Applying corner pressure

CFotoCFoto Joined: Posts: 24
Just encountered some questions recently and would like to ask for some advice:
In Streetfighter, how do you apply pressure in corner?

1)What if the opponent is very proficient in doing anti-air / dp?
2)What are the key factors that trigger their panic mode and start risking unsafe moves to get out?

I began to notice match-up specific spacing lately and trying to get the hang of it, but unless I score a knock down to vortex set-ups (or a forward throw to corner) I don't know what to do.

Thanks

Comments

  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭✭
    1) Stop jumping at him, or using predictable attack patterns.
    2) Stay on the ground. There's no reason to jump at him since you have a positional advantage. Just keep him there and rely on your ground game and anti-airs to keep him in a bad spot.
  • ugo_2uugo_2u Joined: Posts: 3,584 ✭✭✭
    my goal here is not to tell you what to do or what not to do but I will try to explain what corner pressure is about.
    1. Getting an opponent in the corner negates the ability to "walk back" from your opponent, he has only two options, block or try to escape.
    2. you have the ability to walk in and out of his attack and that is scary.
    3. if he attempts to jump he risks getting anti aired, if he tries to walk he risk getting poked.

    Now you know. know the options your oponent has and do your best to counter them.
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  • BlackShinobiBlackShinobi Making moves Joined: Posts: 2,271 ✭✭✭
    Just encountered some questions recently and would like to ask for some advice:
    In Streetfighter, how do you apply pressure in corner?

    1)What if the opponent is very proficient in doing anti-air / dp?
    2)What are the key factors that trigger their panic mode and start risking unsafe moves to get out?

    I began to notice match-up specific spacing lately and trying to get the hang of it, but unless I score a knock down to vortex set-ups (or a forward throw to corner) I don't know what to do.

    Thanks
    Don't count on this, Everyone doesn't panic and throw out unsafe moves, expecting and waiting for it can cause you to lose focus on plying solid and start waiting for their screw up so you can capitalize.
    Focus on the fact that moving backward is no longer and option for them. Anticipate ways they may try to get out of the corner and try to counter them but, don't wait for or assume they will do something stupid just because they are cornered.
    Also the corner isn't free ground to jump in on people
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  • GordonsBeardGordonsBeard QCF+P Bad Stoned Joined: Posts: 379
    The corner is one of the more dangerous spots to try and jump in at them, because they have NO OPTION other than to take the hit, block, or retaliate - running away has been removed. The best advice is to go nuts with your most fun blockstrings - but do not forget what a valuable position they are in - don't overextend yourself and let them out of the corner. It's way more psychologically devastating if they spend their entire match with their back up against the wall.
  • TurboNewbieTurboNewbie Joined: Posts: 27
    So it is psychologically bad for the opponent, they cannot escape (I imagine Dhalsim would panic on a corner) So, just keep blockstringin him to death, antiairing and waiting for the combo opportunity.
    :):qcf::)
  • GordonsBeardGordonsBeard QCF+P Bad Stoned Joined: Posts: 379
    So it is psychologically bad for the opponent, they cannot escape (I imagine Dhalsim would panic on a corner) So, just keep blockstringin him to death, antiairing and waiting for the combo opportunity.
    Dhalsim comes equipped with a teleport however, so you need to be doubly careful to be ready to back away and punish the (inevitable) teleport quickly.
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,366 ✭✭✭
    Heaven forbid that you get cornered by Guile.
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭✭
    So it is psychologically bad for the opponent, they cannot escape (I imagine Dhalsim would panic on a corner) So, just keep blockstringin him to death, antiairing and waiting for the combo opportunity.

    It's not even about waiting for combo opportunities, it's about punishing Dhalsim's responses, since the corner severely limits his options and ranges.
    Dhalsim comes equipped with a teleport however, so you need to be doubly careful to be ready to back away and punish the (inevitable) teleport quickly.

    Anyone who's familiar with the Sim matchup knows to be aware of his optimal teleport opportunities and are able to punish it, or at least stop it, with st.jab or some other similar response in order to get the air reset, and go for the mixups. His teleport is also susceptible to option selects in certain situations. Plus, there are restrictions as to where Sim can teleport to based on the range between him and his opponent.
  • NecrotrophicNecrotrophic キコケン Joined: Posts: 1,922 ✭✭✭
    One nice trick in the corner is to anticipate the jump while really close, and hit them prior to jumping. This is actually dead simple, and you can usually do it 2-3 times in a row against average players, which leads to a stun or just big damage. Against good players, youll only get it once usually, but its still a good tool to have

    Basically, when you're close and you anticipate movement of any kind, throw out a good poking normal, for example st.hp with akuma or chun li
    this will knock them out of whatever theyre doing if you do it right, theyll usually panic and try to jump, and if you just did it again, youll knock them out of the jump too

    you pretty much just have to get a feel for it, but i swear ive done this upwards of 5 times in a row with chun li, people just assume that jumping or being offensive in general in the corner is a good idea, and both chun and akuma have very great options to shut that down, and expose the fact that these people have terrible defense.

    throw shenanigans are also amazing in the corner, I assume you play akuma

    so try this little sequence:

    throw in the corner
    walk back
    walk up
    as they get up, throw again
    walk back
    walk up
    as they get up ex hurricane kick
    walk back
    walk up
    something unexpected
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  • GordonsBeardGordonsBeard QCF+P Bad Stoned Joined: Posts: 379
    Yes if you've got a great walkspeed then getting your opponent into the corner can be a real nightmare for them - Balrog, Akuma, even Ken and his kara-throw. You end up training them to tech a throw and that's when you blast with the ex spinkick.
  • KikuichimonjiKikuichimonji Watch out, I know frame data Joined: Posts: 4,555 ✭✭✭
    http://sonichurricane.com/?p=852

    First rule of corner pressure: Don't let them out of the corner (at least not for free)

    Once you establish that, just play footsies. You can punish their whiffs and walk back and forth. They can't do shit.
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  • SubjectiveSubjective Joined: Posts: 171
    OK so what's the opposite of this question? I'm a 2D fighter noob and whenever I get cornered in 3S I get destroyed. I always guess the options wrong and get hit by overheads, lows, outpoked, etc. Other than not end up in the corner in the first place, what are your best options when cornered?
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭✭
    OK so what's the opposite of this question? I'm a 2D fighter noob and whenever I get cornered in 3S I get destroyed. I always guess the options wrong and get hit by overheads, lows, outpoked, etc. Other than not end up in the corner in the first place, what are your best options when cornered?

    A healthy mix of patience and observing your opponent's tendencies in the corner. Overheads can be blocked on reaction for the most part as long as you're ready for it, but you're going to have to guess once you're in that situation. Parrying on wake-up can be a risk unless your opponent shows that they favor doing low or mid meaty attacks. Ideally you would find a gap to either tech their throw, land a throw on them in order to escape the corner, or poke your opponent with a series or lows to push them back, giving you room to work with.
  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 5,254 ✭✭✭✭✭
    It's mostly depends on the characters involved, the time/health/meter situation, and your understanding of the opponent's habits. But basically there are three main approaches to corner combat from the perspective of the aggressor:
    1) Apply pressure
    2) Maintain position
    3) Ignore the opponent's situation and take advantage of the real estate behind you

    In SF2, zoning characters can perform option 2 using fireball traps (it can also be done in SFIV but it's harder). An opponent cannot take chip damage forever (constantly chipping at the opponent's health is also form of pressure), and eventually they will have to guess their way out by perform a risky escape move, or rely on you messing up. Characters without fireballs can still perform a variation of this if they have a good anti-air, and a move that can safely chip the opponent while allowing them to reset the corner game eg. Fei Long or Boxer in SSFIV. Fei can slowly chip at you with rekkas and force you to attempt a risky counter or escape. Boxer and chip you with safe dash punches and punish all your jumps etc. Note that when these characters have the life lead, there's no reason for them to chip damage pressure. The onus is on the opponent to try to escape the corner.

    Option 1 is usually employed by characters that have good mobility, get good frame advantage off safe attacks, and/or have strong mixups. Also, when time is running down an aggressor who is behind on life is more likely to take risks by attacking (there is a mindgame here of course). Dictator (M. Bison) is a good example of a character that has a really good corner pressure game. He doesn't do as well and Fei or Boxer at waging wars of attrition because his anti-air game is weaker, so it usually in his best interest to apply scissor-kick pressure. Even though they are good zoners, Juri and Guile and also apply strong corner rushdown pressure against certain characters because of the frame advantage they get off the projectiles and normals. Juri has the added advantage of having a more effective overhead, and not requiring charge for her pressure. Vanilla Sagat has a very good corner game. He can back off and zone you out with a very strong fireball/anti-air game, but he could also keep an opponent locked down using safe Tiger Knee pressure.

    Option 3 usually only comes into play when time is running down and you want to put as much distance between yourself and the opponent as possible in order to score a win by Time Out.

    For an example of how meter can affect the corner game, consider the situation between Ryu and a cornered Blanka in AE2012. When Blanka has meter, he can use EX Rainbow Ball to escape rushdown corner pressure. Ryu can use an option select to defeat this, but this will lose to Blanka's EX Vertical Ball. Ryu can try to bait the EX V. Ball and punish, but he loses momentum and risks Blanka escaping by doing a normal into EX Rainbow, or perhaps hopping right through him. In this scenario, it's better for Ryu to maintain a position where he can comfortably anti-air, and punish EX Rainbow with cr.hp. However, when Blanka does not have meter, Ryu can safely rush him down and Blanka's options are essentially limited to blocking (or risking an Ultra combo).

    Remember that even though a cornered the opponent is usually at a big disadvantage, if there's no pressure on them (in terms of life deficit), they have no reason to try to escape - you will need to give them a reason to try to escape the corner. Similarly, an opponent whose character has an easy escape from the corner (eg. teleport) would not usually be afraid of getting rushed down. And in some situations, an opponent might be completely comfortable by playing from the corner. This usually happens if they have a life lead and your character has a tough time getting in on them.

    As for what triggers "panic mode", it's usually a combination of a life deficit and clock that is running down. Good players don't usually panic easily, but in general most players in that situation will tend to take more/bigger risks. Regarding opponents with a good Anti-Air, you should avoid jumping at opponents in general unless it's a punish situation. And when they are cornered, there's even less of a reason for you to jump at them unless it's a knockdown setup or mixup.
  • bkfst_sausagebkfst_sausage ST / SRK2k3 OG Joined: Posts: 2,802
    Apply the Snackish Special

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  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,553 ✭✭✭✭
    I'm amazed at how easily and predictably he can land U2s and walk up SPDs.
  • TheBlackHombreTheBlackHombre Aesthetic Joined: Posts: 1,293 ✭✭✭
    The act of nothing is pressure. Its the same scenario when you have the major life lead and your opponent is desperate to make a come back (because he has to). Why go in, jump, or take any risks? You know your opponent is gonna be desperate for that escape or jump in, so just stay outside his poke range, whiff punish, and trap him. This match is a perfect example of that.
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