Chikara no Hadou: Evil Ryu Strategies & Match-up Thread

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  • m16ghostm16ghost Joined: Posts: 1,810
    It's not that hard to safe jump Cammy. Cannon spike is 5 frames, and she gets up a frame late on face up knockdowns, which is all Evil Ryu has.

    http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?threads/work-in-progess-the-evil-ryu-guide.153362/page-2#post-7352613

    From the frame data, it looks like Cammy is + on block after dp fadc, which seems terribly wrong. I will have to double check that.
  • LinksLinks No copyright law in the universe is gonna stop me! Joined: Posts: 956
    What was she hitting you with after cs fadc?

    I use ultra 1 in this match. When you get her cannon spike to go the wrong way, it's really hard to punish her. If you've got ultra one, just hit it when you land and it'll punish.

    Cannon spike is 4 frames, so you can safe jump it, but it's really difficult because she has a different wakeup timing than the rest of the cast. She gets up late.
    After CS FADC, usually crouching short or strong. I tried to crouch-tech. I'll probably switch to Ultra 1 as well.
    It's not that hard to safe jump Cammy. Cannon spike is 5 frames, and she gets up a frame late on face up knockdowns, which is all Evil Ryu has.

    http://shoryuken.com/forum/index.php?threads/work-in-progess-the-evil-ryu-guide.153362/page-2#post-7352613

    From the frame data, it looks like Cammy is + on block after dp fadc, which seems terribly wrong. I will have to double check that.
    Wow, that can't be right. If it is right, then that's seriously too good. o_O
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  • KomatikKomatik Card demon Joined: Posts: 2,669
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  • LinksLinks No copyright law in the universe is gonna stop me! Joined: Posts: 956
    picture
    Yes... Yes, that is a Cannon Spike. Dat hitbox.

    So it looks like it wouldn't be too difficult to make it whiff on my cross up Tatsu.
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  • DannkkDannkk Joined: Posts: 1,761
    You can actually stuff Cammy's wake up cannon spike. I'm not a matchup training mode guy and probably 60% of the time we both whiff and she goes the wrong way, so I don't know exactly how it works. But a lot of the time if you land a forward throw and then do the walk back for 1 frame then whiff s.mp and do j.lk and she does a reversal cannon spike it will stuff her on the ground and I can land c.lp, s.hp.

    This might be an easier "safe jump" for you to try. I have it in quotes, because she can do a late cannon spike and it will hit you, but it takes an intermediate-higher level player to know that and do it consistantly. Almost every cammy though...will cs and then whiff or get stuffed...and as soon as they get tired of that and start trying to block it's ambiguous as hell so you mix it up with dive kicks and they get hit a lot.
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  • DannkkDannkk Joined: Posts: 1,761
    double post
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  • BlackVenom18BlackVenom18 I play to win, not to entertain Joined: Posts: 143
    Any tips on keeping Seth grounded and stop him from jumping all over the place
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  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    edited February 2013
    Stoping by to share something I tested a few days ago.

    A friend of mine playing with Ibuki was escaping the ex axe kick unblockable with her qcf +K and I decided to check if I was doing it wrong or if its really escapable and Id need to find an OS. Its really escapable and the only OS that will catch Ibuki's qcf + HK is the U1. After the backdash, jump in and do qcf MK, qcb PPP.
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    another thing, its not new aswell, Im just posting to assure that everyone knows about it.

    When doing the unblockable against Seth, use cl.HP as an OS and finish the combo with a HK tatsu. If you managed to do the first combo starting at least with c.MP, the j.HK + HK tatsu will dizzy him and the next combo will kill him.
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    Any tips on keeping Seth grounded and stop him from jumping all over the place

    dp, jump with an early hit, neutral jump. None of them are flawless due seth's possibilities of changing the direction of his jump arch. If youre looking for something to deal with his jumps over you when you are knocked down, you dont have too many options. The setup after the SPD (spd, dash, walk and j HK) is really safe against E.R., and its easy to do. If you are going to try a dp, Id recommend the LP one, the one with better chances of hitting (will trade, follow with an Ultra if you can), but remember that the "better chances" are like 0,00001%. Your dash will get hit by the j HK, never tried the backdash, I think youre going to dodge the j HK and then you gonna eat the rest of the combo. Theres the focus + dash, you will absorv the j HK and get hit by Seth's next move, if hes try to do a string with low kicks and low punchs theres a chance the first of them will hit and the next one will miss. If he does a neutral jump with instant dive, it will dodge the MP, HP and EX dps, Im not sure about the lp one actually, Im almost sure that it gets beaten, almost.
  • yoeyoe16yoeyoe16 Joined: Posts: 31
    any tips also on the sakura matchup? i also seem to have problems regarding her fr.hk poke. any tips would be appreciated :D
  • ShineboxShinebox Joined: Posts: 2,689
    edited March 2013
    yoeyoe16 wrote: »
    any tips also on the sakura matchup? i also seem to have problems regarding her fr.hk poke. any tips would be appreciated :D

    So far this has worked for me:
    Only throw fireballs if you can catch her with an SRK afterwards, use fs.HK to AA her if she gets jumping happy. Most Sakura's love to turtle so don't be afraid to cr.MK > EX Axe kick. Use fs.MK as a poke when she's staying back too much and using st.HK, you have to be careful not to eat a trade because it's not in your favor. You can safely jump in on her because most will try to AA with d.HP this is your chance to land a dive kick on her

    For this match up I use U2.

    Oh one more thing, her wake up isn't that good. So if you land a MK Axe kick go for cr.LK > fs.LP > cr.HK on her.
  • yoeyoe16yoeyoe16 Joined: Posts: 31
    Thanks for the reply Shinebox :)
    will go to the lab right away and try those things out :D
  • GodlyDpStatureGodlyDpStature Joined: Posts: 14
    Hey guys, I started playing E Ryu a bit ago and he's so fun I've almost already got him to B Rank

    Anyways, I have this friend that plays CODY and I need help on the matchup

    1. Any Safe Jumps/Unblockables/Fake Crossups/Character Specific Cody Setups you know of?
    2. Best Normals vs Cody? I throw out c mk. but it often gets beaten out, leaving me eating damage or a full combo
    3. Best Ultra for Cody? I use ultra 1 because of Shoryu into full Ultra 1, but is ultra 2 better in this matchup?
    4. Best punish for blocked Ruffian Kick?
    5. Best punish for blocked Criminal Upper
    6. Best punish for blocked Zonk Knuckle?
    7. Best punish for blocked Bad Spray (Sand/Dirt attack)?
    8. General goal in this matchup to win, etc...?

    Sorry guys, I know this is a lot of stuff but if you were to even answer 1 of these I would be appreciative. I looked through every page of this thread to no avail for info on Cody.

    Any help at all would be awesome, thanks!


  • yoeyoe16yoeyoe16 Joined: Posts: 31
    edited May 2013
    having a hard time pulling off a cr.LK > fs.LP > cr.HK after a MK Axe kick -_-
  • LinksLinks No copyright law in the universe is gonna stop me! Joined: Posts: 956
    edited May 2013
    Hey guys, I started playing E Ryu a bit ago and he's so fun I've almost already got him to B Rank

    Anyways, I have this friend that plays CODY and I need help on the matchup

    1. Any Safe Jumps/Unblockables/Fake Crossups/Character Specific Cody Setups you know of?
    2. Best Normals vs Cody? I throw out c mk. but it often gets beaten out, leaving me eating damage or a full combo
    3. Best Ultra for Cody? I use ultra 1 because of Shoryu into full Ultra 1, but is ultra 2 better in this matchup?
    4. Best punish for blocked Ruffian Kick?
    5. Best punish for blocked Criminal Upper
    6. Best punish for blocked Zonk Knuckle?
    7. Best punish for blocked Bad Spray (Sand/Dirt attack)?
    8. General goal in this matchup to win, etc...?

    Sorry guys, I know this is a lot of stuff but if you were to even answer 1 of these I would be appreciative. I looked through every page of this thread to no avail for info on Cody.

    Any help at all would be awesome, thanks!


    1. For Cody, safe jumps are almost irrelevant. He has no invincible wakeup moves without meter, and even then, a meaty attack will beat EX Criminal Upper and any jump-in would be fine since you'll be able to block before EX Zonk hits. You can do unblockables on Cody, such as
    2. Cr. MK is not great versus Cody, but it stops him from moving forward recklessly and can beat out Crack Kick if timed properly. St. MP is pretty good for buffering into fireballs. St. MK also works well as a poke, but it loses to Focus Attacks and jump-ins. I'd say the MP buttons are your friends.
    3. I go for Ultra 2 in almost every matchup, and this one is no exception. The fact that you can punish a blocked EX Zonk with Cr. MK xx EX Hadoken FADC, Ultra 2 for around 500 damage is worth it to me. You can also punish a HP Criminal Upper with a reversal Ultra 2. Ultra 1 is just universally useful, so I'd say it's a matter of preference.
    4. Depends on the strength used. The LP version may be best punished by a grab, Jab, or reversal DP if blocked at a distance. Cody players like to set up meaty or far LK Ruffians, so be careful. These can be made pretty safe. The MK, HK, and EX versions are pretty unsafe, so you can easily land a Close HP into combo.
    5. Depends on the version. The MP and HP versions can be easily punished by Cr. MK or Cr. HK. The HP version can be punished by reversal Ultra 2. I need to lab this a bit more to determine a reliable LP Criminal punisher.
    6. Cr. MK punishes Zonk. You can get Cr. MK xx LK Tatsu at most distances of a blocked Zonk.
    7. Bad Spray is free to punish since it has horrible blockstun, just walk up a bit before pressing a button.
    8. General goal is to play it safe until you get a knockdown, then go to town on him. Cody has trouble dealing with ambiguous crossups and the like since his reversals are slow or lose to jump-in attacks (with the exception of HK Super, but don't worry too much about that one :P). When at mid-range, Cody can play footsies effectively with Evil Ryu. You should play it safe and try to bait Zonk Knuckles and counter-hit/punish those using Cr. MK xx Tatsu. Be wary of jumps once you've shut down Cody's other options. You'll need to be on point with anti-air SRKs in this matchup since Cody's J. HK and HP have high priority and can easily beat Cr. HP unless they are poorly spaced.

    Basically, if I beat Cody, I usually end up stunning him. Play it safe and patient until you have the opportunity, then exploit the holes in Cody's defense.
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  • DangerDanger Joined: Posts: 3
    I'm tryin to pick up e. ryu.
    What are my main footsie tools? Cr. mk and mp?
    Also, what are my options for wake up?

    I'm actually fairly new to ae, but have been playing sf casually since sf2, and have finally decided to take it more seriously.

    Thanks for the help in advance!
  • DarkMessatsuDarkMessatsu Joined: Posts: 2
    Hi guys i´m having a bad time plinking cr.mp after mk axe kick.any tips?
  • Rice_EaterRice_Eater Now more Evil Joined: Posts: 1,807
    Hi guys i´m having a bad time plinking cr.mp after mk axe kick.any tips?

    I'm using audio cues for this link. Evil Ryu does that loud grunt after a axe kick, wait until after he finishes the grunt to link your cr. MP. Their are visual cues as well. When he stomps the ground, he creates a cloud of dust, if you focus on that and wait for it to disappear, that's about the right time to hit the link as well. I find it easier to go for the audio cue though, but admittedly I still lose focus and try to feel it out like I normally do. You just have to keep at it until you can train yourself to do it naturally instead of looking for it. Hopefully at some point, I can do it by feel instead of listening to the audio.
  • DarkMessatsuDarkMessatsu Joined: Posts: 2
    Rice_Eater wrote: »
    Hi guys i´m having a bad time plinking cr.mp after mk axe kick.any tips?

    I'm using audio cues for this link. Evil Ryu does that loud grunt after a axe kick, wait until after he finishes the grunt to link your cr. MP. Their are visual cues as well. When he stomps the ground, he creates a cloud of dust, if you focus on that and wait for it to disappear, that's about the right time to hit the link as well. I find it easier to go for the audio cue though, but admittedly I still lose focus and try to feel it out like I normally do. You just have to keep at it until you can train yourself to do it naturally instead of looking for it. Hopefully at some point, I can do it by feel instead of listening to the audio.

    thanks
  • ShineboxShinebox Joined: Posts: 2,689
    edited May 2013
    When you see his teeth is another time to do the plink
    yoeyoe16 wrote: »
    having a hard time pulling off a cr.LK > fs.LP > cr.HK after a MK Axe kick -_-

    I was actually wrong this doesn't work on her. I was thinking about Ibuki

    Anyhow, you can also counter poke with S+HP and get some counter hits on her, try not to press buttons if she has you cornered and you're getting frame trapped she will win. Try to avoid walking backwards too much. Your st.MK is definitely the best poke in this match up

    Speaking of, does anyone have any tips for dealing with Ibuki?

    So far I have tried playing the match up against her like I would when I use Ryu but it's not quite working out my grounded normals seem a little slow and I'm getting whiff punished alot. This was also Thrillhouse I was playing against. cr.MP worked pretty well when she close but that's about all I have right now

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated

  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    edited June 2013
    Post edited by DeathGun on
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    edited June 2013
    Shinebox wrote: »
    When you see his teeth is another time to do the plink
    yoeyoe16 wrote: »
    having a hard time pulling off a cr.LK > fs.LP > cr.HK after a MK Axe kick -_-

    I was actually wrong this doesn't work on her. I was thinking about Ibuki

    Anyhow, you can also counter poke with S+HP and get some counter hits on her, try not to press buttons if she has you cornered and you're getting frame trapped she will win. Try to avoid walking backwards too much. Your st.MK is definitely the best poke in this match up

    Speaking of, does anyone have any tips for dealing with Ibuki?

    So far I have tried playing the match up against her like I would when I use Ryu but it's not quite working out my grounded normals seem a little slow and I'm getting whiff punished alot. This was also Thrillhouse I was playing against. cr.MP worked pretty well when she close but that's about all I have right now

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated


    mk AK, c.LP xx LK tatsu, c.LP and forward dash. That may or may not cross under her. If you manage to reset properly, she will get dizzy.

    U1 to stop her from scaping from the EX AK unblockable.

    in the corner, MK AK, c.MP xx LK tatsu, c.LP or c.LK and dash. If you use c.LP the dash wont cross under her, if you use c.LK it will.

    The guy that plays with Ibuki over here sucks whenever he isnt vortexing but I just noticed that she isnt the best footsier around. Keep spamming c.mk xx hadoken, s.MK, hadokens from close distance and c.MP to get a counter hit. Ibuki will keep trying to get past hadokens with her slide and the ex neckbreaker and trying to get a knockdown whenever possible. If she does the slide too near or too far, she shall get punished. Her sweep is easy to bait because Evil Ryu's pokes have longer range, she tends to throw it out in antecipation, you shall c.mk xx LK AK when it whiffs.

    She have an unblockable against Evil Ryu, very easy to perform: ex neckbreaker, backadsh, qcf K, j. LK. You shall crouch the first frames and then block it as a crossup. Feels like youre doing a hadoken. Its easy to block, but you have to be aware in case she does a kunai instead the j.LK.

    If you blocked her EX dp, dash forward and punish properly, you wont need to guess if shes going to throw the kunai or not.
  • ShineboxShinebox Joined: Posts: 2,689
    edited June 2013
    Thanks I will make sure to try some of that out.

    Next question: Akuma

    -I cannot play footsies with that character's walkspeed
    -You can't whiff punish this character because he will back dash then walk forward and throw
    -His grounded normals also faster
    -Constantly throws fireballs in front of him and advances towards me

    Do I guess? From what I noticed in order to win in this match I have to get somewhat lucky and land a hit that will lead to stun

    Also, I used that Makoto unblockable before the second time I tried it though I got punched upward then ex kicked to ex hayate and I was stunned. I guess it's good if they dont expect it <.<
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    akuma's matchup is the most dumb matchup Evil Ryu have. Its like 7-3 akuma imo. You get heavily outfootsied, outzoned and everything leads to a dumb vortex. I will to record a video that will at least allow you to pressure him with a 50/50 jump in the corner after a FADC combo.

    About Makoto's video, in my tests both her DPs, EX grab and hcb PP whiffs. They get performed to the wrong side. The change of sides also makes it really hard for her to dash forward and the backdash dodges the j.MK but takes the rest of the combo.
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    here:

  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    Akuma's setup:



    Theres a lot of details about this setup but I wont write them all here. Try it and bring any concerns to the thread, then I will try to explain it better.
  • ShineboxShinebox Joined: Posts: 2,689
    I might have jumped too late then on Makoto

    I will try the Akuma stuff later.
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    btw, theres some footage of me against an Akuma in some videos I posted recently in the video's section. It isnt a Sako vs Infiltration but may help.
  • tetsu1984tetsu1984 Joined: Posts: 132
    @Deathgun: Your clip is private :(
  • MetaSkipperMetaSkipper Pikachu used Surf! Joined: Posts: 1,556
    A buddy of mine is having trouble against Juri, Bison, and Sagat. Any tips?
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  • LinksLinks No copyright law in the universe is gonna stop me! Joined: Posts: 956
    A buddy of mine is having trouble against Juri, Bison, and Sagat. Any tips?

    I am no expert, but against Bison, St. MP beats Scissor Kick. Knowing that changed the way I play the match a lot. Still have to watch out for Bison's normal pokes though.

    Against Sagat, you just have to play safe and move in smartly. If he throws a high Tiger, use that opportunity to throw a red fireball. Once in footsie range, St. MP and Cr. MK are your friends. If you land any solid hit on him, you've got a serious advantage.

    Not too experienced against good Juri players, but in general I force her to come to me and the rest works itself out.
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  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    edited June 2013
    Not too experienced against good Juri players, but in general I force her to come to me and the rest works itself out.


    how do u force her to come to you? Imo she is the best in the game to outzone Ryu and Evil Ryu, tied with Dhalsim.
  • DannkkDannkk Joined: Posts: 1,761
    DeathGun wrote: »
    Not too experienced against good Juri players, but in general I force her to come to me and the rest works itself out.


    how do u force her to come to you? Imo she is the best in the game to outzone Ryu and Evil Ryu, tied with Dhalsim.

    You don't force her to come to you. You can't. You need to move towards her until she stops backing up. Either cuz she's smart or cornered.
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  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    edited June 2013
    I think the same, but once he said he forces her to come to him, I wanna know more his experiences playing Juries
  • LinksLinks No copyright law in the universe is gonna stop me! Joined: Posts: 956
    DeathGun wrote: »
    I think the same, but once he said he forces her to come to him, I wanna know more his experiences playing Juries
    If you read my post, I say I haven't played many good Juri players. What usually ends up happening is one of the following:
    A. I manage to get in using Focus Attacks, jumps, or low forward fireball FADC and start a party.
    or
    B. Juri jumps at me or dive kicks. If I respond correctly, momentum shifts to me.

    It's pretty simple. You just can't be braindead with your zoning or you WILL get blown up like you said.
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  • Explorer200Explorer200 Joined: Posts: 445
    edited July 2013
    Any tips versus Ryu? I have trouble dealing with his better pokes and ex fireball. Any advice is greatly appreciated.
  • DeathGunDeathGun Joined: Posts: 699
    throw your own ex fireball on him, use your c.mk before Ryu gets in range to use his c.mk, and spam s.MK when Ryu get in the distance to c.mk you.
  • Explorer200Explorer200 Joined: Posts: 445
    edited July 2013
    DeathGun wrote: »
    throw your own ex fireball on him, use your c.mk before Ryu gets in range to use his c.mk, and spam s.MK when Ryu get in the distance to c.mk you.

    I got the spamming S. MK down haha. Funny, for some reason I never thought to use ex fireball outside of combos. (fail). I know evil ryu has a longer reach crouch medium kick but i just seem to get counter poked by Ryu's cr. med kick everytime I use mine.

  • ThisGuy198ThisGuy198 Mid tier lurker. Joined: Posts: 218
    I once suggested that someone should make a Google doc for Evil's matchups (Like they did in the Dee Jay forums) but nothing ever happend >:(
    lol I guise no one has the time.
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