Balrog Thread

1567810

Comments

  • CWheezyCWheezy Joined: Posts: 889
    Can't anyone with an invincible move do that
  • RufusRufus An unexpected database error has occurred. Joined: Posts: 1,966
    does Balrog have a similar OS to hawk's dp/ 360 ?
    lets say rog safe jumps with jab, then cr jab, then grab attempt + up n punch, so if opponent reversal, his grab attempt gets canceled into buffalo headbutt?
    ...
    That's a little more challenging technically, and has different properties, but should be possible (possibly also out of low rush...). Blocking is safer than the headbutt (by a little) and T Hawk has better throw range on his 360 than Balrog does on his normal throw.
    Can't anyone with an invincible move do that
    It also requires throw range and the invincible move to be 'good' enough to beat whatever reversals the other guy has available. It's unlikely to be a strong option for, say, Cammy.
    Hitboxes http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/HDR/
    "You don't know what you're talking about as much as I do." -- Unknown
  • -TheBastard--TheBastard- FAB u LOSE! Joined: Posts: 1,276
    Can't anyone with an invincible move do that
    I mention rog due having a long ass start up, so most chars if try to reversal, their attack invincibility runs out n by the time rog's buffalo headbutt is active, it beats the opponent's clean.

    also rog's mp grab has has big range so he can loop most of the cast
    <blitzfu> cool, and bastard is a loser, screen shot that
    <Pasky> he's always trolling, he has a macro button that troll
    <Kyouya>LoL Bastard, best post evah! But you forgot the tiger uppercut!!

    Imagine a snail being able to play fgs, and being a noob in it, it would sure be a salty snail, oh the tragedy of a snail!
  • othartheomothartheom recovering hyou bal Joined: Posts: 116
    this is just what boxer needs! maybe now he will be viable ;p

    **vomits**
  • oldschool_BRoldschool_BR Projectile spammer Joined: Posts: 2,442
    I'm pretty sure Sesho is right, and the Japanese - and probably even the better US Rog players - have been using it for quite some time.
  • CronopioCronopio ST Joined: Posts: 1,849
    Probably common knowledge for every Rog user, but just now I realize that you can use low TAPs while still having a high K TAP charged. Hold all three punch buttons immediately after you execute a rush punch (or a standing HP for example), holding the button you used for the rush and piano-holding (for a lack of a better term) the rest. You can do a 1 TAP immediately after the move ends, easier if your TAP hit or was blocked of course. So you can still have access to TAPs while still holding that K TAP.
  • oldschool_BRoldschool_BR Projectile spammer Joined: Posts: 2,442
    It looks like these are from the same day Tsuji did those FT10 against Sashishi, Sasori and Mattsun, at Mikado:


    Edit: 17:27 on second video is pretty unfair
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    ^^ It's unfair, but Ryu should always be using red fireball in this match. Chalk it up to execution error.
  • Bob SagatBob Sagat Akuma Thurman Joined: Posts: 1,547
    There's something I've been doing a lot lately, don't know if this is well known, but it may be worth exploring.
    If you ever find yourself getting hit with a fireball, yet you have charge, with the right timing you can hold forward for a while during the fireball slowdown and press punch really late. You'll almost do two steps forward before the rush punch comes out.
    It seems to be pretty good to gain some extra distance to hit opponents who should be out of range and it can throw people off, because the punch comes out so late after you hold forward.
    If this turns out to be useless, at least it's oddly satisfying to do.
    this is just what boxer needs! maybe now he will be viable ;p

    Claw avatar
    Roald Dhalsim
  • RufusRufus An unexpected database error has occurred. Joined: Posts: 1,966
    ...
    If you ever find yourself getting hit with a fireball, yet you have charge, with the right timing you can hold forward for a while during the fireball slowdown and press punch really late. You'll almost do two steps forward before the rush punch comes out.
    It seems to be pretty good to gain some extra distance to hit opponents who should be out of range and it can throw people off, because the punch comes out so late after you hold forward.

    You should be able to do that even without the slowdown. You can move forward the same distance, but only get to hold toward for half as long.
    Hitboxes http://www.pedantic.org/~nate/HDR/
    "You don't know what you're talking about as much as I do." -- Unknown
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    There's something I've been doing a lot lately, don't know if this is well known, but it may be worth exploring.
    If you ever find yourself getting hit with a fireball, yet you have charge, with the right timing you can hold forward for a while during the fireball slowdown and press punch really late. You'll almost do two steps forward before the rush punch comes out.
    It seems to be pretty good to gain some extra distance to hit opponents who should be out of range and it can throw people off, because the punch comes out so late after you hold forward.
    If this turns out to be useless, at least it's oddly satisfying to do.


    this is good. especially if you play chun, you can delay the fireball 1 step to keep pushing back and gain position. for ryu i don't see any advantage using, maybe ken cuz his fireball recovery is faster then ryu's.
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
    Ah shit..    
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
  • Bob SagatBob Sagat Akuma Thurman Joined: Posts: 1,547
    You should be able to do that even without the slowdown. You can move forward the same distance, but only get to hold toward for half as long.

    True, though I think the fireball slowdown might help, because it looks like you're walking longer, which may help in tricking your opponent in thinking you don't have charge. I'm no psychiatrist though, but maybe this could be useful.
    Roald Dhalsim
  • Bob SagatBob Sagat Akuma Thurman Joined: Posts: 1,547
    Standing headbutt for Rog just involves mashing st.LP and then going really fast to crouch position whilst kara'ing a light kick and then resuming the mashed LP.

    Alright, after some practice, I've managed to do this thing as well. I've also found that it isn't necessary to mash jabs first, then do the cr.lk, then mash jab again. You can go straight from the cr.lk to the jab mash. You don't even have to mash that fast, just be consistent.
    It seems to work as long as you hit down a little bit before the lk. As long as you do that, you should be able to get it, as long as there's no skipped frames getting in your way. It does seem somehow easier to mash beforehand, but you don't have to do it.
    You also don't have to switch back to mashing st.lp superfast. Just let your finger bounce off of the lk, then move up and start hitting lp.

    Still have no idea WHY the hell this works at all...

    EDIT: Wait a fucking minute, no scratch that! This is how you do it!
    I got the inputs right, but you do have to mash jab first. Mash jab, hit cr.lk, then jab again. Now, if Rog stands back up while holding down, you did it right -HOWEVER- after you do this, you don't have to start the technique again with standing jabs! It gets stored somehow.
    So after you activate the "restand", you can start the technique with the cr.lk, in stead of having to mash jab first. Fuck it up though, and you have to start with the mashed jabs again. Hope that made sense.

    tiny edit: Of course you don't even have to mash jab to start this, a single jab, followed by a cr.lk etc works as well. Mashing is probably easier though.
    Roald Dhalsim
  • -TheBastard--TheBastard- FAB u LOSE! Joined: Posts: 1,276
    only the Chun Copter creator could figure this out!
    <blitzfu> cool, and bastard is a loser, screen shot that
    <Pasky> he's always trolling, he has a macro button that troll
    <Kyouya>LoL Bastard, best post evah! But you forgot the tiger uppercut!!

    Imagine a snail being able to play fgs, and being a noob in it, it would sure be a salty snail, oh the tragedy of a snail!
  • Bob SagatBob Sagat Akuma Thurman Joined: Posts: 1,547
    Uhm no, I never would have found this thing in the first place and I still don't understand why the heck this would happen.
    Also, the only real match application I can think of so far is when you're playing against Honda. You mash the stand jabs to counter his headbutt, then when he tries to walk forward and sweep you, you bust out the headbutt.
    Roald Dhalsim
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    I've seen Boxers do it just for fun. I've seen it used to bait Zangief and Hawk players into jumping forward, but it's a pretty gimmicky move. It's just funny to see.



    4:14 You can see him attempt to do it before he finally gets it a few seconds later.
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707


    Never seen that before. Doesn't even look difficult to pull off. New Boxer tech.
  • BoggleMindsBoggleMinds Joined: Posts: 332
    I was talking to MysteriousFighter on GGPO last night and he mentioned an advanced Boxer option select against Ryu. Apparently on Ryu's wakeup you can do

    j.LK -> MP throw kara'd into LP headbutt

    where once you do the j.LK you land just outside Ryu's throw range. The idea is obviously to get a throw if Ryu does nothing, and LP headbutt (which will beat everything) if Ryu tries to shoryu or hurricane out.

    I haven't had time to try this out, and I don't think I've ever seen this technique demonstrated in any match videos. I would've thought if this technique was very effective that you'd see it used more, but maybe it isn't well known. I was wondering if anyone could confirm that the option select is possible.

    On a side note, MysteriousFighter is the only Ryu I've seen who actually uses the kick throw/DP option select in the Ryu mirror match (Nohoho posted the trick on his blog a few years back).
    "My first visit to an arcade changed my life. It was such a sensational experience. The fact I got to play with total strangers and connect with them through the game enthralled me." --Daigo Umehara

    www.youtube.com/Guoguodi
    GGPO Handle: Gizzle
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    That has been around since the SSF2 days and I'm guessing even befor. Here you see Daigo using it all over the place with Guile vs Cammy. There is a listing of the attempts in the description. The way out would be a reversal grab.


    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    actually....It wouldn't work on anything before SSF2 now that I think of it
    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    errr maybe vs Blanka huh lol
    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
  • papasipapasi N Ken is the truth Joined: Posts: 1,568
    MysteriousFighter is top tier man
    djfrijoles wrote: »
    There is a listing of the attempts in the description.

    I knew that channel is full of gold but there is nothing apparent in the title of the video and description by default is hidden on youtube. No wonder I missed it.

    Good catch beans.
    eltrouble "I doubt that ST will be on the main stream ever again."
    OhNuki: Real men play ST!!
    James Chen: there is something special about playing ST on a cab. It just feels so goooooood.
    Super Turbo Hitbox & safe jump guide http://www.strevival.com/hitbox/
  • vandarkholmevandarkholme Joined: Posts: 387
    Hey, I'm trying to learn Balrog (I'm a honda main).
    Can anyone explain to me how to deal with ryu tatsu crossups on wakeup and close range?
    Headbutt of course doesnt always work, should I use just an anti air normal when he does it not-meaty?
    Is it better to not jump in this matchup? I like to do air-to-airs in fighting games but I have no clue if there is anything that beats ryu jump tatsu unless I stick out a jumping normal veeeery early.
    Sutorito Faita : Sad strike
    vandark, you should hear a cool pherai story from me one day then. Add it to all your history. I'll probably remember it closer to EVO time and just retell it to the forum when I'm probably going to re-tell some more anyway. Its not the glory hole one though, that one's too legendary. You probably know more about that than me.
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    Hey, I'm trying to learn Balrog (I'm a honda main).
    Can anyone explain to me how to deal with ryu tatsu crossups on wakeup and close range?
    Headbutt of course doesnt always work, should I use just an anti air normal when he does it not-meaty?
    Is it better to not jump in this matchup? I like to do air-to-airs in fighting games but I have no clue if there is anything that beats ryu jump tatsu unless I stick out a jumping normal veeeery early.

    A lot of it is dependent on Ryu's timing. If he goes for early tatsus, you can actually do a dash upper to get out of the way. Advanced players can do dash upper ~ super, which sometimes hits Ryu as he's landing from the jump.

    Honestly, the best solution is to crouch-block. This counters late tatsu attempts. Basically you duck down as you get up, and then stand up and block the crossup direction. Depending on how he does it, he'll either whiff the attack, or you'll end up blocking it as you stand up. Difficult to time, and situation specific, but that is one option.

    Again, I stress, these are pretty advanced maneuvers that require that you get a feel for Ryu's attack timing, and a lot of practice. Best case scenario is to avoid getting caught in these mixups in the first place. For now, it might be easier to just block against it, hope you block correctly. Ryu can't go for a lot of mixups if you block since you get pushed a bit far away, and it's VERY difficult for Ryu to cross up Boxer using a j.roundhouse.

    The standard strategy is to not jump initially. Use jab headbutt to get around fireballs, or the fierce version if you're within range to hit him. Build meter by doing this. You can occasionally go for a jab low rush punch if you want to play more aggressive. You might catch him doing a bad fireball or low poke, then you can have fun doing safe jumps, mixups, turn punches. Go nuts.

    The matchup feels about even, maybe slight Ryu favor at the start. Once boxer gets super, a clean knockdown, or traps Ryu in the corner, it's strongly in his favor. RTSD.
  • MaxGritMaxGrit Master Baiter Joined: Posts: 291
    Balrog is a fun character to learn for a brand new ST player. Do you think I can learn him for USF4 by playing ST?
    SSF4T on GGPO is very fun.
  • DNGR S PAPERCUTDNGR S PAPERCUT Joined: Posts: 1,608
    Yeah. Pr-balrog was playing sf4 rog rush down like st rog. Shit was hype. I almost rush punched the guy sitting next to cuz it reminded me so much like st rog.
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
    Ah shit..    
    ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬ஜ۩۞۩ஜ▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    MaxGrit wrote: »
    Balrog is a fun character to learn for a brand new ST player. Do you think I can learn him for USF4 by playing ST?

    Depends on your style of play. Playing ST can force you to rely on your fundamentals, as Balrog has a very good poke game in both SF4 and ST. His rush punch is pretty oppressive in ST, whereas it's not quite so abusive in SF4, since game mechanics and certain characters have a lot more safe options to combat it. It can also help you learn how to hold TAP while playing the footsie game, and how to hide charge times during your offense, which is pretty tricky to learn at first.

    The same thing can be done by playing Rog in AE and just learning the game. Getting seat time in either games will definitely help build you up as a player.
  • geadomgeadom Reversal Counter Hit Joined: Posts: 1,077
    Learning to play ST as ANY character is gonna help you in any other game possible, even non-fighting games, imo
    "He´s different, he´s special." Pick up your spear, the only thing you can do is your best
  • -TheBastard--TheBastard- FAB u LOSE! Joined: Posts: 1,276
    turtle players= camping
    <blitzfu> cool, and bastard is a loser, screen shot that
    <Pasky> he's always trolling, he has a macro button that troll
    <Kyouya>LoL Bastard, best post evah! But you forgot the tiger uppercut!!

    Imagine a snail being able to play fgs, and being a noob in it, it would sure be a salty snail, oh the tragedy of a snail!
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    So... against Ryu's short tatsu into throw bullshit. What do you Rog players do to counter? Seems like since short tatsu doesn't have any landing frames it is incredibly easy to jam on throw or just block/srk.
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    So... against Ryu's short tatsu into throw bullshit. What do you Rog players do to counter? Seems like since short tatsu doesn't have any landing frames it is incredibly easy to jam on throw or just block/srk.

    You can actually hit Ryu during his landing frames, but it seems easier to use an attack that hits mid instead of low for ease of timing. cr.jab and cr.strong are popular options, since there's not much hurtbox on those attacks.

    Alternatively, you can use jab headbutt, as that beats out throw attempts, attacks, and stands a good chance at beating, trading, or going through uppercuts.
  • oldschool_BRoldschool_BR Projectile spammer Joined: Posts: 2,442
    Headbutt, crouching fierce, cr.fwd -> cr.str xx rush, kick rush, standing fierce, standing strong, block and throw... Lots of options. It's only ever useful as an escape attempt to safe jumps and from point blank range, when sometimes normals go the wrong way. Offline, it's free damage in every other scenario. And when Rog does damage... it's high damage.
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    I usually try to tag the short tatsu on the way down with a cr mp but it seems if they are going for a throw out of the tatsu they always get it. Crouching HP will usually miss because it doesn't have enough horizontal hitbox to connect. Crouching HK has long startup and usually gets me thrown too. Reacting with a headbutt seems like the way to go, but that is a pretty difficult spot to do it in for me.
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • CUTWESTCUTWEST IMM'A....BAAAAST! Ya' Mirin'? Joined: Posts: 1,733
    edited December 2014


    New Technique / Glitch discovered???

    explain.png
  • BixHDBixHD Semi-lurker Joined: Posts: 182
    edited March 2015
    Is st.MK good as a poke? I see Boxer players in SF4 use it as such sometimes, so I'm guessing it should apply in ST aswell
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    edited March 2015
    BixHD wrote: »
    Is st.MK good as a poke? I see Boxer players in SF4 use it as such sometimes, so I'm guessing it should apply in ST aswell

    I only really see close standing mk (and close standing hk, same thing) used as a tick in ST, and rarely at that.

    Balrog_stclfrwrd2_stclrh2.png

    Far standing mk and hk are kinda useless imo.

    Balrog_stfarfrwrd2.png Balrog_stfarrh3.png

    Post edited by studtrooper on
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    BixHD wrote: »
    Is st.MK good as a poke? I see Boxer players in SF4 use it as such sometimes, so I'm guessing it should apply in ST aswell

    Not really. It's a cancellable poke at close ranges, which lets you try out some funky frame traps and style points in your attack string, but it's not really a core part of his gameplay.

    As far as the neutral game goes, his st.HP, cr.MP, cr.MK, cr.HK, special moves, cr.HP or st.MP (anti-airs), are WAY more important. It's all quite matchup dependent though. Learning how to have a strong rush game and incorporate all these things + specials and supers into your attack patterns is just as important.
  • BixHDBixHD Semi-lurker Joined: Posts: 182
    I only really see close standing mk (and close standing hk, same thing) used as a tick in ST, and rarely at that.
    Far standing mk and hk are kinda useless imo.
    eltrouble wrote: »
    Not really. It's a cancellable poke at close ranges, which lets you try out some funky frame traps and style points in your attack string, but it's not really a core part of his gameplay.

    As far as the neutral game goes, his st.HP, cr.MP, cr.MK, cr.HK, special moves, cr.HP or st.MP (anti-airs), are WAY more important. It's all quite matchup dependent though. Learning how to have a strong rush game and incorporate all these things + specials and supers into your attack patterns is just as important.

    Yup, tried it out a bit, I think it leaves your lower self vulnerable a lot. st.HK looks like it might make an anti-air... maybe.
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    edited March 2015
    BixHD wrote: »
    Yup, tried it out a bit, I think it leaves your lower self vulnerable a lot. st.HK looks like it might make an anti-air... maybe.

    Your anti-air go to normals are crouching HP and standing MP. If you haven't already found it, take a look here: http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Balrog_(ST)
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    BixHD wrote: »
    it leaves your lower self vulnerable a lot. st.HK looks like it might make an anti-air... maybe.

    You only use it as part of an attack string. It's not reliable at all in the neutral game.

    St.HK is pretty useless compared to his other ridiculously good normals. Like previously stated, cr.HP and st.MP are his best anti-airs. As far as special moves go, his headbutt, rush upper (surprise, long distance AA), and super are his best AAs.
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    does Balrog have a similar OS to hawk's dp/ 360 ?
    lets say rog safe jumps with jab, then cr jab, then grab attempt + up n punch, so if opponent reversal, his grab attempt gets canceled into buffalo headbutt?

    Look at 11:45 of video:

    Does anyone know how to do this consistently? A rog player on Fightcade did it against my honda with great success a few months ago (ochio be damned) and it got me curious.

    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • BoggleMindsBoggleMinds Joined: Posts: 332
    does Balrog have a similar OS to hawk's dp/ 360 ?
    lets say rog safe jumps with jab, then cr jab, then grab attempt + up n punch, so if opponent reversal, his grab attempt gets canceled into buffalo headbutt?

    Look at 11:45 of video:

    Does anyone know how to do this consistently? A rog player on Fightcade did it against my honda with great success a few months ago (ochio be damned) and it got me curious.

    I believe it's possible (at least, various people have told me so), but I could never get it to work. I have a feeling if it was consistently doable then all you'd ever see is this mixup, similar to how T.Hawk is played. It reminds me of some of the crazy OS's that MysteriousFighter would do with Ryu, yet I never saw any other Ryu players use them. Probably comes down to inconsistency and therefore becoming an unreliable crutch.
    "My first visit to an arcade changed my life. It was such a sensational experience. The fact I got to play with total strangers and connect with them through the game enthralled me." --Daigo Umehara

    www.youtube.com/Guoguodi
    GGPO Handle: Gizzle
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    I believe it's possible (at least, various people have told me so), but I could never get it to work. I have a feeling if it was consistently doable then all you'd ever see is this mixup, similar to how T.Hawk is played. It reminds me of some of the crazy OS's that MysteriousFighter would do with Ryu, yet I never saw any other Ryu players use them. Probably comes down to inconsistency and therefore becoming an unreliable crutch.

    I tried looking up my replay data in fightcade but it turns out it was slightly before Fightcade's start. The dude who did it so well was called "DAIGO" on GGPO. Obviously not Umehara. No idea who he really is.
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    Balrog vs Chun theory time. What are you supposed to do against a Chun player that spams the shit out of cr mk and has excellent reversal ability and reaction time? Seems like rog has no answer outside of super. It beats all of rog's ground arsenal it seems like :/
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • eltroubleeltrouble Joined: Posts: 5,707
    Balrog vs Chun theory time. What are you supposed to do against a Chun player that spams the shit out of cr mk and has excellent reversal ability and reaction time? Seems like rog has no answer outside of super. It beats all of rog's ground arsenal it seems like :/

    Build meter first, then go in. Even Chun has to respect a super that can punish a cr.mk at half screen. Sweeps at max range tend to trade in his favor, safe jumps work very well against Chun, Boxer's short jump arc can be hard to AA consistently depending on your timing, and a normal straight rush trades against her legs.

    Tons of footage available on youtube to study from. Tsuji vs. Otochun pops up quite a lot, and you may be able to find Shiki vs. Chun with some hard digging.
  • BoggleMindsBoggleMinds Joined: Posts: 332
    edited July 2015
    Balrog vs Chun theory time. What are you supposed to do against a Chun player that spams the shit out of cr mk and has excellent reversal ability and reaction time? Seems like rog has no answer outside of super. It beats all of rog's ground arsenal it seems like :/

    I've never played a Chun who spams cr.MK, although I don't think that it's as strong of a counter to Boxer as you think.
    Maybe try trading with jab rush from the correct range against cr.MK. By correct range I basically mean the very tip of Boxer's glove.

    Balrog_lrush4.png

    Crouching roundhouse is also excellent at trading with her normals, so you could try that. If it trades it's in your favour too, plus you get the knockdown into further mixups. This is all assuming that you're "losing" the neutral game because she has upkicks to stop you jumping in or trying to TAP to get in. Like eltrouble said, feel free to build meter as another option since you're not really pressured by a defensive cr.MK.

    The way Chun usually wins is by zoning with lightning legs into kikouken, having upkicks charged and ready to go in case of TAP or a jump-in. If she gets a knockdown you'll probably eat a throw or two given how godlike her throw is in this game. Once she gets super your offense is essentially shut down as well.

    The way Boxer wins is getting a knockdown and then maximizing damage off that with mixups. Once you have super you can shutdown her fireball game. It's relatively hard to win the neutral game in this matchup, although there are things like trading with legs and kikouken by using st.HP or the straight rush. Sometimes you can catch them doing lightning legs without a down charge and jump at her with j.fierce into grab (aka the "Tamashima grab"), for example. If she switches to zoning with kikoukens then you generally try and build meter quickly with headbutts and short rushes, otherwise you won't be able to get in. Overall it's still a slightly unfavourable matchup but definitely winnable.

    "My first visit to an arcade changed my life. It was such a sensational experience. The fact I got to play with total strangers and connect with them through the game enthralled me." --Daigo Umehara

    www.youtube.com/Guoguodi
    GGPO Handle: Gizzle
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    Overall it's still a slightly unfavourable matchup but definitely winnable.

    I used to think Rog had a slight advantage in this match but I agree Chun wins this 5.5-4.5 or something like that. I usually don't have that big of an issue with Chun, but KushYu on fightcade has an amazingly great gameplan for Chun vs Rog. I don't think I've ever feared that cr.MK as much as when he uses it as a pressure tool (into combo or throw threat or whatever). Wish I could easily turn fightcade replays into youtube videos so I can point directly to the matches.

    If anyone's bored and doesn't mind waiting for the balrog vs chun fights to give me some insight I'd appreciate it (I play Honda/Rog and a little Hawk here while Kush plays mostly Ryu and Chun): fightcade://challenge-6105-1436564266.70@ssf2xj
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    Alright. Lets talk about Balrog's super and the "random" lag occurrence that happens occasionally that allows him to be hit (or thrown, or swept) after the 2nd or 3rd hit. Anyone have any notes here on how it usually happens and how to avoid it? Seems like it usually happens when the opponent is in the corner and usually happens more against a blocking opponent than one getting hit.
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
  • oldschool_BRoldschool_BR Projectile spammer Joined: Posts: 2,442
    I remember it happening frequently when I am quite near the corner, yet not with my back against the invisible wall.
  • studtrooperstudtrooper Super Turbo Joined: Posts: 3,053
    I remember it happening frequently when I am quite near the corner, yet not with my back against the invisible wall.

    Good point. I think I recall something similar. Wish there was more data on this.
    ST/HDR: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    GGPO/Fightcade: x64
Sign In or Register to comment.