), this could be even more powerful... Abel's rushdown potential looks crazy right now.

[humbag]

In match 25 of these (http://page.freett.com/msc_movie_002/sf4_index.htm) vids, you can see Abel do a SICK reset in the last round. It goes like this (if I got any of the normals wrong, my bad):

variety of combos into cl.st.Fierce xx Rekka (1 hit) xx EX FADC, cr.Fierce xx Roll, cr.Jab xx Roll

At this point they're reset and crossed up, and you can mix up with some combo into the reset again, or 360 them.

If there's a way to land the low fierce without having to EX FADC the Rekka (maybe just off a DCed f+fwd?), this could be even more powerful... Abel's rushdown potential looks crazy right now.

Yep i posted this a while back. His mixup potential is massive once he gets going.

What I was meaning earlier was that if c.mk is as good of an anti air as we think after a anti air c.mk cancel into rekka which will first wiff, then they land, into either the overhead or low hit follow up to the rekka.

What I was wanting to know is if the timing of the opponents flip matches the second rekka when they land.

[DaFeetLee]

His command grab is a hcb, not a 360.

[Wasted]

His command grab is a hcb, not a 360.

^ This. Can't remember how many people I had to tell to stop mashing the stick to do it.

Pity it's got fuck all range, though.

[Yamato]

it's a QCB to be exact !

Mad combo i saw today:

f mk dash hp cancel at 1st hit (it does link after the kick !) qcf hp (or mp, dunno) cancel Saving attack cancel dash (basically you don't hit with the SA), d HP 2 hits, roll, and after, air grab, or reset, or directly an ultra after the d HP. That's just sick.

[ChaiThai]

I have not had the chance to really mess around with Abel since the machines are always packed, and I have a few basic questions. When you do his rekkas do you need to go neutral then toward after the 1st, or can you just hold toward and do each one?

Also, what are good pokes for footies?

[Rioting Soul]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTTubwgvNko&feature=related

Look at what happens at 1:20. Did Abel's roll just barely crossup and make Sagat's reversal Tiger Uppercut go in the opposite direction, or does the throw at the end of Abel's rekka combo make the opponent's reversals go in the opposite direction? I kept pausing the video to see what was happening. When Sagat wakes up from Abel's air throw, he is facing away from Abel. If the Sagat player had not done anything then Sagat would have gone to a neutral position facing Abel. But Sagat went from waking animation to Tiger Uppercut animation with no neutral animation in between. If I'm right about this then that means that a large amount of reversal attacks are useless against Abel if he gets his air throw.

[Hyuga]

I just started playing Abel and suck complete ass with him, but I've noticed I have no clue what to do 1-2 character lengths away. What are his longest pokes? And what should I be doing to get into their faces? When I roll I tend to eat shoryukens, same with jump-ins. Ex-axe kick is nice though.

[Nocturnal]

I just started playing Abel and suck complete ass with him, but I've noticed I have no clue what to do 1-2 character lengths away. What are his longest pokes? And what should I be doing to get into their faces? When I roll I tend to eat shoryukens, same with jump-ins. Ex-axe kick is nice though.

I would say his stand LK is probably his best poke since it's pretty fast. His down + HK has long reach but can be risky to just stick out at random. fwd + MK is probably what you want to use to start the pressure, since you can dash aftewards on hit/block. EX Axe Kick is good if they are spamming fireballs and you want them to think twice before spamming them out again. You can also EX Roll throw fireballs but it can be a bit risky on the recovery slightly. I'm still learning Abel so a lot of this is from the few hours I've used him so far at Super Arcade. I'll be doing more testing with him to see what else might be useful with him.

[Wasted]

I have not had the chance to really mess around with Abel since the machines are always packed, and I have a few basic questions. When you do his rekkas do you need to go neutral then toward after the 1st, or can you just hold toward and do each one?

Also, what are good pokes for footies?

you can just hold forward.

All of Abel's crouching normals seem to be good. C.MK has lots of range, you can still combo a super off of it, too. F+MK can be cancelled into a dash.

[ChaiThai]

Thank you very much I'll give him a run tomorrow, and hopefully be able to post something after.

[Rioting Soul]

Thank you very much I'll give him a run tomorrow, and hopefully be able to post something after.

Could you grab someone with his air throw and try to bait them into doing a reversal afterwards?

[FullMetalRoss]

if people are just spamming fireballs ex heel kick isn't really the best way to deal with them. The best is to patiently walk foward and block or jump over them and try and react quick enough to the next one to lk roll through and get a cr.mp or a command grab. It worked really well for me... unless there is something Im missing. Ex heel kick is just the no brainer way to do it.

[Rioting Soul]

if people are just spamming fireballs ex heel kick isn't really the best way to deal with them. The best is to patiently walk foward and block or jump over them and try and react quick enough to the next one to lk roll through and get a cr.mp or a command grab. It worked really well for me... unless there is something Im missing. Ex heel kick is just the no brainer way to do it.

But EX Heel Kick seems to be a good deterrent to fireball throwing. If an Abel player just(only) goes about it the way you say, then the opponent will throw projectiles more often. If you were to bop them on the head once or twice with EX Heel when they throw a projectile, they should wise up and throw less projectiles when you have EX stored. Then you'll have more breathing room and won't have to worry about blocking projectiles and being pushed around nearly as much. It'll be a necessity against a good Guile.

If you are in position to roll through or jump over and punish then do so, but EX Heel is valuable to help make that area within its range to be a little more safe for you to advance.

[Wasted]

Ultra through them from halfscreen on reaction. That should learn them.

[polarity]

Rioting Soul: It looks to me like it's the combination of the air throw followed by the wakeup roll that causes the reversal to go the wrong way. If you watch the vid, you can see he goes for the same setup later on, only he gets thrown out of the roll the next time.

[FullMetalRoss]

But EX Heel Kick seems to be a good deterrent to fireball throwing. If an Abel player just(only) goes about it the way you say, then the opponent will throw projectiles more often. If you were to bop them on the head once or twice with EX Heel when they throw a projectile, they should wise up and throw less projectiles when you have EX stored. Then you'll have more breathing room and won't have to worry about blocking projectiles and being pushed around nearly as much. It'll be a necessity against a good Guile.

If you are in position to roll through or jump over and punish then do so, but EX Heel is valuable to help make that area within its range to be a little more safe for you to advance.

Ex heel kick takes meter, you won't always have that... so when you don't have meter people are going to pressure you to death with fireballs. Learning to deal with them through a slow-paced advancement like the one I described is important. It's similar to using sagats Roll in cvs 2 to guess through a long poke and then go for a good punishment combo.

[Rioting Soul]

Ex heel kick takes meter, you won't always have that... so when you don't have meter people are going to pressure you to death with fireballs. Learning to deal with them through a slow-paced advancement like the one I described is important. It's similar to using sagats Roll in cvs 2 to guess through a long poke and then go for a good punishment combo.

I wasn't saying that your method didn't have it's place.

[noodleman]

roll throw is the greatest cvs2 tactic EVAH.

[DaDesiCanadian]

All I know is, the moment you do ex heel kick through fireballs, people stop spamming that shit and get more nervous.

[FullMetalRoss]

roll throw is the greatest cvs2 tactic EVAH.

I didn't say roll throw with sagat, I said roll into big punish combo. And you have to admit, rolling through say a blanka amazon slide or a cr.fp is a big part of winning with sagat at high level.

[Wasted]

Can someone outline Abel's target combos, if any?

[noodleman]

I didn't say roll throw with sagat, I said roll into big punish combo. And you have to admit, rolling through say a blanka amazon slide or a cr.fp is a big part of winning with sagat at high level.
i would say st.lk is a bigger part of that match up, but this isn't cvs2 discussions. I was just making a general statement anyways. roll throw in my mind one of the most scrub tactics i've seen that actually works to some extent ahha.

[humbag]

I dont think Abel has any target combos unless the dash cancelable f+mk counts as one since you can combo after it on hit.

[Chocolate Sausage]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTTubwgvNko&feature=related

Look at what happens at 1:20. Did Abel's roll just barely crossup and make Sagat's reversal Tiger Uppercut go in the opposite direction, or does the throw at the end of Abel's rekka combo make the opponent's reversals go in the opposite direction? I kept pausing the video to see what was happening. When Sagat wakes up from Abel's air throw, he is facing away from Abel. If the Sagat player had not done anything then Sagat would have gone to a neutral position facing Abel. But Sagat went from waking animation to Tiger Uppercut animation with no neutral animation in between. If I'm right about this then that means that a large amount of reversal attacks are useless against Abel if he gets his air throw.

Good observation. I went over that bit many times as well, and it doesn't look like Abel's roll crossed up Sagat, which means the air throw leaved them backturned and -unabel- to do an immediate reversal in the right direction, so the roll was just to bait out the tiger.

Or maybe the roll just has some messed up hitbox which means he crossed him up with his toes or something at the end of the roll.

[noodleman]

does abel's f.mk dc combo into anything on hit, or does it have to be counter hit? the one time i saw it connect into a combo was on counter hit...

[humbag]

seems like its on normal hit in the vids that i have seen

Maybe its just really hard timing but i dono.

[DaDesiCanadian]

It's normal hit, and the timing isn't hard at all..,

[Septimus Prime]

Hey, can we close this and get a legit Abel thread so newbs like me don't have to try to figure out where the strat section starts?

[ChaiThai]

Could you grab someone with his air throw and try to bait them into doing a reversal afterwards?

Yea, too much competition today, couldn't learn Abel properly. But I will say I tried a few rolls off the air throw. I couldn't bait out the same unusual reversal as shown in the video, and ate a few throws instead.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Hey, can we close this and get a legit Abel thread so newbs like me don't have to try to figure out where the strat section starts?

Usually i'd agree, but this thread is such a goldmine that it's worth the effort imo.

[Hyuga]

Hey, can we close this and get a legit Abel thread so newbs like me don't have to try to figure out where the strat section starts?

I had that same exact problem. I just started reading from a random page.

[Septimus Prime]

Usually i'd agree, but this thread is such a goldmine that it's worth the effort imo.
From what post should I start reading, then?

[DaDesiCanadian]

Also, read from around page 15 or so. Pay attention to CFAY and Yamato.

[1der]

anyone got any tips on the Dash cancel input, i'm not getting much chance to "practice" any indicators, "tricks", whatever might be of help to me

[Sanchez]

From what post should I start reading, then?

If the post isn't a question it's probably good info.


anyone got any tips on the Dash cancel input, i'm not getting much chance to "practice" any indicators, "tricks", whatever might be of help to me

Do it slow. The game gives you hours to confirm things.

[noodleman]

I've summarized some info:

Movelist:

Best normals:

C.fierce: One of his best normals. It hits for two hits, and knocks them in the air for a juggle on the second. The first hit can be cancelled into a rekka. The second hit can be comboed into his anti-air grab, or linked into one hit of rekka while they're in the air.

S.forward: Awesome poke because it can be normal dash cancelled. Try cancelling for pressure strings, mix up with throw/command grab/more pressure strings. If it hits, the dash cancel combos. (e.g. s.forward, dash, s.fierce)

c. forward: decent poke, can be used an anti air. Can be comboed into rekka.

c.strong: good poke, can be comboed into rekka

j.fierce: his best air to air

j.fwd: his best crossup/jumpin

Specials:

"Terry Kick" (qcb + kick): One of the safest specials in the game it seems. It hits high, and is safe if the correct strength is used. (e.g. use qcb+rh where you should have used qcb+fwd, and you can get punished). Ex version goes through fireballs.

Rekka (qcf+p, f+p/k, f+p/k): His foundation. This is how you will be doing most of your damage. Combos off most of his normals, and ex absorbs a hit i think. It can be SADC'ed into a c.fierce.

anti air grab (srk+p): better used in combos than anything else. Angle is awkward for anti air, and gets stuffed/trades a lot. Don't depend on it too much

Roll: Very useful move. Use this for positioning, escaping, roll/throwing noodleman, roll command grab etc. Note that you can be swept or thrown out of it.

Main combo that seems to be floating around:

st.fwd, dash cancel, st.fierce, rekka, SADC, c.fierce, roll, c.fierce anti air grab

lol so true :shake:

[Hyuga]

Quick questions, In most vids I've watched, Abel will SADC the first hit of the rekka. Is there a reason why the player doesn't SADC the second hit instead? Can't be done, hitstun is less, etc.etc.

[noodleman]

it's likely cause it won't combo, though i haven't tested it.

[Atb_555]

Dont know if this has been asked before but does Ex Sky Fall have armor properties or not?

[Septimus Prime]

Please split off this thread from post #289, SK. We don't need the rest of it.

[ToyRobotTerror]

How about someone gives me the info and i paste it into the first post? Profit?

[Ultima]

Holy crap, what did they do to Abel's Rekka damage? I saw this thing at CTF yesterday and it was doing maybe 11% damage: 9% for the initial hit,and 1% each for the remaining follow ups. >:|

[Wasted]

I've summarized some info:

Movelist:

Best normals:

S.forward: Awesome poke because it can be normal dash cancelled. Try cancelling for pressure strings, mix up with throw/command grab/more pressure strings. If it hits, the dash cancel combos. (e.g. s.forward, dash, s.fierce)

you can't dash cancel regular standing MK. It has to be F+MK.

[DaDesiCanadian]

My bad. Stupid notation.

[Hyuga]

I played's Jwong's Abel today. I don't think I realized how far he can jump from to cross you up. He would do it from half screen and from up-close.

[ssjtin]

Am I correct in saying that dash cancelling a regular SA costs nothing, but cancelling a special move into SA costs...1 ex bar?

And what are some of the more useful SADC uses and special/normal move SA cancel (can someone help me out with the terminology please, what's the proper abbreviation)

What are his chain combos? (like Ken's s.mp xx s.hp)

What are his overheads?

[DaDesiCanadian]

Am I correct in saying that dash cancelling a regular SA costs nothing, but cancelling a special move into SA costs...1 ex bar?



urrite

[noodleman]

actually, cancelling a special move into SA costs 2 ex bars.

[Joe The Condor]

Abel is by far the coolest new character in SF4. Awesome combos, and I love the wrestling.

[changuillo]

he´s not a wrestler, he is an MMA fighter...but yeah hes pretty cool.

a question, is his Super worth doing? or should I spend my ex bars in EX moves and cancels? (like the rufus boy)

[kidfear]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sambo_(martial_art)

[Saotome Kaneda]

cleaning this thread takes too long


fuck you guys

[noodleman]

much thanks to SK :)

[ssjtin]

Yep, massive thanks for the cleanout.

For this combo; f+forward , DC, s.fierce, rekka, SADC, roll, c.fierce, airthrow, or roll, c.fierce

I hit with f+forward, (do I just tap ff to dash cancel?), press st. fierce, cancel into complete rekka, initiate SA and then DC....

actually this is too confusing for me. Could someone explain how this combo works? It would really help my understanding.

[humbag]

SADC c.fierce then roll airthrow or reset

[ILL_BILL]

I find when DC'ing the f+mk, since the stick is already in the forward position, you only need to tap forward again ONCE to DC.

My timing on the SADC on the other hand is WAY out, and i cant get the followup fp to connect at all.

[Wasted]

SADC c.fierce then roll airthrow or reset

Don't understand the need to roll before the air throw, to be honest.

Abel can grab Shotos out of the air without rolling, is it required for specific matchups?

[Leebee Link]

+gives meter

+looks badass

+leads to crossup shennanigans if you don't throw

[ssjtin]

Awesome, watching some vids I think I've got the theory. So here's two combo's I'm looking to use:

f. mk, DC, s. hp xx rekka, SADC first rekka hit, c.hp, roll, air throw

c.mp xx rekka, SADC ... same thing

BIG QUESTION!!!!

With his airthrows, rekka, and tornado throw, what strength do you use?

For tornado throw, I would guess that jab would be most useful for it's speed, or EX if you have meter.

For airthrow, would you always use fierce in combos for most damage, but jab for speed when trying to catch jumpers?

For rekka, does any strength combo from his normals? So then would you always use fierce rekka in combos?

[Wasted]

+gives meter

+looks badass

+leads to crossup shennanigans if you don't throw

LK roll will not crossup after c.hp.

But, I see the merits of points 1 and 2 :D

Timing to grab out of LK roll seems to be INCREDIBLY strict, though, I find.

I was not aware that HP grab was even possible after c.HP.

[noodleman]

i think he's talking about cr.fp xx roll, cr.lp/mp xx roll (cross up).

[DaDesiCanadian]

he´s not a wrestler, he is an MMA fighter...but yeah hes pretty cool.

a question, is his Super worth doing? or should I spend my ex bars in EX moves and cancels? (like the rufus boy)

His super is all but useless. His ex-moves/sadcs are just too nice to waste, and they do tons of damage.

Also, I love how "roll/throwing noodleman" is now cemented into Abel Strategy in the first post. :rofl:

[Joe The Condor]

he´s not a wrestler, he is an MMA fighter...but yeah hes pretty cool.

a question, is his Super worth doing? or should I spend my ex bars in EX moves and cancels? (like the rufus boy)

If anything, he's a Sambo fighter, but looks a lot of Alex...

[CFAY]

Holy crap, what did they do to Abel's Rekka damage? I saw this thing at CTF yesterday and it was doing maybe 11% damage: 9% for the initial hit,and 1% each for the remaining follow ups. >:|

if you play against a good abel, you'd wish all the hits took 1%. its not the rekkas thats painful, its fact that he has one of the nastiest mix up games in SF4 and on one knockdown it could mean the end of the round.

[noodleman]

just some fyi, i dunno if this is true for all characters in the game. but abel's forward dash doesn't count as airborne, so you can be spd'ed during the the dash. I think back dash count as airborne, but i haven't tested it.

[1der]

if you play against a good abel, you'd wish all the hits took 1%. its not the rekkas thats painful, its fact that he has one of the nastiest mix up games in SF4 and on one knockdown it could mean the end of the round.

sounds a bit like Makoto any legitimacy to that comparison or am i clutching at straws?

[SLICK RICK]

sounds a bit like Makoto any legitimacy to that comparison or am i clutching at straws?
i was thinkin the same thing...and it makes sense that i would be interested in abel since mak's my char in 3s ;)

[noodleman]

it's hard to say. I'm not too familiar with makoto, but from what i know, makoto has mix up between the grab and combos, which abel has, but not in the continuous manner that makoto has. once you get the grab, imo the mix up is over and you need to start over.

imo the mix ups are going to be generated from the rekka xx sadc, cr.fp xx roll combo, which is kinda hard to land if the oppnonent is zoning you out.

[ssjtin]

Hey any ideas on how to matchup against blanka?

It seems that he can barrel roll into me all the time and land out of reach for any punishment.

[Nocturnal]

Hey any ideas on how to matchup against blanka?

It seems that he can barrel roll into me all the time and land out of reach for any punishment.

You can probably try a his EX Axe Kick qcb + kick to counter the blocked blanka ball. Your best bet is to just get on top of Blanka ASAP and not let him space you out.

[CFAY]

it's hard to say. I'm not too familiar with makoto, but from what i know, makoto has mix up between the grab and combos, which abel has, but not in the continuous manner that makoto has. once you get the grab, imo the mix up is over and you need to start over.

imo the mix ups are going to be generated from the rekka xx sadc, cr.fp xx roll combo, which is kinda hard to land if the oppnonent is zoning you out.

any knock down with abel could spell trouble. if youre talking about command grab, he still gets way more than enough time to cross you up/roll behind/infront and do whatever the hell he wants. if its the reakkas grab he'll still be up on time to close in on you before you can start your zoning. ofcourse they wouldnt make the game where his command grab is so easy and yet every one of his knockdowns leave the op right in front of him, oh wait thats gief :rofl:

[Haki]

Hey any ideas on how to matchup against blanka?

It seems that he can barrel roll into me all the time and land out of reach for any punishment.

You can punish with Ultra if timed correctly.

[Mickey D']

sounds a bit like Makoto any legitimacy to that comparison or am i clutching at straws?

Abel to Makoto comparison? Think Makoto, but a little bit more forgiving. Much like Makoto, if you guess once wrong, it's going to lead into HUGE damage. The only ONE difference that I can tell you so far is the stun factor.

However, very much like Makoto, Abel does have the whole IMMEDIATE stupidity where you're opponent is constantly stuck battling against his decision to block or jump. He can throw on wake up (and also throw you if you try to jump away ala Shoryuken) do LARGE combos without meter (but be SCARED when he's GOT meter), and he has great "reset" crossup abilities.

So is Abel anything like Makoto? Yes, the only thing that I have yet to see is the stun factor. Be afraid when Abel knocks you down, because you will either get thrown if you block, you will get thrown if you jump away, or you will get comboed if you try to back dash away

[1der]

it's hard to say. I'm not too familiar with makoto...



Abel to Makoto comparison? Think Makoto, but a little bit more forgiving. Much like Makoto...

I finally got to play a extended period this weekend. I think I'm just seeing the Makoto in my mind. I see similarities but this is a new character, at least for me. Heck its a new game.


any knock down with abel could spell trouble...he still gets way more than enough time to cross you up/roll behind/infront and do whatever the hell he wants. if its the reakkas grab he'll still be up on time to close in on you before you can start your zoning. ofcourse they wouldnt make the game where his command grab is so easy

I'm a little confused. Abel's KD game is good and his wake up control is good? or he has good options out of wakeup? or all of the above?

I'm not gonna get to play again for another week had a series of questions: Against Sim I had a ton of problems, and the guy i played kept teleporting "onto my shoulder" has anyone else experienced this? If so what answer do you have? All i could do was block...i froze up and didnt really get to think about it til later. Also does Abel's AA grab pull Sim out of this? good idea bad idea?

[noodleman]

Hey any ideas on how to matchup against blanka?

It seems that he can barrel roll into me all the time and land out of reach for any punishment.
i notice you kinda have to rush him down. and there isn't much you can do about the ball. You can punish the ball with your ultra, so use your SA wisely and build up that ultra meter.

you can't cross blanka up, so i wouldn't try, every time i did his electricity would eat me up.

[Nocturnal]

I've been able to beat Blanka balls with Abel's down + LP plenty of times from playing Blanka players. Though for the most part like everyone already mentioned you have to be onto of Blanka.

[solbadguy420]

Does anybody know any good strategies vs Gief.

[dominic]

Against Gief don't try and roll past him as much. I prefer to jump in and poke until safe unless I land a rekka. His sean kick is pretty safe from most grabs on block.

I like to try and bait a throw, dash in on him when he is waking up but then quickly dash back just before he can strike. I have baited a lot of ultras out this way.

[Wasted]

I get SPDed after Sean Kick on block.

[noodleman]

are you sure you're spacing your kicks properly?

[Golden_Gunman]

Probably already been mentioned, but if you have Ultra, it's guaranteed after a blocked Blanka Ball.

[ssjtin]

Do you execute it on block or is there timing involved? I'll probably try it tomorrow so let me get the first one right.

[noodleman]

better if you have reversal timing, though i don't think it's necessary.

[sambao]

does anybody know of the differences between using different kick buttons to perform a roll??

also from the look of the movelist there's an EX roll?? what does that do??

thanks!

[Septimus Prime]

The range changes. Lk is about a body length; hk will take you right past your opponent from the starting position; mk is somewhere inbetween.

EX roll is "faster" and "more invincible." It seems fairly useless to me.

[Atb_555]

I would think it would be a good GTFO of the corner trick on wakeup.

[Septimus Prime]

EX Tornado Throw is probably better, though, since Abel will slam his opponent behind him, into the corner. It's really hard to mix in an EX roll because the yellow flash kind of kills the surprise factor.

[DaDesiCanadian]

Ex Throw is never a good idea on wakeup. Any half decent player will very quickly learn to adapt to it, and adjust their meaty game accordingly.

[Buktooth]

the first hit of abels rekka is unsafe on block, even if you cancel to the followups. sagat at least can dp between the 1st and 2nd hit

anybody know the rules of the roll? it seems totally random to me. sometimes goes through throws, sometimes seems full-body invulnerable, sometimes totally not

after the command grab just dash and jump and it sets up a cross up into mixup again

[Septimus Prime]

Ex Throw is never a good idea on wakeup. Any half decent player will very quickly learn to adapt to it, and adjust their meaty game accordingly.
No one said to do it every time.

Like with all SF games, wake-up block is usually your best option.

[mtsac kid]

abel gets hit out of every day special they block
still love my mofo tho

[sambao]

anybody know the rules of the roll? it seems totally random to me. sometimes goes through throws, sometimes seems full-body invulnerable, sometimes totally notsomeone told me that it's vulnerable to throws and sweeps