Marvel 101: The UMVC3 Basics Thread

24

Comments

  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    Bill wrote: »
    That team has too much derp and will lead to too many fraudulent wins for someone new to the game--it will prevent them from developing smart gameplans. A character with a one frame command grab that leads to huge damage who also has a lightning fast teleport and does huge damage with even basic combos once his glasses are off does not sound like a good way to learn fundamentals. I don't think I even need to say anything about having Vergil anchor in terms of the impact on developing fundamentals.

    I'm with Viscant on this one. His idea of starting out with Magneto/Doom/Sentinel is perfect. It encourages teaching someone to think and it will teach you the game. It's not loaded with derp--which is perfect. No teleport + assist free mixups whenever you please, no normals that can be mashed out like mad to give you a free hit when you're under pressure/don't know what to do, and no Dark anchor gimmicks to comeback after someone has outplayed you.

    False on everything you just said.

    1. The team has derp but Wesker cannot derp in this game anymore like he use to. Marvel at a high level prevents Wesker to start all his bullshit like he use to unless Wesker plays footsies. Your spacing with him has to be A-1 to win with him, or they need to keep getting hit with dumb stuff.

    2. Wesker doing huge damage? Show me a combo where he kills Thor. Or even himself. I know of one combo that does ALMOST 1 million but that shit isn't practical at all.

    3. Vergil anchor is derp but everybody plays it and he supports Wesker more than one way. He actually has a purpose outside of derping it up in xf3.

    4. Magneto/Doom/Sentinel can teach you the game but if you say its not loaded with derp, you are wrong. Magneto with drones can get brain dead. You can call assist and play tippy toes with there head.

    5. Anchor Sentinel is actually really good and derpy.

    I was about to say for magneto play Magneto/Doom/Sentinel though.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 58,004 mod
    edited June 2013
    Yeah Wesker was durp back during NEC11. Which even that early on the tier thread (including myself) were already shaky about keeping him as a top tier. Now he's just a character and if your opponent isn't flying above the assist for teleport mix ups and doesn't know to pushblock Wesker's normals to keep away from command grab setup, then yeah.

    The only way to learn to fight the durp really is just to use it yourself and play against people who actually know how to deal with it.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    I also think that Dante would be a good ass fundamental learning character if it weren't for the concept of bold canceling being really strict nowadays. Dante has really good reach with some of his normals, an airdash, decent ground dash, a teleport, good ground control and some really interesting incomings. Dante's major problem is damage. I think the best I've seen from him solo is 650k, might be 700k, which is unacceptable nowadays in this game. But a good team with good DHC's can solve that problem easily.

    So Wesker, Dante and Magneto are IMO the best characters to learn the game with, by rank of who teaches you the best, I'd have to say:

    1. Magneto
    2. Wesker
    3. Dante

    And the best teams IMO to learn the game with is:

    Wesker/Magneto/Vergil
    Magneto/Doom/Sentinel
    Dante/Doom/Sentinel
    Wesker/Dante/Magneto

    That's just me though. I would like to know Devil Jin's opinion on this.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • BillBill Joined: Posts: 1,278
    Cee Dizzy wrote: »
    Bill wrote: »
    That team has too much derp and will lead to too many fraudulent wins for someone new to the game--it will prevent them from developing smart gameplans. A character with a one frame command grab that leads to huge damage who also has a lightning fast teleport and does huge damage with even basic combos once his glasses are off does not sound like a good way to learn fundamentals. I don't think I even need to say anything about having Vergil anchor in terms of the impact on developing fundamentals.

    I'm with Viscant on this one. His idea of starting out with Magneto/Doom/Sentinel is perfect. It encourages teaching someone to think and it will teach you the game. It's not loaded with derp--which is perfect. No teleport + assist free mixups whenever you please, no normals that can be mashed out like mad to give you a free hit when you're under pressure/don't know what to do, and no Dark anchor gimmicks to comeback after someone has outplayed you.

    False on everything you just said.

    1. The team has derp but Wesker cannot derp in this game anymore like he use to. Marvel at a high level prevents Wesker to start all his bullshit like he use to unless Wesker plays footsies. Your spacing with him has to be A-1 to win with him, or they need to keep getting hit with dumb stuff.

    2. Wesker doing huge damage? Show me a combo where he kills Thor. Or even himself. I know of one combo that does ALMOST 1 million but that shit isn't practical at all.

    3. Vergil anchor is derp but everybody plays it and he supports Wesker more than one way. He actually has a purpose outside of derping it up in xf3.

    4. Magneto/Doom/Sentinel can teach you the game but if you say its not loaded with derp, you are wrong. Magneto with drones can get brain dead. You can call assist and play tippy toes with there head.

    5. Anchor Sentinel is actually really good and derpy.

    I was about to say for magneto play Magneto/Doom/Sentinel though.


    WTH? Is this thread aimed at beginners or for someone trying to win EVO 2013? Everything you said only applies to the game as it is played at an extremely high level.

    1. Wesker can derp like mad at levels that aren't high--and he does fine even at a high level. But again why in world are we talking about high level Marvel? I thought the title was the Marvel basics thread. Port + assist is brutal at a low level of play and even at a high level it's great. Wesker is left at frame advantage after a port + assist and he has a 1 frame command grab. That means he's 100 % safe after any port + beam/projectile assist AND if they press a button after blocking his crouching light will always win out. And if they continue blocking they will get command grabbed. That's an absurdly favorable scenario for something as braindead as port + assist and will slaughter other beginning players. Completely negating the incentive to learn strategies etc.

    2. Wesker easily does 800-900K for one bar and no assists--that's great. Add on assists and you can get 1 mill or of course you can just DHC. You're using the fact that a character can't kill Thor as a sign that he doesn't do a lot of damage? That's an absurd standard for someone at the beginner level.

    3. Doesn't matter--he encourages awful habits and will lead to a slew of wins just by x factoring and using swords.

    4. Magneto with drones is a joke for a beginner level player. First beam assists maul the drones and the majority of players, even beginners, run one beam assist. Making matters worse, even if the beginner confirms after the drones, it won't matter because he won't be doing more than 400K anyway--if he's lucky--because all of Magneto's combos that do any damage are some of the hardest bnbs in the game. A beginner isn't landing the hyper grav loop, will have a hard time with his basic fly combo, and won't have 3 bars every time they get a hit to gravity squeeze. Using Magneto as a beginner will cause you to get slaughtered; but you will learn a lot.


    5. I actually kind of agree with this. But it isn't anywhere near the level of Vergil.
  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    Bill wrote: »
    WTH? Is this thread aimed at beginners or for someone trying to win EVO 2013? Everything you said only applies to the game as it is played at an extremely high level.

    1. Wesker can derp like mad at levels that aren't high--and he does fine even at a high level. But again why in world are we talking about high level Marvel? I thought the title was the Marvel basics thread. Port + assist is brutal at a low level of play and even at a high level it's great. Wesker is left at frame advantage after a port + assist and he has a 1 frame command grab. That means he's 100 % safe after any port + beam/projectile assist AND if they press a button after blocking his crouching light will always win out. And if they continue blocking they will get command grabbed. That's an absurdly favorable scenario for something as braindead as port + assist and will slaughter other beginning players. Completely negating the incentive to learn strategies etc.

    2. Wesker easily does 800-900K for one bar and no assists--that's great. Add on assists and you can get 1 mill or of course you can just DHC. You're using the fact that a character can't kill Thor as a sign that he doesn't do a lot of damage? That's an absurd standard for someone at the beginner level.

    3. Doesn't matter--he encourages awful habits and will lead to a slew of wins just by x factoring and using swords.

    4. Magneto with drones is a joke for a beginner level player. First beam assists maul the drones and the majority of players, even beginners, run one beam assist. Making matters worse, even if the beginner confirms after the drones, it won't matter because he won't be doing more than 400K anyway--if he's lucky--because all of Magneto's combos that do any damage are some of the hardest bnbs in the game. A beginner isn't landing the hyper grav loop, will have a hard time with his basic fly combo, and won't have 3 bars every time they get a hit to gravity squeeze. Using Magneto as a beginner will cause you to get slaughtered; but you will learn a lot.


    5. I actually kind of agree with this. But it isn't anywhere near the level of Vergil.
    You will learn from the basics of moving, to combo creation, to team compositions and even advanced tactics of the insanity that this game is

    That answers your question.

    1. If you can pushblock and jump against Wesker, you win. Spacing and whiff punishing is how you win against Wesker.

    2. Wesker does 850k without glasses and 750k with glasses. That is his max optimal BNB off a low. You'd be lucky if you get 900k with 2 assists. Stop it.

    3. What you just said was retarded. Its like saying Sentinel taught you bad habits because he was so good and oppressive. Vergil is a good character and I think that he helps Wesker out in many ways, so stop it.

    4. LOL. Magneto/Drones is a joke? Play Ray Ray and come back to me.

    5. No he's not, but he's still fucking derpy and you are lying to yourself if you think that playing Vergil wouldn't teach you the game.

    In conclusion, stop it.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • BillBill Joined: Posts: 1,278
    Cee Dizzy wrote: »
    Bill wrote: »
    WTH? Is this thread aimed at beginners or for someone trying to win EVO 2013? Everything you said only applies to the game as it is played at an extremely high level.

    1. Wesker can derp like mad at levels that aren't high--and he does fine even at a high level. But again why in world are we talking about high level Marvel? I thought the title was the Marvel basics thread. Port + assist is brutal at a low level of play and even at a high level it's great. Wesker is left at frame advantage after a port + assist and he has a 1 frame command grab. That means he's 100 % safe after any port + beam/projectile assist AND if they press a button after blocking his crouching light will always win out. And if they continue blocking they will get command grabbed. That's an absurdly favorable scenario for something as braindead as port + assist and will slaughter other beginning players. Completely negating the incentive to learn strategies etc.

    2. Wesker easily does 800-900K for one bar and no assists--that's great. Add on assists and you can get 1 mill or of course you can just DHC. You're using the fact that a character can't kill Thor as a sign that he doesn't do a lot of damage? That's an absurd standard for someone at the beginner level.

    3. Doesn't matter--he encourages awful habits and will lead to a slew of wins just by x factoring and using swords.

    4. Magneto with drones is a joke for a beginner level player. First beam assists maul the drones and the majority of players, even beginners, run one beam assist. Making matters worse, even if the beginner confirms after the drones, it won't matter because he won't be doing more than 400K anyway--if he's lucky--because all of Magneto's combos that do any damage are some of the hardest bnbs in the game. A beginner isn't landing the hyper grav loop, will have a hard time with his basic fly combo, and won't have 3 bars every time they get a hit to gravity squeeze. Using Magneto as a beginner will cause you to get slaughtered; but you will learn a lot.


    5. I actually kind of agree with this. But it isn't anywhere near the level of Vergil.
    You will learn from the basics of moving, to combo creation, to team compositions and even advanced tactics of the insanity that this game is

    That answers your question.

    1. If you can pushblock and jump against Wesker, you win. Spacing and whiff punishing is how you win against Wesker.

    2. Wesker does 850k without glasses and 750k with glasses. That is his max optimal BNB off a low. You'd be lucky if you get 900k with 2 assists. Stop it.

    3. What you just said was retarded. Its like saying Sentinel taught you bad habits because he was so good and oppressive. Vergil is a good character and I think that he helps Wesker out in many ways, so stop it.

    4. LOL. Magneto/Drones is a joke? Play Ray Ray and come back to me.

    5. No he's not, but he's still fucking derpy and you are lying to yourself if you think that playing Vergil wouldn't teach you the game.

    In conclusion, stop it.

    1. LOL no that's a free air throw into another combo which can also lead into a reset

    2. I'm talking about with a DHC--very few characters hit 900K by themselves.

    3. No it's not "retarded" as you so eloquently put it. A character like Vergil has many "get out of jail free" cards that encourage horrible habits. For example he heavily encourages mashing because his normals have absurd priority and absurd hitboxes. If you are having trouble against an opponent simply mashing H, S oftentimes will not only save you, but will actually give you a happy birthday as well. Same thing with spiral swords, It encourages someone who doesn't have a strategy or understand proper neutral actions to just activate spiral swords and go in because many characters don't have an option against that. It's not about simply being a strong character, Magneto is very strong, but you can't just mash on his normals when you're in trouble or activate a super that prevents your opponent from doing anything until it's expired. You have to block, think, attack when it's safe, develop a gameplan etc.

    OBVIOUSLY if you're playing against Filipino Champ or Yipes that will not work lol, before you bring up that kind of argument again. I am talking about BEGINNERS.

    4. LOL your reading comp is atrocious--within the first sentence I said BEGINNERS. No shit one of the world's best players is oppressive with Magneto drones. The point is that this is aimed at BEGINNERS. A beginner is going to get slaughtered playing Magneto point with any assist--it really doesn't matter.

    5. Honestly, the first part of this sentence is completely incoherent--it's inconsistent with your first post and my response to it. And if by teach, you mean show someone how to X factor, activate swords, activate devil trigger, and then rapid slash and teleport until they get a hit then yes it will "teach" them the game.


    All that being said this isn't the place for a debate since it's to help people so I'm just going to leave it at that. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion about a video game anyway lol.
  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    ^^^^ To everything you just said, you are wrong again and you are not thinking. I thought I was bad at arguing. You make me sound like a lawyer.

    And again, stop it.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • TheDarkPhoenixTheDarkPhoenix BEHOLD! Joined: Posts: 12,622 mod
    Any tips on backwards wave dashing (non plink) I fail so hard at it, I get a super or special 100% of the time.
    "this game is about winning, If you had the option of a 1) Big dick or 2) a small dick, would you choose 2 because it took more skill? Thought not"
    -Bokkin
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 58,004 mod
    Well if you ask me...this is Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 and they made the game to be accessible while still being as cheap as possible. This isn't a game to be telling people what to pick or who to pick to start out with. You don't tell people to start gangbanging in the hood with something fair like a tall bucket or a knife to work on their gang fundamentals. If the dudes out there are using guns and ducking behind cars, you do the same. If you don't, you will probably die a lot faster. That's life, that's also Marvel.

    You're going to pick some "fundamentals" team to learn the game or whatever the fuck and then fight PR Rog who's going to go HAM with Wolverine/Doom/Vergil and you're either going to have to learn how to fundamentally deal with it or just pick up what he's doing also. Which even a player like him who just goes in with a character who does that well with horizontal assist, he still is going to land hits more consistently than other players and his execution is pretty strong for someone who uses a team like that. If Wolverine/Doom/Vergil is fucking shit up, that's a fundamental team within the game and you have to learn how to execute it or learn how to fight against it by using it or fighting against it often enough. This is a player who would beat you with any team any ways regardless of how fundamental unless you are on or near his play level.

    You don't tell people to not pick Makoto or Yun in 3S because you can bypass footsie games and grab people up with Mak or sit back and build meter until you win footsie wars with Genei Jin. No...that's just the way the game fucking works and you either pick a character with strong footsies to work against it or pick another character that just goes in before they get their shit started. Each character is still a fundamental tool within the game and it's on you to figure out how to use your tools against the other cast.



    It really doesn't matter how durpy or not so fundamental of a character/team a beginner picks up. Eventually they're going to play against someone who plays a team that has options to deal with obvious teleport+assist setups where the beginner isn't caring when or why they throw out the assist vs. the opponent. Especially if the other person is playing a character like Magneto who can just fly around and H/S swat the Strider assist or just flat out move around it while staying above beam and drones assists. They will learn to stop mashing helm breakers on incoming and during the neutral when the opponent meaties or chicken blocks and punishes enough times. If you pick a specific type of team you're just going to run into players who use those "non fundamental" teams any ways. There's a way to play dirty with every team and there really isn't much any character in this game that doesn't have something yolo that you should just do cuz it works.

    The game is in fighting against all of it long enough to learn specific options in the neutral for dealing with it before you are the one taking the incoming mix up.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    Any tips on backwards wave dashing (non plink) I fail so hard at it, I get a super or special 100% of the time.
    1. Your signature is fucking godlike

    2. Backwards wavedashing is just simply back, dash, downback. The best thing I can tell you is to go really slow at first then pick it up in speed as you go. I had trouble with it and I had to go extremely slow in order to get it down.
    Well if you ask me...this is Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 and they made the game to be accessible while still being as cheap as possible. This isn't a game to be telling people what to pick or who to pick to start out with. You don't tell people to start gangbanging in the hood with something fair like a tall bucket or a knife to work on their gang fundamentals. If the dudes out there are using guns and ducking behind cars, you do the same. If you don't, you will probably die a lot faster. That's life, that's also Marvel.

    You're going to pick some "fundamentals" team to learn the game or whatever the fuck and then fight PR Rog who's going to go HAM with Wolverine/Doom/Vergil and you're either going to have to learn how to fundamentally deal with it or just pick up what he's doing also. Which even a player like him who just goes in with a character who does that well with horizontal assist, he still is going to land hits more consistently than other players and his execution is pretty strong for someone who uses a team like that. If Wolverine/Doom/Vergil is fucking shit up, that's a fundamental team within the game and you have to learn how to execute it or learn how to fight against it by using it or fighting against it often enough. This is a player who would beat you with any team any ways regardless of how fundamental unless you are on or near his play level.

    You don't tell people to not pick Makoto or Yun in 3S because you can bypass footsie games and grab people up with Mak or sit back and build meter until you win footsie wars with Genei Jin. No...that's just the way the game fucking works and you either pick a character with strong footsies to work against it or pick another character that just goes in before they get their shit started. Each character is still a fundamental tool within the game and it's on you to figure out how to use your tools against the other cast.



    It really doesn't matter how durpy or not so fundamental of a character/team a beginner picks up. Eventually they're going to play against someone who plays a team that has options to deal with obvious teleport+assist setups where the beginner isn't caring when or why they throw out the assist vs. the opponent. Especially if the other person is playing a character like Magneto who can just fly around and H/S swat the Strider assist or just flat out move around it while staying above beam and drones assists. They will learn to stop mashing helm breakers on incoming and during the neutral when the opponent meaties or chicken blocks and punishes enough times. If you pick a specific type of team you're just going to run into players who use those "non fundamental" teams any ways. There's a way to play dirty with every team and there really isn't much any character in this game that doesn't have something yolo that you should just do cuz it works.

    The game is in fighting against all of it long enough to learn specific options in the neutral for dealing with it before you are the one taking the incoming mix up.

    You are 100% right sir.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • BillBill Joined: Posts: 1,278
    edited June 2013
    Cee Dizzy wrote: »
    ^^^^ To everything you just said, you are wrong again and you are not thinking. I thought I was bad at arguing. You make me sound like a lawyer.

    And again, stop it.

    Trust me as an actual lawyer (well in fairness a J.D.) no you don't--you have so many logical flaws in your arguments it's not even funny. Basically what your'e saying comes down to "pick whatever is the easiest to win with fastest" and that's it. You're also supporting a lot of your arguments with incorrect facts mixed with a lot of strawmen. Although I'm not even sure you know what a strawmen argument is.
  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    What the fuck? That's not what Im saying at all. Stop talking. Now I know you are bullshitting.

    I play this game way too much with people for me to spew out incorrect facts. Wesker to me is perfect to learn movement and "Marvel footsies". Magneto's beam is optimal for Wesker. Rapid slash is godlike for Wesker and Vergil is a great character/anchor. That's why Im saying pick the team, not because its easiest to win with the fastest. If I wanted people new that's starting off to pick what's easiest to win with fastest, I would of said pick something like Wolverine/Doom/Vergil and just go balls deep.

    I actually do know what a straw man argument is, but I never done that the whole time. I said the team, you said its too derpy because of Vergil, which is false btw, and then I gave my end of the argument, and then you said some bullshit about beginners and then I told you to stop talking. You probably did a straw man argument way more than I did. And you are suppose to be a Lawyer? Fuck outta here.

    Anyway, DJ is right pick some bullshit and learn from there. /debate.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 58,004 mod
    edited July 2013
    .

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • DestinDestin Ziggy Stardust Joined: Posts: 1,181
    . indeed
    I am the hero.
    HERO KENZAN!
  • KaoriKaori Would you like a demonstration? Joined: Posts: 1,172
    I might be answering my own question but I was wondering if the speed you do an basic c. L,M,H,S (or variations of) affects the combo? I'm asking because I've been trying to learn Morrigan's Bnb and have been struggling with the timing. I started doing the opener (s.L, s.M, c.H, s.H) slower and I've been getting the
    first rep more consistently

    In online videos it looks like players are hitting that opener really fast however and they always get it to connect.
  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    Kaori wrote: »
    I might be answering my own question but I was wondering if the speed you do an basic c. L,M,H,S (or variations of) affects the combo? I'm asking because I've been trying to learn Morrigan's Bnb and have been struggling with the timing. I started doing the opener (s.L, s.M, c.H, s.H) slower and I've been getting the
    first rep more consistently

    In online videos it looks like players are hitting that opener really fast however and they always get it to connect.

    Can I see what video you are talking about?

    And yes it can. I never experienced this on the ground but in the air I have. Cap's air to ground combo you have to slow it down a bit so you can get close to the ground for the charging star. Is that what you mean?
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • ifbpwnstarifbpwnstar Lab Monster Joined: Posts: 1,215
    edited July 2013
    Kaori wrote: »
    I might be answering my own question but I was wondering if the speed you do an basic c. L,M,H,S (or variations of) affects the combo? I'm asking because I've been trying to learn Morrigan's Bnb and have been struggling with the timing. I started doing the opener (s.L, s.M, c.H, s.H) slower and I've been getting the
    first rep more consistently

    In online videos it looks like players are hitting that opener really fast however and they always get it to connect.

    Yes. When you cancel moves in this game, most will instantly do it or buffer to the first available frame. This means that pushback, juggle height, and etc... can slightly deviate based on when you cancel. Most normals will have a lock out to buffer to the first available so they're pretty consistent (typically the lock out is to the first active frame). Individual character hurtboxes and the distance at the start can also heavily impact things
    MvCi: Gamora/Marvel - Soul
    SF 5: Nash
    UMvC3: Cap (SS) | Vergil (RS) | Strider (vajra)

  • RoyRekuRoyReku 我是Noob Joined: Posts: 19
    Kind of a random question, but what would you guys say is the most important technique for a beginner to master right away in this game? I've been using this guide in conjunction with a few other guides out there, and they have really helped out my game for the most part, though there are still some things I haven't been able to get right (when to attack/stop blocking during opponents attacks, how to correctly utilize assists, how to approach, etc..).
    UMVC3 Team : Zero, Vergil, Amaterasu
    Persona 4 Arena : Yu Narukami aka Proswagonist and Elizabeth
    BlazBlue : Noel, Jin
    Super Smash Bros Melee : Roy, Falco, Dr. Mario
    Super Smash Bros Brawl : Falco, Marth, Pikachu
    Super Smash Bros 4 : Mega Man, Rock Man, Jump n Shoot Man
  • CoosCoosCoosCoos Yep. Joined: Posts: 1,842 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Something I have always wondered about, what exactly is the definition of optimization when talking about this game?

    I see the term thrown around liberally but what constitutes to if something is optimal or not?
    AE: Fei

    Marvel: Mag/Doom/Dante

    UNIEL: Waldstein
  • DrSlouchDrSlouch Gyah gyah gyah gyah! Joined: Posts: 151
    edited August 2013
    Strictly speaking, it just means the same as it means in the general English language: "the best." The most you can make of that situation. In less literal terms, when people talk about, like, "optimizing" combos, for instance, it's usually implied that the general framework for the combo is more or less great, but there's little bits and bobs you could fit in still that don't change the meat of it. Like a combo involving normal-jump-height jump loops where you could maybe fit in an extra H or something at the end and it doesn't change your juggle timing or anything, but adds a little more damage/meter gain. That'd be optimizing a combo. In terms of team composition, when people say "optimal" teams they mean a team for character X that is the best possible team for them, most effectively bolstering their strengths/minimizing their weaknesses to make them the best they can be.
    My PSN ID is DrSlouch and my XBL is Doctor Slouch. My main UMvC3 team is Ryu/Firebrand/Sentinel, my back-up team is Thor/Dormammu/Dr. Strange, and my Skullgirls team is Filia/Peacock.
  • KaoriKaori Would you like a demonstration? Joined: Posts: 1,172
    What are box jumps? Are they just jumping, air dashing down forward with an attack?
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    Kaori wrote: »
    What are box jumps? Are they just jumping, air dashing down forward with an attack?
    That's a tri-dash. Box jumps/dashes are air dashing forward, then attacking.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
    Give me attention: @ LaziestNameEver
    PSN: Laziest_ID_Ever (I don't really play online)
    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • KaoriKaori Would you like a demonstration? Joined: Posts: 1,172
    Any way to practice Tiger Knee-ing just by itself?
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    Kaori wrote: »
    Any way to practice Tiger Knee-ing just by itself?
    Pick a character with an air OK special. Tiger Knee away.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
    Give me attention: @ LaziestNameEver
    PSN: Laziest_ID_Ever (I don't really play online)
    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • KaoriKaori Would you like a demonstration? Joined: Posts: 1,172
    What are active frames? Is it the period of time when an attack will do damage?
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    Kaori wrote: »
    What are active frames? Is it the period of time when an attack will do damage?
    Pretty much.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
    Give me attention: @ LaziestNameEver
    PSN: Laziest_ID_Ever (I don't really play online)
    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • KaoriKaori Would you like a demonstration? Joined: Posts: 1,172
    Are commentators talking about tech rolling when they say forward tech, neutral tech etc?
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    Kaori wrote: »
    Are commentators talking about tech rolling when they say forward tech, neutral tech etc?
    Pretty much, yeah. They might also be talking about air recovery, too.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
    Give me attention: @ LaziestNameEver
    PSN: Laziest_ID_Ever (I don't really play online)
    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • PLaTaNoPLaTaNo FPS Sensei Joined: Posts: 1
    Is there an "Adopt a Noob" thread anywhere around here? Just picked this game up for $5 bucks off the Xbox 360 Marketplace and I need some serious help working out the kinks. Doesn't help that I play claw now on my FPS games either/ Haaaalp :c .
    "Smoke good, eat good, live good."
    div%3E
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    PLaTaNo wrote: »
    Is there an "Adopt a Noob" thread anywhere around here? Just picked this game up for $5 bucks off the Xbox 360 Marketplace and I need some serious help working out the kinks. Doesn't help that I play claw now on my FPS games either/ Haaaalp :c .
    Try the newbie forum.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
    Give me attention: @ LaziestNameEver
    PSN: Laziest_ID_Ever (I don't really play online)
    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • AeonSphereAeonSphere Joined: Posts: 10
    Hey I copy pasted some of this from a thread I made just now

    I'm completely new to this game

    I think my team is probably gonna be Vergil,Wesker/Zero,Spiderman

    How do I start off? I've learned one BnB with Vergil which is LMH->Stinger->SHS->LMH (in air)->helm breaker->high time->trick->dimension slash
  • TimTimTimTim T-T-T-Timmay! Joined: Posts: 1,329
    AeonSphere wrote: »
    Hey I copy pasted some of this from a thread I made just now

    I'm completely new to this game

    I think my team is probably gonna be Vergil,Wesker/Zero,Spiderman

    How do I start off? I've learned one BnB with Vergil which is LMH->Stinger->SHS->LMH (in air)->helm breaker->high time->trick->dimension slash
    Replace
    LMH (in air) helm breaker with MMH (in air)
    You should almost never be using l in an air magic series.
    Especially not with vergil.
    A preferred order would be
    Spiderman/Zero , Wesker, Vergil.
    The last two are debatable but the Spiderman and Zero are definitely points.
    Just a lazy prick.
  • AeonSphereAeonSphere Joined: Posts: 10
    Ah, I see

    What about the other characters I mentioned, how do I start off learning to use them?
  • forte95forte95 Buster Cannoneer Joined: Posts: 546
    First, learn a combo. One that starts with a launcher and ends in a super. This is your preliminary BnB. A simple combo is best; you don't want to spend too much time dwelling on combos without knowing enough about the game.

    Next, play. Play with people around your skill level. Experiment with your characters' moves and see what can be used to hit the opponent without getting yourself hit. Not every move is going to be useful; settle only for the safe ones ("safe" depends on the situation, but it basically means there's a small chance of getting hit if you use the move). If you get hit while doing a move, remember what move you were doing and what move your opponent was doing, then learn from the situation. If you do hit the opponent, combo into launcher and do your BnB.

    After you play a lot of matches, you're gonna have some sort of idea how to use that character. Remember the moves that you frequently use to get the hit? Learn the optimized BnB followups to those, since chances are those moves are the ones that are gonna be hitting often.

    Finally, read. There's a lot of information here that can help you become better. It can be overwhelming if you don't know what to look for, so make sure you actually play before you read so that you would know what you're struggling with.
    I'm a physics enthusiast. Let's talk science.
  • AeonSphereAeonSphere Joined: Posts: 10
    I'm struggling with learning Zero haha, what's a good approach for him?
  • mapleleafs791mapleleafs791 Joined: Posts: 866
    edited December 2013
    Note: i have read the whole srk marvel wiki and i play sf4 and sfxt so im not completely retarded but...
    In marvel i feel completely dumb. i am going to watch a ton of footage obviously in the next couple days but as
    I got it during the sale on the 23rd im obviously fresh. I have a couple questions as i learn this game and i have yet to go play yet so im a clean slate for tips...

    my team is magneto/doom/sentinel
    ----
    1. how the hell do you play the neutral game in general this game is wacky compared to what im used to in SF4 or cross tekken. is there a marvel footsies guide? (i am aware it varies with characters)

    2. Why should I learn mag/doom/sent instead of mag/doom/vergil (as a new player that wants to learn the game as a whole iv heard sent is a good learning tool but this is not my first fighter so im wondering if i should still stick with the advice or just learn vergil as the teams i am interested in are x/doom/vergil for the large majority). [keep in mind this isnt my first fihter but is sent that good in learning marvel?]

    3. wtf is guard breaking. I dont get what the hell is going on when i read posts about it. something about reducing incoming throw invincibility + some other stuff?!?! Help me out if you can i just dont know how incoming mixups even work or guard breaks in general.

    4. how do you defend TAC’s I hear stuff about spinning the stick? but then i hear about max TAC break attempts in so many frames so spinning shouldnt work the way i understand it. so can you spin or should you pick one direction


    http://www.blockstring.com/ 
    XBL GT: Chilaisho
    SSF4 AE 2012: Cody, Evil Ryu, Yun
    SFxT: Law x Kazuya
    UMvC3: Magneto, Dormammu, Doom 
    Smash Bros Melee: Marth, Shiek
    Heroes of the Storm, Hearthstone:
    SpoR | 1589
    My Personal SF4 Dropbox Folder of tipshttps://www.dropbox.com/sh/irhsi8omjpubcss/AAA7GYqwfB1cEFwDuixkLrgUa?dl=0 


  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    Did you read the thread AeonSphere?

    Pick a character, learn how to move with the character.

    Then learn the moveset and how to use them.

    Then you go straight into combos.

    Its bad to go into a match just pressing buttons online and shit. That's a quick way to be blown up and discourage yourself from this game.

    Note: i have read the whole srk marvel wiki and i play sf4 and sfxt so im not completely retarded but...
    In marvel i feel completely dumb. i am going to watch a ton of footage obviously in the next couple days but as
    I got it during the sale on the 23rd im obviously fresh. I have a couple questions as i learn this game and i have yet to go play yet so im a clean slate for tips...

    my team is magneto/doom/sentinel
    ----
    1. how the hell do you play the neutral game in general this game is wacky compared to what im used to in SF4 or cross tekken. is there a marvel footsies guide? (i am aware it varies with characters)

    2. Why should I learn mag/doom/sent instead of mag/doom/vergil (as a new player that wants to learn the game as a whole iv heard sent is a good learning tool but this is not my first fighter so im wondering if i should still stick with the advice or just learn vergil as the teams i am interested in are x/doom/vergil for the large majority). [keep in mind this isnt my first fihter but is sent that good in learning marvel?]

    3. wtf is guard breaking. I dont get what the hell is going on when i read posts about it. something about reducing incoming throw invincibility + some other stuff?!?! Help me out if you can i just dont know how incoming mixups even work or guard breaks in general.

    4. how do you defend TAC’s I hear stuff about spinning the stick? but then i hear about max TAC break attempts in so many frames so spinning shouldnt work the way i understand it. so can you spin or should you pick one direction


    1. Neutral game in Marvel is basically movement. Either getting in or keeping them out. In SF4 and SFxT, players walk back and forth alot trying to make them whiff a button or catch them doing something stupid and punishable. Same thing pretty much in Marvel. There is alot of movement and projectiles, assist calls and buttons in general thrown out until someone can get some offense started.

    2. There is no reason why you shouldn't learn Mag/Doom/Vergil instead of Mag/Doom/Sentinel. Mag/Doom/Sentinel is a great Magneto team but Mag/Doom/Vergil is such a ridiculously good team in Marvel 3. If you wanna learn that, go ahead. Just as long as you learn to play the game properly in the end. The high level players will blow you up, even if your team is ridiculous, if you don't know the game and how to play it.

    3. I can't explain a guard break in this game entirely, but I can tell you that a guard break is a throw you can't tech due to the extra frames given on the pushblock. Magneto has hella good guardbreaks. So does Doom and Sentinel. Hell, even Vergil.

    4. I actually think spinning the stick once is possible. I seen Winrich do it and I never seen him get TAC'ed in person. I pick one direction. Its a guess that can mean life or death of your character.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
  • JaykitJaykit Joined: Posts: 2
    It's amazing how helpful this is, when you read the entire thing.

    Something I've been stuck on is plink dashing, which I thought was well explained. Is there anything to make it easier? Practiced for a while and still can't get it down consistently. That frame difference is ridiculously hard to pull off - but I guess that's what more practice is for.
  • Cee DizzyCee Dizzy The shit I don't like Joined: Posts: 3,408
    Have you ever impatiently waited in an office? Maybe at work and shit for quitting time? Notice how some people strum their fingers on the table with their first 3 fingers? Think about it like that. Just do it alot faster.

    It took me like 2 weeks to learn how to do it and use it in actual matches.
    https://www.facebook.com/FGCCoble <--- Friend me https://twitter.com/CeeDizzy313 <---- Follow UMVC3: Wolverine/Doom/Vergil, Team Nemo SF4: Fei Long, Rolento Injustice: Aquamane, TTT2: AK/Heihachi, Alex/Kuma
Sign In or Register to comment.