View Full Version : The Fox thread
Zero-SR388
03-13-2008, 11:03 AM
I didn't see a Fox thread, so I made one.
Post strats or w/e for Fox here.
(I hate how the screwed up his cheap down grab from melee...)
Hey kid, wanna yiff?
Seriously though, I'm not impressed with Fox. Without the crazy broken shit from Melee, he's kind of a bland character. He's still quick and can do some fun things, but he doesn't have anything that really wows me. Haven't played with him or seen many Fox vids though, so I could just be ignorant.
Fox's Up Smash is still really a good way to kill along with the b-air (But its a little harder to pull off than in melee) Fox can also drill shine and shine spike but those are hard to pull off
H-F Blade
03-13-2008, 12:21 PM
From what I've tried, the shine is no longer jump cancellable. Or at least I had trouble jump canceling it, making it fairly risky to spike with. You can repeatedly tap down+B in the air to slow your descent but I haven't exactly found much application for it. u-air is still pretty powerful as well though obviously not the same as Melee. Fox can also still do running up smash.
Zero-SR388
03-13-2008, 03:55 PM
Hey kid, wanna yiff?
Seriously though, I'm not impressed with Fox. Without the crazy broken shit from Melee, he's kind of a bland character. He's still quick and can do some fun things, but he doesn't have anything that really wows me. Haven't played with him or seen many Fox vids though, so I could just be ignorant.
He's still cheap... He's actually banned from some tournements, because if you get somebody against the wall you can repeatedly shine them forever.
(The same goes with falco except with his laser)
I don't think Fox is as fast as he should be in this game.
His up smash and uair are still great attacks, though, and you can cause a lot of trouble with his blaster in this game.
A tactic that is used would be to shoot with the blaster until the enemy tries to close in, then use his forwardB while they are running towards you.
And another thing I like about Fox is that his up taunt (the beginning animation for fireFox) can trick people.
It's pretty good for playing mind games.
If you punish blind jump in's with his fireFox, then the up taunt will fake people out, making them jump backwards, givning you the range needed to fie the blaster without getting comboed from the lag...
$hAoLIn
03-13-2008, 04:03 PM
At this point, Fox's drill (down+air) is looking insane to me. Great for setting up combos into up+tilt, grab, and the shine. It's spike properties are great as well, and it's just too damn satisfying to land a drill spike into firefox ricocheting the opponent off of the stage for a K.O.
His new shine is looking to be great, if not better than the first. But most definitely, it's the most useful of the space animals. The fact that it can now cancel downward momentum helps with mind games, evading finals smashes, etc.
His new forward+air has wowed me a bit as well. It now has upward momentum that will allow fox to descend slower when short hopped, and with high jumps will allow all of the hits to connect for the sweetspot at the end.
I know Fox still got the juice.
Zero-SR388
03-13-2008, 04:08 PM
I love pissing people off with the land master.
you guys know about jump shine, right?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=uNawxTzTWVY
Zero-SR388
03-30-2008, 06:59 PM
TILTS:
Forward tilt: Strait thrust kick.
Seems to have decent priority, and okay range.
Down tilt: Tail sweep.
Launches off the ground,
and is great for setting up combos.
Has okay range
Up tilt: Kicks up from behind.
Can be chained with itself and is a good
launcher for opponents who are behing fox.
Has short range.
SMASH ATTACKS:
Forward smash: Rolling double kick.
Fairly quick, and goes forward a little.
Decent K.O. potential.
Down smash: Splits kick.
Good range, and hit's forward and behind.
Can be used for edge gaurding.
Up smash: Grounded backflip kick.
Great for K.O.'s, and can be used with a dash in.
Very quick and hit's 360 degrees,
and can also be combo'd out of a shine.
AREALS:
Uair: Areal backflip kick. Can K.O. at around 85%, and hits twice straight up.
Fair: Spinning kick. Hits about five times and can K.O. on the last hit.
Similar to links up B, but goes forward.
Dair: Downwards drill kick. Good for jump-in's and racking up damage,
and can be shine cancelled.
Bair: Kicks strait backwards. Has good K.O. potential,
and is good for edge gaurding
SPECIAL ATTACKS:
B: Blaster. Quick shooting laser that does not make opponents flinch.
Good for racking up damage from a distance.
Forward B: Fox illusion. strait forward dash. goes about 8 character lengths.
Can be used for recovery.
Down B: Reflector (Shine). Reflects projectiles, and stuns opponents on
initial contact. can be chained after dair and followed up with an
up smash.
Up B: Firefox. charges up with a burning animation that damages
opponents who are caught in it, the blasts in any given direction.
Has great recovery range, especially when used from strait up.
Overal Fox generally is not a close range character, but has been used as one in all of the Smash games. He has good long range attacks, and good combos in at close range and is still one of the fastest characters in the game.
Even though he is fast, he's still not weak, which gives him an edge on competiton...
ZProtoss
03-30-2008, 07:13 PM
Fox has always been a powerful character in all of the smash games, and brawl is really no exception to that. He's one of the quickest characters in the game, has strong KO moves (both smashes and aerials), and has the shine which is incredibly versatile in many situations.
I really don't see why he isn't included in the top tier on most tier lists actually.
Zero-SR388
04-01-2008, 04:04 PM
I thought he WAS high tier, but I guess I'm wrong.
But honestly, I don't see why not...
Tigerboi
04-02-2008, 04:58 AM
He dies alot easier now, other than that I really like him. short hop dair ftw.
rogueyoshi
05-11-2008, 01:39 PM
fox can chainthrow giant characters with down throw.
i don't play with items on, but found that out due to wario ware.
Zero-SR388
06-02-2008, 11:20 AM
He dies alot easier now, other than that I really like him. short hop dair ftw.
Even if you're under say, FD, you can recover.
When you'd normally fly straight out on a upwards slan aiming from the edge, you'd go way to far out and miss the edge.
But in brawl you can actually curve the firefox by moving the joystick, so you can still recover from under stages, or in another instance: If you're falling below the edge and you cant go on a slant without hitting the bottom of the stage, if you're close enough you could go straight up and then curve towards the edge.
Oh, I discovered a combo, also.
It works best at around 30% :
dair> u tilt (repeat until opponent is airborn) (repeat combo.)
I've done this up to about 2 times in a row on MK.
ZSS I got 5. (both with DI)
fox can chainthrow giant characters with down throw.
i don't play with items on, but found that out due to wario ware.
You can chain forward throw if you're quick enough...
Does anybody ,besides me, on SRK even play with fox!?
Falco and wolf can also do this.
what? no clever Fox-related title?
U-smash is the murderer of all Fox's enemies. Reflector is the enemy of the gimpable. D-air is the enemy of anyone large and not highly floaty
residentwaterfowl
06-07-2008, 01:37 PM
Fox is a great rushdown character. He can get in easily and launch combos and strings easily. He builds damage well and his drill kick is great utility move.
My big gripe is his lack of KO moves (though the ones he has are pretty good) and his lack of weight. He has poor air mobility, making his air game pretty bland. Also his recovery is only average. Edgeguarding with him is risky since he falls pretty fast compared to most.
B-air rules but it has such a narrow hitbox. That combined with Fox's high jumps and hops makes it really hard to land. SH N-air is a great follow-up to a lot of ground moves, including the dash attack.
U-air is still a great kill move but it's not as good as it used to be. U-smash still rules and you can boost it for greater effectiveness. F-smash is decent for catching opponents off-guard but isn't as strong as I would like.
Blaster sucks now. Limited range means you have to be a bit closer, making is a bit risky because of the lag.
Also, his dash is great. Foxtrotting around is easy and fast. It works to set up an approach or a grab. Constantly dashing around is a great way to frustrate your opponent.
His f-throw is great and can chain at low percentages. D-throw is eh but it can lead to a few good follow-ups. I usually switch between those two. B-throw and u-throw suck, I never use them.
Shine is still good but not as good as Melee. Useful to get opponents off your ass and to stop downward momentum.
Brahma
06-09-2008, 07:44 AM
I've been messing with Fox some lately. Nair and Dair are two great approaches. Dair leads to grab or jabs.
Usmash is awesome. Kills most characters on 110% on most stages. Boosted it can be used as a punisher after blocking or for whiffs. His Foxtrot and Using shine to jump and stop momentum set him up to cause whiffs well.
Limited blaster range sucks, you have to stop blaster sooner than Melee. It does refresh your knockback/damage though, so fire it off whenever you can.
Utilt is great for comboing. Especially if you DI Fair or Dair behind someone.
SH and immediate firefox wrecks shields. If you land one of these and a Fair on a shielder within a few seconds it will shield break.
He has a tough time off the edge though. I was getting edgeguarded by Ganon hard. His firefox doesn't have much priority.
I've been playing with Fox along with Wolf vs better players lately. I'll leave the Wolf shit out of here, but as for Fox.. his greatest problem is his approach. it's not that it's horrible or anything, but the moves that hurt the most can't be landed so easily. for instance, you basically have to dive bomb someone with the weaker part of N-air in order to start the U-tilt into D-air lockdown. Dash attack works too but that can be dodged easily
Brahma
06-10-2008, 05:20 AM
Dair seems to be a decent approach, a little short ranged, but foxtrot dancing and using SH shine to stall helps. ALso, part tof the beauty with Fox is that you don't have to approach, you can camp lasers to make them come to you.
Brahma
06-12-2008, 12:29 PM
I'm working on Fox's ledge game some. Trying to get SideB off the stage for an instant edgehog. It's risky, but against characters like Oli and Ivy, you can laser spam from half the stage away, and when they think it's safe to grab the ledge with UpB, you can Illusion over and grab it. If you're a second off though, you die. Still, not a bad thing to have in your arsenal.
Also, Dair off the stage seems pretty good. It drags down and after you have some good options. You can footstool, shine stall then footstool, or drop into them and shine, or shinestall and drop a shine. I caught a Dedede a few times with Dair dragdown into footstool and shine stall footstool. With his big hitbox it's easy to get him off the bottom of the screen.
residentwaterfowl
06-12-2008, 03:10 PM
So I'm liking Fox's game more and more but I realize his air mobility is his biggest problem. It sucks. Try double jumping forward and see how far you actually go. It makes air approaches and recovery harder than it should be. It's annoying. :/
Brahma
06-13-2008, 05:15 AM
Yeah his ground game is really where it's at. Get as close as you can on the ground before you go aerial. Range is a problem in general, at least for me. I main DK and I fall short with a lot of my Fox approaches.
residentwaterfowl
06-13-2008, 12:34 PM
Yeah, usually when I throw, I run forward as much as I can before actually trying to juggle with an aerial.
One big problem I see is approaching the ground after getting knocked upward. It's hard to escape your opponent if they try to get underneath you. Airdodging and d-airing aren't always the best option. I'm often finding myself sideBing in midair to get out from over my opponent.
Brahma
06-13-2008, 12:58 PM
Yeah, Fox has that problem as a fastfaller. Use shine stall. If you shine right out of the opponents attack range, you can drop a Dair or airdodge back to the ground afterwards. Don't use it too often, as it wil get you punished with a strong aerial attack if they know you'll stall, but keep it mixed up in their with airdodge and Dair to mix it up and keep them guessing.
imasloen
06-13-2008, 11:24 PM
He's no melee fox...
Dair/nair > shine isn't what it used to be. Upsmash and uair still kill nicely though.
huh, why's everyone using shine? I find D-air into U-tilt very effective and that's what I use. Very hard to avoid, hard to guess what move's coming next
Brahma
06-17-2008, 05:27 AM
I believe shine leads to a free dash attack or dash grab.
imasloen
06-18-2008, 10:49 PM
huh, why's everyone using shine? I find D-air into U-tilt very effective and that's what I use. Very hard to avoid, hard to guess what move's coming next
I don't play brawl fox, but I played melee fox, and shine was the best option for him after a dair. Things are probably different for brawl fox, since dair to shine is a lot easier to get shield grabbed out of now.
Zero-SR388
06-25-2008, 11:38 AM
I don't play brawl fox, but I played melee fox, and shine was the best option for him after a dair. Things are probably different for brawl fox, since dair to shine is a lot easier to get shield grabbed out of now.
It's been nerfed horribly.
It's only about half as useful as it was in melee, but its a lot easier to pillar with fox in Brawl, so thats what I do.
It doesn't require shining.
You can either dair > utilt > dair, or dair > dgrab > dair.
You can repeat the combo by doing dair, then utilt and repeat, and you can get up to about 80% damage on some characters.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=u3cUGixLQvk
This is what I'm talking about, for those of you that don't know.
PozerWolf
07-13-2008, 12:41 PM
I don't understand Fox's shine combos.
Supposedly if you hit someone with shine, you can run up and shine again.
How exactly does this work?
Some say you need to Jump Cancel the shine when you do it, but I do JC it and still nothing.
Is there somewhere that explains more about the shine?
Zero-SR388
07-13-2008, 08:51 PM
I don't understand Fox's shine combos.
Supposedly if you hit someone with shine, you can run up and shine again.
How exactly does this work?
Some say you need to Jump Cancel the shine when you do it, but I do JC it and still nothing.
Is there somewhere that explains more about the shine?
You just JC > dash > shine repeat.
It's the same effect as wavedash shine in melee, only not quite as fast...
But you have to do the JC REALLY fast... Almost simultaneously.
I'll try and find you a video.
residentwaterfowl
07-13-2008, 10:43 PM
JC shine combos have to be really fast to make them inescapable. In theory, you might not even have to JC shine if you halt your dash with a crouch and hit B immediately. Should come out just as fast...in theory...
Zero-SR388
07-14-2008, 09:31 PM
JC shine combos have to be really fast to make them inescapable. In theory, you might not even have to JC shine if you halt your dash with a crouch and hit B immediately. Should come out just as fast...in theory...
That won't work, bc you have to press shield to dash cancel.
Ehh, I completely misread what the other guy said about shine combos.
It's simple.
Shine, then dash forward and attack with w/e. (you cant really d / fsmash, though...)
And to do multi shines (shine combo) the way your talking about all you have to do is JC shine, but you don' really hae o Jc, you can just tilt the stick down and press B, and he shine comes ou faster.
The reason why it comes out faster is because if you press down all the way, it registers he lag of ducking and then standing up again before it will actually initiate the move.
So if you tilt, you don't duck at all.
PozerWolf
07-21-2008, 01:42 PM
Oh, so in general your TKing the shine to continue the combo?
Ok, I see...
Zero-SR388
07-21-2008, 02:56 PM
Oh, so in general your TKing the shine to continue the combo?
Ok, I see...
TKing...?
residentwaterfowl
07-21-2008, 05:24 PM
TKing...?
Tiger Kneeing
QCF to U + K for Sagat in SFII (I forget which version) did his tiger knee. For QCF moves that worked in midair (like Akuma's air Hadouken) it was a good way to lauch the move quickly after jumping.
This is similar, but it's more like using a jump to produce a quicker version of the move on the ground rather than in the air. The move also cancels the jump itself due to the aerial momentum canceling properties of the shine. We call it simply jump canceling or JCing, not to be confused with GG's Jcing which uses a jump to cancel the last few frames of an attack.
Zero-SR388
08-30-2008, 10:04 PM
Tiger Kneeing
QCF to U + K for Sagat in SFII (I forget which version) did his tiger knee. For QCF moves that worked in midair (like Akuma's air Hadouken) it was a good way to lauch the move quickly after jumping.
This is similar, but it's more like using a jump to produce a quicker version of the move on the ground rather than in the air. The move also cancels the jump itself due to the aerial momentum canceling properties of the shine. We call it simply jump canceling or JCing, not to be confused with GG's Jcing which uses a jump to cancel the last few frames of an attack.
Oh, I know what it is,. I've just never heard it called TKing... Lol' you don really do that motion. Its more like "Shine> Dash attack/Aerial/Re-Shine>repeat... I dont really shine much, though.
Kumer
09-26-2008, 04:40 PM
yeah i started playing as fox again and i'm really loving it. his jc shine for example it isn't nearly as useful as it was in melee, but it's good to throw in the mix and throw off your opponent. it's especially good for bumping them off the edge, allowing you to go in for a sudden gimp kill. and his drill is a great poke for kills w/ up-b and down-b, and good from setting up combos w/ u-tilt or d-grab following into any of his air moves. also sh, n-air works pretty well as a poke and stuffing.
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