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  • telesnipertelesniper Joined: Posts: 365
    edited August 2013
    cong said:
    Hey guys, I have a couple of questions about Ken, and I was hoping you guys can help me understand the character better. After getting a knockdown, I see Ken players walk up to the opponent and do cr. short, standing jab as the opponent wakes up. Then the Ken players will typically go for a throw. My question is why do the standing jab? Wouldn't doing a cr. jab after the cr. short be more useful in covering up the intention to throw, as cr. short into cr. jab looks like you're hit confirming for super (prompting the opponent to keep blocking or go for a red parry). Or is this a way to prevent the opponent from jumping out? My vision for options are narrow, so I can't really think of any other explanation. 
    Against most characters, st.Jab will whiff unless they are standing, this can lead to a few things...

    #1. cr.Short is blocked, st.Jab whiffs.  This puts you closer to your opponent than a blocked cr.Jab, also, since they aren't in block stun, you can throw them almost immediately.

    #2. cr.Short hits and st.Jab combos. This can be easily confirmed into Jab Shoryu, also it can be option selected as there are a few recovery frames of the st.Jab, so if it isn't blocked or it connects, the Shoryu won't come out. It's more unlikely that your opponent will block low (cr.Short), then additionally block the st.Jab, so this is a relatively safe choice.

    #3. cr.Short is blocked, st.Jab is Red Parried. If you incorporate the option select Shoryu, you will automatically attempt to punish their parry with the Jab Shoryu.

    The option select works the same way as the st.Strong to Shoryu option select, in which you press punch during the recovery of the move so that if it's parried, you "auto" Shoryu, but in st.Jabs case, you input P when it would combo, so during it's active frames.
    Post edited by telesniper on
  • akuaku スピリチュアルやからね! Joined: Posts: 3,865
    edited February 2013
    cr.LK->st.LP will combo if the opponent is standing, in which they can hitconfirm into Shoryuken. If the st.LP whiffs from them crouching, they can go for a throw. It's a basic Shoto option select(ish) situation.

    EDIT: Pft, I didn't even read telesniper's post because it didn't show the new page..
  • congcong Joined: Posts: 173
    I have another question related to my narrow perspective on situational options. When I block a jump-in attack, I want to either keep blocking a possible ongoing combo or tech a possible grab. Let's assume my opponent can: 1.) continue a tight block string after the jump-in attack, 2.) grab 3.) do a frame trap so that it beats any attempt to tech a grab. I've been trying to avoid this situation altogether by getting reads and do air to air. I some times walk under the jump-in (a little hard as I need a good read--so I don't walk into a sweep--and it's spacing dependent--I avoid the jump-in in time). Although I try to avoid the situation, what would be a good option if I blocked the jump-in. Is it just a pure guessing game from that point? I've tried crouch tech option select, but it still seems to get beat. Also, I hate teching grabs with characters with short throw range.

    Thanks for the help!
  • MakaveliMakaveli Joined: Posts: 34
    edited March 2013
    Hey there Cong.

    Alright so from what you wrote, the first thing that popped in my mind was this:
    It's a great video covering viable options in an anti-air situation (so against a jump-in)

    Besides what's in the video, here's my take on your question. That won't be of much help I'm afraid but anyway always a good reminder.
    After you've blocked the initial jump-in attack, I'd advise to immediately start crouch blocking and try to techtrow (or crouch tech OS) any suspicious throw setups -on reaction- :p Usually there are some "staples" setups before a throw depending on characters, thinking specifically about shotos right now.
    But yeah, basically it's all about guessing games... there's no absolute better/safer option other than the classic crouch blocking imo. Don't be too hasty to press buttons either. Oh and from my experience, watch out for the jump-in attack --> backdash --> cr.mk xx super. That gets me a lot of time (and even top players)...

    Out of the 3 options you listed, blocking keeps you safe from 2 of them. Of course if you get thrown, you're gonna have to face another wakeup mixup situation ^^
    In the end, you're gonna have to decide when it's better to try to tech or even attempt a parry or poking depending on: how much meter they have, if they can inflict you big damage with a hitconfirm or not, etc.

    Well, I mostly hope the video will help you haha. =)
    "NO BLOCKING, NO LIFE."
  • IglooBobIglooBob Bob the builder Joined: Posts: 4,039
    I was watching Kazuya Alex vs Matsuken Ken set on Youtube, and saw Matsuken go for crossup forward then immediately backdash every time. shotos will definitely do that a lot and look for you to hit a button or whiff throw. it's a cool option. though probably dependent on already having conditioned you to expect throw/target combo/short short upon landing.
  • DanderDander BANNED Joined: Posts: 7,227
    Cong, I think Watts started doing it waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back when to keep things in stride. You could try low short tick grab but with the standing jab they are 1.) still seeing attacks 2.) still hearing buttons pressed 3.) still see themselves blocking due to the block stance short forces out of the opponent.

    One or any combinations of those three could be it. There's also the combo into uppercut but I think it's good for forcing the next event/string.
    8tROOXi.png
  • IglooBobIglooBob Bob the builder Joined: Posts: 4,039
    How should Chun and Ken players approach the Akuma matchup for players who like to play keepaway until they decide to go for their offense, which is basically a simplified JR Rodriguez? Do you just wait for them and build meter while they jump around, or do you chase them down? And once they do start going for their offense, is getting out of demon flip setups really just a guessing game or are there clean options that will beat most of his possibilities?
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,711
    i try to dash forward in that sort of situation.
    Play more.
  • IglooBobIglooBob Bob the builder Joined: Posts: 4,039
    thank you. I guess that should be obvious if I think about it. but then again that's why I posted it in the new player FAQ. I have been working with "just sit back and wait for them to come to you" and it has been suboptimal.
  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    edited May 2013
    imo stay grounded for one. gouki already has very good anti air options, but all his fireballs cause a knockdown when you get hit by them airborne. unless you have a good angle to hit him with j.ex tatsu or hp,hp he is stronger in the air than ken or chun.

    what do you mean by demon flip setups? like post sa1? if so, ex SBK deals with ambiguous xups, and even experienced players have a hard time stuffing it. another thing to consider is that if they don't have another sa1 stocked, its less likely they will go for a low attack since c.mk has slow startup.

    In the case of Chun I'd say its definitely worth it to build meter. Chun getting fully stocked is a much bigger powerup than Gouki getting fully stocked.

    lastly, its doubly important to have your reversals down against keepaway Gouki. in general stay patient and wait for an opening. you really only need 2. study the vulnerable areas of jump fb.
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • IglooBobIglooBob Bob the builder Joined: Posts: 4,039
    thanks, that's all helpful. for demon flip I really mean anything where I'm waking up and can't move around freely. will EX SBK deal with most of his available options (that don't stuff it)?
  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    I mainly brought up ex SBK as an option to deal with an ambiguous xup since it hits on both sides, although on second thought, since Gouki demon flip xups usually mean that the non xup version will have the demon flip kick hitting you, it might not be that great.

    its actually pretty tough to deal with demon flip as a chun player. its imo Goukis biggest strength in that matchup (hence why you see guys like Uraken basically flying that entire match). default to block and react to the mixup when he lands. parry only if the gouki player is being very obvious with his timing for the demon flip kick. if you're waking up when hes at the peak of his demon flip, RH and to a lesser extent stand lp work decent. you can also try jump back lk.

    Ken has it easier. same advice about defaulting to block, but when you have time to go for lp SRK, do it everytime. even trading here is worse for the Gouki player. jump back RH is also great tool when you're afraid you'll be hit during your shoryu motion.

    you really just want to avoid getting hit by the deep demon flip kick since this yields a full jump in combo for the gouki player. everything else doesn't pay off nearly as well. this is why I advise avoiding parry unless its totally obvious.

    I'd study top Chuns/Kens vs Jiro and Uraken as those guys really get the most mileage out of demon flip. generally if you block it out, you'll find yourself back in a neutral position, not having to deal with a really tough demon flip mixup again unless they score a good knockdown on you.
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • IglooBobIglooBob Bob the builder Joined: Posts: 4,039
    cool thanks for the advice. one more question: when dealing with demon flips on your wakeup, is this a situation where staggering whether you quick roll or not is going to be helpful? I assume this will mess with timings and spacings. though of course post SA1 that's not an option.
  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    yes definitely stagger quick rolls against demon flip! good thinking!
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • NoMoreFunlandNoMoreFunland Perfection equals obliteration! Joined: Posts: 1,229
    edited May 2013
    Hey Bob, jump back instant lp is low damage but very effective at knocking away demon flip.

    Actually Pherai, I'm remembering that Zabi vs Magi battle. Zabi was eventually using cl.mp, into tatsu usually, as a post sa1 option on chun. At the time I was wondering why not use cl.mk since it has a few better properties but now I wonder if mp was to stuff Ex.SBK. Maybe the hitbox or startup line up better to win out. Nica messed around with cl.mk to stuff SBK on a stream and he found you had to delay it a bit to work.

    ...

    Just popped onto ESN's site to check out the frame data and hit boxes and general movement of the two normals. There are some big unexpected differences it seems. Mp is a frame slow on startup and stays out for a frame less than Mk as well as having worse hit/block stun making Mk seem like the better normal overall. Mk is a wired when you look at the bones though. It has a good size two part hit box that stays out for a couple frames then it shrinks down to one tiny box for the remaining hit frames and right after active frames it leaves a fat blue limb hurt box for a bit. On top of that the startup animation moves the body hurt box way forward from neutral. Mp on the other hand comes out at a decent size and stays out like that for the whole hit period. The body hurt box doesn't really move forward either. Somewhere in those differences is the reason I see Japanese Gouki use cl.mp instead of cl.mk in certain situations like ambiguous xups.
    Post edited by NoMoreFunland on
  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    Actually Pherai, I'm remembering that Zabi vs Magi battle. Zabi was eventually using cl.mp, into tatsu usually, as a post sa1 option on chun. At the time I was wondering why not use cl.mk since it has a few better properties but now I wonder if mp was to stuff Ex.SBK. Maybe the hitbox or startup line up better to win out. Nica messed around with cl.mk to stuff SBK on a stream and he found you had to delay it a bit to work.

    I think there's 2 reasons. First yeah, I think meaty MP is the best move to stuff wakeup ex SBK (actually UOH might be best but requires good timing for a decent follow up). Another reason tho is pushback on cl.mp is less than cl.mk. MOV taught me against Chun that after regular dive kick pretty much always go for cl.mp x mk tatsu, but same principle applies to after xups.

    that frame data explains a lot tho! reminds me of an old gvision ranbat vid with Jiro vs Tokido. Jiro stuffs wakeup ex SBK with a really late timed meaty HP x HP shoryu x sa2 ftw. Looks fuckin sick but I can't find it anymore.

    tangetial but on the subject of cl.mp, I've been noticing the spacing after Gouki's target combo (block or hit) puts you at a great range to punish a reactionary c.mk or far HP. take it for a spin!
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • ESNESN 最初はぐう... Joined: Posts: 1,347
    Also, you will never be able to stuff ex sbk with cr.mk at all, cause it hits too low.
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,711
    on the topic of quickroll and not.
    imo the only time you want to pretty much always quickroll is if you are knocked down such a distance away that they cannot possibly follow up unless you don't quickroll.

    any other time i really doubt any advantage gained from quickrolling.
    there are also times when due to positioning quickrolling is just a bad choice since itll corner you.

    it shouldn't ever be something you just default to.
    if they want to corner you and you don't quick roll they need to push you which is also using up their time. any time advantage they gain doesn't really matter since you can see any setup coming that requires that kind of time advantage.
    Play more.
  • IglooBobIglooBob Bob the builder Joined: Posts: 4,039
    shoto short x3 as a hit confirm into super - just useful to give yourself more time to confirm, or other reasons too? I was thinking it might be meant to catch people who block for a split second then try to jump out but not sure. I know it has definitely caught me for that reason at least.
  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    afaik more time to confirm is really the only practical reason to use this along with what you mentioned (why does this happen so much?), but I also like how it looks so I use it for that reason sometimes too.

    1 short, pause, short x2 is sick tho :tup:

    also worth mentioning is if you don't anticipate a parry attempt jab short short has its advantages.
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • SpiderMadSpiderMad I'm new to 3s, be nice and helpful to me =( Joined: Posts: 18
    edited August 2013
    Hi I'm new. When SSBMelee got into Evo I did my part and tried to get into a fighting game (besides Melee and Project Melee [A Brawl Mod to make Brawl like Melee]). Third Strike was told to me to be Free to play on the PC using Supercade; and is the closest to being awesome like Melee but without boring long combos like Marvel. I've been trying to learn Chun li for a few weeks now, using a cheap Xbox 360 Fightpad which so far has been good. I'm going to try to read the most of what I can of this old thread to get more beginner help and such; but I need as much help as I can get since the people on Supercade aren't that helpful and don't usually speak english. I only have one friend who's sometimes on to give me advice. Are there any IRCs to ask Third strike questions? otherwise I got a Skype james.madway .

    I suck at doing EX spinning bird kick from wake-up, am I able to charge while I'm knocked down or what

    And what are good tips for Chun li dittos?

    Once I learn and master Chun I'll definitely pick up more characters like Yun/Ken/Yang/Akuma
    Post edited by SpiderMad on
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,711
    You can charge at any time in the game.
    If you suck at doing it from wake up your timing is just off. You are probably trying to do it too early. Learning the reversal window takes a little bit of time.
    Play more.
  • PointBreak91PointBreak91 Custom costumes for SFV please Cap Joined: Posts: 666
    Pull the stick down to charge as soon as you see yourself being bopped to the floor, or do a tech roll. Keep throwing out standing HP until they parry it. If they like to jump at you, dash under or try jumping at them with the air throw. Try throwing out MP up close, then back and HP to beat counter attacks. This builds meter fast, and combos into your super. When dancing forward fishing for low MK into super, try the universal overhead (MP + MK) to force stand, and then go low. From the correct distance and spacing, you can even combo straight into super from this.
    Chun Li doesn't really do combos in this, it's just pokes, throws and super. Think about where you land after the super, by tapping down then up just as the last kick hits. Sometimes in round 3 if you have two bars stocked, you can simply dash under them as they fall, then just land the second one for a speedy lights out ;)
    twitch.tv/nyc_vf
  • SpiderMadSpiderMad I'm new to 3s, be nice and helpful to me =( Joined: Posts: 18
    edited August 2013
    or do a tech roll.

    Keep throwing out standing HP until they parry it. If they like to jump at you, dash under or try jumping at them with the air throw. Try throwing out MP up close, then back and HP to beat counter attacks. This builds meter fast, and combos into your super. When dancing forward fishing for low MK into super, try the universal overhead (MP + MK) to force stand, and then go low. From the correct distance and spacing, you can even combo straight into super from this.

    Chun Li doesn't really do combos in this, it's just pokes, throws and super. Think about where you land after the super, by tapping down then up just as the last kick hits. Sometimes in round 3 if you have two bars stocked, you can simply dash under them as they fall, then just land the second one for a speedy lights out ;)
    That's pressing down just as I'm about to land right? Why/When would I want to do that?: Any time except for when it'd put me into the corner?

    What do I do after they parry the HPs, cus I've had that exactly happen
    Which move by itself do I spam for the most meter if I'm stalling? I saw a video but the guy was uncertain if Back+HP or Low MK built meter faster.

    What's all her AA options and which should be used for what? I only know of lightning legs and Back+HP being said to be AA, and my friend said MK or something which looks like it should be a decent one but no one has mentioned it (Renic's tutorial didn't).

    What do I do when they are in the corner?
    Tebbo wrote: »
    You can charge at any time in the game.
    If you suck at doing it from wake up your timing is just off. You are probably trying to do it too early. Learning the reversal window takes a little bit of time.
    My friend told me unlike SF4 and other games, S3 doesn't have any buffer for the reversal: but pianokeying can help; should I use that for EX lighrtning legs? What should I do on wake-up without EX meter for EX bird kick, Light bird kick?
    Post edited by SpiderMad on
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,711
    you're looking for specific answers to general situations and there is nothing like that in 3S.
    just don't think about the game that way. think about everything as a tool with its own properties that can be used in a bunch of situations.

    reversal is simply doing something on the first frame possible. there is a window, but its much much smaller than sf4.

    honestly a lot of your questions are too basic. you should just play vs cpu for a while and experiment with her normals and specials.
    Play more.
  • DanderDander BANNED Joined: Posts: 7,227
    A good chun to watch if you want to learn how the game is played is probably Justin Wong. He has a very straight forward style to him that is easily recognizable by many beginner and even advanced players.

    Chun is probably going to be very straight forward and you are over-thinking it. Think of Chun as Marth from Melee without the combos. When facing a Chun, if her pokes can reach you, they will usually hit you out of whatever you try.

    3s parry is more like Brawl perfect block than Melee perfect block with as little block stun and shine time (whatever it's called) as Brawl. I recall Melee stun times for block and perfect block being much longer but it could be I'm not be remembering correctly. One of her better meter building tools is cr mk because of the recovery and instant anti air parry she has after getting back up from a crouch. Be careful not to mash it, or you'll get crazy legs.

    What I mean by that instant anti air parry is since you crouch to do cr mk and her cr mk makes her a really small target, chun moves much lower to the ground. And since Chun moves lower to the ground they have to wait longer to actually try and hit her. If they have to wait longer to try and hit her, you have a lot of time to actually recover from your attack, and if for some reason you whiffed to a low jumper (like dudley) you can tap forward as you're recovering from your cr mk to parry -> anti air/punish. This is actually an advanced tactic that, I think, is best learned early on. It really helps to organize modes of attack and defense as well as get you used to common mix up scenarios where you have to actually consider what the opponent is likely to do and not just what the scenario entails.


    Tech rolls are indeed done by pressing down just before you hit the ground. They are best used out of the corner because you don't want them be able to dash over you for a free ground cross-up mix-up situation. Tech rolls are to force a tighter window of attack on your opponent, where they would otherwise have all day to set up their next attack as you are getting from the ground. Tech rolls usually end up in opponent long limb poke (usually blockable low), dash grab/regular mix up game. The added benefit this has to your game is that there are fewer things your opponent can do to throw you off his trail because now he can only whiff so many attacks if he wants to stay on you/not get wake up grabbed or uppercut, or in Chun's case wake-up EX Spinning Bird, cr jabbed, cr short.

    And to conclude, Chun actually has an array of anti air tools but unlike shoryuken, they are tailored to many different situations.

    Her useful anti airs include:

    jab
    b hp
    hp, from a distance
    strong
    mk
    cl mk
    cl rh
    and I guess even far rh.

    Alright, breakfast time.
    8tROOXi.png
  • SpiderMadSpiderMad I'm new to 3s, be nice and helpful to me =( Joined: Posts: 18
    edited August 2013
    How do i decide which of those anti-airs to use? What you mean by stating both MK and close MK?

    How do I deal with Akuma's fireballs, as well as Kens who are really good and have a 2nd move after everything? I'm getting a little disheartened and wish more guides for Yun/Chun existed
  • DanderDander BANNED Joined: Posts: 7,227
    edited August 2013
    SpiderMad wrote: »
    How do i decide which of those anti-airs to use? What you mean by stating both MK and close MK?

    How do I deal with Akuma's fireballs, as well as Kens who are really good and have a 2nd move after everything? I'm getting a little disheartened and wish more guides for Yun/Chun existed

    Hit boxes in 3s are very precisely defined. There aren't any huge hitboxes like in sf4 and other street fighter iterations ( except for Chun Li ), so it's really just about finding out where they hit and using them appropriately. The difference between this game and others is that since the hit boxes are so much smaller and crafted for particular situations that you can't just use one attack for all situations. So if you want to use her jab to anti air, you need to make sure the jump in will place the opponent up close, and if you want to use the far fierce as an anti air you'll have make sure that the opponent is a bit further away so that you can land a hit and not get kicked in the face in the process of doing so. Figuring out stuff like that for all your normals can essentially make most normals viable anti-airs but may require parries for most. There are also some normals that have smaller hurtboxes (that is the defined area where you can be hit after having pressed a button) and so those may work better in some situations where two different normals can both be used "optimally". Like, you can use far fierce and standing mk for roughly the same situation, except far fierce puts you closer to the opponent and at an angle that might allow a jump attack that has a more horizontally inclined hit box to hit you without allowing you to land your fierce. Whereas the mk will be quicker, mostly hitbox and not put you in position to eat an air attack. Each with their own benefits against from defensive and offensive aspects.

    The differnce between the cl mk and regular mk is that close mk has an almost completely vertical hitbox that hits above her head, so it would be ideal to use it against cross ups or neutral jumps. If the button is held, it hits two more times on the way down, so it'll be good against the neutral jump parry. The far mk is good for a distanced anti air and for stuffing jump attempts.


    If your problem is with fireballs, I hate to say this, but you really just need to practice playing the game more, win or lose, and get a feel for the game as this game and not just another fighting game. What you described is a cancel, and is a really unsafe thing to do with fireballs outside of a purely punishing situation but even that wouldn't make much sense because the cancel window for a fireball is at an interval that keeps the fireball within a certain range. This means that if you want to cancel the fireball, that is do a second attack after it, you need to do it before he lets it go or even slightly after it is released which would give you more than enough time to block it or parry it and block the second attack ( fireballs have shit recovery and allow you to hit just about any attempt at one if you sit and wait for it to happen ) without the risk of missing a punish opportunity.

    The reason not a lot people can get into this game is because it's so different and requires you to delve into it more deeply than your typical fighter. There are very specific configurations to most match ups, though parry can negate that, but there are also some general boundaries to the deeper levels of the game that require parry. Like, for example, Ryu has a string of attack (as does most of the cast) where he can do a close attack follow up with a far mk, on hit or block, then end up at the perfect position to either recede slightly and be safe against most of the cast, ex fireball or low forward into whatever he wants and then he gets to start over. He can do this all day and you have to just block it and wait all day or you can notice it and parry out of there. Two of the options I stated allow him to cancel which can mess with your parry or force you to think further ahead and thus keeps you busy while he has the physical advantage of getting to push any buttons he wants which would allow him to force the situation to go however he wants it to (if he's experienced enough, anyway), and the second one gives him more options than simply far mk. He can go low if he thinks you've caught up with him, parry an attack you might consider doing, which was been narrowed by understanding and made more easily deduceable, or block and reversal with a fast super or something. And that's really not even all there is for him to do in that situation. It only gets more complicated when you weigh in the fact that you can "know he knows you know" and so on. And that's just one of the strings he has, there are more.

    Play third strike, it's a good game.
    Post edited by Dander on
    8tROOXi.png
  • yuukiyuuki Joined: Posts: 782
    edited August 2013
    SpiderMad wrote: »
    How do i decide which of those anti-airs to use? What you mean by stating both MK and close MK?

    How do I deal with Akuma's fireballs, as well as Kens who are really good and have a 2nd move after everything

    Ill give you a concise, straight forward answer instead of a long convoluted one.

    anti airs in this game have a similar but different application than most fight games (because anti air can be air parried)

    Depending on the situation, chuns normals such as back hp, close hk, st jab can be used. Other normals can be used but its situational, like the ones listed above.

    other options instead of doing a move for anti air include, parrying, walking under, dashing under, jumping back w/ parry, and blocking.

    As a general rule, watch what the best chun li players such as nuki, rikimaru, and mov do (preferably not outdated footage) to get an answer to questions like this.

    Fireballs can be parried, blocked, jumped over, or supered through depending on the super (chun houyokusen's start up goes through fireballs)

    I dont understand your question about ken.
    かかってきな。
  • TebboTebbo Play. Joined: Posts: 5,711
    maybe with ken he means his target combo?
    in which case just block...

    maybe he is letting off block because he isn't used to 3S.
    Play more.
  • SpiderMadSpiderMad I'm new to 3s, be nice and helpful to me =( Joined: Posts: 18
    yuuki wrote: »
    As a general rule, watch what the best chun li players such as nuki, rikimaru, and mov do (preferably not outdated footage) to get an answer to questions like this.
    I found this tournament for recent MOV

    and this video for recent Rikimaru (MOV seems better)

    Nuki only seems to have old stuff, but would you say old stuff isn't really that bad: or it is and the metagame just gets way better every year?

    The Ken question was just like how he's owning in this (I feel like the Chun gettin owned, and his fast attacks come right after u think the combos over).

  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    edited August 2013
    if you're new i wouldn't worry about how up to date the videos are. I've been playing for 8 years and I still learn a lot from videos from before I even started. If there were Nuki videos from the days of the dinosaurs they'd probably be sick as fuck

    although Nuki is probably the most well represented among recent 3s vid releases. Just check for Gamespot Versus Danisen videos on TheShend's channel and there should be a grip of recent, great Nuki footage
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • yuukiyuuki Joined: Posts: 782
    edited August 2013
    like pherai said, there's stuff in old videos that are good too but in general I'd say videos from 2008 and up are good to watch.

    why I say that is because I'm thinking of how in older videos chuns do stuff like anti air back hp x lighting legs (which is outdated IMO) or weak follow ups after houyokusen.
    かかってきな。
  • SpiderMadSpiderMad I'm new to 3s, be nice and helpful to me =( Joined: Posts: 18
    edited August 2013
    yuuki wrote: »
    in older videos chuns do stuff like anti air back hp x lighting legs (which is outdated IMO)
    how so?
  • DanderDander BANNED Joined: Posts: 7,227
    SpiderMad wrote: »
    yuuki wrote: »
    why I say that is because I'm thinking of how in older videos chuns do stuff like anti air back hp x lighting legs (which is outdated IMO)
    how so?

    because Japanese players don't jump into the back fierce set up.

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  • yuukiyuuki Joined: Posts: 782
    It's been awhile but I just remember the set ups themselves, and mix up after not seeming as strong before.

    however now that I think about it, you'll see some gimmick set ups that people rarely use now or don't use now (for example post houyokusen, knock twins down with jump rh and then dash under then as they quick stand)

    かかってきな。
  • DanderDander BANNED Joined: Posts: 7,227
    I guess sggk isn't as strong anymore as it used to be when it was first realized.
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  • pheraipherai LIVE FOREVER Joined: Posts: 11,887 mod
    I kinda feel like the strength of SGGK has always been exaggerated, but I'm sure the declining use of crouch tech has it being a bit weaker than it used to be
    pherai gouki dated gwen stefani in HighSchool. Thats why today she likes all things Japan. smokin.gif
  • SpiderMadSpiderMad I'm new to 3s, be nice and helpful to me =( Joined: Posts: 18
    edited August 2013
    I didn't understand any of that "(for example post houyokusen, knock twins down with jump rh and then dash under then as they quick stand)
    " which is also called "SGGK" for some reason?
  • DanderDander BANNED Joined: Posts: 7,227
    edited August 2013
    SpiderMad wrote: »
    I didn't understand any of that "(for example post houyokusen, knock twins down with jump rh and then dash under then as they quick stand)
    " which is also called "SGGK" for some reason?

    After the super, you super jump and hit them with a RH. When they land, if they roll, you can dash over them rolling and end up on the other side.

    SGGK, I'm not getting into it, there's a whole thread dedicated to it, but it's essentially doing one set of inputs and getting varying results. Usually, either hit confirm into cancellable attack of choice or kara-grab.

    You really just need a glossary of some sort. I don't know that we've made a thread like that on here.

    *rant*These boards typically cater to a certain kind of individual and one must conform to that individual or be assed out, but I tend to do as much as I can to help as I really just care about getting people to play this game.*/rant*
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