Beware: Moves that will counter Rose

[IceWilly]

I'd like to make this into a solid discussion of moves that will punish many common Rose strategies. Moves that have hyper armor and blow through hits/fireballs etc. Ultras or supers that can be activated right after yours from close range and win, etc

My findings thus far....
- Abel's ultra will go through yours (and everything else) and hit. has just over 1/2 screen travel.
- Balrog's TAP and EX punches go through/around fireballs.
additionally balrog's super and ultra will go through shamwow if you would have hit him. If he is outside the range and does his ultra/super he will be caught.
- Honda needs to be within half a screen to ultra past an LP soulspark and hit before block comes. Almost impossible to do on reaction, even when expecting it.
- gouken is a menace. His EX rush can reach from 3/4 of the screen or more, goes through fireballs and ultras and can hit you with his ultra also. cr.hp beats out all his flip shennanigans if timed right. I don't plan to ever soul spark against him with any amount of meters.
- Bison's headstomp is easily blocked/avoided if he hurdles an lp soulspark, even if done right away. Don't do anything but long range sparks because he will special/ultra through them all.
- Don't mess around with Ryu's ultra or even worse his super. his super was canceling out my ultras every time. His whirlwind kick has a really hard time hitting lvl 2+ focus attacks.
- Sagat's ultra can beat out Rose's if timed right, or close.
- Back dash owns Zangief pretty hard. I had the dummy spamming backdash in the corner and I was trying to grab. its a low chance. If you are getting tick thrown in the corner i'd spam the hell out of backdash or vertical jump. Standing HK loses 100% to lariat. St.HP beats it at the right distance, as does Forward HK as has been mentioned.
- Fuerte's Ultra hops shamwow and lands. EX run has armor and can blow through fireballs. (probably ex fireballs too)

From what I've seen only Abel, Gouken and Sagat scare me in terms of punishing lp soul sparks or ill timed ultras. This is not to say anyone can't punish them on block... I just had been hit with a counter ultra to mine a few times and wanted to know what would blow past moves I already had out in air.
I will be going through it more later, but a few quick ones.



I realize this is all very situational, and in most cases you wouldn't ever throw your ultra out unless you were sure it would connect. But if you are like me and getting a little itchy on the trigger finger, these are the times you want to make SURE you do not.

[xero15]

of course certain tactics are dependent on character match ups but you can actually throw a fireball at balrog from far and still have time to punish with a trip or any other poke before he gets to you. dont do it when youre mid screen of course. im not sure about his ex punches though i would say you could do lp into lk drill but thats a fast cancel i assume. fuerte you can grab out of his dash. same with zangief you can throw the fireball then follow up with something from afar anyways.

[Gonzales]

el fuerte's ultra goes over Roses Ultra if done before or after, its because he hops over the hitbox rigth at your head, its a fairly annoying ultra

[Zakuta]

I haven't lost to Abel's Ultra yet.

Also, you're missing the most obvious counter, being a simple dragon punch.

[Windsagio]

abels ultra vs roses seems to be a case of 'he who goes first, loses'

[Gonzales]

kens f.foward is a very annoying move, it doest counter her moves but if you block he seems to have a lot of advantege enougth so if you try to counter poke, he's beat out your pokes with cr.foward the best thing seems to be not block he F.foward by spacing yourself correctly.

[Shinkuu Tatsumaki]

abels ultra vs roses seems to be a case of 'he who goes first, loses'

That's the case with all ultras pretty much.

[Makyz]

versus abel i either have to jump straight up on wake up or ex drill. Although I see Abel get owned by jump ups often his down fierce is really unreliable

[Windsagio]

kens f.foward is a very annoying move, it doest counter her moves but if you block he seems to have a lot of advantege enougth so if you try to counter poke, he's beat out your pokes with cr.foward the best thing seems to be not block he F.foward by spacing yourself correctly.

Totally loathe that move, ken players (at least at my level) that tend to use it, tend to totally spam it, making it reasonably good FA fodder. Does it beat her slide?


That's the case with all ultras pretty much.

True enough >>

[HirumaNC]

That's the case with all ultras pretty much.

Agree.

Exception: Shamwow beats Ryu's ultra even they do the ultra after shamwow =D

[Tuigi]

If you miss your Ultra akuma can actually Ragin Demon UV. you... I waas not expectign that to hit me.

[D1_]

Blanka's slide goes under her drill, soul spark, ex soul spark, and super. If Blanka is a full screen away you can throw out at least one s. spark to bait the slide. If he's half a screen away...trust me dont throw out any random s. sparks. Thats just asking to get KD'ed (knockeddown).

Blanka's balls also bug me to hell, especially the EX ones since they go through her s. sparks. I know a well timed cr. HP can beat it out but the timing is pretty tricky. Also is there a way to counter a diagonally aimed upward Blanka ball? I think maybe j.HK but I wasn't too consistent with that.

Usually to counter slide spamming Blankas I try to bait the slide if they're 3/4 screen away with a soul spark and then I throw out an Ultra while they're still in the middle of the animation.

Btw small tidbit, Rose can Soul Throw Blanka outta his dashes XD (since he hops forward each time.)

[Gonzales]

Does it beat her slide?


yes it does, thats probally the only normal he has that can compete with Rose's normals, a well spaced cr.foward and standing RH beat it thouth

[A Nun]

Having issues with poke-y Chun Lis, she seems to have greater poke range with her low kick and i can never seem to get a move in edgewise. Any advice on getting the edge? EX Soul Drill worked once, but I need a strat that doesn't rely on the super meter (mainly for gaining early game edge)

And pardon my ultra-scrubbiness but Is there like a glossary for all these cr.fk and abbreviations I see everywhere? I swear it's like trying to decipher hieroglyphics sometimes.

[Tahldon]

What I've recently discovered is: Rose's LP timed right, beats out Blanka Balls (EX and regular alike) and Honda headbutts (but headbutts are harder to time, you have to swing almost the same time he starts, especially on his EX version). It has to be timed right though or they'll hit everytime.

A well timed Cr.FP will beat out a Rainbow Blanka Ball, too.

What I'm having problems with are Jumping Shotos, Screen Leaping Vegas, and freaking Guile. Guile pressures so hard. Sonic boom repeatedly, then low kick, and this annoying overhead punch, then throw. If I try to go Offensive on him, he freaking flashkicks me to death, even when I'm not jumping

What do I do for those?

[wufftype]

For Guile it's kinjda hard to predeict it, but if you reflect the sonic boom then they tend to freak out enabling you to get in and start your own poking and pressuring.

[Tahldon]

Reflecting Guile's sonicbooms are just the tip of the problems I get from playing against him. The problem is his recovery after he throws a fireball. For one, the projectile itself is fast and it seems like every Guile player just pops them out at a thought, regular and EX alike. At varying speeds, it's nearly insane to try to deflect, jump over, and/or slide under them.

But I say again, that's just his -projectiles-. Nevermind the fact that he's chasing the fireball, himself, to come hit you. Blocking/Deflecting/Sliding under the sonicboom is nothing but a diversion for him to come up and do his retarded Cr.FK or Cr.Mk mixed in with that dumb overhead punch he has. The combo that does me in the most is: Sonicboom, Cr.Mk, Cr.Mk, Overhead punch, throw, repeat.

The pressure's so hard when he's doing all that, I can hardly know what to do with myself. My poor Rose just gets murdered and then I get enraged cause it seems so -cheap-.

I've tried everything from overwhelming offense to getting into a projectile/deflect battle with Guiles and nothing seems to work. I may win like 40 out of 100 fights with that guy and it gets tougher every time. I'm really starting to think Guile is a terrible matchup for her. Everyone else I can handle, but Guile... he makes me want to rip my hair out and I shave my head! :arazz:

[MagnetoManiac]

Hey guys, I know this is contradicting the thread but umm...I found something pretty cool.

I focus'd point blank against Blanka right? So he woke up with ultra...

I thought I was going to get hit, but I was mashing back dash during the startup (still in place and supposed to get hit)...and it appears the invincibility frames saved me from the first hit.

I then proceeded to ultra him and it grabbed him! It was pretty awesome, and yeah, felt like a good "fuck you" to the Blanka player, cuz I hate that mofo.

[miki]

Hello,

It seems that Zangief's EX green hand can beat ShamWow too :shake:

[Rable]

I Doesn't have problems against Guile.
When he's doing the double crouch roundhouse kick, Utra or EX spiral him on reaction. It's not hard at all. You can also focus attack if you have neither of EX or ultra.

For sonic boom, wait to see which speed it is before reflecting because lp sonic boom is so slow. If he follows it, reflect (works great for me), if he charge for another one, absorb.

As a Guile player, I can say you he suffer a lot against cross ups, so go for cross ups everytime you can !
It's evident, but don't forget to punish blocked somersaults as strong as you can.

[Kersey]

Another note about Blanka's ultra, I was practically being hit by it when I activated ultra and I still won.

[Acku]

Blanka should never do ultra or super when rose has one. Neither should he do roll moves. Rose vs Blanka is a whole different game once Rose has ultra.

[pennylane]

Blanka should never do ultra or super when rose has one. Neither should he do roll moves. Rose vs Blanka is a whole different game once Rose has ultra.

Can you shamWOW blanka after a blocked ball or do you have to hit him on reaction to seeing the ball first?

[DiBiddilyBop]

Can you shamWOW blanka after a blocked ball or do you have to hit him on reaction to seeing the ball first?

You can ultra a blocked ball.

[Gerk]

You can ultra a blocked ball.

What about if it's EX'd?

Not sure why but I absolutely choke when I'm doing her ultra facing right.

[Saqs]

You can Ultra ANY blocked ball.

[IceWilly]

What about if it's EX'd?

Not sure why but I absolutely choke when I'm doing her ultra facing right.

I've made it a habit of mine to always go to Towards/Up when I am executing the ultra on the second qcf. I do a little BS qcf in the corner, then go all the way to the top corner and hit the PPP. It has good results for me.

I play on a square gate with a much larger than average space between my buttons and joystick. I think this pulls my hands out on a larger angle and what I think is horizontal is actually still in the bottom corner. I got a lot of EX soul throws before I played around with the execution. Haven't had a problem with accidentally jumping unless I am just playing stupid

[thor777]

I've made it a habit of mine to always go to Towards/Up when I am executing the ultra on the second qcf. I do a little BS qcf in the corner, then go all the way to the top corner and hit the PPP. It has good results for me.

I play on a square gate with a much larger than average space between my buttons and joystick. I think this pulls my hands out on a larger angle and what I think is horizontal is actually still in the bottom corner. I got a lot of EX soul throws before I played around with the execution. Haven't had a problem with accidentally jumping unless I am just playing stupid

why not just use the shortcut f, df, f, df + ppp? it's so much faster

[Gerk]

I play on a square gate with a much larger than average space between my buttons and joystick. I think this pulls my hands out on a larger angle and what I think is horizontal is actually still in the bottom corner. I got a lot of EX soul throws before I played around with the execution. Haven't had a problem with accidentally jumping unless I am just playing stupid

This is actually what I was guessing was the problem for me, too (EX2 user here.)

Excellent.

And I'm gonna try the ultra vs. cannonball now. I dunno about higher up, but ~3500 Blankas seem to love doing 2-4 EX'd blanka balls in a row.

[zarrec]

You can ultra a blocked ball.

The only time I've been able to Ultra a blocked horizontal ball is when Blanka is in the corner and I'm kind of near him when he does the ball. In any other situation, the Ultra misses.

Someone mentioned you need to do the Ultra fast enough to get a "Reversal". I spent about 20 minutes in training mode trying this and the Ultra still missed even when I get a "Reversal".

Can we confirm if using the Ultra to punish a blocked ball is possible outside of a corner situation?

[Acku]

It's always possible, I never miss. You just need to start your motion when in stun phase, and press PPP just after.

[Rable]

Don't you also need to be blocking standing in order to punish blanka ball with ultra?

[IceWilly]

why not just use the shortcut f, df, f, df + ppp? it's so much faster

I'll have to try that, but usually I am doing it from crouch so I going up to forward means I am already halfway there. I don't assume df, f, df would work right? it seems that this yields me a DP motion, thus EX soul throw burning my meter.

Will try tho

[zarrec]

Don't you also need to be blocking standing in order to punish blanka ball with ultra?

OMG! Thank you! When I standing block the ball I can hit the Ultra every time.

This is quite odd though. Does this mean than standing block has a faster recovery or does it simply not get pushed back as much by the blocked ball?

[IceWilly]

I asked about that in another thread and didn't get a solid answer... but it sure seems like standing recovery is better against most things, if not all.

[catbond]

I beat Rose's Ultra with Lariat once with Gief, got beat the next time. Timing was different but I honestly can't remember what the difference was.