Alpha 3: Q & A

[GeekBoy]

The other thread was 72 pages...I don't know how much was spam or not, but that's too much...continue here!

[CMM171]

Can anybody post the character rankings for an A3 n00b plz? I know I've heard lots of good stuff about V-Akuma and V-Sakura but I wanna know some others because I just started to play(I know I'm really late:p ).

[mondu_the_fat]

This is going to sound inane, but check out the previous Zero 3 thread (page 65, for example). Sorry, but there are repeated requests Z3 rankings (more than all the other games combined). There is also a dedicated V-Akuma thread.

.

[State of Nature]

OK, many random questions.

1. Runaway Vega: is his best runaway Ism V-Ism? When Sabin said his air defense was KK throw, did he mean the airthrow? Is it ill advised to slide when people jump at you to get out of the way? When you use his off the wall moves for runaway, do you just fly away and not hit punch, or do you hit punch and try and land far away (whiff the attack)?

2. What other characters are good for runaway? Rolento, right? What about Guy?

3. What are Charlie`s best air defenses? Crouching strong, crouching fierce....standing rh? Should I bother with the short flash kick?

4. What regular/special/super move does the most guardbreak damage in the game?

[glass]

Geekboy:
could u post links to the other individual A3 threads at the TOP post of this thread? they're small... but i think that's just why they need to be mentioned. i recall one for each of the ff:

- Gouki
- Sakura
- Nash
- Zangief
- Rose


CMM171:

originally posted by Muskau
page 66
A3: A3 Everything!


Top Tier
---------------------------
Dhalsim
Akuma/Gouki
Zangief
Sakura
Ryu
Charlie
---------------------------

Is Charlie right to be here? It makes second tier look kinda empty... lol

Second Tier
----------------------------
Rolento
Karin
Sodom
Vega/Balrog
----------------------------

I don't see why Sodom is so great, I thought he was toast after his VC was done, and I haven't heard too much about him winning in tourneys

Third Tier
-----------------------------
Chun-Li
Juni
Cody
Guy
Gen
Cammy
Adon
Sagat
Ken
Balrog/M.Bison
M.Bison/Vega
Rose
Blanka
------------------------------

Should Chun-Li perhaps be moved to second-tier??? I was also wondering if Balrog or Blanka should be moved around, they both have very powerful pokes.

Bottom Tier
-------------------------------
Birdie
R.Mika
Dan
Juli
E.Honda
-------------------------------

Bottom Tier is still the same since I haven't seen much of these characters


State of Nature:
i really don't know... i'll answer your questions with questions...

1. yes the KK airthrow; i recall him mentioning it's good because it throws the opponent behind him. i'm not sure about its other properties tho; maybe it has larger range than his PP airthrow..?

2. Rolento for runaway, yes. Chun works too i think (hit and run?). does V-Akuma qualify for this position?

3. IMHO, stand jab and low strong if deep, low fierce and stand roundhouse if up high. short flaskick isn't bad, i use it a occasionally; i personally use c.FP the most, JP second most. but take a second opinion. top priority anti-air of course would be his VC.

4. hmm... i wouldn't know..


my own questions.
- i've been playing Ryu a lot lately. i must ask if this is reasonable; c.FK xx hadoken. this is probably a ST era question but i never learned it's importance until now. as Ryu i constantly need to use walk up c.FK xx hadoken. but often one of 3 things will happen;

1. c.FK > red hadoken (most frequent)
2. c.FK > shoryuken (second most frequent)
3. c.FK > blue hadoken (least frequent)

i'd like to know how to maximize the frequency of #3 while minimizing that of #2. if that's not possible i'd like to know how compromising for the (much) slower red hadoken is likely to get me killed (who can VC or reversal through it) if ever. or maybe the difference between using the red and blue in A3 isn't even worth worrying about?

- why does c.FP/FP xx shoryuken hit some times and not others? what makes the difference?

[Muskau]

I think Apoc should probably have a SFA3 character of the month where he comes up with a new hardly used character with secret techniques that suddenly put them into second tier lol

[v-ryu_jimmy]

HELLO ALL! im back:)

if you want, i can make a technical video for lot of character (when start OC, how to escape OC, etc..). then, there will be post on www.thelemmings.net.

please, tell me what kind of strategy you want in it. (i already have some idea. but tell me what you think about).

ps: there were too much post...i couldnt read them all T.T

Ill post this message on all character's thread.


ps2: maybe it would be good to create a new thread "A3 technical idea" with all your ideas. then, i wont have to check every thread to see what you wrote;)

[gbursine]

In all honesty, I think dan may be 2nd to last tier.

[bushin187]

what ism is best for Rolento ? Is it X or V-ism ?

[HawaiianRyan66]

What are Rolento's Vism combos?:D

[Apoc]

Originally posted by glass
Geekboy:
my own questions.
- i've been playing Ryu a lot lately. i must ask if this is reasonable; c.FK xx hadoken. this is probably a ST era question but i never learned it's importance until now. as Ryu i constantly need to use walk up c.FK xx hadoken. but often one of 3 things will happen;

1. c.FK > red hadoken (most frequent)
2. c.FK > shoryuken (second most frequent)
3. c.FK > blue hadoken (least frequent)

i'd like to know how to maximize the frequency of #3 while minimizing that of #2. if that's not possible i'd like to know how compromising for the (much) slower red hadoken is likely to get me killed (who can VC or reversal through it) if ever. or maybe the difference between using the red and blue in A3 isn't even worth worrying about?

- why does c.FP/FP xx shoryuken hit some times and not others? what makes the difference?

Here's what I find easiest. And I do believe accuracy of these basics are key to playing a good Ryu.

This may depend on your type of stick but the idea is the same. While walking, let go of the stick as you go down or tap back(tapping back will slow your momentum a tad) before going down. Thing is, if you tap back and then roll to down, you will get the red fireball. If you go neutral then down, it will always be the blue fireball.

Also, be sure of when you press the button. You may do the motion for a fireball properly, while walking, but if you hit the button while the stick is at down/forward, you will get a dp. Be sure that you don't press the button until you are directly pressing towards.

Another method requires no stopping(not that going neutral is even noticeable to the opponent, heheh) just walk, then down+forward, complete the fireball motion fast ending with towards and hit the button AFTER you are holding towards. Kind of a delayed thing. You cancel the end of the forward but the delay helps you NOT to hit the button at down+forward(getting a shoryuken) since you pause for a split after it's already at the towards position.

Letting go is what I do. If your sticks are very loose I recommend delaying the button so that you avoid the dp command completely.

The reason for getting a dp is because the button is timed wrong and the computer uses walking as the towards part of dp motion. Then, hitting the button a 10th of a second off leaves you in the down-forward position which is specific to a dp even if you do complete the fireball motion. The mistake comes at when you hit the button.

Getting the red fireball comes from over compensating or doing the 2in1 from a blocking posture. To avoid this, simply avoid going past down on the stick before a fireball. Going passed down(meaning to down back and further) leads to cpu misinterpretation. That's why letting go is suggested. When you let go, you're less likely to grab the stick and pull it back to do the fireball and more likely to tap down and go into it.

Hoped this helped some.

Woohoo, all this a3 info. We need to do a collaborative a3 guide. With all of the info on these sites? sheesh.

Apoc.

[bushin187]

Originally posted by glass
Geekboy:

- i've been playing Ryu a lot lately. i must ask if this is reasonable; c.FK xx hadoken. this is probably a ST era question but i never learned it's importance until now. as Ryu i constantly need to use walk up c.FK xx hadoken. but often one of 3 things will happen;

1. c.FK > red hadoken (most frequent)
2. c.FK > shoryuken (second most frequent)
3. c.FK > blue hadoken (least frequent)

i'd like to know how to maximize the frequency of #3 while minimizing that of #2. if that's not possible i'd like to know how compromising for the (much) slower red hadoken is likely to get me killed (who can VC or reversal through it) if ever. or maybe the difference between using the red and blue in A3 isn't even worth worrying about?

- why does c.FP/FP xx shoryuken hit some times and not others? what makes the difference?

I don't understand. c.FK knocks people down right?
you must mean c. MK. Or maybe i just learned some new shit :lol:

no seriously c.Fk can't combo into anything right?!?! ( unless it's akuma's OTG )

[Apoc]

Originally posted by bushin187


I don't understand. c.FK knocks people down right?
you must mean c. MK. Or maybe i just learned some new shit :lol:

no seriously c.Fk can't combo into anything right?!?! ( unless it's akuma's OTG )

no, cr.RH can't cancel into anything outside of vism. Cr.fk can cancel into anything.

Allow me to tease for but a second.

Fk does not mean "Fierce Kick". There has never been a fierce kick in streetfighter. It has never been light kick, medium kick, fierce kick. There isn't and never has been a fierce kick.

Now, for streetfighter, the buttons are as follows(for the past 11+years) jab/strong/fierce for PUNCHES. Short/Forward/Roundhouse for KICKS.

Once you understand this, it's easy not to be confused. cr.fk could ONLY mean crouching forward kick.

You're confusing 2 things here.

#1. There is no fierce kick.
#2. You understand things as light medium and hard. Problem here is you mixed true button names with light-hard and came up with fierce kick. One or the other would suffice. SF button names or light-hard for the newbie. Confusion only comes when you mix the two somehow:P

K...done teasing.

Past posts should make sense now=)

Apoc.

[js2756]

FK means Forward Kick.

The equivalent of that is Medium Kick or MK.
Jab Punch (JP) = Light Punch (LP)
Strong Punch (SP) = Medium Punch (MP)
Fierce Punch (FP) = Hard Punch (HP)
Short Kick (SK) = Light Kick (LK)
Forward Kick (FK) = Medium Kick (MK)
Roundhouse Kick (RK) = Hard Kick (HK)

Capcom used this terminology when they released SF2. They switched to LP, HP (I believe) with CvS and MvC2 since there was only 4 buttons (not sure what they're using for CvS2).

[bushin187]

lol I understand now. stop it !!!!!!!!!!! :(

[js2756]

Actually, I never saw Apoc's post when I posted mine. I did edit it after I saw it though. :D No worries, a lot of people are used to MvC2 terminology, so they look at me wierd when I use the old SF terminology.

Apoc: You're my hero for that bigass post on A-Rog from the old "Everything about A3 thread". :p

[Apoc]

Sweet! Gracias js2756
:D

Bushin:It's no biggie, everyone does it. I was just teasing because of the confusion.


For those interested, on #gamecombos on efnet PSX2000 uploaded some Vegas A3 matches as we were getting ready for Evo. It has me and Danny Leong(team usa A3). I'm using some Chun and some Rog in A-sim. Danny is using his sick V-Akuma. Psx joins in to give us some comp for characters we don't get to face often by throwing us some A-gief and some A-Sim. There's a bit of humor added as well. It's a good 235mb.

It showcases Vegas style which is completely aggressive.

This was prolly a week before Evolution. I hadn't bothered to add crouch cancels yet and Danny hadn't perfected the crouch cancel vc finisher at the time neither but the play is top notch. For those that haven't seen a good A-Rog in action, this shows him in high level comp.

If you need help getting on irc you may refer to www.gamecombos.com and I think Dr.Funkenstein may add it to his hub.

Also, during spring, A3 will be one of the main events in the Vegas tourney being planned so I'll keep ya posted for those interested in having spring break in Vegas=)

Apoc.

[Rolling Start]

My biggest problem matchup by far is my usually A-Cody (sorry, can't do customs on a keyboard) vs any Vega. All of cody's moves seem to have just a LITTLE too much start-up time (all the ruffian kicks, bad stone, criminal upper, shall i continue?), and vega just jumps all over my as. Plus, without a dedicated normal anti-air really worth a damn (IMO), i get rushed like a mother. Any help from a cody freak would be much appreciated.

PS: How come blanka isn't rated any higher in this game? I always seem to do quite damn well with him against people of my own skill level (semi-noob - bta noob). Is it his lack of a decent super? His VCs not quite good enough? I want answers!

Please.

[TS]

Originally posted by Rolling Start
PS: How come blanka isn't rated any higher in this game? I always seem to do quite damn well with him against people of my own skill level (semi-noob - bta noob). Is it his lack of a decent super? His VCs not quite good enough? I want answers!

Please.

Blanka is a pretty decent character, I think. A lot better if you can crouch cancel well. Good air priority (which of course is good for ccs), but he's pretty unspectacular. I actually found out that if you're one of the like 3 characters in the game that can't beat his rolling ball attack (Rose is apparently one of them, sans super), you actually have to start thinking. And having to think, while someone else can just be on auto pilot, obviously puts you at a disadvantage.

Rolento is REALLY good, in all modes. I'd probably have to say A or V is best.

Nature- Sabin meant the air throw, because it has crazy range.

[Nibor]

Originally posted by Rolling Start
My biggest problem matchup by far is my usually A-Cody (sorry, can't do customs on a keyboard) vs any Vega. All of cody's moves seem to have just a LITTLE too much start-up time (all the ruffian kicks, bad stone, criminal upper, shall i continue?), and vega just jumps all over my as. Plus, without a dedicated normal anti-air really worth a damn (IMO), i get rushed like a mother. Any help from a cody freak would be much appreciated.

PS: How come blanka isn't rated any higher in this game? I always seem to do quite damn well with him against people of my own skill level (semi-noob - bta noob). Is it his lack of a decent super? His VCs not quite good enough? I want answers!

Please.

First I'd have to say go to the arcade, but i'm sure you're answer is that you can't, but let me make it known that it is very possible to do customs on keyboard so just practice.

Anyways, the Cody Vs. Vega matchup. Vega definately has the upper hand especially when its A-Cody. Vega can hit Cody with c. strong after a blocked mid screen jab criminal upper, so be sure not to get screwed by using that on a blocking vega. Cody's main problem in this fight is that he's not really fast enough to catch or corner vega. Use c. fierce -> short ruffian as a poke (somtimes even c. fierce -> jab stone even though there's a small window against vega to get punished) Cody can't really safely use stones to zone in this match, between vega's high and fast jump and his long limbs he'll be able to punish Cody when he tries to use his projectile. Use s. forward too because it will stuff vega's c. strong. For air defense use the normal s. roundhouse, but if you find yourself in a jam use c. fierce. The c. fierce might end up trading a lot but if you trade with a j. short its worth it, plus, they are still hit up into the air giving you plenty of options. An earlier c. fierce will hit clean though.

Crouch Cancel is your friend in this matchup. Vega jumps around a lot and Cody can outprioritize most if not all of Vega's jump attacks with a jump jab. Not only will cc do massive amounts of damage and dizzy, but it will also corner vega. This is exactly where Cody thrives, when his opponent is in the corner. Playing Cody you probably know all of his corner traps. Also, when you hit with a jab criminial upper, go for the counter it j. fierce a lot. This way you can utilize crouch cancel to bring vega to the corner once again.

Jumping in you can have problems. Against V-vega, his flashkick will beat most of your air attacks. So i'd recommend if you know he's going to go for flashkick then jump in and block the flashkick and then f + roundhouse him out of his recovery. J. roundhouse will stuff vega's c. fierce if timed right but be sure not to become too predictable with it because then Vega can start using his air throw for air defense.

Also, throw a lot. Cody's kick throw is great, it does good damage every time and it puts the opponent into or close to the corner. After a KK throw you can walk up and c. fierce -> short ruffian (or jab stone) for even more pressure. Oh and Cody has a small trick which really isn't even a trick but it's great. Hit j. roundhouse, when blocked (or hit even), doesn't push him that far away from the opponent compared to other peoples jumping fierces + roundhouse. After a jump roundhouse just walk forward a small amount and throw. It really gets on people's nevers especially when you hit with the j. roundhouse and you go into throw anyways :lol:

I strongly recommend though, trying to get Cody's customs down. It will give you a 50%-100% air defense option which is really valuable especially against a tough fight like vega.

[Apoc]

V-Ryu-Jimmy,

Every thread dude? Every A3 thread? heheh sheesh!

Apoc.

[Apoc]

Originally posted by Muskau
I think Apoc should probably have a SFA3 character of the month where he comes up with a new hardly used character with secret techniques that suddenly put them into second tier lol

LOL! Sounds fun! Pick a character, I'll try! Who knows? I was gonna use A-Vega next cuz Vega/Chun/Rog are my og characters=)

Apoc.

[Muskau]

Hmmm I dunno what character hasn't been covered much? If all the stuff about SFA3 that was ever posted on this messageboard (including lost crash stuff) was collected together then you'd have a lot of info about everything. So I'm not sure who is the least talked about.

Since most of the time on SFA3 threads people want VC's and not an overall list of tactics that the character can use, so it seems like as soon as the match starts you must get into position for VC lol

I'm not sure if SFA3 overall character tactics should be discussed more, since two stuff ups can cost the match in competitive play, and its even more dangerous since a VC or CC can be tacked on to the end of it.

ST seems to have more focus on overall tactics and gameplan on that level because they don't have the luxury of doing a memorised and practiced series of attacks that the opponent cannot defend against after you get a hit. Easy ST damage just sounds like its harder to get in comparison. I suppose this is what makes old-school players who used to play ST better than newer players since the basic ground tactics are already at a good level with ST players, while newer players are trying to memorize VC's and so forget the other things.

Hmmmm I'm rambling

[gbursine]

How bout v-dan?.... he's got like a vism counter, with his pushblock. doesn't that bring him anywhere above absolute bottom tier?

[Gandido]

I believe Temujin could talk best about V-Dan.

A-Guy = too good
Apoc = My father

Whiff cancelling into overheads off a final fight chain that was blocked is neat.

[Apoc]

Originally posted by Gandido
I believe Temujin could talk best about V-Dan.

A-Guy = too good
Apoc = My father

Whiff cancelling into overheads off a final fight chain that was blocked is neat.

Hey hey hey! Chill on the "old" jokes bro! I'm not THAT old:mad:

heheh:p

Apoc.

[d_chang]

Originally posted by TS


I actually found out that if you're one of the like 3 characters in the game that can't beat his rolling ball attack (Rose is apparently one of them, sans super), you actually have to start thinking. And having to think, while someone else can just be on auto pilot, obviously puts you at a disadvantage.


I think if you walk one step forward and neutral roundhouse you can punish it. At least is memory serves me right. I'm interested in knowing for sure, just out of curiousity. No more playing Rose for me. The only reason I remember, is cuz I remember NOT being able to do it in Zero3CRAPPYUpper, and I got frustrated.

Daniel

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by Rolling Start

PS: How come blanka isn't rated any higher in this game? I always seem to do quite damn well with him against people of my own skill level (semi-noob - bta noob). Is it his lack of a decent super? His VCs not quite good enough? I want answers!


Blanka is pretty much an auto-loss against Dhalsim. I think it's the worst match in the game. In my experience, he's also pretty much an auto loss against Gief too, as well as Honda (!) and Balrog. Such a poor track record against two of the most played characters and one of the worst (Honda, not 'rog -- I don't want to be flamed to death by Apoc :)) is a horrid sign.

Most people who play Blanka tend to play on auto-pilot (to use TS' term) and tend to tely on his jumping attacks and rolls to overwhelm an opponent. No insult meant, but, yes, noobs love Blanka because the don't have to think to win with him. However, if you do take time to play him intelligently, he's decent.

[ballpoint]

i dunno if he's so bad vs Gief, well A-Gief anyway. imho he's kinda like Vega in many respects, and in that match Gief's (lack of) mobility doesn't help. i'd agree abot the auto-pilot... there's a lot of stuff u can see coming that just forces you to take guard damage if you don't have the tools to fight him. but against certain chars like X-Rog, Blanka literally loses for free :D

Apoc:
i've never thought about releasing the stick, thanks. i figure tho in the US the sticks are rather tight; over here the sticks are the japanese style ultra-loose ones so letting go is a bit of a problem (large stick rotation diameter).

mm... i've tried several things
- holding down, tapping K, then doing the qcf much more quickly then hitting P (like your second method)
- holding down-back, then the qcf much more quickly then hitting P.

the second one i listed should've worked better in theory but it's pretty much the same i find. will need more testing :D


OKAY... does anyone have any tips for learning Gief? i'm just talking about landing SPDs more consistently.

- i'm using super loose sticks so any ideas on that situation would be good. for one thing it took me at least 4 years to realize that to do a 360 or 720 on loose sticks, you don't need to scrape the edges of the stick casing (you don't have to touch the square hole the stick is mounted in).
- clockwise or counterclockwise? as in, what works best for you.
- lately i've made a point to tap JP > FP after the 360 motion. i think in theory i should get either a jab SPD, a fierce SPD, or a whiffed prox cancelled jab into a fierce SPD. or basically just a doubled chance of an SPd coming out. sometimes tho the jab just comes out on the full due to human error. should i bother drumming both buttons?
- is jab prox cancelled into SPD commonly used at all?

- Gief jumps on me with fierce, which i block. i try to jump after the block, but his close low roundhouse always tags me. wtf?
- how to beat Gief's jumping forward knee without meter? seems to be rather abusable..

[ballpoint]

oh.. is Mouko's All About A3 translation still in the works? anyone heard from him?

- doesn't the AAA3 book list some some of the best/most useful guard crushing strings for each character? like Rose's low strong > low forward > far roundhouse. we could use more of that.

- what's Ken's best strings into RK or f.RK? it's one slow thing but i've seen someone beating shit outta ppl with it and missing wasn't an issue. it's not his ST roundhouse (speedwise) but i figure it involves conditioning them not to jump, then whacking them with it.

- what's Rog's standard VC? a lot of places have "repeated headbutts" but he doesn't have that on the arcade.

[toilet]

Originally posted by ballpoint
OKAY... does anyone have any tips for learning Gief? i'm just talking about landing SPDs more consistently.
Sorry, but when anyone mentions A3 Gief I have to throw out http://shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13894. It has a lot of good info from before the big SRK crash as well as everything mentioned since and is worth reading.

clockwise or counterclockwise? as in, what works best for you.
I find clockwise easier if you're asking. It's good to be ambispinderous if you're learning since, as Apoc mentions in the Gief post: "I had a good laugh when he talked about how good Japanese V-Gief was. What was funny was the reason. What's funnier is that the reason is true. The Japanese are the only V-Giefs that can do the extended range grab from both sides consistantly!"

JP > FP ... is jab prox cancelled into SPD commonly used at all?
Yes! Get used to the "magic distance" (again, Gief guide). Learn how to do it with Jab SPD's and you'll be amazed how far away you can suck them in from.

how to beat Gief's jumping forward knee without meter? seems to be rather abusable..
Hm. I don't find Gief's knees that special in A3. Now A2 on the other hand...

But seriously, I don't know the situation you're in, you just might not have frame advantage for retaliation. Practice your reversals? Same with jumping out of the fierce, though if you are getting tagged with the c.rh then the opponent most likely didn't do the fierce deep enough and you're getting hit in your pre-jump animation.

[Muskau]

Yeah I'd love some basic pressure strings and normal move priority comparisons for characters, but I doubt they'll be done for a long time.....

For V-Ken I find b+FK more usable than his RK pokes most of the time since on a successful hit with b+FK(such as anti air) can be cancelled straight into a hadoken so you can keep pressure on.
I find the standing RK more useful when your sure they are not going to jump. b+SP is just a funny anti-air to use if you want to go for style points lol

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

Could some one tell me what any ism Vega has on V-Akuma??

[TS]

...please don't tell me I've been crouch canceling off of counter hit jump jabs and turtling, when I could have just hit Roundhouse. It makes me feel sad.

Originally posted by Sir-Jabs-Alot
Could some one tell me what any ism Vega has on V-Akuma??
His own blood.

I dunno, Vega doesn't do TOO bad, especially if you're playing someone who doesn't get to play Vegas that often. Poke with crouching Strong and Fierce, and Forward, and all that, like usual, and learn when to jump. Vega doesn't really have any character-based advantages, but in terms of practicallity, just keeping your distance and poking the shit out of them will draw out a Dp or fireball from a LOT of people, so you can do alright because of things like that.


There are vids of some CTF a3 tourney over at cornertrap. (http://www.cornertrap.com) Really good match of Arturo vs Ricky Ortiz, but the rest of the vids are cool too (Nibor vs Ortiz, and 2 of Temujin vs Ortiz). Go get them if you don't have them already. Mostly Sak vs Dhalsim, except Sabin plays some V-Vega, Nibor plays Cody, and Temujin used Cammy and Dan in one match.

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

Originally posted by TS
...please don't tell me I've been crouch canceling off of counter hit jump jabs and turtling, when I could have just hit Roundhouse. It makes me feel sad.


His own blood.

I dunno, Vega doesn't do TOO bad, especially if you're playing someone who doesn't get to play Vegas that often. Poke with crouching Strong and Fierce, and Forward, and all that, like usual, and learn when to jump. Vega doesn't really have any character-based advantages, but in terms of practicallity, just keeping your distance and poking the shit out of them will draw out a Dp or fireball from a LOT of people, so you can do alright because of things like that.


There are vids of some CTF a3 tourney over at cornertrap. (http://www.cornertrap.com) Really good match of Arturo vs Ricky Ortiz, but the rest of the vids are cool too (Nibor vs Ortiz, and 2 of Temujin vs Ortiz). Go get them if you don't have them already. Mostly Sak vs Dhalsim, except Sabin plays some V-Vega, Nibor plays Cody, and Temujin used Cammy and Dan in one match.

Thanks for the link.. I have a friend thats better then me at A3. He has played longer then me. Its hard to win with his Vega A,X,or V. and beat my V-Akuma all I do is wait for him to try to come in and fuck up if he will not come in then I'll jump in on him with (Rh. Hurry Kicks )and get in on him and VC or just bust him up knocking his claw and mask off lol . Then I guard his shit if I have more health ;0.. Peace!

[Big_Bad_Geif]

anyone got dan vcs?...

[glass]

Originally posted by Big_Bad_Geif
anyone got dan vcs?...

not i. but would u happen to know a guy named Patrick? decent player, played Karin Rolento and a few others, came down from Auckland (to Melbourne) a month ago.

[Nibor]

Originally posted by Big_Bad_Geif
anyone got dan vcs?...

Temujin (who has the best Dan I've seen) uses I think two customs with Dan. Here's what they are from what I've seen.

Anti air:

VC1, jab dp, land, s. roundhouse -> qcb + roundhouse, then keep doing qcb + short until the corner, then in corner, whiffed fireball, [fierce -> qcf + P] repeat brackets until 10% meter or even less is left, whiff s. jab, let shadow hit, and jump up for CCed fierces.

I don't use dan so try this at your own risk ;)

then he just has a corner fireball rave:

VC1, qcf + fierce over and over (add in a fierce or two at the beginning I guess), then with a little less than 50% meter left do qcb + short and go into the fierce -> qcf + P once or twice, and going into CC setup.

[Big_Bad_Geif]

Originally posted by glass


not i. but would u happen to know a guy named Patrick? decent player, played Karin Rolento and a few others, came down from Auckland (to Melbourne) a month ago.

Yeah... if its the same patrick im thinkin of... Does he have a shaved head?...

He was decent, but he was a long shy of being good i think... he sorta fell into patterns to easy and jumped too much... Athough I doubt he put as much time and effort into it as the hardcore guys over here....

I remember this shoto scrub beat him off and was talking shit bout him behind his back... so I jumped on and raped the bastard off... But Patricks a nice guy, hes cool to talk too...

Ask him about the suit guy...

Thanx Nibor, I was already doin the hadou rave and the whiff fireball customs with him but didnt know bout the CC stuff...

Peace....

[MIXXIAN 11]

Can someone give me a lik to the old Alpha 3 thread pleez?

[shadowcharlie]

hmmm, id like to know what geifs splash outprioritizes, and what beats it out cold.... new thread YAYAY apoc.......yayay:lol:

[Apoc]

Originally posted by shadowcharlie
hmmm, id like to know what geifs splash outprioritizes, and what beats it out cold.... new thread YAYAY apoc.......yayay:lol:

Whoa! um...with which characters? I'm sure I couldn't think of em all and a lot depends on range. It'd be much easier to explain specific characters. Also, Aism and Vism splash act differently so it really depends. Any specific character you need counters for?

Apoc.

[Temujin]

for the CC ender with dan you do (stand fierce, whiff fireball) until almost no meter then you do standing strong and jump up (shadow hits) then I usually do 3 jump fierces, one or two jump strongs, then land with low fierce>>spin kick (short or roundhouse).. after that you can do another low fierce>>spin kick depending on if or how they flip. 30-40% meter return which is crucial for Dan.

[Slide]

I've beaten Gief's splash with Guy's crouch strong deep. When I use Guy against Gief, my whole game is to get him to jump.
Sakura's early jab DP works.
Can Karin's stand fierce beat it clean without trading?

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by OrangeMegaslide
I've beaten Gief's splash with Guy's crouch strong deep. When I use Guy against Gief, my whole game is to get him to jump.
Sakura's early jab DP works.
Can Karin's stand fierce beat it clean without trading?

Err, if your whole game is to actively try to get Zangief to jump into an anti-air you're asking to be VCd, or SPD for max range.

Yes, Karin's FP can beat it, pretty well, too.



BTW, Dhalsim's jab of doom clealy beats Zangief's splash. His <near> SP can also beat Gief, but it has to be done a bit earlier than usual.

Lots of crouching SPs beat the splash (with proper timing, of course). Shotos (including Dan!), for instance. Rose'. Charlie's. Honda's headbutt beats it cold. DPs can beat it, but also requires some timing, as well as good choice between JP/SP/FP. Gen's waterfall kick is one of the most reliable aganst the splash (annoyingly so). Against V-Gief the list expands to include the traditional anti-airs, such as crouching FP of most characters.

[Nippon Ichi]

Any tips for X-Rolento?

[shadowcharlie]

Originally posted by Apoc


Whoa! um...with which characters? I'm sure I couldn't think of em all and a lot depends on range. It'd be much easier to explain specific characters. Also, Aism and Vism splash act differently so it really depends. Any specific character you need counters for?

Apoc. ryu,charlie,and sak in v
and gen in a
v splash, i was thinking sak can b+hp,or b+hk?

[ballpoint]

Originally posted by Apoc

Also, Aism and Vism splash act differently so it really depends. Any specific character you need counters for?
Originally posted by mondu_the_fat

...Against V-Gief the list expands to include the traditional anti-airs, such as crouching FP of most characters.

i'm just wondering... how did this information come to arise anyway (was it published in a guide/article?)? it just doesn't seem like something everyone just commonly notices.

what other seemingly unchanged normals have different properties in the different isms (eg Gief's splash)? i mean priority range and speed in particular (as well as bufferability eg V-Rog's c.FP).

[Apoc]

Originally posted by shadowcharlie
ryu,charlie,and sak in v
and gen in a
v splash, i was thinking sak can b+hp,or b+hk?

In a rush...um...off the top of my head...

Ryu:far st. fierce when he jumps from low forward range and such. You wouldn't believe how much this move can own Gief. Also, st.jab after walking into him. When gief jumps from a ways away he usually waits to hit the splash in order so that it stays out when it reaches you. Use this to your advantage and walk into the jump sometimes and hit jab before any move can come out from him. Of course juggle/airthrow or set up a nice crouch cancel following this as well as the usual walk under strongxxspinkick etc. Dps work as AA too:P VC. Don't underestimate the power of the airthrow over the splash. st. strong-use like fierce but when you don't have time to get the fierce out. st.forward at 45 degrees. And of course the million things you can do to him on the way up in his jump. AC etc

Charlie:far st. strong. Very early low fierce(nearly infallable when done early. If you trade, Charlie still has the momentum and the ability to juggle and all the million other yadda yadda. St.jab, much like Ryu's but it just seems better with him to me. Deep RH flashkick. Neutral RH. Hopkick backward, jump back fierce, AC, backfist on the way up will trade at worst. Airthrow...he has tons of counters but these are the best so...

Sak, I don't even touch this ho. um...st.jab, early back fierce(doubles as a poke that major counters), kk airthrow, vc if they have no meter, back+RH hella close, far RH on the way up or if they jump from far simply to cover distance. St.strong. I know at some ranges you can use low frc to major counter. Jump back forward hits it too I think...not really to sure. Temujin should know.

Gen can rush super through it, heheh. Air super or airthrow. Just fly away to the wall. Early waterfallkick, st. strong sometimes. Low RH in kkk style. st jab(in kick style preferably). Jumping RH in kkk. He has tons of tricks at certain ranges but I'm no Gen player:( I would use those if I were to touch him. Or just block and reversal 100hand slap. He can't keep jumping on you or attack after the splash. Unless on a wake up but still. Reversal 100hands should set you back at the safe distance again while doing a tad of blocked and guard damage. Sorry, don't know Gen well.

L8z

Apoc.

[TS]

To the people asking how to play Gief: just jump at them and do Fierce splash over and over, or alternate between that, and jumping in with nothing, and then SPD/FAB their anti-air attempt. And of course, jump splash, crouching jab/short, SPD. And mash on Fierce when you're on the ground, and do lariat for anti-air. That's basically all you need to know to beat people who are as good/better than you, and don't have enough anti-gief experience.


To add to Apoc's list, Charlie's level 1 flash kick super will outlast VC invincibility, so you can do it even vs V-Gief safely, IIRC. Ditto that with Gen's waterfall kick, since you can hit kick again if he VCs through the first hit.

Apoc: is Rog's "Final" turn punch practical to use, or is it out of the question because of how long it takes, and the startup time?

and for whoever asked, old A3 thread is at http://shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=174

Playing A3 on broken sticks sucks. But god damn it, I can't stop...

[Slide]

Originally posted by mondu_the_fat


Err, if your whole game is to actively try to get Zangief to jump into an anti-air you're asking to be VCd, or SPD for max range.


I'm sorry I didn't specify. I was reffering to A-Gief.

[Apoc]

Originally posted by TS
To the people asking how to play Gief: just jump at them and do Fierce splash over and over, or alternate between that, and jumping in with nothing, and then SPD/FAB their anti-air attempt. And of course, jump splash, crouching jab/short, SPD. And mash on Fierce when you're on the ground, and do lariat for anti-air. That's basically all you need to know to beat people who are as good/better than you, and don't have enough anti-gief experience.


To add to Apoc's list, Charlie's level 1 flash kick super will outlast VC invincibility, so you can do it even vs V-Gief safely, IIRC. Ditto that with Gen's waterfall kick, since you can hit kick again if he VCs through the first hit.

Apoc: is Rog's "Final" turn punch practical to use, or is it out of the question because of how long it takes, and the startup time?

and for whoever asked, old A3 thread is at http://shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=174

Playing A3 on broken sticks sucks. But god damn it, I can't stop...

Actually, Gief can vc through the level1 and 360 the 2nd flashkick, heheh.

In X the final punch is worth it and the TAP is good in certain match-ups but for A-Rog I find that it's not worth it since you can't throw. ac, trip, airthrow, and of course you lose 3 buttons period. The charge time is too long to hold down 3 buttons while not using those techniques. Some matches? Sure. Overall? Nope.


Apoc.

[Gunter]

Originally posted by TS
To the people asking how to play Gief: just jump at them and do Fierce splash over and over, or alternate between that, and jumping in with nothing, and then SPD/FAB their anti-air attempt. And of course, jump splash, crouching jab/short, SPD. And mash on Fierce when you're on the ground, and do lariat for anti-air. That's basically all you need to know to beat people who are as good/better than you, and don't have enough anti-gief experience.



Dammit, TS just gave away my whole strategy with Gief... :bluu:

[Superassrider]

About V-Nash's crouch canceling,could it be that i cant do the crouch canceling on the saturn version of alpha 3. In el_diablo's video,we see that you cant block after an air recovery. Does this only works on the arcade version,cause im not a retard,but it just wont work on the saturn version.

[el_diablo]

actually, it does work on the arcade version, on the dc version, but not on the sat(not that way) and not on the ps. on sat and ps, you gotta do it so the opponent can't flip. or it won't work. weird, but that's the way it is.

[TS]

Originally posted by Gunter



Dammit, TS just gave away my whole strategy with Gief... :bluu:

I know, but I lose to Gief so easy...proof that having more moves doesn't make you better, because Gief only does like 4 things (jump fierce/splash, empty jumpin, spd/super/vc, crouching fierce, lariat) and owns like 75% of the characters in the game. God damn him.

Apoc- thanks. How does Rog get around the standing jab issue vs shotos though? I wanna know what to look for vs a good Balrog in that match.

[Marvel_ous One]

Im really trying to learn V-Karin. I know most of the otg combos and whatnot. The only thing im having trouble with is setting up for her infinite. Can anyone help me out?

[MrSimpson]

Yo Apoc, im not gonna quote that whole post, but about the splash, i think thats gonna help mi ryu a lot. Thanks >)

[MIXXIAN 11]

Can u guys give me some Alpha3 match vids, combomovies, or sites pleez? Thanx in advance!!! :)

[Gunter]

Originally posted by MIXXIAN 11
Can u guys give me some Alpha3 match vids, combomovies, or sites pleez? Thanx in advance!!! :)

Some vids of me attempting to use V-Gief (first time!) at a recent SVGL tourney:

http://www.garnetscope.com/matches/

EDIT - Oh yeah, for the record, I had gone all the way through the winners bracket with A-Gief, then lost to Kim (ohyeah1234)'s V-Sak. In the loser's I stayed with A-Gief until I played Kim again, then from then on I used V-Gief vs. him, Alex Valle, and then John Choi (in that order).

[FLOOK-WORM]

Originally posted by GeekBoy
The other thread was 72 pages...I don't know how much was spam or not, but that's too much...continue here!

Hey Geek Boy - you are a stupid cocky mother fucker who thinks you know it all. By the way, don't go around calling players scrubs when in fact you are a scrub in my opinion. I've played you and you don't know jack shit pal. Man, you talk alot of shit online but can't back it up in real life.

Damn, I hate assholes like you. I can't wait to destroy your fucking worthless mr. know it all ass. By the way, you should know exactly who I am. I'm the guy you have never won a game against and hardly ever beat my friends either. You are a disgrace to us CA players.

[FLOOK-WORM]

Originally posted by Sir-Jabs-Alot
Could some one tell me what any ism Vega has on V-Akuma??

SJA - If you have any skill at all. You should NEVER lose with V-Akuma against a Vega. Akuma is too good. Vega has to try to poke at you but your customs are too powerful even if blocked and vega is sooo weak. Even if Vega manages to get in a full V roll custom on you, it will fully charge you V meter for another full custom. Why in the hell would you even bring this match up? Sure, there are some really good vegas out there, but overall you will rape him ever time even if you are the same skill level. A Vega has to work ALOT harder for a win than a V-Akuma does.

You can half suck with V-Akuma and your opponent can be a good player but still lose a few because V-Akuma is just sooo much better. Who else do you use and who does your friends use. You should be winning 90% of your V-Akuma matches against any A or X ism opponents and only lose a few matches against other V-opponents.

[CHARLIE-GOD]

Originally posted by Sir-Jabs-Alot


Thanks for the link.. I have a friend thats better then me at A3. He has played longer then me. But he can never beat my V Akuma with his Vega A,X,or V. All I do is wait for him to try to come in and fuck up if he will not come in then I'll jump in on him with (Rh. Hurry Kicks )and get in on him and VC or just bust him up knocking his claw and mask off lol . Then I guard his shit if I have more health ;0.. Peace!

Just curious, who is your friend that can "NEVER" beat your V-Akuma with Vega? Thinking......

[CHARLIE-GOD]

Originally posted by FLOOK-WORM


SJA - If you have any skill at all. You should NEVER lose with V-Akuma against a Vega. Akuma is too good. Vega has to try to poke at you but your customs are too powerful even if blocked and vega is sooo weak. Even if Vega manages to get in a full V roll custom on you, it will fully charge you V meter for another full custom. Why in the hell would you even bring this match up? Sure, there are some really good vegas out there, but overall you will rape him ever time even if you are the same skill level. A Vega has to work ALOT harder for a win than a V-Akuma does.

You can half suck with V-Akuma and your opponent can be a good player but still lose a few because V-Akuma is just sooo much better. Who else do you use and who does your friends use. You should be winning 90% of your V-Akuma matches against any A or X ism opponents and only lose a few matches against other V-opponents.


I agree V-Akuma has the advantage in probably a good 80%+ of his match ups, if not more. If you can do the OTG custom everytime, he is nearly unstoppable in the right hands. He has too many weapons and a full life OTG custom if done perfectly. All he needs is a custom next to you and low forward-->low RH sweep into --->OTG custom = death. Very easy to start but takes some practice grabbing them OTG. Of course his dive kick is just too good at fucking your opponents timing up. back + RH kick, dive kick, superior customs, ridicoulously fast recharging V-meters, etc. = TOP TIER easily. That's why everyone seems to use him in tourneys. Then there's V-Sak, V-Gief, A/X/V Dhalsim.....


Oh, nice name buddy. FLOOK-WORM? What the.... :lol:

[Apoc]

Originally posted by TS


I know, but I lose to Gief so easy...proof that having more moves doesn't make you better, because Gief only does like 4 things (jump fierce/splash, empty jumpin, spd/super/vc, crouching fierce, lariat) and owns like 75% of the characters in the game. God damn him.

Apoc- thanks. How does Rog get around the standing jab issue vs shotos though? I wanna know what to look for vs a good Balrog in that match.

There are no issues. It's like ol skool. If there jab is fully extended it will hit most of Rog's moves. However, if the st.fierce fully extends it's a major counter and does more than a normal st. fierce and pops them up so that you can push them further to the corner. Many ppl thought that this was a problem without really understanding. First off, if you randomly toss out jabs, even a level 1 will hit it clean. Rog starts off with 3 of them. That's not a safe bet for defense, ever. Also, you can see the timing of their presses making it easy to get a major counter. I love when ppl break out this useless strategy. I'll super them and major counter them to death. It looks really funny at first when Rog eats a few jabs. Then Rog lands one super or major counter that completely makes up for it and then some. I mean, generally, you don't ever want to show the opponent your exact intentions. Doing that is like saying let's play a game of hit the jab. If the jab hits you, you lose a bit. If you hit the jab, they lose an entire shitload. It's so easy to start off the round with a dash motion and see the jab and just do a super instead and freeze the screen. Also, better shotos will try to reversal dp the super. Rog can trick them there too. At a range say, just about starting distance, a shoto can't hit a level 1 with a dp reversal because level 1 is so slow it will hit after the dp. Then switch to level 2 when they smarten up to delay. Either way, only way outta the super is to cancel and that isn't safe either depending on the super I choose at what range. Rog can seriously f*ck with anyone who thinks st. jab is some sort of secret defense.

Truth is, timed well, ANYthing can hit Rog's moves. It's all in how the players time their attacks against one another. Jabs are dope when used as a reaction. It's suicide to randomly throw them out.

What do I do? ...hit em? heheh

Apoc.

[Apoc]

Originally posted by MIXXIAN 11
Can u guys give me some Alpha3 match vids, combomovies, or sites pleez? Thanx in advance!!! :)

There's some of me and Danny from Vegas practicing for evo with PSX2000 on irc. #gamecombos on efnet as well as a ton of a3 footage over the last couple of years.

Gunter: ooo sweet! New A3 vids=)


Apoc.

[Nibor]

Originally posted by Marvel_ous One
Im really trying to learn V-Karin. I know most of the otg combos and whatnot. The only thing im having trouble with is setting up for her infinite. Can anyone help me out?

Yo, yeah here i'll post her set up:

VC3, when you're right near the corner (but before you're totally in the corner) do: dp + P, dp +K (whiffed), dp + P, right as the second dp + P ends the shadow dp + K will hit for one or two hits doesn't matter, but then just jump up with jab then cc repeated roundhouses for infinite

[Temujin]

NEC3 Results : 1-Arturo, 2-Nibor, 3- Ricky

I just want to congratulate Arturo for his win and Nibor for his continuous improvement.

I anyone has any details about the tourney please post.. and if anyone has footage please share.

Unfortunately I have exams so I couldn't make it.. one the rare times I miss an East Coast A3 tourney.

[Marvel_ous One]

Originally posted by Nibor


Yo, yeah here i'll post her set up:

VC3, when you're right near the corner (but before you're totally in the corner) do: dp + P, dp +K (whiffed), dp + P, right as the second dp + P ends the shadow dp + K will hit for one or two hits doesn't matter, but then just jump up with jab then cc repeated roundhouses for infinite
So u cant be totally in the corner then when starting it right? I seen that one on a vid and actually done it a couple times with the whiff dp+k. I thought there was another setup with vc2. Anyways, that one is hella hard to time i guess cause sometimes they hit the shadow and cannot flip, but sometimes they flip like it aint nothin :(. I guess I'll keep practicing it then. Congrats on 2nd place Nibor. I shouldve been there to take you out :D .

[MIXXIAN 11]

#GAYCOMBOS No way!!!:mad: Peepz there are mean SOBs u plead wid them they don't help at all and give u fake links and crap and after an hour u just give up. Please just give me websites.:)

[MIXXIAN 11]

BTW in Alpha duz every char. have their own damage setting, like CVS2 & MVC2? (Been wondering 4 years now.)

[Nibor]

Hey I posted about NEC A3 results in the results thread (and about how there isn't much footage :( )

Anyways, Karin's VC2 infinite setup (its kind of dumb though because there's like 5 frames where the opponent can flip, it basically relys on the opponent not timing his flips right) goes like this: when you get to the corner just do, DP + P over and over until about 10% meter is left and then one time don't do DP + P and the shadow of the last one will hit a little after the last one ends. Then jump up for infinite.

[bushin187]

Originally posted by MIXXIAN 11
Can u guys give me some Alpha3 match vids, combomovies, or sites pleez? Thanx in advance!!! :)

get Direct Connect and connect to ((goforbroke.dynip.com)) there are alot of vids on there including ones that aren't on websites anymore.

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

Could some one please give me a link to that A3 VC page. The one with all the player VC's.. Thanks!

[Superassrider]

To the people asking how to play Gief: just jump at them and do Fierce splash over and over, or alternate between that, and jumping in with nothing, and then SPD/FAB their anti-air attempt. And of course, jump splash, crouching jab/short, SPD. And mash on Fierce when you're on the ground, and do lariat for anti-air. That's basically all you need to know to beat people who are as good/better than you, and don't have enough anti-gief experience.


TS: Playing with gief is far more complicated than that,you cant rely on jumping that much,yes a Zangief jumps quite a lot,but he also has a groud game,and footsie even if hes that fat. Because of his ground game,you can actually Jab spd just by walking!!

El_Diablo: Hey,thx for the info,I really appreciate it.

[MIXXIAN 11]

Originally posted by MIXXIAN 11
BTW in Alpha duz every char. have their own damage setting, like CVS2 & MVC2? (Been wondering 4 years now.)

^
^
^
^
^
^

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by Superassrider



TS: Playing with gief is far more complicated than that,you cant rely on jumping that much,yes a Zangief jumps quite a lot,but he also has a groud game,and footsie even if hes that fat. Because of his ground game,you can actually Jab spd just by walking!!



I think TS was just simplifying. I have to admit, when I first played Z3 with Z-Gief that was exactly how I played him, and was delighted that such simple strats _do_ dominate a lot of players.

When I switched to V-Gief (this should also answer ballpoint's question) I found out the hard way that simply splashing someone hardly works -- a lot of anti-air was knocking V-Gief's splash out of the air. This forced me to learn new strats (other than the VCs), and also led me to some of Gief's othe good moves such as knees, and a more effective ground game.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that Gief _can_ be played using a small set of moves and still be an effective force (kinda like X-Sim, in contrast to Z-Sim), but using a few more moves makes him even better.

Mixxian: What do you mean by "own damage setting? In any case, the characters of Z3 take more/less damage. Gief for example, is pretty tough -- he takes less damage from attacks and is harder to dizzy. The other end of the scale is akuma -- takes _slightly_ more damage and _slightly_ easier to dizzy. And there's also the matter of guard meter length.

[ballpoint]

Originally posted by Sir-Jabs-Alot
Could some one please give me a link to that A3 VC page. The one with all the player VC's.. Thanks!

Geekboy:


i was about to say they were on the first page of this thread... but when i looked for the post with all the links and the post was gone. wtf..? even toilet's posting of the link to the Gief thread is gone. i'm quite certain it was on this thread, because i'm certain jimmy used that post to reach and bump all the other A3 character threads up..

edit:
gah... still looking. if any mod finds it, can someone put them on the sticky Dasrik thread..? thanks..

[MIXXIAN 11]

Originally posted by mondu_the_fat

Mixxian: What do you mean by "own damage setting? In any case, the characters of Z3 take more/less damage. Gief for example, is pretty tough -- he takes less damage from attacks and is harder to dizzy. The other end of the scale is akuma -- takes _slightly_ more damage and _slightly_ easier to dizzy. And there's also the matter of guard meter length.

This is exactly what I mean 'cept in percentages. EX: Cammy 110% damage.

[mondu_the_fat]

The info can be found at the latter part of KMegura's SFZ3 FAQ. The damage taken by characters are by ranking, not exact numbers (ie. who takes most damage, takes least damage, etc). Putting in exact numbers is kinda hard (and pointless) because in addition to each character's basic toughness, you have to factor in the -ism type, opponent's -ism, counter hits, OTGs, current level of life, all those little factors that involve damage scaling, etc. AFAIK, Z3 has more factors involved in determining damage per hit than the other games.

'Coure, someone with all about Z3 book might be able to answer, but I haven't seen muoko post in ages.

[Bear_Fart]

anybody got any tips on how to play birdie?


0__0
(o,o) - Bear_Fart

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

Originally posted by ballpoint


Geekboy:


i was about to say they were on the first page of this thread... but when i looked for the post with all the links and the post was gone. wtf..? even toilet's posting of the link to the Gief thread is gone. i'm quite certain it was on this thread, because i'm certain jimmy used that post to reach and bump all the other A3 character threads up..

edit:
gah... still looking. if any mod finds it, can someone put them on the sticky Dasrik thread..? thanks..

Are you the guy that posted the thread links when this thread started? lol I looked at them and was going to print some stuff out. Because I knew my luck I would never be able to find it :p oh well. All I need are some V-Ryu tips and V-Akumas OTG combo the best most dmg he has... Thanks peace!!

[ballpoint]

yeah. it was on this thread right..? so i'm not imagining things? (yay i'm not insane... maybe...)

maybe the server crashed and it deleted all posts i na 24 hours window? i dunno. i'm sure those threads are still floating around somewhere tho. shouldn't be too far down.

hmm...

- i was playing around with Nash's reset VCs on the PS version, whiffing, hitting with low strong and stand fierce and such. i distinctly remember the roundhouse flashkick consistently connecting after the opponent flipped; it wasn't airblocked. this happened quite a few times. i dunno why i'm just getting this now..

- has anyone seen a glitch where the screen goes black (ala Guilty Gear) after a super finish..?

- still hanging on why V-gief's splash sucks compared to Z-Gief's, and what other normals get screwed over in the different isms (WIThOUT looking different).

- anyone heard of a CPS2 cancel from the shun goku satsu with X-Gouki? something like shor short SGS for 17 hits...

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by ballpoint

- has anyone seen a glitch where the screen goes black (ala Guilty Gear) after a super finish..?


Twice.


- still hanging on why V-gief's splash sucks compared to Z-Gief's


From what I can see, hit area. It look like Z-Gief's chest can hit slightly lower than V-Gief. Don't quote me on that, though.

[toilet]

Originally posted by ballpoint
yeah. it was on this thread right..? so i'm not imagining things? (yay i'm not insane... maybe...)
I actually noticed that too. I think he moved them (or my post at least) to the Please read before posting to Strategy & Tactics thread since there is now a link to the Zangief thread in there.

[glass]

Originally posted by toilet

I actually noticed that too. I think he moved them (or my post at least) to the Please read before posting to Strategy & Tactics thread since there is now a link to the Zangief thread in there.

actually i PMd Geekboy (or was it Dasrik?) the link to your Gief thread while the old A3 thread was still up (was quite a compilation) and the thread was on the list shortly after.

hmm... disappearing posts. this is freaky.


- TS posted a link to a japanese page with a bunch of lil charts/grids/tables some time ago arranged like a round robin, with little numbers in each box colored according to the ism. about 4 charts or so on the same page. has anyone any idea what the link was, and what the charts mean?

[DeAdSpAcE]

These questions goes out to Nibor and Temujin, two of the best A3 players around. I often get confused with how to do Sakura's custom, I'm not even sure if I'm doing it right but I do mp dragon punch, b+hp, weak hurricane kick, b+hp, repeat to wall and then dp+k, p, p, p. I'm trying to learn her lately but I have no clue if I'm even doing that right but I've seen Temujin fire off this combo real well so this one goes to him. For Nibor I've been trying to learn V-Cody, again the custom I get confused with as well. I know that the fireball motion+mk is used for traveling and there are intervals with standing hp and c.hp. How is this custom done?

[js2756]

The Sak custom is very easy to do.

Most people start it with jab. DP because it also turns the combo into an anti-air VC and you recover quickly from it. What you have there is correct. The only trick to it is making sure that your distancing is correct with your hurricane kicks. Her standing FP cancelled to fireball in the corner portion of her VC can be a little tricky, because the timing can get thrown off if you accidentily charge the fireball.

What exactly are you having problems with? If you can give a slightly more specific post about what part of the custom is giving you trouble, it'll be easier to give pointers.

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

Just go to this thread and all links are there :confused: :lol:

Please read before posting to Strategy & Tactics (READ THIS FIRST)

[DeAdSpAcE]

Originally posted by js2756
The Sak custom is very easy to do.

Most people start it with jab. DP because it also turns the combo into an anti-air VC and you recover quickly from it. What you have there is correct. The only trick to it is making sure that your distancing is correct with your hurricane kicks. Her standing FP cancelled to fireball in the corner portion of her VC can be a little tricky, because the timing can get thrown off if you accidentily charge the fireball.

What exactly are you having problems with? If you can give a slightly more specific post about what part of the custom is giving you trouble, it'll be easier to give pointers.

I think it's the distancing that gives me problems (sak custom). Once in a while the guy starts going off range and I can't continue with it. I'm guessing it's a matter of speed or such, if not then I don't know what I'm doing wrong that would bring the guy out of range.

[js2756]

If your opponent is starting to get too far away, use a Forward hurricane kick instead. It will take you farther than the short HK and you can keep the custom going. It's just a matter of gauging how far away they are and using the appropriate strength button for the HK. The timing isn't hard to get used to.

[Nibor]

For Nibor I've been trying to learn V-Cody, again the custom I get confused with as well. I know that the fireball motion+mk is used for traveling and there are intervals with standing hp and c.hp. How is this custom done?

Nibor's V-Cody Notes to be out soon. I've written the guide i just need to encode the videos that go along with it (total spoonfeedage btw). It will probably be out this weekend whenever i find time to go over to SSP's house and use his kickass computer.

Real quick here's his normal everyday anti air custom:

VC3, c. strong -> qcf + roundhouse -> whiffed s. fierce -> qcf + forward -> s. fierce -> whiffed qcf + forward -> [whiffed c. forward -> qcf + forward] (repeat brackets until corner and then do) [s. fierce -> whiffed qcb + jab] (repeat brackets until about 20% meter is left and then do) s. roundhouse -> whiffed c. fierce, (at this point the shadow of the last jab hurricane hits as the c. fierce ends) [j. short, cc landing] (repeat brackets until death or time runs out)

Oh yeah, about sakura custom. Use VC1 or VC2, and use jab dp if they are close, but also a great thing about it: a lot of people jump from far away and it will be out of range for jab dp and it may just look like a random jump that you can't punish, but just use VC2 and use strong dp and 1-3 hits of it will connect and start the custom from there.

When your into the midscreen part use forward hurricane kick every time but just switch up the fierces between back+fierce and normal fierce. This way you get them to the corner faster and you get more damage in because her normal fierce does more damage than her back+fierce.

[MIXXIAN 11]

Which Gen combo does the most damage:


1. LV.3 zanei into gekirou

2. LV2 Zanei into LV.1 Jakouha?

[Superassrider]

well the combo that i know with Gen who does the bbest damage is:

Cross your opponent with J.MK then C.LP then C"LK then C.MK then Lvl 2 janei into lvl 1 Jakouha.

hope that helps.

[Big_Bad_Geif]

Originally posted by Superassrider
well the combo that i know with Gen who does the bbest damage is:

Cross your opponent with J.MK then C.LP then C"LK then C.MK then Lvl 2 janei into lvl 1 Jakouha.

hope that helps.

The opponent can tech out between the janei and the jakouha... and if they escape the jakouha it leaves you really open...

I usually buffer the jakouha of a crouching strong... that way if they tech it u dont waste a bar and leave yourself open...

Peace

[MIXXIAN 11]

Originally posted by Superassrider
well the combo that i know with Gen who does the bbest damage is:

Cross your opponent with J.MK then C.LP then C"LK then C.MK then Lvl 2 janei into lvl 1 Jakouha.

hope that helps.

I know this combo I just wanted to know that specific point in the combo. I also know your opponent can flip out of Jakouha, I just wanted to know which juggle was the most damaging.:)
I hope this is cleared up now.

Also can u guys explain why these characters are Top Tier, cuz 'cept for a few I can't see why their called top tier( Ahh man no Gen, Fei Long, or Guy!!! :( )

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

I have a question.. (this could be a dumb question;) ) Why do they call Rog arcade Rog on DC if you hold start? My friends call him Shin Rog :lol: Also should I keep using arcade Rog or is he not far to use like Shin Akuma?

[MIXXIAN 11]

Cuz he supposed to be the Balrog from SF2.

[ballpoint]

Sir-Jabs-Alot

1) the links to the Akuma, Rose, Nash, Dhalsim, etc threads are not on the Dasrik thread. only the links to the Gief thread, and the general A3 threads including the VC thread.

2) for full notes on Arcade Balrog see KMegura's FAQ on www.gamefaqs.com. arcade Rog has similar punch and kick animations except for low fierce and roundhouse and floating fierce for X-Rog. console Rog has a headbutt he can use at anytime iirc. but the rundown is using anything but Arcade Rog is "cheating", since he's not selectable in arcade.

[Bogardalicious]

Alpha 3 kicks so much ass. Its one street fighter game that can never get old. But anyway,

The characters i use the most in A3 is R. Mika and Cody.

R. Mika's ass attack is a really good startler against others. Her uniqueness also works to her advantage (Gimmicks are really hard to find with her). Use the ass attack (kick) to rush and ass attack (punch) to counter. Ass Attack (Punch) does have that early delay but if her ass catches air, her ass gets hella high priority. Her supers are also pretty good. Her qcfx2 +p is a decent way to plow through your opponent. Her 720+p is hella good mostly against other wrasslers and non-pokers. Her qcf x2 +k super is weird and i dont quite think it does much damage. Use her 360+p over her 360+k. Her 360+k grapple has shitty priority.

And with cody, GET THE KNIFE. Get the knife, duck and quickly tap wp. The opponent will think of it as a fuck around thing but theyll soon realize that the knife has hella...and i mean hella high priority. If they jump towards you, cfp should do the trick. However, watch out for fireball bitches.

[Big_Bad_Geif]

Originally posted by Bogardalicious
Alpha 3 kicks so much ass. Its one street fighter game that can never get old. But anyway,

The characters i use the most in A3 is R. Mika and Cody.

R. Mika's ass attack is a really good startler against others. Her uniqueness also works to her advantage (Gimmicks are really hard to find with her). Use the ass attack (kick) to rush and ass attack (punch) to counter. Ass Attack (Punch) does have that early delay but if her ass catches air, her ass gets hella high priority. Her supers are also pretty good. Her qcfx2 +p is a decent way to plow through your opponent. Her 720+p is hella good mostly against other wrasslers and non-pokers. Her qcf x2 +k super is weird and i dont quite think it does much damage. Use her 360+p over her 360+k. Her 360+k grapple has shitty priority.


She got heaps of cool set ups into her level 1 720 punch super... and you get heaps of damage if u mash it rite...

c.lk, 720 jp
c.sp 720 jp (this one is cool coz she does that little hop then u grab)
qcb+p 720 jp
j.sk 720 jp

One of my fave setups is to do her slide under ur opponent as they jump in, then 720 from the other side... looks real cool and is kinda useful too...

And i think that her ac is pretty decent too...

Shes my fav character for dealin to scrubs... :)

[TS]

oops, that vid was Temujin vs Arturo, not Ricky...sorry about that...


-glasss http://www2b.biglobe.ne.jp/~s-game/zero3/dia.htm

I think it's just a chart made from a bunch of players getting together, and seeing who won the most, or which character won the most.

[glass]

Originally posted by TS
oops, that vid was Temujin vs Arturo, not Ricky...sorry about that...


-glasss http://www2b.biglobe.ne.jp/~s-game/zero3/dia.htm

I think it's just a chart made from a bunch of players getting together, and seeing who won the most, or which character won the most.

i thought something along those lines, but Dhalsim has some pretty low digits (3) while Gouki consistently has some higher ones (6-7)... @.@

[Sir-Jabs-Alot]

Originally posted by ballpoint
Sir-Jabs-Alot

1) the links to the Akuma, Rose, Nash, Dhalsim, etc threads are not on the Dasrik thread. only the links to the Gief thread, and the general A3 threads including the VC thread.

2) for full notes on Arcade Balrog see KMegura's FAQ on www.gamefaqs.com. arcade Rog has similar punch and kick animations except for low fierce and roundhouse and floating fierce for X-Rog. console Rog has a headbutt he can use at anytime iirc. but the rundown is using anything but Arcade Rog is "cheating", since he's not selectable in arcade.

:confused: Sounds like I may have said somthing to piss you off.... I meant to say the VC page is on there thats what I was looking for sorry... Also thanks for the Rog stuff..

[ballpoint]

mm... well u could've checked quite a number of general resources.. i think even gamefaqs could've helped u there..

but apologies... rough day i guess... posts running away and having a thread shut down didn't help.. blah...



- who are the highest ranked A3 players in the world atm..? (official and unofficial.. i'm not sure if Daigo still plays..)

- has anyone noticed that X-Karin uses both supers..?

[Bogardalicious]

Can some explain how x ism works. I know that you can only do one super (supposedly her best one). But whenever you miss it all that happens is that a sillouette appears behind you and the match continues. What is that? And what are some advantages of using X ism over A ism?

[js2756]

X-ism pros:
you do more damage per hit
longer guard meter
super meter fills up faster (relative to other meters)
faster walk speed

cons:
you take more damage per hit
cannot air block
no ACs
most characters have only 1 super
Supers require the entire meter

Each character also has a different normal, and sometimes special, moveset. eg. Chun has her SBK from ST in X-ism, but does not have it in any other mode.

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by ballpoint

- has anyone noticed that X-Karin uses both supers..?

Yep. Bug. Damn computer fuking cheats.

Mixxian: Which characters are you talking about?

Dhalsim -- Yoga fire -> foot/fist up ass. While this has always been his strat, in Z3 he has the godly priority to go with it. Z_sim can escape certain combos, and I'm sure you can see the advantage in that.

Akuma -- Block and die.

Gief -- SPD at ranges where you can't him him. Annoyingly high priority. VCs for up to 90% of your life.

Sakura -- priority+speed = nasty zoning

[TS]

Originally posted by glass


i thought something along those lines, but Dhalsim has some pretty low digits (3) while Gouki consistently has some higher ones (6-7)... @.@

tables are speific character or player wins... first table is for V-Sodom, so the 3 means he won 3/10 matches vs A-Dhalsim. At least I assume it's out of ten.

Second table is for V-Birdie :wtf: , third seems to be for V-Chun Li, and the bottom one is for V-Dhalsim. For some reason it was noted that V-Birdie was on the 1P side, probably for some CC combo. Also mentions something about a "counter" in the Birdie section, but nothin I can read. All the characters in the chart are in what whoever made these to be their "best ISM," and above the diagrams, there what I guess is a breakdown of that character vs each of the 3 ISMs...for example for Dhalsim, it's saying that his win ratio is 8.5 (presumably out of 10) vs X-ISM, 7.1 vs A-ISM, and 7.2 vs V-ISM. But vs the characters as they are in the chart, his overall ratio is 7.2.

[shinpug]

Hi all, New to the forum, but been playing sf since world worrior days. I craduated college recently and now Im able to get back into arcade gaming. I went to school in San Francisco but never really took much time out for arcade gaming, needless to say, Gouki has been a much favored character aside from my most favored Ryu. Anyways my question is this. I went recently to the Folsom 14 Theaters and there is an arcade there (for those who live in Sacramento you will know the place,) Anyways I picked Gouki with Aism and thought yeah I can do this just remember all the shit you learned, and this fool takes a vism Gouki and does an airflip juggle and whoops the shit out of me, judging from the posts, you all know about the vism Gouki, and My post is kinda long. In short, I am wondering if anyone can clue me in on 1, how to do this vism tecnique and 2 is there a feesable way to defend against it with aism Gouki?

Thanks.

[ballpoint]

shinpug:
we have a decent Z-Gouki here... his gameplan vs V-Gouki tho seems to consist of a lot of smart running away. i'd say keep your meter for zero counters and the L3 DP super (zero counters primarily), but many u'd probably still find it difficult to win.

look for the thread titled "SFA3 help needed" started by "The Electrifying One" for general advice on learning A3..

as for Gouki's general VC, u could try the V-Gouki thread (below). would also help if u posted V-Gouki specific strats there..

http://shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=13001


TS:
i didn't think of that...
wow. so this list would be far from complete then, listing only top tier char results...
(btw are you using the Women on the Globe (tm) translator...?)


Bogardalicious:
in addition to the stuff js posted, u have
(pros)
- CPS chain
- greater normal throw range


fighting human Shin Gouki:
someone posted this on another thread and was wondering jus for fun how to deal with it. is this match difficult or overrated? last time i played a bad Shin Gouki was using Rolento, and i could run away like a goddamned tick the whole match. no problems, but i think it was coz of the other guy's general skill level. i'd imagine V-Gouki could give Z-Shin Gouki some trouble too. what about V-Shin Gouki tho..? again, this is jus for fun and i hope this doesn't kill the thread...

[popoblo]

i'll be going to a tourney relatively soon (about 2 weeks) and A3 will be one of the games. i don't have the time to learn and practice V-ism combos.

what characters would you guys recommend me using? which of the shotos is best/has the best priority and which -ism is that particular shoto best in? i think ryu is pretty damn good.

and what's so great about sakura? is she best in V-ism or can she still be dominant in another -ism?

[Big_Bad_Geif]

all the shotos pretty much rock hard in v-ism...

although Ryu is decent in all the isms and ken is fairly decent in a-ism...

if u want a decent character without much practice try Dhalsim...

[el_diablo]

just to tell all v-nash players that i've found a way to do the same CC followup to the VC3, no matter with controller you got. so now, with nash, either p1 or p2, you can gain back 45% of vc after a vc. but it's damn hard. and aaaaaall about timing. just tell me if anyone is interested, and i'll explain it detail by detail.

[glass]

Originally posted by el_diablo
just to tell all v-nash players that i've found a way to do the same CC followup to the VC3, no matter with controller you got. so now, with nash, either p1 or p2, you can gain back 45% of vc after a vc. but it's damn hard. and aaaaaall about timing. just tell me if anyone is interested, and i'll explain it detail by detail.

i'm interested. details, details..

[js2756]

Ken is also good in X as his super is fast and damaging. He also has very good range (I believe it is the best of all the shotos unless they're in V, because of his st. RH). But the best non-V shoto would probably be Ryu in A, followed closely by Akuma in A.

Sak is by far the best in V. I honestly am not completely sure of this, but always having access to her b. FP is a huge advantage. This move has huge priority and deceptive range, plus the fact that you can cancel into the hadoken makes it a good mid-screen poke. What makes Sak so good is, enormous priority and range(b. FP, st. RH), easy and damaging customs that also build a good amount of meter when executed correctly, good speed, easy guard break combos, and a B&B combo that in all honesty, should not be doing that kind of damage. There's probably more, but those are the advantages I remember off the top of my head.

[TS]

Originally posted by ballpoint


TS:
i didn't think of that...
wow. so this list would be far from complete then, listing only top tier char results...
(btw are you using the Women on the Globe (tm) translator...?)


Didn't use a translator, though if you translate it, it doesn't make any more sense. I did find out the names of the players using the characters, so that's something...

popobolo- Ryu is good in A/X, I think Ken is better in X than A, and Sak is good in A. Crossup, crouching jab x2, standing Short, Fierce DP, repeat. Good throws, though you can't poke with her close fierce like you can in V-ISM, because of the whole range thing. Anyway, just poke with standing (far)Roundhouse/strong, and crouching forward. Crouching Fierce xx jab DP for anti air.

[popoblo]

can somebody post ryu's most damaging and/or B&B v-ism combo?

thanks.

[CrazyBalrog18]

Temujin has a sick sakura:eek: i saw an old match against ricky.

U comin to GT? there's an alpha 3 tournament the 21st of dec.

[Temujin]

Originally posted by CrazyBalrog18
Temujin has a sick sakura:eek: i saw an old match against ricky.

U comin to GT? there's an alpha 3 tournament the 21st of dec.

Most likely dude.. see ya there

[Nibor]

Originally posted by Temujin


Most likely dude.. see ya there

Oh sounds good I might actually go to this now. And temujin i heard you were coming to CTF the day before? We will get in some good matches then.

[js2756]

Originally posted by popoblo
can somebody post ryu's most damaging and/or B&B v-ism combo?

thanks.

I don't think that any 2 V-Ryu players really use the exact same VC combo. The reason for this is because it's very easy to vary the combo, and because of the different levels of execution skill out there, some like it simple while others like it to be harder (but more damaging).

At the core of most Ryu VCs is:
fireball, hopkick and that it is done in the corner (except for confusion VCs)

In fact, you can just do fireball to hopkick and repeat it until the meter runs out for a very simple VC combo that will still easily do over 50%. The variation comes in when you take out a hopkick and substitute something else since the hopkick's main purpose is to keep you close to your opponent.
eg. fireball, st. FP, fireball, hopkick, repeat
This combo will do more damage than just fireball, hopkick (upwards of a 20% boost in damage), but some people just like to keep it simple. You'll have to gauge how confident you are in your execution to determine what kind of combo you want to do.
I personally also tend to start my VCs with a cr. FK because it comes out much quicker than the FB and also forces my opponent to block low (if they anticipate it) and then I can transition to the overhead punch to the regular combo.

[glass]

okay. does Z-Guy lose to X-Balrog for free or what?

i need tips on the following matches:
- using Z-Guy, vs X-Rog (killing Rog)
- using Z-Guy, vs Z-Sim (kilingl Sim)

Guy seems to be able to handle my V characters but always loses to Rog :D what's Rog's greatest weakness in general..?

also, on this V-Dan VC..

[VC1] JP.koryuuken > RK > RK.dankuukyaku > {SK.dankuukyaku} to corner > {hadoken (miss) > FP} til meter gone > cc

- is this Dan's most reliable VC? coz the first short dankuukyaku seems too difficult to hit with consistently because the roundhouse one hits rather ambiguously half the time. does a more consistent alternative exist? maybe a salvage? or does the RK dankuukyaku have to be timed in a very specific manner?

anyone with Dan tactics? here's what i have so far

- abuse range on FK
- counterhit c.JP > FP, or c.JP > c.RK
- FP to GC
- c.SP as late antiair or c.FP as early anti-air
- turbo (tiger kneed) dankuukyaku for quick attack or retreat
- crouch cancel like mad
- don't get pushblock happy

Qs
- counter hit c.JP > c.FK > gadouken doesn't hit very consistently for me (from JP to c.FK). should i practice or isn't it worth it? should i stick to standing fierce after the low jab?

[bushin187]

Originally posted by glass
okay. does Z-Guy lose to X-Balrog for free or what?

i need tips on the following matches:
- using Z-Guy, vs X-Rog (killing Rog)
- using Z-Guy, vs Z-Sim (kilingl Sim)

Guy seems to be able to handle my V characters but always loses to Rog :D what's Rog's greatest weakness in general..?



rush them both down !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i don't know anything about balrog ( boxer right ?? )
but sim''s game is keep away. Guy has the moves to get in close

qcf+punch,punch
qcb+punch,punch (moves through some of sim's limbs)

if your close use your c.MP ,c.FP xx special move to rush down and keep him in the corner. ( might be easier said then done ):p

[glass]

Originally posted by bushin187


rush them both down !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
i don't know anything about balrog ( boxer right ?? )
but sim''s game is keep away. Guy has the moves to get in close

qcf+punch,punch
qcb+punch,punch (moves through some of sim's limbs)

if your close use your c.MP ,c.FP xx special move to rush down and keep him in the corner. ( might be easier said then done ):p

definitely..
problem is when Guy gets rushed down - Sim's short slide is not easy to deal with. as far as i've seen nothing short of a hurricane kick or super will stop it, and if Guy guesses wrong and does either he eats a short slide into L3. Guy seems to have a lot of trouble since his game is quite ground based, running in and out and such. his leap is okay but Sim's almighty jab of righteousness stops it _cold_, on reaction. i'm sure i had more but that's all that comes to mind at the moment..

the prob with Rog is similar. i dunno, maybe the Guys in my part of town jus keep to the ground too much. maybe getting around Rog should be easy. but lotsa damage, lotsa priority and lotsa range on that (unduckable) FP and dash straight seem to give Guy some trouble..

[shadowcharlie]

im interested in the v nash shit as well......

[MIXXIAN 11]

Man, I still can't find any info on the Aplha 3 top tiers.:(

[ballpoint]

Originally posted by MIXXIAN 11
Man, I still can't find any info on the Aplha 3 top tiers.:(

the latest tiering posted on the old decreipt 70+ page A3 thread is on the first page of this thread.

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by shinpug
Anyways I picked Gouki with Aism and thought yeah I can do this just remember all the shit you learned, and this fool takes a vism Gouki and does an airflip juggle and whoops the shit out of me, judging from the posts, you all know about the vism Gouki, and My post is kinda long. In short, I am wondering if anyone can clue me in on 1, how to do this vism tecnique and 2 is there a feesable way to defend against it with aism Gouki?



If you're looking for that "something" with Z-Akuma that will let you win against V-Akuma, then, sadly, there isn't any. On paper, V-Akuma is simply the better character. Anything that Z-Akuma can do, V-Akuma can, and more.

Your best defense against V-Akuma (or anyone else for that matter) would be to avoid the situations in which you were hit by the VC. How did you opponent land his VC?

- Did you jump in, then got caught by a DP?
- Did you leave yourself open (such as right after a mistimed fireball) which let him jump in and pull off the VC?

I ask these questions because, in my experience, these are the situations which are the most likely to have happened that led you to being hit by a VC (there are others, which I'll talk about later). And they're things that can only be solved by getting better. It doesn't matter whether your opponent is using V-Akuma or not: you made a mistake and was punished for it (of course, V-ism can deal more punishment :)). Short of becoming a better player, you may choose to play more defensively in order to give your opponent less opportunities to take advantage of, but there are problems to this (see below).

When being juggled midscreen always try to escape. Not everyone can do long combos perfectly, and there will be times when you will be given the opporunity to air-recover. Simply tapping PP right after being hit is enough input to air recover if you can -- the response may not be immediate (i.e. you won't recover the moment you input the command). Mashing won't help. No amount of button pressing will save you from a juggle that's perfectly executed, and mashing only decreases your chances of inputting the correct command if you do escape.

If you do air recover you have several options. The first (and easiest) is to simply air block on the way down. This is fine midscreen -- if your opponent messed up chances are he'll be to far away to go after you. Simply air blocking if your back is already in the corner will be disastrous -- the damage scaling will be reset, and if your opponent is within range you will take a lot of damage. Your seond option would be to air-fireball. Again, this is fine midscreen, but not if your back is to the wall. You can also try to go for a super combo air fireball. This is a safe bet, midscreen or otherwise. Akuma's super combo air fireball pushes him upward, and may ruin your opponent's timing even if your are in a position to be hit again. Another option would be to do a "forward" air recovery then immediately do a air hurricane kick. This has the weird effect of making Akuma _immediately_ land in front of your opponent. Done right, your opponent would be in big trouble, because now you'll be in a position to punish _him_. Another option would be to a a "forward" air recovery then attack on the way down. I prefer the air hurricane on the way down because it tends to catch a lot of players off-guard.

If you're unable to air-recover while being juggled midscreen and end up being juggled in a corner, it's probably best _not_ to try to air-recover. AFAIK, Akuma has no infinite, and his juggle will end eventually. Attempting to air-recover while being juggled in a corner only places you in a position to receive _more_ damage.

Here's another situation that can come from fighting V-Akuma: You block a jumping attack, then while you're in blockstun your opponent activates VC, does a weak attack, a fireball, then while you're blocking the fireball he does a demon flip, grabs you then proceeds to juggle you around. Congratualations, you've been hit by Akuma's unblockable VC. In theory, you can avoid the unblockable by simply crouching right after blocking the fireball (the demon flip grab can only be done on standing characters). In practice, it isn't so simple. Street Fighter players instinctively block an attack from the air by standing up. Not only that, if your opponent decided to do a demon flip punch instead of grab, you _will_ be hit if you were crouch-blocking (and if you're hit by that move, you _will_ be juggled). So what should you do? Stand-block (and risk being grabbed) or crouch-block (and risk being hit by the punch)? My suggestion is to stand block. The risk of being grabbed is lower than the risk of being hit by the punch -- if your opponent made a mistake in positioning he'll end up doing the punch instead of grab.

Once you block the punch, your opponent will likely try to salvage the situation by converting the combo into a midscreen guard crusher:

The midscreen guard crush VC is basically the rolling demon punch -> ground attack (such as crouching FK or standing FP) -> fireball (then repeat the sequence). Unless your guard meter is dangerously low, I suggest to simply block the damn thing. Or you can try to jump backward right after the standing FP (but not the crouching FK) then do super combo air fireball. The reason you can jump back is that there is a considerable lag if your opponent is using the standing FP to do the midscreen crusher. The lag is enough to let you jump, sweep, or super (but I don't suggest sweeping or using Akuma's dragon punch super, since both tend to trade hits).

Akuma's corner guard crusher (which is hopkick -> fireball [repeat]) can be dealt in several ways. The first is to wait the damn thing out. Waiting it out has several good points: 1) If your opponent makes a mistake with the fireball, he'll do a roll instead -- it's time to punish him. 2) sometimes the guard crusher isn't quite enough to crush you at all -- at the end of the combo you can punish your opponent if his last move was a fireball. Waiting has the obvious disadvantage of, well, guard crushing you. The second option with dealing with the corner crusher is to try to jump out of the way. Not every player can perform the crusher consistently (i.e. you can't jump) or convert the crusher into a damage combo consistently, especially not if you were hit in the air and one of his attacks whiffed -- it simply ruins a lot V-akuma player's timings. Trying to jump out of it is a viable option if your guard is about to be crushed anyway, and being hit by a red fireball tremendously contributes to damage scaling (as opposed to being guard crushed and then combo'd).

Be careful whn trying to play footsie against V-Akuma. V-Akuma can use the axe kick, which has longer range than all of Z-Akuma's normals. In any case, don't play footsie against a fully charged V-AKuma -- he can VC through one of your pokes then hit you with a fireball into a juggle.

Ugh, this is a long post, and is strictly from personal experience, so I really don't know if they're that relevant. I tend to use tactics that assume that my opponent is about the same level as I am -- which is to say, makes ocassional disastrous mistakes (such as flubbing juggle VC, or missing the unblockable VC, or accidentally rolling during a corner crusher). If your opponent is that type that OTGs with Akuma, well, that's out of my league, and you can pretty much ignore my post.:D

[mondu_the_fat]

Originally posted by glass


problem is when Guy gets rushed down - Sim's short slide is not easy to deal with. as far as i've seen nothing short of a hurricane kick or super will stop it, and if Guy guesses wrong and does either he eats a short slide into L3. Guy seems to have a lot of trouble since his game is quite ground based, running in and out and such. his leap is okay but Sim's almighty jab of righteousness stops it _cold_, on reaction. i'm sure i had more but that's all that comes to mind at the moment..



I agree, but, then again...

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=174&perpage=15&highlight=dhalsim&pagenumber=20

[ballpoint]

i've always been very bad at putting my game down on paper and examining it, so this post helped me out anyway. some notes of course;

- i think Akuma has several unblockables, the one with the grab ender after the flip being only one. the other involves hitting with a low attack while the P ender's shadow simultaneously connects, which BAS seemed to enjoy using at B5 (resetting with teleports naturally).

FP.red hadoken > demon flip (P or K ender) > c.SK > hadoken (whiff) > c.FP > KKK teleport backwards > repeat

i don't remember if it's a corner only setup, but am almost sure it isn't.

- iirc, the V-ism shadow continues to act even during super freeze; it doesn't pause along with the rest of the game. i'd assume that if V-Akuma was juggling me and i was allowed to flip, it was a setup for a reset that involves the shadow hitting. by doing the air super during the flip, you mess up the shadow's timing as well as getting some invincibility, a chance at hitting your opponent and that upward thrust the super ends with. whether this is a good strategy overall tho i can't say; i personally haven't played enough V-Akumas..



that stuff about Daigo slaughtering american Sims totally escaped me. does anyone have footage of this? anyone have any idea how he did it?

[Temujin]

Originally posted by Nibor


Oh sounds good I might actually go to this now. And temujin i heard you were coming to CTF the day before? We will get in some good matches then.

Actually I probably won't.. If I find a place to stay in VA we'll get there friday night.

Don't worry we'll play alot on saturday before/after the tourney. You know how long cvs2 takes to finish..

[bushin187]

Originally posted by glass


definitely..
problem is when Guy gets rushed down - Sim's short slide is not easy to deal with. as far as i've seen nothing short of a hurricane kick or super will stop it, and if Guy guesses wrong and does either he eats a short slide into L3. Guy seems to have a lot of trouble since his game is quite ground based, running in and out and such. his leap is okay but Sim's almighty jab of righteousness stops it _cold_, on reaction. i'm sure i had more but that's all that comes to mind at the moment..

the prob with Rog is similar. i dunno, maybe the Guys in my part of town jus keep to the ground too much. maybe getting around Rog should be easy. but lotsa damage, lotsa priority and lotsa range on that (unduckable) FP and dash straight seem to give Guy some trouble..

you really should watch the vid and see daigo play a-guy it will clear alot up. Sim's short slide :rolleyes: everytime i used repeated short slides against shoto's they just block it and sweep. I never could keep on doing it which is logical because it such a dumb tactic. Remember almost everything can be countered you'll find a way to beat it eventually.

Ps. If you want to see the vid download direct connect and connect to ((goforbroke.dynip.com)). you can download it from me or Dr funkenstein. There's alot of a3 footage on there. The file name is A3 nationals 12

[PsychoSquall]

While playing SFA3 for the DC, the computer controllered character (Guy) does his chain combo: standing jab, strong, fierce... but sometimes it does two fierce punches in a row, like jab, strong, fierce, fierce. It connects as a combo. Is this a bug, or is it actually possible? I can't do it. The two fierce punches are the same punch moves, too.

[Apoc]

Originally posted by PsychoSquall
While playing SFA3 for the DC, the computer controllered character (Guy) does his chain combo: standing jab, strong, fierce... but sometimes it does two fierce punches in a row, like jab, strong, fierce, fierce. It connects as a combo. Is this a bug, or is it actually possible? I can't do it. The two fierce punches are the same punch moves, too.

That's a cpu only chain.

Apoc.

[el_diablo]

for those interested, nash's thingy is on the char vc thread.

[ballpoint]

Originally posted by bushin187


you really should watch the vid and see daigo play a-guy it will clear alot up. Sim's short slide :rolleyes: everytime i used repeated short slides against shoto's they just block it and sweep. I never could keep on doing it which is logical because it such a dumb tactic. Remember almost everything can be countered you'll find a way to beat it eventually.



hehehe...
well if anyone of the 5 billion shotos (as well as the sodoms zangiefs and roses) i've played thought about sweeping me, they sure haven't done it. i don't think you're timing your slides tightly enough ///

thanks for the footage links :)

[MIXXIAN 11]

WHAT FOOTAGE LINX?!!! I WANT FOOTAGE LINKS PLEEZ!!!!
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD PLEEZ IVE ME THE LINX!!!:eek:

[Nibor]

Here it is... my V-Cody notes/guide/videos etc..
I didn't have time to record all the movies into .avi so in order to watch them you'll have to use kawaks. I was working on the NEC dvd trailer all weekend so i didn't have time. How to watch the movies using kawaks is explained at the end of the file, which is in microsoft word format. Enjoy.

There seems to be a problem with the file size of the zip even though its only about half of the maximum allowed, for now i'm only going to post the document.

EDIT: Ok the movie files are here:

http://www.geocities.com/niborcf/

I'll send them to people directly of AIM if the site doesn't work so just message me on AIM at NiborNY if you want me to send them to you. Or on irc just PM me (Nibor).

[glass]

holy shit..

about putting stuff in kawaks and not in an avi file..? i think this does just as nicely if not better. i've yet to read the FAQ but it looks impressive so far (but not being a Cody player myself, take it with a grain of salt).

i've only seen a few vids but i've already learned something. i didn't think crouch cancelling could be done like that (actually crouching).

edit:
ah...
hm actually renaming everything one by one does get a bit tedious. but i think it still works, since it allows a large volume of material to be viewed very very precisely. still tedious tho. can't be helped i guess..

[js2756]

2) sometimes the guard crusher isn't quite enough to crush you at all

Akuma's corner guard crush combo (in my experience) can guard crush anybody if Akuma has 100% meter and he doesn't fuck up. The only character who I can possibly think of that will not get crushed is X-Gief (how often are you going to see that). You're right though that if you take the hit, it will sometimes mess up the timing of the combo. There are still a lot of things to consider when you are getting nailed by it. When do you choose to take the hit? If you do it early, that still leaves a