Emblem Lord's Training

[EmblemLord]

Ok, since I want the skill level of SRK smashers to increase quickly and I love to train/talk about fighting games I came up with this idea.

Basically it goes like this.

I will train with anyone that request it.

The training session will last one hour.

Now there other rules and I have solid reasoning behind them.

2 stock 3 minute matches. Why? So we can record matches and so I can look over them.

No items. Yeah, yeah cry more. Ready to listen to my reasoning? Ok here it is.

If you want advice on how to play YOUR character, then that has absolutely nothing to do with items. If you don't know how to fan infinite or don't know why it's good to go for assist trophies when you see them then I can't help you.

Plus items can mask player skill with thier character. Not always, but it can happen.

With no items, I can accurately observe your play style, your weaknesses, your strengths, your weak match-ups, and what you need to work on.

Hell this is training for me too, and when I look at my matches I want to be able to analyze my own weaknesses as well.

The training is about dealing with your own weaknesses as a player and dealing with your character's weaknesses and items usually make up for character weaknesses which interferes wtih training IMO.

So, anyway, moving on.

Banned stages are as follows: Warioware, Pictochat, New Pork City, Hyrule temple. Warioware and Picto Chat because of stage interference and Warioware is just dumb, since sometimes one character gets a star while another gets nothing plus the ledge dissappears when the stage shifts.

The other two are just too damn big.

After the training is over I'll either post my thoughts in this thread or pm you back.

If you want the training just post in the thread.

I encourage you to ask questions and tell me things that you think you need help on so I know what to look for.

Also I play the following characters.

Marth, Ike, Metaknight, Toon Link, Pit, Falco, Wolf.

Marth and Falco are by far my best characters.

I'm still good with the others though.

My FC is 2621-2304-4977.

Also my AIM is DrgSupergogeta if you want to communicate with me outside of SRK.

Generally I will only train 2-3 people a day. Maybe 4.

And with that, post away people.

[Chaos]

I'm on the boat for another good session for sure. I'm going to train up and try to play on monday or tuesday, lets set a time to smash. I'm maining GAW and seconding Wolf. To expound I have worked alot since last night and want to continue to improve my DI as well as my chase games. I also need to learn the engine and improve my aereal game. Aim is boogaloobboy.

[mastermind]

I need to tune up my Metaknight. Right now he's losing his spot as my main to TLink. And I just picked up TL, so I guess I need help with him, too.

Hollerrrrrr. I'm at work right now, I don't know how long you'll be doing this for, but maybe some day down the line in the next couple weeks, I'd like to get some pointers.

[EmblemLord]

I'll do this..until....uhhh...actually I see no end in sight.

As long as people want it. I'll do it.

[Chaos]

What the hell dude if you wanna play some matches now I'm available. No way to get better than to play I guess.

[orochizoolander]

LOL @ thread, Elord is a scrub. :P

I'll personally attest to him having a deadly marth dude knows his spacing very well.

BTW emblem we should get some more EPIC marth vs metaknight matches:tup:

[EmblemLord]

Chaos: I'll be on in like 10 mins.

Complaing to my friend online about how broken Snake is and why he should stop using him cuz he is lame and gay and I hate him.

[The Damned]

Also I play the following characters.

Marth, Ike, Metaknight, Toon Link, Pit, Falco, Wolf.

Marth and Falco are by far my best characters.

Complaing to my friend online about how broken Snake is and why he should stop using him cuz he is lame and gay and I hate him.

._.


...Anyway, possible construed arrogance of the thread aside (although you already said you need training as well, so that's not actually an issue), I would like to "train" with you since I usually see you around midnight or so (my time, PST) and no one else seems to be on. I get off work at 10:00 P.M. and I won't be home until probably 11:00 P.M.

However, if you're up for it, I would like to use Ganondorf and Luigi against you.

[EmblemLord]

Chaos: I stopped because I felt like I had enough matches with you to give you advice on what you need to work on.

Hope you don't mind.

GG's.

Also tell your friend GG's as well.

Do you want me to pm the advice or post it here?

[Chaos]

Thanks again man the ROB matches were my brother. I was able to notice a small but notable improvement in my play in the last 8 or so GAW matches, better at recognition of some patterns and punishing. I still cannot understand how to avoid being air juggled a billion times, it seems your air moves just annihilate mine no matter what option I try to use. So you would launch and just push me around from there.


Edit: PM or post is fine. Also my Wolf results were encouraging.

[TempestFox]

Sign me up

[EmblemLord]

Ok, here we go.

Posting it here is good since I noticed that alot of SRKer's I have faced used G&W.

I'm only gonna talk about G&W not ROB or Wolf since I really didn't face them enough to get a handle on thier playstyles.

G&W is a beast. Great damage, decent speed and good knockback on his attacks, plus alot of priority.

All of that goes out he window vs Marth. Marth is faster, with better knockback, equal in priority, and virtually equal in damage per move.

Against Marth you have to be very defensive and more patient. Bait him into dashing towards you and using a SH fair approach then punish him.

We already talked about G&W's awesome D-throw before. No need to get into that again. You just have to practice that and get better with it. Also you need to start doing dashes to space yourself. It's just a quick flick of the analog stick in either direction.

I didn't see you use it much, so start practicing with that.

The weapons of choice in this match are the d-tilt and bair. D-tilt has good range and bair has about equal range to Marth's fair and bair. Also I wanna see more u-tilt usage on your part bro. It's a solid comboing tool.

But mostly you should be be playing defensively and baiting attacks, then punishing.

As for hitting you in the air.

Airdodge dude.

Airdodge = God tier

It's too good. Just spam it. lol.

Also use G&W's dair more. That thing has crazy priority and for some reason it's safe on block.

Work on your bad habits more too like, jumping out of habit when I hit off the stage. You would just jump whenever I did that and I anticipated it perfectly and it gave me a free aerial.

Work on all that stuff I mentioned and train hard. Then face me again.

I'll be waiting.

*Runs fingers through blue hair and sheathes my sword. Cape blows in the wind as I walk away.

[Oroman]

^ Good shit Emblem. Who are these other G&W players; I'd love to play them.

[EmblemLord]

I think TempestFox plays a G&W.

I dunno I just been seeing him alot lately.

Anyway I forgot to mention this before, but you can approach with your shield.

Just dash and then when you are in your full run animation you can shield at any time. Dropping your shield only takes 1 frame, and from there you can do anything.

It's the safest way to approach in the game.

[Sonichuman]

that's interesting Emblem...I'd like to do that with you at some point when i get a chance

[EmblemLord]

If anyone wants to do it then just say when.

[TempestFox]

I think TempestFox plays a G&W.



Huh?



See my Av again.

[EmblemLord]

Lol!!!

[Bowling Pin]

Emblem, you played me earlier. What were your thoughts?

[Master Chibi]

Train me this weekend good sir~

[Monte]

don't trust this scrub. I beat him with jigglypuff, he'll only lead you to scrub town. I mean do you really want to train with someone that gets beat by jiggly?

P.S. I beat him with jigglypuff, the worst character in the game! She's just a dumb pink puff ball and I beat dat ass!

[EmblemLord]

lol. She isn't the worst.

And you beat my Toon Link.

Not my Marth.

Bowling Pin: Here we go.

MOAR PK FIRE!!!!!

You were doing great with camping me and staying slippery, but you need more PK fire less PK Freeze and less PK Thunder.

Use more F-tilt since it has great range.

More f-smash since it's his most reliable smash.

Abuse grabs when I get close. Camp hard. Real hard.

Camp so hard that I actually want to hunt you down and murder you.

Try not to go in the air vs Marth since he can beat you there.

Stay on the ground and make him come to you, then punish him when he is predictable.

[randomplayerx]

Yo, I'm the guy who played ROB earlier today with chaos. Notice his 3 letters rpx is short for my handle. Yeah its my game and wii, he just jacks it. We are both newbs when it comes to smash. I still frequently don't understand why a things happen sometimes and haven't mastered the basics. That being said, I am planning on playing online once I get a little more experience, and look forward to tips on ROB and D3.

[gbursine]

EL and masterchibislut can you both add me for shits and giggles >.<

i attempt to play on a tournament level

[EmblemLord]

I was about to play my friend, but if anyone want's an hour training session I'm free right now.

Who want's it?

[xS A M U R A Ix]

I'm getting my Wii this weekend, and I play a lot of good players pretty often, so I'll have some good strats for you all to steal. If you guys wanna learn or need help learning to fight certain characters, I play:

Metaknight, Snake, ROB, Toon Link, Lucas, DeDeDe, and Wolf.

WE DA BEST!

[EmblemLord]

The Damned: Honestly you're as good as me. Probably a bit better. I feel like I only won alot of the matches because Ganon isn't that hot.

Anyway your Ganon and your Luigi are solid. Luigi is too beast online. Can't block his Shoryuken set-ups.

I can give you no advice on your Ganon. It's solid. You just need to be able to read your opponent and make those hits count. I would suggest more side B spam over down B spam. That's just me though. Also more empty short hop mindgames and maybe a tad more ground game a la f-tilt and d-tilt. Ganon's d-tilt actually has IASA frames on it so remember that.

Your Luigi is good.

So proud that you spammed the hell outta me and managed to get around my own spam as well.

When against a better spammer you just have to watch the patterns and look for holes. Once you get in there, usually get them in the air and try to keep them there as long as possible, wait for airdodges, then retaliate.

For both your characters I would suggest more grabs. Just good for set-ups and positioning advantage.

Any specific questions you want to ask?

Amazing games BTW.

[The Damned]

The Damned: Honestly you're as good as me. Probably a bit better. I feel like I only won alot of the matches because Ganon isn't that hot.

Anyway your Ganon and your Luigi are solid. Luigi is too beast online. Can't block his Shoryuken set-ups.

I can give you no advice on your Ganon. It's solid. You just need to be able to read your opponent and make those hits count. I would suggest more side B spam over down B spam. That's just me though. Also more empty short hop mindgames and maybe a tad more ground game a la f-tilt and d-tilt. Ganon's d-tilt actually has IASA frames on it so remember that.

Your Luigi is good.

So proud that you spammed the hell outta me and managed to get around my own spam as well.

When against a better spammer you just have to watch the patterns and look for holes. Once you get in there, usually get them in the air and try to keep them there as long as possible, wait for airdodges, then retaliate.

For both your characters I would suggest more grabs. Just good for set-ups and positioning advantage.

Any specific questions you want to ask?

Amazing games BTW.

Yeah, amazing games. I wish the replay limit was longer, but I at least got to save that great Pokemon Stadium 2 Match between my Luigi and your Marth because we both stupidly killed ourselves in our first stock off the left side. :lol:

As for your advice and praise, thanks. I honestly don't think I'm better than you, though. Especially since I keep killing myself. I just have to actually use training mode more for basic things like recovery practice instead of "experiments" with the times and percentages of things and such.

As for more questions, I actually think the first thing to ask is what does "IASA" stand for? I've seen it used before, but I always neglect to ask. (That and I don't have an SWF account.)

Beyond that, taking the empty short hop thing to Ganondorf to heart, you honestly thing I should cut down on Wizard's Foot for approaching? What do you think I should it for? Because I've noticed recently, actually just yesterday I believe, that it seems like people actually recover before Ganon is done with the animation, so if they're right on top of him they can probably use whatever aerials they have that come out before short jumps.

Which is another problem with the King of Evil: Your empty short hop advice is again sound, but should I really bother to attack at all with his short hop aerials? They all have lag and I don't think that Nair comes out fully before hits the ground; the same with Dair a lot of the time if you don't C-stick it, which I'm so unused to. I mean, if I stop using Wizard's Foot for approaching so much, which I should, and I can short hop airdodge towards people, should I really bother attacking unless they're wide open?

And speaking of short hops, you say that I should use Side+B more? Do you mean on the ground, which I feel leaves me more open, or more in the air (close to the ground), like I think is better? I just want to understand your opinion better.


As for Luigi, I don't really have any big questions because I only started using him on Tuesday. I just have to learn the machinations of his Tornado better, stop overshooting people with his surprisingly decent dash attack and figure out how to recover better since you showed me--what should be obvious--that Green Missile (or whatever his Side+B is called) stops when it hits people.


So, yeah. Practice practice. (Although I kind of need to do a lot of work and I've been playing this too much as it is....)


I look forward to fighting you again sometime week if you're up for it. I have Spring Break and if I'm not at work I should be a home.


Again, amazing games. Thanks.

P.S. Thank you for showing me that Toon Link can be such annoying asshole. I'm so thankful he has the Hookshot as his grab instead of a normal one or else he would be bastard with the auto-Deku Shield.

[Rioting Soul]

Just found something out and don't know if you guys know about it yet. If you map the C-stick to do specials, do a run then press the stick in the opposite direction. This will make your character jump forward while looking back. It doesn't have the sluggish stopping animation of the other backwards forward jump method(run forward, tap back, jump forward). I got it accidentally after trying that wavebouncing stuff.

[EmblemLord]

Interruptible As Soon As = IASA. Just means you cancel the move before the animation ends completely.

Side more then down b cuz like you said people can attack ganon even on hit after a wizard's foot. Plus side b can lead to shit. Free jab or tech chase opportunity.

Empty short hop is just to mess with people although you could side b in the air vs taller characters. Alternatively I think Shade will often crouch repeatedly in place with Ganon to mess with people's heads.

Short hop to aordodge is good since ganon has to be defensive and this lets him close a little more safely.

Wizards foot is still solid, but I think Gerudo Dragon will serve Ganon a little better. But you should experiment and come to your own conclusions.

Looking forward to facing you in the future.

Also why no Snake for now?

Don't wanna whore out he best character in the game? ^_^

[quiche]

I'd love some Olimar training. When are you available?

...seriously.

[Rekano]

My Bowser game needs to ascend, its stuck at SSJ1. :rofl:

[EmblemLord]

I'm available now.

[JoeMasters]

I'm available now.


Im adding you later today, I'll try to run some games tonight. Just bring the Marth cuz im bringin Ganon.


@ damned- short hop ariels with Ganon are good with mind games lime Emblem said. I mostly use his fair for range and KO, nair for spacing, uair for comboing, diar for comboing, and bair for mixups and edge guarding. I'd elaberate more but this sint the thread to do it in, I dont like preeching, and im in a rush:looney:

ADD ME EMBLEM

[KrsJin]

This is a dope thread. I wish more would be willing to take this approach as a community both on and offline with other games.

Keep it up everyone.

[IbanezNinja]

Hey thanks for the help man, ggs.

[Oroman]

Yo Emblem you on for some training tonight?

[EmblemLord]

Yeah, gimme like 15 mins, then when I start the room plz join it.

Also get on the IRC channel so I can give you advice inbetween matches.

[Oroman]

Yeah, gimme like 15 mins, then when I start the room plz join it.

Also get on the IRC channel so I can give you advice inbetween matches.

Alright let me use the bathroom first then I'll get on.

[quiche]

GGs tonight Emblem. I think you helped my game a lot, and afterwards I was able to get 5th place in the tourney.

I beat 2 marths and a luigi/pikachu.

I lost to two wolf players. Go figure.

...seriously.

[Oroman]

GGs Emblem

[EmblemLord]

Yeah, GG's to both of you guys.

Oroman: I don't know what to tell you. You beat me a few times and I was impressed. I have a few words of advice though. For one thing don't always jump out of habit when I knock you away with an attack that has low knockback. I was able to predict your jump and punish you every time. Mix up your responses.

Also try grabbing more to set-up for your tech chase game.

I was able to hit you in the air a few times, so remember that airdodge, although you were using it alot more this timea round.

At this point it's just a matter of eliminating your bad habits, and coming up with solid strats and things to do to punish your opponents bad habits or cover their options.

Like when you did the d-throw set-up you followed up with d-tilt which covers the option of tech in place or not doing anything. Very Smart.

You also did another trick, which was repreated Bairs. You did one Bair, then when I tried to attack out of instinct you had already DIed back and this allowed you to come in with another Bair.

Coming up with solid tactics like this which take advantage of your opponents habits and instincts is key to becoming an amazing player and you are well on your way.

Good Shit Oroman.

[Oroman]

Thanks, I need to eliminate my scrubby habits (like killing myself).

[Ninja Wallace]

I'll play whenever. Need to improve my Snake.

[Shade]

I haven't played you since our first/last session. I'm always down for some warm ups/training, at some point.

Since I've just come to the conclusion I can't take my Ganon game any further as of now, I'll be using someone other than him. Also, I'd like to play your Marth, or Wolf, and none of the others for reasons I'm sure you're aware of. And I also request that you do indeed spam the shit out of me when you see the opportunity. That's what I need.

Let me know when you're available.

[EmblemLord]

Ummm, I'm not aware of those other reasons.

Please elaborate.

[Shade]

Ummm, I'm not aware of those other reasons.

Please elaborate.

So you can move spam me, like you did before. You really had me with Wolf, IIRC.

[ezekial45]

Hey Emblem! Add me! I use Ganon and Luigi mostly. Then Wolf, Falco, Dedede, and Lucas.

5198-2079-9974 <Brawl Tag: Sync>

[Keits]

Id like to 'train' with you at some point, when i have time.

[Shade]

GG's, E. Games were laggy for god knows why, though. Mad odd. Anywho, didn't know you can do a mean Sheik/Zelda, too. Good shit.

[Worthless]

I'd like to hop on for some Ike/Wolf training in the future

[EmblemLord]

Sure just tell me when.

[Worthless]

I'd be cool for some matches tomorrow night.I just didn't wanna mess up any sessions you had going now

[gh]

Thanks for the matches Emblem. I know I need a lot of work.

[eddymasta]

I'd like some training if its cool with you

[EmblemLord]

Yeah. Whenever is good for you.

[eddymasta]

Rain check, i'll play ya tomorrow if ya want :)

[Jammin'Jobus]

i'd play you if this wi-fi lagfest wasn't so bad.

[EmblemLord]

WHAT?!!?!?!

SRK...how could you let a thread of such epic porportions fall to the way side?!?!!?

I THOUGHT WE WERE GONNA HIT THE NEXT LEVEL TOGETHER SRK!!!!!!

YOU LIED TO ME!!!!!!!!

DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMN!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Keits]

WHAT?!!?!?!

SRK...how could you let a thread of such epic porportions fall to the way side?!?!!?

I THOUGHT WE WERE GONNA HIT THE NEXT LEVEL TOGETHER SRK!!!!!!

YOU LIED TO ME!!!!!!!!

DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMN!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I guess we need to get a new metagame, huh?

[Zan-kun]

Yo, I'd be totally down for this because my Sonic and PT suck. Hard. I won't have much free time until the week after next.... I'll wait if I have to.

[mugwhump]

I'd like to do some Falcon Punch once I get my dongle working again

Also I can train anyone having trouble against Captain Falcon

just in case you can't beat him

I know there must be someone

[Pimp Willy]

I guess we need to get a new metagame, huh?

OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH DAMN

speaking of metas, metaknight is pretty fun to play and easy to pick up : O

[Galactic]

,As for hitting you in the air.

Airdodge dude.

Airdodge = God tier

It's too good. Just spam it. lol.

*Runs fingers through blue hair and sheathes my sword. Cape blows in the wind as I walk away.

lol @ the idea of a Marth player vs someone who doesn't know how to air dodge. That must have been RAPE.

Haven't played online as of yet, but I will soon once my internet at home stops fucking around. Let's see how good you guys on SRK are. (Let's see how bad lag hurts this game)

^_-;

[Chiris Pantsu]

I'd like to train my IC/GaW/Jiggz against you. I'm really bad. D:

[DGMavn]

Holy crap, made an SRK account to get in on this.

Sometime Saturday work for you?

[Monte]

Holy crap, made an SRK account to get in on this.

Sometime Saturday work for you?

talk about setting yourself up for disappointment. EL can't even beat jiggly! I'll show you guys the true strength of camping.

[EmblemLord]

LOL.

I didn't even camp you in that match.

Saturday is fine or Sunday. Doesn't matter.

[randomplayerx]

I still want to play sometime, just been playing lots of halo 3 recently.

[DGMavn]

Cool. I'm here off and on most of the day, so hit me up on AIM when you're around.

FC = 0387-8529-1923.

[uremog]

i want to do this, but i'll be broke ass busy for the next week practicing for a performance. i'll get back about this after that

[Ryjin]

Okay I gotta see how good EL really is.

R.O.B. Power! - FC - 1934-0299-0304

My aim is Luda1187 if you wanna get some matches going and I'm not on Wifi.

[Ryjin]

F*ck marth goddamnit! Good games Emblem.

[EmblemLord]

lol. I used Marth like..twice?

Anyway, you want advice or are you good?

[Ryjin]

Any tips you think might be good.

[EmblemLord]

Ok.

You didn't use Lucario or Snake much so I won't comment on them. Your ROB was solid. Won't comment on that either. Except maybe to use more d-tilts since they will usually trip an opponent and you get a free d-smash and they chaing together really easily.

Also be more aggressive with off the stage edge guarding with ROB since he can fly.

I'll comment on your PT though. Mainly your Ivysaur. More Razor Leaf spam as well as more jab combo. Also more spacing with your Bair. That move has insane range and speed. With Razor leaf and Bair cmaping you can really be a hassle for your opponent to approach.

Your Charizard was good overall, but stay on the ground a but more overall and remember to use more d-tilts. It has good range and it's very fast. More Flamethrower when you can.

Your Squirtle was good from what I saw. Remember to DI back with your aerials to avoid being punished.

We'll play more again and then I'll have more for you.

[randomplayerx]

Yo wed is my off day, so I'm going to make an effort to play you. I'll just look for you in the irc channel.