The Breaker's Revenge Thread

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  • JLW2490JLW2490 Fighting Game Recorder Joined: Posts: 43
    Saizo Gameplay.
    <JLW> щ(ಠ益ಠщ)
    <Azmodan> カオス♪chaos☆
    <Azmodan> JLW so cute AA
    <setsura> nooooooooooo!wwwww
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited December 2013
    Dao v Saizo

    Some things you can try next time for this match up:
    - Kick super goes over lows and at certain distances it can hop Saizo grenade. You'll have to go all-in with a read most likely though because grenade has really good recovery and there's a chance he'll recover first...But this match up isn't really about playing smart anyway XD

    - Saizo circle sword move (any version) can be punished with kick super on block. If you have the charge and manage to block one, let it rip ASAP. This will take away at least ONE of his tools and give you a fighting chance.

    - If you ever down Saizo, especially with a hard down from a super, you GET IN THAT ASS. Close the gap ASAP and watch out for reversal LP Hair into Super. That being said, Saizo's reversals are BAD without the meter to back him for making LP Hair viable as a reversal. If he has no meter and he's down, FREE JUMP INS. **One thing to note though, is that some players are reckless with LP Hair>Super and will attempt to go into super even on BLOCK. If you guard LP Hair and he has meter, best way to punish is to LK FLASH KICK. It will punish regardless of the player choosing to late cancel into super or not.**

    - If you manage to get a BIG life lead on Saizo and he somehow gets too much breathing room in the round, try to slow down the pace of the match and make him come to you. Simply jump over his projectiles when you see the "throwing" animation. Both Kunai and Grenade projectiles can be jumped on reaction AND he CANNOT alter speeds of these projectiles so you dont have to worry about landing on one randomly. When Saizo tries to close the gap this is when you can change gears and go back to offense. Closing the gap in this match is key so you can let Saizo hang himself in this sort of situation. Only drawback here would be the timer damage mod if too much time has elapsed since the last hit was exchanged.

    After watching through this set I'm starting to think the match may not be HORRIBLY BAD and there may be SOME hope for Dao...I'm probably wrong though lol

    P.S. Can't emphasize this enough but...

    LET SAIZO KNOW YOU WERE IN THERE!
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    ...and if your saizo dont be afraid to challange a jump in with close hk, let whomever is trying to get IN THERE, know you already there tho -_-
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited December 2013
    Those were actually OS throw attempts lol. Throw using HP+HK will produce HK if the opponent is out of throw range. Really strong with Saizo, Tia, and Rila due to how their close HK's work XD.

    There are some other funky OS throw button combinations in the game too. Still tinkering around to find what works best though.

    @jedpossum
    Any idea on how to hide/disable the "macro recording/playing" text in fba-rr? Trying to put together a vid and may need to do some macro shenanigans with a "clean" display.
    Post edited by Zee Tee Bee on
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    ztb, i was not referring to anything you posted...i play saizo and im saying that close hk is an AA option even when it trade...
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • jedpossumjedpossum Ok, Darling Joined: Posts: 4,227
    edited December 2013
    Those were actually OS throw attempts lol. Throw using HP+HK will produce HK if the opponent is out of throw range. Really strong with Saizo, Tia, and Rila due to how their close HK's work XD.

    There are some other funky OS throw button combinations in the game too. Still tinkering around to find what works best though.

    @jedpossum
    Any idea on how to hide/disable the "macro recording/playing" text in fba-rr? Trying to put together a vid and may need to do some macro shenanigans with a "clean" display.

    Hmm I din't get a notification from this but srk bugs aside.

    In Macro.Lua (Just open it in notepad)
    emu.message(pmesg .. (playing and recording and "   " or "") .. rmesg)
    

    Just comment out this line with -- before emu.

    I occasionally stream so you can see how boring poking around in the memory is. www.hitbox.tv/jedpossum

    [8/6/2014 8:19:53 PM] Pasky: jedpossum, hacker of the obscure fighting games

  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited December 2013
    jedpossum wrote: »
    In Macro.Lua (Just open it in notepad)
    emu.message(pmesg .. (playing and recording and "   " or "") .. rmesg)
    

    Just comment out this line with -- before emu.
    You goddamn scientist, you, thanks! Although I always get scared when you post up random codes because this scripting thing is still new to me and usually takes me some time to figure things out. One I overlooked and forgot to mention was that there's also an input display at the bottom to show commands. Any way to remove that as well?

    Finally (but not really), could you hook me up with this new pseudo-training mode build you have? Seems you have some of the damage issues fixed (the stun damage in the earlier build you designed was buggy as well and I'm wondering about this too).
    jedpossum wrote: »

    Quick look there is a testing background perfect for the job. I just need to get rid of the hud.

    Edit too lazy to make obs record mame fully

    And lastly (see?), is there a way to remove the HUD AND backgrounds. Need an all-black background with just characters for possible edit shenanigans.

    ztb, i was not referring to anything you posted...i play saizo and im saying that close hk is an AA option even when it trade...
    Oops.
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • jedpossumjedpossum Ok, Darling Joined: Posts: 4,227
    edited December 2013
    jedpossum wrote: »
    In Macro.Lua (Just open it in notepad)
    emu.message(pmesg .. (playing and recording and "   " or "") .. rmesg)
    

    Just comment out this line with -- before emu.
    You goddamn scientist, you, thanks! Although I always get scared when you post up random codes because this scripting thing is still new to me and usually takes me some time to figure things out. One I overlooked and forgot to mention was that there's also an input display at the bottom to show commands. Any way to remove that as well?

    Finally (but not really), could you hook me up with this new pseudo-training mode build you have? Seems you have some of the damage issues fixed (the stun damage in the earlier build you designed was buggy as well and I'm wondering about this too).
    jedpossum wrote: »

    Quick look there is a testing background perfect for the job. I just need to get rid of the hud.

    Edit too lazy to make obs record mame fully

    And lastly (see?), is there a way to remove the HUD AND backgrounds. Need an all-black background with just characters for possible edit shenanigans.

    Only thing that was updated on the script was bai hu on character select and very primarily boxes. I haven't found any thing on the hud yet.

    I occasionally stream so you can see how boring poking around in the memory is. www.hitbox.tv/jedpossum

    [8/6/2014 8:19:53 PM] Pasky: jedpossum, hacker of the obscure fighting games

  • JLW2490JLW2490 Fighting Game Recorder Joined: Posts: 43
    edited December 2013
    Maherl Mirrors
    First Part

    Second Part

    A unique piece of work this was.

    To be honest I was just copy 'n' pasting what Zar was doing but...seems the A and B versions of the
    sword slash are safe when used from max range. The few punishes you may have noticed were either
    from them being used from the wrong range or using the wrong version *C or D* There were a couple
    of moments were I tried to max punish with Jump C, Crouch C, Sword Super...but failed miserably.

    That is it for now. Will update with more games later.
    Post edited by JLW2490 on
    <JLW> щ(ಠ益ಠщ)
    <Azmodan> カオス♪chaos☆
    <Azmodan> JLW so cute AA
    <setsura> nooooooooooo!wwwww
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited December 2013
    JLW2490 wrote: »
    Maherl Mirrors

    seems the A and B versions of the sword slash are safe when used from max range. The few punishes you may have noticed were either
    from them being used from the wrong range or using the wrong version *C or D*
    Using frame advance on FBA-RR, looks like A Sword (-5F), B Sword (-7F), C Sword (-10F), D Sword (-13F)
    wrote:
    To be honest I was just copy 'n' pasting what Zar was doing
    Fair game cus...I've taken some of your Dao tech before and was copy/pasting your Maherl strings later on in this set. He got some nasty frame trapssss.

    Still trying to figure out how the Breaker System works in this silly game. Seems there's a 5Frame buffer window for a Breaker and I think it removes 1F of hit/block stun (have this feeling my numbers are way off). If I'm not lazy, I'll look more into this madness.
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited December 2013


    Got BODIED for xmas :( (Thumbnail says it all)

    **Only first match has sound muted, after is unmuted but low volume. Kind of rushed into battle and didn't have time to setup recording software properly. Rarely get to play this guy and didn't want to miss the opportunity to get in a quick set due to delay on (secretly) recording.

    (I think Tia is secretly best character in the game :p)
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • CaptainGinyuCaptainGinyu Choppin Bricks Like Karate Joined: Posts: 1,978


    Got BODIED for xmas :( (Thumbnail says it all)

    **Only first match has sound muted, after is unmuted but low volume. Kind of rushed into battle and didn't have time to setup recording software properly. Rarely get to play this guy and didn't want to miss the opportunity to get in a quick set due to delay on (secretly) recording.

    (I think Tia is secretly best character in the game :p)

    Great sets! Why do you think Tia is the best? As a Dao-Long player, I find her to be much more annoying than Sho.
    “When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace.”-Jimi Hendrix
    Take the Raw Vegan challenge! Lol nah fam, I don't even do this shit anymore.

    SFV: Zangief Sub: Juri
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    KOF XI: Terry/Oswald/Gato | KOF 14: Terry/NAK/KOD, Terry/Yamazaki/KOD

    PSN: CaptDeepThot


  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited April 2014
    Why do you think Tia is the best? As a Dao-Long player, I find her to be much more annoying than Sho.
    The character's roster of options is immense!

    --FOUR different anti-airs to cover various distances AND she can tack on more damage and force a hard/untechable down with super juggle followups for most of them.
    • Crouch HP anti-air gets huge damage when canceled into Cutlass Flasher super.
    • Close Standing LP not only blows up jumping crossup strings but you can tack on some fair damage with - yup - the hard down again (stLP anti-air > juggle with immediate jump neutral LK > air HK Soul Spike [qcb+k] > land then Rapid Charge super)
    • Tip-hit LP dp and far HK give her super juggle option
    • Can convert to super damage (Rapid Charge) from air-to-air jHP or jHK (or anything for that matter)

    --Has combos from lows (crLK) which lead to knockdown and excellent damage without meter usage and builds a good sum of meter in the process. (pretty standard for top tier but great nonetheless)

    --Can add extra damage to combos AND get better corner positioning using supers (Burning Revolver enders carry over 3/4 STAGE)

    --Rivals Sho's ground mobility using Dash Buffering LP's. (I need to make a vid of this or something because it's kind of nuts how fast she can cover ground with it).
    • Her fireballs aren't full screen but they slow down a lot near dissipation. This allows her to close ground when coupled with the Dash Buffering tech or just dash attacking in general.
    • Can lock down opponents with dash LP pressure due to her LPs having VERY LITTLE recovery. (I tried this with other characters [sho,saizo] and it wasn't nearly as seamless nor effective)
    • Dashing normals like stHP (to LK Soul Spike) or dash stHK to fish for jump outs and jumping in neutral is crazy-strong too. Can, of course, convert to supers in these situations as well when AA hits.

    --Has THREE anti-projectile options that blow up predictable strings and allow her to control the midscreen area well
    • Rapid Charge is low-profile and slips under A LOT of dumb stuff (lol). It's speed also allows for punishers in situations where NO OTHER CHARACTER IN THE GAME has the option to do so. The range on this super also lets her anti-air from halfscreen (lol) due to this silly game having no trip-guard (it will trade against some jump-ins though)
    • HK Soul Spike (qcb+k) makes no sense. The move has invulnerability up until around where she hits the apex. Coupled with the speed she can slip THROUGH fireballs with ease (I've passed through Sho's Air super fb many times). The move can also be DOUBLE KARA CANCELED to travel a full length of the screen (dash HP > Kara LP+HP > Kara qcb+HK). Oh yeah, the move leaves her in airborne state from startup until she lands so it blows up lows too. (She can technically anti-air with this too but the timing/spacing has to be on point). Also good that the move ends in BACK so if you mistime you get guard :p
    • Cutlass Flasher has a TON of invuln and can be used to wreck fireball strings and BEST OF ALL, Sho's Hop-kick into Air super fb frametrap (block hopkick > turn around stHP > MASH out super [empty cancels HP if super, combos if no super])

    --Mirage Spear Kick (mash k) combos do absurd stun damage. Stuns in TWO combos vs half the cast in Round 1 (4 combos and a baby tap in Round 2 or after first stun).
    • Safe on block EXCEPT against certain characters (Saizo, Sho, Tia. Sho/Tia need meter though)

    --Air Soul Spike shenanigans add to her mobility, pressure strings, and gives her some sexy escape options
    • TK up-forward HK Slice lets her escape corners and (sho) fireball wakeup game
    • Can cancel from jLP, jHP, jLK into air Slice. This move has to be guarded HIGH when airborne so she gets to set up high/low mixup from jump-ins. E.g. jHP > Air Slice (can land and link after) OR jHP > land > crLK into combo ender
    • More super conversion options if air-to-air jump attack to air Slice lands.

    --Fast and lengthy backstep. Not as good as Sho's and Saizo's as their backsteps leave them airborne and have short duration (with high invuln frames) and landing recovery to boot. Still good for spacing and escaping when midscreen.

    --Fuzzy guard setup with ascending jHP to Air Burning Revolver.
    • Strong only in corner or from guarded crossup though. Tough to execute (for me at least) but if you get it down, your opponent is going to be spending a lot of time at the craps table.

    --Best fashion sense
    • Belly-cut denim jacket, leotard, stockings, puffy socks, and converse!
    • Can't mess with that
    • Don't dress in the dark


    Overall, I think she's the best...ON PAPER. Her ability to confirm into easy damage and convert damn-near anything into supers is unbelievable. Sick speed and mobility, average projectile (at least she has one), anti-projectile options, strong punishers for a WIDE range of situations, strong pressure, random-hits-to-easy-damage conversions, versatile mixup/wakeup game, and good, consistent damage round Tia out very well. She also has answers for a lot of dumb shit you'll see in this game.

    Unfortunately though, you need the Hands of God to execute with her consistently. She's highly technical and presses A LOT of buttons. Once getting the hang of that though, I feel she has the potential to just swam opponents or be anywhere on the screen at any time.

    Edit:
    Major weaknesses would probably be not having full-screen fireball and her DP's not being consistent as reversal/anti-air
    Post edited by Zee Tee Bee on
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited December 2013
    More matches. Can't stand this video quality though. If anyone is familiar with OBS and can throw some tips my way to make this not look ugly, hit me up please. I'll post up my specs if necessary.



    Edit:
    Didn't want to triple post. Had a 5-man rotation going on in the GGPO Breakers room yesterday and streamed it.


    More Edits:

    New FT10 set.
    Post edited by Zee Tee Bee on
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • PrinceMurphyPrinceMurphy Joined: Posts: 322
    Play this game yesterdayfor the first time since I've actually learned how to play fighting games at a decent level. I'm in love! I'm definately gonna try to learn this on a high level. Fuck the popular games.
  • PrinceMurphyPrinceMurphy Joined: Posts: 322
    5 man session from the other night. All of us have only been playing a few days.
  • Running WildRunning Wild Rock You Like A Hurricane Joined: Posts: 3,183
    I miss this game. :(
    YouTube Channel - All sorts of random vidya's of fighting games and shit.
    Stream - Watch me bad in various classic fighting games.
    RB2: Xiangfei, Cheng, Mary, Geese
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    if karnov was the father of 3s, this is the father of sf4
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • kenurankenuran Kerberotte Joined: Posts: 2,068
    if karnov was the father of 3s, this is the father of sf4

    Nah that would be Street Fighter EX.

    I am The God of Might.

    Teaching yourself Kanji is quite the bitch...
  • NorieagaNorieaga FADC x ROFLCOPTER Joined: Posts: 4,223
    I felt right at home when I first played this game given that its just like ST. I DO wish it had more characters, however, that would've been great. Just for the sake of variety.
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    kenuran wrote: »
    if karnov was the father of 3s, this is the father of sf4

    Nah that would be Street Fighter EX.
    might as well say pokemon... smh

    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,984
    Seem varid enough for me. You have your rushdown, turtle, oki, punishment, zoner, grappler.

    Also how does one do those color edit cheats?. Love to give peile some decent pallets.
    Seikuken Disciple
    "That Phantom Breaker Guy"
  • jedpossumjedpossum Ok, Darling Joined: Posts: 4,227
    I assume it's that mame cheat I wrote awhile back.
    Extract the breakrev.xml
    Copy and paste the cheat into the xml
    reinsert the file back into the cheat archieve

    I occasionally stream so you can see how boring poking around in the memory is. www.hitbox.tv/jedpossum

    [8/6/2014 8:19:53 PM] Pasky: jedpossum, hacker of the obscure fighting games

  • NorieagaNorieaga FADC x ROFLCOPTER Joined: Posts: 4,223
    @keo-bas‌

    The play-style variety is there, I just mean more character variety. I always like a fighting game to have at least 15-20 characters. Still, Breaker's is amazing.
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited April 2014
    http://shoryuken.com/2014/04/01/balloono-breaking-apart-breakers-revenge-with-lord-bbh-and-zandkun/

    Dudes didn't even reference this thread. I chuckled on the inside.

    Also, Breakers is just a bastardized SFA1. It fathered no games because in the end it was just SF clone #378 (which was brutally apparent in the character representations). And people commenting about lack of character variety in Breakers should up their dosage of ADHD medication. Sit down with the game for more than 5 minutes and the quality of the cast will reveal itself. Keo-bas pretty much nailed it when he listed those archetypes in an earlier post. Dudes need to learn to appreciate the true poverty experience and squeeze every byte of data for what it's worth. (The way things are going now, that's probably asking for way too much though).

    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited April 2014
    No idea why this is happening but....it's happening lol

    4/6/2014 12pm EST
    83uii26.jpg

    http://fr.twitch.tv/miles_the_one
    ok, so there's actually a French BR tourney happening RIGHT NOW! Time for everyone to harass SRK staff to get them to front page it or something.
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    i question the validity of that article, and would still say that brazil has the best players (not many by any means)
    but cmon, nothing worth note on youtube match wise? =/
    telling people to watch japan replays (who are notorious for using combos that can be breakered by small children in tourney play)
    =/
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    telling people to watch japan replays
    Wait...did it really say that? They're...pretty bad at Breakers lol. Hell, I haven't seen too many impressive match videos on yt in general. Also, where are these Brasilians you often speak so highly of? On GGPO/Supercade most of them are hacks - so-so players at best. Was this during a different era or something?
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Yeah a few years back there were 2-3 players. Only one teally really good one id say. All the other brazilians were on his piece and constantly ref him when th
    ey would lose. Seiryu...although people would sometimes use that name and wernt on the same level.
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,984
    expected more but oh well. Teir r breakdonw was pretty poor.I think sho is good is because he can be playwed with minimal crazy high priority.
    Seikuken Disciple
    "That Phantom Breaker Guy"
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    i just expect more insight from zand, bbh i have never known to be a breakers player and i was actually shocked that he played MOV for money in it 2 years ago, not shocked that he won tho (japan sucks ^_^)
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited April 2014
    Yeah a few years back there were 2-3 players. Only one teally really good one id say. All the other brazilians were on his piece and constantly ref him when th
    ey would lose. Seiryu...although people would sometimes use that name and wernt on the same level.
    Ah, guess I was too little, too late. Didn't really dive into Breakers until around last April. Only exceptionally strong players I've come across since then are Vector (aka Ramp) (Sho), and Anex (Sho). There are a few players I feel are on my level/respectable or are close but overall I feel we could all be doing a much better job representing high-level play for this game. Problem is, seems that many of the online (and offline) players are content w/ just derping around with it and keeping Breakers as a sort of novelty fighter rather than pick it apart and exploring new aspects of gameplay. Hell, the crap I discovered w/ Tia in a 2-month time span is enough for me to reconsider how tiers as a whole are evaluated by the Breakers "community". Anyhow...



    Can you confirm if this is the "real" Seiryu?

    keo-bas wrote: »
    Teir r breakdonw was pretty poor.I think sho is good is because he can be playwed with minimal crazy high priority.
    This character...has some seriously retarded (secret) tech that people aren't running. Don't know what I'd do if I came across a truly committed Sho user (uuughhh).

    (japan sucks ^_^)
    Real Talk. Sad how the most viewed vs match for Breakers R on yt is the "Daigo vs MOV" match (which may or may not be bullshit but whatever). Either way, the vid is a terrible exhibition of Breakers gameplay.

    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • Lord BBHLord BBH EASY EASY~ Joined: Posts: 1,137 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    keo-bas wrote: »
    expected more but oh well. Teir r breakdonw was pretty poor.I think sho is good is because he can be playwed with minimal crazy high priority.

    Care to elaborate on the real tier list, then?

    Sorry that I drew a blank on notable names/youtube videos. There were a lot of questions and I honestly couldn't think of much at the time because I couldn't remember the last time I specifically watched match videos, and I gave up on actually being able to enjoy anything on GGPO years ago. I also specifically said that the majority of Japanese vids on youtube were not of the highest quality, so don't get mad at me for that.

    Yes I probably should have made mention of this thread because there's a lot of useful information in it. That one's entirely my fault since I never post or even log in here anymore.

    If anyone else thinks I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about, let's get some games in at EVO.
    DON'T JUMP AT MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    edited April 2014
    Lord BBH wrote: »
    If anyone else thinks I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about, let's get some games in at EVO.
    "...Saizo kinda suffers because he doesn’t have enough invincibility on his [breaker] — if he had a special move with full invincibility I think it would then be debatable whether he or Sho were better." - Matt Hall/BBH

    *ahem*

    *waves hand like an eager preschooler who knows the answer*

    ...I don't think you know what you're talking about, Mr. Hallllll :D. Saizo's qcb+LP has a considerable amount of invincibility - enough to pass through projectiles, dp's, and supers. Why he has this (goddamn) option is beyond me but it's there. (Also, backstep breaker seems to be a highly overlooked option among players).

    ...And I'm too poor for evo so...come see me in NYC? lol

    INCOMING CONTROVERSIAL TIER LIST

    A Biscuit's Breaker's Revenge "Tier List"

    Was coincidentally working on this just before seeing the new posts and also curious to see where Bai-Hu stands in this mess of a game.

    I also have a few option selects in mind that I'd like to test if I ever get my hands on a pad/stick again. I think they could dramatically change the outcome of some of the horrible matchups/situations in the game. Breakers Revenge is, in my opinion, far from being figured out and the tier list I composed will likely see many revisions. Hopefully others will be persuaded to view the game in a different light as well. Gotta GO IN first though.

    POPOFF EDIT:
    Found some of Zand's old matches...
    ...I woulda BODIED this dude lol. But seriously though, this is what Breaker's Revenge matches are supposed to look like (minus a few combo optimization issues *cough*)







    Wet Dream Edit:
    I want to wake up every morning to this...
    Post edited by Zee Tee Bee on
    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    i think anyone who considers condor in the top tier is a fucking idiot.......does that qualify us playing at evo bbh =D?
    jk but on a serious note:
    ztb: i can not confirm if that is him or not, solid saizo stuff but iv seen a lot of that from other saizo players. the times iv played him (4-5 long sets at various times through out the year) he used dao and have very strong understanding of priority traps and spacing to a point where he would almost make dao look top(obv hes not the top 3 at all)
    i agree with people not using a lot of stuff that isnt the most cookiecutter shit with sho or saizo or even fuckin mahlr so i could imagine theres a lot of untapped stuff. i still never see people use saizos boxer float RH or AA people with the close verson of the RH into frog/fire etc etc. shit few people even use the slide cancel right.

    bbh: people are happy that yall talked about the game but i think there are so few chances for the convo that people that play feel like it was very hmmm vague, idk i guess there so few opportunities to get it into any kind of spot light and so much to say. and zand should have (not that he can control the questions asked of him) talk more about the game itself less about how did i start etc etc what do u think about....again not his fault. =} see u on those mean vegas streets
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,984
    Sorry for my grammer. But honestly their only three things that make sho better than other characters.

    1. jb. This move has insane priority, constant hit box, and it super cancle. sho player can throw this out with little repercussion as his hit box his coverup.

    2. air fire ball super. This move is really fast does respectable damage and it’s practically safe in most cases.

    3. meter building of a lot of things. Personally i think breakers revenge is heavy base around meter management. Which sho can do easily since eh builds a lot of meter off his gameplan.

    Sho is no slouch in other department but he doesn’t particularly excel at them and have their flaws.

    Saizo has decent stuff and crazy good stun potential but he he does lose to oki due to not so great reversal and have huge hit box to allow unique meaty scenarios.

    Tia is solid but over hype due to her pressure. Thing is on paper she seems exceptional but when you come technical with her than she underwhelming. Her fire ball its really good on block but not on hit. Basically its very easy breaker a lot of her stuff and unless use meter to secure her combos, she risk being breaker during her stuff.

    Dao I think is secret top tier as play risk free with his dash ability and and hit confirm very well. His pokes also keep people in check to. Only thing keeping him from top teir is that he build meter slowly and its essential.

    Condor, pretty much typical grappler with few tricks to be different but like any grappler he does struggle with character who can keep him out. Fortunately all his tools allow him to get In and stay in if he make a good read.

    Rila,a tank. She has priority and damage potential to be respected. But just like condor, she struggle with character who can keep her out but on top o that her defensive option are also underwhelming. But she ironically keeps some of the upper character in check, (namly dao)

    Allision, not sure why everyone put him at bottom, he has some stuff going for him even though requires a lot of commitment. He’s of the few character who can deal with zoning on multiple levels, priority to challenge some of the higher characters, problem is that he his is so slow that he can’t do much reaction base, he’ll have to read or worst guess and hope for the best.

    Maherl is kind of like weaker version of rila but he does have easy time hit confirming and combing his super, how ever rila movement option is better and she has meter less reversal, while maherl doesn't really have reversals.

    Pielle is not helpless but he not doing anything either. He wants his opponent to do stuff so he can surprise him with his punishing potential. Pielle has a lot of tricks to work with but people who can zone him better put peille in his place. Ironically sho is not peille worst match up but Dao just demolished peille game play all together. Sho at least have to close in which peille can deal with.
    Seikuken Disciple
    "That Phantom Breaker Guy"
  • Lord BBHLord BBH EASY EASY~ Joined: Posts: 1,137 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Lord BBH wrote: »
    If anyone else thinks I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about, let's get some games in at EVO.
    "...Saizo kinda suffers because he doesn’t have enough invincibility on his [breaker] — if he had a special move with full invincibility I think it would then be debatable whether he or Sho were better." - Matt Hall/BBH

    *ahem*

    *waves hand like an eager preschooler who knows the answer*

    ...I don't think you know what you're talking about, Mr. Hallllll :D. Saizo's qcb+LP has a considerable amount of invincibility - enough to pass through projectiles, dp's, and supers. Why he has this (goddamn) option is beyond me but it's there. (Also, backstep breaker seems to be a highly overlooked option among players).

    Ya know I'm all for seeing the game further explored and getting more exposure, but being an obnoxious dick about things like this isn't a good look.

    But ok, Saizo's qcb+LP. I disagree on it being a "considerable" amount of invincibility. It can't get through slow projectiles at all, only really fast ones like... well, Saizo qcf+LP. And even then it has to be timed perfectly. It's very inconistent on what it beats, which is why I don't consider it as good of a breaker as something like Sho qcb+K or Tia DP. Plus there's the whole thing with it being unsafe on hit unless you have meter (which you usually will have with Saizo I suppose), and you have to cancel it fast or else they pretty much have a chance to breaker back. I suppose it has a better chance of it working as a breaker if they start the fireball from point blank range and it hits them during startup.

    Yes, I admit backdash breakering is something I often forget about and should be considered.
    i think anyone who considers condor in the top tier is a fucking idiot.......does that qualify us playing at evo bbh =D?

    I said Sho and Saizo are top tier. I'm starting to question your reading comprehension :P

    Yes, the article is kind of all over the place. The problem is, it's too long for the average person who doesn't know anything about the game to want to read it, and the people that do play the game want to poke holes at every fucking thing, even when I tried to make it clear that certain things were my opinion and shouldn't be treated as gospel. Oh well.

    keo-bas wrote: »
    stuff

    ...so why was the tier breakdown in the article "pretty poor" then? If you're listing the characters in order of strength it's really not that different, but I'll address one thing.

    I don't feel Dao-Long has the potential to be a "secret" top tier because he can't open people up as well as other characters can. His only command "overhead" for strings is the jumping elbow thing, which is slow as hell and anti-air bait. No command throw of course. I mean his offense is okay I suppose, he can dash up and press a million buttons to link into A+C but without meter he's usually only in range to buffer into fireball. If someone gets a life lead on him and decides to start turtling, he has a much harder time at chipping away at his opponent than Sho, Saizo, or Tia. This is a big problem and what keeps him from being top. It's not to say his tools and normals are terrible, he has buttons for a lot of situations and can be a fairly effective Guile-style turtle. But the big difference between him and Guile is that he is not always recovering fast enough to be throwing his projectiles relatively safely, or winning projectile wars altogether...
    DON'T JUMP AT MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
  • Zee Tee BeeZee Tee Bee Br0k3яZ Revanche Joined: Posts: 1,008
    Lord BBH wrote: »
    -snip-
    My bad, you're right about everything you mentioned.

    Managed to sneak in some recordings this evening. Probably going to take a break from upping new matches (and possibly playing as well) for a while as the majority of online players just want to play for fun. No point in trying to get all serious about it, being a joy-kill and whatnot. Hope people can still enjoy watching these matches as much as I have though. Apologies for poverty quality by the way.





    "Regardless of what they knew and could do, the 360 d-pad undid them." - Book of Rioting Soul
    **Team Grain of Salt** 7/11
  • shadowcharlieshadowcharlie ★ஜ۩dip۞set۩ஜ★ Joined: Posts: 9,169 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Lord BBH wrote: »
    i think anyone who considers condor in the top tier is a fucking idiot.......does that qualify us playing at evo bbh =D?

    I said Sho and Saizo are top tier. I'm starting to question your reading comprehension :P

    Yes, the article is kind of all over the place. The problem is, it's too long for the average person who doesn't know anything about the game to want to read it, and the people that do play the game want to poke holes at every fucking thing, even when I tried to make it clear that certain things were my opinion and shouldn't be treated as gospel. Oh well.


    i consider tia top tier, u have condor in the same tier as her.......that is my logic here.=P the average person is already going to lose interest in the article, heaven, (gospel=PPPPP) forbid that people disagree with someones opinion and want to discuss it, because saying its just "your opinion" makes it immune from a debate.
    also in regard to dao, not every character that is good has to have mixup options or ways to open someone up, especially in a game with mobility options(or lack of) like breakers.

    >>
    one thing that i have brought up in the past and has bothered be for years is still the MASSIVE comeback damage mechanic when you are low on health and someone is life leading i think meter in this scenario for the char with the life lead is trivial, mainly due to the fact that your super meter use will still be under the damage nerf of everything you do.
    bust my gun at the sun just to sit in the shade~
    ἐξίσταται γὰρ πάντ' ἀπ' ἀλλήλων δίχα
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,984
    Lord BBH wrote: »

    ...so why was the tier breakdown in the article "pretty poor" then? If you're listing the characters in order of strength it's really not that different, but I'll address one thing.
    After rereading it can say I jumped the gun calling it poor, it wasn't as extensive is I had hoped but it does the job So my apologize for the previous comment.

    as for doa i believe your underestimating how good regular throws are. His command overhead is not desighn to open peopl up but to counter lows and fire balls. His pressure still get the job done of conditioning people to not push button during pressure. SO can do dash in or empty jump into throw which Dao throw is really good.
    Seikuken Disciple
    "That Phantom Breaker Guy"
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