2014 Firebrand Team Building Guide and discussion

KresentKresent For Science. You Monster.Joined: Posts: 793
edited May 2014 in Firebrand
Foreword
Edited(5/7/2014): I've re-written a lot of this thread, updating it for 2014.

Firebrand is a character who demands a lot from his team. He generally doesn't offer much, but there are unique synergies amongst every character. This thread will be periodically updated to add information to it. However, I only play Firebrand with a couple of characters (Dormammu, Doom, Amaterasu). While I can learn a lot from watching other players, there's only so much one person can know. Because of this:

If you want information added to this main post, state your case
By this, I mean try to bring information that is both credible, TESTED/TESTABLE, and worth while. Firebrand has a lot of character specific combos and Bon Voyage hard tags can have a lot of variables involved. If you're trying to demonstrate a combo or set up with Firebrand and someone else, try to have a video for it. If a character doesn't have their own section listed below, it means that I do not know enough about them to write it, and no one else has done it yet. If you want to write a section about a character, please try to follow some kind of format so that I can keep this thread pretty consistent. Please use proper punctuation and grammar, or I'll have to be the one to edit it. If your information is good and I add it to the thread, I will credit you. I would love to eventually have some information about every character, but I can't do it alone.


This thread is for the discussion of Firebrand teams. This guide in the first post is just a bonus to the thread. Feel free to post about potential Firebrand teams, discuss specific teams, and about your own team and ask for advice about it.


Without further ado, let us talk about Firebrand

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Firebrand is a character that demands a lot from his team. He boasts some of the best actual mix ups, as he is one of the only characters to have a (near) universal instant overhead (j.L) on the whole cast, but he also has both Bon Voyage and a command dash to go back to the ground for another high/low. Both of those tools also work very well for left/right mix-ups as well, but these mix-ups all require an assist to be truly threatening. Yet despite his strong mix-ups, his low base damage and minimum scaling causes him to lot on his partners to build the damage and meter for him. Unblockable set-ups are unreliable without assists or DHCs behind them, and fuzzy guards are a lot hard without an assist.

This post is dedicated to the individual characters and how they work with Firebrand. I will first cover assists briefly, and then more in depth in the individual character's page. Please feel agree to argue with me, as it is impossible for me not to insert my opinion sometimes.


So what are you looking for in a partner? The first thing you'll need is a good assist. Firebrand likes having something that has lockdown, enough for at least one or two mix-ups. You want something that has some form of durability too, usually something fast like a beam and having something for unblockable set-ups is always nice. This following section considers ONLY the assists, not other synergy. Not every assist is listed, there are no order in the tiers, and the gaps between the tiers are pretty small. This list does not consider assists primarily used in unblockable set-ups. They have their own section below. For more info on specific assists, refer to each characters individual section.

Assist rankings for Firebrand (No order within tiers)
Tier 1(Top): Dr. Doom (Plasma Beam), Iron Man (Unibeam), Amaterasu (Cold Star), Akuma (Tatsumaki Zankukyaku)
Tier 2: Dr. Doom (Molecular Shield), Dante (Jam Session), Iron Man (Repulsor Blast), Rocket Raccoon (Log Trap),
Tier 3: Dr. Doom (Hidden Missiles), Dante (Weasel Shot), Magneto (Electromagnetic Disruptor), Frank West (Shopping Cart), Sentinel (Drones), Hawkeye (Triple Arrow), Rocket Raccoon (Spitfire Twice)


Assists that can be used for "inescapable" unblockable loops on incoming
Super Skrull (Tenderizer)
Iron Man (Repulsor Blast)
Dante (Jam Session)



This next section will focus on the individual characters. I will try to stick to some form of formatting, but it might change slightly from character to character.

Akuma
I ran Firebrand/Akuma for over a year so I have a lot of knowledge about this. Unfortunately, their synergy is average, at best.

Assist: Tatsu is one of the top assists for Firebrand, and the only one of Akuma's worth using. It provides very fast lockdown that allows for instant overheads or fake out lows. Quick recovery and short lockdown means you get to use it a lot. It's great as a GTFO for Firebrand against certain characters as well, also giving him projectile negation potential. As far as rushdown Firebrand goes, Tatsu is the best assist for relentless pressure and mix-ups.

DHC/THC: The DHC synergy here is unfortunately lackluster. Dark Fire brings them too high for beam and the last hit of the beam brings them too high for all of Dark Fire to hit (If any of it at all). Since you better be running Tatsu, your THC will be the uppercut super. This is actually pretty good for Firebrand because Dark Fire carries them at the exact same speed/angle. So, in most cases where you want to use two meters, just THC instead. Most Firebrand/Akuma teams will have a character in the middle to mitigate the TAC/DHC/THC problems.

TAC: None

Conclusion: The best part about having Akuma is the Tatsu. It is amazing for Firebrand, especially for rush down. The quick start up, fast travel speed, high priority, and low duration combine to allow Firebrand to keep it fast and a lot. The lockdown is just long enough for at least one mix up every time, it doesn't scale much, and the projectile negation and high priority helps a lot with Firebrand's lack of invincibility. However, the DHC synergy here is poor, and Akuma's has very limited TAC options. The best bet it to put a character in between these two that will cover the damage/meter problems that Firebrand/Tatsu has. This can be hard, as Akuma is a very tough character to play well in this metagame, and not many characters can abuse Tatsu like Firebrand while still offering him the damage/meter options.

Potential teams: Firebrand/Doom/Akuma, Firebrand/Dormammu/Akuma, Firebrand/Dante/Akuma, Firebrand/Sentinel/Akuma, Firebrand/Storm/Akuma, Firebrand/Taskmaster/Akuma

Rating: 7/10

Amaterasu
Zak Bennett is the prime example of Firebrand/Amaterasu right now and he makes it work.

Assists: Cold Star. Always. There is no reason to use either of Amaterasu's other assists. It's easy to argue that Cold Star is Firebrand's best assist. Long term lockdown means that if they block it, they are getting opened up. Firebrand has a lot of ways to force the opponent to block it so blocking this assist once may spell the end of the game, as Cold Star also allows for unblockable resets and incoming unblockables against certain characters. The only problem with this assist is that it can be hard to force air based characters to block it.

DHC/THC: Both characters have an install super that work in opposite ways. Firebrand's speeds himself up while Amaterasu slows everyone else down. They are good for DHCing in and out of each other. You get access to a LV3 DHC and Okami Shuffle isn't bad as a DHC. However, the THC here is amazing. Regardless of assists, you get Dark Fire/Okami Shuffle. Firebrand finishes way before Amaterasu, allowing him to either charge an (solo) unblockable for the incoming character OR add on another Dark Fire after Okami Shuffle ends.

TACs: I don't think Amaterasu has much to offer, TAC wise. There is an infinite, but a lot of characters have better infinites and in most cases, Amaterasu should be your anchor anyway.

Conclusion: Amaterasu is a great partner for Firebrand. Bringing Cold Star to the table is enough to solidify her as one of his best partners. The added benefits of the DHC/THC are great too. She works amazingly with Doom, Firebrand's other best partner. The main problems with Amaterasu are her low damage (Shown more when you're already playing the low damage Firebrand) and her learning curve (Which is arbitrary anyway). However, a good Amaterasu player is a scary thing when he has XF3

Potential teams: Firebrand/Doom/Amaterasu, Firebrand/Dormammu/Amaterasu,

Rating: 9/10

Dante
I don't run Dante and have tried to get into him several times so all of this is just what I've theorized/tested about the two.

Assists: Starting off, Jam Session is amazing for Firebrand. Short range lockdown that comes out fast. Very easy for him to convert at any height and is completely cuts off part of the screen. It really powers up Firebrand's fireball/zoning/keepaway game and allows instant overheads and faked lows everywhere. It works for incoming unblockables but if they take the hit, it can be hard to convert unless you are expecting it or are just really fast. Weasel Shot is also pretty good for Firebrand if you need a horizontal projectile, working similarly to a combination of Jam Session and Cold Star. It comes out faster than Cold Star and reaches farther, so it is definitely worth considering if you want to run Dante too.

DHC/THC: Dante half fails in this department. Having Devil Trigger allows for safe DHCs in and out of each other but Dark Fire and Million Dollars don't connect well at all. This problem also arises in the THC, as Dark Fire carries them out of Million Dollars.

TACs: Dante only has decent TAC stuff in Devil Trigger. He has a small TAC combo and then the TAC infinite but Dante is notorious for bad scaling already.

Conclusion: When it comes to Firebrand/Dante, I recommend playing Firebrand/x/Dante. The lack of DHC synergy and the poor TAC options from Dante make him bad in second for Firebrand. However, Jam Session is just too good to pass up. And despite popular beliefs, Dante anchor is pretty good. When I think of running Dante with Firebrand, I think of him as the "glue" character that ties Firebrand and the other character together.

Potential teams: Firebrand/Doom/Dante, Firebrand/Dormammu/Dante, Firebrand/Sentinel/Dante, Firebrand/Frank West/Dante, Firebrand/Vergil/Dante, Firebrand/Dante Akuma

Rating: 7/10

Dormammu
I've been running Firebrand/Dormammu for almost a year now. Like everyone else, I got the idea from Zak Bennett. Personally, I don't think that the "best" Firebrand team has Dormammu on it, but a lot of the stronger ones do. I'm currently running Firebrand/Dormammu/Doom, so here is my opinion

Assists: This is the only part where Dormammu doesn't shine. Firebrand can use Dark Hole better than most people, but it's still a lackluster assist. Liberation has potential but that all depends on the spell you have. Even then, Firebrand has a hard time converting these spells (Both leave in a Hard Knockdown and Hell Spitfire H scales so much that sometimes you can't even pick them up. Early grounded Bon Voyage is the best bet). Purification is bad as a neutral assist, but is the best for incoming Stalking Flare unblockables.

DHC/THC: Now where Dormammu shines the most. ALL of Firebrand's combos lead to the corner because of Bon Voyage. So that means that ANY combo ended into Dark Fire can be DHCed into Stalking Flare, where you can then build 1B1R and use it, into however you want to end the combo. The main thing about this is that it allows Firebrand to drop a lot of meter if necessary. This obviously makes the team more meter heavy, but the ability to do this is important. It works against most characters, though not against certain important ones. Here is a video. The list of character it does not work on is in the description. If you want to go into Chaotic Flame, you have to end Dark Fire early. However, you can use a SJ Dark Fire to clear the screen of projectiles and then DHC into Dormammu's Stalking Flare or Chaotic Flame. DHCing from either of Dormammu's LV1s into Luminous Body is very useful. As far as your THC, you get Chaotic Flame unless you pick Liberation, where you get Stalking Flare. I recommend Chaotic Flame, unless you have tricks with the Stalking Flare THC with your other character.

TAC: Dormammu's TAC infinite has been known for a while now, but it wasn't until recently that LintLicker discovered a consistent repetition for it. It wasn't long after that Angelic found a way to make the starter consistent, and now we have a Dormammu TAC infinite. This changes a lot for this pair. This solves the damage problem completely and will always kill pretty fast. You can also pull off incoming unblockables with the meter you just built from the infinite. It may come to a point where getting a TAC from Firebrand to Dormammu may lead to two dead characters instead of just one.

Conclusion: Dormammu's synergy really shows in the damage department for Firebrand. He brings Firebrand's BEST DHC and a particularly useful TAC infinite. Dark Hole allows for combo extension to help bring all your combos to 1 meter and can also be used for reset capabilities, due to it's long blockstun. The hardest part of running Dormammu with Firebrand is finding that third character who is not only good for both of them, but brings a good enough assist to the table that your team can survive off of ONLY that assist. There are others who work there, but this requirement really limits the potential of running Dormammu with Firebrand. One of the benefits of running Dormammu is that if you have meter to use, you always have ways to use it.

Recommended teams: Firebrand/Dormammu/Doom, Firebrand/Dormammu/Dante

Rating: 9/10

Dr. Doom

Assist: All three of Doom's assists have different uses for Firebrand, and which one you use tends to come down to match-up. Plasma Beam stands out as the most universal, being useful in every match-up. The start-up, durability, and lockdown of the beam is perfect for Firebrand's moveset, sharing similar start up to his specials. Plasma Beam gets a big point here in that it is the shortest duration of Doom's assists, and doesn't leave anything on the screen after he leaves. This means that out of Doom's assists, you can hard tag the quickest after Plasma Beam. Molecular Shield is really good for Firebrand as well, being the best of the three at the incoming mix-up game. It tends to shine in match-ups vs rushdown characters, like Wolverine or Spencer. You get Sphere Flame THC for this assist, though. Missiles is most useful against characters or players who like to jump around a lot, like Magneto or Trish. It is the longest lasting and most likely to mess up your hard tag, but it does allow Firebrand to play a different kind of game, flying around "recklessly" with Missiles covering him.

DHC/THC: While not Dormammu level, the DHC synergy between Firebrand and Doom is pretty good. Both characters corner carry, so DHCing is easy. Dark Fire->Sphere Flame or Air Photon Array -> Dark Fire. DHCing from Sphere Flame or Photo Array into Luminous Body is good too and it's possible to combo off of either hyper, if they connect properly. If you force them to block Photon Array on the ground, you get a free mix-up by DHCing into Luminous Body. If not using Rocks, your THC is decent. Both cover the same area, but since Doom is grounded, not all of the lasers hit. I avoid THC when my Doom is alive.

TAC: One of the many reasons that Doom help's Firebrand so much is because of TACs. Along with the obvious option of infinites, you get a very powerful normal TAC combo that ends in Sphere Flame into either a DHC/hard tag into Firebrand. Not much to say here since everyone knows about Doom's TACs other than that the additional damage and meter build is extremely appreciated by Firebrand. A lot of assists can be used to set up unblockables after finishing a TAC infinite by DHCing from Sphere Flame into Luminous Body.

Conclusion: Hard tags are the biggest part about running Doom with Firebrand. Off of any Bon Voyage past mid screen or any throw NOT into the corner, Firebrand can hard tag into Doom for at least 2 relaunches. Works on every character as well. Since you have to be a certain distance from the corner to do it, the combo is very scaled from the Bon Voyage. Doom's scaling doesn't care though, and you build more damage/meter by hard tagging into Doom and then hard tagging back out at the end. So, as you can see, Doom offers a lot to Firebrand. Good DHCs, amazing assists and TACs, and hard tag combos. IMO, the best Firebrand teams require Doom. He just offers too much. Because Doom is such a versatile support character, this allows you to run a lot of X/Doom or Doom/X shells and just run Firebrand on point. He also synergizes well with both Dormammu and Amaterasu, arguably two of Firebrand's best partners.

Potential teams: Firebrand/Doom/Amaterasu, Firebrand/Dormammu/Doom, Firebrand/Doom/Strider, Firebrand/Doom/Vergil, Firebrand/Doom/Dante

Rating: 10/10

Iron Man
I'll start by saying that Iron Man is bad on point. Support wise, he brings a lot to the table.

Assists: Iron Man comes with two assists that are good for Firebrand. Unibeam is really good for Firebrand, but lacks the consistent hard tag combos that come with choosing Plasma Beam over it. Other than scaling, this beam is amazing for Firebrand. Very few characters duck under it, it's long lasting, and keeps the opponent standing (Which is GREAT for Firebrand confirms). The other assist is Repulsor Blast. If Iron Man were a good character, you would definitely see more Repulsor Blast players. It puts a square (X, technically) of safety around him and protects that entire area. It lasts a good amount of time for lockdown and once it hits, it also juggles for a while to make it easier to visually confirm the hit. This can be used similarly to Molecular Shield as a tool to handle heavy rushdown. Repulsor Blast is also one of the assist to allow for tight incoming unblockables.

DHC/THC: In most case, Iron Man's angled beam is a joke hyper. Why give him two inputs for the same hyper at different angles when Ryu can just point his? Regardless, the angled beam DHC's perfectly from Dark Fire. I'm sure there are ways to DHC into his LV3 as well, albeit losing some damage from Dark Fire. The THC between these two is pretty good simply because Iron Man's beam is a great hyper during THC.

TAC: Iron Man has his own TAC combos and one of the more practical infinites. If you've opted to run Iron Man, you might as well be going for the infinite every time.

Conclusion: Firebrand/Iron Man is amazing as long as you don't have to play as Iron Man. He is another one of the characters where you're going to need to put in the work if you want the results with him. It's up to you if he's worth it though. He brings amazing assists, DHC, THC, and TAC options. Not many characters do all of those for Firebrand. The main problem I have with Iron Man and Firebrand is finding that third character that works for both of them. As far as Firebrand helping Iron Man, all of Firebrand's assist allow for an extra Repulsor Blast in the corner, which is where a lot of Iron Man's damage comes from. He has some hard tag options, but they are not as universal as some others.

Potential teams: Firebrand/Iron Man/Sentinel, Firebrand/Dormammu/Iron Man, Firebrand/Iron Man/Rocket Raccoon,

Rating: 7/10

Rocket Raccoon
Written by:Skillzdatkillz

Assists:All three of Raccoon's assists work well with Firebrand much like Doom. Pendulum is the first assist I started with, and while it takes away Firebrands's wall bounce, it vastly improves Firebrand's neutral game. It will knock most other assists away (if called at the correct time) while also grounding the opponent's point character. It also forces the opponent to use extra caution in their approach, so Firebrand will not have to deal with recklessly dashing opponents. Also, it provides gimmicks galore, demon missile M+ Log Trap assist is a nice little setup to use on the opponent's wake up to provide for some silly oki mixups. Spitfire Twice provides for great ground coverage (5 low durability points per spit) as well as some great fuzzy guard mixups. Really, it works a lot like Sentinel's drones except there's a shorter window to mix the opponent up, but does not disappear when the assist character is hit (if you can even hit him.) Lastly, Claymore assist provides for some crazy lock down which lets you setup some more high low mixups on the opponent. It makes Firebrand safe at the end of blockstrings. The Udaterasu knockdown setup works with this assist too because Claymore will cover the neutral wakeup options thus giving firebrand a 50/50 wakeup reset.

TAC: Raccoon has a meter steal setup which is useful against Phoenix teams, and apparently, but other than that, there's no worthwhile reason to TAC into him.

DHC/THC: Dark Flame-> Rock n' Roll is not that much more damage than just Dark Flame, but it still works. DHC out to Mad Hopper is a pretty good way to get Firebrand out safely.

Conclusion: Rocket Raccoon's assists make Firebrand's approach and neutral game overall more solid. However, in order to get the full strength of the pair, Firebrand has to have a TAC infinite character in the middle.

Potential teams: Firebrand/Iron Man/Rocket Raccoon, Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Rocket Raccoon

Sentinel
For a long time, I wanted to run Firebrand/Sentinel/Akuma. I ran it for a bit and wasn't satisfied, though the team is good.

Assists: Your obvious choice is drones. Long lasting projectiles that really help Firebrand. Mix-ups, unblockables, and oki set-ups everywhere. Drones make a lot of Firebrand's stuff a lot safer without any extra effort. However, while an amazing assist, Sentinel is huge compared to Firebrand and it can be hard for Firebrand to keep him on the screen. Other than that, the bombs assist isn't a bad choice either.

DHC/THC: The DHC synergy here is good. Plasma Beam and Dark Fire DHC into each other with ease and both do significant damage. Hyper Sentinel Force into Luminous Body is a good DHC in for Firebrand, as well. The THC here is bad because Dark Fire carries them out of Hyper Sentinel Force.

TACs: Sentinel has a basic TAC combo but there is also the option of his infinite (probably what you should be going for if you're playing Sentinel).

Conclusion: Sentinel is a great support character for Firebrand but I feel him as a character is going the way of the dinosaur. His huge hurtbox is a significant disadvantage in such a flood based game. There are match-ups where you will not be able to get Drones on the field at all. It's still possible to run these two together, but you're going to have to work harder than a lot of other people to get the same results.

Potential teams: Firebrand/Sentinel/Dante, Firebrand/Sentinel/Akuma, Firebrand/Doom/Sentinel

Rating: 7/10

Super Skrull
Firebrand/Super Skrull has become known as Apologyman's team and has been terrorizing the meta lately.

Assists: The only one worth using is Tenderizer, and only for the unblockable loop. Otherwise, his other assists are lackluster.

DHC/THC: Dark Fire DHCs into Inferno very easily for a lot of damage but that's about it. Inferno will DHC decently into Dark Fire if you cancel it early or do it super low to the ground, but you probably won't be getting max damage from either hyper that way. You WILL be using Tenderizer, so you will get Skrull Torch as your THC (If not obvious, that's a bad thing).

TAC: None

Conclusion: Skrull+Firebrand is alright. However, if you're not running him for the sake of the unblockable loop, then there are better options. Decent DHC synergy overall and Skrull covers some of Firebrand's tough matches. Outside of that, the unblockable loop is very good and invalidates a large number of characters. If you run this pair, it is best to run Firebrand/X/Skrull, where X is a character with a TAC infinite. The main problem with this pairing is that it relies completely on the unblockable loop. If playing against a team that complicates the flowchart, the flows show a lot more. Against most of the cast though, it doesn't matter.

Recommended teams: Firebrand/Doom/Skrull, Firebrand/Sentinel/Skrull, Firebrand/Iron Man/Skrull

Rating: 8/10

MysticRay: Firebrand/Skrull TAC Unblockable (side/up direction) (cost 2 meters)

Tac to Skrull -> Fully Charge Stone Dunk (Big Fist Air Thingy) -> Ground bounce -> Inferno (DO NOT FULLY MASH! All 98 hits of Inferno cause a Hard Knockdown only the 99th hit causes a flip-out) -> Luminous Body -> Charge Unblockable

GimR: Cross assault glitch with Firebrand unblockable:

Taskmaster

Assists: Taskmaster comes with both the horizontal arrows and vertical arrows. I would recommend up arrows because you can get unblockables off of them (Against characters without good invincible ground options). However, if you have no horizontal assist, horizontal arrows is worth using instead. Overall, they're nothing super special for Firebrand but they are still good assists overall.

DHC/THC: Taskmaster can aim his hyper so the DHC options on this team are good. If using up arrows, your corner THC will also be up arrows and work very well with Firebrand's Dark Fire.

TAC: None

Conclusion: Taskmaster is a pretty good for Firebrand. He gives you the ability to counterpick with your assist and good DHCs. You don't get TAC options but they're still solid together. He fits very well with a lot of other characters that work with Firebrand because of his overall versatility.

Recommended teams: Firebrand/Taskmaster/Akuma

Rating: 7/10
Shuma Gorath - (EMPTY)
Post edited by Kresent on
Member of Team Hitbox
Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
Zero/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
«13

Comments

  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    Reserved
    Member of Team Hitbox
    Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
    Zero/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    Reserved
    Member of Team Hitbox
    Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
    Zero/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
  • TheCapeTheCape Joined: Posts: 944
    If its not fun, I will just stop playing it.
  • soniczero9soniczero9 Joined: Posts: 37
    Nice guide to team synergy you got here. Although I do think it's worth mentioning that Skrull also covers a lot, if not pretty much all, of Firebrands bad match ups. I don't know if that was taken into account when rating the characters, or if it was based purely on how well each character helps Firebrand do what he wants to do.
  • MysticRayMysticRay Mashes Dive Kick Until It Works. Joined: Posts: 4,732
    edited April 2013
    soniczero9 wrote: »
    Nice guide to team synergy you got here. Although I do think it's worth mentioning that Skrull also covers a lot, if not pretty much all, of Firebrands bad match ups. I don't know if that was taken into account when rating the characters, or if it was based purely on how well each character helps Firebrand do what he wants to do.

    OMG yes, Skrull completely does this and he rapes in level 2/3 X-factor.
    Skrull brings more to the table than just an assist, he's a walking mix-up like Firebrand and hits like a goddamn truck. Also Elastic Slam H is a godly move. I consider Skrull to be one of Firebrand's best partners purely for the fact that when covered by Drones he is a fucking monster

    However, Skrull needs that drone assist to be godly and Firebrand/Skrull in neutral is not a good pairing. So I say the score should be like 7.9/10 or 8/10.

    Also. I love your other stuff though Kresent.
    I'm like your #1 fan...as of like right now.
    UMVC3 Teams: Kawaiibrand/Skrub/Whackbot . Kawaiibrand/Dog/Skrub
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  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    I'm thinking more about what he offers to Firebrand as support. I'm trying not to focus on the point capabilities of the other character because that can be pretty variable.
    Member of Team Hitbox
    Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
    Zero/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    If running Firebrand/Dorm/Doom, would it be more practical to just use Dark Hole assist somewhere before another launcher and go into a Doom TAC infinite attempt?
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
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  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    If running Firebrand/Dorm/Doom, would it be more practical to just use Dark Hole assist somewhere before another launcher and go into a Doom TAC infinite attempt?

    Yeah, I do this sometimes. Normally off a grab or Bon Voyage.

    Like: Grab, QCF+H, s.H, s.S, j.M, j.M, j.H, QCF+S, backdash, A1, s.H, s.S, SJ, d+H, QCB+L, c.H, s.S, j.H, TAC

    The main thing is that I try not to do it too often so that every time I'm doing the Dark Hole extension, they aren't always expecting a TAC. Admittedly, I should be trying to TAC into Doom more than I TAC into Dormammu.
    Member of Team Hitbox
    Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
    Zero/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
  • ApocaLipsApocaLips Joined: Posts: 398
    Kresent wrote: »
    I'm thinking more about what he offers to Firebrand as support. I'm trying not to focus on the point capabilities of the other character because that can be pretty variable.

    You do a great job of evaluating the support a character provides for Firebrand. That ultimately comes short of what we're looking for when evaluating teams, however. When you dedicate to a character like Firebrand who demands that the rest of the team conform to him, usually frontloading the team badly, the viability of the remaining shell is very important and will likely separate the good Firebrand teams from the best Firebrand teams. Part of why Zak is so good right now is because Doom/Ammy is a top tier shell that wins games on its own despite its synergy with Firebrand, whereas Dorm/Ammy didn't rise to that level. You even mention this factor expressly in figuring out what teams you yourself actually discarded - it's probably one of the most important factors for Firebrand teams. I'd like to see you include that critical factor in your analysis rather than just writing it off.
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    I feel like during the process of picking two assists for Firebrand, the fact that you have to make sure that they work together is sort of implied. Plus, finding which two work together the best is something that might be better researched in other character subforums. I wouldn't mind some thoughts on this subject here, though.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
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  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    Well the thread is here for everyone to debate their teams. The main posts are to tell you what individual characters offer to Firebrand, so that you can build you own. I've offered "optimal" teams in each character. It's basic team construction to make sure they all work together.

    There are so many good shells that you can place any character in front of that I don't see the point of trying to name them all here. Doom/Ammy, Dante/Sentinel, Dante/Akuma, Dorm/Doom, Dante/Doom, etc.

    Along with this, I wouldn't come to the Firebrand forum to learn about Skrull/Doom/Dorm/etc. Their point games belongs in their own forums.
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  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    Hey Kresent, which do you prefer for your team: Plasma Beam or Hidden Missiles?
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
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    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    I normally use Hidden Missiles but I've been messing around with Plasma Beam a lot lately and I really like it. It's all based on match-up though.
    Member of Team Hitbox
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  • MysticRayMysticRay Mashes Dive Kick Until It Works. Joined: Posts: 4,732
    @Kresent

    I feel like Firebrand/Skrull/Sentinel is the fastest Firebrand team available right now. If I get that first hit I can steamroll for lack of better words. Skrull's corner mixup game is just as dirty as Firebrand's and Dark Fire -> Inferno already allows Skrull for a grab reset using either Elastic Slam OR a normal grab. I think FireSkrullSent is the Vanilla style Wolvie/Akuma of what's available right now. It's the candle that burns twice as bright for half as long. The team falls apart in a long match but I can actually beat Morridoom before it starts up because it's so rapid fire on the fly.


    UMVC3 Teams: Kawaiibrand/Skrub/Whackbot . Kawaiibrand/Dog/Skrub
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  • ApocaLipsApocaLips Joined: Posts: 398
    I overstated my position, there's no need to rank each char overall. Still, if we don't account for matchups that compliment Firebrand's, no one will. Definitely counts as support for Firebrand, even if he's not on point. Also very much a relevant consideration for teambuilding.
  • soniczero9soniczero9 Joined: Posts: 37
    edited April 2013
    I'm desperately trying to drop Doom because I can't stand playing as him, so I thought I'd give Frank a try. I'm assuming this is already well known, but I didn't see anything posted (video or otherwise) here or in the old team thread. So here it is.

  • TheCapeTheCape Joined: Posts: 944
    From the Frank West Level Up Strategies Thread:

    Bon Voyage into HTH (CO) [Does not work on: Amaterasu, Doctor Doom, Ghost Rider, Haggar, Hawkeye, Hulk, MODOK, Nemesis, Phoenix Wright, Sentinel, Thor, Tron Bonne, Wesker]

    Just so you know.
    If its not fun, I will just stop playing it.
  • MysticRayMysticRay Mashes Dive Kick Until It Works. Joined: Posts: 4,732
    I prefer TACing with FireFrank for the level 4.
    Just Run Pick Me Up and use it once so Firebrand can do his normal bnb and TAC in any direction for instant level 4 through the DHC trick.
    Ghetto but it works.
    UMVC3 Teams: Kawaiibrand/Skrub/Whackbot . Kawaiibrand/Dog/Skrub
    Lovez the chubbays and Dark Magician Fatty.
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  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    Hey guys, I'm sorry. I've been super busy with classwork. Next week is my last week of classes. I'll get more of this written up this weekend if I can.
    Member of Team Hitbox
    Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
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  • MysticRayMysticRay Mashes Dive Kick Until It Works. Joined: Posts: 4,732
    Firebrand/Skrull TAC Unblockable (side/up direction) (cost 2 meters)

    Tac to Skrull -> Fully Charge Stone Dunk (Big Fist Air Thingy) -> Ground bounce -> Inferno (DO NOT FULLY MASH! All 98 hits of Inferno cause a Hard Knockdown only the 99th hit causes a flip-out) -> Luminous Body -> Charge Unblockable -> Return to Character Select and choose Firebrand/Doom/Dormammu.
    UMVC3 Teams: Kawaiibrand/Skrub/Whackbot . Kawaiibrand/Dog/Skrub
    Lovez the chubbays and Dark Magician Fatty.
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  • -AEON--AEON- Joined: Posts: 972
    edited May 2013
    GimR made an impressive proof-of-concept using Skrull/FB and the new (banned) glitch, confirming my suspicions that we'd get something broken out of it.
    Viscant wrote: »
    The reason I don't stream is because the chances of me accidentally exposing my dick to the world is too high. I forget stuff way too often, I almost burn my place down because I forgot I was cooking at least once every 3 months. If I started livestreaming I would load up a Taylor Swift video, forget I had a webcam and a stream and then...
    These are self evident truths. You could irrefutably prove God's existence starting from the axiom that Marn is scum.
    Marn is scum ergo sum.
  • KarsticlesKarsticles Greetings. Joined: Posts: 2,700
    I think Mystic Ray deserves consideration for being a top or middle Firebrand assist. It's great at giving him command of the screen, and it also destroys Vajra, which is a common tool against Firebrand.

    The Firebrand/Shuma-Gorath THC deals solid damage and lets Firebrand connect another Dark Fire, as with Okami Shuffle.

    Shuma-Gorath can OTG into full combos off of Bon Voyage:



    "Karst" for short.
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  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    I have been considering Shuma lately and I haven't put him up yet because I want to understand him before I write about him. Unless someone wants to do it for me
    Member of Team Hitbox
    Firebrand/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
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  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    edited May 2013
    Alright so I'm going to edit a few of the ones I've already done to try and talk more about synergy between characters that help Firebrand like you guys were asking. I would appreciate some support from people who could write up some stuff about Shuma, Frank, and Storm.
    Post edited by Kresent on
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  • vian_siuvian_siu Joined: Posts: 327
    edited June 2013


    Fuck Adobe Premiere, can't even import a file without de-sync the audio.

    Anyway I think IM has potential to be as good of a friend to Firebrand as Doom. He can set-up unblockable snap loop and he has one of the best team super in the game with the forward 1 frame Proton Cannon. He also does more damage in these combo than tag into Doom because of the SB and RB loop, too bad his point ability is so awful. At least Doom has easy conversions, foot dive and team super bullshit.

    The first combo is universal on everyone, it should work on every character. But you will have to do kidnap early in a combo for it to work because of hit-stun decay.

    The second combo only works on small characters. Thats not too bad since most good characters are pixies anyway. And the third one is the same combo but with assist extension. The Firebrand assist extension work even very late into the combo since that thing does soft knock down. The key to doing more damage with IM is try to loop SB and RB as much as possible since his special moves doesn't scale move late into a combo.

    I couldn't find something even in level 1 xfactor to help conversion in other areas or xfactor specific mid screen/corner to corner combo like the Doom xfactor kidnap into hard kick combo to help damage.

    Feel free to prove me wrong anyway:)
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  • TheCapeTheCape Joined: Posts: 944
    The only issue with Iron Man/Firebrand is that using RB to get unblockables makes you lose the good Proton Cannon THC
    If its not fun, I will just stop playing it.
  • -AEON--AEON- Joined: Posts: 972
    Dare I say it, but I almost think it's better to just run Unibeam with Firebrand. Consensus seems to be that a strong horizontal assist is the best boon to his neutral game. And while the chance to 300% a team is really tempting, it 1) depends on your opponent's lack of knowledge about taking the hit (and thus reducing meter build), and 2) it's very hard to do with Repulsor Blast. I also wonder if Iron Man wouldn't prefer Hell Spitfire as an assist to abuse something like this on point (though if the tag combos suffer it might not be worth it).

    I think Strider would complete the FB/IM duo perfectly. He loves Unibeam, can use Hell Spitfire for potent mixups up close, and can also benefit from IM raw tags using Heavy Gram. Unibeam and Vajra give Firebrand a great deal of control over his opponents movement, and I'm pretty sure he and Iron Man can both convert it into a full combo. Pretty much any order this team runs in can be used to inflict great misery.
    Viscant wrote: »
    The reason I don't stream is because the chances of me accidentally exposing my dick to the world is too high. I forget stuff way too often, I almost burn my place down because I forgot I was cooking at least once every 3 months. If I started livestreaming I would load up a Taylor Swift video, forget I had a webcam and a stream and then...
    These are self evident truths. You could irrefutably prove God's existence starting from the axiom that Marn is scum.
    Marn is scum ergo sum.
  • TheCapeTheCape Joined: Posts: 944
    I use RB because its great with Frank and FB together. Sadly, that means I miss out on the really good THC.
    If its not fun, I will just stop playing it.
  • -AEON--AEON- Joined: Posts: 972
    You also have Shopping Cart for ground control, though.
    Viscant wrote: »
    The reason I don't stream is because the chances of me accidentally exposing my dick to the world is too high. I forget stuff way too often, I almost burn my place down because I forgot I was cooking at least once every 3 months. If I started livestreaming I would load up a Taylor Swift video, forget I had a webcam and a stream and then...
    These are self evident truths. You could irrefutably prove God's existence starting from the axiom that Marn is scum.
    Marn is scum ergo sum.
  • HeavyweightHeavyweight Joined: Posts: 186
    I dropped Firebrand for a while, mostly because Firebrand/Sent just isn't worth it, but I have come back to him and switched out Sent for Mags. I have to say that Disruptor with Firebrand is surprisingly effective in both zoning and offense. Firebrand lacks quick horizontal pressure in his zoning, which disruptor helps with, and it gives Firebrand an assist he can use for quick mixups that doesn't scale as much as my other assist, Jam Session. I also get the brain dead TAC Infinite and all the mixups that comes with having that behind Firebrand. Just my two cents.
  • shinobi00shinobi00 NINJA MASTER Joined: Posts: 1,474
    edited June 2013
    I honestly think missiles is the best choice for firebrand. He can sit back and zone all day with missiles, and he gets another unblockable setup.
    I dropped Firebrand for a while, mostly because Firebrand/Sent just isn't worth it, but I have come back to him and switched out Sent for Mags. I have to say that Disruptor with Firebrand is surprisingly effective in both zoning and offense. Firebrand lacks quick horizontal pressure in his zoning, which disruptor helps with, and it gives Firebrand an assist he can use for quick mixups that doesn't scale as much as my other assist, Jam Session. I also get the brain dead TAC Infinite and all the mixups that comes with having that behind Firebrand. Just my two cents.

    Firebrand/magneto sounds fun. Can magneto benefit from bon voyage to raw tag?
  • -AEON--AEON- Joined: Posts: 972
    But is the unblockable setup strong enough to be worth forgoing a buffed ground game?
    (I suppose you could run FB/Mags/Doom...and get both!)
    Viscant wrote: »
    The reason I don't stream is because the chances of me accidentally exposing my dick to the world is too high. I forget stuff way too often, I almost burn my place down because I forgot I was cooking at least once every 3 months. If I started livestreaming I would load up a Taylor Swift video, forget I had a webcam and a stream and then...
    These are self evident truths. You could irrefutably prove God's existence starting from the axiom that Marn is scum.
    Marn is scum ergo sum.
  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    edited June 2013
    Plasma Beam > Missiles for Firebrand. I've been running Missiles with him for a while, and while it is good, Plasma Beam is just everything Firebrand needs. His zoning does get better with missiles but it doesn't get amazing. Just better.

    Firebrand doesn't have to worry about protecting Beam. On the other hand, he has to be very careful about calling Missiles. And Firebrand isn't that great at protecting assists.
    Member of Team Hitbox
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    Firebrand/Dormammu/Dr. Doom
    Zero/Dr. Doom/Amaterasu
  • TheCapeTheCape Joined: Posts: 944
    Well what about Unibeam?
    If its not fun, I will just stop playing it.
  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    edited June 2013
    Unibeam is probably better in the sense that it keeps them standing, but Plasma Beam is faster(Barely) and comes out behind Firebrand. Also, Doom's hard tag combos make it way more useful to run Doom.
    Post edited by Kresent on
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  • PMPPLATINUMPMPPLATINUM Joined: Posts: 6
    Hey guys, just wondering is firebrand(demon missile charge) Akuma (tatsu) and spidey ( web ball) a good team? I only picked up firebrand 3 days ago and I don't know much.
  • <Insert Name Here><Insert Name Here> No wonder with people like me SRK Marvel is dead Joined: Posts: 7,940
    Hey guys, just wondering is firebrand(demon missile charge) Akuma (tatsu) and spidey ( web ball) a good team? I only picked up firebrand 3 days ago and I don't know much.
    Not a good look. Spidey's assists are TERRIBLE, he's a point character through and through. Firebrand/Akuma can work, but Spidey won't fit in.
    Xrd: Axl || UMvC3: Magneto/Dante/Frank West
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    "3) LIMITLESS (myself) --Those of you who have played me, will agree with this.. By far the most aggressive safe/style Wolverine." - Limitless, 3rd best Wolvie player in the world
  • PMPPLATINUMPMPPLATINUM Joined: Posts: 6
    So should it be spidey/firebrand/Akuma ? Or should I drop spiderman and get a different character?
  • KresentKresent For Science. You Monster. Joined: Posts: 793
    I really recommend picking Firebrand OR Spiderman. Both are point characters that demand a lot from their team. However, on that note, Doom helps both of them a lot.
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  • skillzdatkillzskillzdatkillz Joined: Posts: 25
    I really like missiles for Firebrand's incoming game. If they tech the guard break, they're locked down by missiles and I still have Ammy's assist for a reset afterwards.
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