3rd Strike Frame Data

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  • fire chocobofire chocobo child genius Joined: Posts: 381
    i remember yohei/blue or some other guy telling me in japan that makoto wakes up from the ground weird. i forgot exactly what it was though. anyone know anything about this?


    Makoto reacts very strangely to meaties that hit high only, such as Dudley's s.mp and Urien's s.mp.

    Dudley does meaty s.mp
    Makoto holds up = s.mp meaties
    Makoto holds downback = s.mp meaties
    Makoto holds back = s.mp meaties
    Makoto does nothing = s.mp whiffs

    Urien does meaty s.mp
    Makoto holds back = s.mp meaties
    Makoto holds downback = s.mp meaties
    Makoto presses nothing = s.mp meaties
    Makoto holds any up direction = s.mp whiffs

    For both Urien and Dudley's meaty s.mps, I tested Makoto actions in parry training versus a single recording. I may post a video of this tomorrow, so you don't have to take my word for it. : )
    ==========================================================================
    *EDIT*
    Here's a video demonstrating Makoto's weird meaty properties.
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  • yuukiyuuki Joined: Posts: 782
    oh word?! thats pretty interesting.

    i remember seeing rx vs shiroitachi in grand finals of tougeki 07. at the very end rx goes for meaty st strong but shiroitachi does wake up cr short and the st strong misses.

    i wonder if the st strong wiffed because makoto was mashing cr short on wake up or what.



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  • GaijinblazeGaijinblaze fingerlicans Joined: Posts: 2,517 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    ^ same instance i was thinking of when i read chocobo's tests. i tried recording urien in that setup and quickrising with makoto into rapid-fire c.lk (to get it on the first frame), and it seemed inconsistent in that sometimes i'd get meatied, and other times makoto would hit urien. are you guys getting something else? my theory now is that there's probably some discrepancy in the wakeup timing depending on when exactly your down for the quickrise gets registered, so i'll have to redo the tests from the other perspective, ie. recording makoto empty quickrising to guarantee the same timing, and manually doing the meaty setup with urien.

    also, i wonder if that karate stance animation that makoto does when recovering from a crouch/knockdown/numerous other things has anything to do with some of her wakeup properties.
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  • fire chocobofire chocobo child genius Joined: Posts: 381
    I was able to occasionally c.lp, c.mp, c.hp, c.lk, and c.mk out of meaty s.mp. I was also able to jump cancel specials/supers. For example, reversal Karakusa gets stuffed but [hcb, ub, lk] makes s.mp whiff and Makoto command grabs Urien.
    Rockefeller: "Fuck growing up."
    A wise man: "i usually procrastinate till i realize i'm fucked and accept it"
  • long island jokelong island joke LI Djokovic Joined: Posts: 138
    more makoto bullshit!
    I think, therefore I stink. - my sf4 mantra
  • Mr. DemonMr. Demon Joined: Posts: 189
    Are frames to crouch, stand, and block all 1? I don't see any movement frame data except dashes and jumps.
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  • yuukiyuuki Joined: Posts: 782
    Are frames to crouch, stand, and block all 1? I don't see any movement frame data except dashes and jumps.

    wheres the frame data for dashes and jumps?
    かかってきな。
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,700
    wheres the frame data for dashes and jumps?

    - page="tables" -

    It doesn't seem to like all browsers which is understandable because browsers are remarkably inconsistent (I'm looking at you IE) but the info is there. It's nice visually if your browser displays it properly.
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  • GaijinblazeGaijinblaze fingerlicans Joined: Posts: 2,517 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    that version doesn't seem to have the coloured bars for the dashes. at least not in my browser. esn's older version has served me well. good thing he keeps both available. thanks esn!

    TABLES
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  • yuukiyuuki Joined: Posts: 782
    makes me wonder if its better to regular jump air parry out of the corner or to super jump air parry out of the corner since regular jumps are faster.

    also maybe its just in my head but i feel like chun lands faster than a lot of characters?
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  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,700
    Ah yeah thanks gaijin i was looking for that version of the page but couldn't find it.

    Are the parentheses referring to move cancelling the recovery of the dash? It isn't listed there what the number in parentheses is referring to but this is what I'm assuming.
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  • Mr. DemonMr. Demon Joined: Posts: 189
    makes me wonder if its better to regular jump air parry out of the corner or to super jump air parry out of the corner since regular jumps are faster.

    also maybe its just in my head but i feel like chun lands faster than a lot of characters?

    idk man, regular jump is faster but u can more easily input option selects into the super jumps...
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    that version doesn't seem to have the coloured bars for the dashes. at least not in my browser. esn's older version has served me well. good thing he keeps both available. thanks esn!

    TABLES
    Actually, this is the only version i recommend, others are just tests i forgot to delete ^^
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,700
    Actually, this is the only version i recommend, others are just tests i forgot to delete ^^

    Thanks for all that. It's quite nice.

    I asked just a few posts up but in case you missed it: what are the parentheses in the dashes referring to? Are those the recovery frames being cancelled by a move?
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    I honestly don't really know as i just took infos from karathrow.com but i think you're right. Seems quite obvious with Makoto in fact.
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,700
    Alright. I assumed that (for the same reason you did) so I'll take our agreement on that as reasonable conjecture. Thanks.
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  • p1nkt1t5p1nkt1t5 Joined: Posts: 640
    where can I get the arcade framedata?
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  • CoryukenCoryuken Joined: Posts: 4
    Hmm, links not working for me. Good idea putting this together though. I'll try again later.
  • BlizerBlizer Proud Imitator Joined: Posts: 232
    I found this one I'm a begginer so I'll let you guys confirm if that frame data is correct.

    http://ensabahnur.free.fr/Baston/index.php?page=gameChars&gameNum=20&gameName=Street%20Fighter%20III%20Third%20Strike
  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    I found this one I'm a begginer so I'll let you guys confirm if that frame data is correct.

    http://ensabahnur.free.fr/Baston/index.php?page=gameChars&gameNum=20&gameName=Street Fighter III Third Strike
    Those are ~90% correct.
    I'm currently extracting frames data and hitboxes from the CPS3 emulated game, so it'll be more accurate soon.
  • TheShendTheShend Sean Powa! Joined: Posts: 766
    Is Streak still on SRK?

    I'm in the process of scanning in some hard SFIII science and I believe the book Streak used to produce karathrow.com was this one, but I wanted to check with him for definite.

    I'll be scanning in the Arcade frame data from Gamest Mook Vol.194 at some point this week as well.

    The purpose of why I'm doing is to extrapolate the DC and Arcade Frame Data and then extrapolate them into google spreadsheets for both and in English & Japanese, so people have access to the source information.
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  • TriplejjjTriplejjj Joined: Posts: 260
    I have a question regarding the startup time of Chun's SA2. According to ESN's tables it is 3 frames startup and links after a stand roundhouse to a crouched opponent, (st rh to crouchers is +4), but reversal SA2 at point blank range never seems to punish Necro's cr forward (-5 on block) in 3SO. What is the issue here? If the data is correct it should be able to punish from a distance, imo. I even saw a couple of vids where Chun punished the same normal from Necro. This has me completely baffled.
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    Iirc what i read yesterday somewhere here, Chun/Ryu/Q have 2 additionnal hit/block stun frames when crouching.
    Will check it tonight.
  • GaijinblazeGaijinblaze fingerlicans Joined: Posts: 2,517 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    yeah, i think billykane got that info from the japanese 3S mook. it would explain why you can't reverse chun's c.mk with ryu's sa2, but you can with similar supers with other characters. to this day i'm not sure how they decided which characters to apply this to or why it was even implemented.
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  • TriplejjjTriplejjj Joined: Posts: 260
    Iirc what i read yesterday somewhere here, Chun/Ryu/Q have 2 additionnal hit/block stun frames when crouching.
    Will check it tonight.

    Wow that sounds really like a really random design decision. Eh whatever, every game has its quirks I guess.
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  • Hol HorseHol Horse a.k.a. Fugo ~ イタリアの強大なユリアン Joined: Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Q also has 1 additional blockstun while standing, that's why he can't blue parry the last hit of chun's SA2
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    Good to know.
    This last hit always feels random to me, as most of the time a red parry will occur and sometimes a blue one.
    Anyway, except if you're out of life, best thing to do is block and hk c&db.
  • TheShendTheShend Sean Powa! Joined: Posts: 766
    I get his HK Dash Attack o_0
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
  • TheShendTheShend Sean Powa! Joined: Posts: 766
    Yeah, if you're blocking long enough to build a charge up the game will use the F from HCB and the kick and puts it together with the charge, the rest of the HCB gets ignored in favour of the charge attack.
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    Never happened to me. Usually if i screw something, it's the c&db motion and i just get a cr.hk, which is quit annoying too.
  • TriplejjjTriplejjj Joined: Posts: 260
    Q also has 1 additional blockstun while standing, that's why he can't blue parry the last hit of chun's SA2

    I always assumed that Q had to red parry because of his hitbox forced him into blockstun a bit longer than other characters while blocking Chun SA2. LIve and learn, lol. What is your source btw? The japanese mook?
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  • otoriotori RTSD Joined: Posts: 6,150
    Yang's cr.lk is listed as being +2 on hit and not chainable, with 4 frame startup. Stuff like cr.lk, cr.lk xx EX Torou Zan work however. Is the frame data wrong or does it work differently from SF4?
  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
  • GaijinblazeGaijinblaze fingerlicans Joined: Posts: 2,517 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    i think otori's asking why it has an X for chaining into itself instead of an O. it's an error. yang's c.lk does chain into itself. yun's page seems correct in that regard.
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,700
    Oh i see, my bad!

    I've been wondering for a long time. What the hell is your avatar?
    Also thanks as always for maintaining the site and all your work with 3s system mechanics.
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  • GaijinblazeGaijinblaze fingerlicans Joined: Posts: 2,517 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berserk_(manga)#Behelit

    well, that just about covers the full extent of my anime knowledge.
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  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,700
    Oh shit I've seen berserk and thought it was pretty cool. Never bothered to read it but I should. Guessing you also like fist of the north star based on the phrase under your name.

    I need to read BOTH of those. Sorry for derailing.
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