EVO MvC2 Exhibtion, Masters Challenge Team Tournament

[inkblot]

Hi guys,

Rather than simply doing another 5on5, here's an idea we've been kicking around as an MvC2 Exhibition.

4 Team, single elimination TEAM TOURNAMENT. Each team has 3 members, standard team tournament rules. Here's what we're thinking for the teams:

1) Team EC (Team Empire instead?)
2) Team CA
3) Team Seattle
4) Wildcard! (single elim tournament determines this team)

Here's the catch. This is a Master's Challenge, so no bandwagoning allowed. That means each team can use only *1 max* of each character. So at most 1 magneto, 1 sentinel, etc on the whole team! The team that has mastered a complete roster of characters will win.


Edit: Another idea we just had is to have the teams DRAFT their characters, like in the NBA lottery. So now there's just 1 Magneto, and you have to draft him! This would provide a lot more variety, and would force the teams to use some creativity when building their teams.

[Gandido]

I don't think the draft idea would turn out really well, but hey, to each his own. I personally like the first idea, and I see it better that way. But hey what do I know. :)

[box]

Teams of 3 with 1 max of each character would mean 9 characters and it's really easy to get 9 characters in MvC2.

Magneto, Storm, SEntinel, Cable, Captain Commando, Psylocke, Ironman, Cyclops, Doom. Maybe BH, Strider, Spiral.

I like the idea of an NBA draft. If we're doing 4 teams of 3, this would lead to a total of 36 characters. Now it's gonna have a ton of character variety. I'd definitely vote for this route. In addition to the 12 above, there's gonna be an additional 24 characters.



Also, I'd like to suggest team Japan be included instead of the Wildcard. They are very good with a lot of characters and would provide a very good exhibition.

[Ponder]

Originally posted by box

I like the idea of an NBA draft. If we're doing 4 teams of 3, this would lead to a total of 36 characters. Now it's gonna have a ton of character variety. I'd definitely vote for this route. In addition to the 12 above, there's gonna be an additional 24 characters.

We're still tinkering with the rules. Tentatively, before each match, teams would alternate drafting a character. After both teams had 9 characters, they would create their teams and fight it out.

[Snowman]

if this turns out really well, its gotta make the 2004 DVD.
It looks like its something different (which could be a good thing), but talk about overkill on MvC2 (I feel for the MvC2 haters even though I play it myself.)

[KaiSingrz]

Wow, this idea is pretty tight. So far, I think the most solid choices for stuff like this would be to have one MSP, a team scrub variation (they may have to sub commando out if the third man needs a good assist), and one odd man out who uses a unique squad. Guys like Julius or Zaza could step up for stuff like this.

Edit:
Ink or Ponder, any idea how the members of each team will be selected now?

[Ponder]

Originally posted by KaiSingrz
Wow, this idea is pretty tight. So far, I think the most solid choices for stuff like this would be to have one MSP, a team scrub variation (they may have to sub commando out if the third man needs a good assist), and one odd man out who uses a unique squad. Guys like Julius or Zaza could step up for stuff like this.


The beauty of the draft process is that you can block those teams. If the other team already has Magento and Storm and it's your turn, you can steal Psylocke away from them. :D

Edit:
Ink or Ponder, any idea how the members of each team will be selected now?

It will almost certainly be 3on3.

[box]

Originally posted by Ponder


We're still tinkering with the rules. Tentatively, before each match, teams would alternate drafting a character. After both teams had 9 characters, they would create their teams and fight it out.

Sounds good so far. Any chance of using teams of 4? That would lead to a total of 24 different characters rather than 18, and a more fair selection process.

If there was a team of 4 members: selection would go

Team A selects 1
Team B selects 2,3
Team A selects 4,5
Team B selects 6,7
Team A 8,9
Team B 10,11
Team A 12,13
TEam B 14,15
Team A, 16,17
TEam b 18,19
Team A 20, 21
Team B 22, 23
Team A 24

If it was teams of 3 members, Team B would be stuck with the last pick while Team A still got the first pick.

Team A selects 1
Team B selects 2,3
Team A selects 4,5
Team B selects 6,7
Team A 8,9
Team B 10,11
Team A 12,13
TEam B 14,15
Team A, 16,17
TEam b 18

Team A point sum in 4 member team: 150
Team B point sum in 4 member team: 150

Team A point sum in 3 member team: 85
Team B point sum in 3 member team: 86

Just a little something to take note of.

Also, if you want to add another twist: Recommended assists only. :D

[Ponder]

Originally posted by box

Sounds good so far. Any chance of using teams of 4? That would lead to a total of 24 different characters rather than 18, and a more fair selection process.

Unlikely. What you'd find is that the 1st player on each team would get all the garbage charaters and the match score would start 1-1 (with the 6 garbage characters being eliminated 1st).

Yes, more diversity, but completely uninteresting.

[box]

Originally posted by Ponder


Unlikely. What you'd find is that the 1st player on each team would get all the garbage charaters and the match score would start 1-1 (with the 6 garbage characters being eliminated 1st).

Yes, more diversity, but completely uninteresting.

Yeah I see what you mean. One way to to counter this would be to have an overall draft pick rather than individual drafts between the two teams that are going to match up. If there's going to be 4 teams, the big 4 (mag/cable/sent/storm) will most likely be split between the 4 teams, and each team will have to rely on their garbage characters to win the matchups. This should be interesting as people will pick characters just to mess up their opponents teams. the sentinel team will pick psylocke to screw up MAgneto, and the Mag player will pick Commando... etc.

I guess what it boils down to is whether people want to see character diversity, or high-level play. I'd vote for character diversity in the exhibition because we're already gonna see high-level play in the finals.

[Blaziniflo]

Can we still do a 5on5 WC vs EC? This idea seems cool and would be a lot of fun, but it's not anything serious or anything the winner should brag about.

[-=Infinite=-]

hmm i dunno, it seems weird and i dont think ud get the best from each place. or im just not gettin it. is this example right??

--------------------------------
this is an example**

teamec:
justin(mad/cable/sent)
sanford(sent*/storm/commando)
Josh Wigfall(mag*/storm*/psy)

team seattle:
row(mag/cable/sent)
kuan(storm/sent*/commando)
Jmar(mag*/storm*/sent*)

----------------------------

ok so those r basic teams each would pick, so by these rules anyone with a star has to change there teams and connot use what another has already picked. so that would mean josh wigfall cant really use a team he would and jmar cant pick his team at all, which makes them unfit for the team. so the teams would have to go pick another person for the team that doesnt use anyone that is already picked. right?

so wouldnt that make each team not as fit or as great as it could be since they have to pick around there teams that they would choose normally??

[mjm]

100% agree with infinite, please don't limit char selection, even if people are sick of seeing 2 msp's on the same team, nobody would complain if choi and valle both picked st ryu, and that game is how old?

[Ponder]

Originally posted by -=Infinite=-
hmm i dunno, it seems weird and i dont think ud get the best from each place. or im just not gettin it. is this example right??

--------------------------------
this is an example**

teamec:
justin(mad/cable/sent)
sanford(sent*/storm/commando)
Josh Wigfall(mag*/storm*/psy)

team seattle:
row(mag/cable/sent)
kuan(storm/sent*/commando)
Jmar(mag*/storm*/sent*)

----------------------------

ok so those r basic teams each would pick, so by these rules anyone with a star has to change there teams and connot use what another has already picked. so that would mean josh wigfall cant really use a team he would and jmar cant pick his team at all, which makes them unfit for the team. so the teams would have to go pick another person for the team that doesnt use anyone that is already picked. right?

so wouldnt that make each team not as fit or as great as it could be since they have to pick around there teams that they would choose normally??

Interesting post. You mentioned Justin would probably want to play mag/cable/sent. Note that in this format, you probably can't even get all 3 of those character (for example, if Team EC doesn't get to pick first, the other team will probably have Magneto!).

So yes, in this format people who specialize with a particular team are at a disadvantage. Similiarly, you don't want to fill your team with people who play the same character, as you only have 1 (or 0!) of that character to use.

The teams that do well will be the ones who have players who use a variety of different characters (like Viscant) or who play wacky teams well (like MikeZ's Doom/Tron/Jugg team).

So why do this instead of the 5on5?
1) Last year the 5on5 didn't seem to prove anything. Many EC posters still claim they have the best Marvel players, even though TeamEC got summarily beaten down. Many posters don't give Soo credit for beating Justin because nothing was *really* at stake, etc.

2) This gives more people an opportunity to particpate than just the 10 people SRK.com picks (via the Wildcard slot).

3) It sounds like it could be a lot of fun.

[FMJaguar]

It would be better if the draft was done between all 4 teams. It's already used for sports so i think the idea works.

To make it fair you might want to reverse the order between rounds, so it goes ABCD-DCBA, repeat. It sounds like it would be more of a team game than a bunch of 1-1 matches this time.

[mjm]

Why keep the 5 on 5 instead of this?

This format is a joke to the hardcore players, limiting character usage between the best players in the world is just a bad idea. This sounds like a gimmick to promote character variety.

Last years 5 on 5 proved that wc was better THEN, why only give ec one shot? I think it's safe to say that wc slacked off(judging from the recent closing of arcades and from watching wc videos) and ec picked up the ball. The 5 on 5 was huge, people loved that shit, why not give them more? Especially considering the end result is likely to be either closer or the opposite. It's about competition, not gimmicky fun for the crowd.

I agree that the event would be entertaining, but ask yourself, will the crowd reaction be anything like last year when soo beasted?

People are looking forward to re-matches. thats why we travel out to the wc. Not to fight low/mid tier.

Another idea is to expand the 5 on 5 to include the other regions and expand on the team vs team concept.

[-=Infinite=-]

well imo, the people that posted they liked it are people that either dont play the game,play low tiers, not up there lv, this seems more for entertainment for those type of players than more of a whos better from seattle,ec,cali,wildcard. that being for the fact that players cant play with what they are used to(handicap) and u wont get the best from each region.

more a fun thing to waiste time than something thats like "man i gotta buy the dvd to see soo beast on justin in the team tourny" or other matches that were there and seeing who the best is at the time.

[Magnetro]

Well, here is what I think (shhh) if you limit it to one character, lets say team 1,does like a mediorcre combo rather than an amazing one with magneto, now team two probably has a better one...

1) If you really want to make it a competition for that you can leave the single char thing.

2) If you want to make it an over cool experience for everyone to watch you can make it no limit.

The only problem is somone doing something TOO repetitive...

[epsilon_]

Where is the CvS2 or 3S love for team tournies?

[SSJGouKi]

If i understood the idea ink gave, i think its great. for once we get to see more then 4 characters being played in this game! this is something refreshing to see in mvc2. seeing the same characters used (magnus/storm/cable/sent) over and over bores me to tears. Especially when people play the same way with the big 4. And im sure there are others that would agree with me. We need a change of pace in this game. If there are no changes made then we will see Storm runaway mashing the fierce button again, Magnus doing tri-jumps until it hits then air combo into tempest again, Cable runaway 24/7 again, Sent drone super with low beam then more drone super over and over...and when victim in corner stomp on them to death again. Its the same thing! Great idea ink.

[Bacardi]

do a reg team tourney that would be better and keep the 5 vs 5

[Magnetro]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi
Magnus doing tri-jumps until it hits then air combo into tempest
:lol:

[SSJGouKi]

you know what i mean. :rolleyes:

[Magnetro]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi
you know what i mean. :rolleyes:

:), Oh man Jadon fucking Brown better come to Evolution now, btw Glitches AREN'T ALLOWED? (to make combo longer or stuff)?

[mjm]

what you're going to see is mag/storm/sent or cable beating the crap out of lower tiers:lol:

you should have low tier tourney division:p

[MadBooFace]

since this evo is on console, you should allow a normal 5 on 5 with same character teams...

imagine genghis with sent/sent/capcom, randy lew with cable-a/cable-b/cable-y, soo with mag/mag/psy, justin with storm/storm/cyke ahahah the possibilities are endless. now that would be entertaining and a breath of fresh air for the way mvc2 is played!

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by Ponder
The teams that do well will be the ones who have players who use a variety of different characters (like Viscant) or who play wacky teams well (like MikeZ's Doom/Tron/Jugg team).

So why do this instead of the 5on5?
1) Last year the 5on5 didn't seem to prove anything. Many EC posters still claim they have the best Marvel players, even though TeamEC got summarily beaten down. Many posters don't give Soo credit for beating Justin because nothing was *really* at stake, etc.

2) This gives more people an opportunity to particpate than just the 10 people SRK.com picks (via the Wildcard slot).

3) It sounds like it could be a lot of fun. Is the reason for the 5on5 to see which coast has players that can play more characters, or which coast has more overall skills in the game? In response to your reasons for doing this instead of the 5on5:

1) Last year's 5on5 did prove a lot. Even though people posted mad shit talk with excuses, EC got beat down and accepted that WC was better at that time. Soo got hella credit, and he did indeed beat Justin's ass.

2) I'm sure that there are tons of players that are better with morrigan than sanford is, but how will you pick the teams? If you let Justin pick the EC team, there's probably an autistic kid in S.C. that would probably own with gambit, but no one's ever heard of him.

3) It probably will be a lot of fun if we were all hanging out and getting drunk, but to take 2 hours away the big screen unless there's tons of left over time and not do the 5on5 would be a shame to all the people that goes to Evo and wants to see players at their best. Not what they could be if they only had 2 characters they sort of know how to use.

I'm not even sure if many people will enter this thing. I'm not saying scratch the event totally, but just don't cancel the 5on5 for this joke tournament. I mean does anyone really want travel, whether it's 15mins or all the way across the country to see Viscant's Juggernaut vs Mike Z's Tron?

Evo's already lacking hype since it's on console. What you're doing is taking away what little hype is left for the 5on5.


Edit: Actually this is probably the worst idea since New Coke.

[eks]

What's the point in even having a qualifier for the wildcard, since they wont be able to play the team they qualify for?

If you want to have this as a side event, fine, but keep the 5 on 5 for the top players, and use this to showcase all rounders or low tier or whatever. This is a pretty bad idea to replace the 5 on 5. It will be amusing but get boring pretty fast

[Cable3858]

As an avid fan of MVC2,its top players, and tournaments in general. I'd say the 5on5 is the way to go. Nobody would give a shit which team won that tournament. But the 5on5? Thats fucking bragging rights. Thats exciting. This other tournament is not.

[SSJGouKi]

Originally posted by MadBooFace
since this evo is on console, you should allow a normal 5 on 5 with same character teams...

imagine genghis with sent/sent/capcom, randy lew with cable-a/cable-b/cable-y, soo with mag/mag/psy, justin with storm/storm/cyke ahahah the possibilities are endless. now that would be entertaining and a breath of fresh air for the way mvc2 is played!

how is this a breath of fresh air... besides psy and cyke which will probably be used only as assists... you just basically listed the Big 4!!!!! How many times did we see the Big 4 in action????? please tell me how this is a breath of fresh air?

[COMMY]

Um, i personally agree with the people that think the 5on5 should go on as it did last year.... Personally, I think I looked forward to that more than the tournament and finals matches... then again i knew the finals were Justin and Ricky :bluu: But, yea, definitely fun watching the 5on5 with everyone cheering in the background and al the matches seemed like high quality. Everyone keeps on saying like people were playing for nothing, or there was no incentive, but the bragging rights you win from it def should that each coast was trying to win it for their coast.

I think, do the 5on5 again... but two differences.
1) Seems like it's already going to happen, but like more differences in the teams. Like i think I read somewhere Sanford's not going, but it should be obvious mixup, justin, and desmond are already in, and add two more up and comin gto EC. West Coast, Soo, Row, Kuan, two more people on the rise. I think it'd be good to see how people have gotten better, and if they use different teams. It would definitely seem like this years 5on5 would be much closer than last years.

2) Don't know if the Canons can, but I don't know some jackpot prize, like $25 to each winner, free DVD, bunch of other stuff, any suggestions?

I figure if EC wins, lolz, end it all next year to see who wins best two out of three. If WC wins again, think it's pretty obvious. I definitely think EC is hungry and they def will compete more this year.

Just my 2 cents :cool:

P.S. although I personally would like to see some people from other regions, like a Seattle team, Cali team, NE team, SW team, it doesn't seem feasible as this would be a shit load of games, but if there were any way around it, I think people would like to see people from different regions :)

[samB]

Team seattle( includes NW right)

Team Cali

Team Florida

Team NY

should have a 5 on 5

[Ponder]

Originally posted by MadBooFace
since this evo is on console, you should allow a normal 5 on 5 with same character teams...


And a give everyone who comes a pony.

[Ponder]

Originally posted by Blaziniflo
1) Last year's 5on5 did prove a lot. Even though people posted mad shit talk with excuses, EC got beat down and accepted that WC was better at that time. Soo got hella credit, and he did indeed beat Justin's ass.


Are you kidding? Have you seen the Did Soo really beat Justin (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=47673) thread? Oh wait, you started that thread. Your most significant contributation to it was this post:

Originally posted by Blaziniflo
holy fuckin shit: a serious and intelligent answer. None of this thread was about whether or not justin threw the match, but rather if he was playing as the real justin wong at the time. Anyone that thinks soo flat out raped justin wong either A) really suck at the game and don't understand anything about it, or B) have never seen the actual match. Ask any top-player who understands the game, and they will tell you it was a pathetic showing; so pathetic to the point where they really think Justin let go of the stick. Now if justin played against Soo like he did against say....Rowtron, do you still think Soo would of raped Justin like he did?

I find your position then hard to reconcile with your position now that "Soo ... did indeed beat Justin's ass". I have to conclude that either:

A) You are now in fact not Blaziniflo and are actually someone who has hijacked his account (possibly with Blaziniflo's permission...)
B) You are Blaziniflo, are wildly schizophrenic, and are posting simultaneouly under different, conflicted personalities.
C) You're just making shit up.

So which is it?

[The Great Sephiroth]

Team WC wins automatically. Mike Z/Viscant/Zaza will rip shit up with random bumfuck teams. Though Wong himself could probably contend with those three...

[Amingo]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi
If there are no changes made then we will see Storm runaway mashing the fierce button again, Magnus doing tri-jumps until it hits then air combo into tempest again, Cable runaway 24/7 again, Sent drone super with low beam then more drone super over and over...and when victim in corner stomp on them to death again. Its the same thing!

if this is what you think top tier mvc2 play is about, then

a) you haven't watched a top tier match since the year 2001.
b) this is the level of competition that you keep getting beat down by in the arcade.
c) you don't even play mvc2.
d) you're a retarded low tier fanboy and nobody cares about what you have to say.

half your posts in srk are about mvc2 top tier, when it's plain you don't even know jack shit about how to play them. if you think that soo's magneto is the same as taiji's magneto which is the same as justin's magneto, you're either blind or too stupid to understand what's going on besides the flashing colors.

[MadBooFace]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi


how is this a breath of fresh air... besides psy and cyke which will probably be used only as assists... you just basically listed the Big 4!!!!! How many times did we see the Big 4 in action????? please tell me how this is a breath of fresh air?

i'm sorry you didn't catch my sarcasm, it's tough to see over the internet. the real purpose of that post was to show how dumb of an idea a draft for characters and limiting players' character selections was by presenting another really dumb idea (same character teams).

Ponder i must be missing some stanford logic there...but if the ponies are groomed and glittered like ricky then why not!

[FMJaguar]

I've been tossing around a few ideas on this since the team thing started. The main problem i have with the team event is that it's not really a team event.

The main purpose of the current team format has been a quick response to REPLACE a game that you can't have a normal tournament for, like A3 and 3s two years ago, like the SBO2 games... it's basically so you can 'say' you have a game, but not really have a tournament. If it was possible to have a singles tournament, you had singles instead.

What mattered was top (8/16/32) in singles... which told us all the results we needed to know. What we run now are not team events, they are singles exhibitions. The only 'good' is when one person pulls some upset so we can talk about it on the internet... but that happens with single game matches, again, nothing to do with the 'team' tourney. Anyone remember EC vs WC? or do we remember soo vs justin?

Just ask yourself.. if ANYTHING significant happens in singles, are you gonna care what happened in the team tourney... WC can win 25-0 but if EC gets a good portion of the top places, it won't matter. And vice versa, ec can go 25-0 but if wc takes top 3 (in reality, top 1) are you gonna see the team tournament in the headline, hellll no. Team tourney is a backup in case singles turn out the same as last year, we still might get some single game matches to talk shit about.

What's astounding is how quick people are to demean the idea. If your saying that the only way to have 'skill' is to take the top couple people and pretend it's a team, to me your saying marvel is a pretty shallow game. Either you play the few styles that get respect aroudn here, or your a low tier scrub, no in between.

The draft format will definately add another dimension. I guess if you wanted to go all out you could make the rounds a full round robin instead of elimination style, but that's just my opinion.

If your gonna say that it's a bad idea, at least look at the whole picture and draw some conclusions from that.

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by Ponder


Are you kidding? Have you seen the Did Soo really beat Justin (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=47673) thread? Oh wait, you started that thread. Your most significant contributation to it was this post:



I find your position then hard to reconcile with your position now that "Soo ... did indeed beat Justin's ass". I have to conclude that either:

A) You are now in fact not Blaziniflo and are actually someone who has hijacked his account (possibly with Blaziniflo's permission...)
B) You are Blaziniflo, are wildly schizophrenic, and are posting simultaneouly under different, conflicted personalities.
C) You're just making shit up.

So which is it? Wow, those choices all seem so good I just don't know which one to choose.

I think i'll just go with D) Are the Cannon's afraid WC will lose and are trying to let WC save face by doing this mockery of a tournament? This type of event is usually reserved for Soo when he's made to entertain his little cousin that's visiting, not at what was once the biggest national tournament of the year, but now 2nd because it's on console.

Then again, I don't think any amount of debating will actually be as effective as you pick captains for the teams, and see if they can actually find 2 other real players that will agree to particpate in this scrub circus.

If this happens, this will be the biggest scandal since the evo02 MvC2 finals.


FMJ: all that shit about evaluating and scared of something different is just bs and you know it.

The 5on5 is a competition between rivalries. I'm not saying only playing top tier is having skill, as I have seen some vicous low tier playing. But those players have never won a tournament with any real competition.

On the 5on5, the respective teams will be bringing their best, and the best are realistic in their tiers. But the best should not be forced to play (if they even participate in this catastrophe waiting to happen) with one hand tied.

[Neo_Slasher]

i got a better idea ppl! make it instead of 5on5... 7on7!!!!!!!!!:eek:

why?
1) means more players for each team(duh!:p ) which ends up in more matches (49 to be exact!!!!)
2) means more exitement!!!, croud roaring!! and total absolute MvC2 raping , comebacks , ownage and carnage!!!!
3)garanteed more destructive, bloodthirsty and gory MvC2 match vids for evo2k4 DVD(to make sure this doesn't get misinterpreted there has always been that kind of footage but nuthing like the EC vs. WC look at any evo 2002 or 2k3 MvC2 match and tell me the number of the vids that has the exact amount of shit the Beefy 5 on 5 has? almost like 85.3% of the EC vs.WC match vids has extreme shitload of drooling gameplay).
4) if the problem lies in the how are we gonna put that much footage on the DVD just take out the highlights on MvC2 or make a disc 3 containing absolutely mvc2 footage(hell lot more of highlights , ECvs.WC action and the finals of course :cool: )
and this should add more fotage to other games(3rd strike highlights? or A3?)

[Xecutioner]

Can we at least have the trailer for the team tournament on the DVD this time?




Daywalker

[Zigmover21]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi


how is this a breath of fresh air... besides psy and cyke which will probably be used only as assists... you just basically listed the Big 4!!!!! How many times did we see the Big 4 in action????? please tell me how this is a breath of fresh air?

You've contributed nothing to this discussion, so please, stfu already. Nobody cares if you just want to vent.

[margalis]

I have a good idea. We can have a single player "tournament" where players can be seeded by "region" and the "winner" will be the "best" player.
...
Anything other than the single player is an exhibition. If you are going to run an exhibition, run a fun one that provides something DIFFERENT than the real tournament.

I like the idea of a draft because the "team" aspect of team actually matters. 5 on 5 doesn't matter too much other than the few self-important people who think the world revolves around their stupid smacktalk.

If you want to face your rival...make it to the finals and play them. That's how rivalries are formed and endure anyway. Nobody really gives a damn if Josh Wigfall called Soo's mom or cow or something...that's not an exciting rivalry.
---

I agree that the EC vs. WC thing proves nothing that isn't proven better in the actual single player tournament.


Edit: As far as last year's event is concerned, does anyone even remember anything other than Soo and Justin?

[CableHViperB44]

Low tiers would turn the whole thing into a comedy instead of a drama. "Oh shit, he killed magneto wit captain america!! lol lol... "

Personally, I prefer the drama.

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by margalis
I have a good idea. We can have a single player "tournament" where players can be seeded by "region" and the "winner" will be the "best" player.
...
Anything other than the single player is an exhibition. If you are going to run an exhibition, run a fun one that provides something DIFFERENT than the real tournament.

I like the idea of a draft because the "team" aspect of team actually matters. 5 on 5 doesn't matter too much other than the few self-important people who think the world revolves around their stupid smacktalk.

If you want to face your rival...make it to the finals and play them. That's how rivalries are formed and endure anyway. Nobody really gives a damn if Josh Wigfall called Soo's mom or cow or something...that's not an exciting rivalry.
---

I agree that the EC vs. WC thing proves nothing that isn't proven better in the actual single player tournament.


Edit: As far as last year's event is concerned, does anyone even remember anything other than Soo and Justin? Hold on a minute.........THIS is actually the dumbest idea since New Coke.


The players on the 5on5 don't think the world revolves around them, with the exceptions of Kuan and X.

The members are picked based on tournament results and their performances....hence, that's why we use ECC and whatever WC qualifiers around the time of Evo to decide.

You probably like the draft aspect of the idea ponder posted up because it gives you some justification of only being able to use cable and sonson.

[SooMighty]

the thing I remember most about the 5 on 5 was when after I played Ricky I went out a door that was near the front stage to get a couple smokes in. I told nigga Kuan to listen for a knock on the door so he can open the door for me when I finish smoking. he didnt hear the knocking I guess, so I had to walk out that hall, which led to I dont know where. and had to run back to the building where EVO was at. DAYUM.

[SSJGouKi]

Originally posted by Zigmover21


You've contributed nothing to this discussion, so please, stfu already. Nobody cares if you just want to vent.

nah

[VietKhan]

is marvel gonna be on console?

[Ponder]

Originally posted by Blaziniflo

I think i'll just go with D) Are the Cannon's afraid WC will lose and are trying to let WC save face by doing this mockery of a tournament?

It's the old Cannon conspiracy theory. I understand why you'd try to change the subject now that I've nailed you for being a hypocrite, but next time could you could at least try to do it with some amount of originality? Thanks.

[Hoonyo]

Sentinel - The #1 fucking draft pick

[Jeffzorz]

hmmmm maybe you could just do a

ec vs wc mvc2
ec vs wc cvs2

5on5 mvc2
3on3 cvs2 or somthing

[KaiSingrz]

Weeeell, I'm all for the 4 team tournament idea. But I really don't like the draft pick idea. For one thing, one of the most entertaining parts of watching low tier characters is seeing them actually hang with the big 4 when both are backed with some decent assists. The draft pick idea just forces everyone to water themselves down even further than they have to. I'd stick with the idea of limiting the usage of characters within the team, and not throughout the tournament as a whole. I mean seriously, I'd find it more entertaining if I saw Clock using Omega Red/Strider/Doom and taking it to a Storm/Sent player than if I saw Omega Red/Doom taking it to Storm/Ryu or something. It's obvious that a tournament like this would cause some watering down of some characters. But I think the draft pick could potentially take it down to a point where it just can't be as entertaining as it could be.


Edit:
Ink or Ponder, one more question. Will there be certain rules to the wild card tournament when it comes to character selection? And if there are, what are they?

[Deus]

instead of wasting time with some stupid character draft boshit, why not just have a real team tourney with a team from each region i.e. team seattle, team cali, team nyc etc.

having some *new* and *innovative* way to hold a team tournament is fine and all, but shit, people have wanted regional representation for awhile. i would much rather watch seattle fight justin than see some ugly ass bh/doom/commando shit because storm and sentinel were already drafted.

[demiSe]

Originally posted by Deus
instead of wasting time with some stupid character draft boshit, why not just have a real team tourney with a team from each region i.e. team seattle, team cali, team nyc etc.

Because that would be the intelligent thing to do. This year's Evo is about consoles and stupid low-tier gimmicks. Hopefully next year's Evo will go back to being enjoyable.

[Shin-RoTeNdO]

I would rather see no assists be allowed more than the team draft idea. Either way, it'll be exciting to see what will take place this year at EVO.

[inkblot]

We post these things to get player feedback. About 2 of you are doing a great job of telling us what you want to see and why. Thanks.

As for the (ahem) others, flaming does not help us when making this decision. If you want to be taken seriously, you might try discussing the topic seriously, without the insults and quips.

[box]

I'm really starting to like the idea of an overall draft character pick between the 4 teams. Obviously the first four picks are gonna be the big 4. But after that it is totally up in the air. Do you try to counter-pick the magneto by taking away psylocke, or sentinel by taking away commando, or do you pick cyclops to go alongside your Cable. It's guaranteed that new teams are gonna be made up for all of the team members.

Again the reason I like this is because it does offer character diversity. I watch enough high-level play during the finals.

Is there any chance of giving Team 4 to Japan. They are really good with a lot of different characters and I think they have a real shot at winning this type of tourney.

[margalis]

Why not do a "real" team tournament with one team from each region? Because that's retarded. In a real team tournament you would allow lots of teams with no restictions on members...unless by "real" you meant "fake."

Nobody should be under the illusion that exhibitions and invite-only tourneys are real tourneys - they aren't.

How is a region based tourney any more exciting or better than a single player tourney? Just choose one, team or single.
---

This is not a crazy new idea. In Magic: The Gathering draft-day selection style tournaments are popular. It's a different kind of skill. Adaptation, making the best of a bad situation, etc.

Approaching this as "how do we make this into a real tournament?" is foolish. It isn't a real tournament. A limited-entry region based team tournament isn't a real tournament either.

I like it because it shows off some different skills. A magneto combo is exactly the same whether it is in a team tourney or a single player tourney...in the end each match is identical, the only difference is the surrounding.

In a draft tourney there is strategy in drafting coherent teams and matching characters to team members. It's interesting and different, which is sort of the point of exhibitions.

Edit: A large number of idiots seem to dislike the idea, which makes me think it must be good.

[KaiSingrz]

Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if the big 4 weren't the first four picked. You also have the big 4 assists: Sentinel, Cyke, Doom, and Commando. 3 of those guys area already equipped with top tier point capabilities. Sentinel is obviously the first draft pick. After that, I wouldn't be surpised if Doom or Cyke were picked early on as well.

Another reason why I like the idea of not having the draft is because of the concept of allocating what's available. Using the original idea, with three guys, you could do a team lineup that puts stock into two players while having one odd man out team for extra support. Think of it something like a Storm/Sent/AA type lineup:
Sent/Cable/Commando
MSP
IM/WM/Doom

Or you can go for a more balanced lineup that doesn't really put stock into one guy, but balances in between all 3 players a la Team Row like:

Doom/Cable/Cyke
BH/Sent/Commando
Magneto/Storm/Psy

Without using the draft pick, each region's variety is MUCH better represented. using the draft pick just turns everything into utter randomness, which doesn't necessarily lead to good things. It no longer becomes a contest of which region has players who are effective with lower characters. It becomes a contest of which region is the least shitty at using the lower characters.

[eks]

Originally posted by margalis
Why not do a "real" team tournament with one team from each region? Because that's retarded. In a real team tournament you would allow lots of teams with no restictions on members...unless by "real" you meant "fake."

Edit: A large number of idiots seem to dislike the idea, which makes me think it must be good.

hey dude
you're a faggot

do you even play marvel?

are you even going to evo?

what the fuck do you know?

shut the fuck up

[TS]

This would be a great way for people to actually learn about the game...but people don't want that...

Originally posted by KaiSingrz
Weeeell, I'm all for the 4 team tournament idea. But I really don't like the draft pick idea. For one thing, one of the most entertaining parts of watching low tier characters is seeing them actually hang with the big 4 when both are backed with some decent assists. The draft pick idea just forces everyone to water themselves down even further than they have to. I'd stick with the idea of limiting the usage of characters within the team, and not throughout the tournament as a whole. I mean seriously, I'd find it more entertaining if I saw Clock using Omega Red/Strider/Doom and taking it to a Storm/Sent player than if I saw Omega Red/Doom taking it to Storm/Ryu or something. It's obvious that a tournament like this would cause some watering down of some characters. But I think the draft pick could potentially take it down to a point where it just can't be as entertaining as it could be.



Agreed. Even though I think a good Strider would rock this sort of team tournament (Doom is an uncommon enough character to not conflict with teammates, any number of characters can go in the third spot, hard to beat, especially with limited character choices, etc.), it works better than the draft. The draft idea sounds fun also, but I think it wouldn't hold up quite as well. Making it teams of 4 but keeping the character limit rule would be interesting as well.

I'm not a big fan of the draft for 2 reasons: 1, stupid counter games (grabbing Doom so you don't have to worry about Srider, some guy ending up with a retarded team like Cable/Commando/Psylocke etc) and 2, which is sorta related to the first, people ending up with characters they don't know how to play. I honestly don't have confidence that the players will know what to do if they end up with Rogue/Sentinel/Tron, or any other teams which could actually work, or characters who are fully capable of pulling off shit like Genghis' CapCom did last year...and it will just look retarded.

[JALbert]

I think drafting individual characters will just end up silly... no teams will really have chemistry and it's end up as Justin playing w/ the top 3 picks of EC and beating everyone.

How about drafting teams?

MSP, MSS, Scrub, Scrubclops, Sent/Strider/Doom, etc.


EDIT: Much rather see a normal team tournament, in any case. This is just if y'all insist on drafting.

[Xecutioner]

I like the idea of 4 teams but I'm not feeling this draft pick idea to much. Don't get me wrong it is a fresh idea, I just don't think it will work well at EVO. Mainly because everybody would rather see a rematch between the two coast. So any other idea is pretty much irrelevant.


Having 4 teams this time, is a good idea though. You can have a EC, WC, Midwest, and I suppose a team Seattle since people always puts them by themselves. You have one team versus another and the winners will fight each other to see who is the best.


Daywalker

[ruin-]

Why limit characters? honestly if everyone on team WC is really good with sent why should they limit them selfs? nah... i dont think this is to prove who knows how to play more characters just who can win.

If not this just turns into one of those SRK scrubs dreams where you can just ban what you dont like rollcancels/strong characters.

[Deus]

Originally posted by margalis


"yeah man, fuck this marvel shit lets go play magic"

[Blaziniflo]

Ekin's the man, and his word is bond. Margilis is one of dumbest people I've ever read. Seriously, do you play Marvel? And where you from and who do you play with? Oh yea, you're gay and stfu.

Sorry Ponder, for me being a hypocrite, but if YOU'RE going to try to change the subject of me making relevant points in replying to your reasons for not having the 5on5, then you are hypocrites as well. You say your reasons for this thread is to get player feedback, and then totally ignore my points and refer to some thread I made 8 months ago.

You want constructive criticism? Here it is: Marvel is random enough as it is. The game is 4 years old. Anyone that is still playing this game is damn serious and competitive, and have given up on that whole "damn he's playing top-tier, he's so cheap" complex. There have been more new tactics and strategies devised with the limited number of characters used these days than in the past few years combined.

Anyone that is posting they're sick of seeing top tier vs top tier is F)probably doesn't play this game, A) plays and sucks at this game, G) is a person that choice G applies to and is probably not going to Evo, or O) if they are going to Evo, they're either really rich or are T) going to get peaced out really quick, most likely both.

I understand what you're doing though. Evo's on console and the hype isn't there. You figure the players that are hardcore about the game and really want a real 5on5 will be at Evo anyways. But you want to attract the fanboys and other less serious players with an event that they can enjoy and might be excited about.

It's understandable, since neither of you play MvC2 hardcore or even at all, that this idea might sound good to you.

I would suggest contacting the 5 players in each of the regions you picked you think that has the most understanding of their respective players and knows the most people and see what they say. I know I've already talked to the 5 from Cali, 5 from EC, and 3 from Seattle that I think fits those requirements, and they all said the idea is blasphemy in the name of all that is Marvel and wouldn't play in it. So if you do hold it, you're looking at a bunch of middle/lower tier players beasting with Sabertooth.

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by Xecutioner

Having 4 teams this time, is a good idea though. You can have a EC, WC, Midwest, and I suppose a team Seattle since people always puts them by themselves. You have one team versus another and the winners will fight each other to see who is the best.


Daywalker Nah, it should be round robin. In the arcade downstairs. And then have the draft pick tournament on the big screen. Guess where everyone will be?

[margalis]

Originally posted by eKiN


hey dude
you're a faggot



No...you are...wow, genius comment. I like how all of you put together are too stupid to make one coherent comment. Who ties your shoes in the morning?

Edit:

Blaze is an idiot, so I will spell this out for him.

Blaze's argument now: We need an EC vs WC tourney to settle who is better - the players will bring their best.

Blaze's argument perviously: The EC vs WC tourney didn't settle anything and the players didn't bring their best.

So which is it? It can't be both.

The whole thing is stupid anyway, because we ALL know two things:

1: WC is better than EC
2: Justin is better than anyone

There is no way around those. It IS settled and it has been settled for about a decade. EC has had time after time to put up or shut up, and they always get beat down, come up with a lame excuse, then say "oh...you're just SCARED!" The only people who think there is an EC/WC rivalry are the perrenial EC losers.


Edit 2: eKin gets a response when he posts something not totally retarded. I don't think you guys are doing yourselves any favors when your entire arguments are "***." Good one guys!

Edit 3: There is a serious MVC2 tournament already. I do think it would be a HORRIBLE idea for this to replace and become the main MVC2 tourney. But nobody is proposing that. A team vs. team, WC vs EC random exhibition is really no different than an actual tourney. It's the same people, playing the same chars....why bother? It's a tiny variation on the exact same thing. Maybe we could also do a north/south tourney! An international/US tourney? A 3 on 3 touney! Who cares? It's the same matches. Nobody gives a shit about watching Josh Wigfall play out his side of some pretend rivalry in any setting.

The only person interesting in the WC/EC angle is Justin. If you really want a cool exhibition, just do Justin vs everyone. The thing that made last year exciting was Justin. (And the fact he got whipped once) Take Justin away and you have boring shit identical to the normal tourney.

It's funny you guys are crying about a scrub tourney....exhibitions are exhibitions, tourneys are tourneys...exhibitions are not serious by definition. You can't do a serious tourney limited to arbitrary invites to randomly divided geographical areas.

Why do you guys like the EC vs WC angle?

a: There is an exciting rivalry. (In your imagination)
b: Last year it was exciting. (Because of one match)
c: It settles things. (Except last year, when it didn't)

[eks]

Originally posted by eKiN
do you even play marvel?

are you even going to evo?

what the fuck do you know?

shut the fuck up

[mjm]

Originally posted by margalis


The only people who think there is an EC/WC rivalry are the perrenial EC losers.

or maybe you could include the ec players that crept up and won a few games(or more) last year....

seriously, you're ignorant so i don't mind.

They own us so damn hard, lets just vote in this thread who the winner was and get it over with.

I <3 this

edit:why do we like the ec/wc angle?

because the ec actually has a pretty good player base now, comp is better and it's likely to be a better match-up.

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by margalis


Blaze is an idiot, so I will spell this out for him.

Blaze's argument now: We need an EC vs WC tourney to settle who is better - the players will bring their best.

Blaze's argument perviously: The EC vs WC tourney didn't settle anything and the players didn't bring their best.

So which is it? It can't be both.

The whole thing is stupid anyway, because we ALL know two things:

1: WC is better than EC
2: Justin is better than anyone

There is no way around those. It IS settled and it has been settled for about a decade. EC has had time after time to put up or shut up, and they always get beat down, come up with a lame excuse, then say "oh...you're just SCARED!" The only people who think there is an EC/WC rivalry are the perrenial EC losers. The whole thing is stupid anyways, because we ALL know two things:

1. You're a *** who just gives his worthless input from behind a computer screen.
2. You're a *** who just sucks dick.

Are you going to Evo? If not, then STFU and stop posting because this shit doesn't concern you.

If you are, play me for $100, 1st to 10. If you don't accept, I'll just quote ekin, and you can just go away.

[margalis]

It really doesn't matter all that much, what format an exhibition takes place with is really just trivia. It's just amusing that you guys are complaining about a "scrub tourney" while advocating the incredibly scrubby notion that a 5 on 5 invite tourney is worth going beserk over, and the actual TOURNEY tourney isn't worth mentioning.

What next? You guys start crying about some rule changes to a combo exhibition?

I guess the 5 on 5 invite tourney appeals to people because they know they have no shot in an actual tourney.

The real problem here is that you clowns are elevating a non-serious side activity above the core event, while claiming to be "hardcore" players or some such shit...all this invite only garbage is filler and window dressing. As self-proclaimed "serious" players your goal is supposed to be winning an actual tournament. Imagine that! I guess if you have no chance of winning a real tourney the invite only tourney makes you feel all warm inside.

[eks]

Originally posted by margalis
some shit about an event he isnt even going to

i guess acting like a faggot on the internet makes you feel all warm inside

[margalis]

Blaze: The 5 on 5 is great, because it settles rivalries.
Blaze: The 5 on 5 last year settled nothing.
Blaze: I'm a fucking moron.

[Mummy-B]

I bet if them Japanese Marvel players showed up with thier random fucking Marvel teams, they'd actually do pretty well in this whole one character the whole time deal. I think Joe Zaza and his random teams would be pretty crazy too. This actually gives people who play non-standard teams at a competitive (or close to competitive) level an advantage, since they would pretty much benefit the team as a whole.

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by margalis

Some shit about an event he's not even going to please shut up already.

[margalis]

Originally posted by Blaziniflo
please shut up already.
You first?

Lol I'm done. I think an exhibition with some sort of character exclusivity would be interesting, which is the point of an exhibition. You think I'm a ***. Both our opinions are now known. I think at some point you even tried to make some sort of argument for or against the actual topic...maybe.

The question you should ask yourself is: Why do I care so much about the exhibition and not the actual tournament? Instead you are going off on how it's an insult to world of marvel...IT'S A FUCKING EXHIBITION!

You can get the last word (which will no doubt be ***), just imagine me pasting that last line over and over again as every response.

IT'S A FUCKING EXHIBITION!

[mjm]

except this exhibition is way less intense compared to the ec vs wc

whats confusing about that?

It's not that this is a bad idea, it's just that east coast is way more interested in another shot at playing their top 5..

i'm interested in how many side events there will actually be time for. thats one way to get people to open up to the idea, discuss the limitations of what we can really do at evo. The consoles should make for many many possibilities. why can't we just run hella marvel exhibitions:lol:

[Shin-RoTeNdO]

Originally posted by Blaziniflo


There have been more new tactics and strategies devised with the limited number of characters used these days than in the past few years combined.



True, but that also goes for the number(s) of characters that are rarely used in Tourneys.

Have you seen of heard of vegita-x? He uses Rogue/Storm/Tbone. Proof that low-tier can compete in Marvel at the big tourneys. Because a lot of these low-tier characters aren't hardly used, many of us to don't get to see how well they play in the hands of someone who has taken their time and 'devised' strategies and tactics to go head to head against people using the big four. Some names like Joezaza, MikeZ, should pop up in peoples minds and those people who use Team Steriods and etc... IMO, therea are going to lots of great matches if they do go with the draft pick team exhibition.


Its something new. A new idea and also another change for this year's EVO. People don't like change, never have, and never will, but you can't stop change. Either you like it or not, it's not going to hurt to try it out and if the idea flops, you know what not to do the next year.

[Soy Sauce]

It's not about East or West, it's about niggas and bitches, power and money, riders and punks. Which side are you on???

Be a man Trommell, cmon don't be scurred, you're runnin from Ronso that's what I heard!

[PsiANyd]

You niggas is still fuckin talkin? You niggas is still breathin? Fuckin roaches. Alright, it's a raid on cockroaches.

I CAN BUILD YOU A GREAT STATUE!!! GRAND HORN ON HEAD!! GRAND HORN ON HEEEEAAAAADDDDD!!!!!!!!

[_MJ_]

lets call the whole thing off and close thread, aye?

[OhNoos]

hmmm maybe i should take the team i was playing 6 months after this game came out, out of retirement... Felica/Jugs/Ken hahaha

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by RoTeNdO


True, but that also goes for the number(s) of characters that are rarely used in Tourneys.

Have you seen of heard of vegita-x? He uses Rogue/Storm/Tbone. Proof that low-tier can compete in Marvel at the big tourneys. Because a lot of these low-tier characters aren't hardly used, many of us to don't get to see how well they play in the hands of someone who has taken their time and 'devised' strategies and tactics to go head to head against people using the big four. Some names like Joezaza, MikeZ, should pop up in peoples minds and those people who use Team Steriods and etc... IMO, therea are going to lots of great matches if they do go with the draft pick team exhibition.


Its something new. A new idea and also another change for this year's EVO. People don't like change, never have, and never will, but you can't stop change. Either you like it or not, it's not going to hurt to try it out and if the idea flops, you know what not to do the next year. wow dude, you're dense. but you're in empire, that's understandable. Us llamas would never be as dumb as you. Did read my posts? It's not "let's not try it out," it's "let's not try it out if it's going to replece WConEC 5on5." Actually wait, it is let's not try it out. Zaza and Patrick are dope. Patrick's vagiter in case you're just a fanboy. Mike Z sucks. Tell me something though, not dispecting zaza and vagiter, but do you think people would actually want them to play representing their regions over say, sanford or soo? This tournament idea is a joke. But then again, you probably don't play.


Just drop the subject. Have both. This one for the fanboys. And the 5on5 for the fanboys and gangstas. GGOP.

[Storm's Force]

this thread is out of control:eek:

[Robyrt]

To get this thread a little more back on topic...

I love the idea of a Marvel team tourney, I think it would be a lot more fun to watch than a 5on5, especially with 4+ teams. Of course it's not as serious as the singles tourney, that's the point, ignore the whining.

However, I think drafting characters is a horrible idea. There are two major strategies for a limited draft like this: (1) give all your best characters to Justin, and (2) distribute your five good characters between 3 people. All 3-5 matches will be awesome if both teams pick option (2). If both teams pick (1), you'll have one great top-tier match and two beatdowns by the winner. If one team picks (1) and the other picks (2), you have either three very boring "Justin's top tiers own whoever had to play Rogue this time" matches or a stunning upset. The result? You just decreased the 5on5 to a small singles tourny with low-tier players as the opening act - and that's not nearly the level of coolness a team tourney could be.

I'd rather see teams draft from individual character pools - i.e. each team gets only one Magneto. This way, you don't totally shaft the skills of the players on your team (imagine team seattle losing the coin flip and not getting Sent, what's Kuan going to play?) but you get to see 50% more character diversity (9 chars as opposed to 6).

[SSJGouKi]

Originally posted by Mummy-B
I bet if them Japanese Marvel players showed up with thier random fucking Marvel teams, they'd actually do pretty well in this whole one character the whole time deal. I think Joe Zaza and his random teams would be pretty crazy too. This actually gives people who play non-standard teams at a competitive (or close to competitive) level an advantage, since they would pretty much benefit the team as a whole.

this shows how broke mvc2 really is.

[OhNoos]

To be honest this sounds like the only marvel matches I’d want to watch, I could honestly not give a fuck who won a 5 on 5 EC vs. WC. I know my opinion doesn’t really have any sway but marvel is fucking boring as hell for me to watch since I don't play any more and you can only watch mag combos or sent combos so many times before you sort of tune out.

Something new might bring people into playing MvC2 that don't currently... If that’s possible since SRK, and before that, #capcom have always been big on the VS games over all other fighting games.

At least seeing people play characters that don’t normally get seen will make the fights slightly more interesting, forcing people to play somewhat “out of they’re element”

The draft idea sounds fun as well, if it works out it might be fun to see that in 3s/ST/CvS2 team tournaments too... How will who gets 1st over all be decided?

[box]

Originally posted by Robyrt

However, I think drafting characters is a horrible idea. There are two major strategies for a limited draft like this: (1) give all your best characters to Justin, and (2) distribute your five good characters between 3 people. All 3-5 matches will be awesome if both teams pick option (2). If both teams pick (1), you'll have one great top-tier match and two beatdowns by the winner. If one team picks (1) and the other picks (2), you have either three very boring "Justin's top tiers own whoever had to play Rogue this time" matches or a stunning upset. The result? You just decreased the 5on5 to a small singles tourny with low-tier players as the opening act - and that's not nearly the level of coolness a team tourney could be.


Option 1 might not go down. Justin beats people down with cammy/cyke/doom, or marrow/guile/tron, or cammy/guile/charlie etc. If I was on Justin's team I'd give the one big-four character to someone else just because Justin has the ability to handle wack-ass teams.

Plus, in an overall draft pick with 4 teams, your most likely going to get 1 big-four character(mag/cable/sent/storm), 2 upper tier(cyke/commando/psylocke/doom/ironman/blakheart/tron/spiral/strider), and the other 6 are gonna be shitty mid tier characters.

[FMJaguar]

Which goes back to having the match itself be round robin, even if there are some strong teams you still have to win some more matches to win the whole thing

[GalzPanic]

I think if there's gonna be a team tourney, then it might as well be 5 on 5. however

The draft idea sounds really fun. If it really is going to happen, then it should be a singles event. For example, if it was an 8 man event, the draft (assuming the order flipflops on the way back) might like look like this:

1. Mag
2. Storm
3. Cable
4. Sent
5. BH
6 Doom
7. Commando
8. Spiral
9. Cyke
10. Ironman
11. Strider

Spiral/Cyke IM/Cap Strider/Doom (uhoh)

Of course players would think ahead and make sure Strider/Doom doesn't happen. This is where draft strategy comes in.

Also, the draft shouldn't stop at 3 rounds. It should be 4 or even 5, and each person will make a team from 3 of their 5.

anyway, yeah fun!

[KaiSingrz]

Originally posted by margalis

Why do you guys like the EC vs WC angle?

a: There is an exciting rivalry. (In your imagination)
b: Last year it was exciting. (Because of one match)
c: It settles things. (Except last year, when it didn't)
my god. that's one of the stupidest things i've ever read. Are you blind? Last year's was exciting because of one match? Were you even there? Oh sure. Totally ignore that huge crowd ovation at the end of the Soo vs. Ricky match. Completely ignore the crowd Exploding when Row destroyed Ricky's Storm in 4 seconds. And I suppose Genghis OCVing Wigfall with commando had everyone sit on their hands?

Anyway Ink and Ponder, I think a lot have spoken. I have a feeling a draft tournament isn't going to draw that large of a crowd. Maybe you should make a poll about this, having everyone on SRK vote between a 5on5, the team tourney without a draft, or a team tourney with the draft. Just to get an idea of what the people want. You could probably throw in other ideas for an exhibition as well into the poll. Like a combo exhibition as well or something.

[margalis]

It's pretty obvious a draft tourney isn't very popular. As I said before, it's an exhibition....I have an opinion but it really doesn't matter, or shouldn't anyway.

A good question would be, why is the ACTUAL tourney so boring? A lot of people seem more interested in the side event than the main event.

[KaiSingrz]

Originally posted by margalis
It's pretty obvious a draft tourney isn't very popular. As I said before, it's an exhibition....I have an opinion but it really doesn't matter, or shouldn't anyway.

A good question would be, why is the ACTUAL tourney so boring? A lot of people seem more interested in the side event than the main event.
nobody said the actual tourney is boring. Just you.

[demiSe]

A combo exhibition is a MUCH better idea than some gay low-tier tourney.

[Snowman]

Originally posted by demiSe
A combo exhibition is a MUCH better idea than some gay low-tier tourney.
so we can all see the combos from Mag/Storm/Sent/Psycke/Cable/Capcom/Strider/Doom thats been done over and over from the years?

[demiSe]

Originally posted by Snowman

so we can all see the combos from Mag/Storm/Sent/Psycke/Cable/Capcom/Strider/Doom thats been done over and over from the years?

Umm no, dickums. The combo exhibition is graded on innovation and flash. So you obviously can't win it by doing corny bnb type shit that everyone and their grandma can do. Cali already had a combo exhibition a while back which IIRC Mike Z won. So why not pit the coasts/regions against each other and see who has the best combo artists. I heard Chikyu is coming to Evo so you can throw him into the mix as well, I know he's good at that type of thing.

In short, watching low tiers play = boring. Watching low tiers do crazy combos = not as boring. This event definitely has the potential to be highly entertaining. You say you want to see new stuff in marvel? Well, this is the right way to do it.

[KaiSingrz]

Originally posted by Snowman

so we can all see the combos from Mag/Storm/Sent/Psycke/Cable/Capcom/Strider/Doom thats been done over and over from the years?
um... when we did a combo exhibition contest here at FF, a lot of new shit was shown. Potter got innovative with Sentinel fast fly. Mike Z showed off some wack ass glitches. There was even a guy who showed some nice shit with Hulk/Collossus/Thanos. So shut up and drink your tea, lousy brit.

[Snowman]

I may be a brit, but I'm welsh, don't get the welsh mixed up with english.
If they can show me something new then I aint one to complain.
Just after viewing tons of MvC2 combo & match vids, I've possibly seen it all. I'm not one to hate on ideas but if Evo was going to do one I'm not going to complain either.

I guess I'm just not a big fan of MvC2 anymore (since the tournaments I am able to go to take it out of its list)
Kinda makes you wonder why Evo never did a Combo Ex. competition.

[eks]

Originally posted by Snowman
I may be a brit, but I'm welsh, don't get the welsh mixed up with english.

you may be an idiot

stfu

[Ziggy]

Looking at the suggested format, I can see that the idea is to provide an exhibition for the favourite US SF game that will entertain the EVO crowd with a wider variety of characters. I can only imagine that the reason for wanting this in the first place is that people are getting bored with seeing the same stuff (e.g. EVO2K3 MvC2 finals).

As eKiN knows, I'm not going to EVO, and I'm not a serious MvC2 player, but I am a fan of top-level MvC2 play. I happily bought the EVO2K3 DVD, watched all the MvC2 that was provided, and was thoroughly entertained, especially since I knew that I was seeing the best MvC2 play in the world. This included the EC vs WC exhibition. (I never doubted for a moment that Soo vs Justin was a serious match. Why anyone would think otherwise is beyond me.)

Given the new format for EVO2K4, I'm all for the organisers running extra events that will entertain those attending. If this draft thing is going to achieve that, then by all means go for it. Looking at the details, however, I fail to see how this is going to produce top-level MvC2 matches. Limiting charcaters in this fashoin is going to create a bastardised version of MvC2, which might be amusing to watch, but is going to be full of emergency teams and quirky tactics, neither of which are what EVO competition is supposed to be about.

I think the EVO organisers and attendees should run whatever they like on the side. All I'd ask is that you don't put this kind of sub-par trash onto the DVDs. I don't want to pay for low-tier MvC2 matches/combos when I can download hundreds of them already.

[Shin-RoTeNdO]

Originally posted by Blaziniflo
This tournament idea is a joke. But then again, you probably don't play.



:lol: OKay so you think its a joke, fine. I respect your opinion playa, but it all doesn't matter to me. Its only a game in the first place so I'm not going to argue with anyone. What is up with the name calling? Don't target me because I'm with EA. I don't have any 'enemies' except for the ones overseas. Peace.

[Snowman]

Originally posted by eKiN


you may be an idiot

stfu
:lol:

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by margalis
It's pretty obvious a draft tourney isn't very popular. As I said before, it's an exhibition....I have an opinion but it really doesn't matter, or shouldn't anyway.

A good question would be, why is the ACTUAL tourney so boring? A lot of people seem more interested in the side event than the main event. OMFG, you're still posting? Go do some homework, because if mommy gets upset she'll turn off your internet.

To the welsh fisherman: We don't even listen to white Americans in this community, what makes you think we'll listen to you? And your post is retarded because you obviously don't even play the game. I said it last year, and I'll say it again: No wonder you people lost the fucking war.

[Snowman]

I post because I can, I do not care who listens to it or not.
That I believe is the whole point of forums. And I think the Cannon's listen on open ears, unlike alot of members on SRK who just flame the hell out of anyone for making one bad idea/post.
It doesn't suprise me though, when people jump on the flaming bandwagon I've seen it all the time here on SRK.
And to correct one thing on your post about me, I do play MvC2, just not as strongly as I did (since its been removed from normal UK tournaments)

[Blaziniflo]

Originally posted by Snowman
And I think the Cannon's listen on open ears
Not to brits they don't.

Originally posted by Snowman
I do play MvC2, just not as strongly as I did (since its been removed from normal UK tournaments) Now you're just lying to yourself......

[Snowman]

Perhaps they don't listen to brits, but overall I don't really care either, as long as I get a great DVD from the event I'm set.
And I'm not lying to myself, I've been playing MvC2 since 2001 (when I had it with my DC), and after finding out that Absolution (my countries main tournament) is dropping MvC2 due to poor registration numbers, I've decided to cool off on MvC2, and work on my other games, which includes 3D titles too.
You know very little about me, so don't assume. I don't intend to argue/flame people in this thread either so I'm done. And I hope that people don't flame me back either.
Jolly good show, pish tosh must be off.

[KaiSingrz]

Originally posted by Snowman
I may be a brit, but I'm welsh, don't get the welsh mixed up with english.
If they can show me something new then I aint one to complain.
Just after viewing tons of MvC2 combo & match vids, I've possibly seen it all.
watching every single match vid ever produced would just put you on the same knowledge level of kdcmarvel. Go get a first hand experience of top level play before you claim you've seen it all. NEXT


Kinda makes you wonder why Evo never did a Combo Ex. competition.
I can see it now...

Evo 2k2: The Cannons hold a combo ex contest... only to get kicked out of UCLA before they could hold Marvel finals. In order to do this, they get rid of the 3s and A3 exhibitions, pretty much saying "fuck it" to any chance the 3s and A3 community can get to pick up. Yeah, smart move.

Evo 2k3: The Cannons hold the combo exhibition contest... making the entire tournament, which already ended past midnight, run 2 hours longer. The only way to compensate for this is to kill the 5on5. Yeah, way to go smart guy.

just stick a crumpet in it already, Alfred.

[JALbert]

Couple points.

1. Everyone for this whole low tier drafting idea doesn't play Marvel. Everyone who does thinks that it's a bad idea and a 5 on 5 is better. And when I say everyone, I'm sure there's a couple exceptions so don't quote this and post up 'OMG TEH ERROR!!! YOU LOSE!!'

2. People say that last years 5 on 5 grudge match didn't settle anything, there's been nothing but dispute over what happens, flame flame, etc. etc. OH SHIT, GRUDGES! Looks like it worked to me.

3. Let's make the Cali/Seattle/EC/Other tournament for money. Anyone from the regions can buy a stake in the team (basically place a bet), and get a representational share of the pot if their team wins. Just a thought. Or actually have Evo put up a prize stake to be split by the winning team so there's no 'It didn't mean anything, Justin wasn't trying' talk.

[Magnetro]

Originally posted by JALbert
...winning team so there's no 'It didn't mean anything, Justin wasn't trying' talk.

Yah, I wish it was that simple, not the Soo vs Justin match period, but people where talking about the whole thing :( :o

[Morphiend]

no chance of making soo vs justin its own event? i think that's what people REALLY want to see. :(

[Shrek]

I think this is a fantastic idea...something different / added twist / etc..whatever you want to call it, it's a new way to do it.

I think using some different formats with tested games shoudn't be something that everyone freaks out in regards to, but looks forward to.

This year at ECC we are trying a new format for a team tournament, where team captains are named and then we draft players (not characters) out of a pool of entrants. It's an old game (yes I know) but now with a slightly different twist.

Personally I'd be interested in seeing how some of the proposed formats will work. Good call on coming up with something else we can try.

I do think an ec vs. wc 5on5 rematch may be good to have in addition though, I know there are enough unwashed masses that would like to see that too.

[Spyro]

I never understand why do idiots say MvC2 is boring cause they only see 4 chars being used...

MvC2 is fun cause of those chars, take those away and MvC2 becomes a boring piece of shit.

[box]

Mike Z is the King of MvC2 low tier.

Go to www.evilslash.com and download match 27.

It will make you go :eek:

[Stumpy da Dopey]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi
seeing the same characters used (magnus/storm/cable/sent) over and over bores me to tears. Especially when people play the same way with the big 4.

wow, one of the dumbest posts ive ever read.

i dont play mvc2, but by that logic, even if everyone stopped playing those characters and started playing others, it would still be boring to you because you would see those other characters doing the same things over and over.

also, using that logic i can say that every fighting game ever created bores you to tears. in every game you will see the same characters used doing the same things over and over.

your post is retarded in so many ways.

[Magnetro]

Originally posted by Stumpy da Dopey


wow, one of the dumbest posts ive ever read.

i dont play mvc2, but by that logic, even if everyone stopped playing those characters and started playing others, it would still be boring to you because you would see those other characters doing the same things over and over.

also, using that logic i can say that every fighting game ever created bores you to tears. in every game you will see the same characters used doing the same things over and over.

your post is retarded in so many ways.

Co-Sign...

+ Combo Exhibition by itself would probably be cool, although like most of the people here *I* don't want it to replace 5on5.

[margalis]

Originally posted by KaiSingrz

nobody said the actual tourney is boring. Just you.

That's the implication when people go bonkers over an EXHIBITION. Exhibitions are supposed to be fun side events.

This type of tourney won't produce the best top-level play? Who cares? That's what the tourney is for, where you have to earn your way to the top instead of getting an invite.

If you guys want to see more top-level matches, you should argue for another real MVC2 tourney. A 5 on 5 invite tourney is not that.

[OhNoos]

Originally posted by margalis


That's the implication when people go bonkers over an EXHIBITION. Exhibitions are supposed to be fun side events.

This type of tourney won't produce the best top-level play? Who cares? That's what the tourney is for, where you have to earn your way to the top instead of getting an invite.

If you guys want to see more top-level matches, you should argue for another real MVC2 tourney. A 5 on 5 invite tourney is not that.


man has a point.

[demiSe]

Originally posted by OhNoos



man has a point.

nah...

[SSJGouKi]

Originally posted by Stumpy da Dopey


wow, one of the dumbest posts ive ever read.

i dont play mvc2, but by that logic, even if everyone stopped playing those characters and started playing others, it would still be boring to you because you would see those other characters doing the same things over and over.

also, using that logic i can say that every fighting game ever created bores you to tears. in every game you will see the same characters used doing the same things over and over.

your post is retarded in so many ways.

how about go downloading some japan vf4 evo matches. the game has so many moves its ridiculous, you will almost always see something new. GGXX i can't say the same thing for this game, but its no where near as repetitve as mvc2. Especially how you get to see how each character can do all kinds of rushdowns, traps, jump cancels, RC, FRCs etc. There is so much to be seen. Even KOF2K2... i've download lots of japan kof2k2 matches and all the max combos i see are very impressive. Sentinel, how many times did we see the same 4 hit air combo ending in the rocket punch? And what about Cable? Is there not another way in playing him instead of running away 24/7? Or Storm runaway mashing on the fierce? tell me some examples (especially cable) that are NEW that we haven't seen already.

[Amingo]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi

Sentinel, how many times did we see the same 4 hit air combo ending in the rocket punch? And what about Cable? Is there not another way in playing him instead of running away 24/7? Or Storm runaway mashing on the fierce? tell me some examples (especially cable) that are NEW that we haven't seen already.

you're obviously too dumb to know what storm corner resets are. you're also too dumb to know what fastfly is. and what sent's corner unfly infinite is. and i guess you think tk grenades/viper beams and zoning with assists is running away. "oh man, he's not rushing them the fuck down, that runaway bastard!" then again, you think magnus is about ac into hypergrav tempest. rofl. what a retard. snicker.

if you don't even know how to play the game at a basic level, you might want to shut up instead of displaying your stupidity for the world to see.

[KaiSingrz]

Originally posted by margalis


This type of tourney won't produce the best top-level play? Who cares? That's what the tourney is for, where you have to earn your way to the top instead of getting an invite.
teams with no chemistry are boring as fuck. And when top level players use their top level teams, that's more entertaining cuz people can actually exhibit their skills with characters they're experienced with. And that's exactly what an exhibition is for. For entertainment and to cater to the people. That's why while I like the 4 team tourney idea, i don't like the draft idea. At least w/o the draft, teams will have chemistry and at the same time, you will see some lesser used characters actually competing with the more common ones.

If you guys want to see more top-level matches, you should argue for another real MVC2 tourney. A 5 on 5 invite tourney is not that.
No we shouldn't We should argue for what we want to see. Not for two of the same thing. I'll just say this. You weren't at evo last year. You're not going to be at evo this year. You don't even play marvel. You have no idea what the overwhelming majority of the marvel community wants to see. So stop acting like you do.

[SSJGouKi]

Originally posted by Amingo


you're obviously too dumb to know what storm corner resets are. you're also too dumb to know what fastfly is. and what sent's corner unfly infinite is. and i guess you think tk grenades/viper beams and zoning with assists is running away. "oh man, he's not rushing them the fuck down, that runaway bastard!" then again, you think magnus is about ac into hypergrav tempest. rofl. what a retard. snicker.

if you don't even know how to play the game at a basic level, you might want to shut up instead of displaying your stupidity for the world to see.

And i don't want to know the terms. Fastfly LOL.... get a life! :lol: Ink, make this draft happen... some of us want to see the other 52 chars being used in this game.

[Amingo]

snicker. as this is the perfect example of the retards that you will be catering to if you force people to use low tier. little 12 year olds that will go "wow! mommy, look, jill did a 5 hit air combo! yeah! i've never seen that before!" of course, he's too stupid to understand that every jill will be doing the same ac to tackle xx super. gosh, guess he'll be bored to tears again.

anyone who actually plays the game seriously would rather watch quality top tier play than more variety in characters with mediocre play. forcing people to play other characters just makes it so that the true depth of mvc2 isn't shown, rather you're giving people the false illusion "hey wow mvc2 has so many characters and flashing lights and bright colors".

if you're catering to the masses of retarded kids like ssjgouki, sure. but then you might as well just show mvc2's incredible intro sequence with guile and zangief and ryu.

[eks]

Originally posted by margalis


That's the implication when people go bonkers over an EXHIBITION. Exhibitions are supposed to be fun side events.

This type of tourney won't produce the best top-level play? Who cares? That's what the tourney is for, where you have to earn your way to the top instead of getting an invite.

If you guys want to see more top-level matches, you should argue for another real MVC2 tourney. A 5 on 5 invite tourney is not that.

this guy can't be serious

[OhNoos]

Originally posted by Amingo


you're obviously too dumb to know what storm corner resets are. you're also too dumb to know what fastfly is. and what sent's corner unfly infinite is. and i guess you think tk grenades/viper beams and zoning with assists is running away. "oh man, he's not rushing them the fuck down, that runaway bastard!" then again, you think magnus is about ac into hypergrav tempest. rofl. what a retard. snicker.

if you don't even know how to play the game at a basic level, you might want to shut up instead of displaying your stupidity for the world to see.



I never get people who want to have big dick contests over fucking fighting games. Don't you see how sad it looks? Seriously, you're making us look bad. Calm down, take a few deep breaths and step away from the keyboard.

[Stumpy da Dopey]

Originally posted by SSJGouKi


how about go downloading some japan vf4 evo matches. the game has so many moves its ridiculous, you will almost always see something new. GGXX i can't say the same thing for this game, but its no where near as repetitve as mvc2. Especially how you get to see how each character can do all kinds of rushdowns, traps, jump cancels, RC, FRCs etc. There is so much to be seen. Even KOF2K2... i've download lots of japan kof2k2 matches and all the max combos i see are very impressive. Sentinel, how many times did we see the same 4 hit air combo ending in the rocket punch? And what about Cable? Is there not another way in playing him instead of running away 24/7? Or Storm runaway mashing on the fierce? tell me some examples (especially cable) that are NEW that we haven't seen already.

watch vf4 evo, GGXX, KOF2K2 or any game for that matter at top level play for 3 years (like mvc2) and then *you* tell me some new examples that we haven't seen already.

you still dont realize how consistently bad your posts are. everything you say can be applied to any game, not just mvc2.

[inkblot]

Thread closed due to intense hostility.