M.Bison SFA3 Thread

[Chunster01]

Well... as nobody has ever done a Bison thread (i searched and all and didn't find anything) so i'm starting this thread myself...

in my opinion his most useful Ism is A because the combos i've read aren't that damaging or useful as variables of others characters and i guess that is obvious that his most important poke is standing far forward together with crouching strong but i still can't find a good Anti-Air for Bison if someone has any idea post it here please.

i think A better than V because the most damagin VC's i've read is 75 points and his level 3 Psycho Crusher and Nightmare Knee Prees does almost as much damage. And i guess that you can make mind games with the skull dive/sommersault.

Jumping fierce, besides straight forward is the only good air attack i can think of (Maybe forward strong too?)

well... that's all this bison scrub knows...

if you have more info so i can improve my knowledge about bison i'll be glad to listen :pleased:

[G-Product]

quite frankly, Alpha Bison sux and will always suck

[shadowcharlie]

u should look in the main a3 thread theres a few pages covering bison and his good pokes strats, lvl3 psycrusher is the best reversal lol in the game imo

[Middlekick]

M.Bison Anti-Air Notes


Bison's best anti-airs from the ground would be:

1)Standing Fierce
You want to hit opponents from a distance, so only the fist part makes contact with the opponent

2)Low Strong
Although often dependent on the type of opponent regarding its use, this can be used from a close distance and is ideal to cancel from for good damage:

Counter hit low Strong-> Double Knee Press/lvl 2/3 Knee Press Nightmare/lvl 3 Psycho Crusher

3)Low forward
This doesn't actually hit the opponent out of the air. Its purpose, due to Bison's sprite being so low to the ground, is to make the opponent's jumping attack whiff, allowing the opponent to land into the ending frames of the low Forward....

3)Head Press
If it hits on a counter, follow up with the Skull Diver.

4)Level 1/2 Knee Press Nightmare

5)Level 3 Psycho Crusher


Air-to-air options:

1)Air Throw
Good reach.

2)Jumping towards Short
Useful for setting up crouch cancel combos such as: Counter Hit jumping short-> crouch cancelled jumping Fierce-> low Strong-> Head Press/Double Knee Press etc. Also good against air-recovering opponents.

3)Vertical jumping Fierce
Has a large hit-area. A cross between Zangief's and Blanka's vertical jumping Fierces.

[Chunster01]

thanks that info is interesting

on which pages am i supposed to find that info about bison? i dont think i have that much time to look for myself

[Muskau]

Psycho Crusher is only useful as an anti-air if you are sure the opponent is going to land into the middle or rear of the Psycho Crusher, if any attacks hit the front of it, it will be a trade at best, even at lvl 3. I always use lvl 1 Knee Press for anti-air, much much more reliable. Crouching strong is do-able, but only if you have god-like timing and luck.

I'm thinking jump back strong might work in some instances as well.

[Chunster01]

i've read some stuff posted about bison a time ago in the main SFA3 topic but i don't understand why Bison was so used in that tournament you talked about and that BAS player but now he seems so worthless to everyone.

[TS]

i've read some stuff posted about bison a time ago in the main SFA3 topic but i don't understand why Bison was so used in that tournament you talked about and that BAS player but now he seems so worthless to everyone.

1. Loses to Sak and probably Akuma also. More than likely Dhalsim as well.
2. Is boring, as near as I can tell. I've only ever come into contact with one good A-Bison player, but his strengths were poking and alternately turtling like some sort of giant turtle beast. Nothing against him, but he doesn't have any flashy combos like Guy or impressive pressure strings like Charlie. I don't think people like the way they look by winning with him. IMO.

[Chunster01]

so you're suggesting on moving on to another character?

[ShinRyuX]

Akuma owns Bison....he can't stop divekicks and with V-ism, Bison just can't win if you play right. Chun Li also owns Bison IMO. Her jumping short is really good against him. Still, Bison's can still be decent since he has a fast walk speed, fast jump, and good footsies.

[gig4ls]

I always thought Bison's lp psycho shot was a pretty good AA. I could be wrong.

[Kyokuji]

The only good Bisons I've seen were the ones who played mass runaway. Was annoying as hell to fight.

[Terry_nb]

The only good Bisons I've seen were the ones who played mass runaway. Was annoying as hell to fight.

Yup, the same for me. The teleports, fast walking speed and long jump making him very hard to catch, at least for my Akuma without meter.

Btw, the lvl one Psycho Crusher ain't good at all IMHO. It trades and loses just against to much. Even slow stuff like Ryu's f+FP trade or even beat it ...

[Lil' Josh]

The only good Bisons I've seen were the ones who played mass runaway. Was annoying as hell to fight.

:rofl: Teleport, Head stomp, Slide, Teleport, Repeat....:rofl:

:confused: You have to do some cheap shit to win lol I play Bison, I was just wondering if there are actually any good VCs (not just repeating that scissor kick) for him and wether or not X-ism would be a good idea because of his psycho crusher...?:confused:

:looney: And also are there any good vs Ryu tactics... I'm sick of Ryu players and there Jumping MK:looney:

[Allo]

These are the most commonly used M. Bison VCs. The c.FP allows enough stun time to allow the scissor kick to hit even if the opponent is crouching. However, because of the really slow startup time for the c.FP, you can actually get hit out of it before it connects. Best to use his VCs as anti-air, as listed.

His best VC is the one where you keep crossing over. The corner juggle where he teleports away does jack$#!+ damage...

(A) Initiator
A1: (Ground) |VC2| c.FP, b,f+MK --> B1, D1
A2: (Ground) |VC3| c.FP, b,f+MK --> B2a
A3: (Anti-air) |VC3| FP, b,f+MK --> B2b

(B) Midscreen Juggle
B1: [FK, b,f+LK/MK (miss, depending on distance)] × n --> D1
B2a: FK, b,f+MK --> B2b
B2b: [b+FP, b,f+LK (miss)] × n --> B2c before reaching the corner
B2c: b+FP, b,f+FK (miss, cross over), FP, b,f+FK (miss) --> B2b

(C) Midscreen Ender
None

(D) Corner Juggle
D1: [FK, rdp+PPP (shadow hits during this time), b,f+MK] × n
D2: [d,u+FK, FP] × n

(E) Corner Ender
None

[TS]

For a corner ender, you can do b+FP xx c.RK, and then juggle with a head stomp.

You can actually do (VC2/3)c.SP, SK scissor kick, FK scissor kick [b+FP, whiff SK scissors etc) as an anti-air, but you have to cancel the c.SP ASAP.

[Lil' Josh]

For a corner ender, you can do b+FP xx c.RK, and then juggle with a head stomp.

that's what I've been doing lol

[gig4ls]

I always thought Bison's lp psycho shot was a pretty good AA. I could be wrong.

Can anyone verify or deny this?

:rofl: Teleport, Head stomp, Slide, Teleport, Repeat....:rofl:


I thought his slide was pretty bad, doesn't look like it has good range and recovery is bad :(

[Best Kind Boxer]

Slide is like all Bison slides... from real far out, can catch people walking in, has less recovery if blocked, etc. But more of a surprise move. Laggy-est sweep in the game? :P

LP psycho shot is kinda like Chun's FB in ST. You can make them land on it and trade hits. You can't really use it like a DP though. I think it's good from afar, because the damn thing is so slow you can play against them trying to jump over it..

Bison isn't that bad IMO. Nice anti-airs, nice pokes, good jump attacks, etc..

Better in V? I dunno. Easier in A. :lol:

[Lil' Josh]

A-ism is better tha V-ism? Explain you're theory please.
Bison isnt that bad IMO too, he gets slaughtered by shotos. so sometimes i look relly shit cos i get smashed to shit by shoto-scrubs...
What could you use as a DP, MK?

[Best Kind Boxer]

Never said better, just easier. :wgrin:

His VCs aren't exactly user-friendly or extremely powerfull IMO, and in A-ism he doesn't have to worry about close moves while poking (can use far fierce and far forward while keeping a charge, etc).

But of course, V-ism is beastly. I also haven't seen a good V-Bison, but I'm sure he could make use of the blue meter.

[Terry_nb]

I thought his slide was pretty bad, doesn't look like it has good range and recovery is bad :(

Well, the slide is ok vs V activations. It stayes out so long that you can't really VC through it early. I made this mistake a few times already ... So it can surprise here and then besides the usual uses ...

I also think a good V or A Bison can confuse like mad, together with a good runaway turtle game he can do ok in the game. But never get cornered by a gief or V-Shoto ...

[Kyokuji]

Don't see how getting cornered with him is so bad when he has a teleport.

[TS]

^Bison anti-airs were mentioned in Middlekick's post. Crouching Fiece and Jab are also worth mentioning...I think crouching Jab beats Akuma's divekick if timed right...? Don't remember. You can combo crouching Jab xx Short Knee Press as ant-air even without a Counter Hit.

A-ISM advantages:
-Supers are actually good. Knee Press Nightmare is deceptively quick, and does decent damage. Level 2/3 pass through fireballs. Psycho Crusher does disproportionate Counter Hit damage- Level 3 normally does like 45% damage, but will do ~60% IIRC if it lands on a Counter Hit. Even Level 1 does like 25% if it lands on a Counter Hit, though it has such crappy priority, I don't think that really matters. Level 3 is good as anti-air, I don't know about Level 2.

-AC is good. It's the teleport, which automatically gets you out of the corner. You can also AC and not teleport behind them, maintaining your position. The AC actually takes up a shorter amount of time than blockstun, which makes it easier to punish some things.

V-ISM advantages:
-Better normal attacks; V-ISM gains controllable normals, like all V characters. So V-Bison gets to use far standing Fierce as anti-air, for example.

-Gains meter more quickly, since V/X gain meter at a faster rate than A.

-More damaging anti-air, because of the VC.




The problem with V-Bison is that the VCs are harder to land than you'd think. Say, (VC3) crouching Strong xx Knee Press into whatever works to start a VC, but actually will whiff vs crouching characters. It works if you use VC1 (you may actually need to use crouching Jab/Short...?), but that lessens the damage, since you're starting off with twice the number of hits. Anti-air VC can be started with standing Short, crouching Strong, standing Strongs etc, but at least for me, is a pain in the ass. You have a small window to cancel into the Knee Press, and you can't charge while the screen is paused, which takes some getting used to. You do get stupid guard damage VCs with V-Bison, however.

A-Bison has an easier time countering pokes and can punish things with the kick super, and his AC is a bit better for runaway, though V's can serve mostly the same purpose. Level 1 kick super (L2/3 also?) is safe if blocked, so you can do stupid tricks, like do the super, and then do another super if they try to retaliate. The problem with the Psycho Crusher is that it doesn't always get maximum damage, and will sometimes even only get one hit. If someone is doing an attack where the main part of thier body is far behind them or is retracting (say, Gen's crouching Fierce, or Chun Li's standing Roundhouse as hypotheticals), the Psycho Crusher won't travel fast enough to connect for all hits unless you start the super when very close to them. Level 3 is the useful version, I haven't messed around much with the level 2 very much, but Level 1 doesn't seem so hot. The super, moreso at level 3, is hard to VC through when jumping, however. You can activate and then walk forward, IIRC, but I don't know who if anyone can attack successfully. Walking into a level 3 super is counterintuitive, however, so a lot of people will get hit by it.

I personally would to with A-Bison over V, for both ease of use, and being better overall. Bison seems to poke a lot, and while V-Bison has the better selection of normals, A does slightly more damage, and the supers give him better options for punishing attacks. Definitely easier if not better.


Anyway, more general Bison notes-

Knee press goes over sweeps and other low attacks.

Close standing Fierce dosn't cause a Major Counter for some retarded reason.

Teleport is invincible from the start. If you want to up your chances of getting a revesal teleport, hold down all the punches, do the teleport motion, and release all 3 punch buttons as you hit all 3 kick buttons.

Bison is actually pretty fast. You can get away with walkup->throw once or twice. Speaking of the throw, if you throw someone in the corner you can tag them with crouching/standing Fiece if their air recover.

The Skull Diver at the end of the head stomp can be safe if you hit it super, super, reidiculously, unrealistically deep. You can actually link a Jab after it. You get stupid games with the head stomp, like doing it then flying across the screen, vs doing it and doing the Skull Diver afterwards, or even doing it and then flying behind them. if someone is getting up, you can actually land the stomp really deep, which makes it harder to counter what you do afterwards, and can also act sorta like a crossup.

Teleports: backwards DP+3P= staying in your same position, IIRC. Flashy way of dodging things. Backwards DP+3K= teleporting far away from your opponent. DP+3P= Teleports right in front of the opponent IIRC. DP+3K= teleports behind opponent.

I think pretty much everything else has been mentioned.

[Ouroborus]

too bad V bison dont have the psycho banish

[Terry_nb]

Don't see how getting cornered with him is so bad when he has a teleport.

You doesn't always have the time for teleports and his anti air's are sometimes pretty much worthless if you didn't got the right timing. It often happened to me getting cornered by a decent A or worse V-Gief = gg. Well, I'm for sure no pro with Bison but I found it quite hard to escape Splashes, tickthrows (or grabbing throw into air super) and blowthrough VC's with Bison ..., maybe it's just me.

@TS
nice post :)

Seems Bison got the same probs in V as Guy, very specific positions of the opponent are needed.

[Lil' Josh]

cna you "paint the fence" in this game, i seen a move like the punch used in it, i was actually quite shocked too.

[Terry_nb]

cna you "paint the fence" in this game, i seen a move like the punch used in it, i was actually quite shocked too.

Nope he can't do this in A3. First thing Bison lacks the dp+P (his Psycho Banish like Ouroborus mentined already) and VC's act different then CC's in CvS2. You just coudn't juggle in the same way in A3 then CvS2 ...^^

[Lil' Josh]

Nope he can't do this in A3. First thing Bison lacks the dp+P (his Psycho Banish like Ouroborus mentined already) and VC's act different then CC's in CvS2. You just coudn't juggle in the same way in A3 then CvS2 ...^^

i swore i cseen a move like psycho banisher but anyway it doesnt matter

[Lil' Josh]

right, I'm in a tournametnt and how thee hell am i gonna beat dhalsim? he takes the piss... what move is best for his spinning head move?

[TS]

Correction: Level 1 Knee Press Nightmare isn't safe if blocked, it can be hit by Reversal DP, Rising Jaguar etc. But Reversal supers are (all?) too slow, with the exception of Zangief's FAB and maybe other throw supers.

edit: vs Dhalsim's headbutt spear thing, I don't know if you have anything that will beat it on the ground. So you can

-Super, though it might whiff if he's still too high in the air when you do it
-Teleport, though you need to do it early so he can't hit you with standing Strong or something when he lands
-Jump and meet him in the air with something like neutral jumping Roundhouse or Short (ditto)

I have no experience in Bison vs Dhalsim whatsoever.

-Knee Press Nightmare vs slides and crouching Fierce. You'll probably trade if he does a crouching Fierce if you do the super too early, but you can try to hit him just as the c.FP is starting to retract. If he blocks the super (level 1), he doesn't have anything that can hit you back AFAIK, except for using an Alpha Counter for A-Dhalsim. If he tries to hit you after the super you can block, or teleport, or do another super. Regular Knee Press goes over slides too, if you do it early.

-Far standing Strong/Fierce probably beat/trade with his far limbs, if not try crouching Strong and standing Short.

-vs X-ISM Dhalsim, you need to bait the super to win. Like after a knockdown cancel a crouching Strong into a Teleport (or super, if you're bold), or just use whatever random tricks. Things go alot easier when he doesn't have the super ready. Limbs need to be cancled immediately so for example it'd be f, d+SP, d/f+3K to cancel into the teleport, and there's a short window where you can do it and not get hit by the super. Also works vs ACs.

-Head stomp gets you close even if it whiffs, and Bison has a huge jump anyway. I hope you can do jumping Roundhouse, c.FK xx knee press or super consistently, since if the opportunity comes up, you need to take it.

-Psycho Crusher (level 2?/3) is good vs anything close, like the drill kicks, but may not get all hits vs his crouching Fierce, and defintely won't vs far normals.

-...throw a lot?

-Close standing Strong or close/far standing Strong and Fierce probably beat/trade with his close crouching Fierce if you do it early, since moves which hit above Dhalsim have the best chance of knocking him out of that move (ie. Balrog standing Fierce, Rose standing Strong etc).

I'll try to upload some super-random Bison stuff to YouTube next week, though there are actual matches already up.

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3297407&postcount=2928

[Xenozip.]

I have no experience in Bison vs Dhalsim whatsoever.
Me either, but I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that his primary concern is mid-range fireball and limb pressure.

-...throw a lot? Against Sim?

[Lil' Josh]

Does anyone hate the punch after the head stomp?
it allways either get air-thrown/SRK'd cos i press it by acciednt lol

can anyone gimme an idea of what bisons good/badf matchups are?

[TS]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SIoi_NitQo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUMapl6XfjM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzT0IdDlPsw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc5Tn8PUwz0

Keep your expectations low.


Random Bison stuff, as promised several decades ago. At the start of one of the vids, #3 IIRC, Adon does the Jaguar Revolver super and then whiffs a throw immediately after, and I hit him with the super vs the whiffed throw.

There are some V-Bison combos in Xenozip's big combo video thread at the top of this forum.

[Kyokuji]

Yeah, Blanka is royally fucked against a good Bison player.
His reverse devil punch has really good priority as well.
Unless I activate really late, it goes right through my anti-air.

[Snowe]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L3reJ-gwsg&mode=related&search=

[Mouko]

Yup, the same for me. The teleports, fast walking speed and long jump making him very hard to catch, at least for my Akuma without meter.

Btw, the lvl one Psycho Crusher ain't good at all IMHO. It trades and loses just against to much. Even slow stuff like Ryu's f+FP trade or even beat it ...

his supers pretty much suck vs shotos. You can see the activation on his kneepress and DP it, even if you're caught in a mid move.

[X-COPY]

his supers pretty much suck vs shotos. You can see the activation on his kneepress and DP it, even if you're caught in a mid move.

Yeah, cause Bison users will do the super randomly for you to uppercut. You're a moron.

[EveryFlowerFlow]

^you'd be suprised

[Terry_nb]

@Mouko
For the Knee Press Super ... I only see it in use as anti air, so dping through it isn't an option. I play vs a decent Bison once in a while and he only uses the super for this purpose and safes the rest of his meter for AC's.

[TS]

Yeah, cause Bison users will do the super randomly for you to uppercut. You're a moron.

He's saying that you can stick out a normal move and then cancel it to a DP. For example, :r:, :d:+:mk:, and then do :df:+:hp if you see the screen freeze so the DP will come out. You can also just do the DP motion on reaction, though it's of course safer to do the motion beforehand.

[X-COPY]

He's saying that you can stick out a normal move and then cancel it to a DP. For example, :r:, :d:+:mk:, and then do :df:+:hp if you see the screen freeze so the DP will come out. You can also just do the DP motion on reaction, though it's of course safer to do the motion beforehand.

Yeah, I gotcha. I know what he was trying to say, I was just being abrasive, lol. But yeah, I still think anytime you get SRK'ed during super, you're either getting majorly predictable or you're just getting plain ol' gayed.

[TS]

A-Bison vs A-Ryu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OO8CfuZRFg

A-Bison vs V-Cammy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgJYVl2i_i8

Bison vs V-Zangief
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZ28OB9d8YQ

Bison vs V-Akuma
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wVoYHRzelE

[Terry_nb]

A-Bison vs A-Ryu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2OO8CfuZRFg

A-Bison vs V-Cammy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgJYVl2i_i8

Bison vs V-Zangief
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZ28OB9d8YQ

Bison vs V-Akuma
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wVoYHRzelE

Nice, good to see some new vids here. :)

[God 2.0]

Good afternoon ladies and gents.

Thought I'd share some of my observations with Bison.

- short and j.short are very fast pokes, and can be useful to counter your opponent's movements. At longer range, use jab instead. short is faster at close range.

- if your opponent blocks your level 1 knee press nightmare, you might want to try starting a new super at the very end. this might fool some players who will try and punish you for the blocked super. Alternatively, you may try to throw them or start another attack. To play it safe, use a kkk back teleport to get away from any reversals. All of these require strict timing to perform properly.

- The psycho shot can be used as an anti air at low angles. One can also use his s. roundhouse, though this might lose trades to some air attacks. Safest anti air is c. strong, j. forward, and of course, j.short.

[EveryFlowerFlow]

- if your opponent blocks your level 1 knee press nightmare, you might want to try starting a new super at the very end. this might fool some players who will try and punish you for the blocked super.




that really only works online. Like TS said a blocked KPN can be punished by reversal DPs and the like.

[oppn1]

that really only works online. Like TS said a blocked KPN can be punished by reversal DPs and the like.
I think these days online sfa3 tips matters more than ever. Where are all the non-japanese tourneys, there are like zero of them, while online is pretty much crowded. Sorry for off-topic random babbling :sweat:.

[bigvador]

i think bison is the best boss i have ever played all that power also for me i would pick the v isim because i f i catch him once then i can pull off a endless combo

[keo-bas]

I’m just a bison scrub trying to learn a few things.

As I bison player shoto’s are my worst nightmares. Their crouching whiffs most of bison standing normal attacks, which ruins bison poke game.

Though my execution is terrible, I find that super is much more reliable anti air than his normals, at least against meaty on wake up.

I’ve yet to under stand how his alpha counter works. I need to tweak with it further and see what his best option is. But so far it only led me to my doom.

Knee stomp is bison user best friend (though risky I find it being reliable throwing it out randomly but its terribly unsafe still), and skull diver is like icing on the cake for counters or mix up.

Though I picked bison out of sheer love since his introduction in ssf2 (I instantly became a bison fan boy when he threw that awesome cape). He’s a nice character with reach and jumps.

(Oh maybe it’s just me but walking backwards is never good or playing long range battles. I prefer mid range so normal attacks can reach.)

I begin to wonder can bison really bear Akuma?
During my last session. I played an akuma that beat me 26 to 0. Not to say that the player wasn't good, and that Im good myself but studying the battles. Akuma seems to just over power bison in many area's. :(...