Makoto Video Thread/Match Critiques

himynameisnatehimynameisnate whoo yeahJoined: Posts: 14


I finally get to upload some of my matches. Sorry for the horrible quality; I recorded it off my cellphone.

Kinda failed in my executions in some, I don't usually drop my combos; that's what lag does to you T_T. But it got better later.

Recorded it off the replay, by the way. Good and bad critiques are welcomed. Need to know what areas I do good in, and what areas I lack and need to improve. =p

Edit: Changed the title so that people can upload their own matches, and have theirs critiqued.
"People become bakers because they knead the dough"
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Comments

  • KenshinXKenshinX Joined: Posts: 28
    I think you're trying to play her too much like her 3S form. Following up a Hayate with cr. lk into hayate is not really a safe move, that Dudley could've punished it with an uppercut if it was blocked. Plus you're not really making good use of her pokes and just rushing in recklessly. You're trying to get in that karakusa and gimmicking your way to victory too much. If you're opponent knew how to block and punish, you would've lost. How many cr. mp and hayates did he block that game?
  • UndiscoveryUndiscovery Booty. Ages 3+ Joined: Posts: 207
    The first thing I noticed was an absolute abuse of Hayate. The best suggestion I can say is....don't. It's very tempting because a normal canceled into the Hayate seems very 'quick', and sequential iterations seems to give the idea that you're applying offensive pressure. But, Hayate is something you really need to pick your spots for. The fact that ANY version of it can be Focus Absorbed means if your opponent doesn't want to be put into block stun, he doesn't have to....and he might get a counter crumple into free combo to boot.

    The second thing I noticed was an under-utilization of Makoto's normals. Please trust me on this....her normals are GDLK. If you want to put pressure on your opponent, use normals.

    The only other things I have to say are pretty trivial. Like ^^^KenshinX said, you can't play her like 3s Makoto; a lot of things were lost in translation. The risk/reward for rushing in to get a karakusa is not worth it at all, because once they get a reversal knockdown, they will jump in on your wake up all day. The true threat is really that she has the option to Karakusa, and which leads me to my final note.

    Once you get a knockdown, you gotta start going for mixups. She has many options:

    Whiffed Forward+HK to the other side and start pokes or jump in
    Cross up with MK and either do block strings into overhead or command grab
    Block string into tick throw with kara throw, follow up with jump in.

    It's ok to be up in your opponents face and not do damage. The pressure itself is enough to eventually make your opponent crack, and then you get your guaranteed damage.
    Hip bone connected to the...butt bone.
  • himynameisnatehimynameisnate whoo yeah Joined: Posts: 14
    Thanks guys, your response made me think twice about my gameplay. Although, it does seem like I spam Hayates too much, but it's just because I'm able to exploit it, and make full use of it without getting punished too hard. If he did catch on, and made me regret pushing out my Hayate, then my game plan will change. And yeah, I did play much like a 3s Makoto on that one, haha.

    Here's another match where I 'adapted' to a much more 'punish' style and made use of her normals more. See how it fares:



    Again, positive and negative criticism are always welcomed. Anything to level up. =p
    "People become bakers because they knead the dough"
  • NinjaCWNinjaCW Joined: Posts: 486
    We should probably just use this thread for anyone wanting feedback on their makoto so we don't have more of these threads popping up. If the OP doesn't mind that is. . .
  • lilfootlilfoot Joined: Posts: 107
    Nice match, but I don't think you'll be learning "from your mistakes" by playing that Dudley. Seems like you got away with murder.
    I personally like getting smash by players much better than me so some of those lessons are beaten into me =)
  • Falco2073Falco2073 Joined: Posts: 4
    How does one practice though? The majority of people on Live are noobs that won't help your game at all, and if anything probably get you into bad habits. And I don't really know any good players.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    yeah im going to post my video if OP gives me the okay

    oh my OP is that monitor an Asus VH222 if so i got the same thing lol
  • Rey AriesRey Aries Joined: Posts: 484
    Thanks guys, your response made me think twice about my gameplay. Although, it does seem like I spam Hayates too much, but it's just because I'm able to exploit it, and make full use of it without getting punished too hard. If he did catch on, and made me regret pushing out my Hayate, then my game plan will change. And yeah, I did play much like a 3s Makoto on that one, haha.

    Here's another match where I 'adapted' to a much more 'punish' style and made use of her normals more. See how it fares:



    Again, positive and negative criticism are always welcomed. Anything to level up. =p

    I don't know anything about Makoto, but I can tell you that you were playing better. My only complaint is that you should use other things for punishing than a sweep because I'm pretty sure there are better more damage dealing punishers for Makoto. If not, I have no real feed back lol.
  • ChoysauceChoysauce Joined: Posts: 101
    double post ftl, srk needs to fix this problem
  • MiyomeiMiyomei SonSon is top tier. Joined: Posts: 1,532
    I think the OP (or a mod) should change the title to "Makoto Match Video Thread/Critiques".

    Here's mine. This was yesterday. Still working on my execution and getting used to Dudley's SSFIV antics. There are some terribly long periods of nothing in the second and first rounds, sorry.

  • himynameisnatehimynameisnate whoo yeah Joined: Posts: 14
    @ NinjaCW and Miyomei: I totally wouldn't mind changing the title to what Miyomei suggested. It would be nice to see other peoples matches.

    @lilfoot: True. There's no way to get better than playing someone that is better than you.

    @Falco2073: True too. But, I don't play with scrubs though. Most of these guys that I play with, since I only play with my friends online who live on the same island, haha, are pretty good. We have a local tournament scene going on, and usually it consists of the same guys that I play with everyday on casuals. The 'tournament' just gives it a more 'official atmosphere', makes everyone hype. Check out this channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/GuStreetFighter

    @FunkyLam: Sorry dude, it's a Samsung T240HD lol. And yes, I'm totally changing(if I can figure out how, haha) the title so that anyone can post up their matches. If I can't or aren't able to, hopefully a mod sees it, and is able to make the changes.

    @Rey Aries: Usually knockdowns are what you want to aim for, although Mak doesn't really have that much of a mixup game.
    "People become bakers because they knead the dough"
  • KenshinXKenshinX Joined: Posts: 28
    @Rey Aries: Usually knockdowns are what you want to aim for, although Mak doesn't really have that much of a mixup game.
    Lolwut?
  • himynameisnatehimynameisnate whoo yeah Joined: Posts: 14
    Lolwut?

    I was comparing her to like mix-up masters like Akuma and Gief, but oh well.
    "People become bakers because they knead the dough"
  • LoliSauceLoliSauce Joined: Posts: 19
    @FunkyLam: Sorry dude, it's a Samsung T240HD lol. And yes, I'm totally changing(if I can figure out how, haha) the title so that anyone can post up their matches. If I can't or aren't able to, hopefully a mod sees it, and is able to make the changes.
    Just double click the "edit post" button on the first post, and you can change the title in the advanced edit screen.
  • Sandman3621Sandman3621 Joined: Posts: 17
    I don't know if anyone posted this up yet, but here is some footage from a guy named Daidouraku. He's actually playing against someone that's good :D I've been using this has a reference point of how I'm going to start using my Makoto. Good stuff!

  • daffudaffu Just Say No Joined: Posts: 39
    http://www.youtube.com/user/Disgustipated#g/c/38CE840F29AD898A

    Playlist of my ranked mode training as I slowly learn the character. Of what is uploaded so far I know I need to work on anti-airs, but anything else I can work on improving?
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Video of me vs a Guile player. Any critiques would be welcomed.

  • Twin RhapsodyTwin Rhapsody Absent for a while. Joined: Posts: 212
    Video of me vs a Guile player. Any critiques would be welcomed.


    Holy crap, you managed to actually land Abare against Guile's Booms! Thought that was damn near impossible. Was he just not blocking the 2nd one?
    MvC3 Team: Felicia/Chris/Whisker
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Holy crap, you managed to actually land Abare against Guile's Booms! Thought that was damn near impossible. Was he just not blocking the 2nd one?

    I buffered in the ultra during my jump and activated it as soon as I saw him move, so it was pretty much an educated guess. He didnt change up his pattern too well.
  • RizhallRizhall 殺意はhot-hot!! Joined: Posts: 1,099
    This isn't really targeted to anyone in particular, but I think one running problem I noticed with you guys is that you guys let your opponent off the hook too easily. You guys land a hit, and get a chance to shift momentum, but then you guys back off and give the enemy time to breath and build up confidence. I'm not saying you should rush in blindly, but stay close, and give your enemy little time to lick his wounds. Pressure isn't always normallxxHayate, you can do other stuff like, nomalxxHayate CANCEL dash karakusa, jump Tsurugi cLPxxHayate cancel dashback dashforward, cLPxxOverhead, jump crossover/jump tsurugi mixup.
    If it's casual matches, you don't HAVE to win. Just practice. If something doesn't work out, then fine, you know that now, and your game stepped up that little bit. If it DOES work, your game just got leveled up without even trying. Don't be scared of a reversal or 5, just go for it. You're the one that's learning, not him.

    Even Daidouraku started losing once he let Desora breath, but when he started rushing down again, he would bring the win~
    Note: I have the same problem, and I'm working through it too. =P

    @OMNI88 WTF REACTIONS! *thumbs up*
    Subtle and insubstantial, the expert leaves no trace; divinely mysterious, he is inaudible. Thus he is master of his enemy's fate.
  • Mr. Basara!!Mr. Basara!! Satsui no Flowchart! Joined: Posts: 783
    Video of me vs a Guile player. Any critiques would be welcomed.


    I don't feel comfortable criticizing someone who Abare'd Guile's Boom Twice... It's like going up to God and saying "Ya know? You coulda really done such and such better..."

    Good shit.

    But seriously, when Guile was walking behind those booms, you were holding your focus too long. Once the boom hits you, you need to let it go. You aren't going for crumple, so much as just trying to hit him and keep him from going in to the "Life Lead sit back and Boom" strategy.

    I know it's hard, but EX Hayate to get in isn't the way to go. I only saw you use it once, so I guess it's fine.

    All i can say is, when you get in, mix up normals with EX oroshi, tick throw, and IA Tsurugi more. Aside from that, good shit, sir. Clutch wins.
    It's like saying "Coke should make green cans. Mountain Dew has green cans, I don't see why Coke has to be this underpowered in can color." -Kich
  • BronzefistBronzefist Spews random garbage Joined: Posts: 1,526 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    This isn't really targeted to anyone in particular, but I think one running problem I noticed with you guys is that you guys let your opponent off the hook too easily. You guys land a hit, and get a chance to shift momentum, but then you guys back off and give the enemy time to breath and build up confidence. I'm not saying you should rush in blindly, but stay close, and give your enemy little time to lick his wounds. Pressure isn't always normallxxHayate, you can do other stuff like, nomalxxHayate CANCEL dash karakusa, jump Tsurugi cLPxxHayate cancel dashback dashforward, cLPxxOverhead, jump crossover/jump tsurugi mixup.
    If it's casual matches, you don't HAVE to win. Just practice. If something doesn't work out, then fine, you know that now, and your game stepped up that little bit. If it DOES work, your game just got leveled up without even trying. Don't be scared of a reversal or 5, just go for it. You're the one that's learning, not him.

    Even Daidouraku started losing once he let Desora breath, but when he started rushing down again, he would bring the win~
    Note: I have the same problem, and I'm working through it too. =P

    @OMNI88 WTF REACTIONS! *thumbs up*

    I'm definitely guilty of not pressuring enough as well, however my big problem with her is that she seems to be too reliant on her dash for closing the distance. I'm used to characters like Gen, Chun & Adon that actually have a fast (or at least respectable) walk speed, where I can manuver in and out of footsies and block as soon as possible. Once Makoto commits to a dash she doesn't have that luxury. Right now if I get agressive I eat jab spam or some SRK reversal. Wakeup pressure depends entirely on your opponent's character and their playstyle. I've been fighting WAY TOO MANY flowchart scrubs online that SRK me as soon as I even think about applying wakeup pressure, so I've developed a bad habit of not pressuring people as much as I should (online in general has given me some terrible habits :/).

    In general I find that when I *try* to be offensive I end up having to play defensively because I find it to be very difficult to safely approach some characters. That's just been my experience though.

    Although I really do need to play some games and say "fuck it," and go all out with offense--should be entertaining at least.
    THIS WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A FIGHT TO THE DEATH...
    MvC3: She Hulk, Thor, Hulk, Haggar lariat assist, Arthur dagger assist
    SSF4: Gen, Makoto, Adon...all at scrub level :sad:
  • Mr. Basara!!Mr. Basara!! Satsui no Flowchart! Joined: Posts: 783
    Honestly, I don't think Makoto wants to be in her opponent's face. You want to make sure to stay around max mp range. Dashing in and getting closer than that is only ok after you've conditioned the opponent to not press buttons through frame traps or just out right beating their shit down. THEN you can get in their face and start grabbing them.

    The only time I think it's ok to be nose to nose distance is after you get an untechable knockdown. That's when you want to get in and press your meaties and safe jumps. But hey, different strokes for different folks, I guess. If you're winning, then you're winning.
    It's like saying "Coke should make green cans. Mountain Dew has green cans, I don't see why Coke has to be this underpowered in can color." -Kich
  • NinjaCWNinjaCW Joined: Posts: 486
    For everyone relying on dash to close the distance stop it, either crawl (walk speed) or use her normals to close the distance. Trust me once you get in the range of s.mp here comes a jump, crouching forward, or standing poke. If it's a Shoto it's most likely jump or crouching forward unless they are really confident in their footsies (akuma watch out for f.RH). I have found that people realize for trying to do crouching forward I will IAT them on the head so they go to focus. You want people to fear that range and it's hard if you can't control them in the air.

    If you take control of the air she can win the ground game for the most part anyway.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    I don't feel comfortable criticizing someone who Abare'd Guile's Boom Twice... It's like going up to God and saying "Ya know? You coulda really done such and such better..."

    Good shit.

    But seriously, when Guile was walking behind those booms, you were holding your focus too long. Once the boom hits you, you need to let it go. You aren't going for crumple, so much as just trying to hit him and keep him from going in to the "Life Lead sit back and Boom" strategy.

    I know it's hard, but EX Hayate to get in isn't the way to go. I only saw you use it once, so I guess it's fine.

    All i can say is, when you get in, mix up normals with EX oroshi, tick throw, and IA Tsurugi more. Aside from that, good shit, sir. Clutch wins.


    Thanks. All I used to play was Abel so trying to get in without a step kick has been difficult, so im trying to get rid of the urge to jump in or random hayate when I get frustrated. Im working on IA tsurugi and using her normals better.
  • Mr. Basara!!Mr. Basara!! Satsui no Flowchart! Joined: Posts: 783
    Thanks. All I used to play was Abel so trying to get in without a step kick has been difficult, so im trying to get rid of the urge to jump in or random hayate when I get frustrated. Im working on IA tsurugi and using her normals better.

    F+MK at a moderate range and F+MP at a slightly closer range are good alternatives for moving in. I think they're a bit safer (and faster) than IA Tsurugi, but you don't get the payoff for landing them. You're doing fine, though.
    It's like saying "Coke should make green cans. Mountain Dew has green cans, I don't see why Coke has to be this underpowered in can color." -Kich
  • TebenTeben Joined: Posts: 88
    Watching Abare punish Sonic Boom makes me feel good inside.
    F+MK at a moderate range and F+MP at a slightly closer range are good alternatives for moving in.
    thisssssss.
    http://www.theawesomeevery.com
    http://teben-the-every.deviantart.com

    Like art? Commissions are wide open, check the links above for examples!
  • WilWil Joined: Posts: 6,253
    Here's a couple vids of me trying Makoto out:




    I'm set on trying to make Makoto (and Guy) work in SSF4, so I'll be hitting up this Makoto forum quite a bit to learn from all the other players.

    The play styles of Guy and Makoto are a big change from the characters I used in vanilla SF4. I used Honda and Blanka in that game but will probably use them again when I feel like I want to turtle it up. :sweat:
    SFV: Cammy, Ibuki, Karin
  • Roy0Roy0 Team NAH Joined: Posts: 543
    I'll be on this thread A LOT! Come August, you guys are going to hate me with my flood of vids. =P
    Member Of Rutgers' Underground Gaming Society: Knight Slash 4! Spring 2012
    http://www.youtube.com/user/JustBlockStupid
  • TebenTeben Joined: Posts: 88
    Here's something I've been doing. I was originally posting them in the strats and match ups thread but, this place seems more appropriate.





    The idea is to show a mixture of failure and success in order to come up with better ideas. I try to explain why I feel things are or are not working in these videos, too. Hopefully, it will show an evolution of my Makoto's game play as well. Thanks to everyone who said they enjoyed them! I'll see about getting up another soon.

    I'm also excited to start seeing how everyone else is doing.
    http://www.theawesomeevery.com
    http://teben-the-every.deviantart.com

    Like art? Commissions are wide open, check the links above for examples!
  • daffudaffu Just Say No Joined: Posts: 39
    Yesterday after some casual matches with a friend we did a first to five set, both of us sticking with the new character we are trying to learn.




  • lilfootlilfoot Joined: Posts: 107
    awesome videos teben. especially loving the annotations. I'm a total scrub so it helps a lot.
  • SaintAviSaintAvi Joined: Posts: 84
    Here's something I've been doing. I was originally posting them in the strats and match ups thread but, this place seems more appropriate.





    The idea is to show a mixture of failure and success in order to come up with better ideas. I try to explain why I feel things are or are not working in these videos, too. Hopefully, it will show an evolution of my Makoto's game play as well. Thanks to everyone who said they enjoyed them! I'll see about getting up another soon.

    I'm also excited to start seeing how everyone else is doing.

    Subscribed, Im trying to progress with Makoto, it's proven a bumpy road so far though.
  • MadTitanMadTitan Thanos Reigns! Joined: Posts: 1,210
    I'll be putting some matches up soon.. still loving the mak. FINALLY got some stuff figured out.

    (Disclaimer - I didn't really play much sf4 prior to ssf4 so it's been learning curve... also In 400ish ranked matches I have yet to pick someone other than mak...)

    I went from 78th ranked makoto in n.america to 34th ranked last night.. landing both my first 5-peat and 10-peat (actually made it to 14).. doesn't mean much yet given that most stuff isn't even discovered with her yet.. but I feel good about ALL her normals and ALL her specials right now. GOD LIKE all the way around.

    Vids incoming this evening.. really need the feedback.
    <-Nicer than you->
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Another vid against a Ken player.

  • NinjaCWNinjaCW Joined: Posts: 486


    Some more matches I had vs a Chun player (my friend), I did a lot of silly things in the match but he's hard to make sit still.
  • farplanerfarplaner Joined: Posts: 636
    Another vid against a Ken player.


    Hey, great use of cr.MK as anti-air man. I know I need to train myself to anti-air better but I can never seem to find any normal to be consistent.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Hey, great use of cr.MK as anti-air man. I know I need to train myself to anti-air better but I can never seem to find any normal to be consistent.

    Its only a place holder anti-air for now, until Im more comfortable using fukiage. The extra damage and stun I can get off that compared to a regular normal is too good to pass up.
  • daffudaffu Just Say No Joined: Posts: 39
    Now I am curious, how often do people try to use Fukiage as AA? Once I found out how awesome st.MP is I never even think of Fukiage. Maybe if I am trying to counter a cross up attempt, but rarely ever.
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