How to do Guile upside down kick, cr.mp, flash kick?

vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!!Joined: Posts: 62
There's a new Guile on the scene lately with the nick tsuyoshihyuga who does Guile upside down kick, cr.mp, flash kick. For the life of me, I can't get close to pulling this off. I can do cf.hk, cr.mp, lp sonic boom and cf.hk, s.mp, lp sonic boom fairly regularly. But I can't figure out the timing for what tsuyoshihyuga is able to do so flawlessly.

Here's a video of what I'm talking about, although in this one, he only does it once.



Does anyone have any suggestions or help for how to do this?

Thanks!

Comments

  • vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!! Joined: Posts: 62
    Here's another video where he does it 3 or 4 times:

  • Dem ShadesDem Shades If FB meets SB then backfist meets face Joined: Posts: 10
    Finally managed to do this but need more training to do it consistently. Actually it's not as hard as you think. You just have to get used to the timing. Force yourself to do the FK-cancel off of the mp a little later than you usually would do. Maybe the Delayed Charge Cancelling Video from Nemesys Syndrome (thx for your vids, man) can help you out with this too.
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    edited September 2013
    @vanRijn,


    Here are the video(s) on delayed charge cancelling:


    Post edited by Nemesys_Syndrome on
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    edited September 2013
    I'm going to add that the trick to doing most of the delayed charge cancel combos is to execute them slowly and don't rush through the inputs.

    Another word of advice. I don't know about the Seth player but Upside Down Kick on block is really unsafe and you can end up getting punished really hard for it.
    Post edited by Nemesys_Syndrome on
  • vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!! Joined: Posts: 62
    Awesome, thanks, guys! I'm going to have to spend a few hours in the training room now. =:)
  • vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!! Joined: Posts: 62
    @vanRijn,

    Here's the combo in slow motion

    So, I'm not sure what's going on in these videos. Is it just waiting longer to do the cr.mp xxx flash kick cancels than you normally would? Do you have a post or something that describes this more, @Nemesys_Syndrome?
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    @vanRijn,

    Made this video especially for you. Hope it helps.

  • vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!! Joined: Posts: 62
    @vanRijn,

    Made this video especially for you. Hope it helps.


    You rock, @Nemesys_Syndrome!! Thank you!!!

  • ugo_2uugo_2u Joined: Posts: 3,592
    I'm going to add that the trick to doing most of the delayed charge cancel combos is to execute them slowly and don't rush through the inputs.

    Another word of advice. I don't know about the Seth player but Upside Down Kick on block is really unsafe and you can end up getting punished really hard for it.
    How is a move that's 0 on block really unsafe?
    ssf4ae v2012 tutorial archive http://www.padstickgaming.com/
    Footsie Guide by Maj PDF: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30414642/footsie guide.pdf
    Follow me on Twitter @ugo_2u
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    edited September 2013
    What are you going to follow up with afterwards that will keep you safe? Risk pressing crouch tech and eating a reversal or getting thrown.

    EDIT: I honestly don't believe it's 0 on block. It has to be in the negatives.
  • traxustraxus Joined: Posts: 315
    It's 0 on block.
  • ugo_2uugo_2u Joined: Posts: 3,592

    Upside down kick

    Start up: 16
    Active: 6
    Recovery: 12
    On Block: 0 (on first active frame)
    On hit: 5 (on first active frame)

    Damgage: 100
    Stun: 200
    Meter: 60

    Special Properties
    1-29 frame lowerbody strike and projectile invincible

    6-28 frames unthrowable

    Dude this move is AWESOME!!!
    ssf4ae v2012 tutorial archive http://www.padstickgaming.com/
    Footsie Guide by Maj PDF: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30414642/footsie guide.pdf
    Follow me on Twitter @ugo_2u
  • vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!! Joined: Posts: 62
    Meh. It's okay. I get DP'd out of it all the time, and it whiffs on a decent number of characters.
  • ugo_2uugo_2u Joined: Posts: 3,592
    who does it wiff on
    ssf4ae v2012 tutorial archive http://www.padstickgaming.com/
    Footsie Guide by Maj PDF: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/30414642/footsie guide.pdf
    Follow me on Twitter @ugo_2u
  • vanRijnvanRijn Still salty about Guile nerfs!! Joined: Posts: 62
    It's been a while since I've checked, but IIRC it completely whiffs on Blanka and a couple of others, even if they don't change their hitbox on wake-up. And (again, IIRC), I believe it whiffs on Yun and Yang if they do a wake-up short or forward. I believe there are other characters whose hitboxes (I think Guy?) just get them out of Guile's upside-down-kick for free either by not doing anything or doing a relatively safe wake-up move. And of course, playing against any character with an uppercut will destroy Guile's upside down kick, since 90+% of online shoto players mash uppercut like scrubs whenever they can.
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    edited September 2013
    Bait the dp/reversals, force/train them to crouch tech then go in with the Upside Down Kick.

    I mostly use the Upside Down Kick on Crumple Stuns only. Or if I notice that they're crouch teching on reaction. Use the reaction to your benefit. Try a dash up and just block. Are they reversalling with dp's? Are they poking with a low move? Are they crouch teching? Either they'll crouch tech or throw out a low poke (low forward kick comes to mind).
  • BehindTheLightBehindTheLight gg Joined: Posts: 180
    edited April 2014
    It's crazy how hard this move is. I can't get it. Extremely annoying.

    @Nemesys_Syndrome‌ - When doing the cr.mp, you are plinking that right? Hitting mp and lp?
    Post edited by BehindTheLight on
  • TeriosTerios Where do you want me to break you first? Joined: Posts: 1,675
    @vanRijn,

    Made this video especially for you. Hope it helps.


    It's private. :C

    Rashiidoooooooo!
  • AhgamaAhgama Sunglasses Explosion Joined: Posts: 576
    Although trying to delay the cancel as much as possible can help, I think it is super important to focus on just how fast you begin your down charge. You may think you're doing it fast but make sure you aren't writing it off and that you are really doing it as fast as you can.

    You should try to go to down-back or down-forward depending on which direction you used to do your Upside Down Kick. If you did UDK starting from back, go down-back. If you started from forward, go down-forward. This will help reduce the travel time of the stick from say forward to down-back. From there, just don't mess up the link. I find that when I focus too much on the charge time and cancel time that my regular link timing suffers so try to retain whatever natural timing you had for the link.
    You must defeat Shen Long to stand a cha- /backbreaker
    Hong Kong Arcade Location Guide
    XBL: Ahgama Mk7
  • expandingmanexpandingman Joined: Posts: 105
    Yeah, my charge time is the issue. And I can tell it's the charge and not link timing because I can cancel into SB easily, but not FK. So the extra time of pushing the stick down is where charge time is lost.
  • ultraman zoffyultraman zoffy Joined: Posts: 180
    So for some strange reason, this combo just clicked tonight, and I can hit it about 7-8 times out of 10 now. Looking forward to incorporating it into my game as a new BnB! =)
  • BehindTheLightBehindTheLight gg Joined: Posts: 180
    nice man, really nice. I'm jealous.
  • plamatontoplamatonto Joined: Posts: 58
    edited December 2014
    Hi, I'm a 1000pp-4000bp Guile player, I noticed i almost never use the UDK or even st.HK, when they are close I usually use cr.lp/cr.lk/cr.mp into bnb, f.HP or just cr.hp/st.hp. When should I be using UDK, st.HK? When should I prioritize it over the options that I usually go for?

    P.S.Feel free to add answers to questions that are close to this one and are important but I didn't mention or something.
  • AhgamaAhgama Sunglasses Explosion Joined: Posts: 576
    edited December 2014
    Think about what UDK specifically counters. What do people normally do if they are scared of a tick throw? They crouch tech in rhythm with your light attacks. UDK is throw invincible after frame 6 and has no lower hurtbox after frame 1. It essentially kills most low attacks (c.lk teching) and rewards you with a high damage counter-hit combo starter plus a psychological attack on the opponents willingness to press c.lk when point blank. People can block your crouching jabs and crouch tech your throws all day. This is where you need UDK or cl.st.hp counter-hits to exploit their defensive choices. UDK can also be used against Chun's Hazanshu on reaction, or vs Abel's slow tornado throw startup and more.

    If you're talking about close neutral standing HK, it's basically a situational anti-air.. no real reason to use this on the ground. Far st.hk is pretty self explanatory... long range high damage poke that hits at a nice medium height while moving you slightly forward. Try whiff punishing shoto sweeps with it.
    You must defeat Shen Long to stand a cha- /backbreaker
    Hong Kong Arcade Location Guide
    XBL: Ahgama Mk7
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    The other night at NLBC, a Gief player tried to "splash" on me in the corner on my wake up. He slightly timed his body splash late. It was late enough for me to plink Cl.St.Hk on my wake up and knock him clean out of the air. The look he gave when he got hit was pretty much "What move is that?! Did Guile get a new move for USF4?!"
  • BehindTheLightBehindTheLight gg Joined: Posts: 180
    The other night at NLBC, a Gief player tried to "splash" on me in the corner on my wake up. He slightly timed his body splash late. It was late enough for me to plink Cl.St.Hk on my wake up and knock him clean out of the air. The look he gave when he got hit was pretty much "What move is that?! Did Guile get a new move for USF4?!"

    Is that match uploaded somewhere?
  • Nemesys_SyndromeNemesys_Syndrome What the?! Where?! Joined: Posts: 2,412
    Nope. Unfortunately not. It was in casuals only.
  • plamatontoplamatonto Joined: Posts: 58
    I can't get the timing of UDK cr.mp XX FK, however I can land the UDK cr.lp cr.mp XX FK, is there any reason to learn the cr.mp with out the cr.lp since they both start up with 4 frames?
  • AhgamaAhgama Sunglasses Explosion Joined: Posts: 576
    edited March 2015
    plamatonto wrote: »
    I can't get the timing of UDK cr.mp XX FK, however I can land the UDK cr.lp cr.mp XX FK, is there any reason to learn the cr.mp with out the cr.lp since they both start up with 4 frames?

    It's not a super practical thing to learn but mainly the difference is including the c.lp pushes your opponent further away which can cause flash kick to hit further out, only doing 80 damage instead of the full deep hit damage. If you happened to do EX flash kick and the first part whiffs, you would have wasted a meter to do the same 80 damage, and if you try to flash kick FADC U2 from too far, you won't be able to FADC because it needs to hit deeper to allow the cancel. This is kinda dependant on the range you started and also the opponent's hurtbox size but yea... also the jab may hurt scaling in some cases.

    You must defeat Shen Long to stand a cha- /backbreaker
    Hong Kong Arcade Location Guide
    XBL: Ahgama Mk7
  • pmf026pmf026 FAMILY MAN Joined: Posts: 1
    keep holding downback while cr.mp, cancel late. That's it.
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