FGD Lounge: for general fighting game discussions that aren't thread worthy

Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdhJoined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
edited August 2013 in Fighting Game Discussion
I want to know why KOF 98 is so popular? i've only realised this whilst looking around GGPO. The KOF98 rooms seem to be packed at all times.. so someone explain to an ST player why 98 is so good.
Post edited by Preppy on
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  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2013
    jedpossum said:
    KoF 98 is a good game.
    i know. i'm not trying to start a sf vs kof discussion, i'll even agree that kof98 may possibly be better than ST based on its popularity. I just want to know how the objective of the game differs to ST... like landing crossovers to win a match, etc..
    Post edited by Sexperienced. on
  • HecatomHecatom (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 13,487 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2013
    For starters you have more mobility options in the form of the different type of jumps, that alone changes how those games are played.
    Post edited by Hecatom on
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  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    Hecatom said:
    For starters you have more mobility options in the form of the different type of jumps, that alone changes how those games are played.
    interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
  • bkfst_sausagebkfst_sausage ST / SRK2k3 OG Joined: Posts: 2,802
    World Heroes Perfect was better than any version of Street Fighter 2 until Super Turbo came out.
    PSN: M1X4H < click it!
  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    edited February 2013
    World Heroes Perfect was better than any version of Street Fighter 2 until Super Turbo came out.
    WHP is the game Team NINJA secretly wants to make with DOA... except with more titties.
    Post edited by d3v on
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  • AirLancerAirLancer Just a touch of Honey Joined: Posts: 484 ✭✭✭
    Sexperienced. said:interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
    Well, how much more effective would most SF characters' offenses be if their jumps were twice as fast?

    That's how.
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  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    What exactly are "simultaneous button cancels" in the Genesis/MegaDrive version of HF (Special Champion Ed)?
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  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    AirLancer said:
    Sexperienced. said:interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
    Well, how much more effective would most SF characters' offenses be if their jumps were twice as fast?

    That's how.
    despite having more mobility options kof' seems to be a lot slower and less precise than sf.
  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    AirLancer said:
    Sexperienced. said:interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
    Well, how much more effective would most SF characters' offenses be if their jumps were twice as fast?

    That's how.
    kof characters seem a lot slower than SF characters.
    the7k said:
    Hecatom said:<br />
    For starters you have more mobility options in the form of the different type of jumps, that alone changes how those games are played.<br />
    <br />
    <br />
    interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
    I remember an old youtube vid of a Japanese match between a Cammy vs O.Sagat, where the Sagat basically forced Cammy to jump straight up over and over to avoid getting hit by either the Tiger Shot or the Tiger Uppercut should she try to advance. I'd imagine this match would have been completely different if she had access to a Super Jump, Short Hop, Super Hop and Evasive Roll.
    maybe so but i've noticed that the more mobility options a fighting game has the slower they characters are. is it possible to have sf style precision spacing in kof?
  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    AirLancer said:
    Sexperienced. said:interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
    Well, how much more effective would most SF characters' offenses be if their jumps were twice as fast?

    That's how.
    kof characters seem a lot slower than SF characters.
    the7k said:
    Hecatom said:<br />
    For starters you have more mobility options in the form of the different type of jumps, that alone changes how those games are played.<br />
    <br />
    <br />
    interesting, how much does the jump height effect how KOF98 plays in comparison to ST?
    I remember an old youtube vid of a Japanese match between a Cammy vs O.Sagat, where the Sagat basically forced Cammy to jump straight up over and over to avoid getting hit by either the Tiger Shot or the Tiger Uppercut should she try to advance. I'd imagine this match would have been completely different if she had access to a Super Jump, Short Hop, Super Hop and Evasive Roll.
    maybe so but i've noticed that the more mobility options a fighting game has the slower they characters are. is it possible to have sf style precision spacing in kof?
  • the7kthe7k Kitty Pride. Joined: Posts: 5,274 ✭✭✭✭

    kof characters seem a lot slower than SF characters.<br />

    maybe so but i've noticed that the more mobility options a fighting game has the slower they characters are. is it possible to have sf style precision spacing in kof?
    I'm not an expert, especially on older KOFs (First KOF I played seriously was KOFXI on Atomiswave - while I enjoyed the older KOFs, I never had any real local competition with them or decent internet growing up), but I feel that even if the characters are technically slower, the game feels faster because of all the mobility options.

    By spacing, do you mean zoning? Or do you mean using pokes to keep enemies at bay? Either way, KOF definitely has both. In most KOFs, I play characters with very far-reaching, meaty pokes (Clark's St.D in KOFXIII is one of my favorite attacks of all time) to control the pace of the match. As for zoning, it exists, though not quite in the same form as SF. All the mobility options means it won't be as effective, but it is still very effective.
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  • NickRocksNickRocks On the west side I'm screaming FUCK KD Joined: Posts: 14,714 ✭✭✭✭✭
    so how did you guys do at your first ever tourney? I'm going to FR and just wondering how to combat the inevitable nerves
  • HD-ManHD-Man Big Apple 3 A.M Joined: Posts: 6,971 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2013
    My bad wrong topic. Disregard this post
    Post edited by HD-Man on

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  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2013
    the7k said:
    By spacing, do you mean zoning? Or do you mean using pokes to keep enemies at bay? Either way, KOF definitely has both. In most KOFs, I play characters with very far-reaching, meaty pokes (Clark's St.D in KOFXIII is one of my favorite attacks of all time) to control the pace of the match. As for zoning, it exists, though not quite in the same form as SF. All the mobility options means it won't be as effective, but it is still very effective.
    my definition of spacing is simply holding or tapping back to evade attacks and moving forward to counter said attack, this is more noticeable in a game like alpha2 because of proximity blocking, not so much ST... i'm currently looking for an example to show you...
    Post edited by Sexperienced. on
  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    HD-Man said:
    My bad wrong topic. Disregard this post
    there is no specific topic of discussion.
  • phoenixnlphoenixnl Joined: Posts: 538 ✭✭✭
    the7k said:
    By spacing, do you mean zoning? Or do you mean using pokes to keep enemies at bay? Either way, KOF definitely has both. In most KOFs, I play characters with very far-reaching, meaty pokes (Clark's St.D in KOFXIII is one of my favorite attacks of all time) to control the pace of the match. As for zoning, it exists, though not quite in the same form as SF. All the mobility options means it won't be as effective, but it is still very effective.
    my definition of spacing is simply holding or tapping back to evade attacks and moving forward to counter said attack, this is more noticeable in a game like alpha2 because of proximity blocking, not so much ST... i'm currently looking for an example to show you...
    Walkspeeds in KOF are very high compared to modern fighting games. So yes, there's quite a lot fo that. But usually you choose more proactive forms of evading attacks and counterattacks.

    For example you can stand in a position that your opponent might try to sweep you, and then you hop. If he sweeps you land with a jump attack right on top of him and get a full combo.

    Due to hops, the 'height' of an attack becomes a lot more relevant. like, a st.HP of chun-li has a significantly different effect from a cr.MK of ryu for example. Even though the ranges are roughly equivalent. cr.MK is more liable to being hopped over, while st.HP may be crouched under etc.
  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 2013
    the7k said:

    kof characters seem a lot slower than SF characters.<br />

    maybe so but i've noticed that the more mobility options a fighting game has the slower they characters are. is it possible to have sf style precision spacing in kof?
    I'm not an expert, especially on older KOFs (First KOF I played seriously was KOFXI on Atomiswave - while I enjoyed the older KOFs, I never had any real local competition with them or decent internet growing up), but I feel that even if the characters are technically slower, the game feels faster because of all the mobility options.

    By spacing, do you mean zoning? Or do you mean using pokes to keep enemies at bay? Either way, KOF definitely has both. In most KOFs, I play characters with very far-reaching, meaty pokes (Clark's St.D in KOFXIII is one of my favorite attacks of all time) to control the pace of the match. As for zoning, it exists, though not quite in the same form as SF. All the mobility options means it won't be as effective, but it is still very effective.

    here's an example of spacing, it starts at 33secs to the end of the video.
    Post edited by Sexperienced. on
  • krazykone123krazykone123 Kemosabe Joined: Posts: 2,775 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Messing around with Cammy in CVS2 right now, anyone have some tips for Roll Canceling?
  • rukawa_kaederukawa_kaede Badness At Its Finest Joined: Posts: 2,422 ✭✭✭
    looks like you need some tutorials


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF5yg2QH_Lw

    phoenixnl said:
    the7k said:
    By spacing, do you mean zoning? Or do you mean using pokes to keep enemies at bay? Either way, KOF definitely has both. In most KOFs, I play characters with very far-reaching, meaty pokes (Clark's St.D in KOFXIII is one of my favorite attacks of all time) to control the pace of the match. As for zoning, it exists, though not quite in the same form as SF. All the mobility options means it won't be as effective, but it is still very effective.
    my definition of spacing is simply holding or tapping back to evade attacks and moving forward to counter said attack, this is more noticeable in a game like alpha2 because of proximity blocking, not so much ST... i'm currently looking for an example to show you...
    Walkspeeds in KOF are very high compared to modern fighting games. So yes, there's quite a lot fo that. But usually you choose more proactive forms of evading attacks and counterattacks.
    i didnt even know you could walk in kof. in all the match vids i've seen the characters either jump or run or sometimes roll.

  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 5,193 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Can anyone recommend some lesser-known fast-paced games like MvC2 and VS? I know Jojo's can get a bit crazy but other than that I don't have lots of experience with fast-paced titles.
  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Can anyone recommend some lesser-known fast-paced games like MvC2 and VS? I know Jojo's can get a bit crazy but other than that I don't have lots of experience with fast-paced titles.
    Skullgirls as long as you aren't playing with/against Fortune.
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  • tatakitataki Non-SF4/MVC3 FG news: twitter.com/#!/novriltataki Joined: Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2013
    2013/2/20 High level Karnov's Revenge
    Post edited by tataki on
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  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 5,193 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Which FGs have top tier grapplers?
  • HecatomHecatom (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 13,487 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Anyone knows if the FR XVI videos would be uploaded to youtube?
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
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  • tatakitataki Non-SF4/MVC3 FG news: twitter.com/#!/novriltataki Joined: Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Which FGs have top tier grapplers?
    SFA3, KOF98, AH1.
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  • Negative-Zer0Negative-Zer0 Joined: Posts: 5,677 ✭✭✭✭✭
    If everyone else could move upwards socially, so can blacks. They are just dumb.
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  • DavDzDavDz Joined: Posts: 464
    So there was a fighting game double pack that contained both SoulCalibur IV and Tekken 6 in the package. I was wondering that if you buy Soulcalibur IV from this double pack, does the game contain all of the DLC [Specifically the DLC Star Wars characters such as Yoda for the PS3 version or Darth Vader for the Xbox 360 version] available at the start, or do you still have to pay to unlock a Star Wars character?

    If you still have to pay for it, that's kinda lame and would kind of defeat the purpose of buying it
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  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    Posted by someone on my G+.

    ibwI1puhNCjqAg.gif

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  • HecatomHecatom (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 13,487 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I don't even need that to not buy the nextbox.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
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    ( •_•)
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  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    Welp, IPL's dead. I guess we're not eSports anymore.
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  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    Fuckin' A! If you want us to share your damn video on the front page, don't fucking set it to private.

    /rant
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  • krazykone123krazykone123 Kemosabe Joined: Posts: 2,775 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Why do Capcom fans allow front runner games like UMvC3/SSFIVAE/SFxTK pass with such shitty netcode?

    It's 2013 and the majority of my wired connections (3/4 bars) in UMVC3 are horrendous compared to even my wireless connections in Skullgirls/VF5FS/Blazblue/TTT2.
    Why is this allowed? It's been 4 years since SFIV debuted on consoles, you'd think Capcom would've gotten an earful by now that their netcode is shit.
  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    SFxT has decent rollback based netcode. It may not be up to current GGPO standards, but neither was GGPO back in the day.
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  • King9999King9999 Mega Men Joined: Posts: 8,589 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm really impressed with VF5FS's netcode. It's a shame that game doesn't get more love.

    So why doesn't that game get more love?
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  • SirMixahLotSirMixahLot Proud Shoryuken.com member since 2003 Joined: Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭✭✭
    http://www.geekexchange.com/capcoms-25-greatest-fighting-games-53275.html#.UW1Qxhg9uBg.gmail

    Pretty crappy list, I think...
    Alpha 2 gold, but no A2? All 3 versions of SF4? WW being #1? GTFO...

    Marvel vs. Capcom 2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  • jedpossumjedpossum Ok, Darling Joined: Posts: 4,092 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2013
    World Warrior on the snes is Capcom's best selling game only game to come close was RE 5(only if you count both versions).
    Yeah, that list is so bad I can't think enough bad words to even describe it.
    Post edited by jedpossum on
    "Nobody should worry about being wrong on SRK. Everybody is going to be wrong." - WTF-AKUMA-HAX I occasionally stream so you can see how boring poking around in the memory is. http://www.twitch.tv/mountainmanjed
  • SirMixahLotSirMixahLot Proud Shoryuken.com member since 2003 Joined: Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2013
    jedpossum wrote: »
    World Warrior on the snes is Capcom's best selling game only game to come close was RE 5(only if you count both versions).
    Yeah, that list is so bad I can't think enough bad words to even describe it.

    Yeah... The order doesn't make sense, and half the games don't make sense...
    Glad Slam Masters got love though... But no Hyper Fighting or Champion Edition? Super Turbo = no, but HDR?

    I mean...
    1-5 range could include: MvC2 &/or UMvC3, CvS2, 3S, Super Turbo, and SSF4AE2012 or whatever, and the order depends on who you ask...
    After that, 6-10 range could include: Vampire Savior, Alpha 2 &/or Alpha 3, Hyper Fighting &/or Champion Edition, Project Justice, MvC1, again order depends.
    10-25 is some combination of Project Justice, Power Stone 2, Slam Masters, other Vs. games, other Vampire games, MSH/CotA, HDR, Cyberbots, maybe Pocket Fighter, and even Battle Circuit or Megaman Power Fighters... But having PJ and Rival Schools or both PS games is fucking silly...
    Post edited by SirMixahLot on
    Marvel vs. Capcom 2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  • Sexperienced.Sexperienced. kdh Joined: Posts: 4,841 ✭✭✭✭
    oh, I'm currently creating my own fighting game thats the reason why i was asking for the SF vs KOF comparison
    http://www.geekexchange.com/capcoms-25-greatest-fighting-games-53275.html#.UW1Qxhg9uBg.gmail

    Pretty crappy list, I think...
    Alpha 2 gold, but no A2? All 3 versions of SF4? WW being #1? GTFO...

    gutter trash list. how can street fighter 2 turbo, A2 and ST not be in the top 3.
  • jedpossumjedpossum Ok, Darling Joined: Posts: 4,092 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This is so goofy I can see why it didn't get used.
    "Nobody should worry about being wrong on SRK. Everybody is going to be wrong." - WTF-AKUMA-HAX I occasionally stream so you can see how boring poking around in the memory is. http://www.twitch.tv/mountainmanjed
  • d3vd3v #MAXCPM Fiber Override Joined: Posts: 23,973 mod
    Why is it that in the west, you have different notation methods for different games? Over here in the far east, most everyone just uses numeric directions.
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  • 4neqs4neqs thick_thighs Joined: Posts: 9,260 ✭✭✭✭✭
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Which FGs have top tier grapplers?

    Street Fighter EX1 (OG, plus and Alpha) games

    Zangief + EX series in general, pretty high up iirc

    "But that's SRK for you. SFIV could have a feature where Chun-Li steps out of the TV and gives the players blowjobs, and some would still complain because she wasn't Sakura." --Azrael(?)
  • SirMixahLotSirMixahLot Proud Shoryuken.com member since 2003 Joined: Posts: 3,379 ✭✭✭✭✭
    4neqs wrote: »
    ilitirit wrote: »
    Which FGs have top tier grapplers?

    Street Fighter EX1 (OG, plus and Alpha) games

    Zangief + EX series in general, pretty high up iirc
    to add to this:
    Vanilla SF4 Gief
    Super Turbo O.Hawk
    Marvel vs. Capcom 2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
  • CyclopsPawnchCyclopsPawnch PEW PEW Joined: Posts: 100
    Never played MKvsDC before. Why do people say that it sucks?
  • Hyper InfernoHyper Inferno Joined: Posts: 473
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