2015 UMVC3 SRK Tier/Theory Discussion. 7/10 First Page Tumblr: Power of snapback, Future power teams

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  • WorstPlayerWorstPlayer Calm Yourself Joined: Posts: 4,918
    MILF wrote: »
    Rokmode wrote: »
    Tron could have 800k and still be the hardest to kill because of her stupid fucking body

    worse than shuma's imo

    Another reason why they are besties

    I combo Shuma just fine, Tron too.....
    Funny, Thor/Dok is actually not as bad of a combination as it seems. My fellow Brodok rocked Thor/Dok/Doom the other day.

    Side note....Strange/Dorm/Rocket are strangely (get it) a motherfucker to fight.

    do Thor + modok have any incoming unblockable?

    Good question, I'll Jibjab next time I see him. He hit me with some retarded ish the other day over and over. Do you know that THOR can actually use purification really well?
  • LTPLTP Joined: Posts: 832
    LTP wrote: »
    Honestly I just feel feel that Dorm/Doom controls matchups better than Strange/Doom but that may just be that he feels more natural to me. (Which is hilarious because I play a rush down MODOK.) In all honesty even MODOK/Vergil/Doom kills off of most confirms and at best you get jammed. If you're a machine like my sparring partner with infinites its a FACT. DOK really doesn't need two major screen control assists. He only needs missiles.

    DOK/Morri/Doom has an insane amount of pluses going for it
    DOK/DOOM/Vergil is self explanatory
    If you want team asshole DOK?

    This is my boys wonky ass team, but he got infinites
    DOK/DOOM/HAGGAR -
    DOK/Dorm/HAGGAR -
    It's hard for me to say whether or not Dok/Dorm/Doom controls matchups better than Dok/Doom/Strange or Dok/Strange/Doom, but Dorm helps cover the more important ones better. HBR into Chaotic Flame punishes Spiral Swords and Dorm has a better time dealing with Morrigan than Strange. However, in terms of being a MODOK centered team, I believe that Dok/Doom/Strange delivers more. You get a projectile counter super that you can DHC into, an underutilized crossover counter punish tool in the form of air SoV, and you get a better selection of assists (Bolts and Eye vs Dark Hole). Both Bolts and Eye extend combos nicely and let you connect jamming bombs using only those assists (Dark Hole as well). Bolts is obviously great in neutral, and Eye is much better in neutral than Dark Hole, since it persists and eats up projectiles. Eye is such a great assist for keeping characters that want to get in out. One unique benefit of Dark Hole is that it's one of the best assists for setting up unblockables midscreen.

    Dok/Doom/Vergil and Dok/Doom/Haggar are both great Dok teams as well. Dok/Morri/Doom is also a great team, but I personally don't really like it much, as it's a team built around Morrigan, not Dok. If you use missiles on that team to get a hit with Dok, this tends to be in a situation where you'll be using j.S in your confirm, meaning that you can't really go for anything in the followup combo except for a TAC to Morrigan or setup Morrigan with AV, if you have the meter. TACs aren't bad, but I'd prefer to just have a combo that kills without it or at least be able to throw in a jamming bomb in any situation.

    I actually don't use J.S as my primary confirm very often but then again that's partiallly because I use my the turn around in the air technique that Mixup mentioned. I never was a huge fan of S as my confirm because I kind of stink at my kill combos that use S in the beginning. I've had great success really on my staggered DOK staircase. It's pretty easy, commonly looks like baby kicks, to B, to H, air dash H, flight H, air dash H to ground.

    Anyway I think Darkhole is excellent for a DOK that plays more midscreen with an aggressive stance. Unblockable setups are way too long ignored or even attempted by the few DOK players I know. I've been integrating a lot of them into my gameplay and it really changes his game. I'll agree that bolts/SOV gives more neutral control (for just about everyone in the game) but I prefer the option of the Stalking flame DHC to the projectile counter. Bolts is good in some matchups but in others I think he's out there too long. When Metroid (not that he's the best DOK by any stretch) used him he'd get him killed calling him to much.

    On DOK/MORRI/DOOM I disagree. People will go out of their way to get through DOK and get to Morrigan which keeps DOK alive longer. If you've got a great DOK this creates a debacle for them. Also Morrigan gives DOK some great DHC options most importantly an invincible DHC. Now besides the infinite DOK has if you JAM a character and set it up so they fall into Astral Vision jammed? Its just way to sexy to ignore. Also Harmonizer allows for HBR shenanigans that most people haven't experimented with Hidden Missiles. I think it's just as much a DOK team as Morrigan team. It's really a really, really solid team. I personally run it with Shadow Blade but maybe it is a Morrigan team people just fear my DOK more LOL!

    In all honesty though I'm a huge fan of starring Morrigan first for MORR/DOK/DOOM. I get my TAC in and load up MAX POWER. Having bullet hell with a fully loaded DOK in the middle is ridiculous.
    Can you explain further on how you use the air turn around technique for air to air confirms? From what I've looked at, things similar to the air to air confirm you have listed aren't any better than just using j.S from the get go in terms of HSD, though you obviously get a bit more flexibility combo wise, depending on what assists you are running. The (j.S, add, j.L, st.L) confirm that saves the groundbounce is as optimized as it gets, but it's tricky.

    I agree that more Doks should go for unblockables when they are running the right assists. I'd love to see more cr.H hopping too ((cr.H, jump, addf)xN). It's so good at keeping Dok's pressure game going.

    Dok/Morrigan/Doom is definitely feels like a Morrigan team rather than a Dok team to me, and I did play it for a while. It's certainly solid and has great neutral, but once you get a hit, you aren't always guaranteed to get a kill without a TAC or a jamming bomb. As for something like jamming a character and putting them up against astral vision, it just seems unnecessary to me. Either you're burning two meters to set that up, or you are up against a incoming character who is jammed. It's easier to just do a jamming bomb + big barrier reset or a jam and snap, and get the same result. In any case, I'd love to see the Central Park BRODOKs at the D&B tournament on stream lol.
    UMvC3: MODOK/Doom/Strange
    P4AU: S.Naoto, Adachi
    YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/MythicVerbosity
  • WorstPlayerWorstPlayer Calm Yourself Joined: Posts: 4,918
    LTP wrote: »
    LTP wrote: »
    Honestly I just feel feel that Dorm/Doom controls matchups better than Strange/Doom but that may just be that he feels more natural to me. (Which is hilarious because I play a rush down MODOK.) In all honesty even MODOK/Vergil/Doom kills off of most confirms and at best you get jammed. If you're a machine like my sparring partner with infinites its a FACT. DOK really doesn't need two major screen control assists. He only needs missiles.

    DOK/Morri/Doom has an insane amount of pluses going for it
    DOK/DOOM/Vergil is self explanatory
    If you want team asshole DOK?

    This is my boys wonky ass team, but he got infinites
    DOK/DOOM/HAGGAR -
    DOK/Dorm/HAGGAR -
    It's hard for me to say whether or not Dok/Dorm/Doom controls matchups better than Dok/Doom/Strange or Dok/Strange/Doom, but Dorm helps cover the more important ones better. HBR into Chaotic Flame punishes Spiral Swords and Dorm has a better time dealing with Morrigan than Strange. However, in terms of being a MODOK centered team, I believe that Dok/Doom/Strange delivers more. You get a projectile counter super that you can DHC into, an underutilized crossover counter punish tool in the form of air SoV, and you get a better selection of assists (Bolts and Eye vs Dark Hole). Both Bolts and Eye extend combos nicely and let you connect jamming bombs using only those assists (Dark Hole as well). Bolts is obviously great in neutral, and Eye is much better in neutral than Dark Hole, since it persists and eats up projectiles. Eye is such a great assist for keeping characters that want to get in out. One unique benefit of Dark Hole is that it's one of the best assists for setting up unblockables midscreen.

    Dok/Doom/Vergil and Dok/Doom/Haggar are both great Dok teams as well. Dok/Morri/Doom is also a great team, but I personally don't really like it much, as it's a team built around Morrigan, not Dok. If you use missiles on that team to get a hit with Dok, this tends to be in a situation where you'll be using j.S in your confirm, meaning that you can't really go for anything in the followup combo except for a TAC to Morrigan or setup Morrigan with AV, if you have the meter. TACs aren't bad, but I'd prefer to just have a combo that kills without it or at least be able to throw in a jamming bomb in any situation.

    I actually don't use J.S as my primary confirm very often but then again that's partiallly because I use my the turn around in the air technique that Mixup mentioned. I never was a huge fan of S as my confirm because I kind of stink at my kill combos that use S in the beginning. I've had great success really on my staggered DOK staircase. It's pretty easy, commonly looks like baby kicks, to B, to H, air dash H, flight H, air dash H to ground.

    Anyway I think Darkhole is excellent for a DOK that plays more midscreen with an aggressive stance. Unblockable setups are way too long ignored or even attempted by the few DOK players I know. I've been integrating a lot of them into my gameplay and it really changes his game. I'll agree that bolts/SOV gives more neutral control (for just about everyone in the game) but I prefer the option of the Stalking flame DHC to the projectile counter. Bolts is good in some matchups but in others I think he's out there too long. When Metroid (not that he's the best DOK by any stretch) used him he'd get him killed calling him to much.

    On DOK/MORRI/DOOM I disagree. People will go out of their way to get through DOK and get to Morrigan which keeps DOK alive longer. If you've got a great DOK this creates a debacle for them. Also Morrigan gives DOK some great DHC options most importantly an invincible DHC. Now besides the infinite DOK has if you JAM a character and set it up so they fall into Astral Vision jammed? Its just way to sexy to ignore. Also Harmonizer allows for HBR shenanigans that most people haven't experimented with Hidden Missiles. I think it's just as much a DOK team as Morrigan team. It's really a really, really solid team. I personally run it with Shadow Blade but maybe it is a Morrigan team people just fear my DOK more LOL!

    In all honesty though I'm a huge fan of starring Morrigan first for MORR/DOK/DOOM. I get my TAC in and load up MAX POWER. Having bullet hell with a fully loaded DOK in the middle is ridiculous.
    Can you explain further on how you use the air turn around technique for air to air confirms? From what I've looked at, things similar to the air to air confirm you have listed aren't any better than just using j.S from the get go in terms of HSD, though you obviously get a bit more flexibility combo wise, depending on what assists you are running. The (j.S, add, j.L, st.L) confirm that saves the groundbounce is as optimized as it gets, but it's tricky.

    I agree that more Doks should go for unblockables when they are running the right assists. I'd love to see more cr.H hopping too ((cr.H, jump, addf)xN). It's so good at keeping Dok's pressure game going.

    Dok/Morrigan/Doom is definitely feels like a Morrigan team rather than a Dok team to me, and I did play it for a while. It's certainly solid and has great neutral, but once you get a hit, you aren't always guaranteed to get a kill without a TAC or a jamming bomb. As for something like jamming a character and putting them up against astral vision, it just seems unnecessary to me. Either you're burning two meters to set that up, or you are up against a incoming character who is jammed. It's easier to just do a jamming bomb + big barrier reset or a jam and snap, and get the same result. In any case, I'd love to see the Central Park BRODOKs at the D&B tournament on stream lol.

    Well the DOK morri drop comes from HPB from SJ into astral, into soul drain loops I believe. Jibjab is my resident lab monster who breaks DOK all day. He's the only DOK that I know that does the damn DOK j.H rom and he developed the DOK staircase too. I'm doing a pretty poor job of explaining things as usual. Kind of reminds me of me going hey Bauser I think DOK can chain stuff after HBR and then Bauser starts chaining 5 supers together LOL! I personally gave up on the team because astral fireballs were to demanding for me. I try to do the DOK infinite still because well.....it's DOK :)

    Jumping D+H is kind of a big deal for DOKS along with cube confirms.

    I'm trying to get at least SOME member of the CPC out to the tournament. It's tough because it's a Friday night and everyone has significants to answer too. Mine is cool as shit so it's what it is.
  • serpentaurusserpentaurus just watching Joined: Posts: 4,525
    Thor can use purification but liberation is where it's at.
    umvc3: Thor / Dr.Strange / Ammy - Thor / Dorm / Doom - Wesker / Dr.Strange / Vergil - ssf4: Vega
  • Merkyl999xMerkyl999x Crazy X-23 Guy Joined: Posts: 2,210
    Purification is actually pretty beastly for Thor. Mixup blew me up pretty hard with it this weekend.
    UMvC3: Magneto(EMD)/ X-23(CS)/Dante(JS)
    300%, Welcome to America.
    R.I.P. Iron Man/Rocket Raccoon
  • legostepperlegostepper mvc2 and street fighter are relevant to umvc3 Joined: Posts: 366
    Mixup plays Thor? Maybe Thor can actually win CEO.
    UMVC3 Team: Evil Guile/Squidward/Spoderman aka ESS
  • WorstPlayerWorstPlayer Calm Yourself Joined: Posts: 4,918
    Well Jibjab was trying to show me the benefits of purification for MODOK/THOR/DORM. Like I said,
    if I can get dude out this Friday and he doesn't get all "Fuck these kids" you might be in for a treat with
    his whack assed teams LOL.
  • discovigilantediscovigilante I'm associated with this guy! Joined: Posts: 3,037
    Mixup plays Thor? Maybe Thor can actually win CEO.

    Mixup's going to CEO?
    discovigilante
    UMvC3:
    Nova β Doom α/ɣ Ammy β
    Nova β Strange ɣ Ammy β
    Ammy β Doom α Dante α

    SF5: Bison, a lil Birdie, waiting on Juri

    Stuff I should play more
    Aquapazza: Chizuru
    Guilty Gear Xrd: Sin
    UNIBEL: Hyde
  • legostepperlegostepper mvc2 and street fighter are relevant to umvc3 Joined: Posts: 366
    On the fullschedule stream almost a month ago full schedule was talking to ray ray in the stream chat and setting up a money match between the two at CEO so I assume its true.

    emp_put_mixup_on_stream
    emp_take_shoultz_to_CEO
    emp_fourcorners_extrabuttons
    UMVC3 Team: Evil Guile/Squidward/Spoderman aka ESS
  • EMSmixupEMSmixup Joined: Posts: 168
    Thor can use purification but liberation is where it's at.
    How does thor use liberation assist in the neutral?
    Helpppppp
    Equinsu Ocha
    Shoutlz
    비 열 한 악마
    Barre de ba Wiley
    Programme complet
    "Talent hits a target no one else can hit. Genius hits a target no one else can see"
  • MarveloMarvelo Oh, it's on now. Joined: Posts: 1,606
    EMSmixup wrote: »
    Thor can use purification but liberation is where it's at.
    How does thor use liberation assist in the neutral?
    Helpppppp

    MIKEEEEEE. Come to CEO. It's been too long already!

    Zero/Doom/Strider | Storm/Strange/Dante | Nova/Doom/Strider | Wesker/Storm/Akuma
    Xbox Live: Marvelo SRK
    Twitter: @MarveloMcfly
    "He's a nice guy, but a slimy player."
  • FuneralMoonFuneralMoon It was my privilege Joined: Posts: 301
    Is legostepper autistic?
    Zero/X/Doom
    Time is Precious. Don't waste it on bad teams.
  • charlie88charlie88 Ya'll niggas gay. The Keving Gates kinda gay. Joined: Posts: 5,120
    No he just read the Naruto Manga every week. It happens to us all don't sweat it guys.
    FC:1864 9258 8415
    PSN: Death_Loner_Kage
    Umvc3: Learning Viper...plays tron strange dante strider

    I am willing to play trade and embrace the suck
  • Brightside6382Brightside6382 It can't be helped Joined: Posts: 950
    If naruto was a little girl it would be a better manga.
  • ChrisisChrisis Follows her path Joined: Posts: 7,684
    edited June 2014
    Is there a problem with someone falling on the broad array of the autistic spectrum?
    Isis is something shiny that likes water.
  • wnewne Fucking purple. Joined: Posts: 3,357
    besides with their brains? no
    I'm wet.
  • ChrisisChrisis Follows her path Joined: Posts: 7,684
    It's a different formation of the brain, not something wrong with it. Like using Ubuntu instead of Windows. It's not that Ubuntu is wrong, just not the configuration that the majority of people use.

    The only way something is wrong with an autistic brain is when those interfacing with it aren't intelligent enough to understand that the most effective methods of interaction are different.
    Isis is something shiny that likes water.
  • wnewne Fucking purple. Joined: Posts: 3,357
    im pretty sure we're all just joking
    I'm wet.
  • WorstPlayerWorstPlayer Calm Yourself Joined: Posts: 4,918
    Ubuntu is ass. Like cottage cheese ridden nonwiped after spicey Indian food ass.
  • charlie88charlie88 Ya'll niggas gay. The Keving Gates kinda gay. Joined: Posts: 5,120
    What is an Unbunta, is that spanish for ass?
    FC:1864 9258 8415
    PSN: Death_Loner_Kage
    Umvc3: Learning Viper...plays tron strange dante strider

    I am willing to play trade and embrace the suck
  • shinquickmanshinquickman Joined: Posts: 1,854
    It has something to do with Linux.
    TimeAttack: Grand Coward of SRK since November 18th, 2015
  • charlie88charlie88 Ya'll niggas gay. The Keving Gates kinda gay. Joined: Posts: 5,120
    Pardon my ignorance but I don't even know what that is. In all seriousness.
    FC:1864 9258 8415
    PSN: Death_Loner_Kage
    Umvc3: Learning Viper...plays tron strange dante strider

    I am willing to play trade and embrace the suck
  • legostepperlegostepper mvc2 and street fighter are relevant to umvc3 Joined: Posts: 366
    The Duke wrote: »
    Autistic mind is the mutant of the real verse.

    Explains why I pick Wolverine.
    UMVC3 Team: Evil Guile/Squidward/Spoderman aka ESS
  • MechWarriorMechWarrior Joined: Posts: 5,718
    edited June 2014
    wne wrote: »
    im pretty sure we're all just joking
    None of that sort of talk would sound like it was for shits and giggles if it was said out-loud.
    Just how it is, by now.
    wne wrote: »
    I feel the same way but I'm torn. I have a friend that plays a really Wonky DOK team that works wonders vs a lot of people. I'm not sure what DOKs optimized team really is with him on point. In my heart I believe it's something like DOK/MORRIDOOM or DOK/DOOM/VERGIL which saddens me......only because I find Morrigan tedious and Vergil I've played twice.
    I've played offline with LTP a lot, from my experience and his theory i personally think that Modok/Doom (missiles) or a good lockdown is necessary. but missiles is most versatile

    normally he plays doom anchor and shoves strange/dorm in second or magneto on point. I think the dok/strange/doom team is the best personally, when he gets even a throw anyone with less than a mil dies easy
    Yeah.
    I've also played LTP fairly often(at OWA's sessions sometimes, funny enough), and I have played sporadically against other DOKs with different teams.
    Dok/_____/Doom, or nothing, IMO.
    XBL: MechWarriorNY
  • serpentaurusserpentaurus just watching Joined: Posts: 4,525
    EMSmixup wrote: »
    Thor can use purification but liberation is where it's at.
    How does thor use liberation assist in the neutral?
    Helpppppp

    you dont, just change to liberation and play the "thor get one hit, 1 kill, dhc to dormammu and charge 2D1C to reduce chance of comeback" gameplan.

    Purification is good for covering resets (resets after of smash M, etc) or for extending more the thor damage output, so against a team with no comeback chances like Hulk/Haggar/Sentinel i think its wise to use purification instead of liberation (or against a player that suck enough to not have comeback chances at all regardless of his team
    Merkyl
    )

    dark hole is the dormammu neutral assist and works like a downgraded coldstar that needs more covering so if you want a neutral assist better learn how to use that.
    umvc3: Thor / Dr.Strange / Ammy - Thor / Dorm / Doom - Wesker / Dr.Strange / Vergil - ssf4: Vega
  • VASagaVASaga Not Yet Strange! Let Them Wait Joined: Posts: 1,607
    Darkhole is much better than Coldstar.

    Coldstar doesnt even have any durability that interacts with other projectiles and cant be used in neutral unless you want Amaterasu to die. You have to basically already be in on them to use it.

    Darkhole does better chip. Its as durable as jam session and eats up damn near everything.
    Its easier to cover by jus dashing forward into it so Dorm is offscreen and even still Dorm wont be 1 shotted like Ammy.
    It actually has really strong defensive & blockstring applications. Its a highly underated assist.
    "I must have ascended to a higher plane of thinking than most because I play Dr Strange"
  • bloodymessbloodymess Joined: Posts: 1,916
    VASaga wrote: »
    Darkhole is much better than Coldstar.

    Coldstar doesnt even have any durability that interacts with other projectiles and cant be used in neutral unless you want Amaterasu to die. You have to basically already be in on them to use it.

    Darkhole does better chip. Its as durable as jam session and eats up damn near everything.
    Its easier to cover by jus dashing forward into it so Dorm is offscreen and even still Dorm wont be 1 shotted like Ammy.
    It actually has really strong defensive & blockstring applications. Its a highly underated assist.

    Daggers are much better than both of them ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
  • MechWarriorMechWarrior Joined: Posts: 5,718
    edited June 2014
    VASaga wrote: »
    Dark hole is much better than Coldstar.

    Coldstar doesnt even have any durability that interacts with other projectiles and cant be used in neutral unless you want Amaterasu to die. You have to basically already be in on them to use it.

    Darkhole does better chip. Its as durable as jam session and eats up damn near everything.
    Its easier to cover by jus dashing forward into it so Dorm is offscreen and even still Dorm wont be 1 shotted like Ammy.
    It actually has really strong defensive & blockstring applications. Its a highly underated assist.
    You are one of my favorite people for info-dumping about Dormington, but I gotta get on you for that 1st line, like Dizzy did.

    Otherwise you nailed it(of course), but as the Dark Lord himself is, we should be boisterous, but also self-aware(the one thing we can be his better in!); Dark Hole has its merits... but if you can't place it in a way that controls space/constrains the foe's mobility at that moment, and where they can move safely, it's wack.
    XBL: MechWarriorNY
  • sjohnst2sjohnst2 Joined: Posts: 1,496
    edited June 2014
    nonsense post, disregard.
  • wnewne Fucking purple. Joined: Posts: 3,357
    did everyone just take some crack or something
    I'm wet.
  • -AEON--AEON- Joined: Posts: 972
    edited June 2014
    I can't think of a single character that prefers Dark Hole to Cold Star as an assist. Can anyone else?

    Even characters who prefer Dorm to Ammy as a partner typically do so for other reasons.
    Viscant wrote: »
    The reason I don't stream is because the chances of me accidentally exposing my dick to the world is too high. I forget stuff way too often, I almost burn my place down because I forgot I was cooking at least once every 3 months. If I started livestreaming I would load up a Taylor Swift video, forget I had a webcam and a stream and then...
    These are self evident truths. You could irrefutably prove God's existence starting from the axiom that Marn is scum.
    Marn is scum ergo sum.
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