AE PC Regular Keyboard Players

hadouzerohadouzero Joined: Posts: 44
keyboard_hitbox.jpg

I've ran some tests, and so far I've tested these mappings on 3 different keyboards, all regular USB types (Elephant Slim Keyboard, DELL and hp (last two are from school). For regular PS/2 keyboards, you can press any amount of keys you want simultaneously, so you guys don't need to read this. Back for USB keyboards, they all lock up the same, and I would assume so with other keyboards too, but I found the proper keys to map the buttons so you can initiate KKK, PPP, Grab, Focus, Taunt (not really needed), and even doing Juri's held kicks simultaneously with movement without any use of hotkey. Though there are some limitations still

ASD - left, down, right
Space - up

890 - lp, mp, hp
UIO - lk, mk, hk

As for the limitations, I haven't recorded any data on what works and what doesn't (keep note that you can still maneuver fine while holding these). I didn't really care much for holding normals as I don't use them much like Boxer, Juri or whoever else, but I'll mention a vague description of the limitations anyways:

Holding any 1 kick will let you do any 1 normal
Holding any 2 kicks will let you do any 1 normal except 1 or 2 normals, (maybe some will be unavailable, like mp and hp for example)
Holding 3 kicks will let you maneuver only

Same thing with the punches, but with the punches, you're allowed to press more than one normal simultaneously.

Big problem with Hakan though. I can't cancel the oil dive without the use of a PPP hotkey, so I set up the PPP hotkey with 7. Though the ex.oil shower can be cancelled using by pressing all the punches regularly, since you're not really holding any key when doing the shower.
I'm sure no one cares of how the keyboard works, so I won't bother explaining further. Just try the button mappings and see if it works for you. Sorry for Juri, and Boxer users who likes to hold those normals, you have some options but you're still limited a bit. Cody's fine I'm sure.

Here's a demo video of it. In the video, I used QWE as oppose to ASD, but I found out you can't hold some of the normals while maneuvering (like when using Juri or Boxer's). But if you use ASD, there's less limitations. Enjoy

Comments

  • discostupiddiscostupid Joined: Posts: 54
    the issue is known as n-key rollover. most usb keyboards have a limit to the number of keys that will simultaneously. some (gaming) keyboards have dedicated paths for awsd and arrow keys, and some have higher rollover overall

    i use a regular usb keyboard and asdf/zxcv for lp,mp,hp,ppp/lk,mk,hk,kkk.

    one particular issue is that if you press lp + ppp, it will cancel out the lp and only register mp&hp. it's very frustrating when trying to link normals or regular specials into ultra.
  • VulpesVulpes No. Joined: Posts: 3,677 ✭✭✭
    W = Left
    E = Down
    F = Right
    Space = Up
    Numpad 789456 = Attacks

    Is the most "natural" keyboard setup I found.
    Why.
  • hadouzerohadouzero Joined: Posts: 44
    the issue is known as n-key rollover. most usb keyboards have a limit to the number of keys that will simultaneously. some (gaming) keyboards have dedicated paths for awsd and arrow keys, and some have higher rollover overall

    i use a regular usb keyboard and asdf/zxcv for lp,mp,hp,ppp/lk,mk,hk,kkk.

    one particular issue is that if you press lp + ppp, it will cancel out the lp and only register mp&hp. it's very frustrating when trying to link normals or regular specials into ultra.
    Oh you press them by accident. You could just remove the ppp hotkey, and just use the asd normally, still works. But I guess you prefer those hotkeys?
    Yeah I was thinking of buying the choco mini (only in jp though), it had full KRO support but oh well. This works for me so I'm happy.
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,520 ✭✭✭
    I have a laptop keyboard that appears as PS/2 on device manager, yet I can press only two keys simultaneously. I remember I had an old PS/2 keyboard and I coudnt even perform Subzeros slide on MS-DOS version of MK1. Also DOS version of SF2 had a PPP, KKK shortcut due to this. Probably you are referring to good keyboards that have both PS/2 and USB as simultaneous outputs or USB keyboards that are plugged on a PS2 port through a USB/PS2 adapter. Unfortunately my desktop PC has not a PS2 port.

    I use arrows, QWE (PPP), ASD (KKK) and 1,2,3 (taunt, PPP,KKK). For grapplers and charge characters, I prefer to use a stick, not just in SF4.

    Some FG like Last Blade 2 and Vampire Savior are much easier with an arcade stick. Setting space for up will really disorganize my rhythm completely. I have to re-learn the keyboard this way. Far easier to use a stick or even a pad.
    not good at any, mediocre at many
  • GetSaltyGetSalty Joined: Posts: 73
    I'd imagine Zan
    For grapplers and charge characters, I prefer to use a stick, not just in SF4.

    Hmm. I'd imagine grappler and charge characters would be easier execution wise when on a keyboard.
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,520 ✭✭✭
    SF4 is much more keyboard friendly than emulated fighters. charge characters are more flexible with a stick there.
    Eg using SFIII Chun-li or Alex with a keyboard almost obliterates their down-up charge moves, links and combos. Garou's Rock Howard loses a lot when played with a keyboard.
    On the other hand Ibuki has some extra advantages in anti-air attacks with a keyboard. it depends on the character really.
    not good at any, mediocre at many
  • hadouzerohadouzero Joined: Posts: 44
    SF4 is much more keyboard friendly than emulated fighters. charge characters are more flexible with a stick there.
    Eg using SFIII Chun-li or Alex with a keyboard almost obliterates their down-up charge moves, links and combos. Garou's Rock Howard loses a lot when played with a keyboard.
    On the other hand Ibuki has some extra advantages in anti-air attacks with a keyboard. it depends on the character really.
    I agree, though the charge characters are pretty easy on kb too no (less input mistakes)? Haven't played any charge characters seriously actually, but when I did i find the charge inputs are easy to do.
  • JMKSJMKS Joined: Posts: 13
    I'm a 100% keyboard (and of course, 100% PC) player. My layout: arrows, and nearly whole numerical block; 123456 for normal attack, and 789, "plus" and Enter for macros (i use them all). That's pretty natural for me. Althought I'm lefty, I have ocassional problems with dash after EX Tatsu => Ultra (Sakura mainer since vanilla), so when I'm facing right, I'm using right hand for dash ;).
    And the depressing part - definitely more than 1000 hours in the game (since vanilla) and have'nt played on stick since SF2 (more accurate - MK4 I think) arcade times or so :( - entered one tournament recently, borrowed a stick and lost pretty miserably to some average player, not performing even any specials consistently :(. Is there any way to connect keyboard to console...? I should buy a stick probably...
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,520 ✭✭✭
    you can use a hitbox instead.

    I'd buy a hitbox too if it direction buttons werent on the left side, making it even harder to learn than a stick. Instead I'll invert the stick controls so as to be used with right hand, while attack buttons with left hand. Left hand is not suited for holding the stick.
    I agree, though the charge characters are pretty easy on kb too no (less input mistakes)? Haven't played any charge characters seriously actually, but when I did i find the charge inputs are easy to do.

    they are easier to do perhaps but performing combos with charge characters requires extra effort with a keyboard. You have to press one button out of 4 that blocks the rest of the movements. With a stick you press a direction while being able to buffer more moves by moving it a little diagonally down and then up or front. it is not easy but far easier than with a keyboard. Or to put it better, it is more difficult than it is worth.
    not good at any, mediocre at many
  • hadouzerohadouzero Joined: Posts: 44
    I'm a 100% keyboard (and of course, 100% PC) player. My layout: arrows, and nearly whole numerical block; 123456 for normal attack, and 789, "plus" and Enter for macros (i use them all). That's pretty natural for me. Althought I'm lefty, I have ocassional problems with dash after EX Tatsu => Ultra (Sakura mainer since vanilla), so when I'm facing right, I'm using right hand for dash ;).
    And the depressing part - definitely more than 1000 hours in the game (since vanilla) and have'nt played on stick since SF2 (more accurate - MK4 I think) arcade times or so :( - entered one tournament recently, borrowed a stick and lost pretty miserably to some average player, not performing even any specials consistently :(. Is there any way to connect keyboard to console...? I should buy a stick probably...
    There's actually a converter for keyboard to consoles, look it up. I honestly don't think it's worth it though, it's better to just make a hitbox yourself and customize it the way you play it.
    they are easier to do perhaps but performing combos with charge characters requires extra effort with a keyboard. You have to press one button out of 4 that blocks the rest of the movements. With a stick you press a direction while being able to buffer more moves by moving it a little diagonally down and then up or front. it is not easy but far easier than with a keyboard. Or to put it better, it is more difficult than it is worth.
    Still not sure what you mean. You mean the keys lock up for you when it has 4 keys pressed simultaneously? The format I have lets me have atleast 5 or 6 simultaneously, besides you don't need that many do you to perform charge moves while doing combos. It's just holding two directions at the same time and some normals. And it's not like holding juri's kicks at all so I don't see that a problem for charge characters.
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,520 ✭✭✭
    Not locking up due to hardware limits but because of your finger holding the down button and the tight space in the direction keys. with f/b charges this is not an issue as with d/u charges.
    the problem is not so big in SF4 but it can be in other fighters in Finalburn and MAME, particularly in d/u charge moves, but also charge db, then df,db, up and attack.

    Eg I tried playing following characters:
    Akari (The Last Blade 2)
    Chun-li,Alex (Third Strike)
    Tila (Breakers Revenge),
    BBHood (Vampire Savior)
    Blue Mary, Leona (KOF98)
    Iggy (Jojo's Adventure)

    in those cases, playing charge characters on a stick is much more easier than on a keyboard for d/u.

    Playing Last Blade on a keyboard limits the game a lot. But Akari seems to be the most affected. Combining Astro-revolve with Tenmon Kakageshi Tenshin or Tenmon Tezuru Hokuto (meaning D/U + C followed by D/U + B or A) during a combo is very difficult with a keyboard, especially for fast matches. try doing a combo and combine it with Astro-revolve. It is too difficult.

    Same thing with Third Strike. Linking Bird Kick with Kikosho or other hits seems very limiting on a keyboard.
    not good at any, mediocre at many
  • hadouzerohadouzero Joined: Posts: 44
    Not locking up due to hardware limits but because of your finger holding the down button and the tight space in the direction keys. with f/b charges this is not an issue as with d/u charges.
    the problem is not so big in SF4 but it can be in other fighters in Finalburn and MAME, particularly in d/u charge moves, but also charge db, then df,db, up and attack.

    Eg I tried playing following characters:
    Akari (The Last Blade 2)
    Chun-li,Alex (Third Strike)
    Tila (Breakers Revenge),
    BBHood (Vampire Savior)
    Blue Mary, Leona (KOF98)
    Iggy (Jojo's Adventure)

    in those cases, playing charge characters on a stick is much more easier than on a keyboard for d/u.

    Playing Last Blade on a keyboard limits the game a lot. But Akari seems to be the most affected. Combining Astro-revolve with Tenmon Kakageshi Tenshin or Tenmon Tezuru Hokuto (meaning D/U + C followed by D/U + B or A) during a combo is very difficult with a keyboard, especially for fast matches. try doing a combo and combine it with Astro-revolve. It is too difficult.

    Same thing with Third Strike. Linking Bird Kick with Kikosho or other hits seems very limiting on a keyboard.

    Ohhh sorry I forgot you're not using the Hitbox format. Yeah I used to play WASD for my arrows back then, and yeah now i can understand you. You really do need extra effort on that, but after switching the up to the space bar everything is alot easier now. Might as well put those thumbs to use, it doesn't take long to adjust. It's weird but it just feels like a jump button, and it feels natural when you try it out. Give it around a couple of minutes and you might get used to it already, took me 10 mins until I could do 8/10 chicken wings on sf2, and those are strict timing.
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,520 ✭✭✭
  • NILNIL Joined: Posts: 17
    W,A,S,D = Up, Left, Down, Right

    Y, U, I, O = [lp + Mp + FP], lp, mp, fp
    H, J, K, L = [lk+ Mk + HK], lk, mk, hk

    B = Grab aka lp + lk
    N = Focus

    This is my setup, works great, and you can do everything a lot easier than the setup above.
  • yomipoweryomipower not a legendary game designer Joined: Posts: 1,167 ✭✭
    Arrows - Movement

    Q W E - LP MP HP
    A S D - LK MK HK

    I've used this since forever on pc fighters. Am I the only one who uses arrows for moving?

    By the way, USB limit for silmultaneous keyboard presses is 6 + modifier, PS/2 is NKRO. I've noticed the problem with doing EX moves/Ultras without shortcuts is not with the keyboard unable to read all the inputs, but with the design of the keyboard. I can do ultras and ex-moves no problem with a "flat" keyboard (Logitech Classic Keyboard 200) but with a traditional "staired" keyboard (SteelSeries 6GV2, Q-pad MK-50, Logitech Deluxe 250 keyboard) my ex moves and ultras drop frequently. I can do throws, taunts, focus attacks and whatnot with my above key configuration 100%, no drops on both types of keyboards. There's just something about the design of the "stair" keyboards that drop the inputs, might wanna try switching to a flat one if you have similar problems.
    Yomi, which is the Japanese word for the underworld. Also a brand of vitamins for children.
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,520 ✭✭✭
    Arrows - Movement

    Q W E - LP MP HP
    A S D - LK MK HK

    I've used this since forever on pc fighters. Am I the only one who uses arrows for moving?

    By the way, USB limit for silmultaneous keyboard presses is 6 + modifier, PS/2 is NKRO. I've noticed the problem with doing EX moves/Ultras without shortcuts is not with the keyboard unable to read all the inputs, but with the design of the keyboard. I can do ultras and ex-moves no problem with a "flat" keyboard (Logitech Classic Keyboard 200) but with a traditional "staired" keyboard (SteelSeries 6GV2, Q-pad MK-50, Logitech Deluxe 250 keyboard) my ex moves and ultras drop frequently. I can do throws, taunts, focus attacks and whatnot with my above key configuration 100%, no drops on both types of keyboards. There's just something about the design of the "stair" keyboards that drop the inputs, might wanna try switching to a flat one if you have similar problems.

    I use arrows too. I agree with what you mention. Had the laptop keyboard more than a 2 button limit it would have been perfect. Mainly because of the shorter keystroke travel distance. The Logitech G510 keyboard suffers from that. but regarding other genres like FPS and platformers where you have more issues with directions and screen position than FG, it is better
    not good at any, mediocre at many
  • AughAugh Press X to not did Joined: Posts: 356
    I just go asd space movements, iop kl; normals on a PS/2 Steelseries 6g. Dealing with n-key rollover/ghosting was ass, and I can't tech or focus or shit like that with normals on the numeric+ qwerty rows cause the pairs are so diagonal on there.
    Ink: Then it was too expensive and that was short there was short there was short there was short
  • helhelhelhelohelhelhelhelo True Believer | * * * * | Joined: Posts: 251
    I don't really use the "hitbox" thing they all use, if I go keyboard, I use simple WASD and UIOJKL and Y as start
  • kedawakedawa . Joined: Posts: 370 ✭✭
    I only play on keyboard if I don't have a stick handy, but I have a pretty straight forward layout for Street Fighter games.

    -WASD for movement (I like to use the space bar as an extra up in games that allow multi-key binding)
    -numpad 1-6 for attack buttons, numpad plus for 3P, numpad enter for 3K, numpad 7 for throw, numpad 8 for focus, numpad 9 for taunt
  • AmoniAmoni I'm from Vietnam! Joined: Posts: 131
    If you really want to play on a keyboard, invest for a good one.

    using PPP and KKK for EX-moves are good choices, but what happen if you play Seth, Gen or Akuma?

    Play a good keyboard and feel the different. Plinking, Double Plinking, Plink Select and press 3-4 attack button at once without a prob.
  • BDlBDl Joined: Posts: 69
    wasd - movement
    uio - punches
    jkl - kicks
    h - 3K
    space - 3P
    e - throw
    n - focus
  • AughAugh Press X to not did Joined: Posts: 356
    Moved jump from space to W after decade or two playing fighters with that configuration, cause I got sick of TK always coming out as 239 instead of 2369 (muscle problem, not hardware problem).

    It fucking hurts man, and I can't do shit. Need to grind through it I guess.
    Ink: Then it was too expensive and that was short there was short there was short there was short
  • discostupiddiscostupid Joined: Posts: 54
    also if you weren't aware, you can force EX moves to come out with PPP or KKK

    if you hold down PPP, and then press any punch, that punch will be cancelled out

    PPP + LP = MP+HP
    PPP + MP = LP+HP
    PPP + HP = LP+MP

    i use it to avoid unwanted teleports/ultras, since i can't consistently do PPP manually otherwise
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