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  • Spinning BeatSpinning Beat Mr. creampie your girl Joined: Posts: 3,973
    edited August 2016
    thiagoeis wrote: »
    NeoBlood wrote: »
    Kecka wrote: »
    Ken doesn't really have an archenemy. His entire raison d'etre is being a foil to Ryu. Meanwhile, Ryu probably sees Akuma as his archenemy, while he as quite a few people gunning for him depending on the timeline. Hell, Bison's probably more of an archenemy to Guile and Chun-Li. Ryu just feels like he doesn't take much that personally. He just punches bad guys in the face and moves on.

    Ryu is his own arch-enemy. It's a really good way to interpret not only Ryu's character, but also the journey of the player. You're not only fighting your opponent, but your own bad habits and bad decisions during the match. Whereas Ryu is doing all of that AND trying to get a grip on the dark hado.

    If you just say that this character or that character is Ryu's arch-enemy, whenever that enemy is defeated his motivation as a character has to change.

    That's exactly what I was talking with a friend of mine a while ago. Ryu is his own rival/archnemesis because he is always fighting his inner self (trying to get better at every fight) and the Satsui no Hado.

    And yeah, since SFIV I see Bison as an enemy for Chun, Guile and Cammy.

    I don't even think Ryu has a reason to hate Bison.

    Bison just wants to test Ryu's power...lol.
    The most beautiful rose is cultivated in the blood of those who fall before me.
    SFV: Vega.
    3S:Ibuki, Yang, Ryu
    KOF 98:Kyo/Iori/O.Chris
    I play to learn, because you can't win if you don't know shit.
    July, 16 1991: That's when the beat dropped.
    CFN:weedandwater
    R.I.P Bankroll Fresh
  • petran79petran79 Here comes an old challenger Joined: Posts: 1,913
    edited August 2016
    MK9 and X are very popular currently. But I wonder why UMK3 or Mortal Kombat Trilogy are not held in the same regard in popular tournaments? While the older Street Fighter 2 Turbo is still highly regarded and was played along with SFIII-V. Or even King of Fighters 98-2002 that retained their popularity, while XIII (and now XIV) was the main game. Even MvC2 is more popular than older MK games

    But something similar has not happened with Mortal Kombat. MK Trilogy is troublesome to run, but getting a UMK3 cab shouldnt be an issue
    too slow!
  • AlegrettoAlegretto The King of Breakfast. Joined: Posts: 406
    Can you guys think of any normals/specials in a fighting game that are more plus on block than on hit? I feel like there must be some, but I can't come up with any atm.
    MBAA: C-Ryougi/H-Loa

    ;_; it's been so long since I've played MBAA
  • otterotter CFN: otter- Joined: Posts: 4,608
    petran79 wrote: »
    MK9 and X are very popular currently. But I wonder why UMK3 or Mortal Kombat Trilogy are not held in the same regard in popular tournaments? While the older Street Fighter 2 Turbo is still highly regarded and was played along with SFIII-V. Or even King of Fighters 98-2002 that retained their popularity, while XIII (and now XIV) was the main game. Even MvC2 is more popular than older MK games

    But something similar has not happened with Mortal Kombat. MK Trilogy is troublesome to run, but getting a UMK3 cab shouldnt be an issue

    Because the NRS scene only likes to play one game at a time

    partially because they are a smaller group than Capcom players, and partially because that's how NRS promotes their games. "Okay injustice 2 is coming out in 6 months so let's kill mkx now so everyone has their wallets ready"
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,768 mod
    petran79 wrote: »
    MK9 and X are very popular currently. But I wonder why UMK3 or Mortal Kombat Trilogy are not held in the same regard in popular tournaments? While the older Street Fighter 2 Turbo is still highly regarded and was played along with SFIII-V. Or even King of Fighters 98-2002 that retained their popularity, while XIII (and now XIV) was the main game. Even MvC2 is more popular than older MK games

    But something similar has not happened with Mortal Kombat. MK Trilogy is troublesome to run, but getting a UMK3 cab shouldnt be an issue
    Because MK has been somewhat separate from the mainline FGC and they didn't really get much attention in tournaments until MK9 came out. FGC didn't really have a positive view on the older MKs until then.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • MajormelisThereMajormelisThere no labels Joined: Posts: 493
    image

    daisuke ishiwatari was recently interviewed by toco toco tv. Their series is about certain locations that inspire creators. Thought I'd leave this here.
    Skullgirls: Parasoul, Cerebella
    JOJO HFTF: Polnareff, Iggy, jotaro
    Umvc3: poor spider-man, poor ryu, ok sentinel
  • PerthoPertho The Runed One Joined: Posts: 21,126 mod
    d3v wrote: »
    petran79 wrote: »
    MK9 and X are very popular currently. But I wonder why UMK3 or Mortal Kombat Trilogy are not held in the same regard in popular tournaments? While the older Street Fighter 2 Turbo is still highly regarded and was played along with SFIII-V. Or even King of Fighters 98-2002 that retained their popularity, while XIII (and now XIV) was the main game. Even MvC2 is more popular than older MK games

    But something similar has not happened with Mortal Kombat. MK Trilogy is troublesome to run, but getting a UMK3 cab shouldnt be an issue

    Because MK has been somewhat separate from the mainline FGC and they didn't really get much attention in tournaments until MK9 came out. FGC didn't really have a positive view on the older MKs until then.

    Eh...these two comments need to be addressed. Latter first: after UMK3, all of the MK games were shit. Some of us played it for shits and giggles but that's the most of it. The best MK game after 3 was Shaolin Monks. MK9 was the most amazing fighting game of all time compared to the constant bullshit they were putting out. But hey, people love fatalities and MK fanservice so all the shitty games became greatest hits.


    UMK3 and MKT are different beasts altogether. UMK3 has a scene up in the North East. It started getting some press in the early days of SF4 but it kind of went nowhere. MKT gets played in the Dominican Republic for whatever reason. No arcade release during those times meant that the games were taken as seriously. So its kind of this weird side game that nobody really looked at unfortunately.
    Ronin Chaos on Pertho:

    "Oh, Pertho. You complete me."
    jimmy1200 wrote: »
    pertho attacked me first, saying i get all my life tips from 106th and park.
  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    Currently there is a member of TYM who is rebalancing MK9, calling it Mortal Kombat: Trilogy Edition.

    Can be played on PC & PS3 CFW (a.k.a jailbroken PS3)

    More info can be found here: https://testyourmight.com/threads/mortal-kombat-9-trilogy-edition-mod-discussion-currently-on-version-1-50.58263/

    If y'all have question, i'll try to answer them the best way I can.
  • NeverYouMindNeverYouMind Joined: Posts: 416
    The idea of Kabal being balanced is greatly welcomed! Thank you for spreading the word.
  • PerthoPertho The Runed One Joined: Posts: 21,126 mod
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    snip

    so instead of playing the game you got you're gonna cosplay that shit? Man leave that type of nonsense to smash players.
    Ronin Chaos on Pertho:

    "Oh, Pertho. You complete me."
    jimmy1200 wrote: »
    pertho attacked me first, saying i get all my life tips from 106th and park.
  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    Pertho wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    snip

    so instead of playing the game you got you're gonna cosplay that shit? Man leave that type of nonsense to smash players.

    Really? This the type of attitude you bring to the table when people are trying to provide a good fighting game to the FGC something that NRS are incapable of doing?

    I ask again:

    Really?
  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    edited August 2016
    Hecatom wrote: »
    If you need to hack the game to deem it playable then why dont play another game instead?

    If we have the resources to change the game to the way that we prefer or make it playable, thats what we're gonna do & also not everyone likes MKX & INJ
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,768 mod
    Ugh... next thing you know, you gonna have scrubs trying to make rebalanced versions of Marvel vs. Capcom 2.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,934
    edited August 2016
    im not agaisnt mod and hack like aesthetic changes and what not but changing mechanics and property is where I draw the line.

    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Pertho wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    snip

    so instead of playing the game you got you're gonna cosplay that shit? Man leave that type of nonsense to smash players.

    Really? This the type of attitude you bring to the table when people are trying to provide a good fighting game to the FGC something that NRS are incapable of doing?

    I ask again:

    Really?

    Hold da fuck up.

    Who in gods given earth gave you the credentials make such statement?

    Nothing and I mean nothing guaranteed this fan project going to better than NRS MK9 has produce. Saying something going to be better base subjective idea as "balance" is frivolous. MK9 goal was to reboot the franchise and offer feature that cater to the competitive community and did it in spades. MK was brought to its root with 2.5 gameplay, added mechanics common in modern FG that improved upon old ones. They provided a fine tune training mode with features still neglected to be added by other main stream fighters on top of a tutorial. Execution wasn't the best but they attempted sincerely with mostly positive results. Yes their glaring issue development wise, but no one can take away any of NRS accomplishment base on them not living up to few individual standards. And its not like they're not trying to improve. Injustice, MKX/XL is evidence enough.

    Instead of trying to reshape game intricate design. The people doing this MK9 trilogy edition should be trying to make their own stuff and present it as its own and not harp on another design and slightly modify it in the whims their improving it. As aid I'm not against mods sense i like how caster add roll back to online gaming. Color edit or costume music. While Im not sure how stuff like Pokemon uranium and metriod 2 remake operates. I'm sure their made in homage to the developers of the game and not out of spite which seems to be the driven theme around MK9 trilogy and project M.

    Seikuken Disciple
    "That Phantom Breaker Guy"
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 21,625
    edited August 2016
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    It is simple, who the fuck are the people doing the hack to even take their balance changes into account?
    Why should anyone care and accept their changes.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
    "Orgasm is a simile for the emotional epiphany a woman has when the shame of penetration is eclipsed by the inherent virtue of servicing a man." ~ Kromo.
    ( •_•)
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  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    Have any of you guys played MK9 on a competitive level?
  • Evolution169Evolution169 Wake up DP is unbeatable Joined: Posts: 1,003
    edited August 2016
    Why rebalance MK9 when you could just play MKX? It has GGPO netcode and dev support on PS4, and from what I hear, PC support soon.

    And everyone bitches about 3S balance, but no one plays 4th strike on Fightcade. Maybe it's shit, idk, but there seems to be very little interest in playing hacks.
  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    edited August 2016
    Why rebalance MK9 when you could just play MKX? It has GGPO netcode and dev support on PS4, and from what I hear, PC support soon.

    MKX & MK9 are two completely different games and there're people out there who want to play MK9 without the broken mess.
    Eirokaj wrote: »
    Good to know people aren't too open-minded on giving a community's project a chance before bashing it.

    Right! Like nobody in here except @NeverYouMind said anything positive about this project. Just shitting on it from the gate.
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,934
    edited August 2016
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Have any of you guys played MK9 on a competitive level?

    have you ever played a competitively game seriously? you rock what ever it takes to win,(within the confines of the game). If can't handle the competition or game is not your cup of tea, play another game.

    But if want to play say game then "git gud".
    Seikuken Disciple
    "That Phantom Breaker Guy"
  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    edited August 2016
    keo-bas wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Have any of you guys played MK9 on a competitive level?
    -Snip-

    I'll mark that as a No.
  • Pokemon123Pokemon123 Joined: Posts: 234
    so how was the comp scene for marvel before mvc2? May have just been the era they were released in but barely able to find anything about it.
    aspiring 3s player.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,768 mod
    edited August 2016
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)

    But in regards to UMK3 this is not the case... Jab infinites, noob saibot, etc. As far as playability goes, it need a "rebalance" to be tournament playable. Now I can't say in the same breath that MK9 was as broken as UMK3, but having input bug, P1 Advantage, Meter drain glitch, etc didn't help its case.

    I wouldn't go as far & call REO, Pig of the Hut, Lord of The Fly, & 16-Bit weak or scruby player because they are helping in rebalance of MK9 with MK9: Trilogy Edition.

    You SRK guys might not respect this modding of a official game, but could at least respect the community as whole on what they're trying to achieve.

  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,768 mod
    edited August 2016
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    This shows an extreme lack of knowledge of the games in question.

    ST had multiple lopsided match ups (Ryu vs Honda was a 9:1 that the latter struggled to climb). 3S had its own balance issues with 4 characters clearly dominating the rest of the cast. And a little less than half of the rest being somewhat viable, but not really. Chun is probably as bad as Noob (multiple 7:3 matchups in her favor with no bad matchups).
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • WeeabooWeeaboo The Dream is dead. . . Joined: Posts: 1,314
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    This shows an extreme lack of knowledge of the games in question.

    ST had multiple lopsided match ups (Ryu vs Honda was a 9:1 that the latter struggled to climb). 3S had its own balance issues with 4 characters clearly dominating the rest of the cast. And a little less than half of the rest being somewhat viable, but not really. Chun is probably as bad as Noob (multiple 7:3 matchups in her favor with no bad matchups).

    So 3s & ST need a rebalance to be playable?
  • thiagoeisthiagoeis Just press the buttons Joined: Posts: 549
    Pokemon123 wrote: »
    so how was the comp scene for marvel before mvc2? May have just been the era they were released in but barely able to find anything about it.

    I second this question. I've been curious about this for a while now.
    High level salty play

    - I try to play:
    UMvC3: Chun-Li/Doom/Strider, Taskmaster/Chun/Hawkeye, Task/Doom/Hawk, point Hawkeye and point Vergil (troll) teams
    SFV: Alex, Guile and Ryu (CFN id: trakkerzorg)
    Deciding on MvCI stuff: Ultron/Strider might be sick

    Other games:
    - I play 4fun or when someone asks:
    GGXrd: Slayer
    SFxT: Combinations of Poison, Jin, Ryu, Vega(Claw), Yoshimitsu, Guile and sometimes Chun
    MSH: Psylocke and Spider-Man
    MvC: Gambit, Spider-Man, Ryu, Strider. Trolls with Zangief, Venom and O. Hulk
    Super Turbo/HDR: Guile, Vega(Claw)
    3rd Strike: Akuma, Ryu. Trolls with Alex and Twelve
    USFIV: Vega(Claw), Ryu. Fools around with Seth and Poison

    - Stuff that I should practice more but I don't:
    DOA5LR: Kasumi
    MvC2: WarMachine/IronMan/Doom. Also weird teams with Rogue, Gambit, Ken, Akuma and other mid tiers
    CvS2: A-Guile/Ryu/Vega, A-Terry/Ken/Vega
    KOF XIII: Terry/King/Kim
  • PerthoPertho The Runed One Joined: Posts: 21,126 mod

    So 3s & ST need a rebalance to be playable?

    HDR was a new version of SF2. 4th Strike was some random dude who decided that the problem with 3S was the lack of combos.

    So the answer is no, neither game needed it and the tier lists have shifted from where they were 5 years ago. If w are still finding things for those games, then i' d be incredibly surprised if the MRS people had truly explored MK9 to the fullest.
    Ronin Chaos on Pertho:

    "Oh, Pertho. You complete me."
    jimmy1200 wrote: »
    pertho attacked me first, saying i get all my life tips from 106th and park.
  • NrsFightingGameFanNrsFightingGameFan Joined: Posts: 1
    edited September 2016
    Why rebalance MK9 when you could just play MKX? It has GGPO netcode and dev support on PS4, and from what I hear, PC support soon.

    MKX and MK9 have completely different metas. The games couldn't be more different if they tried. MKX is centered around explosive offense due to how powerful mobility, jumping attacks, and mixups are within the game. Also, the game is drenched in armor. MK9 is more traditional based; classic footsies play a much bigger role, practically no setplay, and defense is more inline with the offense.
    Post edited by NrsFightingGameFan on
  • AlegrettoAlegretto The King of Breakfast. Joined: Posts: 406
    edited August 2016
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    This shows an extreme lack of knowledge of the games in question.

    ST had multiple lopsided match ups (Ryu vs Honda was a 9:1 that the latter struggled to climb). 3S had its own balance issues with 4 characters clearly dominating the rest of the cast. And a little less than half of the rest being somewhat viable, but not really. Chun is probably as bad as Noob (multiple 7:3 matchups in her favor with no bad matchups).

    So 3s & ST need a rebalance to be playable?

    Not to be playable--because the FGC rolls with the punches--but certainly to be anything close to "balanced". It's either dishonest or ignorant to pretend otherwise, and it's certainly dishonest to pretend "playable" and "balanced" are interchangeable. MMPR:FE was also "playable", but no one can argue Ivan Ooze was "balanced".

    Alegretto wrote: »
    Can you guys think of any normals/specials in a fighting game that are more plus on block than on hit? I feel like there must be some, but I can't come up with any atm.

    Anyhoo; are there no examples that come to mind, then?
    MBAA: C-Ryougi/H-Loa

    ;_; it's been so long since I've played MBAA
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,768 mod
    edited September 2016
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    Weeaboo wrote: »
    Don't know where this hate coming from, but oh well.

    The thing is, the mainline FGC has never really been open to this kind of modding. The prevailing mentality has always been to play whatever it is that the devs put out as the standard, competitive version (usually the arcade version). Anything broken or unbalanced was simply accepted unless it was stuff that actually froze the game or crashed it. The idea was that anyone who complained or wanted stuff nerfed, banned, etc. was a weaker player, or scrub who was suggesting something detrimental to the metagame in the long run. Hence any "rebalance" attempts, even official ones haven't been well received, case in point Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix which died a quiet death after most of the scene stuck to classic Super Turbo instead of HDR.

    Well as far as I know there have only three revision of popular FGs: HDR ( a rebalance of ST) 4Th Strike (a rebalance of 3S) & UMK3: Jugg Hack & UMK3: TE ( a rebalance of UMK3).

    2 out of the 3 were poorly received because of how perfect or balance the original game played ( I will never in any arguments I have with someone say that 3s or ST were imbalance or broken, because its completely not true.)
    This shows an extreme lack of knowledge of the games in question.

    ST had multiple lopsided match ups (Ryu vs Honda was a 9:1 that the latter struggled to climb). 3S had its own balance issues with 4 characters clearly dominating the rest of the cast. And a little less than half of the rest being somewhat viable, but not really. Chun is probably as bad as Noob (multiple 7:3 matchups in her favor with no bad matchups).

    So 3s & ST need a rebalance to be playable?

    Had they been released in this day and age, scrubs would be screaming for balance patches for these games. I mean, IIRC there was a stretch where Chun/Yun were just about winning every 3S tournament.
    thiagoeis wrote: »
    Pokemon123 wrote: »
    so how was the comp scene for marvel before mvc2? May have just been the era they were released in but barely able to find anything about it.

    I second this question. I've been curious about this for a while now.

    @Spider-Dan (if he's still posting in the forums) is probably the best person to ask.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 21,625
    Pertho wrote: »

    So 3s & ST need a rebalance to be playable?

    HDR was a new version of SF2. 4th Strike was some random dude who decided that the problem with 3S was the lack of combos.

    So the answer is no, neither game needed it and the tier lists have shifted from where they were 5 years ago. If w are still finding things for those games, then i' d be incredibly surprised if the MRS people had truly explored MK9 to the fullest.

    TBH, HDR wan't bad, the problem boils down that the old capcom communtiy don't really like balance changes on their games, regardless of the quality of it.
    Now 4th strike, that was some dumb shit, like this mk9 rebalance nonsense
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  • just5moreminutesjust5moreminutes mfw Capcom reveals something Joined: Posts: 6,679
    Hacks should be reserved for outright stupid mechanics (SSBB Tripping)
    Can you be FGC without playing anymore?
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird Crack is back! Joined: Posts: 24,139
    I don't support these kind of hacks because players should accept the game the way it is. If you don't like it move on to something else.
    PSN: Hawkingbird
    FC: 0834-1564-0151
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/runawayavenger
    SFV Lounge discord: https://discord.gg/Tp23Ccr
  • King9999King9999 Joined: Posts: 10,792 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Am I the only one who wouldn't mind seeing someone pick up the rights to Clay Fighter and try to make something decent?
    Switch Friend Code: SW-2722-8799-3295
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  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 6,373
    Ideas for broken fighting games that are still playable?

    HnK
    Sengoku Basara X
    Vanilla MvC3?

    What else?
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird Crack is back! Joined: Posts: 24,139
    X-Men vs Street Fighter
    PSN: Hawkingbird
    FC: 0834-1564-0151
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    SFV Lounge discord: https://discord.gg/Tp23Ccr
  • KomatikKomatik Card demon Joined: Posts: 2,657
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Ideas for broken fighting games that are still playable?

    HnK
    Sengoku Basara X
    Vanilla MvC3?

    What else?

    Marvel 2 should count?

    JJBA Heritage for the Future, Petshop all day?

    Chaos Breaker maybe?
    Steam:Coffeeling | Fightcade: Coffeeling-FIN
    Xrd: Sol | ST: Claw, O.Sagat, O.Ryu | 3S: Chun-Li, Akuma
    Resource pack for learning fighting games and/or starting KOF13
  • BurnYourEgoBurnYourEgo Ishikawa don't care about your weeabullshit avatar. Joined: Posts: 1,983
    Any body have the whole "8 buttons is dick" mantra. Can't seem to find it.
    Steam: BurnYourEgo: Terribly playing KOFXIII and Xrd, want to learn Skullgirls
    Fightcade:Bathtub_Leviathan: ST, maybe 3s
  • PerthoPertho The Runed One Joined: Posts: 21,126 mod
    8 buttons became the truth once recording and playback became things you could map.
    Ronin Chaos on Pertho:

    "Oh, Pertho. You complete me."
    jimmy1200 wrote: »
    pertho attacked me first, saying i get all my life tips from 106th and park.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,768 mod
    Any body have the whole "8 buttons is dick" mantra. Can't seem to find it.

    Ask in the Tech Talk lounge.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • crash_and_burncrash_and_burn While you're at it, add some more bells!!! Joined: Posts: 2,406
    I know that in the grand scheme, whether here on SRK or of course the FGC in general, my opinion may not matter, however, in the random event that someone cares, or at Capcom reads these threads, I just want to state for the record, as a Bison main for 22 years, if they neglect Bison in SFV and do not buff him in a fair way, I am effectively done with this fucking game.
  • VeseriusVeserius Hold Down Back Joined: Posts: 11,043
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Ideas for broken fighting games that are still playable?

    HnK
    Sengoku Basara X
    Vanilla MvC3?

    What else?

    TMNT Tournament Fighters(SNES version)
    Vuh-sair-ee-us or just Ves I guess | Twitter | Youtube  | Maj's Footsie Handbook  | My TMNT:TF Netplay Guide
  • Master_ChibiMaster_Chibi .: Dynamites! :. Joined: Posts: 15,026 mod
    Veserius wrote: »
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Ideas for broken fighting games that are still playable?

    HnK
    Sengoku Basara X
    Vanilla MvC3?

    What else?

    TMNT Tournament Fighters(SNES version)

    That's like ST broken though. Which is far far less broken then anything listed already.
    ~*Hai! Back to Japan!
  • VeseriusVeserius Hold Down Back Joined: Posts: 11,043
    edited September 2016
    Veserius wrote: »
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Ideas for broken fighting games that are still playable?

    HnK
    Sengoku Basara X
    Vanilla MvC3?

    What else?

    TMNT Tournament Fighters(SNES version)

    That's like ST broken though. Which is far far less broken then anything listed already.

    i mean it doesn't have air dashing(well minus wingnut), but it's a game of dumb tech killing people in one grab/combo/unblockable loops.
    Vuh-sair-ee-us or just Ves I guess | Twitter | Youtube  | Maj's Footsie Handbook  | My TMNT:TF Netplay Guide
  • The MartianThe Martian A Terrible Fate. Joined: Posts: 11,960
    You know, I've always found it weird that I main such a varied mix of characters from different fighters. At one point I thought grapplers might be my favorite archetype, but then in another game I'll play a rushdown and want nothing to do with any of the grapplers at all. One could argue this is because of how EXTREMELY these titles vary from fighting game to fighting game, and that's definitely a part of it, but....honestly? I think I've narrowed it down to the possibility that I just love characters that force you to block. Block a lot.

    Tekken? I play Jin, with a side of King and Dragunov.

    Blazblue? Tager and Noel.

    Street Fighter? Bison.

    Guilty Gear? Potemkin and A.B.A.

    People say I push a lot of buttons when I play, and I really do. But it works for most of the characters I play, and that's why I do it. I wanna get inside your head as a player and force YOU to make mistakes, then capitalize. That's when I'm having the most fun. Characters with dat Yomi factor are always so fun to me. Bison's always been a character I've played in this fasion, and even though he's not at his best in SFV, I love how much of a monster he becomes once you're stuck blocking his bullshit. Even the high tiers like Ryu and Necalli have no choice but to cower in fear, knowing one wrong move will send a fourth of your health down the drain.

    That's why Tager is my favorite grappler of all time, and one of my favorite fighting game characters in general. He's intimidating as hell to fight, and one minor mistake against him can turn into you being a hit away from death. I realize most grapplers work this way, but Tager is different. The amount of damage you can end up taking is ridiculous.

    Didn't mean to rant about pretty much nothing, but I've always tried to pinpoint why I like the characters I like and it makes more sense the more I actually think about it.
    "You have a heart of gold. Don't let them take it from you."

  • KeckaKecka Psycho Crushing that booty Joined: Posts: 1,542
    You know, I've always found it weird that I main such a varied mix of characters from different fighters. At one point I thought grapplers might be my favorite archetype, but then in another game I'll play a rushdown and want nothing to do with any of the grapplers at all. One could argue this is because of how EXTREMELY these titles vary from fighting game to fighting game, and that's definitely a part of it, but....honestly? I think I've narrowed it down to the possibility that I just love characters that force you to block. Block a lot.

    Tekken? I play Jin, with a side of King and Dragunov.

    Blazblue? Tager and Noel.

    Street Fighter? Bison.

    Guilty Gear? Potemkin and A.B.A.

    People say I push a lot of buttons when I play, and I really do. But it works for most of the characters I play, and that's why I do it. I wanna get inside your head as a player and force YOU to make mistakes, then capitalize. That's when I'm having the most fun. Characters with dat Yomi factor are always so fun to me. Bison's always been a character I've played in this fasion, and even though he's not at his best in SFV, I love how much of a monster he becomes once you're stuck blocking his bullshit. Even the high tiers like Ryu and Necalli have no choice but to cower in fear, knowing one wrong move will send a fourth of your health down the drain.

    That's why Tager is my favorite grappler of all time, and one of my favorite fighting game characters in general. He's intimidating as hell to fight, and one minor mistake against him can turn into you being a hit away from death. I realize most grapplers work this way, but Tager is different. The amount of damage you can end up taking is ridiculous.

    Didn't mean to rant about pretty much nothing, but I've always tried to pinpoint why I like the characters I like and it makes more sense the more I actually think about it.

    I'm kind of the same. I'll think I have an archetype, and I do have certain types of characters I find awesome, but then realize I don't actually play them in a lot of games. If you ask me who the characters I would go for in SFIV, I would say Hugo and Dudley. Who did I play? Sagat. Okay, so I obviously like long reach and fireballs. So naturally I mainly play Big Band in Skullgirls, because a slow as fuck character with no projectile is clearly in that mold. But they're both big dudes, right? So obviously I like big buff dudes. So naturally my #1 pick in KoF is Athena, and in Guilty Gear it's either Zappa or Bridget. I've narrowed it down to me being a style over substance kind of guy. If you have a move, particularly a super, I think looks awesome I will at the very least make a token attempt to learn that character. Which explains everyone but Athena. I just really like Athena and I have no idea why.

    Also, am I the only one who will go into the "fighting" tag in the Steam Store and consider buying them all just in the hopes I will find something so abysmal it becomes hilarious?
    SFV: Gief, Bison
    Xrd: Fucking nobody and everybody, but I like Elphelt, Sin, Raven and Ramlethal a little more than others
    Garou: Grant, Butt
    KI: Riptor, Aganos
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