The Official NBA 2005-06 Thread [Archive] - Page 10

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Warblade49

05-24-2006, 02:31 PM

From Mark Cuban's site on how the team was built. It was posted about a year or so ago.

There is nothing tougher than being in the locker room after losing in the playoffs, particularly this year. Every man on the roster knew we were capable of playing better than we did. We knew we gave them 3 games that we had won. In the locker room after the game, it all hits you at the same time.

There is nothing you can say to players with tears welling in their eyes or rolling down their cheeks. You can put your arm around them. You can tell them how much you care about them.

The players know just how fragile every part of their careers are. You just don’t know where things will go from here. There are any number of outside elements that impact the physical and business side of basketball, which makes a lost opportunity all the harder to deal with.

It hurts. It hurts that night. You can’t sleep. It hurts the next day. The only feeling that can I compare it to is the one you get breaking up with a girlfriend. Your emotions are tied up for 8 months in the season and when it’s over. It hurts.

The only saving grace is that I love the team we have and the direction our coach will take us. It still astounds me that we did as well as we did given that we not only changed coaches with 18 games to go in the regular season, but we also did 180 degree change in philosophy. Hopefully we will have a full summer to develop our young players and a full training camp under AJ. AJ is a great teacher and motivator. Training Camp and a full season will make us far better than we were this year.

At this point last year, I was concerned. We lost in the first round. We had multiple players who were asking to be traded. We had taken some chances in bringing in players, and it didn’t work out. Guys had played for themselves rather than for the team. It was a team that was going no where fast.

Our first move was to trade Antawn Jameson to get Devin Harris and Jerry Stackhouse. Antawn wanted to be a started on a team where he could have an impact. He is a first class guy and when Washington called with the offer of the #5 pick and Stack, it was a chance to keep our word to AJ, reduce our logjam at the Power Forward position and pick up a backup point guard in training for Steve.

Of course, pretty much the next day Nash decided to leave. At that point I was very concerned. I was concerned as to what our team would have looked like had Steve stayed, but I was even more concerned about life without Steve because we now had no idea what our team would look like at the beginning of the year. It was bad enough that I thought we had made a mistake by not lottery protecting the draft pick we had traded to get Pavel.

We had always expected Steve to stay. I had also given the mandate to Donnie that other than draft picks, our committed payroll (the amount of money that we owe in total to all players) would have to come down. We were able to save some money when we traded Antawn.

Walk (Antoine Walker) had asked to be moved. I had promised him we would do our best to accommodate him. Walk was always very professional with me. We had talked through the summer to that point. I kept him up to speed on the discussions going on, but made it clear that I wasn’t going to take back more salary. That if we could do a deal that was salary neutral with him and any other players, and that would help the team, we would do the deal. Unfortunately, to that point, we hadn’t received any offers that would meet those criteria.

I also was trying to keep my options open in case the chance to trade for Shaq could become a reality. In talking to the Lakers however, they made it clear there was zero chance of a trade with us. Front door, back door, with one, two, three other teams, it wasn’t going to happen.

As of Draft Day, our starting lineup was looking to be the exact same lineup as the one we had ended the previous season with — Nash, Finley, Marquis or Josh, Dirk and Antoine Walker. On the bench we would have Eddie Najera, Shawn Bradley, Devin Harris, Stack and we knew that Danny Fortson would be turned into Calvin Booth.

One of the reasons we traded our pick to get Pavel on Draft Day was that we knew we didn’t have a great team, and that a big part of this season was going to be developing young players. We could make the playoffs, maybe do some damage there, but our biggest upside from this season would be in developing our young guns around Dirk, Steve and Fin and seeing where they could take us in the future.

Then Steve left for Phoenix. If we had questions about our team before he left, we had more after he left. We started to scramble. Our first order of business was to re-sign Marquis. Nellie liked to use him as a point guard, so it gave us some stability there.

After that, Donnie went to work. His first deal got us Jason Terry and Hendu from the Hawks for Tony Delk and Walk.

That gave us a point guard with experience and that had had individual, if not team success in the league. At that point, we honestly didn’t expect Hindu to play at all. He hadn’t played the year before due to back problems, and we expected to be able to collect insurance money on his contract. (Obviously it didn’t turn out that way, and Hindu more than paid for himself with his contributions this year). So at that point in time, the economics of that deal actually saved us money.

With the money that we had saved when Steve left, I could have just put the money in my pocket, and I seriously considered doing that.

Around that same period in time, I started having conversations with Avery Johnson about coming back as a player and then at some point after he retired, becoming a coach. I really wanted AJ here. He was the unsung hero of our 2002-3 playoff run. He ran practices and got in people’s faces when it needed to happen. When Portland ran off 3 straight against us, he was the voice in the locker room pushing the guys and the guys loved him and responded well to him.

Avery still wanted to play at that point, so we signed him to a 1 year deal as a player. He also told us that we should be going after Erick Dampier if we could work out a sign and trade with the Warriors.

The thing about a sign and trade is that it’s just that — a trade. I told Donnie that as long as we gave up enough salaries, plus what we saved from Nash, to be less than or equal to what we guaranteed Damp in his deal, I would give it my blessing. It took what seemed like months to work out, but we were able to trade basically Laettner (who we got in the Stack/Devin deal) and Eddie Najera for Damp and Evan Eschmeyer. We had stuck to our financial parameters, saved money and got to a point where we felt we had the nucleus to have a very good team. In fact, it was the first time we had what looked like a traditional team, with a post up center and 3 young perimeter players who were good and could be great defenders.

I need to also mention that although I was upset when Steve left, that was tempered because I was mad at how his agent handled the entire situation. Steve is a first class guy. Someone I think is amazing in so many ways on and off the court. His agent I don’t feel the same way about. (And for those who care about trivia, I would rather get beat by Steve, someone I like then someone I don’t think much of)

What hurt far worse than Steve leaving for more money, was having to trade Eddie Najera. Free Agents leave of their own accord. When we trade someone, it’s usually not their choice. Eddie didn’t want to leave. He loved it with the Mavs and we loved having him here. He would be in and out of Nellie’s doghouse, but he always had a smile on his face and picked up the energy and spirits of everyone around him. He not only was a crowd favorite, he was a locker room favorite as well. It was not a fun day when the trade went down.

So that was how the team of 2004-5 was put together.

Unlike last year, this year ended completely differently. I’m proud of what we accomplished, on and off the court. To a man, every new player came up to me, and thanked me for bringing them into the organization. Guys thanked each other for a great year. Our young players continued to develop and will be even better next year. I think our veterans will thrive as they get more comfortable with Avery’s system.

It doesn’t take the hurt away from losing this year. But it sure makes it easier to look forward to next year

I want to bring up one more thing that I am incredibly proud of this team for. Starting with the first game of this season, Michael Finley asked that every player on the team put his hand over his heart during the National Anthem. Although we have players from around the world, every player, coach, trainer and throughout the organization, followed his lead as a sign of team unity and as a way of saying thank you, and did so every single game of the year.

I thought that other teams might follow our lead. I thought that the media might pick up on it and maybe even give us a hard time about it since we had players from around the world. None of the above happened, which made it all the better. It was something that was uniquely our Dallas Mavericks.

I have to tell you, that as owner of the Dallas Mavericks, win or lose, I started every game, with my hand over my heart, grateful for the opportunity to live in this great country and incredibly proud of every single person representing the Mavs on that court.

Mark on Finley getting booed in Dallas.

I remember when Dirk called Utah a city the first year we made the playoffs. Every time he touched the ball he got booed. When Nick Van Exel went back to Denver, he got booed. Before game six in Dallas, someone asked about the fans booing Michael Finley and if i thought it was a good thing. Absolutely i told them. They were’nt booing Dirk the person in Utah, or Nick the person in Denver. Mavs fans arent booing michael finley the person. They all booed the guy he plays on TV. Michael Finley the Spurs player. Fin is a great guy with a great family. But getting booed is part of what makes a rivalry a rivalry. Any player will tell you, they boo the jersey.

Warblade49

05-24-2006, 02:39 PM

Why Finley was cut by the Mavs last year. From ESPN.com.

Michael Finley would still be with the Dallas Mavericks if they could have acted with their hearts. Instead, they had to make the right financial decision.

The Mavericks were one of 18 teams to take advantage of a one-time chance to escape luxury tax obligations for any single contract on their books, waiving their captain just before the deadline late Monday night. Dallas owes Finley $51.8 million over the next three seasons.

"This is the hardest part of our business," said Donnie Nelson, the Mavs' president of basketball operations. "We were trying to come up with some creative ways to still have financial freedom and somehow keep Mike. There was no way around the situation. ... There's no question that it's been a very difficult process for the franchise."

Teams had until Monday to take the amnesty option that was part of six-year collective bargaining agreement agreed to earlier this summer by the league and the players' union.

In all, 18 teams saved more than $212 million in future tax payments by waiving players.

Dallas, by far, reaped the most savings by releasing 10-year veteran Finley. The Los Angeles Lakers saved $29.7 million over the next two seasons by releasing Brian Grant, who was expected to sign Tuesday with Phoenix, and the New York Knicks avoid $23.1 in luxury taxes over three seasons for forward Jerome Williams.

Under terms of the rule, players who were waived will still be paid by their former teams and cannot re-sign with them until their current contracts have expired. They also get whatever money from contracts with new teams.

The Mavericks avoid a dollar-for-dollar tax on Finley's $15.9 million salary for the 2005-06 season. The two-time All-Star is due $17.3 million and $18.6 million over the final two seasons of the $102.2 million, seven-year contract owner Mark Cuban gave him in 2001.

"Just what he's meant on and off the court, he's impacted everyone from fans to the front office," Nelson said. "Ultimately, it's our responsibility to do what's in the best interest of the Dallas Mavericks, but Michael has a special place in Mark's heart, my heart, and a special place in the franchise. At the end of the day, this just feels right."

Finley was traded to Dallas from Phoenix on Dec. 26, 1996, and was the longest-tenured player for the Mavericks. He averaged 19.8 points for the Mavs in 626 games the past 8½ seasons, when they went from being one of the NBA's worst teams to five straight 50-win seasons and playoff appearances.

The Knicks had been expected to release Allan Houston, who played only 20 games last season due to chronic knee soreness. The amnesty provision had even been called the "Allan Houston Rule" by some.

But Houston's close ties with Knicks owner James Dolan of Cablevision, along with incoming coach Larry Brown's history of coaching Houston with the 2000 U.S. Olympic team, helped factor into the decision for him to remain on the roster.

New York could also get luxury tax and salary cap relief while also having Houston's $40 salary paid by insurance if his knee injury prevents him from returning.

"I was prepared for (being waived)," Houston said. "You have to be. The team has made changes already in preparation for me not being there, and I understand that. But I still believe I can play."

Among others let go Monday were Fred Hoiberg of Minnesota, Ron Mercer of New Jersey, Calvin Booth of Milwaukee, Troy Bell of Memphis and Clarence Weatherspoon of Houston.

Several teams made moves to clear tax obligations for players who left their rosters long ago. They included Alonzo Mourning (Toronto), Vin Baker (Boston), Derrick Coleman (Detroit), Wesley Person (Miami), Eddie Robinson (Chicago) and Howard Eisley (Phoenix).

Players previously released under the amnesty program included Doug Christie (Orlando), who appears a likely replacement for Finley in Dallas, Aaron McKie (Philadelphia) and Derek Anderson (Portland).

Teams whose payrolls exceed $61.7 million for the upcoming season will have to pay a dollar-for-dollar tax on the overage. Among them are the Indiana Pacers, who waived retired guard Reggie Miller to save $6 million in luxury tax costs.

"In my conversations with Reggie, it is clear he will not play next year," Pacers president Donnie Walsh said. "I've spoken with Reggie, and he is fine with it. This will go down as his final assist."

Lantis

05-24-2006, 02:59 PM

Chicago w/KG + No. 2 draft pick = EASTERN CONFERENCE FINALS BABY! :tup:

Cletus Kasady

05-24-2006, 03:30 PM

Were it not for a surprising migration to smallball over the course of the playoffs, I'd think the Raptors should trade down and try to get a real center to put alongside Bosh. And for comedic purposes, I'd root for them to try to get Rudy Gay so Villenueva thinks he's at UConn again and stops trying along with Gay. But really, I have no clue; I'd say Morrison along with Geo, but he's the same guy who all but guaranteed that Sean May would be the best player of last years draft :P, so maybe that puts the kibosh on Morrison.

So I dunno...Foye? Roy? Italian Dirk (possibly Italian Darko)? Thomas could probably play either the three or a Marion-esque four.

Carpet Lint

05-24-2006, 04:30 PM

Actually, buddy...Finely could've stayed in Dallas he just wouldn't have been able to start. We would've kept him if he would've swallowed his pride and been the key bench player. So Finley said "No I want to start" so he gets cut. And he goes to S.A. of all places so he could stick it to us, try and hurt us bad in the playoffs. And what does he do in S.A. he's the first person off the bench. Ironic?
Actually, chief...you pulled all of that right out your ass.

Players waived under the amnesty rule cannot resign with the team that waived them until their original contract runs out.

So whether or not Finley wanted to start, he wouldn't have been able to sign with Dallas anyway.

It's not irony. It's just a franchise fucking over a guy - twice - who gave a decade of his life to the organization and the fans booing him on top of it.

Good showing for the collective knowledge of Dallas fans here.

AkumaTX

05-24-2006, 04:36 PM

no one screwed no one. Its called smart business deals.

jae hoon

05-24-2006, 04:41 PM

no one screwed no one. Its called smart business deals.

So what would you call the Knicks.

hihi

05-24-2006, 05:14 PM

Many smart business deals. You get to work half-assed and still get paid.

AkumaTX

05-24-2006, 05:24 PM

bad business decisions. Thats the way it works. Some are good and some are bad hence business. Its all about trying to find ways to make more money. The knicks thought they could win championships by buying high calibur players thus drawing more crowds. Backfired on them though.

Carpet Lint

05-24-2006, 05:36 PM

I don't want Thomas. I don't know much about college ball and NBA prospects, but he screams BUST to me more than any other guy.

Isn't he like 6'9"? Where the hell is all this talk about him being able to play centre? Why is like every 6'8"-6'9" guy suddenly able to play centre now because "Uh...Ben Wallace is only 6'8" and he's a good centre." Well he's BEN WALLACE. He's a freak of nature.

I pray every day for the Raptors to finally get an actual player that's at least 7 feet tall, who isn't on the verge of death (Hakeem) or completely fucking useless (Menke Bateer, Robert Archibald, Jerome Moiso, Loren Woods, etc.).

I like Aldridge, but I like the idea of trading down to get an established player along with a lower pick even better. Especially if Italian Dirk falls a couple of spots or we can get a point like Marcus Williams at a lower spot.

The J'onn J'onzz pick only works with Bosh because they realized that he can play SF. But whenever it's a front court of only Bosh and Charlie at C and PF, it gets ugly. We need a true centre, not another power forward that can also happen to play some centre.

Though with the first pick, I guess the philosophy is always to pick the best player available, without drafting for need. I wouldn't mind Aldridge at all. I'm just hoping he can work out an awesome trade for the pick instead.

And I want to draft Rudy Gay so badly. If only for the headlines.

RAPTORS GET GAY

I would get that jersey so fast you wouldn't believe it. Though I remember hearing about him like two years ago and praying he went to Denver so that I could get the old throwback jersey with his name on it - like the fruity ass rainbow one, with "GAY" on the back.

My only bigger wish is for Miroslav Satan to sign with the New Jersey Devils. I don't understand why this hasn't happened yet.

And for comedic purposes, I'd root for them to try to get Rudy Gay so Villenueva thinks he's at UConn again and stops trying along with Gay.
Lol, awesome.

That J'onn J'onzz pick worked out pretty well (second in voting for ROY next to Chris Paul basically just means a ROY any other year), but I always think we kinda lucked into it.

I don't think Charlie would have played that hard if he wasn't laughed at by every single basketball columnist in the world. If he wasn't picked that high, he wouldn't have had the critism, and I don't even think he would have played that well.

Rob Babcock must be rolling in his grave right now after learning that the Raptors won the first pick. I say that because I just assume he's dead in a gutter somewhere, because no one's going to give him another job.

His first year was pretty much a worst case scenario. But his second year was actually very good.

The J'onn J'onzz pick was excellent. He traded for/drafted Pape Sow with like...the 562nd pick and he turned out to be a solid...uh...8th man (10th or 11th on good team). He completely fleeced the Rockets in that Mike James/Rafer Alston trade. Matching MoPete's contract the year before turned out really well. Even that offer he made to Chris Duhon was a good move, even if it didn't turn out well.

And Wayne Embry traded Rose + Denver's pick for AD's like $13 million expiring contract, but you're an idiot if you think Babcock didn't do all the groundwork on that and was just waiting for something better before pulling the trigger.

I feel bad for him actually. But when he got fired mid-season, I figured there had to be another already established guy we were about to replace him with, because the timing was so strange. I thought it was Kiki actually. But I'm not going to complain about Colangeo, and as much as I think that Babcock could have done a good job this year...you can't pass on an opportunity to replace Rob Babcock with Bryan Colangeo.

Night

05-24-2006, 05:47 PM

It probably doesn't matter too much who has the #1 pick as there isn't really a clear cut #1 this draft, much like the 2004 NFL draft where Alex Smith was the #1 pick heh.

Whoever gets Rudy Gay, I'm gonna feel sorry for the guy because I'm thinking the NBA will be too much of a pussy to release an official jersey for him to the public, much like how there isn't any Randall Gay (NE Patriots) jersey for sale anywhere from where I've looked. It'd be a hit!

My only bigger wish is for Miroslav Satan to sign with the New Jersey Devils. I don't understand why this hasn't happened yet.

Yeah WTF!? That guy was born to play for the Devils and I've seen his picture... he even has a satanic beard and everything.

In the Olympics there was a backup goalie on the Italian team named Gunther Hell. The Devils need to get that guy too!

Airswish99

05-24-2006, 07:39 PM

What happened to Ernie Johnson's** neck/face?

jae hoon

05-24-2006, 07:58 PM

What happened to Ernie Johnson's** neck/face?

Parkinsons or Cerebral Paulsy one of those two.

No flop for the Suns so far today. Should just change their name to the Phoenix Flops. Never see a team flop this bad since Sacramento in the late 90s.

And how in the fuck was that an offensive foul, talk about a bullshit call. Phoenix must be paying the NBA well for these calls.

WTF kinda play was that for Dallas, no one moved but Dirk. No one, you have to always at least give yourself a second option. Terrible play calling.

Zigmover21

05-24-2006, 08:21 PM

How anti-climactic is this?

jae hoon

05-24-2006, 08:22 PM

How anti-climactic is this?

Pretty anti climatic

Refs 1
Dallas 0

PC2000

05-24-2006, 08:23 PM

MVP! and Diawwww

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-24-2006, 08:24 PM

Oh come on, there was worse refing in the SA-Dallas series.

In any case, this was a good game on both sides.

GO SUNS!

Hoonyo

05-24-2006, 08:25 PM

suns!

Outkast

05-24-2006, 08:34 PM

Pretty anti climatic

Refs 1
Dallas 0

Like when Dirk hit Thomas on the head on that dunk for the no call? Come on!!!!!
The refs didn't do anything, Mavs choked. Just man up for the next game dallas.

The calls were way worse in the spurs series.

O yea.....

Go Clippers!!!!!:sad:

Mario Lemieux!

05-24-2006, 08:35 PM

Fucking MVP.

STEVE NASH ftw!!

Catch that improbable flying out of bounds vertical bankshot? Holy shit...

TGC

05-24-2006, 08:36 PM

Lets not forget when Dampier pull Thomas from the shoulder FROM BEHIND because he beat him and only got a foul.

hihi

05-24-2006, 08:41 PM

Lets not forget when Dampier pull Thomas from the shoulder FROM BEHIND because he beat him and only got a foul.

You mean Diaw?

TGC

05-24-2006, 08:42 PM

Yea my bad, i thought it was thomas but i just remember it in my head.

Mario Lemieux!

05-24-2006, 08:55 PM

I read on Hoopshype Babcock is going back into the T-Wolves organization....good for him. I hope things turn out better for him.

Giant Griffey is actually projected to go top 10 =(

I guess we should draft Itali-Dirk with the #1....

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-24-2006, 09:01 PM

I've been wondering...who's Giant Griffey?

DaFlipMastaXV

05-24-2006, 09:03 PM

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y91/thousandsons/griffey.jpg

http://www.cincypost.com/2005/03/25/03-25-2005_NCAA_SWEET_SIXTEEN_DUKE.jpg

(AKA Shelden Williams)

Mario Lemieux!

05-24-2006, 09:10 PM

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y91/thousandsons/griffey.jpg

http://www.cincypost.com/2005/03/25/03-25-2005_NCAA_SWEET_SIXTEEN_DUKE.jpg

(AKA Shelden Williams)

I really hope that I never meet him face to face because I just KNOW I would be cracking up non-stop.

I mean, I'm having difficulty containing myself just looking at his mug shot again, rofl...

TGC

05-24-2006, 09:14 PM

If "Slowing down the Tempo" was as easy as most people make it to be, why doesn't every team do it against the suns?

I remember the 3rd game of the Suns vs Dallas in the regular season. One of the commentators for ABC said, Dallas may be able to run with the suns...but can they run for 48 minutes?

They ran with the suns for 46 minutes, but not 48, and those 2 extra minutes changed EVERYTHING!

and how about Diaw? GO SUNS, I DIDN"T STOP BELIEVING THIS GAME, AND I WON"T STOP BELIEVING.

Hoonyo

05-24-2006, 09:14 PM

i laugh whenever i look at his profile on nbadraft.net

http://nbadraft.net/profiles/sheldenwilliams.asp

DanielLarusso

05-24-2006, 09:15 PM

Sheldon Williams, now there's a future threat to all these would be NBA All-Ugly Team players. He's coming for your starting position, step your game up people. I'm looking your way Michael Ruffin.

--

To the person asking where I got that Bill Simmons quote I posted, it was from number 8 on yesterday's Daily Dime:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-060524

--

Mavs choked tonight. Laid a huge egg. Can't go to sleep on any team that can score like Phoenix can, even if you are up by four or five with a couple dozen seconds left.

jchensor

05-25-2006, 12:13 AM

True Karate

05-25-2006, 04:45 AM

Said it once, I'll say it again: I think the Suns broke basketball.

They are seriously exactly like Chun Li in 3rd Strike. Can't fall asleep on her, can't for even a fraction of a second feel comfortable with your lead. You build that lead, and then one mistake, it's Crouch Forward into Hoyokusen and now you're even again.

Then credit Boris Diaw with the clutch parry for the win.

If the Finals end up Suns vs. Heat, at least that means I don't ahve to watch basketball anymore after the conference finals. I won't be missing anything, anyhow, since there will be no more TNT broadcasts.

- Jameslol:rofl:
With all that talent I dont see how Kobe was up 3-1 in their series...
I think the future of the NBA are gonna be deep teams like piston,dallas,suns,mavs,san. Its gonna be llike having two teams put together.

Cause at this rate no teams could compete with the above teams without a bench just as sick as the starting line up. Houston needs more players and then the state of TX will be all out unstoppable!!! Juggernaut Punch Oowww!!

Outro

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-25-2006, 08:11 AM

Wait jchen, why won't you watch basketball? That won't be a good Finals matchup...?

Hokuto Shingo

05-25-2006, 08:54 AM

The reason we lost last night is we shot too many 3s. Shooting 3/17 from 3 = Instant Fast Break against Phoenix. Me and Avery( Coach Johnson) are dissecting the game film right now as we speak. We'll have something special cooked up for Game 2 just wait and see.

jchensor

05-26-2006, 12:49 AM

I just had someone complain to me that basketball is too concentrated on one-on-one, that there is no true team play like baseball (*gag*). And this year, above all, has proved otherwise. Kobe managed to get a 3-1 lead when his TEAM played well. The Suns, Mavs, Pistons, and Heat are winning because of the TEAMS all contributing. And even guys like the Clippers And San Antonio and New Jersey are all doing well only when everyone contributes, like a random Quentin Ross offensive spurt or when Richard Jefferson goes crazy. Not to mention how much teamwork is needed on the defensive end. If you don't know basketball, though, the defensive teamwork is hard to spot. But the reason I mention this is because, True Karate, I 100% agree with you. It's all about team basketball again.

And HaiDuongRiceMan, I agree that a Heat vs. Suns finals match up would be a good match up and there is a lot of talent there, but for reasons I won't go into (because it's not right to disrespect either team when they are playing well), I so do not want either team to win the championship that having to watch one of them take it all will just end up depressing me.

- James

TGC

05-26-2006, 12:56 AM

Dallas lost because the score was lower than the opponent's score. How about that stat for ya?

illusive

05-26-2006, 01:31 AM

I just had someone complain to me that basketball is too concentrated on one-on-one, that there is no true team play like baseball
What a load of crap. Baseball is the most individual-oriented major sport in America. The fact that sabremetricians are so easily dominating baseball analysis is indicative of this.

Basketball has 82games.com, along with other high profile statisticians. However, there has yet to be any single method that accurately gauges an individual player's value. And that's because basketball is so team-oriented. There are just so many ways a single player can alter a possessions, even if a team just runs isolation all day long (which nobody fucking does).

In baseball, it's easy to look at WHIP, VORP, OPS or some other shit to determine Player A's value over Player B. "Intangibles" don't even exist in baseball anymore, and fuck Derek Jeter.

Def1n1tely

05-26-2006, 01:39 AM

i think phoenix is like msp in marvel...

nothing but offense (rushdown) and not a whole lot of strategy. Very straightforward and simple. Entertaining to watch but you can't help but think that they get pretty lucky and even scrubby sometimes.. they can be outplayed 95% of the match and still win. no need to be defensive because you're on the offensive most of the time.

and then i guess dallas is like team matrix cuz all the players are good and mesh together... and then detroit is like santhrax... hella defensive

TGC

05-26-2006, 01:51 AM

Nba to Video games...Look what u did james.

ArcadeFire

05-26-2006, 02:15 AM

Cool-Breeze

05-26-2006, 05:52 AM

Stupid ESPN Analyst: "I don't mean to start any trouble Raja, but now that you're in the West finals do you think Kobe knows who you are now?"

Raja Bell: "Well like I say...we're in the finals so it doesn't matter that he says or thinks..."

Way to go ESPN...:rolleyes:

LoL the media needs more fuel man the playoffs this year being the best in like the past 6 or more years isnt enough of a story for them.

I want Detroit vs Dallas both my favorite teams duke-ing it out but, Dallas could win that easily, the to damn deep.
I cna give a rats ass about Miami right now, and there streaky bench play. I guess I finaly got my point across with Geo G2.
Did anyone see the nice job Lindsey is doing on Wade despite him scoring near or in the 30's its all for not. We played a nice game one just couldn't make the easy jumpers, we rested up and got the SAME EXACT looks in game 2 but drained a little more of them.

If we win the first game in Miami that gurantee's us the series, Why I say this is because Miami's bench is doing what washington did which is show serious inconsistency, they cant string together 2 average games let alone 2 good ones.

With Raja being out that takes abotu 6 attempts from the 3 point line away from Phoenix, then someone off of the bench who hasn't played much in this years playoffs will be expected to paly VERY GOOD Defense, score about 12 or more points, I dont see this happening.

Dallas should have won game one, Dirk has stepped up his game play but he is also still afraid to defend the opposing teams dominant player when the game is on the line, Diaw whould not have gotten that game winning shot so openlly (WoW new word OPENLLY say it with me people).

Raja Bell=2006 version of John Starks:rofl:

Hokuto Shingo

05-26-2006, 08:50 AM

Its ok Avery got something real nice cooked up tonight. Expect a blowout.

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-26-2006, 12:13 PM

S'all right, we're good with stealing one at Dallas :P

Warblade49

05-26-2006, 03:47 PM

Well maybe this is the reason the Hawks tried to play Boris at the point....

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dailydime-060526

Suns center Boris Diaw's 34-point effort in the Game 1 Western Conference finals win over Dallas was impressive. Here are ESPN draft expert Chad Ford's early reviews of the flying Frenchman:
May 13, 2003: Ford's first report on Diaw

It's clear he has great point-guard skills for someone who's 6-foot-9. He takes the occasional shot and swishes it, but it's still tough to get a read.

The problem with Diaw is that he's smooth. He makes playing basketball look effortless. That's great after you've already made it. But if you're still fighting to get drafted, it causes its share of problems. Teams have questioned Diaw's aggressiveness and effort all year.

It appears to us he's trying. He just doesn't break a sweat doing it. It's easy to see why teams are in love with him.

Diaw's mother was a Hall of Fame basketball player in France. From an early age she taught her son how to play. She drilled him in the fundamentals of Euroleague basketball and scolded him whenever he got too selfish.

His mother still gets on him if he shoots too much. It's a blessing and a curse. Diaw may be the best big playmaker in the draft after LeBron. He's an athletic point forward with fantastic court sense. But he's also his team's seventh-leading scorer. When's the last time a small forward averaging less than 10 points per game was a lottery pick?

Ford's final report right before the 2003 draft:

He may be the toughest guy in the draft to get a good read on. He looks like a shooting guard or small forward with that body and athleticism. But no one seems to be able to explain the lack of offense in his game.

He's got the tools, but he doesn't have the results. Look closer. At 6-foot-9, Diaw's one of the best passers in the draft. He has a pure point-guard mentality that has him always looking to set up his teammates.

When he's in the open floor, he's always prepared to make the extra pass. He may be the most unselfish player in the draft. He has a nice body and is a great athlete with a long wingspan and quick feet. He's already an established defender.

His outside shot needs work, and he looks pretty soft. How will he handle the physical grind in the NBA? There are still a ton of question marks on Diaw, but, bottom line, he's the type of guy who does all the little things that help you win games.

cheese_master

05-26-2006, 07:53 PM

Silentness!

05-26-2006, 08:07 PM

I like how this went from NBA to FG analogies. :rofl:

The last Heat vs Pistons game was crazy. Did you see that pixel COMEBACK towards the end?

TGC

05-26-2006, 11:01 PM

Its ok Avery got something real nice cooked up tonight. Expect a blowout.

I didn't see anything near a blowout. Face it Suns are pretty even matched with Dallas. Diop still can't do shit against Diaw, Diaw is too good for Diop.

Suns just struggled from the 3-pter a little bit tonight, but stealing one game at dallas and now coming home should make the suns feel pretty damn good about themselves.

I ain't gonna cry over this loss, suns and dallas both played hard, but Dallas was more desperate. They really could not afford to go to PHX down 0-2.

We'll see how Sunday goes.

One game at a time.

donaldducktm

05-26-2006, 11:53 PM

it's now a 5-game series for both matchups. Miami and Phoenix with the home court advantage now. I'm still like Miami and Dallas, but it'd be interesting to see Suns vs Pistons (Offense vs Defense...we all know what team wins in that category....)

donaldducktm

05-26-2006, 11:54 PM

Cool-Breeze

05-27-2006, 07:52 AM

Fuck Dwayne Wade... I hope he gets his fucking jaw broken for all his whining. He is whining about the Pistons not giving the Heat any credit after losing Game 1. Didn't his fat fuck piece of shit teammate for the last 13 losses against the Pistons... always follow up the post game conference with "We didn't execute. Its nothing they did, we didn't execute." That was Shaq's post game conference after EVERY LOSS against the Pistons in the last 2 years.

Then Wade goes to whine his bitch ass off about how the Pistons are playing defense on him. Has his faggot ass ever bothered to look at how dirty and physical his shitfaced teammates play? Anyone who has Alonzo Mourning on their team and whines about physical play... should get their ass kicked.

Honestly... I haven't seen any player who gets as many calls Wade does whine so fucking much to the public.... ESPECIALLY WHEN HIS TEAMMATES ARE DOING THE SAME SHIT. I hope wade never wins a fucking ring. In fact, I wish he never fucking makes the playoffs... crying like a baby.

Man you get post of the week for that LoL.
the PISTONS should NOT have to kiss anyone's ass when they lose or win BUT, They gave Cleveland and Lebron props when they took em' to seven games so....????
Fuck fat boy SHAQ, he has turned into an old fat complaining fuck and its rubbing off on WADE, Pat Riley is trying to work the refs as if this is a version of the Lakers he coached to back to back titles, using the Athletes names and what they have done in the past as reasons to give them foul calls and other bull shit.
SHAQ in everygame starts out strong, he gets like 13 points or whatever, Then he gets predictable, once he gets predictable people play better defense on him, then he gets frustrated and starts playing wrecklessly.

EXAMPLE: SHAQ has always used a weak spin move to the inside of the paint for a short jump hook right, but nowadays he is slower and weaker so he cant throw everyone off like he used to in the past, People flopped more in the past when they played Defense against SHAQ because he was so strong and that was when hand checking was allowed. Now no hand checking, defenders have stronger legs and mobile feet, good upper body strength, so SHAQ had to come up with better moves (Which he didnt) he spins now with a HIGH ELBOW thinking these guys will just move but now he is so weak they just take it and either fall back or the refs see it and make the call.

Dwayne Wade is not a great jump shooter he wasnt in coolege and isnt now, the good defense of detroit lets him drive in the first quarter or so, then he gets trapped well and he hesitates and starts to jack up shots, this is what they want because Wade has shown he cant even consistentally drive past Lindesy Hunter and be the FLASH that the HEAT need him to be, No one has played better defense on Wade this year then the PISTONS and the kid is pissed.

jchensor

05-28-2006, 12:49 AM

Fuck Dwayne Wade... I hope he gets his fucking jaw broken for all his whining. ... ... ... Honestly... I haven't seen any player who gets as many calls Wade does whine so fucking much to the public.... ESPECIALLY WHEN HIS TEAMMATES ARE DOING THE SAME SHIT. I hope wade never wins a fucking ring. In fact, I wish he never fucking makes the playoffs... crying like a baby.

Regardless of what Wade says, it's hard to hate the man. He's got some serious talent. It sucks if he is whining (I didn't hear any of his comments, so I dunno what he said), but I still like Wade. Him winning a ring would be my only consolation if the Heat won this year. But one last thing: LeBron James gets way more benefit from the refs than Wade, IMO. ^_^

I ain't gonna cry over this loss, suns and dallas both played hard, ...

I can't help but keep thinking of Rasheed Wallace now. "Both teams played hard." "Both teams played hard."

"Both teams played hard."

And fortunately, the Fighting Game analogies have stopped for now. ^_^ I'll be wary of that next time.

- James

google

05-28-2006, 01:57 AM

Dwayne Wade is not a great jump shooter he wasnt in coolege and isnt now, the good defense of detroit lets him drive in the first quarter or so, then he gets trapped well and he hesitates and starts to jack up shots, this is what they want because Wade has shown he cant even consistentally drive past Lindesy Hunter and be the FLASH that the HEAT need him to be, No one has played better defense on Wade this year then the PISTONS and the kid is pissed.

What are you talking about? He has one of the best mid-range jumpshots in the NBA. Lindsey Hunter?You crazy.

Dwayne is really good. Best player from 03 Draft.

Cool-Breeze

05-28-2006, 07:18 AM

What are you talking about? He has one of the best mid-range jumpshots in the NBA. Lindsey Hunter?You crazy.

Dwayne is really good. Best player from 03 Draft.

Shut Up.
No he doesnt. True he is doing well in this series making more than 32 shots out of like 50 but it is proven Dwayne Wade isnt a great Jump Shotter he is a slasher, thats the second reason he went a little bit lower in the draft, everyone in the league says this about Wade.
Also the games prove themselves if you watching you will see one on one Lindsey Plays hella good defense on this young man, look at the regular season where he was held to 13 points etc. Im not making this up.

Rip Hamilton has one of the best Mid ranged jumpshots in the NBA, Wade is often throwing up crap if he isnt wide open, look at the three point shot he made in game two, that shit wasn't skill at all just catch and slang.

Kobe is a great jump shooter, Tracy McGrady, Paul Pierece, Lebron James, these guys at the SG position I place higher then Wade, these guys work well WITHOUT a big man, Wade is below average without SHAQ.

Cool-Breeze

05-28-2006, 07:36 AM

Dwayne is really good. Best player from 03 Draft.

Best player from '03 draft :rofl: :rofl: :looney: Just because his team is in the playoffs doesn't mean he was the best player from that Draft playa.

T.J. Ford
Chris Bosh
LeBron James
Carmelo Anthony
Boris Diaw-Riffiod
Josh Howard
Leandrinho Barbosa

Those were the best names I could remember from that draft, and yes I do realize Kaman and Collison and others were in that draft year as well.
You all decide this is actually a nice arguement to persue.

Cletus Kasady

05-28-2006, 08:21 AM

What are you talking about? He has one of the best mid-range jumpshots in the NBA. Lindsey Hunter?You crazy.

Dwayne is really good. Best player from 03 Draft.

You misspelled Lebron James.

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-28-2006, 07:57 PM

Give credit to the Mavs, this was an ugly game for the Suns. Hope Bell comes back for Game 4, we need him...

I'd also like to add that Terry looks like a dumb fucker when he does that "sneer" of his.

DanielLarusso

05-28-2006, 08:21 PM

I'm tired of these blind motherfucking announcers. They kept saying "the ball didn't hit the rim" on that shot late in the game and showed 25 replays of it, and the one replay that showed THE BALL CLEARLY HIT THE RIM they only showed ONCE, pretended like they didn't just see the ball hit the motherfucking rim, and continued to say "the ball didn't hit the rim."

Dallas is having to work a lot harder than I thought they would have to beat the Suns. Sorry Suns fans, you ain't winning this series. But on the other hand, once Amare comes back, and if he can play at least to 90 percent of his former self for the whole year, the Suns will be my pre-season pick for next year's NBA title.

---

Miami is looking like the better team in their series. It's too early to call right now if it's Miami's dominance or Detroit's well known lackadasical play. Expect Detroit to be ready to go tommorrow night, but if they lose that game, the Heat will be able to smell it.

google

05-28-2006, 10:01 PM

Shut Up.
Kobe is a great jump shooter, Tracy McGrady, Paul Pierece, Lebron James, these guys at the SG position I place higher then Wade, these guys work well WITHOUT a big man, Wade is below average without SHAQ.

You must not watch Basketball. Dwayne Wade works very well without Shaq. You act as if Shaq is out there everytime Wade is. Did you watch Dwayne Wade his rookie year in the playoffs? What big man did he work well with then? Grant?

The fact that you chuck Lebron up there shows you don't watch what's going on. I guess your brain tells you something else. Lebron James can't shoot. He just can't. He can be a streak shooter, I'll give you that. But half the time, he'll hit one..then throw up a 3 or 4 bricks. BRICKS. He can drive and pass very well. But shoot? Nope. Sorry.

Tracy McGrady? Maybe you forgot he has Yao Ming. I can see how though, he's only a 7'6 man. He's easy to overlook.

Paul Pierce? You could have picked anyone but him. But you did. I really don't know why. Besides shooting three pointers, Dwayne Wade is better than him at everything else.

I really don't know why you brought up any of these guys anyways. The point is, Dwayne has great mid-range jump shot. If you deny that, you must dislike him for some reason, and pretend not to see it.

While we are at it, I'll bite on the Draft as well. It's really nothing to argue.

T.J. Ford - What does he do? He's been injured. He averages something around 10 points and 5 assists. He's okay. He'll get a little better.

Chris Bosh- He would be talked about more, but he had no hype(LJ), and Toronto is not so hot. He's a pretty good player on a team that got alot of air play when Kobe dropped 81. Is he better than Wade? No. He can rebound better though. That's about it.

LeBron James- The most hyped player in years. Great driver, great passer, good rebounder. He can be compared to Magic Johnson. Alot of people will argue he is the best from that Draft, I still pick Wade--because Wade can shoot better. The hype makes everything he does seem much better than what he really does. Don't get me wrong though, he has potential to become Lebron. His own legacy. Not the next this or the next that. But Lebron.

Carmelo Anthony- Another Chris Bosh deal, sort of. More talked about, but mainly criticism. He can score, but it ends really at that.

Boris Diaw- He's becoming very good. But, not worth to really talk about. Not yet atleast.

Josh Howard- No comparison. He's good. But no comparison.

Leandrinho Barbosa- No comparison. He's very fast, and he can drive very well though. He'll become much better.

They are all really good players. But they are just not as good as Dwayne Wade. Alot people would argue Lebron, but we'll let time decide that. I'm not really a stat guy, because stats don't show alot of things. But, they also don't lie. Compare Wades with any of those guys, the only one worth it would probably be James though.

You must have something against Wade. I don't know what he did. You can hate him all you want. But it is really asinine to say he is not better than alot of the players you mentioned. T.J. Ford!? Come on, you can do way better than that.

You can't deny he is good. He has good mid-range jump shot, and he is top 3 of the 03 draft. You can't deny those things.

But I stick by to what I said. He has on of the best mid-range jump shots in the NBA, and he is the best from the 03 Draft.

DanielLarusso

05-28-2006, 10:15 PM

I agree with most everything you said google, but I'd have to take LeBron over D-Wade. Though LeBron is the ONLY player from that draft that I'd take over Wade.

Hunter D

05-28-2006, 11:06 PM

Wade is the best player from his draft. He does everything except shoot the 3 ball well. The kid is also one of the best clutch players in the league right now. Wade is one of the top five best players in the league. Miami has been Wade's team since the day they drafted him.

Maybe a couple of years from now LeBron will be considered the best player from the 03 draft. At the moment he is tied for second IMO. He has to start playing defense and has to become fearless in the 4th. LeBron plays to passive in the 4th quarter IMO, esepecially in the final 2 minutes of games.

Def1n1tely

05-28-2006, 11:10 PM

wade does have a decent mid range shot... but yeah... it gets overlooked cuz hes mainly a slasher

and wades game right now is more polished than lebron imo...

o yea.. my bad for the fighting game analogies... last time i checked this was a fighting game forum... wtf was i thinking?

DaliPicard

05-28-2006, 11:23 PM

THE BALL CLEARLY HIT THE RIM they only showed ONCE, pretended like they didn't just see the ball hit the motherfucking rim, and continued to say "the ball didn't hit the rim."

The Ball DIDNT hit the rim.

It doesnt matter though Dallas had that game anyway.

As far as the posts that are comparing Lebron and Dwane. I think Lebron is clearly the better individual performer, but I wonder how their stats and manerisms would change if Lebron was playing with Shaq and Dwane was playing with "Z!!" (jk). I think Dwane would still try to involve his teamates more and Lebron wouldnt probably adapt well dumping the ball to Shaq everyother possesion.

But I'm crazy about both of these guys (they both give me a reason to be excited about the NBA again -- which I guess is all that matters)

DaliPicard

05-28-2006, 11:24 PM

DaliPicard

05-28-2006, 11:24 PM

AKUMA2000

05-29-2006, 12:00 AM

I never thought Detroit would be down 2-1 seeing how they play good defense when they're "in the zone".......if they don't win tommorrow's game the pressure will really be on.

TGC

05-29-2006, 12:03 AM

This isn't the suns that i know...

Where's the running game?

As soon as they see Dallas is on the otherside, they simply do not run.

Man i guess we really do need Raja Bell. His presense there really helps out the suns, kinda like the presence of Ron Artest and the Sac Kings.

I hope suns can win game 4, make it even, and have Raja back for 5.

ViciousSLASH

05-29-2006, 06:16 AM

You guys forgot Captain Kirk. Jesus that 03 draft was loaded.

He makes us white people proud.

GO DIRK.

jae hoon

05-29-2006, 06:22 AM

Wade was a star before Shaq showed up. Make no mistake about it this has NEVER been Shaqs team. That is part of the reason Van Gundy got pushed out and you have heard Shaq grumbling about it the last couple of years, like he does everywhere he goes.

PC2000

05-29-2006, 07:41 AM

You guys forgot Captain Kirk. Jesus that 03 draft was loaded.

He makes us white people proud.

GO DIRK.

Wasn't Kaman part of the 03 draft too?

Hokuto Shingo

05-29-2006, 08:27 AM

Wade is below average without SHAQ.

You sir are an idiot

PBalla

05-29-2006, 09:31 AM

You sir are an idiot
agreed..

however, i do have to say about your avatar, showing dirk and it says unblockable....didnt bowen block that shit? :wgrin: :wgrin: :lovin:

but make no mistake im glad dallas won....

jeez a mavz heat finals would OWN

Hokuto Shingo

05-29-2006, 12:21 PM

I been arguing this all weekend. So I'm asking you guys, who you taking Josh Howard or Tayshaun Prince. I say Josh but I just want to know what you guys thought.

Cletus Kasady

05-29-2006, 12:41 PM

Josh Howard. He's more consistent offensively than Tayshaun is, and the difference in terms of defense/hustle isn't terribly significant.

BTW, I must have been stuck in Bizarro World in 2004, because in the games I was watching, Lamar Odom was the Heats main guy (the offense ran through him as a point forward and he was very impressive), and Wade hit some big shots and all of a sudden people couldn't wait to yell that he was the best player in the 03 draft because he was in the playoffs (by which logic, Darko >>>>> everybody). Let me know when Miami's offense is "Get The Ball To Wade" like Clevelands is, and then we'll talk.

jae hoon

05-29-2006, 12:45 PM

Tayshaun because he is a better defender. Although I do think Howard has the chance to be a better overall player.

Hunter D

05-29-2006, 01:52 PM

Prince is better than howard right now because he is a better defender and reads the floor better on the defensive end.

ArcadeFire

05-29-2006, 07:33 PM

Looks like Miami is about to go up 3-1...

NeREMIXED

05-29-2006, 07:35 PM

it's DwYane Wade.

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-29-2006, 07:46 PM

Is it wrong to blame this destruction of the Pistons on Flip Saunders?

They need Brown back.

Hokuto Shingo

05-29-2006, 07:48 PM

Homecourt in Dallas is gonna be sweet.

DanielLarusso

05-29-2006, 08:01 PM

Miami is DEFINATELY looking like the better team. Geo, you're looking like a genius right about now. I certainly couldn't have called this. But you can NEVER count Detroit out, even down 3-1. Miami has to win 4. It all comes down to game 6. If Detroit can win two straight, Miami's in trouble, but there's a loong way from that happening right now.

And was it just me or did the PA break out the old "Whoot There It Is" in Miami's arena tonight? Heaven help us.

ckrazy

05-29-2006, 08:04 PM

what basketball without whoot there it is

c'mon seriously

jae hoon

05-29-2006, 08:07 PM

No you really cant blame this on Flip although he will get the blame. Detroit is just playing like they dont give a shit, the coach cant really fix that.

DA GAME

05-29-2006, 08:30 PM

Fuck Detroit.Fuck Detroit.FUCK DETROIT!!!!!!

cheese_master

05-29-2006, 08:31 PM

They are? Is it really Detroit's fault that Miami shot 47 some free throws... and the Pistons shot 22 when Miami was bodying up and knocking down their players? Rasheed Wallace comes in, 4 fouls in the fourth (after being on fire in the 3rd). He gets called for a moving screen... a moving screen which is never fucking called in the NBA... especially when Miami is using it to run over Rip Hamilton or Lindsay Hunter. That is what he gets called for on his 5th foul. Shaq runs Ben Wallace over numerous times, and they don't call shit. Ben Wallace puts his arm on Shaq's back its a foul. I saw some of the weakest foul calls on someone guarding Shaq ever today, when Ben Wallace was in. But apparently the Pistons are playing like they don't give shit. No team can win when the calls go like that. Hell all Miami had to do to win was show up. At least everyone in the world can be happy now, since Detroit won't be in the finals, being boring... because hey thats what David Stern wants. So you guys should be happy and thankful... because watching Shaq run people over is so much more exciting than real team oriented basketball.

opticallyinviz

05-29-2006, 08:48 PM

I only saw 1 play in that game where shaq should've been called on the offensive but wasn't.

Stop blaming losses on officiating; if a team is betterthey'll adjust to however the refs are calling it.

Miami is looking like a much better team than detroit.

The Deadpool

05-29-2006, 09:37 PM

Lantis

05-29-2006, 09:44 PM

Still can't believe that the BULLS of all teams gave Miami more opposition than the Nets AND the Pistons (for the time being).

totaltoanage

05-29-2006, 10:13 PM

Still can't believe that the BULLS of all teams gave Miami more opposition than the Nets AND the Pistons (for the time being).
omg soooo true. good observation.

Wil

05-30-2006, 02:21 AM

Sam Cassell? (http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c369/ShamSports2/samcasselliset.jpg)

or is this

Sam Cassell? (http://www.boomspeed.com/sweetc/et2.jpg)

True Karate

05-30-2006, 03:46 AM

It dosn't surprise me that Detroits down 3-1

heres why

1. Sheed got hurt in the Cavs series and thats when the Cavs went on their lil run.
2. Detroit went to 7 games in the Cavs series, Miami was done in 5.
2. Miami got to rest up for like a week and Detroit had to start a new series in like a day or two.(Detroits tired)
3. Detroit probably would have lost to Miami last year if Wade didn't get that hip injury in the last couple games.
4. Reffs dont know how to officiate Shaq. They feel bad for calling offensives on him cause then its like oh shaqs so strong it just looks offensive so they dont call it. They used to call it but it seemed unfair to shaqs natural power. Cause now they just pick when to call it and they give Shaq too much credit when guys are guarding him. Seriously he shouldn't be in the league. Thats not skill at that point its old school deaths by fireballs while waking up....nothing you can do about it.
5. Detroit shouldn't have got rid of Aroyo now Billups has to play way more.
6. When you guard Rip like a man and put a body on him his natural frame dosn't do him any justice. Game 1 He got bumped out of bounds so easy in the last few sec.
Thats why hes so in shape to keep running around and leave his man, but hes not as fast as he usually is, like I mentioned earlier the Pistons are tired.

Outro

cheese_master

05-30-2006, 12:00 PM

I agree w/ most of what was said. And I agree that the Heat are just plain outplaying the pistons. My officiating beef was heat of the moment. That doesn't take away from the game being called terribly.

The post above highlights most of the reasons I agree Detroit is losing. That and they have just seemed like they don't care anymore... probably tired. Also... please don't say the Pistons wouldn't have beat the Heat if Wade and Shaq didn't get injured. I find that a joke, because no one damn well is saying if Wallaces were completely healthy... the Pistons would be having a better series.

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-30-2006, 04:44 PM

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=An85JGSz6GuuwdpqWzy7hnu8vLYF?slug=dw-flip053006&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

Little article on Flip and the state of the Pistons. Like I said, they need Brown back.

And I sure hope as hell Phoenix scores more than FOUR fast break points. And when the hell is Kurt Thomas gonna step in and play?

Hokuto Shingo

05-30-2006, 04:54 PM

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-30-2006, 05:01 PM

Well, I thought the general idea was that Kurt would be back for the Western Conference Finals.

jchensor

05-30-2006, 05:51 PM

Let me know when Miami's offense is "Get The Ball To Wade" like Clevelands is, and then we'll talk.

Isn't that what it is right now?!? 30+ points a game with over 60% field goal percentage. If that doesn't scream "Get theball to Wade", I'm not sure what does.

- James

jae hoon

05-30-2006, 06:16 PM

Over 60 percent nothing, he is at 70 percent. Wade carried Miami to the EC finals before Shaq even showed up.

cheese_master

05-30-2006, 08:20 PM

Over 60 percent nothing, he is at 70 percent. Wade carried Miami to the EC finals before Shaq even showed up.
You mean the 2nd round. Like lebron did without shaq.

4neqs

05-30-2006, 08:24 PM

Holy fucking shit Phoenix

Edit- And yeah, I'm praying that Detroit gets their act together, or else it'll be a real nasty Game 5

TGC

05-30-2006, 08:28 PM

Why do suns play better with pressure?

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-30-2006, 08:56 PM

"Throw it down Big Diaw, throw it down!"

Wow, he blasted Dirk on that dunk. Not like Carter-over-Zo blasting, but good enough especially coming from Diaw to make you say "Wow."

How the FUCK did Atlanta not see him?!?!

Hunter D

05-30-2006, 09:40 PM

jchensor

05-31-2006, 12:38 AM

Hate to keep harping, but I wish Bell would stop falling to the floor. Play some real defense, please. Stop trying to draw so many damned fouls by flopping. He ends up on the floor more than Wade, but at least people actually KNOCK Wade to the floor. Haven't the refs learned yet?

- James

TGC

05-31-2006, 12:46 AM

Its not just him drawing the Offensive fouls, but causing frustrations, like when he chased Terry down the lane, and pretty much forced a travel. He's hella persistent and he was brought in to guard Manu Ginoboli, the Oscar winner so really can't say much.

And he can bring some offense with him.

And he brings the mental toughness for the team, he's like a Ron Artest for the kings...just the presence there helps the team so much.

Robust

05-31-2006, 03:16 AM

Suns are the luckiest team to ever play basketball.

*InVeRs3*

05-31-2006, 03:53 AM

Suns are the luckiest team to ever play basketball.

I agree. I cannot believe what is happening right now.

opticallyinviz

05-31-2006, 07:16 AM

Luckiest team?
Come on now, you can't be for real.

SaBrE

05-31-2006, 07:17 AM

oh yeah, they are sooooo lcuky that they got good shooters, and are so lucky that they had top 4 record in the nba season. yeah they are so lucky. gtfo with that shit. might as well say heat are lucky being up 3-1 on pistons, and might as well say dallas is hella lucky beating spurs. and clippers being miraculously lucky for even making playoffs...gimme a break

i guess luck streaks last 7 months or something. /sarcasm

...

Hoonyo

05-31-2006, 10:06 AM

phoenix is lucky they're so good

Cool-Breeze

05-31-2006, 11:30 AM

Well sorry I havent been around guys, the job search had to be brought up again.

Anyways, there is no excuses this year, I mean Rasheed is a bit hurt but still no ecuses, believe me man I love this team, they presonifie what TEAM PLAY is all about, but right now Wade is owning there asses with 30 point nights and over.

I did make a hateful post about the youngman a page or so behind that I was completly wrong about, I wasnt trying to say that the HEat wasnt his team but I had the young man on one of my fantasy teams this year and his jump shooting was not up to par, Now I admit what he is doing in the Playoffs is what I wished he had done all season but he is stepping it up when and where it counts.

Detroit needs to have a sit down, call Larry and hold a conference call, get some info from this guy, go out there and follow his teachings. Fuck what ever Flip is saying in the Huddles. Chauncey needs to dominate Payon and Williams, I cant see why he isnt exploiting Paytons slow speed.

Dallas will be playing for the Championship this year, they seem to finally understand like 50% of what it takes to get wins against other great teams besides themselves.
Terry had a bad night but it had to come sooner or later, He will pick it up at home, and I think they will have a great chance at closing it out in Phoneix in 6 games.

GeoG2

05-31-2006, 01:56 PM

opticallyinviz

05-31-2006, 02:09 PM

Yeah because obviously the pistons were really destroying everyone in the playoffs up until this point and it's wade's awesome talents that are really beating them.

The pistons lost the hunger.
They're done.
This is their last time being a contender. I gurantee it.

True Karate

05-31-2006, 02:15 PM

I love how all of a sudden, I go on message boards... and idiot Pistons fans are saying Detroit isn't playing defense anymore and that's why they're losing. And Big Ben saying shit to Flip didn't make shit better.

It's funny to me. I mean... they can't stop Wade. Give props and man up, stop making excuses.
I know your not calling me an idiot cause I mentioned whats wrong with the Pistons, they all were valid points. I even said Miami would have won last year if Wade didn't get hurt. Even Steve Kur said the Pistons caught a break last year when Shaq and Wade got hurt in the dallas game last night and I mentioned that BEFORE he said it. Kur also followed up that statement with now the tables have turned with wallace being not at 100% and Miami is taking advantage.

I love the Pistons but like I said them niggas is tired. But I'm not saying they would win by default with a healthy Sheed either just saying that dosn't help at all.

Whats gets on my nerves is that miami looks so good if u just look at how many games they finished Jersey in but if u watched those games 3 of them could have went either way cause they were 1 point wins. Just think if Jersey got those wins then Miami would have had to push to a game 7 as well and thus would be just as tired.

thats how the cookies crumbles out of cookie monsters mouth though.....

weak

As for Dallas, they were due a bad game sooner or later, and I dont think the Suns are lucky at all, I just think the Suns are good and exel at un planned shit that most teams would just let go has a broken up play while the Suns actually make nice shit happen off of fuck ups.

Kind of like in streetfighter u get players that freeze up when something stupid happens and everybody laughs and says wtf was that while a very small ammount of players will play through the fuck up and create something special.

Like Alex trying to ddt somebody and ends up behind them on an accident cause they ducked which was the right decision but instead of the Alex player freezing up wondering what happened he grabs on reaction and plays through it.

Hope that helped let u c what I mean about the Suns ability to play through fuck ups. thats special.

Krazy lob pass 3 pointer, the lob was so accurate it went in.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Outro

GeoG2

05-31-2006, 02:42 PM

^ Why did you quote me? Did I mention your name?

I said message boards... as in multiple sites.

I don't pay attention to what a lot of you say in here... so if you said something along the lines of what I'm talking about, so be it.

I'm pointing out a general observation.

Yeah because obviously the pistons were really destroying everyone in the playoffs up until this point and it's wade's awesome talents that are really beating them.

The pistons lost the hunger.
They're done.
This is their last time being a contender. I gurantee it.

Good analysis. Let's erase the defensive prowess and hunger they've shown throughout the season because of the playoffs.

Good call.

And Wade is beating them. They can't contain him at all.

HaiDuongRiceMan

05-31-2006, 03:00 PM

I want to compare what Detroit did to Lebron and say that they should do the same to Wade, but Cleveland's team was nowhere as good as Miami's.

You're right Geo, they can't contain Wade, but there is still no excuse that they should be playing this bad. Down 3-1? A team that won the championship two years ago and reached the Finals last year? It's not just one factor. It'll be an interesting off-season for Detroit.

GeoG2

05-31-2006, 03:21 PM

The same thing that is making Detroit suck, is the same thing that is making Wade shoot 50%-60% from 3p range throughout the playoffs.

Shit happens.

Cool-Breeze

05-31-2006, 05:33 PM

I know your not calling me an idiot cause I mentioned whats wrong with the Pistons, they all were valid points. I even said Miami would have won last year if Wade didn't get hurt. Even Steve Kur said the Pistons caught a break last year when Shaq and Wade got hurt in the dallas game last night and I mentioned that BEFORE he said it. Kur also followed up that statement with now the tables have turned with wallace being not at 100% and Miami is taking advantage.

I love the Pistons but like I said them niggas is tired. But I'm not saying they would win by default with a healthy Sheed either just saying that dosn't help at all.

Whats gets on my nerves is that miami looks so good if u just look at how many games they finished Jersey in but if u watched those games 3 of them could have went either way cause they were 1 point wins. Just think if Jersey got those wins then Miami would have had to push to a game 7 as well and thus would be just as tired.

thats how the cookies crumbles out of cookie monsters mouth though.....

weak

As for Dallas, they were due a bad game sooner or later, and I dont think the Suns are lucky at all, I just think the Suns are good and exel at un planned shit that most teams would just let go has a broken up play while the Suns actually make nice shit happen off of fuck ups.

Kind of like in streetfighter u get players that freeze up when something stupid happens and everybody laughs and says wtf was that while a very small ammount of players will play through the fuck up and create something special.

Like Alex trying to ddt somebody and ends up behind them on an accident cause they ducked which was the right decision but instead of the Alex player freezing up wondering what happened he grabs on reaction and plays through it.

Hope that helped let u c what I mean about the Suns ability to play through fuck ups. thats special.

Krazy lob pass 3 pointer, the lob was so accurate it went in.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Outro

You dont have to defend yourself to GEo of all people this is the same guy who was prvoen wrong my MANY people posting in this thread and decided to show his wack ass once he had something minor to speak upon.
Dwayne Wade isnt being trapped like they did with Lebron because HE ISNT THE POINT AND BALL HANDLER like Lebron was.
They set up plays for Wade. Lebron had to set up his own plays in that series.

Geo is talking about 2 completlly different teams, there is no comparison in terms of how the defense should be played. The Heat have a big man, old and slow as he is he is still a focal point in there offense.
Did Cleveland utilize "Z" like the heat use SHAQ???? Hellz no, the man can get alley opps almost when ever he wants, and if you double to high too soon he will do just that.

Geo needs to shut his non basketball watching ass up, funny how he decides to post in here once Detroit started losing, where were you when Wade was still scoring 30 but having a horrible night getting D'ed up by Lindsey Hunter and Prince, fucking faggot.

Miami didnt even Own New Jersey til Jefferson twicked his ankle, its been proven if you go right at Wade, the heat are stuck cause that means SHAQ has to really play defense, thats how the Nets were beating there ass fr a short period of time, driving at Wade, Passing by him then taking it strong to SHAQ, Posting up a garbage center like the young guy Collina then throwing the jump shooter Kristic out there to bring SHAQ from under the hoop, They were the best team in my eyes to defeat the Heat.

Pistons play right into the Heat's hands because Ben isnt a scorer and SHAQ cant be called for 4 offensive fouls every night to keep the PISTONS in games, Detori is beating themselves. 2 Games with a shooting percentage of 37% or less. the heat have been giving them the same looks all series but they cant knock em down. The Heat aint playing great defense themselves either its the PISTONS unable to exscape this shooting funk there in.

jae hoon

05-31-2006, 09:11 PM

Um Detroit isnt dead yet, and Big Ben is a beast.

merdoc

05-31-2006, 09:13 PM

man, i never seen SHAQ get blocked like that.

GeoG2

05-31-2006, 09:40 PM

You dont have to defend yourself to GEo of all people this is the same guy who was prvoen wrong my MANY people posting in this thread

... Umm... who the fuck proved me wrong on anything? You?! LOL.

It greatly disturbs me that you would cut into something that does not concern you just to throw pathetic shots at me. Get off my jock.

funny how he decides to post in here once Detroit started losing

The talk/fan ranting about Detroit not having defense (which I initially posted about) didn't start happening UNTIL they started losing, you idiot. Was I suppose to post about it before the talk actually started happening?

Somebody get this guy a kleenex.

He's trying so hard to 1-up me that it's starting to look like Def Comedy Jam.

Def1n1tely

05-31-2006, 09:59 PM

wow ben wallace is strong

but yeah... umm f detroit

Lantis

05-31-2006, 10:03 PM

What the shit, Shaq got stomped by Big Ben like some poor 6th grade nerd bitch. Kinda funny seeing all that weight just get plastered on the court.

jae hoon

05-31-2006, 10:05 PM

Kinda funny how Shaq complained it was a foul to. Sadly he was being serious

GeoG2

05-31-2006, 10:11 PM

But really, I have no clue; I'd say Morrison along with Geo, but he's the same guy who all but guaranteed that Sean May would be the best player of last years draft :P, so maybe that puts the kibosh on Morrison.

LOL... I'm behind on this. Sue me.

Clet... perhaps my memory is screwed up. I don't remember saying that much.

I remember saying May would be a good player when all of you were saying he wouldn't be, though. I still see truth in that. I'm 98% positive if I went back and checked my posts, it'd go along those lines... but I'm too lazy.

I don't think Morrison should be picked #1 either, but seriously... they don't need another frontcourt player, so what else are they going to do? And I doubt they'll trade down.

merdoc

05-31-2006, 10:15 PM

ok, pistons are now 11-2 facing elimination, hopefully they will overcome, if they play Defence like they did today or should i say yesterday.

TGC

05-31-2006, 10:32 PM

Suns are the luckiest team to ever play basketball.

...Says a Clippers Fan.

jchensor

06-01-2006, 12:05 AM

Its not just him drawing the Offensive fouls, but causing frustrations, like when he chased Terry down the lane, and pretty much forced a travel. He's hella persistent and he was brought in to guard Manu Ginoboli, the Oscar winner so really can't say much.

Agreed agreed agreed. Bell, no matter how much I hate him, is a good defender. He frustrates people well.

Which is why he doesn't need to fall to the floor so damned much.

But as long as he gets the offensive fouls, I guess I can't really blame him for continuing what he does. :sad:

- James

Hoonyo

06-01-2006, 12:24 AM

Ben Wallace likes to flop a lot too. Nobody complains about him. They just give him the Defensive Player of the Year award almost every year. No disrespect to him though. That block on Shaq was real good.

Cool-Breeze

06-01-2006, 08:59 AM

... Umm... who the fuck proved me wrong on anything? You?! LOL.

It greatly disturbs me that you would cut into something that does not concern you just to throw pathetic shots at me. Get off my jock.

The talk/fan ranting about Detroit not having defense (which I initially posted about) didn't start happening UNTIL they started losing, you idiot. Was I suppose to post about it before the talk actually started happening?

Somebody get this guy a kleenex.

He's trying so hard to 1-up me that it's starting to look like Def Comedy Jam.

Dog you were wrong about the bench discussion, look pages back, I left it alone but like three other people said the same thing I said, most coaches do not go past 2 people off of there bench, whether its a trust issue, productivity issue or what ever reason, you got ghost.

Did you read my post... No you didnt. A true fan I'am to admit what detroit is doing wrong without being bi·ased.
My point about you is you never have anything relevant to say and when you do say anything its half-assed and wrong.

Im not crying about Detroit losing, hell its Karma and Life why would I. Plus I dont need to one up you if you read my previous post I explained everything Detroit did against Cleveland and why it will not work against Miami.

What you need to do is read people's post in its en·tire·ty if you read how I broke down what could be done defensivly against either team, almost everyone would agree DETROIT cant play MIAMI the way they played CLEVELAND.

GeoG2

06-01-2006, 11:24 AM

Dog you were wrong about the bench discussion, look pages back, I left it alone but like three other people said the same thing I said, most coaches do not go past 2 people off of there bench, whether its a trust issue, productivity issue or what ever reason, you got ghost.

Dude... I don't know what planet you're on, but you can't prove people wrong on their opinions. What they believe is what they believe... you can't change that unless they want themselves to change. You didn't prove me wrong on anything.

You can provide all the so-called stats you want. Detroit's bench is still garbage compared to Miami's IMO. You can take that to the bank.

My point about you is you never have anything relevant to say and when you do say anything its half-assed and wrong.

You're a funny dude, kiddo. Up until now, you've never had a problem with me. Now all of a sudden I never have anything relevant to say? You got shitted on, so now you want to be a baby?

That's great.

Let's compare.

I make more sense then you. My knowledge isn't Sportscenter based. I've had good debates with folks in here the last three seasons or so. I've made good points and bad points that people either have agreed with or debated on.

You don't make any points.

Look just a few pages back. You said Wade was ineffective without Shaq, and implied Wade wasn't the best of the 03 class. A LOT of people shitted on you for both... and you NEVER responded to them. And yet you're here trying to 1-up me like you think your dumb shit makes more sense or is more relevant then what I say?

I see people taking shots at you all the time in here... and you think your knowledgable on WTF you're talking about?

No. You're an idiot. And you really need to stop. I half ass my responses to you because what you type is half assed, genius.

Cool-Breeze

06-01-2006, 11:52 AM

Dude... I don't know what planet you're on, but you can't prove people wrong on their opinions. What they believe is what they believe... you can't change that unless they want themselves to change. You didn't prove me wrong on anything.

You can provide all the so-called stats you want. Detroit's bench is still garbage compared to Miami's IMO. You can take that to the bank.

Once again PRODUCTIVITY is all i was talking about, I stated Detroit's Bench I felt was more productive, I also said it is a FACT that no coaches play or LIKE to play more than 2 people down there bench. FACT when maybe three other people posted that same response you got ghost and didnt even post back. You then squashed it after I posted the responses of those people who agreed witht he FACT that I posted.

You're a funny dude, kiddo. Up until now, you've never had a problem with me. Now all of a sudden I never have anything relevant to say? You got shitted on, so now you want to be a baby?

That's great.

Let's compare.

I make more sense then you. My knowledge isn't Sportscenter based. I've had good debates with folks in here the last three seasons or so. I've made good points and bad points that people either have agreed with or debated on.

You don't make any points.

Look just a few pages back. You said Wade was ineffective without Shaq, and implied Wade wasn't the best of the 03 class. A LOT of people shitted on you for both... and you NEVER responded to them. And yet you're here trying to 1-up me like you think your dumb shit makes more sense or is more relevant then what I say?

I see people taking shots at you all the time in here... and you think your knowledgable on WTF you're talking about?

No. You're an idiot. And you really need to stop. I half ass my responses to you because what you type is half assed, genius.

And also on that same page a posted and expressed how I was WRONG about Wade playing well or not well with out SHAQ, and please find posts where people have taken shots at ME PESRONALLY???

Who in this thread posted Wade IS the best Player in the '03 draft please post that,(Besides Cletus) and I will lace you with a formal appology, Im quite sure most people posted Lebron James. A Player with no legit bigman, no consistent point guard, or even a legit Veteran outside there center who is hurt everyyear.

Until you posted in this thread with your lame ass opinions people could give a rats ass what the fuck. I really dont have anything against you dude, I like a good arguement but once you sarted calling me Kiddo and shit like that, I took it as a sign of disrespect.

Read the link playa
http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98226&page=113

GeoG2

06-01-2006, 12:15 PM

And also on that same page a posted and expressed how I was WRONG about Wade playing well or not well with out SHAQ, and please find posts where people have taken shots at ME PESRONALLY???

I'm not going to go through the whole thread... that would be demoralizing. I'm only going a handful of pages. And even then, I'm not going to post everything.

You sir are an idiot

agreed..

You must not watch Basketball.

All in response to dumb shit you've said.

Also:

lol @ ppl still responding to cool-breeze. That guy knows SOOOO much about basketball, it's quite rediculous.

Blatant sarcasm.

Who in this thread posted Wade IS the best Player in the '03 draft please post that

Dwayne is really good. Best player from 03 Draft.

Wade is the best player from his draft.

I will lace you with a formal appology

I don't want you to apologize. I want you to shut the fuck up.

Im quite sure most people posted Lebron James.

Only Daniel and DaliPicard really said they'd pick LeBron over Wade right now.

A Player with no legit bigman

Zydrunas isn't legit?

Ok.

It's nothing, considering you're the same idiot who said Delk was with Detroit all season. Or that Dallas only goes as deep as Devin Harris and Marquis Daniels.

True Karate

06-01-2006, 02:12 PM

I think Deven should get more clock then Terry actually.

I would take Lebron over Wade come on, that nigga was like 2nd in scoring this year and led the league in and ones. Hes 6'8 and about 250, hes a fucking beast!!! He shouldn't be that big and be a guard! But he is!! Plus hes good and has the mobility of a lil guard and hes got a nice shot not bricks all day like I heard somebody say. Couple games against detroit he had some bad games where nothing fell but I've seen him go shot for shot against kobe and won and they both had 4o something. But they both are so good who cares I wouldn't be mad if my team got either one of them. But I would take Lebron over Wade hes just a bigger wade, gotta go with the bigger guy.

And Geo its coo

Outro

GeoG2

06-01-2006, 03:29 PM

FACT that no coaches play or LIKE to play more than 2 people down there bench.

I destroyed this argument already.

You posted two people each coach liked to use. I replied with a third or fourth bench player that coaches have been using, whether they liked to or not.

None of what you said was facts. It was analysis based on poor observation.

FACT when maybe three other people posted that same response you got ghost and didnt even post back. You then squashed it after I posted the responses of those people who agreed witht he FACT that I posted.

I responded to everyone. What the hell are you talking about?

I never run from arguments.

And if I didn't respond, then show me the posts so I can reply to them right now.

TGC

06-01-2006, 04:10 PM

Lebron isn't a guard BTW.... He's an all-star, team superstar, so he gets the ball like a PG would.

Robust

06-01-2006, 04:18 PM

I would choose lebron over wade any and everyday.

Also, Cool-Breeze should not be allowed to post in here anymore. lol.

I'm amped for tonights game. I think winner will end up winning the series, but it will go to 7.

Luckiest team in the league plays tonight. <3

Hunter D

06-01-2006, 04:33 PM

Lebron is the more talented player, but based on what I have seen Wade would be the better player to have. Take that as you will people.

ckrazy

06-01-2006, 05:13 PM

Lebron is the more talented player, but based on what I have seen Wade would be the better player to have. Take that as you will people.

that what i was thinking at first to then i realize leborn has no one on his team and wade has shaq and a few vetren

jae hoon

06-01-2006, 05:16 PM

This myth that Lebron has no one on his team is bullshit. He had good players on his team, they just have no offensive sets outside give it to Lebron.

Cool-Breeze

06-01-2006, 05:18 PM

I'm not going to go through the whole thread... that would be demoralizing. I'm only going a handful of pages. And even then, I'm not going to post everything.

Zydrunas isn't legit?

Ok.

It's nothing, considering you're the same idiot who said Delk was with Detroit all season. Or that Dallas only goes as deep as Devin Harris and Marquis Daniels.

No I didnt I said most of the season ass, your the one who thought Arroyo was still with the Pistons which let me know you didnt watch basketball all year. And I never said Devin and Daniels were the only guys they went too, I said most Coaches in the playoffs go as far as 2 down PERIOD. You said you weren't talking about the regualr season when TGC posted a response right??

Zydrunas is not and has never been a threat at Center he has had only 2 seasons where he ment a damn he has had the same foot injury since he got drafted.
Zydrunas legit how is this even a point, what did he do to make the big men of Detroit play defense any different from there all year game plan huh??
Nothing, SHAQ even with old age is a legit big man he is a threat.
So what Zy averaged 16 points all season, and when they needed him he wasn't shit. Correct??

Without a bench, without a LEGIT number #2 go to guy Lebron is the best player out of the '03 draft, he has matured faster than almost any other player you can name.
Wade has SUPPORT. Lebron Doesn't.
People who choose Wade are possibaly choosing Wade due to the fact that he went further in the Playoffs then Lebron... If this is true then go for it, but Lebron makes plays FOR HIMSELF, he carried his team, The HEAT could survive with just Shaq at the helm and no Wade.
Granted they probably wouldn't have a high win/loss record but they still would be better than alot of Eastern Conference Teams without Wade.

Larry Hughes has proven he ISN't as good a defender as teams thought he was, his scoring is damn near missing, Donyell sooo damn streaky its sad, Drew Gooden is playing like Kenyon Martin he shows up only when he wants too, Eric Snow ISN'T a scoring point guard he is a set up man, but there coach is defensive minded and for some reason Eric didnt play good defense this year.
Who is on there bench worth while???

Without Lebron Cleveland ain't shit, Defenently not a playoff team BOSTOn would make it over them.

You posted up above about opinions but when ever I post an opinion its gotta be wrong you contridicting your own shit, I was right about the Bench useage, I know Im right about Lebron and Wade, and you still a bitch.

Even ROBUST chose Lebron over Wade.

I would choose lebron over wade any and everyday.

Also, Cool-Breeze should not be allowed to post in here anymore. lol.

I'm amped for tonights game. I think winner will end up winning the series, but it will go to 7.

Luckiest team in the league plays tonight. <3

Fuck you talking about FANBOY.
You dont even post in here unless GeoG2 post, always riding his nutt sack and shit plus I aced you in your own Freestyle Thread which you have yet to post a respond to pussy. Now what. I even posted in the ORIGINAL Freestyle Thread.

http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112273&page=3

TGC

06-01-2006, 07:07 PM

"This is 10% Luck"
20% Skill

HaiDuongRiceMan

06-01-2006, 07:24 PM

This is also a damn good game.

Tim Thomas kiss = wtf moment of night?

donaldducktm

06-01-2006, 07:27 PM

Tim Thomas is an ugly mofo. When he does that Booker T hand signal, he's hella gay

HaiDuongRiceMan

06-01-2006, 07:58 PM

Terry sneer ain't that much prettier.

By the way, Phoenix can't get a call driving to the lane to save their lives. Dirk is playing out of his mind right now, but Howard and Dirk are getting calls every single drive to the basket.

PC2000

06-01-2006, 08:12 PM

Wow Dirk!

TGC

06-01-2006, 08:23 PM

I still believe, Suns will have that "Pressure Power" and I believe they can still win this.

GO SUNS.

Cletus Kasady

06-01-2006, 08:38 PM

Geo: I think the last thread got deleted one of the times GD was pruned, so it's likely not there. I vaguely recall a very early prediction that he'd go #1, and then backing off it a bit. No big deal, just a little bit of verbal jabbing on my part.

Isn't that what it is right now?!? 30+ points a game with over 60% field goal percentage. If that doesn't scream "Get theball to Wade", I'm not sure what does.

- James

What I mean is that in Cavs games, Lebron often gets the ball at the top of the shot clock and either has to create his own shot or try to draw people in and make a shot for his teammates. He's like their point guard, along with being their primary perimeter/low post option. On top of that, he plays nearly the entire game (if not the whole game).

Miami will run the ball through Shaq and have him pass out of double teams because he's exceptional at that. Walker can create his own shot, and Williams is capable of making things happen (as opposed to Snow, who fills the caretaker role quite well but doesn't really create a whole lot). So in the sense that plays get run through other guys a lot more than on Cleveland (Wade does have the luxury of being able to pick his spots in terms of when to start being the aggressor), their playbook isn't "Get The Ball To Wade".

Hoonyo

06-01-2006, 08:46 PM

nowitzki uses aimbot

illusive

06-01-2006, 08:58 PM

Geo: I think the last thread got deleted one of the times GD was pruned, so it's likely not there. I vaguely recall a very early prediction that he'd go #1, and then backing off it a bit. No big deal, just a little bit of verbal jabbing on my part.

If I remember correctly, Geo only predicted that Sean May would one day prove that he should've been picked No. 1. At that point, it was already obvious who were going to be the top picks (Bogut, Paul, Williams, Williams, etc.), and he just disagreed with them.

There's still time for that to come fruit, so technically he isn't wrong yet.

Robust

06-01-2006, 09:42 PM

Cool-Breeze

06-01-2006, 09:52 PM

cool breezy: I don't even post in here, only on playofftime. And I usually only glance at the thread, but i happened to stumble on geo2's and I had to emphasize how right he is. I don't show any preference over other posters unless I have reason. <3

Tim Thomas doesn't do booker T thing, he actually does the Tony yayo shit: "you can't see me" or "face"

Aight now that I can respect a little bit, most people on SRK post on stuff they saw on the last page and not things they read throughout.
But Geo tends to not read and entire post so he doesnt really understand or WANT to understand my posts.
I explained myself more than a million tims about the bench situation.
And I even posted an appology about the post I made about Wade before he even came back to posted in this thread.

Hokuto Shingo

06-01-2006, 09:53 PM

Well again I come here as usual to call Cool-Breeze an idiot and to let all of you know that the Mavs will win it all. Thats it

Autocrat1

06-01-2006, 10:00 PM

merdoc

06-01-2006, 10:06 PM

Actually, Tim Thomas got that from John Cena's "You Can't See Me" taunt, who did that way before Yayo did.

Don't know who made that more popular, but I'm going with the wigger Cena, sadly.

I just remembered...Tim DID indeed get that from Cena because he had front rows seats to the WWE Judgment Day PPV which was in Phoenix, even though that was a SmackDown PPV it still is the same company that Cena is in.

Dirk was dropping bombs tonight like Hitler in his prime..........

lol @ the dirk comment

i can imagine marv.."that was just terrible czar"

Autocrat1

06-01-2006, 10:13 PM

Here's the Tim Thomas/WWE proof

http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/8956/tima0yd.jpg

http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/5047/timb3kq.jpg

Cool-Breeze

06-01-2006, 10:14 PM

Well again I come here as usual to call Cool-Breeze an idiot and to let all of you know that the Mavs will win it all. Thats it

Im an Idiot for having opinions just like the rest of you???
Wow go figure, I have really only been wrong about the Wade comment so pfft on this comment.
Even though I dont actually remember saying anything directed towards you...
Maybe because before now you didnt exist :rolleyes:

Robust

06-01-2006, 10:18 PM

Actually, Tim Thomas got that from John Cena's "You Can't See Me" taunt, who did that way before Yayo did.

Don't know who made that more popular, but I'm going with the wigger Cena, sadly.

I just remembered...Tim DID indeed get that from Cena because he had front rows seats to the WWE Judgment Day PPV which was in Phoenix, even though that was a SmackDown PPV it still is the same company that Cena is in.

Dirk was dropping bombs tonight like Hitler in his prime..........
I don't watch wrestling, but that would make perfect sense.

My fav move after doing something dope is merton hanks from the 49ers. I remember shaq used to incorporate it into his repertoire of dope moves.

DanielLarusso

06-01-2006, 11:22 PM

Dirk took over at the end of the game like Wade took over at the end of game four.

I said it before and I'll say it again, Miami better win tonight, or else it's gonna be a LOOOONG plane ride up to Detroit for that seventh game. Shaquille - up 3-1 and lose - meet Kobe - up 3-1 and lose. Both in the same playoffs? Make your move tonight Miami.

The Heat is on.

Hokuto Shingo

06-02-2006, 12:36 AM

Im an Idiot for having opinions just like the rest of you???
Wow go figure, I have really only been wrong abou