Skullgirls SRK wiki project

1457910

Comments

  • worldjem7worldjem7 Seven World Jems Joined: Posts: 544
    How can you be in recovery and startup at the same time?
  • Mr. XMr. X Non Stop ∞ Climax Joined: Posts: 20,239
    How can you be in recovery and startup at the same time?
    If you're talking about Valentine's MP, it has a second part if you hit MP again.
    You did not go back in time, this is how the forums look.
    "You are all just as bad as the people you hate. You're only interested in characters based on tears." - Since1717
    NO STREAM = DEAD GAME
    PSN: X_the_Genius | GGPO: Mr X | Skype: MisterEcks
  • worldjem7worldjem7 Seven World Jems Joined: Posts: 544
    Ah. Shouldn't it be listed as its own move, then? The box for the bars is getting pretty big putting the move and its followup in the same thing. It looks more confusing to have multiple moves and their hitstun/blockstun bars all in one table.
  • DaRabidDuckieDaRabidDuckie Happiest. Duck. Ever. Joined: Posts: 9,870 mod
    Ah. Shouldn't it be listed as its own move, then? The box for the bars is getting pretty big putting the move and its followup in the same thing. It looks more confusing to have multiple moves and their hitstun/blockstun bars all in one table.
    There are a lot of normals in the game that chain off of itself into a second or third hit, especially for Valentine. It's marked pretty clearly in the wiki which moves do that, or at least I haven't had any trouble telling them apart.
    "Being degrading or insulting is not the same as being hype. Huh, I think I just solved the problem with the entire community." -- Mike Z on the FGC

  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    Putting them with the timing bars right next to each other gives a nice way to see if you can MP, MP too slow and drop the chain. It also lets you visually compare the hit stuns and see it's easier to cancel into a slower normal like s.HP from one MP instead of both.

    Like I said, Valentine's s.MP is the most complex normal in the game :O
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    You shouldn't summarize recovery frames and hitstop when calculating hit/block advantage.
    HA = +4 from to +5 - that's not right. Actually, HA = +11 to +12.
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    Hey, Pizza. Do you planing to mark invincible frames on those graphs? you can just apply some hatching on top of existing bars or use another color to avoid overcomplicating.
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    Pizzarino
    Btw, we (I and other guys) are translating info from your wiki into russian: http://www.fighting.ru/wiki/index.php?title=Skullgirls
    For example: http://www.fighting.ru/wiki/index.php?title=Filia#Strategy - Filia's strategy section.
    So, thank you for your work!
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    Хм... Самсон - не кот =3
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    Oh, I didn't noticed. But ok, already removed it from the article.
    I hope, Hidan wouldn't be upset because of this:3
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    Oh, I didn't noticed. But ok, already removed it from the article.
    I hope, Hidan wouldn't be upset because of this:3
    Are you Heven on fighting.ru btw?
    Nice to see you here =] If you have something you want to find on SRK about Skullgirls feel free to ask me - I'm lurking here since september.
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    Yep, it's me.
    If you have something you want to find on SRK about Skullgirls feel free to ask me - I'm lurking here since september.


    Thanks for offer to help, 'cause I have some problems with speaking in English:)
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    You shouldn't summarize recovery frames and hitstop when calculating hit/block advantage.
    HA = +4 from to +5 - that's not right. Actually, HA = +11 to +12.

    wut?

    You hit the button and the attack hits on the first frame. When the dust settles, you're free to act +4 before the defending player. If you hit meaty somehow, you hit on the second and last active frame and got +5. None of this can really be argued or change based on how you define hit stop.

    On hit and block, the game holds the attacking character in their active drawn frame of animation for additional frames of game time. This is hit stop. The attacking player gets extra time to hit confirm or cancel into another attack because of hit stop. It's always included in the hit and block stun for the defending player. The extra frames get added immediately after the active frames for the attacking character. Looking at the ST styled frame chart for Peacock's s.LP, they extend the first drawn frame of animation for recovery (the one with the inactive, orange attack box).

    Yes, I plan on making a better glossary for this stuff when I start putting up more complete frame data. These are just examples that I made to help me organize/template everything out.
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    Pizzarino, there's a point: you and your opponent are frozen during hitstop. That's why you shouldn't summarize hitstop.
    Formula for calculting hit/block advantage:
    hit/block advantage = hit stun - (recovery frames + (active frames - 1))
    For example:
    Peacock's Poke: start up = 6, active = 2, recovery = 14, hitstun = 26. So, hit advantage = 26 - (14 + (2 -1)) = 11.
    For meaty attack, ha = 12.

    Graphic example of advantage: http://userpages.umbc.edu/~esara1/ggac/may-meaty5K.png
    from the article on dustloop: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/content.php?104-Reading-and-Using-Frame-Data-Part-1
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    The move is really 19f of hit stun by that formula. It's +4 on hit.

    Thank you for looking at these examples in such detail. Hit stop is not mentioned in that Dustloop post, and gets ignored in every chart I've seen. I think it's pretty important to define hit stop and list it in Skullgirls, but maybe I'm wrong. Does anyone else care?
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • Mr. XMr. X Non Stop ∞ Climax Joined: Posts: 20,239
    Are you guys talking about hitstun and blockstun?
    You did not go back in time, this is how the forums look.
    "You are all just as bad as the people you hate. You're only interested in characters based on tears." - Since1717
    NO STREAM = DEAD GAME
    PSN: X_the_Genius | GGPO: Mr X | Skype: MisterEcks
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    Are you guys talking about hitstun and blockstun?

    we talked about calculating frame advantage, 'cause there was incorrect numbers.
    The move is really 19f of hit stun by that formula. It's +4 on hit.

    Thank you for looking at these examples in such detail. Hit stop is not mentioned in that Dustloop post, and gets ignored in every chart I've seen. I think it's pretty important to define hit stop and list it in Skullgirls, but maybe I'm wrong. Does anyone else care?
    If you have correct numbers then why not? I would like it.
    Btw, where did you get these numbers for Poke move? Was it an official source?
  • Mr. XMr. X Non Stop ∞ Climax Joined: Posts: 20,239
    Ok since hitstop isn't an alternerative name for hitstun as I first thought, what is hitstop?
    You did not go back in time, this is how the forums look.
    "You are all just as bad as the people you hate. You're only interested in characters based on tears." - Since1717
    NO STREAM = DEAD GAME
    PSN: X_the_Genius | GGPO: Mr X | Skype: MisterEcks
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    If you have correct numbers then why not? I would like it.
    Btw, where did you get these numbers for Poke move? Was it an official source?
    He have build actually. AFAIK he is just counting them. Hitboxes can be turned on in-game btw.
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • Firekid2468Firekid2468 Keep the Flag Flying Joined: Posts: 922
    Ok since hitstop isn't an alternerative name for hitstun as I first thought, what is hitstop?

    Ever play Brawl and get hit by Captain Falcon's knee? That's hit stop. That brief pause before you go flying.
    BB: Makoto, Noel
    MvC3: X-23/Wesker/Strider
    SG: Filia/Squigly/M. Fortune
    RTSD all day, erry day.
  • 4r54r5 FIGHTAN VIDYA GAEMS Joined: Posts: 2,579
    When an attack makes contact, hit or block, the players get frozen in animation for a moment. That is hitstop. (Or hitfreeze, hitpause, etc) This is commonly used to make moves appear to hit HARD. You can see this a lot with Painwheel's attacks. For most games, it's something like sub 5 frames, most people don't realize it's there.

    I can really only talk about how hitstop works in GG, so I will. You don't hear much about hitstop because it mostly doesn't matter. Hitstop occurs between the attacking entity and the defending entity. For most situations this would be one character and another character, both characters get frozen for the same amount of time, and so the hitstop doesn't matter. In cases where the attacking entity is a projectile and the defender is character, that's when it matters. The projectile and the blocking/getting-hit character will experience hitstop, but the third party (the guy how launched the projectile) won't. That's when hitstop matters. Ky's combos work because his projectiles inflict hitstop.

    I think in ST, hitstop always applies over the entire game. Making knowing hitstop pretty irrelevant.

    If Skullgirls' hitstop works like in GG, then hitstop would matter alot, with all these assists and projectiles being lobbed all over the place.
    Location: Maryland
    PSN: fourer5 // XBL: fourerfive
    www.youtube.com/user/fourerfive
  • freeAMfreeAM Joined: Posts: 39
    He have build actually. AFAIK he is just counting them. Hitboxes can be turned on in-game btw.
    I see. That's cool:)
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    I have a pre-alpha build. Don't get too excited!

    Hit stop is important in Skullgirls because of the wide rage of hit stops you can find. A simple jab has 7f, more than what's standard in other games. Certain other moves (I'm looking at you, Painwheel) have massive hit stop to make them look and feel different from "softer" attacks.

    What about unblockable protection? I'm finding that it's a move property, assigned by a number, with some attacks having more of it than others. How does that apply through hit stop?

    Right now it's looking like I want to have frame data as a simple table, showing a minimum amount of information similar to the SF4 guide. I really want to make the frame data bar graphs work, but there's no way to make a good template for them without installing new functions to the wiki from an admin level.

    I guess I should start PMing people...
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • deice-deice- kimchi yokatta darou Joined: Posts: 596
    Making solid basic information first and building up from that is a good thing. It took ages to get solid basic frame data for SF games, if we get even that during the first year it'll be amazing (though admittedly slightly easier with the smaller cast).
    SSF4: Juri BBCSEX: Λ-11 AH3: Nazuna MBAACC: F-Hime SG: Valentine/Squigly/Parasoul
    本番はこれからだったのに, もう限界? - honban wa korekara datta no ni, mou genkai?
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    Hmmm... Hey, Pizza, what about this "blockbuster" stuff?
    6905611680_b193590671_c.jpg
    Do you planning to use this term in the wiki?
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    Yes. Much like "outtake" for "snap out", "blockbuster" and "ensemble" are the Skullgirls official names for "super move" and "assist".

    That's actually a really good, easy thing I can update right now...
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • JakeWasHereJakeWasHere FGC N3wb Joined: Posts: 296
    Yes. Much like "outtake" for "snap out", "blockbuster" and "ensemble" are the Skullgirls official names for "super move" and "assist".

    That's actually a really good, easy thing I can update right now...

    If it's not too presumptuous of me, I advise you to strive for clarity. I know there are Japanese users reading the wiki -- I saw them discussing it on the 2ch Skullgirls thread a little earlier and they were trying to figure out what the hell all the terminology meant.
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    If it's not too presumptuous of me, I advise you to strive for clarity. I know there are Japanese users reading the wiki -- I saw them discussing it on the 2ch Skullgirls thread a little earlier and they were trying to figure out what the hell all the terminology meant.

    They came up with awesome stuff like "throw reject miss" and "flying screen deterioration". I think they can hang.

    Official game lingo update from Ravidrath. These are all used in the tutorials/training mode:

    Super = Blockbuster

    DHC = Blockbuster Sequel (recently changed from Co-Star Combo!)

    Super Meter = Dramatic Tension

    Assist = Ensemble

    Snap Out = Outtake
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    They came up with awesome stuff like "throw reject miss" and "flying screen deterioration". I think they can hang.

    Official game lingo update from Ravidrath. These are all used in the tutorials/training mode:

    Super = Blockbuster

    DHC = Blockbuster Sequel (recently changed from Co-Star Combo!)

    Super Meter = Dramatic Tension

    Assist = Ensemble

    Snap Out = Outtake
    So sequels are legit after all? I thought Ravi was trolling =]
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    So sequels are legit after all? I thought Ravi was trolling =]

    They are. I find/replaced all of that stuff so say something if I missed one.

    I've also added an in a nutshell for Painwheel and assist choices for Double.

    2 days before lab time changes everything...
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    Thread falling off the first page? Shame on me.

    I'm starting to get frame data together in a simple format. The pretty bar graphs are a nice concept, but they aren't even close to practical without getting a comprehensive template for them. That can't happen without adding functions to the SRK wiki and a lot more work. I think I'll do simple first then try to re-invent the wheel second...

    http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Skullgirls/Valentine#Frame_Data

    Valentine has frame data for all of her normals now. Check it out and give me delicious feedback.
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • worldjem7worldjem7 Seven World Jems Joined: Posts: 544
    I have to ask, is this true startup or "time-to-hit"?
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    I have to ask, is this true startup or "time-to-hit"?

    True start up. It's how the game is actually scripted @_@
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • worldjem7worldjem7 Seven World Jems Joined: Posts: 544
  • not so saintnot so saint The reports of my death are GREATLY exaggerated. Joined: Posts: 1,948
    True start up. It's how the game is actually scripted @_@
    Mike_Z is using COMMON SENSE!
    It's super effective!
    It will be done as it was foretold for we are servants of the Skully Ones and we will consume tuna with bacon and we will party for days and nights without rest and we no need other fate despite this one! For we are what we are and we will kneel before no one >=[
    "Russian science rise again!"
  • Mr. XMr. X Non Stop ∞ Climax Joined: Posts: 20,239

    "Combo Stage" in the info box is useful for all this, btw.
    1 = (optional) jump-in section (free)
    2 = ground series (free)
    3 = first air combo or 2nd ground series (watched)
    4 = special case if they land before you do (watched)
    5 = limited (watched, and if you start a chain with something you hit with at all during a watched section = infinite)

    In your example cr.HP = stage 2, j.LK->MK->HK = stage 3, ground chain to cr.HP = stage 4, j.LK = stage 5 and a repeat of the j.LK you used in stage 3.
    There's at least one reported bug of a move triggering stage 5 early, but this isn't it. :^)
    You did not go back in time, this is how the forums look.
    "You are all just as bad as the people you hate. You're only interested in characters based on tears." - Since1717
    NO STREAM = DEAD GAME
    PSN: X_the_Genius | GGPO: Mr X | Skype: MisterEcks
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    Added frame data for Filia normals. Valentine has been revised.

    http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Skullgirls/Filia#Frame_Data

    Also updated the combo fanfare list and many of the DLC characters. Hive and Aeon are new!
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • c_nulc_nul C'est cool Joined: Posts: 540
    My feedback

    http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Skullgirls/Valentine
    Information are great but the template is not. Frame data at the end after strategy is not goo imo.

    I really prefer like this http://wiki.shoryuken.com/User:Vito_Mazzarino (3rd example with stand lp)
    Having notes with frame data in the same place is better that scrolling to search information. Also you should add hitstop in blue instead of adding it to the recovery.
    You should add Launch properties in frame data too like you add sweep, wall bounce, etc

    One picture (at least) of each moves can help a lot to learn this game
    Hitbox pictures (with startup+active+recovery) should be an option. You click to see them for advanced player
    "LastPass is a password manager that makes web browsing easier and more secure"
    http://lastpass.com/
  • PizzarinoPizzarino Pikachu gave his life for science Joined: Posts: 420
    I made some nice revisions the unblockable/infinite protection sections. Thanks, Desk!

    http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Skullgirls/Game_Systems
    SRK Skullgirls Wiki: Do it for the children
  • Mr. XMr. X Non Stop ∞ Climax Joined: Posts: 20,239
    There's no left/right unblockables, you always block towards the point character.
    You did not go back in time, this is how the forums look.
    "You are all just as bad as the people you hate. You're only interested in characters based on tears." - Since1717
    NO STREAM = DEAD GAME
    PSN: X_the_Genius | GGPO: Mr X | Skype: MisterEcks
Sign In or Register to comment.