-- Weightlifting & Nutrition Thread -- v9.0 Optimized

[denjin]

Thanks, man. Very comforting.

About the uneven biceps:
You can always readjust by lifting more for the 'weaker' arm.

You really need to work out in front of a mirrior, I'm guessing that you're doing things lopsided.

[HeaT]

I've been doing weight training for like 3 months now and my left bicep is more defined than my right bicep. (I am right handed fyi).

Help!!

the human body is not symetrical...i would say ignore it, keep working out, eventually they will come closer to looking alike...

im outi

Roberth

[hn2682]

Hey Magnus. I remembered you mentioned something about Undulating Periodization in the past. Can you just give me a quick recap on what it is? Thanks.

[mr. newbie]

http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html heres a list of exercises you can do that are broken down into separate muscles and equipment. They also give you tips for making a program and keeping up at it.

so i go to http://www.exrx.net/Workouts/Workout1LTA.html and then i choose the first option. i just do exercises for the groups listed right?

[MagnusMadness]

I'm back

what's crackin?

[Soldier Zero]

I'm back

what's crackin?

Not much, thread's been the same, maybe less posts. I haven't come across any new information, but found this article when I did a google search on periodization.

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1298360

Does undulating fall under conjugate? or are they completely different from one another?

[DaemoN_]

Anybody now where I can learn about natural/hormonal height gains.I'm trying to get as tall as possible before I start any weight lifting.For now I just run/swim and the occasional pushups and situps. Im 16 around 150 and 6'2

[kainzero]

Anybody now where I can learn about natural/hormonal height gains.I'm trying to get as tall as possible before I start any weight lifting.
it's bullshit.

a lot of pro basketball players weight trained when they were in HS, and i doubt they'd all be 7-8 feet if they didn't lift.

i think what's important is that you get enough sleep, i remember hearing that sleep is essential to GH production, and lack of sleep cuts that off and limits your growth.

[300 lb Eugene]

I've been doing weight training for like 3 months now and my left bicep is more defined than my right bicep.



???????
:wonder: :wonder: :wonder: :wonder: :wonder: :wonder: :wonder:

[b00mshakalaka]

What the hell is this now? Mens Fitness Magazine?

[karate_ghost]

hello ppl of fitness, lay down your answer of wisdom!

well, im an alright kind of guy. i used to be a skiny toothpick, but know im getting kind of big( not a girl, ppl). my shape is cool cause i stay toned like all the time, which i dont get. but my love handles are chunky. arent love handles your sides? anyway, how can i get rid of this and get more toned up body-wise? and whats a good exercise for my arms? i do crunches wit 10lbs, but can i do better wit the exercise?
holla.

[Ryad]

did you try running? any cardio should do...

[karate_ghost]

yah. i walk like everyday 1) to work, 2) to the lbrary, to the store..... i practically walk all the time! i just dont know any exercise for the glove handles!

[HeaT]

yah. i walk like everyday 1) to work, 2) to the lbrary, to the store..... i practically walk all the time! i just dont know any exercise for the glove handles!

he said running, not walking, try running, and change your diet a little bit, cut back on foods that are not necessary...there are not specific weightlifting exercises to get rid of fat...

im outi

Roberth

[Ryad]

basically, you can exercise the obliques/abs all you want... but the love handles are fat... and you are either ingesting too much food/too much fatty foods, or not expending enough energy... so either cut back on food or make your exercises more intense... when you do clear up the fat though, a good exercise for the obliques are weighted side bends...

[MagnusMadness]

Not much, thread's been the same, maybe less posts. I haven't come across any new information, but found this article when I did a google search on periodization.

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1298360

Does undulating fall under conjugate? or are they completely different from one another?

undulating is a form of periodization that can be applied to either training templates, either conjugate or concurrent...

[terracotta]

damn.. i gained 9 pounds since last week.

i feel should good :smile:. except i'm spending twice as much on food as i did two weeks ago :sad:. budget constraint ftl.

how do you guys load up on protein/etc without going broke?

[BEEFCAKE]

chicken breasts are pretty cheap
non fat cottage cheese (before bed)
non fat milk
stone cut oats
egg whites
steaks
beans (lentel/kidney etc)
fish (canned tuna in water only)
and the all mighty protein shake (I use ON Whey)
I know Im forgetting alot but those are what I usually eat not including fruits etc
At first I wasn't into brown rice, but Im all over the stuff now.

If theirs a Cost co around your area, go buy your food there, you will save $$$, but yeah clean bulking is somewhat costly if you want to do it right with good foods/fats an not just burgers etc.

[Ryad]

Do you buy egg whites?
I am eating 3 whole eggs (yolk and white) every morning amongst other things... probably not too healthy...

[BEEFCAKE]

Do you buy egg whites?
I am eating 3 whole eggs (yolk and white) every morning amongst other things... probably not too healthy...

Yeah I do, the same folk that make the No Yolk eggs, make an all egg white product too.

[karate_ghost]

he said running, not walking, try running, and change your diet a little bit, cut back on foods that are not necessary...there are not specific weightlifting exercises to get rid of fat...

im outi

Roberth

alright. i'll get more intense wit the exersices.

[Soldier Zero]

Quick question.

After lifting, I drink a protein shake and gatorade (for the sugars). After a run, what am I suppose to drink?

[terracotta]

fernando's: thanks for the list :smile:

i just tried chicken breast recently and for the taste it's definitely worth the price. tuna in water/brine is still cheaper though.

no kidding.. you can buy just egg whites? how's it packaged? (is it just an egg with no yolk?)

[MagnusMadness]

Quick question.

After lifting, I drink a protein shake and gatorade (for the sugars). After a run, what am I suppose to drink?

First off, go buy some maltodextrin and/or some dextrose..(it's not expensive, prolly cheaper in the long haul than a big gatorade every time you work out) and mix that with ur protein shakes instead of drinking gatorade. (the sugar in gatorade is high fructose corn syrup IIRC, not very good for you)

After a run? Well depending on how intense the running was (aerobic or anaerobic or both) you might need a protein shake...it couldn't hurt at least. I probably wouldn't spike my insulin honestly....considering it isn't completely necessary PWO, I wouldn't bother taking in the sugars after a run. If you find yourself spiking ur insulin levels constantly it's possible to develop poor insulin sensitivity. (bad)

Just my opinion.

[RoboGem II]

Basically, I've found a way to rapidly increase my metabolism and I've been losing half to a whole pound a day since I started.

First, I started purchasing a mens multi mega vitamin from the GNC (health store) as well as omega oil caplets. Taking these every morning, I found that it didn't do so much. Then, I started drinking coffee every morning, having no breakfast until 1 hour after I woke up, being told that my body doesn't actually start to burn energy, and breakfast stores a lot of fat until one hour after waking up. Combine it with antidepressants that supress my hunger a bit. Later on, I started taking vitamin B to get a further energy boost in the morning.

I work at Kal Tire as a tire installer, oil changer, and all that, doing a decent amount of hard work, nothing as difficult as a construction worker, but I'm on my feet all day. I find myself eating smaller meals, and to be quite honest, while I'm working, I do drink a pop or two a day usually, but I'm not drinking that stuff anymore while I'm not working. There are a couple of days during all this so far while I ate a slice of pizza and I still lost a bunch of weight. I drink quite a bit of water too, at least 1.5 litres a day or so. (Just a cup or two under half a gallon).

At night, I have either a little snack or nothing at all.

I used to be 209 pounds, and now I find myself at 200. My body frame to be in good shape without having a lot of fat would be ok at 180 pounds or so. I don't feel sick, and I've been told its unhealthy to lose too much weight too fast. But I'm still eating junk like chips and pop sometime too, as well as healthier food choices. I still intake about 2500 calories a day or so, maybe a bit more on other days.

SO uhm, do you guys feel I should keep on going this route with semi-healthy eating, taking vitamins and shit in the morning, drinking my morning coffee, eating an hour after waking up, eating small meals often and indulging in an unhealthy snack every day or second day or so, and not eating at night?

I was told that losing too much weight too fast is unhealthy, I don't know.

I feel myself getting a little stronger too, though it could be just easier for me to lift stuff and exercize (like do push ups) since I'm losing less body weight too.

[TheIlluminati]

SO uhm, do you guys feel I should keep on going this route with semi-healthy eating, taking vitamins and shit in the morning, drinking my morning coffee, eating an hour after waking up, eating small meals often and indulging in an unhealthy snack every day or second day or so, and not eating at night?

Smaller meals xx water xx healthy eating is the basic combo. Congrats man. 2500 calories won't kill anybody. Keep (compound) weight training, throw in cardio.


I've never taken a vitamin myself, though. Do you find it helps considerably?

[Soldier Zero]

First off, go buy some maltodextrin and/or some dextrose..(it's not expensive, prolly cheaper in the long haul than a big gatorade every time you work out) and mix that with ur protein shakes instead of drinking gatorade. (the sugar in gatorade is high fructose corn syrup IIRC, not very good for you)

After a run? Well depending on how intense the running was (aerobic or anaerobic or both) you might need a protein shake...it couldn't hurt at least. I probably wouldn't spike my insulin honestly....considering it isn't completely necessary PWO, I wouldn't bother taking in the sugars after a run. If you find yourself spiking ur insulin levels constantly it's possible to develop poor insulin sensitivity. (bad)

Just my opinion.

Yeah, I know about the sugars, just haven't done anything about it yet. :sweat:
I think I'll do 1/2 a scoop of whey after I run, it's probably gonna be HIIT, thanks man.

How's work anyways?


snip

Sounds alright, don't get too hooked on supplements than regular food though. It's better getting the nutrients you need from real foods as a primary source than supps.

Anyone take Centrum? Was considering it since my mom always keeps it around the house. I don't see the harm in getting extra vitamins.


I've never taken a vitamin myself, though. Do you find it helps considerably?

From what I remember reading, vitamins are coenzymes (or cofactors, I forget) that help support and maintain your muscles.

[Ryad]

Dont take my words too heavily but this is what I think:
If you are trying to gain weight, you are probably eating 4-6 times a day. Hopefully, including vegetables and fruit as your main source of carbs (fibre based and produces a low insulin repsonse, not to mention and the nutrients and useful fat they contain, and the antioxidants in others) and the occasional not so useful stuff like rice, pasta etc...(which your going to try to eat only after exercising).
If you are doing this, chances are you probably getting most of the vitamins and nutrients you need. Ofcourse that is assuming you are eating healthy and the protein shake constitutes 1 or max 2 meals of the day.

If you are trying to lose weight, then depending on how much you are cutting back and how small your meals are, supplements would probably be a good thing.

Dont take too much. If you dont pass the daily recommended its all good. Other studies I read actually shows the daily recommendation shown on the label is actually too low and is not suitable for people working out/exercising, so you can pass that a bit.

In the end though, I would say find some natural foods that you like that contain all the essential nutrients that you need, and incorporate that into your diet. It is believed that although isolated nutrients do work to a certain extent, it is not the same as getting it from its natural source. They think its due to the fact that the natural source may contain other co-factors that help in the absorption or effect of the essential nutrient. So skip the multi-vitamin and, instead, eat an extra few servings of fruits and veggies each day because no pill will come close to the benefits of fruits and veggies.

Edit:
Having said that, if you guys arent eating a lot of fish (chances are you arent) you must get this pill:
Omega 3 Fish Oil Capsules:
They are rich in a specific group of fatty acids (omega 3 fatty acids) that are commonly missing in most diets. When added to the diet, these fats (especially the DHA and EPA components) have been shown to improve insulin sensitivity in muscle cells while decreasing it in fat cells. As a result, nutrients are most likely to be shunted toward muscle instead of adipose tissue. In addition to improved carbohydrate storage, fish oil may improve the efficiency of protein storage, increase metabolic rate, and increase lean mass.

On top of the aforementioned benefits, fish oil also can improve one’s health profile including reducing cardiovascular disease risk, cancer risk, and diabetes risk. Be sure the oil comes from one of the following fish (or a combination of both): salmon, sardine, anchovy, or menhaden. Why these fish? All the aforementioned fish are rich in DHA and EPA, the fats most often associated with all the benefits discussed above.
Note: cod liver oil does not count – you’re looking for EPA and DHA rich marine oils.
Also make sure the fish oil that you buy is concentrated to between 30 and 60%. Therefore you should see 300-600mg of combined EPA and DHA per 1000mg of oil.

[kainzero]

Anyone take Centrum? Was considering it since my mom always keeps it around the house. I don't see the harm in getting extra vitamins.I take Costco brand. It's okay, it doesn't seem to help that much. It helped me get much better sleep, or at least, real dreamy sleep.

The only real bad thing I heard about multivitamins is if it contains iron. Mine does. That's probably why I don't take it every day. I think we get enough iron as it is and you don't want to get iron poisoning.


First off, go buy some maltodextrin and/or some dextrose..(it's not expensive, prolly cheaper in the long haul than a big gatorade every time you work out) and mix that with ur protein shakes instead of drinking gatorade. (the sugar in gatorade is high fructose corn syrup IIRC, not very good for you)You can buy also buy Gatorade powder (sucrose and dextrose) and just mix that in your shake. Here's a link that I found that explains it.
http://ericcressey.blogspot.com/2007/03/is-this-gatorade.html

[maxx]

sooo apparently i might be too skinny. I never saw myself as too skinny or unhealthy...i'm thin but not anorexic thin. I eat everything under the sun and eat about 4-5 times a day when i can..mostly snacks and frozen dinners. I weigh about 147 and i'm 5'8..nothing seemed too crazy. I do martial arts 3-4 times a week and do 200 crunches everyother night. But i felt really hungry today which was kinda odd, since i ate like 3 times today four now. So on the scale it says i'm 147..it measures body fat as well and tells me i'm 9.7% body fat. my moms a nurse and tells me thats too unhealthy...i never felt like i was unhealthy at all. I mean sure i eat alot of junk food but man if i'm not getting fat from that i dunno wuts up.

[HeaT]

sooo apparently i might be too skinny. I never saw myself as too skinny or unhealthy...i'm thin but not anorexic thin. I eat everything under the sun and eat about 4-5 times a day when i can..mostly snacks and frozen dinners. I weigh about 147 and i'm 5'8..nothing seemed too crazy. I do martial arts 3-4 times a week and do 200 crunches everyother night. But i felt really hungry today which was kinda odd, since i ate like 3 times today four now. So on the scale it says i'm 147..it measures body fat as well and tells me i'm 9.7% body fat. my moms a nurse and tells me thats too unhealthy...i never felt like i was unhealthy at all. I mean sure i eat alot of junk food but man if i'm not getting fat from that i dunno wuts up.

no offense yo but for being a nurse your mom is fucking stupid...she should seek another profession...haha...do not trust bodyfat percentages on weight scales that is shady, but you are not too skinny at all...

im outi

Roberth

[maxx]

no offense yo but for being a nurse your mom is fucking stupid...she should seek another profession...haha...do not trust bodyfat percentages on weight scales that is shady, but you are not too skinny at all...

im outi

Roberth

ya i kinda figured that not to trust electronic scales. but wasn't too sure cause she's the nurse n shit. Like i heard bruce lee was 10 percent body fat and me being 9.7 didnt add up in my head. Cause i'm nothing like that body type.

[HeaT]

ya i kinda figured that not to trust electronic scales. but wasn't too sure cause she's the nurse n shit. Like i heard bruce lee was 10 percent body fat and me being 9.7 didnt add up in my head. Cause i'm nothing like that body type.

im pretty sure his bodyfat was lower than that...in this picture...http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p203/heatfury/apartment006-1.jpg

im at 138 lbs and around 10% bodyfat, and he was more jacked than i am...also i am 5'8 as well so according to your mom im too skinny...

anyway, do not listen to your mom...if you want to test her ask her what you should weigh at you height given your activity level...then ask her where bodyfat percentage comes into play in her "observation"...

im outi

Roberth

[bill_rizer]

Bruce lee was skinny, I think he weighed around 140lbs, his idea was too much weight would slow you down, which is true.

Some how he had figured out the perfect balance between speed and power like a super sayian level 2.

Also stop doing 200 crunches that shit anit doing nothing but breaking your back discs.

What you need to start doing is weighted crunches, you should be only able to do 15 or less each set before it hurts.

Also try holding the crunch postion for 2 or 3 seconds so you feel it.

Ive been doing this for awhile and my abs are starting to show up more and more.

[Soldier Zero]

Bruce Lee was a beast, I read his info on wikipedia and it's crazy.

[thumbs_up]

Hey all , I got just few questions about my training routine im 6.2 and about 175 pounds ive been going to the gym for awhile and i dont seem to be getting bigger.
My basic routine is to go about 2 or 3 times a week and around 3 exercises for each body part.

Like day one il do chest , shoulders , triceps in that order then day two il do back and biceps and maybe trapezius then day 3 (optional) il do legs (all) and abs
and for each day I sometimes and forearms exercises.

For the exercises I do 3 sets of really heavy 6-8 times. for example
benchpress il strech and start off with 110pounds(one 44 plus a 11 on each side) 8 to 10 times (2min pause) then add 22pds 8-10 pause and finish with 154 pounds (one 44 plus a 33 on each side) about 5 to 8 times (usually 5...) is this ok?

Any tips would be great ...Help me out if you can thanks!

[Soldier Zero]

Hey all , I got just few questions about my training routine im 6.2 and about 175 pounds ive been going to the gym for awhile and i dont seem to be getting bigger.
My basic routine is to go about 2 or 3 times a week and around 3 exercises for each body part.

Like day one il do chest , shoulders , triceps in that order then day two il do back and biceps and maybe trapezius then day 3 (optional) il do legs (all) and abs
and for each day I sometimes and forearms exercises.

For the exercises I do 3 sets of really heavy 6-8 times. for example
benchpress il strech and start off with 110pounds(one 44 plus a 11 on each side) 8 to 10 times (2min pause) then add 22pds 8-10 pause and finish with 154 pounds (one 44 plus a 33 on each side) about 5 to 8 times (usually 5...) is this ok?

Any tips would be great ...Help me out if you can thanks!

If you want to get bigger, try undulating periodization.

[Ryad]

Hey all , I got just few questions about my training routine im 6.2 and about 175 pounds ive been going to the gym for awhile and i dont seem to be getting bigger.
My basic routine is to go about 2 or 3 times a week and around 3 exercises for each body part.

Like day one il do chest , shoulders , triceps in that order then day two il do back and biceps and maybe trapezius then day 3 (optional) il do legs (all) and abs
and for each day I sometimes and forearms exercises.

For the exercises I do 3 sets of really heavy 6-8 times. for example
benchpress il strech and start off with 110pounds(one 44 plus a 11 on each side) 8 to 10 times (2min pause) then add 22pds 8-10 pause and finish with 154 pounds (one 44 plus a 33 on each side) about 5 to 8 times (usually 5...) is this ok?

Any tips would be great ...Help me out if you can thanks!

how long have you been working out?

[maxx]

Bruce lee was skinny, I think he weighed around 140lbs, his idea was too much weight would slow you down, which is true.

Some how he had figured out the perfect balance between speed and power like a super sayian level 2.

Also stop doing 200 crunches that shit anit doing nothing but breaking your back discs.

What you need to start doing is weighted crunches, you should be only able to do 15 or less each set before it hurts.

Also try holding the crunch postion for 2 or 3 seconds so you feel it.

Ive been doing this for awhile and my abs are starting to show up more and more.

my system of crunches works for me. Cause i know it's working. Also i'm not doing the crunches because i wanna see abs...i know thats a food thing and well..i'm not changing my diet..i'm too lazy. Its more for martial arts reasons to lift my legs for certain aerial maneuvers.

[Ryad]

gymnastics > any ab work out

nothing works the core like gymnastics...
not only is it far more effective, but it is far more functional too...
but it takes a shit load of effort, time to be get there and money for the equipment...
with all the ab workouts people do... get them to try an L-hold... it will cripple most people...

Edit: Gymnastics includes breakdancing, capoeira etc...

[BEEFCAKE]

Hey all , I got just few questions about my training routine im 6.2 and about 175 pounds ive been going to the gym for awhile and i dont seem to be getting bigger.
My basic routine is to go about 2 or 3 times a week and around 3 exercises for each body part.

Like day one il do chest , shoulders , triceps in that order then day two il do back and biceps and maybe trapezius then day 3 (optional) il do legs (all) and abs
and for each day I sometimes and forearms exercises.

For the exercises I do 3 sets of really heavy 6-8 times. for example
benchpress il strech and start off with 110pounds(one 44 plus a 11 on each side) 8 to 10 times (2min pause) then add 22pds 8-10 pause and finish with 154 pounds (one 44 plus a 33 on each side) about 5 to 8 times (usually 5...) is this ok?

Any tips would be great ...Help me out if you can thanks!

Eat, eat, eat, eat, your body wont grow if you don't eat, imagine straining your muscles but then not having anything to replenish what you expended in your workout. I realise you might want to stay lean, but thats why most lifters bulk then cut. You can do a clean bulk like I am and minimize fat gain, while incorporating a LIGHT cardio schedule of about 15-20 every other day.
I hardly ever worked crunches on their own, I would always contract my core when I would do an excercise an the next day I would be sore as hell in the stomach area, Im curious to see how my middle area would look if I were to cut, before I started my bulk about 2 months ago, you could see the shape of my abs, now its hardly there but Im somehwat relieved I still have a 34-35 inch waiste.

btw
off topic but, deadlifts=own me

[maxx]

gymnastics > any ab work out

nothing works the core like gymnastics...
not only is it far more effective, but it is far more functional too...
but it takes a shit load of effort, time to be get there and money for the equipment...
with all the ab workouts people do... get them to try an L-hold... it will cripple most people...

Edit: Gymnastics includes breakdancing, capoeira etc...

lol except that gymnasics includes ab workouts before and after class. So your theory makes no sense..ab workouts go hand in hand with gymnastics. Also an l-kick is less abs and more arms and balance, i've been doing those long before i even got into gymnastics and breaking as serious as i am now.

i think you mean breakdancing and capoeira include gymnastics..its not the otherway around.

but the stuff i do is more kick oriented...though it does include some gymnastics
this is my teacher:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kc7rH8SJ_js

[MagnusMadness]

the hip flexors lift ur legs....not ur abs. The rectus abdominus only tilts the pelvis posteriorly allowing the hip flexors to function more efficiently.

The core musculature acts only to stabilize the spine and/or flex/extend ur trunk.

Want a strong core? Lift heavy and use freeweights. I am living proof.

[maxx]

the hip flexors lift ur legs....not ur abs. The rectus abdominus only tilts the pelvis posteriorly allowing the hip flexors to function more efficiently.

The core musculature acts only to stabilize the spine and/or flex/extend ur trunk.

Want a strong core? Lift heavy and use freeweights. I am living proof.

their are certain moves that deal with abs...such as this move which i am useing my abs for its called a doubleleg, it comes out of capoeira.

http://www.club540.com/tricktionary/doubleleg.mpg

martial arts has never really about lifting heavy weights, alot of the people i deal with dont really deal with weights and just repitition and practice.

[Ryad]

lol except that gymnasics includes ab workouts before and after class. So your theory makes no sense..ab workouts go hand in hand with gymnastics. Also an l-kick is less abs and more arms and balance, i've been doing those long before i even got into gymnastics and breaking as serious as i am now.

i think you mean breakdancing and capoeira include gymnastics..its not the otherway around.

but the stuff i do is more kick oriented...though it does include some gymnastics
this is my teacher:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kc7rH8SJ_js

yes, i meant high level gymanstics, capoeira etc... the line blurs but they all involve a strong core to stablilize the body... and yes, i was over generalizing
if all you do is isolated ab workouts its useless, you need to build up on that... you'll just look good...

magnus madness define strong core? being able to lift the most weights while doing a sit up/hyperextension for example?

btw maxx, i got forbidden on that second link
your teacher has excellent form... but I am not that big into flashy kicks etc... though it is an good indication of certain fitness traits...

[thumbs_up]

yeah i try and eat all the time but what I really want is gain a lot then cut..im just gaining muscle..and is it okay to have long days off like monday chest then the next monday chest or is that too far apart? and cardio , i want to gain not lose but should I be doing anyway ? cause I dont....and ive been training for about 6 or 7 months

[Soldier Zero]

but the stuff i do is more kick oriented...though it does include some gymnastics
this is my teacher:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kc7rH8SJ_js

Beastly, more than anything I could do. :sweat:

I don't think I tighten my abs enough when I do deadlifts and squats; better start changing that.

[Ryad]

Beastly, more than anything I could do. :sweat:

I don't think I tighten my abs enough when I do deadlifts and squats; better start changing that.

yeah same here... i need to focus more on that...

[Green]

Beastly, more than anything I could do. :sweat:

I don't think I tighten my abs enough when I do deadlifts and squats; better start changing that.
Make sure you squeeze your sphincter for squats, too. You don't want to end up on rotten.com.

[Truong]

Not sure if these vids were posted before in this thread, but Olympic lifting is truly fucking beastly.
Some clips:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVB_rQFSsEg 3 times Gold medal winner Dimas training, and casually tossing 300-400+ pounds. At a body weight of 180ish pounds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3E_LHqaNMQ Dimas Clean and Jerking 215KG (474 pounds) at 2000 Olympic games. Fucking insane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CIooz--atY and this vid, because it's just sick.

[MagnusMadness]

Not sure if these vids were posted before in this thread, but Olympic lifting is truly fucking beastly.
Some clips:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVB_rQFSsEg 3 times Gold medal winner Dimas training, and casually tossing 300-400+ pounds. At a body weight of 180ish pounds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3E_LHqaNMQ Dimas Clean and Jerking 215KG (474 pounds) at 2000 Olympic games. Fucking insane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CIooz--atY and this vid, because it's just sick.

dimas is the man. Alot of strong guys couldn't even pick up 450+ let alone clean and jerk it.

[HeaT]

Not sure if these vids were posted before in this thread, but Olympic lifting is truly fucking beastly.
Some clips:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVB_rQFSsEg 3 times Gold medal winner Dimas training, and casually tossing 300-400+ pounds. At a body weight of 180ish pounds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3E_LHqaNMQ Dimas Clean and Jerking 215KG (474 pounds) at 2000 Olympic games. Fucking insane.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CIooz--atY and this vid, because it's just sick.

fucking amazing...

im outi

Roberth

[Ryad]

beaslty

[kz0060]

Hey guys I got a question. I started going back into the gym for the first time after like 6 months. I decided to do biceps and I think I may have pushed myself a bit too much. The day after my arms are feeling like shit. I gotta keep my arms bent. It's painful trying to straighten my arms out. When I do it feels like my muscles gonna like tear. It's been two days since I gone to the gym and it hasn't gone away. Is this a serious prob and should I have this checked out? Or is this gonna heal after time?

[terracotta]

eat more. like you said, it's been a while.. you're gonna have to up your protein intake from now if you don't want it to hurt next workout. eat more and it'll recover sooner.

[HeaT]

Hey guys I got a question. I started going back into the gym for the first time after like 6 months. I decided to do biceps and I think I may have pushed myself a bit too much. The day after my arms are feeling like shit. I gotta keep my arms bent. It's painful trying to straighten my arms out. When I do it feels like my muscles gonna like tear. It's been two days since I gone to the gym and it hasn't gone away. Is this a serious prob and should I have this checked out? Or is this gonna heal after time?

you will be ok, give it 5 days...

im outi

Roberth

[Soldier Zero]

Hey guys I got a question. I started going back into the gym for the first time after like 6 months. I decided to do biceps and I think I may have pushed myself a bit too much. The day after my arms are feeling like shit. I gotta keep my arms bent. It's painful trying to straighten my arms out. When I do it feels like my muscles gonna like tear. It's been two days since I gone to the gym and it hasn't gone away. Is this a serious prob and should I have this checked out? Or is this gonna heal after time?

It's a build up of lactic acid in your muscles. Give it a few more days and you'll be back to normal.

[kz0060]

thanks for the responses guys. I'm a lot less concerned now.

[#8 with Hate]

what's the most efficient way to work on your abs and your arms ? also any1 know what the "ideal" weight is for some1 who is 6'3 lol ?

[Soldier Zero]

what's the most efficient way to work on your abs and your arms ? also any1 know what the "ideal" weight is for some1 who is 6'3 lol ?

There's a whole variety for arms. Abs you can do weighted crunches or bicycle-esque style which is you pull on knee and opposite elbow together then switch; squats and deadlifts work your core pretty hard too though.

I don't believe in that ideal weight crap. I'm suppose to be 157 lbs for 5'8" 1/2 and I'm 160, but I still look thin.

http://www.prosource.net/calculators.jsp

That thing says you should be 196.

Anyone else think the BMI (body mass index) is a load of crap?

[Ryad]

I dont think ideal BMI takes into consideration muscles mass...
I guess its an ok measure for those that arent working out... but for those that have been working out for a while, you will almost always be considered overweight, since you will have more muscle (muscle heavier than fat).
So, I dont know. For me, I ask myself, how strong do I want to be? not how big do I want to be. Then when i reach this goal, I will retain that strength while I work on my cardio. Its up to you where you want to strike your balance... I dont think anything is ideal per se, but perhaps ideal for a certain goal or specific sport.

[terracotta]

like Ryad said BMI, doesn't account for the mass/fat/water composition. though, i hear in some countries (e.g. Australia) you can't get into the armed forces if your BMI is above a certain level. a recruiter told how there was this one huge rugby player who had excellent cardiovascular, but could only get in after an appeals process since his BMI was sitting on 30.

===

anyone got any good bodyweight exercises a guy could try? i'm trying to develop more of a gymnast's physique, but i don't have access to equipment.

one thing i do have is a dip and chin up station (like this (http://www.gun3.com/resources/net.mage.prevalent.potion.products.Product/picture/%5Bjava.lang.Integer:2:92%5D.jpg)), but i can't think of anything new to do with it other than weighted dips/chin ups.

only thing i can name which i haven't done is planches (http://www.beastskills.com/straddle%20planche.JPG).. mainly cause they've been damn difficult so far.

holy shit, this guy's setup is beast..
http://www.beastskills.com/basement%20lever2.jpg

[Soldier Zero]

anyone got any good bodyweight exercises a guy could try? i'm trying to develop more of a gymnast's physique, but i don't have access to equipment.

one thing i do have is a dip and chin up station (like this (http://www.gun3.com/resources/net.mage.prevalent.potion.products.Product/picture/%5Bjava.lang.Integer:2:92%5D.jpg)), but i can't think of anything new to do with it other than weighted dips/chin ups.

only thing i can name which i haven't done is planches (http://www.beastskills.com/straddle%20planche.JPG).. mainly cause they've been damn difficult so far.

holy shit, this guy's setup is beast..
http://www.beastskills.com/basement%20lever2.jpg

During dips if you tilt inwards, your chest gets a bit of a workout.

Small arm circles work your shoulders which can be done in a number of positions such as having them straight up like you're touching the sky, forward like you were reaching for something in front of you, or straight out to your sides.

3-point push ups for your chest. You hold yourself 2 seconds at the top, go down halfway and hold yourself for 2 seconds, down to the bottom and hold again for 2 seconds, back up at the middle hold for 2 seconds, and finally back to the top; that's 1 rep.

Hyperextensions for you lower back if you a bench or something like one.

Weightless squats wouldn't hurt.

Shoulder pushups if you can do those.


I'm sure there are more, that's what I can think of at the moment.

[HeaT]

dips is a chest/tricept workout regardless of how you do them...

if you want to build a gymnast's physic you have to workout hardcore haha...as in lift weights...

im outi

Roberth

[terracotta]

i'll give those a shot, though maybe not the 3-point pushups since i'd be doing too many. shoulder push-ups look interesting.

as for dips: if you tilt inwards they work your chest, if you remain upright they hit the triceps more. supposedly there are a ton of ways to do dips i'm not aware of :S

that's the funny thing.. i think there one experiment where they took gymnasts who never touched a weight in their life. they checked how much they could bench/squat/deadlift, and all results were well above average (e.g. at least bodyweight for a good number of reps).

thing i really like about the gymnast's physique is it's functional as well as asthetically appealing. it'd take mad work to maintain though.

[Ryad]

wow awesome... you a dip/pull up set up... i've always wanted one of those

try doing muscle-ups/handstands/handstand presses/pirouette/l-hold

[maxx]

like Ryad said BMI, doesn't account for the mass/fat/water composition. though, i hear in some countries (e.g. Australia) you can't get into the armed forces if your BMI is above a certain level. a recruiter told how there was this one huge rugby player who had excellent cardiovascular, but could only get in after an appeals process since his BMI was sitting on 30.

===

anyone got any good bodyweight exercises a guy could try? i'm trying to develop more of a gymnast's physique, but i don't have access to equipment.

one thing i do have is a dip and chin up station (like this (http://www.gun3.com/resources/net.mage.prevalent.potion.products.Product/picture/%5Bjava.lang.Integer:2:92%5D.jpg)), but i can't think of anything new to do with it other than weighted dips/chin ups.

only thing i can name which i haven't done is planches (http://www.beastskills.com/straddle%20planche.JPG).. mainly cause they've been damn difficult so far.

holy shit, this guy's setup is beast..
http://www.beastskills.com/basement%20lever2.jpg

i dont find planches that hard to do..just hard to hold. I can lift my own weight i think cause i can do planches to handstands...i'm working on doing planch push-ups i can do 2-3 at most right now. But really it seems like more practice and getting used to it than anything else. I'm doing them for breakdancing so i can do bboy freezes.

[HeaT]

i'll give those a shot, though maybe not the 3-point pushups since i'd be doing too many. shoulder push-ups look interesting.

as for dips: if you tilt inwards they work your chest, if you remain upright they hit the triceps more. supposedly there are a ton of ways to do dips i'm not aware of :S

that's the funny thing.. i think there one experiment where they took gymnasts who never touched a weight in their life. they checked how much they could bench/squat/deadlift, and all results were well above average (e.g. at least bodyweight for a good number of reps).

thing i really like about the gymnast's physique is it's functional as well as asthetically appealing. it'd take mad work to maintain though.

i need hard evidence of this "experiment" if you are a male gymnist it is in your regiment to lift weights, you dont get around it...

im outi

Roberth

[sonny8988]

So I decided to do an upper/lower 4 day split for the summer. But I have a few question about the lower excerises.

What is the difference between romanian deadlifts and deadlifts?

Right now Im doing pretty light on squats but it still kinda hurts on where the bar rest on my back, will i get used to this or will it just hurt more when i start adding more weight? Is there anything i can do about this?

[Soldier Zero]

Right now Im doing pretty light on squats but it still kinda hurts on where the bar rest on my back, will i get used to this or will it just hurt more when i start adding more weight? Is there anything i can do about this?

You'll get use to it. Don't increase weight too rapidly cause you may hurt yourself.

[HeaT]

So I decided to do an upper/lower 4 day split for the summer. But I have a few question about the lower excerises.

What is the difference between romanian deadlifts and deadlifts?

Right now Im doing pretty light on squats but it still kinda hurts on where the bar rest on my back, will i get used to this or will it just hurt more when i start adding more weight? Is there anything i can do about this?

the difference is romanian deadlifts are a different variation of a stiff leg deadlift which primarly works your lower back and hamstrings...the regular deadlift primarily works lower back and quads...

im outi

Roberth

[Soldier Zero]

Anyone do front squats regularly? I been thinking about replacing my full squats (ATG) with those. I was wondering if the weight should be a bit less since I'd have to balance it more than usual.

[HeaT]

Anyone do front squats regularly? I been thinking about replacing my full squats (ATG) with those. I was wondering if the weight should be a bit less since I'd have to balance it more than usual.

ya i do front squats regularly, and ya the weight should be a LOT less imo...i do about 30-40% less weight on front squats than i do on normal squats...

im outi

Roberth

[terracotta]

i need hard evidence of this "experiment" if you are a male gymnist it is in your regiment to lift weights, you dont get around it...

im outi

Roberth

doesn't it make sense? gymnasts do bodyweight exercises all day, with strength AND endurance in mind. the difference is they just swing their bodies around rings or benches. i'm not surprised at all.. workouts like that would give great density as well as size.

[Soldier Zero]

ya i do front squats regularly, and ya the weight should be a LOT less imo...i do about 30-40% less weight on front squats than i do on normal squats...

im outi

Roberth

Guess I'm gonna have to experiment with the weight at first so I don't hurt myself.

[sonny8988]

Ive never done front squats but what are the differences in terms of areas being worked out between front and back squats.

[BEEFCAKE]

Solider Zero or Heat, when do you think its best for me to take my BCAA's? during my lift or before I do my cardio, Im goin to be usin Xtend, to prevent from going catabolic/keepin my gains.

thanks

[Soldier Zero]

Solider Zero or Heat, when do you think its best for me to take my BCAA's? during my lift or before I do my cardio, Im goin to be usin Xtend, to prevent from going catabolic/keepin my gains.

thanks

Eh, depends what you're lifting program is like. If it's a full body or split, I say during that since you would be using more muscle fibers.

I'm not sure about cardio, I haven't really read anything to take before or after it. Magnus mentioned a protein shake afterwards wouldn't hurt.

[Ryad]

For cardio you most likely need some carbs... but you dont want to be full before you run...
oatmeal and a glass of OJ half an hour before running works for me...

[kainzero]

Ive never done front squats but what are the differences in terms of areas being worked out between front and back squats.
front squats work the quads much more.
back squats (depending on how wide you do them) involve more of your hamstrings and glutes. plus you can use your lower back to cheat a little.

were i to start over, i'd probably learn front squats first since it teaches better form. if you try to cheat and bend at the lower back, the weight will fall so you can't really do it. transition into back squats whenever you feel like it, they're all good anyway.

[BEEFCAKE]

Front squats as in sissy squats (thats what their reffered to)?
The ones where you hold the bar across your chest and cross your arms over one another just below your chin?

Ive never tried those, just stuck to the traditional squat.

[Soldier Zero]

^Basically, bar rests on the front of your shoulders.

Takes a lot more balance.

[Amazed]

I started going back into the gym for the first time after like 6 months

it's about time!

[kz0060]

it's about time!

You're never in #srkgd anymoar:sad:

Also, may someone tell me the most effective exercises working the triceps using dumbells?

[VruS]

You're never in #srkgd anymoar:sad:

Also, may someone tell me the most effective exercises working the triceps using dumbells?

i find kick backs are the most intensive tricep exercise for me.

[Ryad]

skull crushers work too

[Soldier Zero]

Was gonna post this website up (originally posted by Magnus), but it's been hacked. :rolleyes:

http://www.bsu.edu/webapps2/strengthlab/

[HeaT]

You're never in #srkgd anymoar:sad:

Also, may someone tell me the most effective exercises working the triceps using dumbells?

here is what you can do with a dumbell(s)...

one arm overhead extensions
two armed overhead extensions
skull crushers (you can do a hammer curl grip or a normal skull crusher grip)
one arm tricept kickbacks
two armed tricept kickbacks

im outi

Roberth

[kz0060]

Thanks you guys! I'm a give them a try.

[Ryad]

oh yeah... pulley tricep pulldowns too...

[terracotta]

By the way terracotta, how long did it take you to get like that? It took a full year before got 80% to that(no homo).

about a year? hardest part was really the diet.. maintaining the training schedule was tough, but like i said that's 100 minutes a weeks usually.

i'll post just the upper body routine. it's not the world's greatest workout but it works for me with my limited equipment.

MONDAY: triceps/chest
- 2-handed tricep extensions: 5 sets, 6 reps each
- weighted dips (+30% bodyweight): 5 sets, 15 reps each
- 1-handed tricep extensions: 4 sets, 6 reps each
- inclined close-grip pushups: 4 sets, 15 reps each

(i superset the first two and last two)


WEDNESDAY: shoulders
- military presses: 7 sets, 6 reps each
- dumbell shoulder presses: 5 sets, 6 reps each


FRIDAY: biceps/back
- weighted chin-ups (+10% bodyweight): ~25 reps total, as many sets as it takes
- barbell curls: 5 sets, 6 reps each
- weighted chin-ups (+20% bodyweight): ~10 reps total, as many sets as it takes



then just eat the usual (1.5ish grams protein per pound bodyweight per day, low GI carbs, little sugar/salt/fat, drink lots of water, etc). i clean bulk to minimize cardio, so it looks the same all year round lol. i've gotten used to life without fast food/alcohol/cigarettes/drugs... most people won't enjoy that.

weakness of this workout: no deadlifts or bench. bench doesn't bother me so much, but i should really try to squeeze deadlifts in somewhere. don't neglect your legs (squats) either.

[Truong]

Ok, I know I'm late on this thread, but I gotta ask...

To all you guys doing exercises like tricep kickbacks, skullcrushers, dumb bell flies, and about 1000 variations of arm curls.... what are you goalsr when it comes to weightlifting?

Are you guys aspiring bodybuilders? Or do you just want them big arms to impress the ladies? If you're lifting for those 2 reasons, I understand.

But if you guys are lifting to get strong, or lifting to enhance your athletic performance in other sports, you're going about it all wrong with all these useless isolation exercises...

Just thought I'd ask.

[Rhio2k]

My damn local store no longer carries creatine as strictly a powder...they have this fruit punch flavored bs. Is it okay to mix that in with my protein shake (taste doesn't bother me...I gulp it all anyway), or should I take the shake, then the fruit punch creatine?

[Asura]

I don't know if this belongs here but, I' 6'5'' and 220lbs and I feel over weight. What's the fastest and safest way to lose weight?

[The Mullah]

Stop eating badly, worked for me.

what have you eaten so far today?

[Asura]

Stop eating badly, worked for me.

what have you eaten so far today?

Today? I've only had a cup of Yogurt and one poptart. Later on I plan on having some Jambalayah (Rice, Spices and Sausage) and probably some popcorn later on to substitute the potato chip flurry I use to go through.

[TheIlluminati]

Ok, I know I'm late on this thread, but I gotta ask...

To all you guys doing exercises like tricep kickbacks, skullcrushers, dumb bell flies, and about 1000 variations of arm curls.... what are you goalsr when it comes to weightlifting?

Are you guys aspiring bodybuilders? Or do you just want them big arms to impress the ladies? If you're lifting for those 2 reasons, I understand.

But if you guys are lifting to get strong, or lifting to enhance your athletic performance in other sports, you're going about it all wrong with all these useless isolation exercises...

Just thought I'd ask.

I'm not sure what you're talking about. terracotta just posted chinups and military presses, which are certainly are compound, "getting strong" exercises; and the posts before that are about squats.

[The Mullah]

Today? I've only had a cup of Yogurt and one poptart. Later on I plan on having some Jambalayah (Rice, Spices and Sausage) and probably some popcorn later on to substitute the potato chip flurry I use to go through.

That's your problem right there.

firstly you're not eating enough food to get your engine running, secondly, what you are eating is nutritionally defficient, bad for you and generally shit.

Check out the below pictures, i am a bit of a yo yo when it comes to weight. When i'm fat ( 6' 235lbs), it's a result of eating lots of rice, lots of KFC kebabs etc. Generally a lot of everything. Those shots prove i'm not just spouting 'theory', there's a million people who will tell you how to change your physique and they can't actually get in shape themselves. I've been a fat bastard, and now i'm trimming down, this is how i did it:

Those pics were last september. I've dropped to 195 pounds in that bottom picture, taken a few weeks ago. I did that by working out 4 times a week training split, traditional style. Each bodypart once a week, (maybe a pump a couple of days later for fun), in the gym for an hour, 3-4 excercises, 3-4 sets pyramiding up the weight.

My diet for the last couple of months has been lots of chicken breasts in the foreman grill, BROWN RICE AND BREAD and very low carbs after 9 pm. Generally eating a lot more carbs in the morning and lunch, about 200 grams of protein a day. I avoid white rice and bread, makes me fat real quick quick. Weekends i hit the kfc, macdonalds and that sort of thing on a saturday and all you can eat sushi on a sunday. My fat-day on saturday is quite important for me losing fat, perks up my metabolism and refreshes my mind. mm, 3 zinger tower burgers for breakfast!

i don't do cardio, my diet during the week is pretty clean. Kechup is probably the worst thing i eat (i have it with my chicken breasts). If i eat like you do i'd put on weight and lose muscle due to my metabolism slowing down and my muscle requiring more protein than you consume.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d138/themullah/tranform.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d138/themullah/DSCN1910copy.jpg

[SFFanatic]

^Whats he is basically saying is Diet > Workout routine.

Thats what is was from me. I've definately improved since I stopped eating so much junk and started back on the brown rice/chicken breast/fish/waffle/water/no sugary sweet shit routine I've been doing for so long. If I added some cardio and got my ass back in the gym, I'd be looking even better before school starts back up :rofl:

[The Mullah]

^Whats he is basically saying is Diet > Workout routine.

Thats what is was from me. I've definately improved since I stopped eating so much junk and started back on the brown rice/chicken breast/fish/waffle/water/no sugary sweet shit routine I've been doing for so long. If I added some cardio and got my ass back in the gym, I'd be looking even better before school starts back up :rofl:


almost, from my experience, diet (i.e. high protein moderate complex carbs, no sugar (fruits as well) low milk) + bodybuilding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cardio.

[SFFanatic]

It only it was so easy for me. I'm a prominent basketball player, so I got to incorporate some kind of cardio into my schedule. Plus I'm doing the whole Vertical Jump Bible thing for the next 3 months.

[The Mullah]

It only it was so easy for me. I'm a prominent basketball player, so I got to incorporate some kind of cardio into my schedule. Plus I'm doing the whole Vertical Jump Bible thing for the next 3 months.

i don't even know what that is bro, sounds like you're not looking forward to it. :rofl:

i tried doing cardio, but i found it countered my muscle gains, which in turn lowered the amount of fat i burn. So after an initial loss of fat, i just started to lose muscle and lose only very small amounts of fat. So for me, cardio is a one or two week blitz at the end of a long diet. i'm not trying to get down to 4%, i'll be happy with a clean six pac.

[Mr. Bastos]

snip

word on those foreman chicken breasts. that shit is golden. When I move out in a month I definitely need to get my own foreman. but looks like I need to give up my white rice :sad: it sucks being filipino(or any asian for that matter) cuz rice is at every damn meal.

I've made a lot of progress from when I started dieting and exercising late november. I've lost about 60lbs and the other day I bought some size 38 pants. now granted I'm still like 100lbs overweight (I'm 5'6.5" 269lbs) but when I started I was wearing a size 48. I was soo fuckin hyped when I could fit into those pants. the problem is right now the weight loss is gettin a ton harder. Not sure what I should do. I'm definitely not giving up and I expected this to happen sooner or later but damn its annoying. I guess I really need to watch what I eat a lot better.


almost, from my experience, diet (i.e. high protein moderate complex carbs, no sugar (fruits as well) low milk) + bodybuilding >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cardio.

no fruits? damn I like eating bananas as a snack at nights. oh and what counts as a complex carb? guess I need to go to costco and stock up on chicken breats. :tup:

[Ryad]

cardio fitness is very important to other people... and to others being able to run fast/long is not so important...
not just that but keeping your heart healthy and strong has numerous important health benefits...
its up to where you want to draw the balance between strength and cardiovascular/respiratory fitness...
personally I think being super strong (or looking super great) with shit cardio capability is useless... as useless as being skinny and being able to run long distance...

[Soldier Zero]

Looking beastly Mullah, great progress you've made. :tup:

[Truong]

I'm not sure what you're talking about. terracotta just posted chinups and military presses, which are certainly are compound, "getting strong" exercises; and the posts before that are about squats.

Yeah, he did. He also posted about 4 different exercises that works his triceps. And he also has a strict day for "shoulders". Hence, why I asked, because he was doing a large amount of isolation exercises. Like I said, if he was just interested in building a nice looking physique, that's a good way to go about it.

As for getting strong: certainly doing any amount of exercises will get you strong. That's obvious. But when one person's program revolves around strong compound lifts such as overhead presses, squat, deadlifts, bent over rows, cleans, olympic lifts and such, will almost 100% of the time get much stronger than the guy who bases his entire work out on biceps and triceps.

Not knocking on anyone's routines, I was merely helping with people like Kz600 who seems like a novice lifter.

[kz0060]

Ha yeah sorry for asking lot of questions. I'm a mad newb when it comes to lifting. Not really sure what my priorities are right now. I want to gain more volume in muscles but I also equally want constantly increase the amount of weight I can lift. Can those be achieved with the same routine or are they two separate paths?

[SFFanatic]

Ha yeah sorry for asking lot of questions. I'm a mad newb when it comes to lifting. Not really sure what my priorities are right now. I want to gain more volume in muscles but I also equally want constantly increase the amount of weight I can lift. Can those be achieved with the same routine or are they two separate paths?

If I am understanding the question right, I thought they kind go hand in hand. I gradually move up in weight when certain weights are too light for my sets.

[Ryad]

Kz... if you are new to weightlifting, and are thin... I find this program to be a good start
http://www.defrancostraining.com/articles/archive/articles_westside.htm

[kz0060]

If I am understanding the question right, I thought they kind go hand in hand. I gradually move up in weight when certain weights are too light for my sets.

Well i mean like for bigger muscle i think you would go low reps with considerably heavier weights right? But i also just want to lift generally heavier weights than i can right now as quickly as possible. Not like increasing my max. lifting but just overall improving my strength. I wasn't sure if the same approach would be effective. eh' I'm still not sure i made myself clear.

And thanks for link Ryad. To clarify tho i'm not thin:rofl: Iono, I'm just sorta big but I don't look like chubby cuz I'm tall. Cuz of my size ppl expect me to be rather strong but I can't lift much heh.

[Ryad]

ah... i see :lol:
still I do think a workout regimen (like westside) can incorporate both exercises to increase both maximal strength (low reps, high weights) and muscle hypertrophy (high reps, low weights)... and perhaps to increase power (dynamic lifting) for the more advanced lifters...

[YTheLastMan]

Mullah, can you give me a sample of like a week's worth of meals? I definetly need some guidelines and i'm sure others here would appreciate it as well.

I eat pretty healthy but I get almost no protein (meat at dinner, yogurt in the morning and an apple during the day), I eat pasta every day for lunch. I'm 5'7 and a half and I weigh 138 (I used to weigh a ton more). I still have too much body fat for my taste though and i'd like to cut, can I do that without cardio?

[The Mullah]

okay i wake up at 7, grab a protein shake.
get to work and have cereal.
get 2 chicken breasts and half a brown baguette at 1.30, then again at 6.
Then another shake when i get home at 8.30, and maybe a little peanut butter on brown bread before gym.

come back from gym at about 10, have something like steak, chicken breast hardly any carbs. then a shake before bed. maybe snack on some cottage cheese thr4oughout the day.

i eat like that everyday except weekends when i eat lots of shit.

and THANKS soldier zero, those hsowts have flattering light, but yeah i'm making progress. It's all about eating clean, high protein and consistantcy in your workout.

[HeaT]

Mullah, can you give me a sample of like a week's worth of meals? I definetly need some guidelines and i'm sure others here would appreciate it as well.

I eat pretty healthy but I get almost no protein (meat at dinner, yogurt in the morning and an apple during the day), I eat pasta every day for lunch. I'm 5'7 and a half and I weigh 138 (I used to weigh a ton more). I still have too much body fat for my taste though and i'd like to cut, can I do that without cardio?

i think this months issue of mens fitness has a whole week of meals EVERY day planned out...that is hot shit right there...check it out...that is some ideal shit right there...

im outi

Roberth

[Ryad]

oh shit... i have to get my hands on that...
my routine meals are getting a bit boring...
thanks for the heads up

[MagnusMadness]

the difference is romanian deadlifts are a different variation of a stiff leg deadlift which primarly works your lower back and hamstrings...the regular deadlift primarily works lower back and quads...

im outi

Roberth

no, deadlifts, and all it's variants, work the gluteals and hamstrings. They are the primary movers. Your back can take a beating but it's role is only to stabilize the spine during the movement.

[MagnusMadness]

That's your problem right there.

firstly you're not eating enough food to get your engine running, secondly, what you are eating is nutritionally defficient, bad for you and generally shit.

Check out the below pictures, i am a bit of a yo yo when it comes to weight. When i'm fat ( 6' 235lbs), it's a result of eating lots of rice, lots of KFC kebabs etc. Generally a lot of everything. Those shots prove i'm not just spouting 'theory', there's a million people who will tell you how to change your physique and they can't actually get in shape themselves. I've been a fat bastard, and now i'm trimming down, this is how i did it:

Those pics were last september. I've dropped to 195 pounds in that bottom picture, taken a few weeks ago. I did that by working out 4 times a week training split, traditional style. Each bodypart once a week, (maybe a pump a couple of days later for fun), in the gym for an hour, 3-4 excercises, 3-4 sets pyramiding up the weight.

My diet for the last couple of months has been lots of chicken breasts in the foreman grill, BROWN RICE AND BREAD and very low carbs after 9 pm. Generally eating a lot more carbs in the morning and lunch, about 200 grams of protein a day. I avoid white rice and bread, makes me fat real quick quick. Weekends i hit the kfc, macdonalds and that sort of thing on a saturday and all you can eat sushi on a sunday. My fat-day on saturday is quite important for me losing fat, perks up my metabolism and refreshes my mind. mm, 3 zinger tower burgers for breakfast!

i don't do cardio, my diet during the week is pretty clean. Kechup is probably the worst thing i eat (i have it with my chicken breasts). If i eat like you do i'd put on weight and lose muscle due to my metabolism slowing down and my muscle requiring more protein than you consume.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d138/themullah/tranform.jpg

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d138/themullah/DSCN1910copy.jpg

The "spouting off theory" comment was aimed at me I'm sure.

thx

[HeaT]

no, deadlifts, and all it's variants, work the gluteals and hamstrings. They are the primary movers. Your back can take a beating but it's role is only to stabilize the spine during the movement.

he asked for the difference in the 2 deadlifts, and that is the difference, if you dont think that a traditional deadlift does not work your quads you are tripping...the romanian puts a greater emphasis on the hamstring, the traditional puts more emphasis on the quads and not as much on the hamstrings as the romanian...

im outi

Roberth

[Soldier Zero]

Eh, I feel traditional DLs focus more on my hamstrings rather than quads. I try having the majority of the weight on my heels at all times.

Who here uses fish caps? What brand's good? I was considering the ones from Optimum Nutrition and NOW Foods.

[The Mullah]

The "spouting off theory" comment was aimed at me I'm sure.

thx

:looney: not at all, don't be so pessamistic. I have criticised you in the past but i've seen you lift, i respect that. If i wanted to get strong, i would certainly take your advice under consideration. Over 4 plates for deadlift is very heavy. We can't all train and look the same.

[HeaT]

Eh, I feel traditional DLs focus more on my hamstrings rather than quads. I try having the majority of the weight on my heels at all times.

Who here uses fish caps? What brand's good? I was considering the ones from Optimum Nutrition and NOW Foods.

yes it works your hamstring but compared to a romanian deadlift which basically is ALL hamstring and no quad work...the dude asked what the difference was, the difference is the romanian places a much greater emphasis on the hamstrings than does the traditional...and traditional has more quad work...

what is weird about this is i honestly do not feel almost any hamstring work in a deadlift...and i know my form is right because i asked my ex boss if i was doing them correctly...to me a dead lift is like a quarter squat (or somewhere inbetween a quarter/half squat) with more muscles invovled particularly the back and arms...

im outi

Roberth

[Soldier Zero]

yes it works your hamstring but compared to a romanian deadlift which basically is ALL hamstring and no quad work...the dude asked what the difference was, the difference is the romanian places a much greater emphasis on the hamstrings than does the traditional...and traditional has more quad work...

what is weird about this is i honestly do not feel almost any hamstring work in a deadlift...and i know my form is right because i asked my ex boss if i was doing them correctly...to me a dead lift is like a quarter squat (or somewhere inbetween a quarter/half squat) with more muscles invovled particularly the back and arms...

im outi

Roberth

Yeah I get what your saying, for me it's the opposite, I barely feel my quads doing any work. I'm sort of near half squat, maybe a bit lower.

[MagnusMadness]

:looney: not at all, don't be so pessamistic. I have criticised you in the past but i've seen you lift, i respect that. If i wanted to get strong, i would certainly take your advice under consideration. Over 4 plates for deadlift is very heavy. We can't all train and look the same.

...I've just never tried to get lean....ever, lol. When I get around 15-16% I just cruise. (that's where I'm at now.) I may give it a shot now though, I went grocery shoppin last night, and I am doing cardio now.

[Amazed]

You're never in #srkgd anymoar:sad:

Also, may someone tell me the most effective exercises working the triceps using dumbells?

Overhead extensions

[mr. newbie]

after every workout my body is destroyed. when i workout i question if i'm doing it hard enough. i don't feel terrible while i'm doing it so i keep going.

then i can't workout again for like a week or more because i can't move.

is this harmful? i have a hard time gaging if i should stop or not.

[Ryad]

if your relatively new at it, then its normal and your body will begin to recover faster... if not, then what your doing is questionable...
Give more details of your regimen so people here can I have a better idea and help you better

[Soldier Zero]

after every workout my body is destroyed. when i workout i question if i'm doing it hard enough. i don't feel terrible while i'm doing it so i keep going.

then i can't workout again for like a week or more because i can't move.

is this harmful? i have a hard time gaging if i should stop or not.

Ditto on what Ryad said. If you're new, chances are your muscles are producing lactic acid for the first time so the burn's gonna be a new feeling.

[MagnusMadness]

this is not true. If you are a beginner, workout like one. Your body won't be destroyed then. As you get more experienced, begin increasing the intensity and volume. Don't you think you could do more work with lighter workouts that could be repeated 2-4x a week instead of destroying ur body once?



And no one actually knows what REALLY causes DOMS. It's been hypothesized that it is microtrauma to the muscle cells...

Lactic acid is a byproduct of your anaerobic metabolism...pyruvate+hydrogen ion (these in excess give you "the burn") = lactic acid. Lactic acid = good.

[Ryad]

too much lactic acid = lactic acidosis, but you'd have to have worked out very streneously very frequently for that to have happened to you...
whatever causes DOMS. it is apparent that the experienced recover from it faster assuming similar intensity of the workout. He is asking if its normal or not...
True though, if you are a beginner, you may have to lower the intensity if its taking you an entire week to recover...
Tell us:
How long have you been working out?
Are you working out your entire body in one work out? or dividing them out?
What are exercises and how many reps are you doing? Are you finding it easy?
Are you eating enough? Sleeping enough?

Edit: Just wondering... what are everyone's weights and Bench Press 1 Rep Max?

[MagnusMadness]

Experiencing DOMS to a lesser degree or less frequently doesn't indicate quicker recovery times. By virtue of that, you could workout everyday unless ur sore. We know that's not the case.

Stretching, Foam Rolling, Icing, as well as taking anti inflamatories can help alleviate soreness....but doesn't have any bearing on CNS and/or muscular recovery.

[SFFanatic]

Went to the doctor for a checkup, I was getting some chest pains after exercising, which is news to me.

Turns out now I gotta do a whole BUNCH of tests(nerves test, chest X-ray, ECG, etc).

Can't exercise for at least a week.

FUCK.

[MaDPoWer]

How long is a full upper body work out supposed to last? I hear that working One muscle per day isn't that effective but doing 3 exercises with 10 reps per set with rest in between can last almost 30mins and they say not to work out more than 45mins....how the hell can you do 3 exercises with 3 sets of 10 each for chest, back, tris, bis and shoulders in under a hour?

[Soldier Zero]

Lactic acid is a byproduct of your anaerobic metabolism...pyruvate+hydrogen ion (these in excess give you "the burn") = lactic acid. Lactic acid = good.

How is it good? I thought it's neutral since it really doesn't do anything.


Edit: Just wondering... what are everyone's weights and Bench Press 1 Rep Max?

I'm at 159 and bench 180 or 185.

[BEEFCAKE]

I weigh 212-215, bench around 275.


Magnus: Can you explain to me why BCAA's are good during a cut? Aside from energy I read that they help you from losing muscle while cutting fat.

[Truong]

Fuck bench press. Man up and do overhead presses and all its variation.

[BEEFCAKE]

Behind the neck presses for me thanks

[TheIlluminati]

165ish, 1 rep max a few months ago was 230-240.. but it's probably lower now because of my work term where I was working ~60 hours a week and I couldn't fit in working out.. stupid, I know.


Fuck bench press. Man up and do overhead presses and all its variation.

I used to do these with dumbbells, but for the longest time it's been all barbell. Any significant difference?

[Ryad]

I like doing that variation where you go overhead press in front and then behind neck in the same exercise, forgot its name...

145Lbs bench 170Lbs
Thats insane for your weight Illuminati, good stuff... cant wait to get there

Sorry to hear SFFanatic

[Truong]

165ish, 1 rep max a few months ago was 230-240.. but it's probably lower now because of my work term where I was working ~60 hours a week and I couldn't fit in working out.. stupid, I know.



I used to do these with dumbbells, but for the longest time it's been all barbell. Any significant difference?

I meant to type Standing Overhead Presses in my earlier post. So if you're using dumbbell, I'm guessing you did them while seated? Because I hardly ever see anyone, myself included, doing standing overhead presses with dumbbell. It just feels... unnatural. With the barbell, you can rest it on your traps, or clavicals if you're doing it from the front, and this lets you drive with your legs much easier. With dumbbells, if you're going heavy, it'll be really hard having most of the weights/dumbbell resting on your arms/wrist, not to mention balance issues. I'd suggest doing all forms of overhead presses with a barbell.

[Truong]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASUkOVQi0xk more Olympic weightlifting.

Check out the Chinese lifter at :52 to 1:30. That is such a fucking BEASTLY jerk. Dude weighs 170 and basically OVERHEAD squatted almost 460 pounds. Overhead squat! If anyone's ever done overhead squatting, you'll know that's the single hardest lift to do heavy. Retarded amount of upper body strength to keep the weight from tilting.

[Soldier Zero]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASUkOVQi0xk more Olympic weightlifting.

Check out the Chinese lifter at :52 to 1:30. That is such a fucking BEASTLY jerk. Dude weighs 170 and basically OVERHEAD squatted almost 460 pounds. Overhead squat! If anyone's ever done overhead squatting, you'll know that's the single hardest lift to do heavy. Retarded amount of upper body strength to keep the weight from tilting.

Man those guys are crazy, I wanna be lifting like that. :sad:

[Rhio2k]

Edit: Just wondering... what are everyone's weights and Bench Press 1 Rep Max?

5' 5", 152lbs, bench = 220lbs

[Ryad]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASUkOVQi0xk more Olympic weightlifting.

Check out the Chinese lifter at :52 to 1:30. That is such a fucking BEASTLY jerk. Dude weighs 170 and basically OVERHEAD squatted almost 460 pounds. Overhead squat! If anyone's ever done overhead squatting, you'll know that's the single hardest lift to do heavy. Retarded amount of upper body strength to keep the weight from tilting.

I am so envious... these men are unbelievable...

good shit Rhio

[MagnusMadness]

How is it good? I thought it's neutral since it really doesn't do anything.



I'm at 159 and bench 180 or 185.

nad binds to hydrogen ions to form nadh....and pyruvate binds to hydrogren ions to form lactic acid. This is how our bodies buffer hydrogen ions, which is important because excess hydrogen ions aggravate nerve endings, causing "the burn".

[Silentness!]

I so want to go back to bench pressing + push-ups, but my biceps are still strained. I don't want to screw anything up so I'm just staying dormant and doing cardio shit.

[mr. newbie]

ok i might change my workout soon. here's what i've used the last say 2 or 3 workouts

dumbbell straight leg deadlift
dumbbell shoulder press
dumbbell lateral raise
dumbbell lying row/bent row
dumbbell pull over
flys
v up
jacknife situp

i use 25 or 30lb weights for everything 'cept pull overs. i can't list reps because i just lift until i can't lift anymore, move on to next exercise, repeat.

i'm not sure if i am a beginner or not but i've worked out on and off for a few years. i've gotten a lot stronger since i got my dumbbells and my machine 2 years ago.

i'm going to try to stick to rep/set plan. appreciate the help.

[Soldier Zero]

nad binds to hydrogen ions to form nadh....and pyruvate binds to hydrogren ions to form lactic acid. This is how our bodies buffer hydrogen ions, which is important because excess hydrogen ions aggravate nerve endings, causing "the burn".

Ah gotcha, my bio book never mentions that.

Most of you guys bench well over your body weight, am I doing something wrong to be hitting a low number like that?

Speaking of chest, what exercises do you guys do? For me bench press, db press, and incline db press have gotten a bit stale, I need to try something different.

[Rhio2k]

Most of you guys bench well over your body weight, am I doing something wrong to be hitting a low number like that?


How long have you been benching your current limit?

[Truong]

Ah gotcha, my bio book never mentions that.

Most of you guys bench well over your body weight, am I doing something wrong to be hitting a low number like that?

Speaking of chest, what exercises do you guys do? For me bench press, db press, and incline db press have gotten a bit stale, I need to try something different.

If you want to bench more, stop doing so many variations. Ditch the incline and decline and the dumbbells. I've said this to so many new lifters: unless you're SERIOUS about being a pro bodybuilder, stop working out like one.

Cut down your bench work out to just the plain old regular flat bench press. Do 5 sets of 5 reps with your 80-90% 1 rep max, and take 5 minute rest in betweens. Do this twice a week, and add 5 pounds every week you do it. Quickest way to improve bench number. And remember, don't go to failure. Nothing destroys strength gains like going past failure, and having a spotter deadlift the weight off your chest for the last 3-4 "reps".

[Ryad]

Arent you supposed to constantly stimulate your body, trying to prevent it to adapt, by switching up the exercises and doing multiple variations?

[Truong]

Arent you supposed to constantly stimulate your body, trying to prevent it to adapt, by switching up the exercises and doing multiple variations?

More bodybuilding nonsense, imo. I suppose that method is effective in gaining MUSCLE SIZE. But muscle size does not = strong muscles. If you want to get good at something, you do that specific movement.

Olympic weightlifters don't decide to "switch it up" and do retarded lateral dumbbell raises when they feel like their body has "adapted" to clean and jerking. And I doubt powerlifters switch up from squat to useless ass leg presses cuz they're stagnating on their number

If you think your body is adapting, add more weight, do more reps, do more sets, don't do some useless variation of that exercise. More volume, more intensity, different rep scheme, etc, etc.

It's really no secret: to increase your number in any lift, do heavy weight (80-90%1 rep max), low reps (3-5), super intensity, DONT GO TO FAILURE AND OVERTRAIN, and, most importantly, proper eating + lots of rest to let your CNS recover.

[tech master]

Although I respect your opinion (everyone responds differently to different work outs), I dont think your opinion on sticking with one excersize and no variations will help EVERYBODY. Maybe some people, but not others.

As for me, I use to have access to a gym for a few months where I would do incline, widespread, decline, and normal benchpress. Of course at home I'd do push ups as well. Right now I just use my home gym and I'm too lazy to reset the bench angles and have had a strict flat bench routine for quite some time.

My bench press shot up a lot more at the gym then it did at home. (i stopped working out for a few months after i lost access to the gym and was VERY ill for another month or so. My bench press ended up being slightly above from when i started at the gym) I have not been able to match my results whatsoever. I use the same Rep/Set routine and have the same diet.

IMO doing different variations on excersizes like incline/widespread/decline/butterflies builds an overall even and strong chest. Having a stronger upper, lower, and middle chest helps keep the bar FIRM in place and strays away from "flying." This results in a better form and an increase in proper muscle gain. Not to mention it helps prevent injuries also.

You can also apply simple physics. When dealing with any structure, how can you make it stronger? By giving more support around it.

However, I do agree with low rep and high weight routines for max gain. Its just that anytime dealing with heavy weight, form starts to go bad. Strengthining other areas of your chest will obviously help with that, and we all know proper form is the best way to build any type of strength

[maxx]

question, if i can hold a hand stand and do maybe 1 or 2 handstand push ups as well as some planche push ups should i be able to bench my own body weight or more?

i havent lifted in years...i used to lift near or above my body weight. Now i dropped weight lifting cuz i'm poor but i keep up with my gymnastics and martial arts stuff and wonder if it has helped me develop more so i can lift past it. but i havent touched benching in years.

[Truong]

Although I respect your opinion (everyone responds differently to different work outs), I dont think your opinion on sticking with one excersize and no variations will help EVERYBODY. Maybe some people, but not others.

Actually, what I said will just about help out ANYONE who wants to gain strength. The principle is simple: you want to get good at something, you do it til you get good at it. 100m sprinters do short burst running; they don't do 10 km marathons. They don't do 400 m relay. They don't do hurdles. They do 100 m sprint. Olympic weightlifters who want to snatch better do snatch. They don't do military presses. They don't do lateral raises. They don't do front raises. I've never read powerlifting article on achieving big bench numbers that suggested you should do triceps kickbacks and skullcrushers to help strengthen the "base". They've never suggested doing rediculous exercises like decline and incline either. The only time you'll ever hear of those exercises being mentioned is from a bodybuilding article or magazine.


As for me, I use to have access to a gym for a few months where I would do incline, widespread, decline, and normal benchpress. Of course at home I'd do push ups as well. Right now I just use my home gym and I'm too lazy to reset the bench angles and have had a strict flat bench routine for quite some time.

My bench press shot up a lot more at the gym then it did at home. (i stopped working out for a few months after i lost access to the gym and was VERY ill for another month or so. My bench press ended up being slightly above from when i started at the gym) I have not been able to match my results whatsoever. I use the same Rep/Set routine and have the same diet.

Gee, don't you think that "few months" of not working out, on top of a month of being "VERY ill" might have had something to do with your decrease in strength?:rolleyes:


IMO doing different variations on excersizes like incline/widespread/decline/butterflies builds an overall even and strong chest. Having a stronger upper, lower, and middle chest helps keep the bar FIRM in place and strays away from "flying." This results in a better form and an increase in proper muscle gain. Not to mention it helps prevent injuries also.

You can also apply simple physics. When dealing with any structure, how can you make it stronger? By giving more support around it.

No offense, and I don't mean to be a dick, but once you start talking about nonsense like upper pecs and lower pecs, you sort of lose all strength training credibility. This is the type of talk that you'll only ever hear from serious bodybuilders, and those guys aren't exactly known for their big lift numbers, despite their size. You'll never hear nonsense like upper pecs/lower pecs/upper triceps/lower triceps/ rear delts/front dealts from serious powerlifters, strongmen, and Oly lifters.

The thing with a big lift like benchpress is that it's already a compound movement; any muscles that needs to be called into lifting the weight will get its share of work. So for you to spend an hour doing triceps kick backs and triceps extension, thinking it'll improve your bench number is just flat out inefficient. Any time you spent doing those exercises should have been spent on either a) doing more benching, or b) getting enough rest). Besides, deadlift is infinitely superior exercise to do if you want to increase your bench.

And once again, the poster was asking how to improve his bench number, not how to put more muscle mass on his chest. They're two different things.


However, I do agree with low rep and high weight routines for max gain. Its just that anytime dealing with heavy weight, form starts to go bad. Strengthining other areas of your chest will obviously help with that, and we all know proper form is the best way to build any type of strength

No man, heavyweights don't encourage bad forms. Weights you can't handle encourages bad form. There's a big difference. 80-90% of your 1 rep max means 80-90% of your 1 rep max that you can do with good form.

[Truong]

question, if i can hold a hand stand and do maybe 1 or 2 handstand push ups as well as some planche push ups should i be able to bench my own body weight or more?

i havent lifted in years...i used to lift near or above my body weight. Now i dropped weight lifting cuz i'm poor but i keep up with my gymnastics and martial arts stuff and wonder if it has helped me develop more so i can lift past it. but i havent touched benching in years.

Er, a handstand calls for very little chest muscle. It's mostly triceps, shoulders, ab/core stability and balance. It's really hard to determine your bench number based on your hand stand strength.

Gymnastic is amazing for bodyweight/functional strength, but lifting heavy ass weight is something else entirely different. From what I remember reading in some articles, Olympic gymnasts, despite having insane bodyweight strength, don't exactly have big lift numbers.

Best way to find out what you're benching is... well, bench.

[Master Giby]

How do I get rid of love handles? I've been eating good and doing random exercises, but I can't get rid of these damn things. They aren't bad, but I know they're there and it drives me nuts.

The thread Search function isn't working for me right now, so if this has already been answered, just redirect me to the answer.

[Mr. Bastos]

How do I get rid of love handles? I've been eating good and doing random exercises, but I can't get rid of these damn things. They aren't bad, but I know they're there and it drives me nuts.

The thread Search function isn't working for me right now, so if this has already been answered, just redirect me to the answer.

well I'm not expert but I've been reading this thread enough to know most people here are gonna tell you this:

you can't target where you lose weight. so instead of random exercise you need to start doing it regularly and doing some type of cardio is going to help too. and of course eating good, but you said you're already doing that.

[Ryad]

Truong... I am not spouting body building nonsense when I talk about alternating exercise (conjugate training)... that is the philosophy of the Westside Barbell club... and they have been (still are?) unrivaled in producing the strongest power lifters around...

Not to the extent as some have mentioned here, but they do alternate...
so for example, for ME lower body, they would alternate between squats, deadlifts and good morning, and to add even more alternatives, they would use chains and bands, different starting positions etc...

Definately agree that Max Effort exercises (80-100%) would produce the highest results in strength as opposed to the body building high rep type of exercise... but for smaller people/beginners, it is necessary to build hypertrophy (low weight, high rep) while strengthening the muscles (high weight, low rep)... and so a combination of the two would be optimal...

Another aspect of the Westside Barbell "regimen" is that in order to improve your lifts, you are going to have to target your weak spots.
"A great example of this is the bench press. Lets suppose your triceps have the ability to bench 300 pounds, but your shoulders can only handle 250. How much do you think you will bench? I will guess and say 250. Now, if you bring up your shoulders to match your triceps, how much will you bench? Probably 300"
And this is where the "accessory" body building type exercise come in... to fortify your weaknesses (Doing too much ME exercises will take its toll)...

[The Mullah]

i can't bench for shit, maybe i should incorporate a coupole of weeks of truongs back to basics training. Then again i dont really train for strength, although it's always nice to have

[Truong]

Truong... I am not spouting body building nonsense when I talk about alternating exercise (conjugate training)... that is the philosophy of the Westside Barbell club... and they have been (still are?) unrivaled in producing the strongest power lifters around...

Not to the extent as some have mentioned here, but they do alternate...
so for example, for ME lower body, they would alternate between squats, deadlifts and good morning, and to add even more alternatives, they would use chains and bands, different starting positions etc...

Definately agree that Max Effort exercises (80-100%) would produce the highest results in strength as opposed to the body building high rep type of exercise... but for smaller people/beginners, it is necessary to build hypertrophy (low weight, high rep) while strengthening the muscles (high weight, low rep)... and so a combination of the two would be optimal...

Well, when you put it like that, it's a world of difference. When you said variations, I cringed and thought you meant variations such as upright rows, "rear delts" triceps kickback, 500 variation of curls, and calf raises lol. Typical bodybuilding crap.

I think we're both misunderstanding each other, but preaching the same thing.

There's a difference between doing varying bench pressing with chains and bands, and varying bench pressing with something useless like flies, cable cross overs and shit. You know what I mean? Benching with chains and resistance band is still benching. It's gonna build crazy strength. Doing flies/Cable cross over/decline benching is just useless for strength gains. Doing movements to hit a certain part of a muscle is just ridiculous.

And I don't agree with beginners and hypertrophy/low weight, high rep concept. Bill Starr's 5x5 program is one of the classic program for beginners and it doesn't preach hypertrophy(going to failure) one bit. It's the exact opposite, actually.

For ANY new lifter serious about making strength gains/size, read this article. It'll sway you away from the evil path that is bodybuilding into the right path of strength training: http://www.eclipsegym.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=57

That link should be stickied on the very first page or something. We'll won't have new lifters coming in asking "how many useless variations of the EZ Bar curls can I do? And are triceps kickbacks a good exercise (answer: fuck no)".

[Soldier Zero]

How long have you been benching your current limit?

Right now it's June, so most likely since April.

Thanks Truong on your input. :tup:

I think I wanna change my program from size and instead to targeting strength & endurance. Tips and advice? Truong's outline for chest would give me strength, but what about endurance?

[MagnusMadness]

TRUONG SPEAKS THE FUCKING TRUTH

wow, that's refreshing...

When talking about gaining strength, we are talking neurons folks. The best way to get good at something is by doing it.


And about newbies gaining strength on this program vs. that program....it's almost inconsequential...Neural adaptations will take place first almost regardless of rep/set schemes. I prefer to start clients off with more rep work to learn the exercises and develop good motor patterns...If I did use fewer rep sets, it would still be with the same 10-12 rep max.

And form doesn't fall apart when intensity is increased. Hell, when I get set up for benching powerlifting style...I pretty much can't move anything BUT my arms.


Right now it's June, so most likely since April.

Thanks Truong on your input. :tup:

I think I wanna change my program from size and instead to targeting strength & endurance. Tips and advice? Truong's outline for chest would give me strength, but what about endurance?

What KIND of endurance. If you want endurance for long, slow, aerobic sports, then just run for distances....increasing distance when necessary..

If training for anaerobic endurance, you have lots of options. But if you want to train for strength exclusively then cutting resting intervals down might be too much to ask. You can always try interval training on a treadmill, or just straight up sprints outside between workouts...You could also do GPP work (general physical preparedness) and complexes between workout days to improve anaerobic conditioning as well.

But it will be pretty taxing trying to pursue strength and endurance concurrently.

[Truong]

Right now it's June, so most likely since April.

Thanks Truong on your input. :tup:

I think I wanna change my program from size and instead to targeting strength & endurance. Tips and advice? Truong's outline for chest would give me strength, but what about endurance?

Endurance is a pretty broad and vague term man. You need to be more specific. Endurance for what? Sport? What kind of sport? Endurance for every day activities? Endurance for sex? Endurance for the Tour De France? Triathlon?

[Ryad]

Well, when you put it like that, it's a world of difference. When you said variations, I cringed and thought you meant variations such as upright rows, "rear delts" triceps kickback, 500 variation of curls, and calf raises lol. Typical bodybuilding crap.

I think we're both misunderstanding each other, but preaching the same thing.

There's a difference between doing varying bench pressing with chains and bands, and varying bench pressing with something useless like flies, cable cross overs and shit. You know what I mean? Benching with chains and resistance band is still benching. It's gonna build crazy strength. Doing flies/Cable cross over/decline benching is just useless for strength gains. Doing movements to hit a certain part of a muscle is just ridiculous.

And I don't agree with beginners and hypertrophy/low weight, high rep concept. Bill Starr's 5x5 program is one of the classic program for beginners and it doesn't preach hypertrophy(going to failure) one bit. It's the exact opposite, actually.

For ANY new lifter serious about making strength gains/size, read this article. It'll sway you away from the evil path that is bodybuilding into the right path of strength training: http://www.eclipsegym.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=57

That link should be stickied on the very first page or something. We'll won't have new lifters coming in asking "how many useless variations of the EZ Bar curls can I do? And are triceps kickbacks a good exercise (answer: fuck no)".

Ah in that case, you are right... it was a misunderstanding, and we are preaching the same thing...

I forgot to mention, that the accessory hypertrophy exercises are never to be trained until failure... but you may still disagree with it... the source is DeFranco and he has trained many a strong athlete but perhaps I should read the Bill Starr article first...

lol "evil path that is bodybuilding"

Magnus is right... for beginners (like me), any kind of training will illicit a growth/strength response...

Lactic acid tolerance type of endurance, isnt dyanamic lifting good for that? It will also build power

So, the guys who mentioned their bodyweights and benchpresses... thanks, and do you mind mentioning what program/philosophy you guys follow?

[RoboGem II]

I have a question:

Pushups and its variants (wide stance, close, fingers, etc) are they good for someone who wants to get back in shape more and more. Right now my max is like 23 pushups at the moment (not much, but I'm kind of a fat fuck who got into better shape over 4 weeks [from 210 pounds to 195, goal is 180 (I'm 5'10", medium/large frame].

Is there a certain point where pushups stop helping you build muscle mass and instead just keep you toned and trim?

[HeaT]

So, the guys who mentioned their bodyweights and benchpresses... thanks, and do you mind mentioning what program/philosophy you guys follow?

im at 135lbs and my max is 225lbs...

program and philosophy? i have been through a few...i have done the whole 1 body part per day, chest one day, back one day, arms one day, etc...then i also did back/bis, chest/tris, legs program...then i did a freestyle one, where i knew what i was going to work out but i would just randomly select exercises so it would be different everytime...and right now im one of of mangus' programs...one day is chest and back, arms accessory...next day is legs, rest, repeat, with different exercises on chest/back and legs day 2...i also do accessory work for traps and calves...

for the current program i am on week 1 is 6-8 reps, week 2 is 8 reps, week 3 is 10 reps and week 4 is unloading 5 reps...everything at 3 sets...

i am thoroughly enjoying the program i have been on or rather...the philosophy of the program...so i think i will stick with it...

im outi

Roberth

[tech master]

Actually, what I said will just about help out ANYONE who wants to gain strength. The principle is simple: you want to get good at something, you do it til you get good at it. 100m sprinters do short burst running; they don't do 10 km marathons. They don't do 400 m relay. They don't do hurdles. They do 100 m sprint. Olympic weightlifters who want to snatch better do snatch. They don't do military presses. They don't do lateral raises. They don't do front raises. I've never read powerlifting article on achieving big bench numbers that suggested you should do triceps kickbacks and skullcrushers to help strengthen the "base". They've never suggested doing rediculous exercises like decline and incline either. The only time you'll ever hear of those exercises being mentioned is from a bodybuilding article or magazine.


No offense, and I don't mean to be a dick, but once you start talking about nonsense like upper pecs and lower pecs, you sort of lose all strength training credibility. This is the type of talk that you'll only ever hear from serious bodybuilders, and those guys aren't exactly known for their big lift numbers, despite their size. You'll never hear nonsense like upper pecs/lower pecs/upper triceps/lower triceps/ rear delts/front dealts from serious powerlifters, strongmen, and Oly lifters.


The thing with a big lift like benchpress is that it's already a compound movement; any muscles that needs to be called into lifting the weight will get its share of work. So for you to spend an hour doing triceps kick backs and triceps extension, thinking it'll improve your bench number is just flat out inefficient. Any time you spent doing those exercises should have been spent on either a) doing more benching, or b) getting enough rest). Besides, deadlift is infinitely superior exercise to do if you want to increase your bench.



And once again, the poster was asking how to improve his bench number, not how to put more muscle mass on his chest. They're two different things.

I think we interpreted the question differently.

"Most of you guys bench well over your body weight, am I doing something wrong to be hitting a low number like that?"

When people bench press, its to improve chest strength. Not too often is it just to show off raw numbers. now considering that he said...

"Speaking of chest, what exercises do you guys do? For me bench press, db press, and incline db press have gotten a bit stale, I need to try something different."

I wouldn't think his goals aren't simply for flatbench pressing. I assume he had the knowledge that its more beneficial ( leaning towards super human abilities) to do different angles. Now he's just wondering WHY its so low, not necessarily meaning he'll do anything to get a better bench press even if it means sacrificing his routine.

I guess you could be right in a lot of cases about raw bench pressing strength but i'm sure any "serious" bodybuilders will tell you people respond differently. It just so happens that I responded better with incline, decline, and wide spread. All the variables were the same besides the fact that I only did flat bench at home.

Not everyone speaks theoretically. I am speaking from experience. Thus why i said your mentallity and strict routining will work for some people, but not everybody. Trust me, I sleep the same, eat the same, workout the same, rotate different supplements the same, time everything the same, motivated the same etc. My strength is up in everything except flatbench pressing.


Gee, don't you think that "few months" of not working out, on top of a month of being "VERY ill" might have had something to do with your decrease in strength?:rolleyes:

actually the time that i was ill wasn't even that recent, a year ago i believe. I'm at full health and I'm about the same strength as last year. i've been working out consistently for the last few months and still have yet to produce the same quick results. no need to roll eyes. i'm not that stupid to not consider the illness.



No man, heavyweights don't encourage bad forms. Weights you can't handle encourages bad form. There's a big difference. 80-90% of your 1 rep max means 80-90% of your 1 rep max that you can do with good form.

Yes, weights you can't handle encourage bad form. But saying incline and decline doesnt promote good form I'd have to question. Your arms arent a perfect rack that hold the bar perfectly straight, strength is still needed to keep it straight. How does a more solid grip and firm arms not help? Your theory doesn't superceed physics.

I completely understand where you're coming from but its a difference in opinion that i don't think anyone can prove one way is better. I really don't think too many (certainly not all) people on this board are thinking in goals of becoming an olympic weight lifter either. I guess I just tie the definition of strength, health, and athleticism closely together. Solely sticking to one angle means you're lacking somewhere else. When training I believe in even development. Thats the best type of strength gain.

Sticking to JUST bench pressing also kind of defeats the purpose of Compound workouts doesnt it? They're meant to stray away from isolation, why would you want to only work out one part of your chest? Just because you work out the chest, doesnt mean it improves every single aspect of it.

I understand the Olympic weight lifters might train with your mentallity, but with most of people who train, aren't training for one specific excersize. This is a Weightlifting & nutrition thread, not an Olympic Lifter thread. I don't frequent this thread so I don't know this guy on a personal basis and what his goals are. Its just that 80% of people i know train the way I try to.

[Soldier Zero]

What KIND of endurance. If you want endurance for long, slow, aerobic sports, then just run for distances....increasing distance when necessary..

If training for anaerobic endurance, you have lots of options. But if you want to train for strength exclusively then cutting resting intervals down might be too much to ask. You can always try interval training on a treadmill, or just straight up sprints outside between workouts...You could also do GPP work (general physical preparedness) and complexes between workout days to improve anaerobic conditioning as well.

But it will be pretty taxing trying to pursue strength and endurance concurrently.

Hm in that case, I think I'll try only for endurance right now.


Endurance is a pretty broad and vague term man. You need to be more specific. Endurance for what? Sport? What kind of sport? Endurance for every day activities? Endurance for sex? Endurance for the Tour De France? Triathlon?

Just every day activities.

Thanks a lot guys, this is some good reading. :tup:

[MagnusMadness]

When people bench press, its to improve chest strength. Not too often is it just to show off raw numbers. now considering that he said...

That is an ignorant statement. It doesn't even make sense. If they are benching for strength then they should be concerned with raw numbers....that's kinda the point.


I guess you could be right in a lot of cases about raw bench pressing strength but i'm sure any "serious" bodybuilders will tell you people respond differently. It just so happens that I responded better with incline, decline, and wide spread. All the variables were the same besides the fact that I only did flat bench at home.

No, he's dead on. You are wrong, and you aren't even on the same page. He is NOT talking about bodybuilding. So whatever any "serious" bodybuilder says is inconsequential. Why are we argueing over what this guy's goals are anyway? I think it's good that a different perspective was tossed into this thread, so if someone reading was thinking of ways to up their bench, they needn't even ask now.


Not everyone speaks theoretically. I am speaking from experience. Thus why i said your mentallity and strict routining will work for some people, but not everybody. Trust me, I sleep the same, eat the same, workout the same, rotate different supplements the same, time everything the same, motivated the same etc. My strength is up in everything except flatbench pressing.

If you bench, you will get better at benching....how can you argue that? I challenge you to start a rigorous strength program in an effort to bench more weight. It will have you benching weekly....upon completion of that program...stop benching for a few months and watch ur numbers dwindle.


Yes, weights you can't handle encourage bad form. But saying incline and decline doesnt promote good form I'd have to question. Your arms arent a perfect rack that hold the bar perfectly straight, strength is still needed to keep it straight. How does a more solid grip and firm arms not help? Your theory doesn't superceed physics.

:wtf:

explain a single law of physics that applies to good bench pressing form?


Sticking to JUST bench pressing also kind of defeats the purpose of Compound workouts doesnt it? They're meant to stray away from isolation, why would you want to only work out one part of your chest? Just because you work out the chest, doesnt mean it improves every single aspect of it.

Again....you aren't on the same page man. We are talking strength...not hypertrophy. Secondly. There is only one chest muscle, with two heads...the sternal and clavicular.

[S.R.T.]

Wow we got Truong and Magnus Madness talking shit, man this is surprising. Two fuckin butt pirates who aren't even muscular, giving advice and shooting everyones opinions down.

Here's a thought instead of talking shit about weightlifting on a FIGHTING GAME FORUM, why don't you fruitcakes hit the weights, get off your high horses, and deflate your heads. I could understand if you guys were ripped or something, I mean I'd still think you guys were complete *******, but at least you could back up your shit talk with results. But you look like runners up in the women over 60, 100lbs weight class.

[MagnusMadness]

Wow we got Truong and Magnus Madness talking shit, man this is surprising. Two fuckin butt pirates who aren't even muscular, giving advice and shooting everyones opinions down.

Here's a thought instead of talking shit about weightlifting on a FIGHTING GAME FORUM, why don't you fruitcakes hit the weights, get off your high horses, and deflate your heads. I could understand if you guys were ripped or something, I mean I'd still think you guys were complete *******, but at least you could back up your shit talk with results. But you look like runners up in the women over 60, 100lbs weight class.

um. I'm a certified trainer. So if I was ripped my advice would be more credible? That makes sense. Do you have any pictures? What do ur lifts look like? Do you even work out? Name a book you've read on weightlifting.......

I'm waiting.

[S.R.T.]

um. I'm a certified trainer. So if I was ripped my advice would be more credible? That makes sense. Do you have any pictures? What do ur lifts look like? Do you even work out? Name a book you've read on weightlifting.......

I'm waiting.

You're a certified trainer? Lol, and that has what to do with it? Yeah theres certified trainers at my gym too, they weigh in at a solid buck fifteen.

If you were ripped would your advice be more credible? Umm....yeah. Did you even read what you just posted? You are the exact...EXACT same as all these fruits on here that say some stupid shit like Magneto is great because he has a 2 frame launch and I know everything about Marvel buuuuut Ive never won a tournament match in my life. If you can't use your own advice, why did you even ask me that question?

Do I have pictures of what?....What grade are you in?

What do my lifts look like? LOL

Do I work out? What difference does that make? I can make this analogy with building bird houses. You can give me all the advice in the world on how to do it, but if you can't do it yourself, why is your mouth open.....wait...I know.

A book I've read on weightlifting? This is the worst question ever. Its not like I couldn't go to Google, type in "weightlifting books" and type up 50 things I've "read". So I'm not even gonna bother with that one.

Good day!

[maxx]

is a digital scale better than a regular scale?

right now my regular scale says i'm 139 and its set a lil before the 0

but the digital scale says i'm 142

[MagnusMadness]

You're a certified trainer? Lol, and that has what to do with it? Yeah theres certified trainers at my gym too, they weigh in at a solid buck fifteen.

If you were ripped would your advice be more credible? Umm....yeah. Did you even read what you just posted? You are the exact...EXACT same as all these fruits on here that say some stupid shit like Magneto is great because he has a 2 frame launch and I know everything about Marvel buuuuut Ive never won a tournament match in my life. If you can't use your own advice, why did you even ask me that question?

Do I have pictures of what?....What grade are you in?

What do my lifts look like? LOL

Do I work out? What difference does that make? I can make this analogy with building bird houses. You can give me all the advice in the world on how to do it, but if you can't do it yourself, why is your mouth open.....wait...I know.

A book I've read on weightlifting? This is the worst question ever. Its not like I couldn't go to Google, type in "weightlifting books" and type up 50 things I've "read". So I'm not even gonna bother with that one.

Good day!


LoL....a long post saying nothing.

If you must know, I've dieted down several times, but when I start having less energy and my lifts suffer...I start adding calories back to my diet. Just because a person lifts weights or knows about resistance training doesn't mean they must be ripped or even ASPIRE to be ripped. Do you know who mike boyle is? Only one of the foremost strength and conditioning coaches in the world....pull up a pic of him....You'd prolly say he doesn't look like he's worked out a day in his life.

How am I anything like the gamers on here that can't play? Everything I preach to you guys I practice in my own training and that of my clients. My clients have gotten tremendous results....and the people on here who have taken the things I've said to heart have benefited from them. There are at least two or three individuals on this board who use a program I've written or a variant of that program and are STILL using it....meaning they must've seen at least satisfactory results.

And another thing about being ripped...that shit is more about nutrition that weightlifting. Unless of course you were skinny when you started lifting weights...You are obviously completely ignorant.

[Truong]

This SRT guy is a fucking idiot. A troll. You know he's utterly clueless when he starts talking about "rippedness". Yeah, Rezzadeh who cleans and jerk 263 KG is a scrub because he's not ripped. And Zydrunas Savickas is a fucking flat, lazy slob who just happens to be number 1 WSM atm. He's not even worth responding seriously to.

As for my numbers, so people don't think I'm talking out of my ass:

Bodyweight - 160 pounds
Squat: 275
Deadlift 335
SOHP: 205

And I got those numbers from doing nothing but TRICEPS KICKBACKS AND CONCENTRATING CURLS TO FEEL THE PUMP MAN!!!11


Maxx: I'm gonna guess a regular scale is more reliable, seeing as most, if not all, athletic commissions use the standard scale to do weight ins. I've yet to see a weight ins where they used digitial scale.

Soldier Zero: Everyday activity endurance has a lot to do with your diet, and how much sleep you get, and just plain living a healthy life style. It's quite simple. Eat healthy, eat your vegetable, leave the junk shit alone, and get enough sleep.

[BEEFCAKE]

dumb bell kick backs did nothing for me, personally I'd rather do skull crushers since you can load much much more weight w/o hurting/straining your shoulders, but if what you say is true then kudos.

[S.R.T.]

This SRT guy is a fucking idiot. A troll. You know he's utterly clueless when he starts talking about "rippedness". Yeah, Rezzadeh who cleans and jerk 263 KG is a scrub because he's not ripped. And Zydrunas Savickas is a fucking flat, lazy slob who just happens to be number 1 WSM atm. He's not even worth responding seriously to.

As for my numbers, so people don't think I'm talking out of my ass:

Bodyweight - 160 pounds
Squat: 275
Deadlift 335
SOHP: 205

And I got those numbers from doing nothing but TRICEPS KICKBACKS AND CONCENTRATING CURLS TO FEEL THE PUMP MAN!!!11


Maxx: I'm gonna guess a regular scale is more reliable, seeing as most, if not all, athletic commissions use the standard scale to do weight ins. I've yet to see a weight ins where they used digitial scale.

Soldier Zero: Everyday activity endurance has a lot to do with your diet, and how much sleep you get, and just plain living a healthy life style. It's quite simple. Eat healthy, eat your vegetable, leave the junk shit alone, and get enough sleep.


You're an idiot, and those are some siiiiick numbers. Post up pics of yourself so we can rip on you and your horrible logic of how tricep kickbacks and concentrating curls don't do anything for your body. Lick your own assneck.

[Truong]

You're an idiot, and those are some siiiiick numbers. Post up pics of yourself so we can rip on you and your horrible logic of how tricep kickbacks and concentrating curls don't do anything for your body. Lick your own assneck.

You're either trolling on purpose, or really fucking ignorant on this matter. And those numbers are hardly sick. They're average at best. There are 160 pounders out there who deadlift 500-600 pounds.

And I never once said tricep kickbacks and curls don't do anything for you. I said they're useless for serious strength gains. Anytime you dedicate a day or a work out session specifically for aesthetic muscles such as bicep/tricep you're wasting a colossal amount of time that could be better spent doing deadlift/squat/ohp/cleans/oly lifts, etc, etc.

And what's your obsession with others posting their pic? Are you seriously going to judge someone's strength and knowledge based on their physique? How brainwashed are you? Go fucking read some more Flex magazines.

[S.R.T.]

You're either trolling on purpose, or really fucking ignorant on this matter. And those numbers are hardly sick. They're average at best. There are 160 pounders out there who deadlift 500-600 pounds.

And I never once said tricep kickbacks and curls don't do anything for you. I said they're useless for serious strength gains. Anytime you dedicate a day or a work out session specifically for aesthetic muscles such as bicep/tricep you're wasting a colossal amount of time that could be better spent doing deadlift/squat/ohp/cleans/oly lifts, etc, etc.

And what's your obsession with others posting their pic? Are you seriously going to judge someone's strength and knowledge based on their physique? How brainwashed are you? Go fucking read some more Flex magazines.

Yeah I know those numbers are garbage, I was making fun of you. Quick pick up.

Sooooory, not everyone here is training for Olympic Weightlifting. I think you waste time doing deadlifts/squats/etc. So whats your fucking point?

What obsession? I told you to post a pic, and you didn't. Did I beg you? ***. And you're damn right I'm gonna base a good amount of judgment on someones strength on their physique. I can already tell you're a fat shit, with no muscle by your reaction to my comment.

Nice job of not replying you fruit :tup:

[Truong]

Yeah I know those numbers are garbage, I was making fun of you. Quick pick up.

Sooooory, not everyone here is training for Olympic Weightlifting. I think you waste time doing deadlifts/squats/etc. So whats your fucking point?

What obsession? I told you to post a pic, and you didn't. Did I beg you? ***. And you're damn right I'm gonna base a good amount of judgment on someones strength on their physique. I can already tell you're a fat shit, with no muscle by your reaction to my comment.

Nice job of not replying you fruit :tup:

I know you're going to brush this off, because you're so used to hearing it, but you're REALLY fucking stupid. No sense in talking sense into someone as thickheaded and blissfully ignorant as you.

[S.R.T.]

I know you're going to brush this off, because you're so used to hearing it, but you're REALLY fucking stupid. No sense in talking sense into someone as thickheaded and blissfully ignorant as you.

Good one!

[Soldier Zero]

Soldier Zero: Everyday activity endurance has a lot to do with your diet, and how much sleep you get, and just plain living a healthy life style. It's quite simple. Eat healthy, eat your vegetable, leave the junk shit alone, and get enough sleep.

I move into my dorm in August and I'm pretty strict with what I eat, but man, it's gonna be hard once in a while...so much crap food around.

Since I'm getting such good feedback (kudos to you and Magnus :tup:), what could I do for functional strength? I'd rather ask now instead of coming back later and bringing up everything again.

[Ryad]

This SRT guy is a fucking idiot. A troll. You know he's utterly clueless when he starts talking about "rippedness". Yeah, Rezzadeh who cleans and jerk 263 KG is a scrub because he's not ripped. And Zydrunas Savickas is a fucking flat, lazy slob who just happens to be number 1 WSM atm. He's not even worth responding seriously to.

As for my numbers, so people don't think I'm talking out of my ass:

Bodyweight - 160 pounds
Squat: 275
Deadlift 335
SOHP: 205

And I got those numbers from doing nothing but TRICEPS KICKBACKS AND CONCENTRATING CURLS TO FEEL THE PUMP MAN!!!11


Maxx: I'm gonna guess a regular scale is more reliable, seeing as most, if not all, athletic commissions use the standard scale to do weight ins. I've yet to see a weight ins where they used digitial scale.

Soldier Zero: Everyday activity endurance has a lot to do with your diet, and how much sleep you get, and just plain living a healthy life style. It's quite simple. Eat healthy, eat your vegetable, leave the junk shit alone, and get enough sleep.

why is your squat less than your deadlift? is it just me?
did you mean 375?

[MagnusMadness]

why is your squat less than your deadlift? is it just me?
did you mean 375?

I deadlift way more than I squat. Most people who squat more than they deadlift are cheating depth in the squat or have a very good suit for squatting. I squat in the low to mid 3's and deadlift in the mid to upper 4's.


Since I'm getting such good feedback (kudos to you and Magnus ), what could I do for functional strength? I'd rather ask now instead of coming back later and bringing up everything again.

You have to define "functional" for yourself. To most people the bench press isn't very functional. I will say that "functional" is the newest catch phrase...don't get too caught up.

[S.R.T.]

why is your squat less than your deadlift? is it just me?
did you mean 375?

That's because they are the typical guys you see at the gym, huge upper bodies and little fuckin chicken legs. Only they don't have huge upper bodies, they have huge upper bodies for the women over 60 category.

[Ryad]

I deadlift way more than I squat. Most people who squat more than they deadlift are cheating depth in the squat or have a very good suit for squatting. I squat in the low to mid 3's and deadlift in the mid to upper 4's.

Hmm... I box squat...
I always thought that the heavy weights resting on your shoulders and arms for the deadlifts makes it a limiting factor, as oppose to them resting on your entire spine...


That's because they are the typical guys you see at the gym, huge upper bodies and little fuckin chicken legs. Only they don't have huge upper bodies, they have huge upper bodies for the women over 60 category.

Why the hate man?

[HeaT]

That's because they are the typical guys you see at the gym, huge upper bodies and little fuckin chicken legs. Only they don't have huge upper bodies, they have huge upper bodies for the women over 60 category.

just out of curiosity, do you think coaches...from basketball, football, hockey, baseball any sport that were AVERAGE at best maybe not even average, have no idea what they are talking about for their sport and that they are not credible??? and are you saying that because they do not look like athletes either, that they do not know what they are talking about in relation to their sport???

im outi

Roberth

[xxphilopiaxx]

I recently got the workout bug again.

My goals for my body are:
-Increase overal strength
-More muscle definition. Not exactly ripped, just more shape to the muscles
-To have a more lean, muscular look. Im not looking to bulk up more than I already am.

With these goals in mind, I've decided that going back to the basics is my best approach. I think in order for anyone to get the body they desire, they have to construct a work out that is suitable for it. If you go to the gym just to work out and lift weights, you'll eventually see results, but they might not be what you want. Im not planning on competing in any contest so, I dont need to get shredded to the bones. Im not saying I wouldn't like to be ripped. Right now my goal is to have the workout body-look: wide back and shoulders, V-taper, strong legs, strong arms, flat stomach. Simple.

So, my workouts are very intense, but they use basic exercises.

Chest:
-Flat bench
-Incline dumbell presses/fly
-Weighted dips (for chest)

Back:
-Wide grip pull ups
-Seated Rows/T-bar rows/bent over barbell rows
-Back extensions

Shoulders:
-Military presses
-front/side/rear lateral raises
-Shrugs

Legs:
-(Variation of) Squats
-Deadlifts
-Hack squats/Leg presses
-calf raises

Arms:
-Pull ups
-Barbell curls
-Concentration curls/preacher curls/spider curls
-Weighted dips (for triceps)
-skull crushers/close grip bench press
-pull downs/extentions

I usually focus on 1 body part a day on a cycle of 3 on, 1 off-with sunday always off. I also very the intensity of my workouts. One week, I might go heavy and do 6-8 reps and the next I'll lower it a bit and do 8-10 reps or go heavier and do 4-6 reps. This is to shock my body. Also, with the list given, I dont start the workouts with the same exercise. If i stated with incline dumbell presses for chest last week and ended with the dips. The next time I might start with the dips first. Again, this is to shock my muscles and also so that the other muscle can get a full workout as well.

I do abs on my cardio days, which is 3x a week. I dont have a set time and day for cardio, because I dont like to feel i have to set one. Some days I feel like running, so I'll run for miles. Other days, I just want to hop on the stationary bike for 15 minutes.

As for my diet, again Im going back to basics. I eat about 6 small-mid size meals a day, and slightly a bit more after I work out. with each meal I make sure I am getting plenty of carbs, lean protien, vegetables/fruits, and enough fat. The only think i really pay attention too is the overal total number of calories Im taking in and from what. I try to get get 50% of my calories from cabs 30% from protien, and about 20% from fruits/veggies. I also make sure to get enough fats as well. Again, I dont follow a strict diet. If i need to eat, I will-I just try and make healthy choices. Avoid processed foods as much as I can, avoid fried foods, avoid junk food and thats it. Everything else, I eat in moderation. ..if I was competing and needed a specific diet so i can get ripped, then I'd follow a magazine diet. My diet is completely suppliment free. I know there are a lot of good suppliments out there, but I want to keep my training suppliment free-just my own reasons.

Also, be sure to drink pleny of water and get plenty of rest. Rest, rest, rest, rest, rest is the most important to get those results.

So, depending on your goals, make your work out and diet work the best for you.

ETA: If you dont have time to hit a gym or anything like that-basic home exercises are always good. There are a lot of push-up variations, lots of crunch and ab workout variations, wall squats, calf raises, chair dips, etc...

[S.R.T.]

just out of curiosity, do you think coaches...from basketball, football, hockey, baseball any sport that were AVERAGE at best maybe not even average, have no idea what they are talking about for their sport and that they are not credible??? and are you saying that because they do not look like athletes either, that they do not know what they are talking about in relation to their sport???

im outi

Roberth

ok, Magnus, Truong are either of you coaches???.....Well then.

That's a great point Roberth. Im outi.

[tajiri]

no hate please:

what are some good free-weight excercises to build-up delts?

[HeaT]

ok, Magnus, Truong are either of you coaches???.....Well then.

That's a great point Roberth. Im outi.

a trainer is a like a coach for weighlifting/health fitness/etc...

there are trainers for sports conditioning who dont look like anything special themselves but who know their shit...they develop workouts for athletes for functional strength and other needs...

and mangus is actually a trainer, so ya, in a sense he is a weightlifting/health fitness coach...

how qualified he is? that is a different story...but that is not the point i am making...

im outi

Roberth

[MagnusMadness]

Hmm... I box squat...
I always thought that the heavy weights resting on your shoulders and arms for the deadlifts makes it a limiting factor, as oppose to them resting on your entire spine...



Why the hate man?

How tall is the box? Also, even if you just touch and go, the slight rebound helps out...

How long have you been squatting? I use a box to teach depth and form, but usually try to move away from it as soon as I can....I usually progress an average client in this fashion:

BW BoxSquat (might use medicine balls to help them with balance)-Dumbell box squat-barbell box squat-free squat...

With the barbell box squat I may not even add weight past the starting point...when it becomes easier, just remove the box and watch how much harder it is for them!! Kinda funny sometimes.

[Tejio]

a trainer is a like a coach for weighlifting/health fitness/etc...

there are trainers for sports conditioning who dont look like anything special themselves but who know their shit...they develop workouts for athletes for functional strength and other needs...

and mangus is actually a trainer, so ya, in a sense he is a weightlifting/health fitness coach...

how qualified he is? that is a different story...but that is not the point i am making...

im outi

Roberth

I agree with you on that... I had a past trainer where she looks nothing what you'd expect because of her height & size. At first, I had the same thought of where I'd think that my $800 would go to waste. Proved me wrong!

Good luck to everyone out there training hard to get to where they need to get to :tup:

[Truong]

Why are people still taking SRT's posts seriously? The guy is a genuine fucktard.

The MAJORITY of the people in this world will deadlift more then they squat. The only reason SOME powerlifters have higher squats is because of the usage of suits. It's not a raw lift, and the range of motion is generally SHIT (barely parallel).

This is a squat suit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMUlCZm3WUw

And this is a suited squat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-92-w4ssOw

Just to let you in on how much suits actually help: the world record RAW bench is barely over 700. The world record SUITED bench press is 1010 pounds. That's 300 pound increase from wearing a suit.

Look how ridiculous these suits look: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlDWdfTAx8o

And the reasons why some powerlifters have higher squat than deadlift? Because there's no such thing as a suit for deadlifting. The deadlift is considered the purest test of strength because there's no suit of any kind to help you pull it. At most, you get a belt and knee wraps. Hell, even the world record BENCH is higher than the deadlift (1010 vs 1003).

Again, SRT proves himself to be a gigantic dumb shit, but continues to posts nonsense. Must be a little fruity bodybuilder who got butthurt from a few snide comments I made towards bodybuilding.

If you're squatting more than you deadlift, you're not squatting right. Like Magnus said, you're either cheating with shitty ROM (1/4 squat, barely parallel squat). Ass to grass is the only way to squat, imo.

[Soldier Zero]

You have to define "functional" for yourself. To most people the bench press isn't very functional. I will say that "functional" is the newest catch phrase...don't get too caught up.

Mostly everyday use, usually if I'm helping my dad fix things (toilet and putting in hard wood floors for example) or just lifting items in general from one spot to another. I find my lower back, forearms, quads, shoulders, hamstrings, and middle back getting the bulk of the work in any activity. It's not everyday things, but time-to-time.

I like doing full body for size, but it seems so wasteful when I can't use it seriously outside of the weight room. My bench can be at an all time high, but I would barely be using my pecs for any real use besides exercises.

[Green]

What's the cheapest decent-tasting weight gainer, considering that I live in Toronto?

[Ryad]

How tall is the box? Also, even if you just touch and go, the slight rebound helps out...

How long have you been squatting? I use a box to teach depth and form, but usually try to move away from it as soon as I can....I usually progress an average client in this fashion:

BW BoxSquat (might use medicine balls to help them with balance)-Dumbell box squat-barbell box squat-free squat...

With the barbell box squat I may not even add weight past the starting point...when it becomes easier, just remove the box and watch how much harder it is for them!! Kinda funny sometimes.

The box allows me to go slightly below parallel.
I definately dont rebound of it, since I have to momentarily relax all the muscles, and explosively rise.
Definately not a VERY deep squat, which may be the reason it is higher than my deadlift, which you have to sink low...
Box Squats is the West Side way of squatting.
Read this: http://www.elitefts.com/documents/box-squat.htm
It is mostly to improve your regular squat... I alternate between the two.
I will try to squat deeper with lighter weights and when I get used to it, see what I can manage.
It may be because I squat more than I deadlift... but I am relatively new (around 6 months) so maybe that will change...

Truong, those suits are ridiculous.
Any equipment that aids in lifting is useless in my opinion, outside of injury-prevention...

[MagnusMadness]

The box allows me to go slightly below parallel.
I definately dont rebound of it, since I have to momentarily relax all the muscles, and explosively rise.
Definately not a VERY deep squat, which may be the reason it is higher than my deadlift, which you have to sink low...
Box Squats is the West Side way of squatting.
Read this: http://www.elitefts.com/documents/box-squat.htm
It is mostly to improve your regular squat... I alternate between the two.
I will try to squat deeper with lighter weights and when I get used to it, see what I can manage.
It may be because I squat more than I deadlift... but I am relatively new (around 6 months) so maybe that will change...

Truong, those suits are ridiculous.
Any equipment that aids in lifting is useless in my opinion, outside of injury-prevention...


The article reinforces what I said about teaching depth....and it looks like he uses the box for dynamic effort work...working in the 50-60% intensity range for 10-12 doubles...

You will definitely be able to box squat more than you free squat. If you deadlift regularly, at some point, you will probably be pulling more than you squat...


On a side note....I can clean over 200lbs now...I'm kinda stoked about that...as I'm pretty new to power cleans.

[Ryad]

The article reinforces what I said about teaching depth....and it looks like he uses the box for dynamic effort work...working in the 50-60% intensity range for 10-12 doubles...

You will definitely be able to box squat more than you free squat. If you deadlift regularly, at some point, you will probably be pulling more than you squat...


On a side note....I can clean over 200lbs now...I'm kinda stoked about that...as I'm pretty new to power cleans.

Cool... I want to start doing some olympic lifting... but there arent any places that teach the basics, and I am reluctant to learn from videos on the internet...

[MagnusMadness]

Cool... I want to start doing some olympic lifting... but there arent any places that teach the basics, and I am reluctant to learn from videos on the internet...

I had to teach myself. It sux. Especially if you do it right and except no less. I thought I was doing cleans well until I found out I'm supposed to be doing a double knee bend mid lift...Had to teach myself all over again.

Trick is not progressing in weight until ur form is flawless, even if it's uber light. I felt like I had been doing cleans with 135 forever.

[Rhio2k]

Guys, is it okay to do bi's and tri's more than once a week? I mean like this:

Mon: Triceps, chest
Tues: Biceps, back, lats
Fri: Biceps triceps

Oh, and I weighed myself in my skivvies yesterday, and over the last 3 weeks I gained 10lbs. I think the main thing that caused that was I hadn't been getting enough sleep (5-5 1/2 hours average). Now that my mom started a night job last month, that left me with no distractions at night and I'm able to get around 7 hours of sleep on weeknights.

[Truong]

Rhio: you can... but why would you want to? You'll get overblown, disproportional, goofy looking arms. Ever see one of those guys on the streets, where they the droopiest looking shoulders, chests so big they look like titties, and two gigantic puffy looking arms? That look is goofy as hell.

And your days are kinda weird too. Why Monday and Tuesday back to back, then take a two day break? Imo, you should do a 3 day split routine, Monday, Wednesday, Friday. It gives your body plenty of rest in between work outs. Monday, do your chest and tris; Wednesday do back and bis; then on Friday you can go all out training them gunz for the ladies.

[BEEFCAKE]

Guys, is it okay to do bi's and tri's more than once a week? I mean like this:

Mon: Triceps, chest
Tues: Biceps, back, lats
Fri: Biceps triceps

Oh, and I weighed myself in my skivvies yesterday, and over the last 3 weeks I gained 10lbs. I think the main thing that caused that was I hadn't been getting enough sleep (5-5 1/2 hours average). Now that my mom started a night job last month, that left me with no distractions at night and I'm able to get around 7 hours of sleep on weeknights.


2x = overtraining, once a week is fine, giveyour CNS/muscles to recover an feedem an grow, yeah sleeping made a big difference for me, the same as you I was only getting around 4-5 hours of sleep, but now I avg at least 7-9 if I can.

Truong, I always figured it wasn't their arms that made them look droopy, but rather their lack of development in their shoulders (delts).

What I would do w/o an ipod during cardio :looney:

[Rhio2k]

And your days are kinda weird too. Why Monday and Tuesday back to back, then take a two day break?


Lol, I didn't post the whole workout week, just the relevant days.

[kainzero]

Cool... I want to start doing some olympic lifting... but there arent any places that teach the basics, and I am reluctant to learn from videos on the internet...
I tried to teach myself and it didn't work out so well. And these are the "power" versions, the one without double knee bends and low catch positions.

Oh yeah, it definitely sucks when you practice in the squat rack, miss your catch, and start crashing all over the rack and making funny sounds. =P


Guys, is it okay to do bi's and tri's more than once a week? I mean like this:

Mon: Triceps, chest
Tues: Biceps, back, lats
Fri: Biceps triceps

I wouldn't do it unless your arms are way small compared to the rest of your body. If I did do it, I'd probably train arms everyday as a kind of shock training.
for like 2 weeks out of the year, then resume normal training.

Anyway, I pretty much use WS4SB right now. But I just keep thinking how crappy it is working out legs. It's like... you're not really gonna impress any chicks with massive quadriceps and hamstrings. I like lifting heavy weights but you can never show off your legs really. My body @ 180# is naturally bottom heavy, so I have a 1RM 350# DL without that much training but my 3RM bench is only 145# and I can only do 2-3 chinups at a time. Sucks.

Everyone laughs at the guy at the gym with a huge upperbody and chicken legs, but man. That guy with huge legs but skinny on top is definitely dumb-looking also. That's me.... I think.

[DVD:madZ]

Hmm, nutrition question: I was looking at some popcorn at the super market, and on the back it said that palm oils added a trivial amount of trans fat. I was wondering that whether this trans fat was neither beneficial or harmful (like those found in meat and dairy products) or purely harmful (like hydrogenated oils). Anyone know?

[MagnusMadness]

And your days are kinda weird too. Why Monday and Tuesday back to back, then take a two day break? Imo, you should do a 3 day split routine, Monday, Wednesday, Friday. It gives your body plenty of rest in between work outs. Monday, do your chest and tris; Wednesday do back and bis; then on Friday you can go all out training them gunz for the ladies.

No legs?

[HeaT]

Why Monday and Tuesday back to back, then take a two day break? Imo, you should do a 3 day split routine, Monday, Wednesday, Friday. It gives your body plenty of rest in between work outs. Monday, do your chest and tris; Wednesday do back and bis; then on Friday you can go all out training them gunz for the ladies.

why not back to back then rest? i do day1,day2, rest, day3, day4, rest,rest...depends how you structure your workouts on those days...

and you are missing legs like magnus said...

im outi

Roberth

[Truong]

I didn't bother screaming WORK LEGS WORK LEGS cuz it didn't seem like Rhio cared for it. He wants big gunz, and I'm helping him with them.

Heat: imo, 3 day split routine is better than any routine where it calls for you to lift back to back hard. Again, unless it's bodybuilding where you're doing a bunch of isolation exercises, then who cares.

[PBalla]

have we discussed cheap, real cheap, but healthy food yet?

on a diff note, do all of you buy your food in bulk like at sam's club and stuff?

[Ryad]

Just got me some egg whites...
I just had to add one egg (yolk and all), to make it a bit yellow and to give it more of a normal eggs taste...
Definately will keep doing this, as it is probably a lot more healthier than my 3eggs a day routine...

I am getting tired of turkey cold cuts...

I dont think I can do what you are doing magnus... I feel like I will screw up majorly without personal instruction
True though, If I just practice with a broom or something for form... I just want someone experienced to see my form before I move on

[Soldier Zero]

Hmm, nutrition question: I was looking at some popcorn at the super market, and on the back it said that palm oils added a trivial amount of trans fat. I was wondering that whether this trans fat was neither beneficial or harmful (like those found in meat and dairy products) or purely harmful (like hydrogenated oils). Anyone know?

From what I know, trans fat altogether is bad, too much causes hardening of the arteries (schelerosis or some spelling like that).


Mostly everyday use, usually if I'm helping my dad fix things (toilet and putting in hard wood floors for example) or just lifting items in general from one spot to another. I find my lower back, forearms, quads, shoulders, hamstrings, and middle back getting the bulk of the work in any activity. It's not everyday things, but time-to-time.

I like doing full body for size, but it seems so wasteful when I can't use it seriously outside of the weight room. My bench can be at an all time high, but I would barely be using my pecs for any real use besides exercises.

Input on that would be nice.

Olympic lifts are that hard to get form even on light weight?

[Truong]

From what I know, trans fat altogether is bad, too much causes hardening of the arteries (schelerosis or some spelling like that).



Input on that would be nice.

Olympic lifts are that hard to get form even on light weight?

That's what I would categorize 'everyday strength' as, as well. The ability to do manual labor over a long period of time. Like you said, lifting an object from point A to point B, without fatiguing.

For this strength, there's no better exercise then the deadlift. It's quite simply the best overall body exercise. The deadlift will work every muscle you mentioned, and then more.

Squat is obvious.

Grip strength is also HUGELY underrated. If you can only do one arm exercise for the rest of your life, make it a grip exercise. Grip/forearm strength >>>>>>>>>> tris and bis by a fucking MILE. Everything you ever lift in life, you first have to be able to grip and hold on to it. Farmer's walk is a great exercise for grip strength. Grab two dumbbells, hold them by the sides, and just walk around your gym for as long as you can hold on to them.

Imo, these 3 are the best everyday functional lifting strength exercises you can do.

And yeah, Oly lifting really is hard to do properly. If you're serious about it, get a certified coach to teach you. Or you can soldier it up and learn off youtube instructional videos lol.

[Ryad]

^
Totally true about grip training...
everyone should incorporate that in their training

[Soldier Zero]

That's what I would categorize 'everyday strength' as, as well. The ability to do manual labor over a long period of time. Like you said, lifting an object from point A to point B, without fatiguing.

For this strength, there's no better exercise then the deadlift. It's quite simply the best overall body exercise. The deadlift will work every muscle you mentioned, and then more.

Squat is obvious.

Grip strength is also HUGELY underrated. If you can only do one arm exercise for the rest of your life, make it a grip exercise. Grip/forearm strength >>>>>>>>>> tris and bis by a fucking MILE. Everything you ever lift in life, you first have to be able to grip and hold on to it. Farmer's walk is a great exercise for grip strength. Grab two dumbbells, hold them by the sides, and just walk around your gym for as long as you can hold on to them.

Imo, these 3 are the best everyday functional lifting strength exercises you can do.

And yeah, Oly lifting really is hard to do properly. If you're serious about it, get a certified coach to teach you. Or you can soldier it up and learn off youtube instructional videos lol.

Thanks, lol, I won't try the O-lifts right now, but I'll change up my program and post here right before I try it. Probably will be in a month or so.

[Gain]

have we discussed cheap, real cheap, but healthy food yet?

on a diff note, do all of you buy your food in bulk like at sam's club and stuff?

first off, what's expensive and what's cheap iyo? second, what food items are you classifying as healthy foods?

it's difficult, if not impossible, to eat healthy and not shell out a few more bucks than usual...

i think Americans are spoiled by the processed foods and junk foods that are so readily available... someone once told me food is cheaper in the US than anywhere else in the world, and that's not only the convenient over processed foods, simple sugar foods etc.... but also organic, natural and just plain healthier foods (lean meat and produce etc.)

the cheap bag of 99cent chips or 99cent burger simply gives the impression that the alternative seems expensive... it's just a matter of making healthy living a priority and putting aside a little more money as an investment towards a healthier life...

there are some instances where people have been cornered into having to rely on cheap meals and such, but for the most part, it's just a matter of a bit of sacrifice...

~

as for cheap stuff, i'm not gonna even play like i'm as educated as some others on this board, but some stuff i use that are cheap are:

designer whey protein from BJS (like $20 for a box)... it's a decent product for a good price...

eggs are always good and always a pretty cheap breakfast food...

i'm pretty much fruits (apples and berries), greens, nuts and chicken breast, turkey cuts, salmon and or tuna on weekdays and part of the weekend... by cutting out junk food and soda etc., my meals/snakcs are blander (not necessarily.. there are some great spices and ish people give me... to spicen things up) and each item is a little more expensive, but overall it works out... i'm not hurting harder than usual in grocery expenses...

it's the eating out and trying to keep it lean that hurts the wallet...

peanut butter can also last you a while and is pretty cheap... even the natural/organic kinds...

[The Green Trench Coat]

So i'm 4 weeks into my cutting cycle.. man I never realized how tough cutting is man.. sheesh ..

I know alot of you know I preached about bulking up cause thats what i did best. but this year I've beent trying to cut up more than everything

The workouts are so grueling man.. the only thing that sucks is working out with lighter weights to get those 15 to 20 reps in. I feel like a pussy breaking a sweat doing chest flies with only 60lb weights but trying to get up to 20 reps is a freaking killer I've been having to use a thermo genic just to keep up my energy for the workout and gakick for quick recovery.

4 more weeks to go.. then break than another 8 weeks then bulking again.

that's all :wink:

get strong Bromos!

[HeaT]

I didn't bother screaming WORK LEGS WORK LEGS cuz it didn't seem like Rhio cared for it. He wants big gunz, and I'm helping him with them.

Heat: imo, 3 day split routine is better than any routine where it calls for you to lift back to back hard. Again, unless it's bodybuilding where you're doing a bunch of isolation exercises, then who cares.

i understand it is your opinion but you are not really backing it with anything on why it is better...

and i also disagree because it depends how you split your workout...if you do upper1,lower1, rest, upper2, lower2, rest, rest...there is no reason for a rest between each workout day because you have enough rest between when you first hit that particular muslce group to the next time...

like in the example i gave you have a 3 day rest bewteen the upper workouts...

but like if you are doing whole body workouts i can see how you woud want to structure your rest periods like that...so that is why i said it depends on how you are structuring your work outs...cause your 3 day split will not always be optimal for the variety of programs people have...

im outi

Roberth

[HeaT]

So i'm 4 weeks into my cutting cycle.. man I never realized how tough cutting is man.. sheesh ..

I know alot of you know I preached about bulking up cause thats what i did best. but this year I've beent trying to cut up more than everything

The workouts are so grueling man.. the only thing that sucks is working out with lighter weights to get those 15 to 20 reps in. I feel like a pussy breaking a sweat doing chest flies with only 60lb weights but trying to get up to 20 reps is a freaking killer I've been having to use a thermo genic just to keep up my energy for the workout and gakick for quick recovery.

4 more weeks to go.. then break than another 8 weeks then bulking again.

that's all :wink:

get strong Bromos!

cutting imo is all about losing weight like 95% and not about how you lift (under the assumption that you train for hypertrophy and will continue to do so during the cutting period)...

this is from experience...if you have fat you have fat, you have to lose it to look cut and doing 15-20 reps will not help you lose fat...your diet will help you lose fat...

im outi

Roberth

[Mister K]

Hey, so I am in a postion where I will be unable to workout with weights for an extended period of time. A couple of years ago I remember hearing alot of things about effective workouts programs using only your own bodyweight. I was wondering if anyone could give me insight into thats or better yet links to a reigiem or thread about such things or somthing.

Im also doing the master cleanse for 20 days and am concerned about losing tons of muscle doing so. Anyone do this before?

Thanks

[Rhio2k]

I didn't bother screaming WORK LEGS WORK LEGS cuz it didn't seem like Rhio cared for it. He wants big gunz, and I'm helping him with them.

Heat: imo, 3 day split routine is better than any routine where it calls for you to lift back to back hard. Again, unless it's bodybuilding where you're doing a bunch of isolation exercises, then who cares.

Like I posted earlier, I only posted the relevant days of my workout week. I do legs on Thursdays. I started doing front squats this week, and they were difficult because i'm not used to the weight distribution being toward the front, but it was okay. I didn't feel any burn afterward, and was kinda dissapointed. Thought I wimped out on it. I woke up this morning and my quads damn near caught fire when I bent my knees. First thing out of my mouth for some reason was "That's the pepper!". Damn kof2k2...what's with the super-delayed burn?

[BEEFCAKE]

So i'm 4 weeks into my cutting cycle.. man I never realized how tough cutting is man.. sheesh ..

I know alot of you know I preached about bulking up cause thats what i did best. but this year I've beent trying to cut up more than everything

The workouts are so grueling man.. the only thing that sucks is working out with lighter weights to get those 15 to 20 reps in. I feel like a pussy breaking a sweat doing chest flies with only 60lb weights but trying to get up to 20 reps is a freaking killer I've been having to use a thermo genic just to keep up my energy for the workout and gakick for quick recovery.

4 more weeks to go.. then break than another 8 weeks then bulking again.

that's all :wink:

get strong Bromos!

How has Gakic been working for you? I've read mixed results but more positive than negative, besides its a Muscletech product, strength gains are supposed to be top notch w/ Gakic.

[VruS]

I'm pretty sure I've been deadlifting properly, but forsome reason when I lie down flat on a hard surface after one set, my lower back KILLS. It becomes too painful to lie down and have to 'arch' my back up for about 3-5 minutes before the pain goes away. Doesn't happen when I sit or stand. Doesn't happen when I do atg squats or anything. It feels like my lower back is being stressed wayyy too much, though when I deadlift I put more power towards my legs on the heels. Is this normal or do I have some fucked up back?

[MagnusMadness]

I'm pretty sure I've been deadlifting properly, but forsome reason when I lie down flat on a hard surface after one set, my lower back KILLS. It becomes too painful to lie down and have to 'arch' my back up for about 3-5 minutes before the pain goes away. Doesn't happen when I sit or stand. Doesn't happen when I do atg squats or anything. It feels like my lower back is being stressed wayyy too much, though when I deadlift I put more power towards my legs on the heels. Is this normal or do I have some fucked up back?


You can't always blame pain/injury on poor form. You could have tight hamstrings and relatively weak core musculature, I don't know.

1. Don't do anything that hurts or causes pain.
2. Go to the doctor if pain persists....and I mean a good ortho, not a chiro. (nothing against chiro's)
3. Try light stretching and foam rolling prior to workouts to improve tissue density and blood circulation, it did WONDERS for my back.


cutting imo is all about losing weight like 95% and not about how you lift (under the assumption that you train for hypertrophy and will continue to do so during the cutting period)...

this is from experience...if you have fat you have fat, you have to lose it to look cut and doing 15-20 reps will not help you lose fat...your diet will help you lose fat...

im outi

Roberth

Agreed. I don't even do 20 rep sets with my women. That's a good way to lose a lot of strength and muscle IMO.


i understand it is your opinion but you are not really backing it with anything on why it is better...

and i also disagree because it depends how you split your workout...if you do upper1,lower1, rest, upper2, lower2, rest, rest...there is no reason for a rest between each workout day because you have enough rest between when you first hit that particular muslce group to the next time...

like in the example i gave you have a 3 day rest bewteen the upper workouts...

but like if you are doing whole body workouts i can see how you woud want to structure your rest periods like that...so that is why i said it depends on how you are structuring your work outs...cause your 3 day split will not always be optimal for the variety of programs people have...

im outi

Roberth

He did say "when lifting hard." 4 days a week of heavy lifting can be REALLY neurologically taxxing. But if you utilize a balanced program and unload regularly then I don't think 4 days of lifting is out of the question. I really like upper/lower splits like you mentioned and they are very popular.


That's what I would categorize 'everyday strength' as, as well. The ability to do manual labor over a long period of time. Like you said, lifting an object from point A to point B, without fatiguing.

For this strength, there's no better exercise then the deadlift. It's quite simply the best overall body exercise. The deadlift will work every muscle you mentioned, and then more.

Squat is obvious.

Grip strength is also HUGELY underrated. If you can only do one arm exercise for the rest of your life, make it a grip exercise. Grip/forearm strength >>>>>>>>>> tris and bis by a fucking MILE. Everything you ever lift in life, you first have to be able to grip and hold on to it. Farmer's walk is a great exercise for grip strength. Grab two dumbbells, hold them by the sides, and just walk around your gym for as long as you can hold on to them.

Imo, these 3 are the best everyday functional lifting strength exercises you can do.

And yeah, Oly lifting really is hard to do properly. If you're serious about it, get a certified coach to teach you. Or you can soldier it up and learn off youtube instructional videos lol.

I agree about the squatting and deadlifting. Grip strength is important, especially if it's holding you back. I, for one, don't use straps EVER anymore...so I find I don't need any additional grip work. I do have to use a mixed grip when I deadlift really heavy though...

I actually read somewhere that a stronger grip somehow equates to a longer life....I swear I didn't make that up and the source is very credible.

[TheIlluminati]

Grip strength is also HUGELY underrated. If you can only do one arm exercise for the rest of your life, make it a grip exercise. Grip/forearm strength >>>>>>>>>> tris and bis by a fucking MILE. Everything you ever lift in life, you first have to be able to grip and hold on to it. Farmer's walk is a great exercise for grip strength. Grab two dumbbells, hold them by the sides, and just walk around your gym for as long as you can hold on to them.


I'm quite interested in doing this. Is it effective to do it at the end of a workout?

Truong, you talk a lot about building strength v. bodybuilding. Can you talk more about this and about a middle path?

[MagnusMadness]

I'm quite interested in doing this. Is it effective to do it at the end of a workout?

Truong, you talk a lot about building strength v. bodybuilding. Can you talk more about this and about a middle path?

I know this question wasn't directed towards me...but I think he will mostly agree...

Strength training and bodybuilding closely parallel. Typically, if you are building muscle, you will get stronger by default (physics)...one of the ways we force our bodies to adapt further (build muscle) is by putting more weight on the bar (obviously not the ONLY way)

Training EXCLUSIVELY for strength calls for a different kind of adaptation to take place....neurological. Basically, your CNS gets better at recruiting the existing muscle fibers for a particular exercise.

How do you elicit neurological adaptations once ur past beginner's level? Lift heavy...to put it bluntly...making your goal to perioidically lift more weight than you ever have.

If you want to take the middle road. Lift heavy, but still with sufficient volume to generate at least a moderate amount of fatigue, and eat enough food to support growth.

Might sound crazy but when I attempted a westside style program that I wrote, I put an inch on my arms....and I didn't really gain any weight....

[Soldier Zero]

Might sound crazy but when I attempted a westside style program that I wrote, I put an inch on my arms....and I didn't really gain any weight....

An inch in what amount of time, like a month?

[VruS]

You can't always blame pain/injury on poor form. You could have tight hamstrings and relatively weak core musculature, I don't know.

1. Don't do anything that hurts or causes pain.
2. Go to the doctor if pain persists....and I mean a good ortho, not a chiro. (nothing against chiro's)
3. Try light stretching and foam rolling prior to workouts to improve tissue density and blood circulation, it did WONDERS for my back.



this is the only exercise that 'hurts' after doing it. It's only there if I wanted to lie down flat on the ground and it lasts for ~5 mins after every set. Pain is only temporary....I'm fine if I just keep standing or sitting or maybe lying down on soft surface (like a bed).

What I don't get is that I am perfectly fine doing squats with heavy weights. Maybe I am mistaking it for some major soreness? I'll try the stretching to see if that works though.

[MagnusMadness]

An inch in what amount of time, like a month?


I honestly don't remember....it wasn't some obscenely short period of time....keep in mind I've been training for a while now...I have to work smart and hard for everything I get these days.


this is the only exercise that 'hurts' after doing it. It's only there if I wanted to lie down flat on the ground and it lasts for ~5 mins after every set. Pain is only temporary....I'm fine if I just keep standing or sitting or maybe lying down on soft surface (like a bed).

What I don't get is that I am perfectly fine doing squats with heavy weights. Maybe I am mistaking it for some major soreness? I'll try the stretching to see if that works though.

Don't do anything that hurts....what you are describing isn't normal by any means. Deadlifts place a lot more torque on the spine....the weight isn't proximal as in a squat. I'm not saying that's necessarily a "bad" thing, but it's quite conceivable that deadlifts could cause pain that squats won't.

Describe the pain and exact location though...I'm just curious....is it para-spinal? Directly on the spine? What region? Thoracic? Lumbar? Cervical? Is it a sharp sensation? Dull? Radiating pain? If it is radiating...does the pain shoot down ur leg or up ur back? Is it a burning sensation?

You should never have to ask yourself if it's good or bad pain...if u don't know, then it's prolly bad...If your workouts yeild some ungodly soreness then I would question ur training practices.

[kainzero]

have we discussed cheap, real cheap, but healthy food yet?

on a diff note, do all of you buy your food in bulk like at sam's club and stuff?
I like this article:

http://www.johnberardi.com/articles/nutrition/berardi_kitchen_1.htm

Because of that, I eat a 3 egg omelette every morning. Fruits are good and cheap, as are mixed nuts. I recently found that the Tyson mesquite-flavored chicken breasts taste really good. I buy sirloin ground beef patties, turkey breast, pesto, and whole wheat bread to make quick sandwiches, along with romaine lettuce and tomatoes. Dried fruit is pretty handy to keep around, and I'd eat more beef jerky if it were cheaper =P

I also found out the awesomeness that is whole foods. While it seems like your typical yuppie-mart, the bulk items like steel cut oats, quinoa, etc. are really good. I tried quinoa today and it's real good... if you're Asian, you can substitute it for rice and you'll barely notice the difference.

[MaDPoWer]

I gotta question. I've been into lifting for years and I'm arms are ripped and I can see definition in my chest and abs but there's just like 10lbs I need to lose before I get to were I want.

My question is, if I drop lifting, and do all cardio until I lose the unwanted lbs, will I lose any muscle mass in the process? I read somewhere that too much cardio (more than 30mins a week) make you burn off muscle!

[MagnusMadness]

I gotta question. I've been into lifting for years and I'm arms are ripped and I can see definition in my chest and abs but there's just like 10lbs I need to lose before I get to were I want.

My question is, if I drop lifting, and do all cardio until I lose the unwanted lbs, will I lose any muscle mass in the process? I read somewhere that too much cardio (more than 30mins a week) make you burn off muscle!

I never understand why people want to do this. Working out can be VERY metabolic. Which do you think is going to do more for your metabolism and essentially burn more calories: An intense "go, go, go" workout lasting an hour or so....or 30 minutes of jogging on a treadmill....It almost sounds silly when I put it that way doesn't it?

Do cardio when you are not lifting. Guys don't need to do an excessive amount of cardio. Make the cardio taxxing enough that 30 minutes is all you can muster.

[MaDPoWer]

I see. I hear that lifting lighter with little to no rest between exercises is a good fat burner

[Soldier Zero]

I like this article:

http://www.johnberardi.com/articles/nutrition/berardi_kitchen_1.htm

I'm surprised he doesn't keep milk, I thought fat free would be fine.

[MagnusMadness]

I see. I hear that lifting lighter with little to no rest between exercises is a good fat burner

Not necessarily lifting lighter...When I lift with hypertrophy (growth) as the goal, I am doing sets for as little as 3 reps to as many as 12 reps. I don't really venture outside the 12 rep zone for any reason.

But if trimming down was a goal of mine, I would definitely consider doing full body workouts (metabolically demanding workouts) 2-3x a week doing cardio whenever I could on off days.

Lifting weights also gives ur body a reason to maintain the LBM it has while in a caloric deficit.

[VruS]

Describe the pain and exact location though...I'm just curious....is it para-spinal? Directly on the spine? What region? Thoracic? Lumbar? Cervical? Is it a sharp sensation? Dull? Radiating pain? If it is radiating...does the pain shoot down ur leg or up ur back? Is it a burning sensation?

You should never have to ask yourself if it's good or bad pain...if u don't know, then it's prolly bad...If your workouts yeild some ungodly soreness then I would question ur training practices.

I think it is paraspinal, lumbar and dull sensation (which I could be mistaking for soreness?) . doesn't radiate to anywhere and doesn't feel like a burning sensation.

so I dont know, you guys wouldn't get 'pain' if you lied down on the floor after a set of deadlifts? I might have to find alternatives to this then ;|

[MagnusMadness]

I think it is paraspinal, lumbar and dull sensation (which I could be mistaking for soreness?) . doesn't radiate to anywhere and doesn't feel like a burning sensation.

so I dont know, you guys wouldn't get 'pain' if you lied down on the floor after a set of deadlifts? I might have to find alternatives to this then ;|

has it always done this? How many reps of deadlifts are you doing?


lol, can you video urself deadlifting and upload it somewhere for me to watch?

[GRITZ]

Hey guys,

I'm 24 and recently I feel like my joints aren't what they used to be. My elbows, shoulders, and knees pop/crack pretty often and I feel like I can't move up in weight too much because it will bother me even more. I'm not a huge fan of supplements (the only stuff I take are 100% whey protein shakes and 2,222 amino acids) but is there something I could take or do that might help my joints out? Any suggestions are welcome.

[Rhio2k]

Glucosamine and calcium supplements?

[MagnusMadness]

You could try glucosamine chondroitin but I'm not sure as to it's effectiveness. If you are in pain, you need to figure out why and fix the problem.

[samB]

Hey guys, I was wondering what your thoughts are on my work out
just to keep in mind, I'm 6'2 185. Slim body sz but a minor gut that I'd like to get rid of but also build muscle in the process of losing fat cals.

I go to the gym 4 days a week for about 1 1/2 hrs. I start out with stretching for a good 5 minutes. Play a game of basketball (est. time 10 min) just to get my heart up then I go on the treadmill and run for 10-15 min. at a first fast pace then I go to a brisk walking pace for 15 min that is a very fast walk because I heard if youd like to lose fat then this treadmill routine will do the job. Then I'll go and do 2 reps of 30 crunches. From then on I'll lift weights for 20 min, in between reps I'll do 10 push ups taking very minor breaks when I'm tired. afterwards I'll just go and do 2 machines either for my leg, biceps, chest, or arms. When I'm done physically I'll go into the sauna for 15 min and I'm done for the day.

Any responses would be good and suggestions would also be accepted. Thanks

[MagnusMadness]

I've always wondered is it good or bad to work out if you're still sore? Whenever I lift for the first time after a long break, I get really sore for like 4 days or so. I started back up again for the summer on Friday, and my chest/triceps are still somewhat sore. I usually do something like this:

Day 1: chest/triceps
Day 2: back/biceps
Day 3: legs/shoulders
Day 4: rest

And then I repeat... so today, I'm back on Day 1. So yeah, can anyone answer my question?

First off, this is a split...not a workout...I still don't really know what you are doing on those days. Secondly, I don't like the split. Don't workout more than 2 days in a row without a day off, and 6 days a week of working out is too much. You grow when you are resting and recovering.

But to answer your question, based on ur workout...yes it is bad. You are probably doing too much and will get burned out or injured one. For myself, on a much less aggressive split with adequate rest and nutrition, I know that if I'm a little sore that it's not a big deal and I go ahead with the workouts.


Hey guys, I was wondering what your thoughts are on my work out
just to keep in mind, I'm 6'2 185. Slim body sz but a minor gut that I'd like to get rid of but also build muscle in the process of losing fat cals.

I go to the gym 4 days a week for about 1 1/2 hrs. I start out with stretching for a good 5 minutes. Play a game of basketball (est. time 10 min) just to get my heart up then I go on the treadmill and run for 10-15 min. at a first fast pace then I go to a brisk walking pace for 15 min that is a very fast walk because I heard if youd like to lose fat then this treadmill routine will do the job. Then I'll go and do 2 reps of 30 crunches. From then on I'll lift weights for 20 min, in between reps I'll do 10 push ups taking very minor breaks when I'm tired. afterwards I'll just go and do 2 machines either for my leg, biceps, chest, or arms. When I'm done physically I'll go into the sauna for 15 min and I'm done for the day.

Any responses would be good and suggestions would also be accepted. Thanks

Terminology....sets are made up of reps or repetitions. So in between sets you'll do 10 push ups...

I don't like this workout either. Call it personal preference, whatever. Sounds like ur just blasting urself cardiovascularly and hit up the machines to finish urself off. I don't even know where to start. Is this a good program? Not really....Will you probably lose some weight and get in better shape? Probably.

[maxx]

i think i pulled a back muscle and i got a breakdance comp this weekend..any suggestions on what to do so i can be ready in time?

[MagnusMadness]

i think i pulled a back muscle and i got a breakdance comp this weekend..any suggestions on what to do so i can be ready in time?

Ice, stretch, massage, rest. Good luck.



Even if it's not 100% it may be good enough to support ur own weight in the dance comp this weekend....don't touch any weights though.

[maxx]

ya i think i may have pulled it either doing bridges or planches...most likely the bridges cause i pushed myself the farthest i've ever gone....like i was touching my own feet.

[LongSh0t]

Hi. I'm a male, 20 YO, 5'10'' 133lbs (a few years ago, I broke 180, but then I just lost all the weight and it doesn't seem to be coming back...). Basically, I'm really scrawny (my pointy shoulders scare the ladies) and weak (I busted my back at 64lbs on a strength test).

I have gym access, but I can't pay a PT. I just want to shape my upper body, and most importantly, get stronger (esp. in the arms). I also have kind of a belly, but that 2nd priority. I assume I can just crunch it out later.

All the advice I see around is for overweight people who want to get fit, not skinny people who want to get strong. So I ask, what should I do for a training regiment? Sometimes, I find myself with a lot of time on my hands. Should I workout multiple times per day, or whenever I get the chance (like isometrics)? What else should I keep in mind?

Thanks so much.

[maxx]

well it seems my back is good now. its still kinda big compared to the other side..but i was doing lots of stuff with planches this weekend and it didnt hurt as well as flipping.

I got a question, what is too skinny for me? I'm 5'8 and lately i've been flucatuating between 139-145...at what weight am i too skinny?

[Silentness!]

Hi. I'm a male, 20 YO, 5'10'' 133lbs (a few years ago, I broke 180, but then I just lost all the weight and it doesn't seem to be coming back...). Basically, I'm really scrawny (my pointy shoulders scare the ladies) and weak (I busted my back at 64lbs on a strength test).

I have gym access, but I can't pay a PT. I just want to shape my upper body, and most importantly, get stronger (esp. in the arms). I also have kind of a belly, but that 2nd priority. I assume I can just crunch it out later.

All the advice I see around is for overweight people who want to get fit, not skinny people who want to get strong. So I ask, what should I do for a training regiment? Sometimes, I find myself with a lot of time on my hands. Should I workout multiple times per day, or whenever I get the chance (like isometrics)? What else should I keep in mind?

Thanks so much.

holy shit 133 lbs at 5'10? I think I'm 5'8 and 150-155 lbs.
_____

What does your diet look like?

[LongSh0t]

holy shit 133 lbs at 5'10? I think I'm 5'8 and 150-155 lbs.
_____

What does your diet look like?

Actually, my license says 5'11'' but I think I'm actually 5'10''...

Honestly, I eat whatever I want, as much as I want/can. I've shocked my friends with some pretty infamous take downs, like KFC Mash Bowl, Triple Stacker Value meal, Texas & Western Whopper Value Meal (not at the same time), and the toughest one: A whole KFC Big Box. In case you're wondering, I don't eat like that every day :lol:

I never thought about it, but I suppose my diet consists mostly of breakfast cereal, sandwiches (subs and burgers), frozen food, home cooked meals, and occasionally canned goods (chef boyardi, soup).

All my life, I've been a fat kid... until about 2 years ago. I guess it was because I was in college, with no money and a lot of studying to do. I walked around campus and abstained from food, but ate a ton when I got the chance and didn't change my diet. I just ate less. Now, it's like I'm stuck this way. I'm making women jealous. :lol:

However, my arms are thinner than Paris Hilton's. I want to man up, and actually be able to lift things. Please help!

[TheIlluminati]

Someone will give you a more detailed answer, but if you`re looking first to put on mass, because you`re that worried about how thin they are:

Look for a workout plan that contains primarily exercises such as overhead/military presses, bench presses, pullups, dips, squats, and deadlifts. And then follow that workout. If you don't know how to do something, ask someone who works at the gym. Especially for deadlifts and squats.