Super Turbo Throw Range Compilation

papasipapasi N Ken is the truthJoined: Posts: 1,568
Just finished collecting all the data and captured 400+ screenshots.

Here are the throw ranges in ascending order
Move                                        Distance advantage compared 
                                            to previous move
                                            (pixels / in game counter)
--------------------------------            --------------------------------
Point Blank                                 0
feilong                                     31
thawk                                       2
balrog/hp                                   1
sagat                                       2
cammy                                       1
deejay, guile                               1
ryu, ken, zangief/super                     1
vega                                        1
zangief/lk suplex                           1
chunli                                      2
mbison, balrog/mp, zangief/throw|mk suplex  1
dhalsim                                     5
blanka                                      5
ehonda                                      2
zangief/hk suplex                           2
ehonda/oicho                                3
thawk/360|super                             7
zangief/spd                                 18

When you slightly tap the stick, you usually move the character from 8~15 pixels / in game counter.

For example, sim will beat vega by 5+1+2+1 = 9 pixels. So you need to control his slide within that range to tick throw vega without worrying about getting counter thrown.

And since feilong's 31 from point blank, if you tap 3 times away from him you'd probably be outside of his throw range.

Boxer's mp is 10 pixels further away from his hp (1 tap).

Honda's normal throw outranges Fei by 25, and yet Gief's spd outranges Honda's normal by 30...


Here's another view of the same data
Move                      How many moves it beats/loses to
-----------------------   --------------------------------
feilong                   -22
thawk                     -20
balrog/hp-throw           -18
sagat                     -16
cammy                     -14
deejay                    -11
guile                     -11
ryu                       -6
zangief/super             -6
ken                       -6
vega                      -2
zangief/lk suplex         0
chunli                    2
mbison                    6
zangief/throw | mk suplex 6
balrog/mp-throw           6
dhalsim                   10
blanka                    12
ehonda                    14
zangief/hk suplex         16
ehonda/oicho              18
thawk/360 | super         20
zangief/spd               22

as you can see, vega/chunli are in the mid tier in terms of throw range
eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/

Comments

  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    As shown in t-akiba's table, the throw ranges are relative

    i.e. even sagat can throw ehonda in 76 pixels (absolute value) and cammy can throw ehonda in 70 pixels, it doesn't mean that sagat can outrange cammy.

    In terms of absolute values though, if you are using the same character (for example, fei) the following are the offsets of each of your opponents
    offset  your opponent
    ------  -------------
     0      cammy, chunli
     2      balrog
     3      ehonda, mbison, vega
     4      feilong, ken, ryu
     5      blanka, deejay, guile
     7      sagat
    10      dhalsim, thawk
    20      zangief
    

    so fei can throw cammy in 65 pixels, cammy's offset is 0, and ehonda's offset is 3, which implies that fei can throw ehonda in 65+3 = 68 pixels.

    You can use this to test it yourself.



    I can say that from the recent researches people contributed, we finally know something that the Japanese might not know down to the details.

    Now we just need to be able to execute :)
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    The number next to the image below is the distance between the two characters as shown in pasky's HUD at the top.


    Table of Content

    feilong
    sagat
    cammy
    deejay
    guile
    ryu
    ken
    vega
    chunli
    mbison
    balrog
    dhalsim
    blanka
    ehonda
    thawk
    zangief
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [feilong]
    feilongfeilong69.png 69
    feilongsagat72.png 72
    feilongcammy65.png 65
    feilongdeejay70.png 70
    feilongguile70.png 70
    feilongryu69.png 69
    feilongken69.png 69
    feilongvega68.png 68
    feilongchunli65.png 65
    feilongmbison68.png 68
    feilongbalrog67.png 67
    feilongdhalsim75.png 75
    feilongblanka70.png 70
    feilongehonda68.png 68
    feilongthawk75.png 75
    feilongzangief85.png 85
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [sagat]
    sagatfeilong77.png 77
    sagatsagat80.png 80
    sagatcammy73.png 73
    sagatdeejay78.png 78
    sagatguile78.png 78
    sagatryu77.png 77
    sagatken77.png 77
    sagatvega76.png 76
    sagatchunli73.png 73
    sagatmbison76.png 76
    sagatbalrog75.png 75
    sagatdhalsim83.png 83
    sagatblanka78.png 78
    sagatehonda76.png 76
    sagatthawk83.png 83
    sagatzangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [cammy]
    cammyfeilong71.png 71
    cammysagat74.png 74
    cammycammy67.png 67
    cammydeejay72.png 72
    cammyguile72.png 72
    cammyryu71.png 71
    cammyken71.png 71
    cammyvega70.png 70
    cammychunli67.png 67
    cammymbison70.png 70
    cammybalrog69.png 69
    cammydhalsim77.png 77
    cammyblanka72.png 72
    cammyehonda70.png 70
    cammythawk77.png 77
    cammyzangief87.png 87
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [deejay]
    deejayfeilong77.png 77
    deejaysagat80.png 80
    deejaycammy73.png 73
    deejaydeejay78.png 78
    deejayguile78.png 78
    deejayryu77.png 77
    deejayken77.png 77
    deejayvega76.png 76
    deejaychunli73.png 73
    deejaymbison76.png 76
    deejaybalrog75.png 75
    deejaydhalsim83.png 83
    deejayblanka78.png 78
    deejayehonda76k.png 76
    deejaythawk83.png 83
    deejayzangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [guile]
    guilefeilong77.png 77
    guilesagat80.png 80
    guilecammy73.png 73
    guiledeejay78.png 78
    guileguile78.png 78
    guileryu77.png 77
    guileken77.png 77
    guilevega76.png 76
    guilechunli73.png 73
    guilembison76.png 76
    guilebalrog75.png 75
    guiledhalsim83.png 83
    guileblanka78.png 78
    guileehonda76.png 76
    guilethawk83.png 83
    guilezangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [ryu]
    ryufeilong77.png 77
    ryusagat80.png 80
    ryucammy73.png 73
    ryudeejay78.png 78
    ryuguile78.png 78
    ryuryu77.png 77
    ryuken77.png 77
    ryuvega76.png 76
    ryuchunli73.png 73
    ryumbison76.png 76
    ryubalrog75.png 75
    ryudhalsim83.png 83
    ryublanka78.png 78
    ryuehonda76.png 76
    ryuthawk83.png 83
    ryuzangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [ken]
    kenfeilong77.png 77
    kensagat80.png 80
    kencammy73.png 73
    kendeejay78.png 78
    kenguile78.png 78
    kenryu77.png 77
    kenken77.png 77
    kenvega76.png 76
    kenchunli73.png 73
    kenmbison76.png 76
    kenbalrog75.png 75
    kendhalsim83.png 83
    kenblanka78.png 78
    kenehonda76.png 76
    kenthawk83.png 83
    kenzangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [vega]
    vegafeilong77.png 77
    vegasagat80.png 80
    vegacammy73.png 73
    vegadeejay78.png 78
    vegaguile78.png 78
    vegaryu77.png 77
    vegaken77.png 77
    vegavega76.png 76
    vegachunli73.png 73
    vegambison76.png 76
    vegabalrog75.png 75
    vegadhalsim83.png 83
    vegablanka78.png 78
    vegaehonda76.png 76
    vegathawk83.png 83
    vegazangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [chunli]
    chunlifeilong77.png 77
    chunlisagat80.png 80
    chunlicammy73.png 73
    chunlideejay78.png 78
    chunliguile78.png 78
    chunliryu77.png 77
    chunliken77.png 77
    chunlivega76.png 76
    chunlichunli73.png 73
    chunlimbison76.png 76
    chunlibalrog75.png 75
    chunlidhalsim83.png 83
    chunliblanka78.png 78
    chunliehonda76.png 76
    chunlithawk83.png 83
    chunlizangief93.png 93
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [mbison]
    mbisonfeilong81.png 81
    mbisonsagat84.png 84
    mbisoncammy77.png 77
    mbisondeejay82.png 82
    mbisonguile82.png 82
    mbisonryu81.png 81
    mbisonken81.png 81
    mbisonvega80.png 80
    mbisonchunli77.png 77
    mbisonmbison80.png 80
    mbisonbalrog79.png 79
    mbisondhalsim87.png 87
    mbisonblanka82.png 82
    mbisonehonda80.png 80
    mbisonthawk87.png 87
    mbisonzangief97.png 97
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [balrog]
    balrogfeilong70.png 70 hp-throw
    balrogfeilong80.png 80 mp-throw
    balrogsagat73.png 73 hp-throw
    balrogsagat83.png 83 mp-throw
    balrogcammy66.png 66 hp-throw
    balrogcammy76.png 76 mp-throw
    balrogdeejay71.png 71 hp-throw
    balrogdeejay81.png 81 mp-throw
    balrogguile71.png 71 hp-throw
    balrogguile81.png 81 mp-throw
    balrogryu70.png 70 hp-throw
    balrogryu80.png 80 mp-throw
    balrogken70.png 70 hp-throw
    balrogken80.png 80 mp-throw
    balrogvega69.png 69 hp-throw
    balrogvega79.png 79 mp-throw
    balrogchunli66.png 66 hp-throw
    balrogchunli76.png 76 mp-throw
    balrogmbison69.png 69 hp-throw
    balrogmbison79.png 79 mp-throw
    balrogbalrog68.png 68 hp-throw
    balrogbalrog78.png 78 mp-throw
    balrogdhalsim76.png 76 hp-throw
    balrogdhalsim86.png 86 mp-throw
    balrogblanka71.png 71 hp-throw
    balrogblanka81.png 81 mp-throw
    balrogehonda69.png 69 hp-throw
    balrogehonda79.png 79 mp-throw
    balrogthawk76.png 76 hp-throw
    balrogthawk86.png 86 mp-throw
    balrogzangief86.png 86 hp-throw
    balrogzangief96.png 96 mp-throw
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [dhalsim]
    dhalsimfeilong93.png 93
    dhalsimsagat96.png 96
    dhalsimcammy89.png 89
    dhalsimdeejay94.png 94
    dhalsimguile94.png 94
    dhalsimryu93.png 93
    dhalsimken93.png 93
    dhalsimvega92.png 92
    dhalsimchunli89.png 89
    dhalsimmbison92.png 92
    dhalsimbalrog91.png 91
    dhalsimdhalsim99.png 99
    dhalsimblanka94.png 94
    dhalsimehonda92.png 92
    dhalsimthawk99.png 99
    dhalsimzangief109.png 109
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [blanka]
    blankafeilong93.png 93
    blankasagat96.png 96
    blankacammy89.png 89
    blankadeejay94.png 94
    blankaguile94.png 94
    blankaryu93.png 93
    blankaken93.png 93
    blankavega92.png 92
    blankachunli89.png 89
    blankambison92.png 92
    blankabalrog91.png 91
    blankadhalsim99.png 99
    blankablanka94.png 94
    blankaehonda92.png 92
    blankathawk99.png 99
    blankazangief109.png 109
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [ehonda]
    ehondafeilong93.png 93
    ehondafeilong98.png 98 oicho
    ehondasagat96.png 96
    ehondasagat101.png 101 oicho
    ehondacammy89.png 89
    ehondacammy94.png 94 oicho
    ehondadeejay94.png 94
    ehondadeejay99.png 99 oicho
    ehondaguile94.png 94
    ehondaguile99.png 99 oicho
    ehondaryu93.png 93
    ehondaryu98.png 98 oicho
    ehondaken93.png 93
    ehondaken98.png 98 oicho
    ehondavega92.png 92
    ehondavega97.png 97 oicho
    ehondachunli89.png 89
    ehondachunli94.png 94 oicho
    ehondambison92.png 92
    ehondambison97.png 97 oicho
    ehondabalrog91.png 91
    ehondabalrog96.png 96 oicho
    ehondadhalsim99.png 99
    ehondadhalsim104.png 104 oicho
    ehondablanka94.png 94
    ehondablanka99.png 99 oicho
    ehondaehonda92.png 92
    ehondaehonda97.png 97 oicho
    ehondathawk99.png 99
    ehondathawk104.png 104 oicho
    ehondazangief109.png 109
    ehondazangief114.png 114 oicho
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [thawk]
    thawkfeilong77.png 77
    thawkfeilong112.png 112 typhoon | super
    thawksagat80.png 80
    thawksagat115.png 115 typhoon | super
    thawkcammy73.png 73
    thawkcammy108.png 108 typhoon | super
    thawkdeejay78.png 78
    thawkdeejay113.png 113 typhoon | super
    thawkguile78.png 78
    thawkguile113.png 113 typhoon | super
    thawkryu77.png 77
    thawkryu112.png 112 typhoon | super
    thawkken77.png 77
    thawkken112.png 112 typhoon | super
    thawkvega76.png 76
    thawkvega111.png 111 typhoon | super
    thawkchunli73.png 73
    thawkchunli108.png 108 typhoon | super
    thawkmbison76.png 76
    thawkmbison111.png 111 typhoon | super
    thawkbalrog75.png 75
    thawkbalrog110.png 110 typhoon | super
    thawkdhalsim83.png 83
    thawkdhalsim118.png 118 typhoon | super
    thawkblanka78.png 78
    thawkblanka113.png 113 typhoon | super
    thawkehonda76.png 76
    thawkehonda111.png 111 typhoon | super
    thawkthawk83.png 83
    thawkthawk118.png 118 typhoon | super
    thawkzangief93.png 93
    thawkzangief128.png 128 typhoon | super
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568

    [zangief]
    zangieffeilong93.png 93 super
    zangieffeilong95.png 95 lk suplex
    zangieffeilong98.png 98 throw | mk suplex
    zangieffeilong112.png 112 hk suplex
    zangieffeilong140.png 140 spd
    zangiefsagat96.png 96 super
    zangiefsagat98.png 98 lk suplex
    zangiefsagat101.png 101 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefsagat115.png 115 hk suplex
    zangiefsagat143.png 143 spd
    zangiefcammy89.png 89 super
    zangiefcammy91.png 91 lk suplex
    zangiefcammy94.png 94 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefcammy108.png 108 hk suplex
    zangiefcammy136.png 136 spd
    zangiefdeejay94.png 94 super
    zangiefdeejay96.png 96 lk suplex
    zangiefdeejay99.png 99 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefdeejay113.png 113 hk suplex
    zangiefdeejay141.png 141 spd
    zangiefguile94.png 94 super
    zangiefguile96.png 96 lk suplex
    zangiefguile99.png 99 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefguile113.png 113 hk suplex
    zangiefguile141.png 141 spd
    zangiefryu93.png 93 super
    zangiefryu95.png 95 lk suplex
    zangiefryu98.png 98 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefryu112.png 112 hk suplex
    zangiefryu140.png 140 spd
    zangiefken93lz.png 93 super
    zangiefken95.png 95 lk suplex
    zangiefken98.png 98 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefken112.png 112 hk suplex
    zangiefken140.png 140 spd
    zangiefvega92.png 92 super
    zangiefvega94.png 94 lk suplex
    zangiefvega97.png 97 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefvega111.png 111 hk suplex
    zangiefvega139.png 139 spd
    zangiefchunli89.png 89 super
    zangiefchunli91.png 91 lk suplex
    zangiefchunli94.png 94 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefchunli108.png 108 hk suplex
    zangiefchunli136.png 136 spd
    zangiefmbison92.png 92 super
    zangiefmbison94.png 94 lk suplex
    zangiefmbison97.png 97 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefmbison111.png 111 hk suplex
    zangiefmbison139.png 139 spd
    zangiefbalrog91.png 91 super
    zangiefbalrog93.png 93 lk suplex
    zangiefbalrog96.png 96 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefbalrog110.png 110 hk suplex
    zangiefbalrog138.png 138 spd
    zangiefdhalsim99.png 99 super
    zangiefdhalsim101.png 101 lk suplex
    zangiefdhalsim104.png 104 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefdhalsim118.png 118 hk suplex
    zangiefdhalsim146.png 146 spd
    zangiefblanka94.png 94 super
    zangiefblanka96.png 96 lk suplex
    zangiefblanka99.png 99 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefblanka113.png 113 hk suplex
    zangiefblanka141.png 141 spd
    zangiefehonda92.png 92 super
    zangiefehonda94.png 94 lk suplex
    zangiefehonda97.png 97 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefehonda111.png 111 hk suplex
    zangiefehonda139.png 139 spd
    zangiefthawk99.png 99 super
    zangiefthawk101.png 101 lk suplex
    zangiefthawk104.png 104 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefthawk118.png 118 hk suplex
    zangiefthawk146.png 146 spd
    zangiefzangief109.png 109 super
    zangiefzangief111h.png 111 lk suplex
    zangiefzangief114.png 114 throw | mk suplex
    zangiefzangief128.png 128 hk suplex
    zangiefzangief156.png 156 spd
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    can't believe i wasted my sunday on that, lol

    Edit: FML, I just noticed that in gief's stage the fucken level is blocking the view. Fuk that I'm not redoing those. At least not now -_-
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • PaskyPasky Ninja with pistol! Joined: Posts: 1,863
    Nice job gaypasi. Should help give people visual cues on throw range in some matches, like if gief's toe is touching fei longs he can be thrown.

    EDIT:

    Sweet, just noticed you actually did do command throws and different version, excellent work!
    <Pasky> so you can go extra fast by just holding it?
    <bookah> turbo handjob
    <baklakiller> sure if had a penis
    <baklakiller> im a beginner gief
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    hahaha look at Hawks 720 range hahaha.
    Why on earth would they have given hawk the same range as his 360 for 720 but not Gief. Sometimes ST makes you think " what in the fuck were they thinking ?"

    hahaha look at the 360 for Gief vs Shotos lol.
    Papasi you're ok in my book. I dont care what people say about you. *whispers* "they say you take it up the ass"
    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • geogeo Official Contrarian Joined: Posts: 1,291
    if gief's toe is touching fei longs he can be thrown.

    Do you think that visual cue is useful in the heat of a match?
    Just one example of ST fundamentalism on dontblowthis.com: "HDR is just another game with no relation to the Street Fighter II series" - riz0ne
  • mrdhalsimmrdhalsim Joined: Posts: 378
    Great work Papasi! It might be worth mentioning here that Boxer's (MP throw only?) looks a little different because the first frame of his headbutt grab has his head forward/back so that animation might make it seem a little different.

    Are you sure Blanka's throw range is better than Dhalsim's? (I'm still not sure I understand the "factor" thing yet, maybe that has something to do with it.)

    Also Ryu vs. Ryu http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/7311/ryuryu77.png looks a little too far, i.e. standing far HP would come out instead of a throw... maybe I don't understand something though.
  • zaspacerzaspacer Joined: Posts: 553
    papasi wrote:
    Edit: FML, I just noticed that in gief's stage the fucken level is blocking the view. Fuk that I'm not redoing those. At least not now -_-

    Doh! :/

    Great job grabbing all of these. I will definitely use them to pinpoint the exact ranges, especially for the nightmare throw range matchups.

    Course you're gonna have to redo the Zangief stage ones to get it complete. :o

    In addition, the next step up from this would be to have the images for each character in the matchup side by side. And from there you'd want to add in the range numbers data for each. After that people can just eyeball each againt each other and get both the range to do the throw as well as the range that they will get thrown.
    Do you think that visual cue is useful in the heat of a match?

    Yes, I do.
    streetfighterdojo.com - video library of top players
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    Are you sure Blanka's throw range is better than Dhalsim's?

    100% positive. even t-akiba's data said so.
    Also Ryu vs. Ryu http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/7311/ryuryu77.png looks a little too far, i.e. standing far HP would come out instead of a throw... maybe I don't understand something though.

    it's not :) see below
    And from there you'd want to add in the range numbers data for each.

    Just updated all the posts with the number (as shown in pasky's HUD at the top).
    If you don't believe what you see, you can verify it yourself :)

    (move just 1 pixel outside of the range I indicated and you won't be able to throw, move 1 pixel closer and you can)
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
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  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    redo all the gief stages yesterday.

    also updated 2nd post with more details
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • zaspacerzaspacer Joined: Posts: 553
    redo all the gief stages yesterday.

    also updated 2nd post with more details

    Good work!

    Here's some variations on how to frame the pics to highlight a matchup:

    dictatorthrowsguile.png

    guilethrowsdictator.png
    streetfighterdojo.com - video library of top players
  • ComedyBlissOptionComedyBlissOption Joined: Posts: 65
    I really dont think you needed to do a giant 16x16 permutation. That's a bit ridiculous! I think just knowing how much farther you can throw certain chars than another is enough.

    I sorted by distance between collision box for ryu from your images:
    gUOV5.png
    I also sorted by distance between ryu's collision box and the opponent's mid or foot blue vulnerable box (whichever was closer):
    kALq7.png
  • mrdhalsimmrdhalsim Joined: Posts: 378
    I really dont think you needed to do a giant 16x16 permutation. That's a bit ridiculous! I think just knowing how much farther you can throw certain chars than another is enough.

    I sorted by distance between collision box for ryu from your images:

    I don't think you need to sort by the distance between collision boxes, but rather the midpoint (midpoint of one char to the midpoint of another). Each char has different widths so doesn't that account for cases like the first in your example (Ryu vs. Honda, how Ryu has to be closer to throw Honda, but Ryu further away to BE thrown by Honda).
  • ComedyBlissOptionComedyBlissOption Joined: Posts: 65
    Sorting by midpoint between collision boxes between characters is not wise because throw length and how far you can be thrown has nothing to do with the midpoints between collision boxes. There are distinct cases where you can easily show the midpoint does not determine throw distance.

    The point on a character that determines where they throw from and also where they can be thrown from is not the midpoint of the collision boxes but is instead set somewhere arbitrarily. All that really matters to someone who plays the game is relatively speaking how much different is this arbitrary distance between characters (especially when you tick throw them off a safe jump setup for certain matchups).

    Here's the list w/ a red line on the character with the closest distance relative to their collision box (gief) and a red line set on cammy's back collision box. This may be easier to see the relative throw distance on characters relative to collision box.

    rBDAN.png
    TbybL.png
  • tedthemechanictedthemechanic Joined: Posts: 2
    Great Job!!!
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    there is now an expanded view of the same tabular data on str website, which is much more accurate than the one on the st wiki

    http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/throw-distance/

    HTH
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • Born2SPDBorn2SPD SPD Fanatic Joined: Posts: 276
    If you're talking about the throw range table on the main ST wiki article, then yeah, it's more accurate than that.
    But both that table and your data is not completelly right.
    As i've already pointed out in a topic somewhere in 2012, Balrog range is not fixed. It depends on the character he is facing.
    Talking about normal throws only, he beats both Honda's and Blanka's throws, but loses to Sim's and Gief's miserably. How's that possible since Honda and Blanka beats Sim's and Gief's throws in range?

    Thats because Rog's throw range is variable. He has a huge throwbox, but against most character the throwbox only comes out when
    rog is close enough, with sim and gief being cases where rog need to be almost at point blank range to the throwbox to come out.

    The original topic: http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/155654/boxers-throw-range#latest

    Data gathered by myself in the wiki: http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Balrog_(ST)#Throws
    I keep reading stuff about ST revival, about bringing this game back to life...
    Its nice to see big tourneys happening and old top players giving this game a chance again...
    But what we really need is new players... And having a strong scene obviously helps...
    But in my opinion what will really bring new players to our community is good tutorials/character guides so they can learn easily and have something to start... So, actually good players, stop being selfish and write stuff about the chars you know! The wiki is lacking so much basic content... Stop being lazy and do something about it.
  • UnessentialUnessential Joined: Posts: 1,168
    Ugh, throw range theory... This always gave me a headache... Characters have different throw ranges but then they shrink/grow depending on who your facing... etc...etc...

    When I saw this thread just now I was hoping it would clear things up... It made things worse... And I can't really tell what those images represent or how to use them. (my gut feeling is the very first post is missing something because just knowing the order isn't enough, because you get some situations, as someone mentioned earlier, where x out throws y who can outthow z, but x does not necessarily outthrow z.
    <quitjockinmystyle> everybody i wil approve what is cheating moves or not.
    STToronto https://www.facebook.com/groups/499056723549379/
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  • Born2SPDBorn2SPD SPD Fanatic Joined: Posts: 276
    Its actually very easy to understand. Just don't think about ranges but range advantages.

    Check the throwboxes images from the wiki (go to the character page, then browse to the throw area)
    The yellow box is the throwbox, and the whitebox is the throwablebox. When yellow box area crosses the white box area, a throw happens (just like the normal hurt/hit boxes).
    What may be confusing is that the throw range matchups are dependent of 2 variables (white & yellow boxes edges) and not only one (the throw range is not a fixed value, like, 20. It depends directly on the boxes geometry, white and yellow). What I mean is, two characters may have throw boxes equal in size (ex: guile and chun li) but their throwable/white boxes may differ. In that example, Chunli's white box is 5 pixels slimmer than guile's, so she has 5pixels of RANGE ADVANTAGE against him, but their throw ranges are the same: they have the same max distance, if counted form the axis, to throw a certain character.

    So what's important in throw matchups is the range advantage/"practical range" of a throw. To get that value, just count the yellow box size from the white box's edge. I already did this for every character, and that data is on the wiki in the "(from the throwable box)" cell.

    About Boxer's throw range, he is the only special case, and the explanation is on that post up here.
    I keep reading stuff about ST revival, about bringing this game back to life...
    Its nice to see big tourneys happening and old top players giving this game a chance again...
    But what we really need is new players... And having a strong scene obviously helps...
    But in my opinion what will really bring new players to our community is good tutorials/character guides so they can learn easily and have something to start... So, actually good players, stop being selfish and write stuff about the chars you know! The wiki is lacking so much basic content... Stop being lazy and do something about it.
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    it is actually very easy to understand

    yellow box - white box = your effective throw advantage as illustrated in this table
    Move                                        Distance advantage compared 
                                                to previous move
                                                (pixels / in game counter)
    --------------------------------            --------------------------------
    Point Blank                                 0
    feilong                                     31
    thawk                                       2
    balrog/hp                                   1
    sagat                                       2
    cammy                                       1
    deejay, guile                               1
    ryu, ken, zangief/super                     1
    vega                                        1
    zangief/lk suplex                           1
    chunli                                      2
    mbison, balrog/mp, zangief/throw|mk suplex  1
    dhalsim                                     5
    blanka                                      5
    ehonda                                      2
    zangief/hk suplex                           2
    ehonda/oicho                                3
    thawk/360|super                             7
    zangief/spd                                 18
    

    except for boxer's oddity, all the images above are correct representation of their max throw distance against each characters
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • SesshomaruSesshomaru Joined: Posts: 577
    is any change between old and new characters ranges? or they stay the same, for example, some old characters jump slighty faster than their ST counterparts, so wondering if it applies to throw ranges as well
  • Born2SPDBorn2SPD SPD Fanatic Joined: Posts: 276
    No, they're the same.
    I keep reading stuff about ST revival, about bringing this game back to life...
    Its nice to see big tourneys happening and old top players giving this game a chance again...
    But what we really need is new players... And having a strong scene obviously helps...
    But in my opinion what will really bring new players to our community is good tutorials/character guides so they can learn easily and have something to start... So, actually good players, stop being selfish and write stuff about the chars you know! The wiki is lacking so much basic content... Stop being lazy and do something about it.
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