Guilty Gear Xrd -REVELATOR- one of life's gilty pleasures

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  • Yuri_AcTNYuri_AcTN Fighting Game Enthusiast Joined: Posts: 1,114
    Skiegh wrote: »
    A very insightful post.

    If/when I decide to pick up GGXrd again, I'll definitely be looking back on this post for reference. Thank you.

    Also, all what you've mentioned within your post can still be applied to GGXrdR1's Jam, correct? Truth be told, I haven't been keeping up with the recent changelogs for the character, so I'm completely oblivious as to what has been altered at the moment.
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    ===============

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  • Mr_BladeMr_Blade Joined: Posts: 203
    Been playing GGRX2 like crazy. This game is SO fucking good
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  • ShariShari Overestimated. Joined: Posts: 2,625
    This character is so much fun.
    Haunts: Is it lag or just impeccable footsies and spacing, I don't know.
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  • LordWilliam1234LordWilliam1234 Too Many Waifus Joined: Posts: 20,914
    @Skiegh How about some matches tomorrow to take you out of that bitter mood? Got the whole day off tomorrow. :)
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  • SkieghSkiegh I am Ryudo Unit 2R Joined: Posts: 424
    @Skiegh How about some matches tomorrow to take you out of that bitter mood? Got the whole day off tomorrow. :)

    @LordWilliam1234 I too am off tomorrow, though I have some things to take care of, you're welcome to message where ever, whenever for games. Would hate to get overly rusty -- already breaching that two week mark with no fighting games, where the rust really starts to set in.
  • DimeDime Wasting time Joined: Posts: 10,066
    Excellent post @Skiegh
    Gettin' my derp on.
  • LordWilliam1234LordWilliam1234 Too Many Waifus Joined: Posts: 20,914
    Skiegh wrote: »
    @Skiegh How about some matches tomorrow to take you out of that bitter mood? Got the whole day off tomorrow. :)

    LordWilliam1234 I too am off tomorrow, though I have some things to take care of, you're welcome to message where ever, whenever for games. Would hate to get overly rusty -- already breaching that two week mark with no fighting games, where the rust really starts to set in.

    I forget; you on PC or PS4?
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  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    I hope a new character gets revealed at EVO.
  • SkieghSkiegh I am Ryudo Unit 2R Joined: Posts: 424
    @LordWilliam1234 PC, of course. You can add me on Steam, at the same name as here. I am very confident I will be the only one. Only ever seen this name taken on like 3 websites.
  • SkieghSkiegh I am Ryudo Unit 2R Joined: Posts: 424
    Top 32 was dope, and we got a Jam in top 8 baby! Theresa really kind of ate Bears alive, I was not expecting that.
  • Sephiroth73003Sephiroth73003 Joined: Posts: 4,279
    edited July 15
    Zato vs Jam isn't an awful matchup for Jam. You need to use a lot of IAD YRC and j.2K YRC though. Gotta mixup going super ham and sitting back and letting him try to hold his ground with Eddie. If you don't switch up the tempo a lot your just gonna get Noburu'd and 2HS all day. Also 6HS can get you between 2S -> drill for a JUICY CH sometimes which literally can just flat out kill Zato.

    Imo, Jam's win till she gets CH by Noburu then .... well ... it's anyones game. Also his normals are just giant hurtboxes and every normal Jam has is AT LEAST 1f faster than his equivalent making her frame trap game legit on him. CH 6HS literally can make him melt and he is one of the easier among the cast to 46PK which helps her a lot.

    Jam is a solid character with 1-2 really crappy ass matchups. Kum and Johnny are 7-3 but I don't think any other matchups are legit garbage.
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  • NaerasNaeras Terribad Joined: Posts: 3,275
    Winners top 8
    Nage - Faust
    Tomo - Leo
    Omito - Johnny
    purepure - Jack-O

    Losers top 8
    Samitto - Chipp
    Teresa - Jam
    310 - Venom
    Kazunoko - Raven

    8 different characters in top 8? I'm fine with this.
  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    No Ogawa though. Or any Zato player, for that matter. :bawling:
  • NaerasNaeras Terribad Joined: Posts: 3,275
    There were three Zato players last year though =V

    Also, did any top Ky go to EVO this year? And where was Machaboo in all of this?
  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    edited July 15
    Machaboo lost off-stream to Kid Viper, and didn't make it into top16.

    You can watch the match here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guiltygear/comments/6netis/evo_2017_offstream_losers_match_kid_viper_johnny/
  • grandabxgrandabx Flameater Joined: Posts: 653 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Purepure was running through people.
    I remember when people thought Bison doing the psycho crusher back and forth across the screen in SF:CE was cheap.
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  • LockMLockM Joined: Posts: 2,420
    edited July 15
    Teresa Jam in top8? Nice!
    Couldn't watch the the later matches live, rewatching now.
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  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU SRK's Capcom Pro Tour Ambassador Joined: Posts: 9,782
    So is Zato really this bad now or what? The hell happened to this character? I thought he was considered top tier not too long ago?
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  • PsaroPsaro Joined: Posts: 65
    edited July 15
    Zato is actually one of the most controversial characters right now in terms of where he fits into the tier list from what I've been seeing, since Teresa put him in D not long ago. In Rev1, most people would put him in high tier, just shy of top. FAB had one of the only tier lists you could find still listing him as top tier, and when you consider that he plays Potemkin it's not too hard to imagine why. There haven't been very many Rev2 lists, but both that I remember seeing (Teresa's and what I assume was a collab tier list among players attending KSB) had him in D Tier, among the worst characters in the game. I don't agree with that placement, but he's almost certainly no longer top tier. He's high tier or upper mid at worst, imo.

    To put some substance into this, basically, Zato can have a ridiculously high ceiling, but he's also very unstable. No defensive options, tends to lose scrambles without Eddie, and sometimes even with Eddie, random shit happens and you get knocked down and killed. These issues get exploited by his bad matchups, of which there are a few. Ogawa ran into one last night in the form of Tomo Leo, but admittedly he should have had that match under control and basically gave it away due to some terrible defensive decisions (par for the course for Ogawa though). Then he got knocked out by Koichi in losers, who was playing either I-No or Answer. I-No is another bad matchup, and Answer is arguably pretty tricky as well.

    So, if people want to tell you that Zato is "bad," this would be the reason why. He's a character whose gameplan is difficult to enforce consistently in a tournament environment where you will almost certainly see your bad matchups eventually. And when the gameplan doesn't work, he can just fold like a wet noodle. Fun fact: even back in SIGN, there were some people (JP players like Satou) who said that Zato was only considered top tier because of Ogawa. Take that as you will.
    Post edited by Psaro on
  • Raging_ZoroarkRaging_Zoroark Disgraceful! Joined: Posts: 1,383
    Thanks @drunkards_walk for posting that video, it helped me a lot. Too bad GCYoshi didn't finished that series yet, I'm looking foward into the next episodes. I had a lot of fun playing Bedman other day, I think I'll stick with it (alongside Jack O, of course).

    Also, yaaaaay a Jack O player in the top 8. I'll watch no matter what. Unfortunately I didn't saw any Bedman players yesterday.
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  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 4,292 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG

    Xrd top 8 live
  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    Omito straight up murdered PurePure...
  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    Insane match between Kazunoko and Nage.
  • kylebrkylebr Casually competitive Joined: Posts: 949
    edited July 15
    JOHNNY ACTION

    Omito is themyth in portuguese, indeed he is.
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  • NaerasNaeras Terribad Joined: Posts: 3,275
    edited July 16
    I am posting this after about 15 units of alcohol, but I bet money on Omito.

    How's that going?
  • OceanMachineOceanMachine ROCKET LAUNCHER GOD Joined: Posts: 8,835
    Naeras wrote: »
    I am posting this after about 15 units of alcohol, but I bet money on Omito.

    How's that going?

    It's been over for 2 hours, and Omito pretty much deleted Tomo in GF.
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  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    Omito pretty much deleted everyone though. He made it look really easy.

    Anyway, are there still chances for a character reveal today? Or do we get nothing.
  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU SRK's Capcom Pro Tour Ambassador Joined: Posts: 9,782
    Saandro wrote: »
    Omito pretty much deleted everyone though. He made it look really easy.

    Anyway, are there still chances for a character reveal today? Or do we get nothing.

    Doesn't make much sense for ArcSys to reveal a Guilty Gear character after BlazBlue finals, unless they're doing announcements for both
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  • DimeDime Wasting time Joined: Posts: 10,066
    Disappointed that tomo didn't win, but still, his Leo got 2nd which is amazing. Easily my favorite player to watch right now besides punk in sf5.
    Gettin' my derp on.
  • NaerasNaeras Terribad Joined: Posts: 3,275
    edited July 16
    Omito hardly ever loses to players not named Machaboo though. The result was pretty unsurprising.
  • Raging_ZoroarkRaging_Zoroark Disgraceful! Joined: Posts: 1,383
    kylebr wrote: »
    JOHNNY ACTION

    Omito is themyth in portuguese, indeed he is.

    Haha, really. O homem Omito.
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  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    edited July 16
    PVL_93_RU wrote: »

    Doesn't make much sense for ArcSys to reveal a Guilty Gear character after BlazBlue finals, unless they're doing announcements for both

    I was kinda hoping they held it back for Sunday because a lot more people will be watching. Nothing for GG though.
  • drunkards_walkdrunkards_walk Joined: Posts: 3,372
    Looks like GG may be on the back-burner for a while...not cool
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  • Raging_ZoroarkRaging_Zoroark Disgraceful! Joined: Posts: 1,383
    Isn't too early to announce a new character?
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  • OceanMachineOceanMachine ROCKET LAUNCHER GOD Joined: Posts: 8,835
    edited July 16
    So the next character will likely be Robo-Ky, huh.

    edit: the source
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  • drunkards_walkdrunkards_walk Joined: Posts: 3,372
    Isn't too early to announce a new character?

    I think so, since rev2 just came out. I'm thinking maybe they will release something after one of the JP GG events later in the year. However, ASW seems spread pretty thin atm...
    Opinions are like bedsheets: you only change them if it helps you get laid.
  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 91
    I expect atleast one character at EVO Japan, maybe even at Tokyo Gameshow. Or else...
    I will be mildly infuriated
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 22,637
    IF there is an announcement for GG i am expecting it on ArcRevo on octber, tbh.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
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  • drunkards_walkdrunkards_walk Joined: Posts: 3,372
    edited July 16
    Hecatom wrote: »
    IF there is an announcement for GG i am expecting it on ArcRevo on octber, tbh.

    Yeah that is what I'm thinking too. However, they did say (iirc) that Rev2 would be the final version of Revelator, so the next game will likely be something bigger, ie, like going from SIGN to Rev and therefore will probably take longer to make. Plus, when you consider all the other shit ASW is doing at the moment, we realistically may not see another GG announcement until late 2018 or early 2019. I do actually really like the current version of the game (minus a few questionable things) so I don't really mind waiting a little while for something big, although a new character here and there would make the waiting easier.
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  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 22,637
    edited July 16
    I actually don't remember them saying that Rev2 would be the final update for revelator, quite the oposite, i am not sure, but i think that it was mentioned that it was more likely that we would get more updates like Rev2 in the future.
    Unlike BB, it seems that they are not interested in making wild changes between versions of GG.
    With Sign to Revelator, it was more like an improved graphical engine with some minor tweaks with existing mechanics.
    Only the Blitz Shield was actually reworked , and even then, it wasn't a massive change.

    Imo, it makes more sense for them to keep updating Revelator like they did ith Rev2.
    The only way i see them making a new game altogueter is that they migrate the Xrd series into the UE4 version of their engine (the one they are using for DBFZ), which if is the case, then i agree, we wouldn't see an announcement for it until maybe end 2018 or even 2019.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
    "Orgasm is a simile for the emotional epiphany a woman has when the shame of penetration is eclipsed by the inherent virtue of servicing a man." ~ Kromo.
    ( •_•)
    ( ಠ_ಠ)
    ( ಥ_ಥ)
  • drunkards_walkdrunkards_walk Joined: Posts: 3,372
    Hecatom wrote: »
    I actually don't remember them saying that Rev2 would be the final update for revelator, quite the oposite, i am not sure, but i think that it was mentioned that it was more likely that we would get more updates like Rev2 in the future.
    Unlike BB, it seems that they are not interested in making wild changes between versions of GG.
    With Sign to Revelator, it was more like an improved graphical engine with some minor tweaks with existing mechanics.
    Only the Blitz Shield was actually reworked , and even then, it wasn't a massive change.

    Imo, it makes more sense for them to keep updating Revelator like they did ith Rev2.
    The only way i see them making a new game altogueter is that they migrate the Xrd series into the UE4 version of their engine (the one they are using for DBFZ), which if is the case, then i agree, we wouldn't see an announcement for it until maybe end 2018 or even 2019.

    I hope they do the update style, and just continuously update Rev2 every year or so with new characters/balance changes. I guess we will have to wait and see to find out. I think if we don't get an announcement at ArcRev in October, then it will probably be a while before we see anything new
    Opinions are like bedsheets: you only change them if it helps you get laid.
  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU SRK's Capcom Pro Tour Ambassador Joined: Posts: 9,782
    I don't mind ArcSys holding back on the Rev2 reveals, the game technically came out less than 2 months ago. Letting BlazBlue shine for now, especially since it;'s not getting a new iteration, is the right choice

    I do, however, wonder when can we expect Arcs to drop new info for Xrd then, since I doubt they'll visit Gamescom (maybe for DBZF reveals) and Tokyo Games Show is only in September
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  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 22,637
    edited July 17
    https://www.redbull.com/us-en/evo-2017-daisuke-guilty-gear-interview

    EVO 2017: Daisuke Talks The Future Of Guilty Gear
    The composer, artist, and designer behind the combo-crazy hard-rock dueling dance of death known as Guilty Gear Xrd, Daisuke Ishiwatari, joins us to chat about the state of the game.

    While Guilty Gear as a franchise isn't quite as well-known as Street Fighter, the brand has made incredible strides in recent years, particularly outside of Japan. Roaring back into the spotlight in 2014 with the release of Guilty Gear Xrd -SIGN- and maintaining its presence courtesy of its two meaty follow-ups (Revelator and REV 2), the series has made significant inroads in appealing to casual fighting game fans.

    Now a mainstay title at Evo, it's safe to say the series is growing. Still, Ishiwatari isn't satisfied just yet. Not one to mince words, the outspoken creator of the franchise had this to say about the game's popularity in the Western FGC: "The game's popularity [in the West] isn't quite where I'd like it to be yet, but given that we've been working on the same style of game since day one, it's good that the image of Guilty Gear in the West is growing. We've always kept the style of Guilty Gear the same, and I'd like to continue [that style] going forward."

    Technological evolution

    While the style of the franchise may be unchanged in the nearly two decades since the the first entry in the series launched on the original PlayStation, the technology powering Guilty Gear is an entirely different story. For example, Guilty Gear Xrd -SIGN- was one of the first fighting games out of Japan to use Unreal Engine as a middleware solution. Before that, like many developers of the previous decades, they 'rolled their own', building the engine at Arc System Works from the ground up.

    "During early development of the game that would become Guilty Gear Xrd, we tested a lot of different middleware options. Unreal Engine was the best match for us given our budget and timeline," explains Ishiwatari. Middleware provides fighting game developers with a suite of tools that can be used to shorten development time, and since Xrd -SIGN- released, several other fighting game developers, including Bandai Namco and Capcom, have taken to utilizing Unreal Engine as a part of their development processes as well, making Ishiwatari a bit of a pioneer in this regard.

    Technology aside, building a balanced fighting game can be exceptionally difficult, as well. During development, Ishiwatari would often attend location tests to measure player reaction to various characters and gameplay systems. When asked what surprises him the most during these trips to the fierce battlegrounds of Japanese arcades was how quickly players adapted to the new games. "Despite the fact [the game] is only at a prototype stage, people attending our location tests are so skilled! It's unbelievable," says Ishiwatari.

    The future of Xrd

    Though he's been extremely busy in recent years handling the respective launches of Sign, Revelator, and REV2, Ishiwatari is far from done. Looking to the future, he would like to make the fans happy by adding more classic characters to Xrd's expanding roster. "I'd love to add everyone in," Ishiwatari explains, "but due to challenges with staffing, development, and budgetary restrictions, it's somewhat difficult at times."

    Asked which character he would add next to the roster, his answer was immediate: "Robo-Ky." The reason? "His interesting playstyle." More recent fans of the Guilty Gear franchise might have seen Robo-Ky make an appearance in Revelator's Story Mode. The character was actually playable in earlier franchise entries, and was notorious for his goofy weapon-based attacks and unique way of handling meter management.

    Predictions, hopes, and dreams

    A fan as well as a player and a developer, followers of Guilty Gear may be surprised to know that Ishiwatari does indeed follow the Guilty Gear competitive scene. He was rooting for veteran Zato-1 player Kenichi Ogawa in this year's tournament. "There are so many great players to choose from nowadays, especially since their numbers have grown so much. If I had to choose one, it would be Ogawa...not only because of his skill at the game, but because of his personality as well," says Ishiwatari.

    While Ogawa regrettably did not end up in Top 8 at this year's EVO (finishing in 17th place after a few hard-fought battles), a few predictions of Ishiwatari's concerning the final matches of the tournament did, in fact, come true. "I'm absolutely sure we're going to see a Raven in the finals," guessed Ishiwatari, "and since Leo has been gaining popularity overseas, and I like him as a character, I'd like to see a Leo in the finals as well." Both of his guesses were spot-on, with Ryota "Kazunoko" Inoue finishing 5th with Raven, and T5M7 ending up battling all the way to 2nd place with Leo.

    Ishiwatari also took some time to answer some rapid-fire questions, such as his favorite character ("I like all of them", he said), whether he would be interested in lending his voice to Sol Badguy in a future game (to which he responded with a simple "no"), and when we can expect to know the future of the Guilty Gear franchise ("I'd like to know that too," he teased).

    Finally, the father of Guilty Gear left us with one final message for Arc System Works fans: "I'd like to continue evolving the series, but beyond that, I'm hoping to start something entirely new with the Guilty Gear franchise. Please look forward to it." No matter what direction Ishiwatari decides to take Guilty Gear in the future, it looks like Arc fans have a lot to look forward to.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
    "Orgasm is a simile for the emotional epiphany a woman has when the shame of penetration is eclipsed by the inherent virtue of servicing a man." ~ Kromo.
    ( •_•)
    ( ಠ_ಠ)
    ( ಥ_ಥ)
  • drunkards_walkdrunkards_walk Joined: Posts: 3,372
    One thing I really really don't want to see is any sort of guest characters in GG or GGxBb or other gg crossover games, I hope that's not what he meant by "something new". It's good to hear he still cares about growing and updating the game though, fingers crossed for an announcement after arc revolution
    Opinions are like bedsheets: you only change them if it helps you get laid.
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 22,637
    If i had to guess, i would say that maybe he wants to give a new try with the Hero/Moba hybrid genre with a new GG Overture.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
    "Orgasm is a simile for the emotional epiphany a woman has when the shame of penetration is eclipsed by the inherent virtue of servicing a man." ~ Kromo.
    ( •_•)
    ( ಠ_ಠ)
    ( ಥ_ಥ)
  • NaerasNaeras Terribad Joined: Posts: 3,275
  • ilitiritilitirit Joined: Posts: 6,379
    edited July 27
    Are there any resources around for understanding how Baiken's Azami actually works? It has to be one of the most badly designed counter moves in the history of... counter moves.

    When I activate Azami then press P/S/H, sometimes the follow-up doesn't come out. I was told that you after activating Azami actually have to keep holding a button (any button), then press the counter. This seems to work but it's awkward as fuck.

    Do the same inputs work when you use it as a guard cancel (hold buttons before activating follow-up)? Guard cancel Azami seems more like a liability than anything else...
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