Dealing with Jack-X (Discussion and Guide)

Joe_LewisJoe_Lewis w8wut?Joined: Posts: 298
This "thread" is to do a write up, as descriptive as I can, about Jack-X

I want to help inform people better so that they don't run into him and get mauled for no reason.

Jack is THE best zoning character in the game as well as in the top 10 on a lot of top players tier lists.

I want to explain this character so you guys can get a better understanding of him so that you can actually start learning something rather than just playing theory fighter with him. This write up is going to be long. Use Control F for stuff

I am going to update this regularly instead of making a HUGE write up and making it overwhelming for some. Maybe once a day Ill do stuff? Please take my poll so I know if this is worth anyone's while.

1. Jack-X Overview: Character Analysis
Jack-X is something that a fighting game has not seen in a very long time. A character with such Strong Zoning, Counter Zoning, and Defensive options, have not been seen since maybe MVC2. These three things are what make Jack-X overall, a hassle to deal with.
In some ways, imagine C.Viper, Sagat, and Vanilla MVC3 Sentinel and Dr.Doom did some anime type stuff and combined their forces and built a Robot designed in their likeliness, eliminating a lot of their flaws;
You get Jack-X. He has:
The damage output comparative to Sentinel
The momentum shifting ability of C.Viper
The Zoning compatibilities of Sagat
Space control of C.Viper and Sagat
The "safe" options of Dr.Doom
Team Synergy of Sentinel and Dr.Doom
Combine this with some pseudo mobility/runaway moves as well as special moves that have properties UNHEARD OF for their use, Hes a wrecking force.

What makes him a "normal" character is that will all of these strong attributes he has a handful of glaring weakness. His overall size makes him vulnerable to a lot of interesting mix up situations as well as alternate side cross-ups. Characters who outclass him in general mobility can also give this ROBOT a lot of trouble since he has a lot of comparisons to a sniper; Deadly from a far, with limited to no up close options. Also, he has a hard time dealing with characters with strong priority since even with all of his powerful tools, his priority is only average.

Jack-X also, with all of these things in mind, has an incredibly steep learning curve in order to fully use him to his full potential, as well as dealing with him. If you run into a strong Jack-X player, he will most likely know a lot more than you may even know about your own character and have character exclusive situations that will most likely get you flustered.

He is powerful, incredibly powerful, however he is still a character with his own weakness'





2. Jack-X Defensive Strategies
Rather then go straight into stuff, lets look the attributes of Jack-Xs best/go to defensive moves.
Surprise Attack (Siesmo)
SA is a two hit low that hits on various potions of the screen based on its strength.
LP: 1 Square in front of him (At his feet)
MP: 5 Squares in front of him (In between squares four and five covering both squares)
HP 7 Squares in front of him only covering square 7.
These moves are NOT positive on block however, due to the range that they can be performed at and the push back, it makes then very hard to punish. Realistically, the only version that can be punished on activation is the LP version. Its somewhere in the rage of -4 and -5 on block. As a Cody player, he can punish the close version because he has a godlike cr.LK. However some characters even with fast moves, like Cammy, cant do anything about any version unless she is literally right at his feet.

This move is a physical attack and came be used to switch cancel.

Anti Air Attack (DP)
AAA is one of the best and most versatile anti airs in the game. Each version has different uses. I will go over them. Keep in mind all of these moves ARE PROJECTILES.
LP: Combo Extender (This is due to its ability to hit the opponant in the air (For a juggle) 2-3 times. This property extends to the other DPs. For examples sake, after a Launcher, a Jack player can connect TWO AAA's just as long as the first one is the LP version,. This also puts the opposing player right at their feet. This move is also safe on block (0 on block).
MP: Invincibility to everything except for throws. This is his Go-To anti air which can lead to a lot of other defensive options, This is the one which I will be explaining into much detail later.
HP: Full Body invincibility to everything however, has the latest startup. This is mostly used to combo extend. However, it does have other uses.

Swing Punch/Super
This is Jacks chargable super attack. The attack has no difference in strength of button use meaning all versions (LP-HP) are the same. The "normal" version can be used as a very late anti air however, little to no jacks use this. His Super however, is one of the best supers in the game and does 310 damage and starts up somewhere around 6-7 frames. This move can be used to Anti Air and hits 6 Squares in front of him.This super has projectile invincibility.

Charge Attack/Hardrive
Charge Attack is a move used in certain combos as well as having usability in other places, such as defensively in ways of "runaway". Each version has different properties

LK: Charges him 4 1/2 squares in front of him.
MK: Charges him 6 squares forward in front of himself
HK: Charges him FULL SCREEN also has 1 hit of armor
EX: Same as HK
All of these moves can be interrupted or the ability to throw Jack out of them.

Steam/Flight Mode
Jack has a flight mode similar to Viper. It allows him to float in the for a short period of time. During this time he has 1 armor hit. Jack can only travel in the direction where he jumped. Meaning, if he jumps backwards, he can only flight backwards. This move can be cancelled into a "butt stop" like move. The length of this flight also varies by the direction of the jump, as well as the point of activation.

Crouching Light Punch
Cancel-able normal move with 7f start up. This move hits Mid with no overhead properties

Standing HP
Non cancel-able normal move that hits high.

Jump LP
A non cancel-able normal jumping attack

Standing MP
Non cancel-able normal attack

Jump MP
A non cancelable jumping attack which hits up to 2 times in the air.


Jack-Xs flowchart is to keep the opponent out with Suprise attack and Anti-Air them when they jump. Pretty basic right? What makes this so strong?

Lets break down the mathmaticlly.

The average health of a character is 1000.
Suprise Attack does 70 damage for each hit. 70x2=140
One Anti Air Attack does 100.
On Block, Suprise Attack does 17 for each hit; 17x2=34.
Super does 310 damage.

In the race to 1000, Jacks damage based on the moves objective is highly in his favor. For a lot of team combinations, If the Point character (if not Jack) does any type of damage from anything, this drops Jack-X's total requirement of hitting the opponent down dramatically, making Jacks total required output smaller.

The smaller the required output, the better for him. Since Jack ALSO has 1150 health the overall requirement of winning the round for the Jack-X is highly in his favor via Timeout of just a raw V, especially if a strong point character, like Kazuya, has been bullying the opponents two characters for a decent amount of the round. If Jack-X comes in and Kazuya does 300 damage to each character, Jack only has to deal 700 damage roughly(which mathematically, is each of his go to moves at least once.)
Pretty ass backwards right?

Anyway; Flowchart; Thats what we are talking about here. All that other crap is theroy.

Lets break down his strategy by each of the ranges, Close, Mid, Far. LETS DO IT.

Far/Max Range
At far range, Jack has the luxury of throwing out full screen Suprise Attacks(We will call this SA from now on). The Risk is the opponant advancing off of a whiff siesmo however, this risk is incredibly minimal since no character can punish a SA from full screen (Except for say Ryu, with Super or something). This range is a range where Jack-X wants his opponent, out of his face.

Mid/Range
This is where it gets complicated; This is also where he a lot of tools at his disposal. Mid Range is where your opponant, more often than not want to jump. This is due to the fact that SA stops becoming a grantee; SA becomes a guess at mid range. However, he has a hand full of tools that allow him to turn this guess into a guarantee- LOW LP.
Crouching LP, since its cancelable allows Jack to cancel cr.CP into SA. Jack can use the LP to check if their opponent is staying on the ground, then tag them with SA, keeping them grounded while still doing damage. Enough of this combination can create (or some) the irrational fear of geting chipped to death, causeing the opponant to jump at Jack. A character jumping in on Jack-X at close range is a risk, but a risk highly in Jack-X's favor. This is because the Jack-X player wants the opponent to jump at this range! A connected AAA on a jump in allows Jack-X to jump back, use flight mode, and the Hidden Temple race continues (And this artifact is all the way at the shrine of the Silver monkey, no one knows how to put that stupid thing together).
Crouching LP also allows the Jack-X user to cancel into his chargeable swing punch, back dash, and get better positioning. This may also bait the opponant to jump becuase the starting animations of Swing Punch and SA look very similar, leading to a free AAA.
Crouching LP also has too Tekken Chains at his use; LP xx HP and LP xx MP, MP. Both of these Tekken chains are good on block of positioned properlly and allow Jack to create some extra space for him to think.

(End of Part 2; I will finish this up later)



2. Jack-X Defensive Strategies
3. Approaching Jack-X
3. Approaching Jack-X
4. OKI vs Jack-X
4. OKI vs. Jack-X
5. Zoners vs. Jack-X
5. Zoners vs. Jack-X
6. Grapplers vs Jack-X
6. Grapplers vs. Jack-X
7. Melee Characters vs. Jack-X
7. Melee Characters vs. Jack-X
8.
8otb...
Stop sending me XBL hate mail when I beat you; It's getting tiresome now.
·

Comments

  • therooktherook I Challenge My Fate! Joined: Posts: 3,458 ✭✭✭
    I do not agree with this match up list....someone Call Spooky and fix it.
    SFIV: Guy, Cody, E.Ryu, Poison.
    Gundam Extreme: Wing Zero(TV)
    Tekken: Lili, Asuka, A.King, Julia/Jaycee, Kunimitsu.
    SC: Taki/Natsu
    VF5FS: Eileen, El Blaze, Aoi.
    ·
  • Fergus2k8Fergus2k8 Let's Rock! Joined: Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭
    PM'ed you with my opinion on Jack vs Asuka.
    SFIV - Poison/Rose/Sakura |TTT2 - Asuka + Julia/Jun/Miharu
    Guilty Gear - May

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  • Dollar_bill$Dollar_bill$ Joined: Posts: 111
    damn! ken gets shitted on by jack this hard? i may reconsider using him in 2013.
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  • Juri_kills_friend!Juri_kills_friend! Leader of the Lili Army Joined: Posts: 2,032
    MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Only one character can stop lili...mother fucking gief piece of shit asshole st. mp for 4 mother fucker! Yeah Joe knows why Lili wins that so cleanly. MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
    JOIN THE LILI ARMY! FOFOFOFOFOFOFO!
    SFXTekken: Ken x Lili (Money Inc) and maybe juri and sakura, and rolento, and maybe nina too!
    2012; Majors Gone to: Winter Brawl, Civil War 4, Capcom 25th Anniversary NYC
    Lili Reset Guide & Video Guide by yours truly JKF
    ·
  • silphsilph Joined: Posts: 267
    How to deal with Jack-X
    Here's what you'll need!
    • Gasoline
    • Matches
    • Arcade Stick
    STEP 1!
    Douse your stick in gasoline. Don't be shy, really pour it on!
    STEP 2!
    Strike match.
    STEP 3!
    Set fire to your arcade stick! (This kills the stick)
    STEP 4!
    Walk away and try your best not to cry!
    ·
  • WantonxWantonx Mooseknuckle Sammich Joined: Posts: 2,111 ✭✭
    This should be interesting. I didn't realize that many people hated playing against him. I guess that's why I hear "fuck that asshole" through my tv speakers sometimes. I thought it was one of the characters speaking :)

    I don't have a good answer for your poll. It is a good writeup so far though. I picked him up to learn how to fight against him and just ended up sticking with it since he is a bad ass robot
    Having seen Cool Runnings a bunch of years ago, I consider myself a certified bobsledding expert
    XBL : Racetract
    ·
  • YuriwaYuriwa I've got time. You up for a rematch? Joined: Posts: 88
    What I learned from this thread is that Jack-X is a normal character with both strengths and weaknesses, and that the OP loves hyperboles.
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  • DarkphyreDarkphyre single-minded Joined: Posts: 1,495 ✭✭✭✭✭
    What I learned from this thread is that Jack-X is a normal character with both strengths and weaknesses, and that the OP loves hyperboles.
    ^ This, though I'll wait for the actual infos before judging this thread :3
    Steam/PSN: Darkphyre
    XBL/GFWL: Shaniril
    SFxT: Juri, Asuka, Lili, Nina, Alisa
    BBCP: Izayoi, Bullet, MU-13
    www.youtube.com/Darkphyre
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  • BadIntentBadIntent Joined: Posts: 176
    I'm interested to see what kinds of stuff you come up with Joe_Lewis. One thing though; before you write up anything about oki against Jack-X, I'd like to see it talked about as if it's 2013. Right now one of the reasons Jack-X is so tough to deal with is because after lose half your life fighting through his seismos and anti-air, he can just DP tag cancel once you finally get in to apply pressure. It's safe vs a lot of the cast and even when it's not, the risk reward is in his favor with that much life and the attacker is going to be really desperate to get any offense going. And if you do ever knock him down, he can roll away from safe jumps or ROLL INTO YOU and DP tag cancel. Since both of his main escape tools are completely unsafe now (and DP tag should now lead to both characters getting hit), I think it would be good to keep that in mind when talking about which setups work best on him.
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  • Joe_LewisJoe_Lewis w8wut? Joined: Posts: 298
    OK!

    Thanks to some of you for the support and the odd excitement. To take suggestions that some of you told me to do, im going to try (keep in mind I say TRY) to put up two a day. Unfortunately I cant just copy and paste the articles from my Ipad to my Labtop since my wifi key is broken. Once I get it fixed this process should be must faster.

    Anyway some notes:

    Part 2 (Defensive strategies) should be up in portions today. I plan on getting the Moves/Attributes up before I go to class today.
    I forgot I was on SRK, I'm going to omit anything that expresses my opinion IE, Match UP chart. This will prevent any unintentional bias.
    Surprised someone on SRK knew what a hyperbole was.

    Happy reading guys
    8otb...
    Stop sending me XBL hate mail when I beat you; It's getting tiresome now.
    ·
  • Juri_kills_friend!Juri_kills_friend! Leader of the Lili Army Joined: Posts: 2,032
    What I learned from this thread is that Jack-X is a normal character with both strengths and weaknesses, and that the OP loves hyperboles.
    and that a little rich girl rocks the fuck outta him.
    JOIN THE LILI ARMY! FOFOFOFOFOFOFO!
    SFXTekken: Ken x Lili (Money Inc) and maybe juri and sakura, and rolento, and maybe nina too!
    2012; Majors Gone to: Winter Brawl, Civil War 4, Capcom 25th Anniversary NYC
    Lili Reset Guide & Video Guide by yours truly JKF
    ·
  • echelonNYKechelonNYK Kara SPD LuLz Joined: Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭✭
    I didn't know this many hated going against Jack. My Jack is semi free :(
    ·
  • HertogHertog Joined: Posts: 242
    could you make a guide like this for Julia or the Mishima's

    I can handle Jack-x with ease.
    SSF4:AE Blanka,Guile, T.Hawk and Hakan

    SFxT: Blanka, Jack-X, King, Rolento, Guile and Megaman/Kuma for the trololololol
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  • Intuitive2011Intuitive2011 Cr.Mk XX Hadoken Joined: Posts: 2,851 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I beat a A+ Jack today with my Gief. Am I good, or is he a fraud?
    http://zeroisbetterthanwesker.blogspot.co.uk/


    "Often times, a loss will strengthen and benefit the player more than a win, so I would say don't be afraid of losing and keeping competing." ~Infiltration
    Your signature has been modifed, please read the rules.
    ·
  • WantonxWantonx Mooseknuckle Sammich Joined: Posts: 2,111 ✭✭
    He's a fraud
    Having seen Cool Runnings a bunch of years ago, I consider myself a certified bobsledding expert
    XBL : Racetract
    ·
  • Intuitive2011Intuitive2011 Cr.Mk XX Hadoken Joined: Posts: 2,851 ✭✭✭✭✭
    He's a fraud
    Damn, and here's me feeling myself. I knew something was wrong. A+ my ass.
    http://zeroisbetterthanwesker.blogspot.co.uk/


    "Often times, a loss will strengthen and benefit the player more than a win, so I would say don't be afraid of losing and keeping competing." ~Infiltration
    Your signature has been modifed, please read the rules.
    ·
  • WantonxWantonx Mooseknuckle Sammich Joined: Posts: 2,111 ✭✭
    You're still good, he just sucks
    Having seen Cool Runnings a bunch of years ago, I consider myself a certified bobsledding expert
    XBL : Racetract
    ·
  • Joe_LewisJoe_Lewis w8wut? Joined: Posts: 298
    Ok Guys. Im gonna start putting up the rest of Part 2 (which is really long) and part three over the course of today.
    8otb...
    Stop sending me XBL hate mail when I beat you; It's getting tiresome now.
    ·
  • Juri_kills_friend!Juri_kills_friend! Leader of the Lili Army Joined: Posts: 2,032
    helpful guide. But can be summed up as this.
    Play lili
    Pair her with jack-x on point
    ???
    YAAAAAAH!
    You win =3
    JOIN THE LILI ARMY! FOFOFOFOFOFOFO!
    SFXTekken: Ken x Lili (Money Inc) and maybe juri and sakura, and rolento, and maybe nina too!
    2012; Majors Gone to: Winter Brawl, Civil War 4, Capcom 25th Anniversary NYC
    Lili Reset Guide & Video Guide by yours truly JKF
    ·
  • therooktherook I Challenge My Fate! Joined: Posts: 3,458 ✭✭✭
    helpful guide. But can be summed up as this.
    Play lili
    Pair her with jack-x on point
    ???
    YAAAAAAH!
    You win =3
    I agree with this....*votes Juri_kills_friend! for President*
    SFIV: Guy, Cody, E.Ryu, Poison.
    Gundam Extreme: Wing Zero(TV)
    Tekken: Lili, Asuka, A.King, Julia/Jaycee, Kunimitsu.
    SC: Taki/Natsu
    VF5FS: Eileen, El Blaze, Aoi.
    ·
  • GemakaiGemakai HadouKen what Others HadouKan't Joined: Posts: 828 ✭✭
    helpful guide. But can be summed up as this.
    Play lili
    Pair her with jack-x on point
    ???
    YAAAAAAH!
    You win =3
    yea... that's sort of how it went for my Elena/Hugo team.

    -Hugo's not very good at a distance and is getting worse all around...
    -Jack-X is still pretty good both pre and post patch
    -Like Jack-X anyway.
    -???
    -OMG! THE DAMAGE AND CONTROL!
    BBCS:EX: Hakumen, Noel, Bang, Hazama | USF4: Vega, Makoto, Elena, Yun, Sakura | UMvC3: Felicia/Doom/Strider
    SFxT: Elena, Paul, Dudley, Vega, Asuka, Law, Julia, Bryan | P4A: Naoto, Aigis, Kanji, Shadow Labrys
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  • SGLeroySGLeroy Bob Cop Joined: Posts: 109
    I personally find jack-X easy to deal with, even when playing 15k+ bp users who have been maining him since the dlc launched, jack has some large holes in his character and he is generally a straight forward and predictable character, that plus bryan is like a 8-2 match-up against jack IMO, atleast, was.
    ·
  • echelonNYKechelonNYK Kara SPD LuLz Joined: Posts: 1,173 ✭✭✭✭
    Jack eats Balrog's lunch. I'm just saying.
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  • J0E LEWISJ0E LEWIS Always Godlike Joined: Posts: 800
    Hey guys I've been really busy with real life crap but I hope to get more of this soon...


    Sent from my iPad2 using Tapatalk
    I am a member of Always Godlike.
    You can find more information about our Team what what we do at.
    alwaysgodlike.com
    ·
  • Fergus2k8Fergus2k8 Let's Rock! Joined: Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭
    Ahhhhhhh multiple Joe Lewises.
    SFIV - Poison/Rose/Sakura |TTT2 - Asuka + Julia/Jun/Miharu
    Guilty Gear - May

    ·
  • www_zeeshan_dewww_zeeshan_de Joined: Posts: 65
    maybe i am someone lucky cos i do play with gief, and i think even if its difficult, its still possible to win vs a good jack-x with zangief. if you cannot defeat jack-x, try with zangief. imo, zangief is one of the strongest in this game, if only you know how to play him.
    ·
  • VegamanVegaman Soak in your own blood! Joined: Posts: 3,570 ✭✭
    maybe i am someone lucky cos i do play with gief, and i think even if its difficult, its still possible to win vs a good jack-x with zangief. if you cannot defeat jack-x, try with zangief. imo, zangief is one of the strongest in this game, if only you know how to play him.
    vids or it didnt happen
    "Nothing cheaper than something free."
    "You must wait at least 28623 seconds before performing this action."
    Jun 16, 2011 -- 12:28PM, DarthEnderX wrote:
    Makoto is about to have the best day ever.
    ·
  • rokninroknin Keeps Trying Joined: Posts: 4,624 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ahhhhhhh multiple Joe Lewises.

    Yeah that confuses the heck out of me too lol.
    ~ aka "ninRok" ~
    SFxT - Juri x Cammy/ Julia x Law | Smash - Greninja / ZSS / ROB
    youtube | soundcloud | tumblr
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  • flyingcloud11flyingcloud11 Rock'in the best Joined: Posts: 305
    maybe i am someone lucky cos i do play with gief, and i think even if its difficult, its still possible to win vs a good jack-x with zangief. if you cannot defeat jack-x, try with zangief. imo, zangief is one of the strongest in this game, if only you know how to play him.
    By play, you mean doing jab jab chain to abc? Then I'm pretty sure everyone knows how to play him lol. QUICK! mash out a lariat when you're being pressured lol.
    MrWhiteProductions.png
    ·
  • VegamanVegaman Soak in your own blood! Joined: Posts: 3,570 ✭✭
    By play, you mean doing jab jab chain to abc? Then I'm pretty sure everyone knows how to play him lol. QUICK! mash out a lariat when you're being pressured lol.
    that works against gold crowns. i have video evidence to proove it
    "Nothing cheaper than something free."
    "You must wait at least 28623 seconds before performing this action."
    Jun 16, 2011 -- 12:28PM, DarthEnderX wrote:
    Makoto is about to have the best day ever.
    ·
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