Guile thread

1568101114

Comments

  • Footsy BebopFootsy Bebop Joined: Posts: 326
    your short is probably making contact too high, try to time it/space it so your short hits lower on your opponent.
  • MavrickMavrick "I Am Cold Blooded" Joined: Posts: 975
    Hey guys, I've recently started playing guile on GGPO and hes pretty fun. But what I'm having problems with is what to do vs dic players. After headstomps it seems like they're perfectly safe. Are there any tips with this match up?

    Not really much you can do but, try to anticipate a head stomp then counter with a air throw. If it lands and they cross you over with the flip you have two option try to attack and hit first or double hit and, or just block. 3 if they head stomp and jump away you can follow up woth a SB but, careful because they could be charging a second head stomp.
    As my dear friend Wax once said "this game is like the special olympics - even if you win you're still a retarrrd" Quotable Quotes
  • MinhHoangMinhHoang Joined: Posts: 291
    Yeah, thats what I figured =/ Thanks
    Scream in pain!!!! NIGHTMARE BOOOSTERRR!!
  • MixahMixah Joined: Posts: 8,130
    subscribes
    Beat... That's all.
  • CrotchMonkeyCrotchMonkey G-R-A-S-P Joined: Posts: 691
    Someones got to help me with honda and chun, worst matchups for me yet. Against chun, my c.mk gets stuffed, and c.fp doesn't seem to even trade with her jumps and I get thrown like crazy. She even has a fb :shake:. Every damn attack seems to end with her lightning kick shit right in my face, so even if I was blocking I can't even throw a sonic boom without touching a leg. Should I just rh flash kick through it or something? Wait for her to stop and then go from there? I get some kind of opening vibe from that like I need to do something.

    Similar situation with honda. I mean the amount of chip damage I take from honda because of the hand slaps is insane. Biggest problem with honda is if I get tripped I'm fucked. His meaties along with the crossups involving his fat ass is killing me here. I can't even do shit to him once he hits the ground because I get 360'd. Is this match supposed to be a keepaway fest for guile? I can't even do that right.

    Anyone have any insight on these two matchups?
    "War is ugly, but to be dominated is uglier." -Imam Khomeini

    SA.M at his finest:
    TheMotherFknTime: YOU WANT PAIN
    TheMotherFknTime: YOU WANT PAIN
    TheMotherFknTime: AEGIS REFLECTOR
  • MixahMixah Joined: Posts: 8,130
    against honda, you have to keep away. if you're worried about getting tick'd, his knee hop can be used against a tick throw to escape it... but watch out because it does put you back in distance to be tick'd anyway.

    remember that no matter which side you're on, down is down.... if he does the ass splash crossup, lk flash kick immediately.. don't do hk... if you wait to long, try to block it... it will win as long as you get it off around the peak of the attack.

    thousand hands are like blanka's electric... he's too close, reversal throw. remember to always maintain that charge... sonic booms to keep away... if he does the ass splash to hop over it, walk up and trip... move back... that's the basic stuff to help this fight.
    Beat... That's all.
  • BattosaiBattosai Joined: Posts: 766 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Someones got to help me with honda and chun, worst matchups for me yet. Against chun, my c.mk gets stuffed, and c.fp doesn't seem to even trade with her jumps and I get thrown like crazy. She even has a fb :shake:. Every damn attack seems to end with her lightning kick shit right in my face, so even if I was blocking I can't even throw a sonic boom without touching a leg. Should I just rh flash kick through it or something? Wait for her to stop and then go from there? I get some kind of opening vibe from that like I need to do something.



    Anyone have any insight on these two matchups?


    Guile's low forward has been raped since Super SF2, therefore chun's low forward out prioritizes it, therefore you can't turtle with the low forward like in CE or HF which sucks ass and his low forward is transparent at times and she will walk right threw it and she will start doing those annoying far standing strongs or fake it then walk up random super in your face...so be careful with it.

    Against the lighting kick I would short kick flash kick it, but make sure to crouch block it before u do that...since it will push you back a little.

    Against chun's jump ins you need to use neutral standing forward kick, then follow it up immediately with a jump towards and short kick + c.jab+ sonic boom or if she gets hit by the jump in use flash kick instead. Also if you do a sonic boom and she decides to jump over it you could also use the knee bazooka to escape her jump ins. Use stand jab when she tries to cross up you on the other side.

    It's a pain in the ass match to win with this toned down guile to be honest, but its winnable if you keep the offense on her rather then being defensive, just don't let her mobilize. Good way to be on the offense is throw a boom, follow it with a ducking short, then ducking forward kick+ sonic boom(when she absorbs it with a fireball back hand her or use the towards and sobat kick, then when she jumps use neutral standing forward kick. Also when you knock her down make sure to cross up with short + low strong + flash kick or if blocked use standing strong + boom after the low strong mix it up with throws.

    Here is a video of muteki vs a chun li player and it shows how you should play against her. I hope this all helps you out bro, take care.






    Bradford
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    Nice link battosai.

    Unfortunately though I think its really hard to learn how to fight Chun Li by watching Japanese match vids. Until you learn the anti airs for the match, you just sit there wondering why the Chun Li's in the videos arent jumping, and you dont learn anything.

    To beat Chun Li you *have* to have your anti airs down solid, and unfortunately against her, you need to use a variety of anti airs depending on the range. So you really have to be constantly aware of what range shes jumping from to know which anti air to choose.

    Close standing forward if she jumps from fairly close to you.
    Walk under standing close strong if shes even closer.
    From other ranges Low fierce works reasonably well, and if it gets outrioritized, you can often have a flash kick charged to hit her when she lands (especially if she reaction jumped a sonic boom).
    Theres sort of a sweet spot jump in range where far standing strong actually works well as an anti air.. this is something Im currently learning. You can see Muteki do it once in the video Battosai posted.
    From farther ranges, sobat kick (towards or back or neutral + forward kick) trades with her jump ins, you just have to choose whether to do it neutral or moving to hit her in the right way for the trade. From extra far ranges you can also make her land on a low foward.
    Quicky jump towards fierce is also useful sometimes.

    Before you are a master of these anti airs, dont even worry about anything else in the match, this stuff is too important.

    Other than that:

    -If you get a knockdown, Guile's crossup is nicely ambiguous against Chun = free wins. If she does her flashkick move making you whiff, flashkick her to knock her back down.
    -Sobat kick is better than low forward, as in many matchups.
    -you can anticipate her super and nail her with a jump back roundhouse. If you guess wrong you're fairly safe anyway.
    -jab sonic booms are almost safe against her super, unless shes really close to you.
    -Don't worry so much about getting thrown. Just tech the throws... big deal you took a little damage. (tech the throws fairly safely by doing low strong.. you can even mash it.. then you arent at so much risk of eating low forward-> low rh or whatever)
  • CrotchMonkeyCrotchMonkey G-R-A-S-P Joined: Posts: 691
    against honda, you have to keep away. if you're worried about getting tick'd, his knee hop can be used against a tick throw to escape it... but watch out because it does put you back in distance to be tick'd anyway.

    remember that no matter which side you're on, down is down.... if he does the ass splash crossup, lk flash kick immediately.. don't do hk... if you wait to long, try to block it... it will win as long as you get it off around the peak of the attack.

    thousand hands are like blanka's electric... he's too close, reversal throw. remember to always maintain that charge... sonic booms to keep away... if he does the ass splash to hop over it, walk up and trip... move back... that's the basic stuff to help this fight.

    Wait you mean I can reversal throw if he does the thousand hand? How close are we talking here because by the time I'm up I'm already in blockstun.
    Battosai wrote:
    chun stuff

    Thanks for that video, I can already see some situations muteki handles that will really save my ass. I'll try to keep that combo in mind so I can at least try to get some pressure on her without feeling too defensive.
    brian wrote:
    chun stuff

    Man that's a lot of shit for antiair. For crossing her up, is it me or is the range really different? I keep actually missing her when I go for a j short. Should I be attempting to do the move as a regular jump in and hope the ambiguousness crosses her up? lol

    Thanks all of you guys for the quick responses.
    "War is ugly, but to be dominated is uglier." -Imam Khomeini

    SA.M at his finest:
    TheMotherFknTime: YOU WANT PAIN
    TheMotherFknTime: YOU WANT PAIN
    TheMotherFknTime: AEGIS REFLECTOR
  • MixahMixah Joined: Posts: 8,130
    within his throw range, whatever that might be. Im' not sure, pixel-wise, but you just have to learn to judge, either block or hit f+hp as soon as you rise up. The same can be done with blanka's electric. remember tho, thousand hand and lightening legs are able to be done at a greater distance than electric, so don't expect to throw a knowing honda out of it.
    Beat... That's all.
  • wolf_1wolf_1 Joined: Posts: 169
    basically what's been said...

    i have the hardest time crossing up chun. i have the hardest time trying to anti air chun. GODDDAMNNNNN
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    If you find that your crossup on chun is whiffing, try pressing the button a touch earlier, and doing the crossup a touch closser to the "original" side.
  • jae hoonjae hoon Flames of Justice Joined: Posts: 13,131 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    This may have been covered already and I apologize if it is. I really just started ST not to long ago and I have alot of trouble with good T Hawk players. The matches are always close but it seems alot of my stuff gets out prioritized during the match. Also Sonic Booms dont seem to be to safe to do.
    SRK Kobrai Kai - Kickin bitches in the face since 2001
  • fatboyfatboy I beat anorexia: 10-0 Joined: Posts: 1,853
    8/15/08 Post....Snip......

    Sick post as always Brian.
    Am I hungry? Sure, I could eat...
  • lw3lw3 Joined: Posts: 277
    does dictator have more throw priority over guile cause i keep getting thrown out of crossup lk, lp or mpxxflashkick when playing on ggpo
  • N-TradeN-Trade Joined: Posts: 63
    does dictator have more throw priority over guile cause i keep getting thrown out of crossup lk, lp or mpxxflashkick when playing on ggpo

    I'm assuming you're being thrown after the crossup lk but before the low lp/mp... this is because you're mistiming the crossup. You need to time the crossup later (Guile needs to be closer to the ground when it hits) so that the low mp combos... if there's a gap in between then you can be thrown.

    Important note: there's no such thing as one character having specific throw priority over another. Bison does have a greater throw range than guile's which some people confuse as priority. I can elaborate on this if you like, but this does not pertain to your above problem.
  • Sanjuro_The_RoninSanjuro_The_Ronin ST 4 life yo! Joined: Posts: 572
    This may have been covered already and I apologize if it is. I really just started ST not to long ago and I have alot of trouble with good T Hawk players. The matches are always close but it seems alot of my stuff gets out prioritized during the match. Also Sonic Booms dont seem to be to safe to do.

    Your joking right?

    The Gule vs. Hawk match-up is nothing but an uphill fight for T-Hawk. SBs are safe to do IF you do them right and you really dont have that much to fear of your cr.forward getting DPed because of the angle of Hawks DP.

    Just turtle your ass off, thats all you really need to do.
    It's kind of late in history to be coming up with real good ideas, luckily I have plenty of really bad fucking ideas.
  • MixahMixah Joined: Posts: 8,130
    Your joking right?

    The Gule vs. Hawk match-up is nothing but an uphill fight for T-Hawk. SBs are safe to do IF you do them right and you really dont have that much to fear of your cr.forward getting DPed because of the angle of Hawks DP.

    Just turtle your ass off, thats all you really need to do.

    Give the guy a break, he said he's just started the game...
    Beat... That's all.
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    So, I think my nemisis in ST is the following:

    I knock down Rog, and want to do safe jump roundhouse, stand fierce, fierce sonic boom. It auto dizzies if it connects, and if its blocked it pushes Rog back significantly across the screen giving you lots of space.

    It sounds trivial but for some reason I fail at this some ridiculous fraction of the time. The basic problem seems to be that the jump roundhouse has a lot of pushback, and if you don't time things well, your stand fierce will whiff, or possibly even become far stand fierce instead of close stand fierce. Needless to say, when these things happen you are fucked.

    Wolf, if you're lurking, I have the impression you are way more consistent at this than me.. do you have any trick to it, or is it just automatic and I suck? :sad:

    PS, Rog's standing sprite is set farther back than his ducking sprite which is what makes crossing him up inconsistent.. I wonder if this could also be screwing me up on the above combo?
  • Footsy BebopFootsy Bebop Joined: Posts: 326
    Just do jump forward instead of jump roundhouse
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    Just do jump forward instead of jump roundhouse

    If you do that then it won't dizzy on hit, and I *believe* it will also not push Rog back to a range where you can safely throw a second sonic boom without fear of being rush punched.
  • fatboyfatboy I beat anorexia: 10-0 Joined: Posts: 1,853
    brian wrote:
    So, I think my nemisis in ST is the following:

    I knock down Rog, and want to do safe jump roundhouse, stand fierce, fierce sonic boom. It auto dizzies if it connects, and if its blocked it pushes Rog back significantly across the screen giving you lots of space.

    It sounds trivial but for some reason I fail at this some ridiculous fraction of the time. The basic problem seems to be that the jump roundhouse has a lot of pushback, and if you don't time things well, your stand fierce will whiff, or possibly even become far stand fierce instead of close stand fierce. Needless to say, when these things happen you are fucked.

    Wolf, if you're lurking, I have the impression you are way more consistent at this than me.. do you have any trick to it, or is it just automatic and I suck?

    PS, Rog's standing sprite is set farther back than his ducking sprite which is what makes crossing him up inconsistent.. I wonder if this could also be screwing me up on the above combo?.

    rogcopytz5.th.jpg

    Check this out. (click photo.) It shows the differnce in Rogs blocking sprite (RED) vs. his standing sprite (BLUE). The blocking sprite moves his body way back. I have to take a half of a step in just to hit the guy once he started blocking.

    I did a little testing. Remember in ST you can get up/wake up into a your block sprite. If a Rog holds back to block, by defualt his whole body and damage sprite is moved back on get up.

    Maybe whe you are jumping in the Rog player is simply holding back (not trying to BH or anyother thing), and thus is hit much futher out on your extended leg, and then is pushed back from where the the leg crosses the block, and not form where he got up.

    If you think about it, that would push him farther out on your combo and cause your fierce to whiff or change to the far standing fierce. Maybe you need to jump a we bit closer? I am not a GUile a player so I do not know how this would help you. But it was fun to explore, I am no authory but it would make sense on why he is falling out of the combo.
    Am I hungry? Sure, I could eat...
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    Well, then suppose you space your jump in closer so that when he blocks he wont get pushed too far back.

    The key question is, if he *doesnt* block, like suppose he stays in crouch, are you now so far forward that you will whiff your jump roundhouse over his head?

    If this was the case I think it would explain my problems performing this combo.

    But I dunno, I see Muteki and Kurahashi Guile do this consistently, and I could be wrong but I thought Wolf was doing this also.

    Perhaps there is a small window of spacing where it works, but the above considerations explain why this window is so small?
  • MixahMixah Joined: Posts: 8,130
    nice explaination fatboy
    Beat... That's all.
  • wolf_1wolf_1 Joined: Posts: 169
    regarding jump rh > close standing fp > fierce sonic boom combo:

    after every knockdown i always attempt the above combo. obviously if you sweep balrog or if he techs a throw then this will not work. i haven't really put much thought into this situation but i just simply find the right spacing for the jump-in and then hit balrog low and deep. from what i've noticed, my close standing FP usually whiffs if my jump-in was placed too far out. for the most part, whenever i whiff FP, my fierce sonic boom will usually come out. i don't remember what happens if balrog just crouches while you are going for the jump-in.

    success rate for me on this combo is about 60 to 75 percent. most of my mistakes come from mis-timing the jump-in rather than having incorrect spacing.

    basically, there really isn't a trick to it, just make sure you can get yourself close enough to do close standing FP.

    mixup strat - if you pull this combo off balrog atleast 2 times in a row, go for a tick throw on the third opportunity/knockdown.
  • BattosaiBattosai Joined: Posts: 766 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    regarding jump rh > close standing fp > fierce sonic boom combo:

    after every knockdown i always attempt the above combo. obviously if you sweep balrog or if he techs a throw then this will not work. i haven't really put much thought into this situation but i just simply find the right spacing for the jump-in and then hit balrog low and deep. from what i've noticed, my close standing FP usually whiffs if my jump-in was placed too far out. for the most part, whenever i whiff FP, my fierce sonic boom will usually come out. i don't remember what happens if balrog just crouches while you are going for the jump-in.

    success rate for me on this combo is about 60 to 75 percent. most of my mistakes come from mis-timing the jump-in rather than having incorrect spacing.

    basically, there really isn't a trick to it, just make sure you can get yourself close enough to do close standing FP.

    mixup strat - if you pull this combo off balrog atleast 2 times in a row, go for a tick throw on the third opportunity/knockdown.

    lol, yeah that happens to me alot to, I use j. foward kick + stand fierce+ sonic boom on rog as a meaty.

    Btw: Wolf1 you were right about how much Guiles flash kick sucks ass in SF4, you basicly cant even use it as an anti air anymore and that is what guile is know for is his Flash kick and not to mention that SJSU SF4 has stiff ass P 360's on them(i had hard time getting a flash kick out). I got really frustrated losing to freakin cvs2 and 3rd strike players at SF4....bullshit man, I expected to get a big ass 25 wins and take off like ST at the arcade, but nope not in SF4,:lame:
  • wolf_1wolf_1 Joined: Posts: 169
    foward kick + stand fierce+ sonic boom on rog as a meaty.
    is this possibly a trade off? like brian stated, if you open with roundhouse and if the combo connects, it's a guaranteed dizzy. if you open up with forward, you won't pull off a dizzy but you'll possibly have a better chance of connecting the close standing fierce?
  • BattosaiBattosai Joined: Posts: 766 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    is this possibly a trade off? like brian stated, if you open with roundhouse and if the combo connects, it's a guaranteed dizzy. if you open up with forward, you won't pull off a dizzy but you'll possibly have a better chance of connecting the close standing fierce?

    You will have a better chance connecting the stand fierce after a jump forward kick yes but no dizzy.
  • fatboyfatboy I beat anorexia: 10-0 Joined: Posts: 1,853

    Perhaps there is a small window of spacing where it works, but the above considerations explain why this window is so small?

    I'd imagine the "small window" would be starting the jump-in about half the length of Sim's hand closer to Rog. (going off of above photo) That way you don't over shoot, but are ever so much closer to connect the combo.

    I think Rog is one of the few characters in ST thats narrower while blocking and in defensive crouch.

    rogcopy2kr9.th.jpg

    In this image you have Rog's three hit boxes. Neutral (blue), Back (red) , and Defensive Crouch (black). Compare it the photo above. Both defensive positions pull Rog back from his neutral stance.
    Am I hungry? Sure, I could eat...
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    snip


    LOL you fucker I just noticed your sig :rofl:
    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • Footsy BebopFootsy Bebop Joined: Posts: 326
    How about j.fwd, low strong, sonic boom, low fwd.? that should dizzy and should give you the spacing you want and should be easier to connect. I think.
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    I tried all the combos of that sort that I could think of and unfortunately none of them actually fully connected mid screen on Rog.
  • wolf_1wolf_1 Joined: Posts: 169
    im starting to become less consistent with the combo now.
  • brianbrian Joined: Posts: 765
    damn I jinxed you lol
  • DwinDwin The Lily Warrior Joined: Posts: 597
    Im having some promblems with my guile play st lately, mostly ever since ive been playing guile i havent used any combos a al basically playing all my matches whti pokes and zoning, is their any way i can incorporate guile combos inot my game because its really hrin me damage wise.

    Also is there anyway to punish dictators head stomp thanx.
    Okay, I was wrong.
  • comoesacomoesa not too bad.. Joined: Posts: 1,172
    Need help with this combo

    crossup lk, c.lk, c.lk,/c.lp,c.lp, xx, super


    You have to kara the super with lp right any tips on the timing?
    FOREVER NEVERMORE
  • ShinVegaShinVega Shoryuken'n est. 92' Joined: Posts: 191
    Yes, but when you Kara you should enter c.short~c.jab+Up/Twds (or Up/Away depending on super motion used). That's how you renda cancel the jab into the super. You're tricking the game engine into allowing you to cancel chain combos into supers.
    No freely available material is allowed on this site, no exceptions. - ptp
    SF2 Code v1.0: t s+ T++ r f++ g+ m+ s+ v++ M++ n++:-- o++
  • SiYkOSiYkO aka fdsdfg Joined: Posts: 501
    Hi, I have been playing guile for about a week, and found a new puzzle I can't seem to solve.

    I played against a blanka who had a relatively simple game. I could hold him off at long range, but he often managed to work his way in. Once he did, he would jump over my sonic boom, and do a very late J.Fierce. I have no charge, but I have time to block this. Sometimes he jumps again after this, but since I gave up the flash kick charge to block high, I block again.

    When I do, he moves in, and invariably does his bite throw. After this, it's a sweep-range standoff as I decide to save the flash kick charge and try to outpoke him, or throw a sonic boom and repeat the same thing.

    When I try to beat the jumping attack with a normal (c.fierce or s.roundhouse with o.guile), I either trade infavorably, or lose.

    I managed to get around this by holding forward when he jumps over the sonic, and sacrifice throwing his air attack - is there a better option to beat this?

    Thanks for any help, this thread has been great.
  • comoesacomoesa not too bad.. Joined: Posts: 1,172
    Yes, but when you Kara you should enter c.short~c.jab+Up/Twds (or Up/Away depending on super motion used). That's how you renda cancel the jab into the super. You're tricking the game engine into allowing you to cancel chain combos into supers.



    Oh thanks i was actually pressing the jab befre I pressed the short..
    FOREVER NEVERMORE
  • Xeno-VXeno-V Joined: Posts: 129
    Hey guys, I read like half of this thread a few hours ago and then I went to play a bit and try some stuff (I never played Guile before and charge characters in general, but now I got a stick and they all seem much easier).

    First of all the b, df, ub+K method for Guile's super works like a charm, thanks a lot.
    I managed to do the cr lk x2 xx super and it's not that hard to pull off. I have more trouble in doing cr mp xx super but does that make sense? I do like db, df+mp, ub+k and 9 out of 10 times I get a sonic boom.

    The second question would sound stupid because i didn't start from the basics but how can you do consecutive sonic booms? In SRK wiki it says that you should kara cancel certain moves so that you decrease their recovery time.
    Is this what most people do?

    I also can't do that many SBs when pressing opponents with Cr. LPs, Cr MKs etc.

    Finally I don't know what im doing wrong but cr lk, st lk, flash kick came out like 1 time out of 10. Probably im doing something wrong and im losing the charge...
    I just hold db and press lk, then go neutral and press lk again and immediately after i press u+lk but nothing comes out.
    So.. what could I be doing wrong?
1568101114
Sign In or Register to comment.