Sim thread

JorantJorant Joined: Posts: 222
Can someone help me with Sim? I know nothing about him. What makes him so damned top tier? I know his grab range is sick, and he's got some nice sliding noogie traps. What moves should I use a lot, what ones are total garbage I should stay away from, if there's such a thing? Little help from some Sim masters?
«13456789

Comments

  • KyokujiKyokuji Needlessly Perverted Joined: Posts: 2,926
    General stuff

    First off, remember that his limbs are controllable in ST. You can hold back to get the close versions of any of his normals.

    In terms of fireball zoning, you'll mostly be wanting to use LP yoga fires (with some exceptions) as they give you plenty of time to stuff whatever they try afterwards and they'll hit jumping characters with large hit boxes. The occasional FP/MP fireball can be used to mess them up or to hit them on wake-up. Yoga flames are generally lousy anti-air, you just end up getting nailed most of the time.

    Close up, c. MK and c. MP are usually your best friends. You can use slides to cross-up people jumping in close-up, or from farther away just to keep them from advancing on you. They'll also go under fireballs and stuff like Balrog's dash punches.

    s. RH is good for early long distance anti-air. Also for punishing stuff like missed sumo stomps or boxer headbutts as long as you time it right. s. MK for stuff closer up or for people whose jump arcs go past s. RH.
    s. LK for situations closer up where s. MK doesn't work right. Back LK is good as a late close-up anti-air, as is his Back LP, which has godly priority, and can also be used to stuff certain cross-up attempts and things like Vega's dive. Back MP is good for stuff that Back+LP won't touch and also again for stopping cross-ups.

    You can use low LK drills to go over fireballs (your best friend against O. Sagat), and nail them once (don't try to follow-up, you'll get stuffed or reversed). Close-up, a mix of RH and MK drills is good for pressuring, and in the corner, you can mix close crouching attacks with low drills and the occasional spear for keeping them from jumping. Well timed/spaced drills will also beat stuff like bison's psycho crusher. Low RH/MK drills are also good for safely advancing on your opponent, or moving around in general since 'Sim's walk/jump speeds are both lousy. When you do drill at someone, try to do it so you hit their feet, otherwise it's very easily punished. They can also be used as a psyche out tool to get someone to jump, whiff something or back off.

    His s. MP can be used to stuff a surprising number of moves. s. FP can be used as a late anti-air of sorts and to punish all sorts of moves. Yoga flames are good for pressure, and the occasional yoga blast for anti-air against high jumpers like Chun' or Vega. If you get a knockdown in the corner and they have a large enough hit box, you can often LP yoga flame them to death as long as you're far back enough.

    I haven't found much use for his back RH.
    s. LP has great priority and can be used to stop pokes. Jump back FP can be good for punishing jump-ins or moves that are normally difficult or impossible to counter like Vega's dive if he's farther away, and jumping straight up with MK can stop Blanka's jump-in among other things. I've seen people use jump back LP instead on occasion as well (maybe because it stays out longer?). Jumping forward with RH can also stop Vega players from getting onto the wall in the first place, just watch out for the bait and switch with the other wall move.

    c. MP is probably your best poke for pressuring or pushing someone back. It's got great range and priority and it's cancel-able. Generally, if you want to get someone away from you, you can do something like close c. MK, close, c. MP, c.MP, s. FP/Yoga fire. If they jump-in and you can't nail them out of the air, and you're somewhat far away, just c. MP them as they land then push them back with a fireball or s. MP/FP.

    Teleporting

    His teleport I mainly reserve for getting out of the corner, because it's not a good spot for 'Sim, especially against someone like Honda. It can glitch on occasion and teleport you into the same spot, which is a serious problem that is unfortunately unavoidable for the most part. 'Porting to the same spot can be good as a psyche out on occasion. You can also use the 'port to avoid chip damage on wake-up provided you can get it out in time.

    Combos

    The only combos you'll probably be using are c. MK/MP > Yoga fire/flame and LK/MK slide > Yoga fire/flame/super. You can also combo a c. MK from a late RH drill.

    Noogie

    You can cross-up Chun' or Vega after a noogie (very helpful since those are your worst match-ups), by using a properly timed c. MK and then follow up with db. MK x2 and whatever for the dizzy.

    Other noogie follow-ups include: Walk forward, close c. MK, and then a series of pokes, walk forward c. MK > yoga fire, low RH drill > Throw, LK Slide > Throw, yoga flame, super.

    Dizzies

    If you do dizzy someone. The best thing to do is usually just LK drill after them and then throw them since you usually won't have time for anything else, and there's not much else you can do anyway. It's good to remember that if you throw them and their life is low enough that they would've died if they didn't tech, they'll take full damage from the throw regardless.
    I also see people do Yoga Flame > LK Yoga Blast > LP Yoga Flame to build meter instead on occasion.

    First 3 seconds

    The opening moments of a match can be very important for 'Sim. If you get off to a bad start, it can often be very difficult to recover against someone like Boxer.
    Most people usually jump back and then wait to see what the opponent does. If they try something, stuff it and if they don't, you can just land and you're at a better starting distance.

    The main thing to remember with 'Sim is to control the space. Zoning =/= turtling. Use drills to move around and try to find the optimal zoning distance for each character and then try to keep them there. If things get desperate, you can always try to drill/throw them death.
    He also has one of the best supers in the game. It does great chip, goes through a ton of shit, and will beat just about anything on wake-up.
    His main weakness is his lack of a reversal. As one of the only characters in the game without one, getting knocked down = bad. You can teleport, but that's not reliable in the corner.

    He may be top tier, but he's far from being a brain dead character (most of the time anyway). All his match-ups play very differently, and a single knock-down can often spell disaster for him.

    Specific match-ups:

    VS 'Gief - Probably the easiest match for 'Sim. This is close to a free win, depending on whether you can keep him at arms length (Dhalsim arms). Stick with yoga fires and s. MP/FP to keep pushing him back. If he lariats, it's a free FP for you. Be careful RHing or MKing him, since a lariat will beat it and knock you down, which could get you into big trouble. Watch out for the occasional banishing fist (green hand) past one of your fireballs. Keep in mind that his s. RH will beat your RH/MK and his c. LP will beat your c. MP.
    His c. RH can also beat a lot of your pokes as well if timed properly.

    VS Honda - A surprisingly difficult match. Don't let him get in, because you're likely fucked if he does. He'll cross you up/tick/command throw you until you're done.
    Back LP and db. LP will stuff his headbutts and if he sumo stomps, jump up backwards with him and knock him out of the air or b. MP. s. RH can also punish it with proper spacing/timing but I wouldn't recommend it. Use close normals if he does it closer up.
    His jumping RH has surprisingly priority and it tends to trade with your s. MK so be ready with your close anti-airs. If he empty jumps or manages to land safe from a stomp, push him back with s. MP/FP. Watch out for headbutts, be patient, and remember to block HHS' low.
    One knockdown can mean death for you in this match, and whatever you do, don't let him get you in the corner, or it's command throw hell for you. The flame trap can however, be your best friend if you manage to knock him down in the corner instead, since he has such a large hitbox.

    VS Chun' - Probably your worst match-up next to claw. Her jumping MK stuffs everything you have, but will sometimes trade with back MP. The only real way to beat it is to do jump back FP (you have to be above her for it to hit), or early jump back RH as a precaution (this will probably trade if you do it too late). Jump back MK drill is also decent anti-air as long as you're above her when you do it. Don't try drilling over her fireballs too often. They move slow enough to hit you most of the time. Learning to slide under her fireballs consistently will help you out a lot since it puts you in a position to back MP under her jump MK or s. RH her jump-in attempt in advance.

    If she lightning kicks from afar, spear over it or use s. MK. You can use RH at the proper distance to keep her from jumping, but once she's in the air, it's her game more or less. Low RH drills can be very effective on her, just watch out for the occasional reversal.

    It can be hard to stop her jab/MP pressure. If she does manage to throw you, and you reverse, you can use standing MP as an option select (if she tries to counter throw, you throw her, if she tries to flip kick out, you hit her with back MP or if it misses, you still have time to block)

    VS Blanka - You get a free FP off every missed or even successful roll attempt. You can use jumping MK to stuff his jump-ins (just watch for rolls) and a slide if you don't see it coming early enough. It's risky though, try to slide so you land behind him instead. That way you don't get nailed by a late jump FP or cross-up LK. Don't let him fluster you with jump-in pressure.

    VS T. Hawk - s. RH any blocked dive attempts or jump-ins and otherwise zone him as normal. If he tries to dive short and tick-throw you, just throw him instead. Keep in mind that unlike 'Gief, he has a DP that will knock you out of your standing/crouching pokes. This match-up is painfully unfair. b. LP literally beats everything he has. Dives, his DP, you name it.

    VS Claw - Likely your toughest match-up. One knockdown can again mean serious trouble for you, because he'll start his ambiguos dive cross-up crap. Use jump back FP, back LP and yoga blasts to stuff dives (watch out for baits) and drill/tick throw his ass to death if you get a chance. If you're advancing and he's retreating, you may want to jump forward with RH to stop him from getting onto the wall. Some of your normals will go under/through his horizontal wall dive.

    VS Boxer - Slides and c./s. MP are you friends here. RH to stop headbutts and far jump-ins, and MK for occasional closer-up one. If he manages to corner you, be patient. Otherwise you'll probably get nailed with a headbutt. Teleport out as soon as you can and keep poking with c. MK when you get a chance. MP yoga fires are your friends here since if you trade, it'll knock him down so you're not stuck blocking his crazy rushdown. Watch your fireballs once he has meter just like you would with Ryu.

    VS Dictator - Back LP to stuff reverse devil punches after a headstomp. It also beats his psycho crusher/knee clean. Yoga blasts can stop his headstomp, but you can easily get baited into eating a psycho crusher doing that. He's very susceptible to drill pressure since he has lousy anti-air, but watch out for s. FP when drilling from afar.

    VS O. Sagat - Be patient in this match-up and it's in your favour. Low LK drills will go over his low tiger shots. His jumping RH can be stuffed by back LK or a slide. s. FP to punish any missed tiger uppercuts. Watch out for the occasional tiger knee, and remember his s. LK hits low and is combo-able. Be patient and use slides/RH/MK drills to move past his tiger shots. You can probably fireball war with him for a while before he beats you out, so you can use this to stall or build meter if necessary.

    VS Ryu - Relatively easy match-up for you until he gets meter. LK drill over his fireballs, use RH to stuff his jump-ins. Watch out for the occasional air hurricane, and throw him as he lands. Be careful poking better players, as they can easily DP your limbs if you get predictable. Hurricane kicks will over your fireballs as well. You can punish missed hurricanes by blocking one hit, ducking to get out of block stun and then headbutting him before the next hit. Try to stay within range of being able to RH him when he tries to fireball. When he has meter, cool your projectile throwing and play carefully until he blows his meter. Try to bait him in to using his super without using moves that leave yourself too open.

    VS O. Ken - Fast, invincible DP's are a pain in the ass. Don't get baited into trying to punish repeated LP DP's. If you're going to punish one, be very careful with your timing. Too early or too late = you getting knocked down. Patience is the key.

    VS Guile - You're gonna want to keep trying to c. LP/MP him under his sonic booms then block right after. Drilling over his sonic booms is dangerous since he'll probably just flash kick you, and his jump-in goes right over 'Sim's s. RH from the right distance so be careful and be ready to slide or whatever. Probably safer to use b. LK since it beats just about all his jump-ins.
    Watch out for ambiguous cross-up LK if you get knocked down.

    VS Deejay - Be careful using c. MP in this match-up, his slide beats it clean. s. MP does go over it though. You can c. MP under his fireballs just like Guile, but again be careful with your timing. db. MK to beat his slides. A lot of his normals badly out prioritize your's so be careful. Slides will beat jump-ins that stuff your normal anti-airs.

    VS Fei-Long - Slide under bicycle kicks or try to trade with back LP. Watch for c. FP's since they can dizzy you fast, but other than that it's pretty much your match. Just keep your cool when the bicycle/rekka rush down starts and throw him out of any badly spaced/timed rekkas. Otherwise, you might find yourself dizzied before you know what happened.

    VS Cammy - Your pokes beat out every move she has. So figure out what beats what and the match is more or less your's.

    'Sim mirror I'm pretty clueless on, and I figure I'm not alone as even a lot of the mirror matches I've seen from the Japanese seem pretty sloppy. Then again, despite his tier ranking, 'Sim players are pretty scarce in most areas, so it's likely not going to be a huge problem if you neglect it for a while (the lack of replies for this topic is also good evidence of that). From what I've seen and played, there's a lot of offensive drilling involved.

    Your worst matches are essentially Chun', Claw, O. Ken and Honda.
    Don't rush reversals with Chun' and Claw as they have fast walk speeds that make it seem like they can throw a lot earlier than they really can.
    "Getting herpes on your face is not a cost-saving solution."
  • Footsy BebopFootsy Bebop Joined: Posts: 326
    Here's a random Sim question.

    Against ST Dictator, does Sim have anything that reverses Dictator's jumping forward (his jumping knee)?

    I know you can't slide on it, but does anything else work? standing jab, stand short?
  • KyokujiKyokuji Needlessly Perverted Joined: Posts: 2,926
    Close s. MK and close s. LK trade, and close s. LP can beat it early closer up. You'd probably have to drill or jump back FP or something from farther away.
    Also, if they're properly timed, a grounded Dhalsim has nothing that will beat shoto FP/RH, Deejay's RH, Blanka's RH, Vega's FP or Sagat's RH up close. The best you'll get is a trade with close s. LK most of the time. You can slide under all of these though.

    If they jump straight up next to you, your best option is almost always close s. MP. Except for the shoto's straight jumping RH which is beaten by close s. LP.

    Back LP will also trade with or beat a lot of normals from farther away as well, as long as their limb doesn't extend past the front of his hand and the priority on their attack isn't too high.
    "Getting herpes on your face is not a cost-saving solution."
  • GrahamGraham Joined: Posts: 571
    Here's a random Sim question.

    Against ST Dictator, does Sim have anything that reverses Dictator's jumping forward (his jumping knee)?

    I know you can't slide on it, but does anything else work? standing jab, stand short?

    Standing jab close counters it.

    As for anti airs, slides work on many chars(they have no jumpin that hits the slide, meaning they cant jump at you), use short slide, low close jab, low close forward as a 3 hit combo on jumpins or do forward slide from a bit further back crossup, then 2 low close forwards, for a 3 hit combo.

    Some chars the slide wont work on the jumpin, in these instances its either close standing jab, far standing jab, or close standing short/forward. If a char jumps on your head then use the close standing strong. Very few chars in the game have counters for all those. If anyone does ask me ill tell you the counter.
  • OuroborusOuroborus plays 3s just to troll Joined: Posts: 7,247 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    i use st old sim.

    whats a good anti air vs chuns j.mk j.lk and ryu and kens crossup?
    ssf4ae tier list regarding Gen:

    D Proto: and where is Gen?
    oORYUOo: you cannot tier what you cannot see
  • KyokujiKyokuji Needlessly Perverted Joined: Posts: 2,926
    You have to remember that just because you can't afford to hit them with the slide, doesn't mean you can't slide under their attack.

    Close s. LP against shoto cross-up. Back MP or jump back FP/RH/MK drill for Chun's MK and you can just slide in on her LK or use anything really on her jumping LK, but the thing is they look identical, so you're better off not taking the chance.

    If you're using old 'Sim, you're gonna have to jump to counter these or slide under the shoto cross-ups from close range.
    "Getting herpes on your face is not a cost-saving solution."
  • Footsy BebopFootsy Bebop Joined: Posts: 326
    What can Sim use to reverse Blanka's jumping attacks? Blanka's jumping fierce? jumping roundhouse? jumping forward? jumping short?
  • KyokujiKyokuji Needlessly Perverted Joined: Posts: 2,926
    I find that jumping forward/MP is best against Blanka with his high jump arc and fast jump speed.
    "Getting herpes on your face is not a cost-saving solution."
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Dhalsim

    I dont think there is one of there....
    But what are some good combo/strats wiht him, i want to learn a good sim
  • NKINKI Mashers Joined: Posts: 1,788
    Merged.
    It was a fun ten years.

    http://nki.combovideos.com
    Thanks to BlazeD and Preppy for hosting!
    Avatar by Buttermaker.
  • Deadpool135Deadpool135 Joined: Posts: 513
    Thank you kyokuji for all the info =). It was much needed.
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    Does anyone know how the damage works for the Yoga Flame? Sometimes it does a ton of damage and other times it does close to nothing. There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it. Is it completely random, or is there some secret to getting bigger damage out of it?
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    random
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    That's too bad. I was hoping there was some technique to it, like make sure to hit them with just the end tip of the flame or something. Oh well.
  • KyokujiKyokuji Needlessly Perverted Joined: Posts: 2,926
    Could be a variety of factors anyway. Natural damage reduction as a person's lifebar goes down, or things just being random as ST sometimes is.
    "Getting herpes on your face is not a cost-saving solution."
  • CigarBoBCigarBoB Joined: Posts: 895
    Sim VS. Boxer

    Here is a bit to add for the match vs Boxer.

    To start the match you have to set the tone right away. I would recomend you dont even pick your character but let time run out on the character select screen so that your opponent knows what is in store for him. Ahh nothing like prematch strats.

    Starting off the round it is wise to cr.strong. If boxer blocks you can put him at the right range right away. If he head butts you will recover and be able to st.mk him before he lands and then a fierce FB will force him to block again. At this point he is in your range. It should be just outside your st.mp rage.

    When you have boxer in your range DO NOT wiff to many moves. Most medium/hard wiffed moves will let boxer rushsweep you and then even if you block it he is in on you. At this range it is best to use FB's and st/cr.mp's that are blocked.

    Be careful not to toss to many fireballs as a good boxer will strait jump one and then get in on you. after you get him at this range mix up your FB speeds. Toss a Jab and if he strait jumps its you can hit him with a few limbs. If he does the < or > fp/mp you can st.fp him. If he does a RH on the way down you can wait and hit him with rh/mk just before he hits the ground. Again be carefull not to get reckless with FB's at this point keep your calm and hold him down with mk/mp.

    When boxer does get in, and he will, you need to watch a few things. If he should jump from far to hit you do a back.mk/lk then you can cancel into jab/strong FB to force him to block and get him back in your range. Back+Jab is an excelent move when boxer is in close on you. Some boxers love to just jump on your head when you are in the corner. If you are not comfortable telleporting you can b.jab him out of the air if you do it early. In this sittuation it is better to do a teleport, the 623KKK will take you the furthest away.

    You will now need to know how to deal with close blocked/wiffed buffalos. After boxer buffalos you can do a few things. If it is wiffed and he is close I recomend you cr.jab x Jab FB. This will force him to block and then anticipate your next move. You can cr.strong and push him out but if you anticipate another buffalo just mk him and get him back to your range again. If you block the buffalo cr.mp/cr.mk will hit him but it may not be wise to xx FB. If the boxer is smart they will buffalo again and hit you and then he is in. you should cr.mkx2 to push him out and then set the pace of the match again.

    Oh and remember the Fierce FB is your friend. From full screen there isn't any thing he can do to punnish you for throwing them. If you play an opponent that likes to use the 1,2,3,4's you will hit him out of them and knock him down. Even if he does a normal rush and trades with you he will be knocked back to the far side of the screen and you are back in controll with more pokes.

    When boxer gets super BLOCK!! I can not stress this enough. It will and has turned the whole game because of one bad slide or FB. If you are keeping him at your max range your game will not change to much. He can not super through FB's at full scree. But from 3/4 screed stop tossing them and do not cr.mk xx FB when he has super he will go through the FB with it every time if they are good. Keep it simple and wait for him to burn his super.

    This is a match that I have had to work out against Joe Zazza's rog over the past 1.5 years. If there is any thing that can be adjusted or added please do.

    Thanks to Gian for showing me the light and making me want to play sim.

    It is my opinion that this match is in favor of sim 60/40 and maybe even 70/30 if boxer doesn't have super.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    who has some strats vs blanka? specifically how to anti-air the bastard.
  • GrahamGraham Joined: Posts: 571
    standing strong close, when he is close, low jab when he jumps from a distance or jump back/up and fierce if you got the space.
  • CigarBoBCigarBoB Joined: Posts: 895
    If blanka is jumping in at you with LK you can short slide under then cr.mpx2 xx FP fierball for a poke string.

    Jumping away RH will work if you do it early. But like graham said FP is better in that situation.

    Most of the time Blanka will jump with HK or HP from far so you cant slide them. If you didn't hit him out of the air early with mk/hk you can back.Jab him for a clean hit. Then fireball them meaty so that they land on it and you can push him out after that.

    db.jab is really good for stoping the ball and other far pokes. The arm does not have a hit box at all.

    Good luck Blanka is a fucking whore vs Sim.
  • fatboyfatboy I beat anorexia: 10-0 Joined: Posts: 1,853
    I was playing with J Cole this weekend, and we played this match up for a bit. One other thing you can throw in to the mix among all the other great tips, is the neutral FP on early jump attacks.

    Many Blanka players like to jump from a far with a slightly early attack to hit your AA limbs. If you see this hit FP b4 they land. You either hit them after the limib retracts and push them back, or if they land and block and you push them back. Either way you reset you zone.

    Most Blanka's will try to reclose this distance they just lost by jumping after being pushed back. Follow up the FP with a slow fire ball and they may land right on it. If they do make it over the fireball use the AA of your chioce or hit FP again... starting the pattern all over.:lol:

    This by no means is *the way to beat blanka* but it is a piece of the puzzle.

    Anyway, I am No Dhalsim expert like many around here.:sweat: But I figured you would want all the information you could get about this match up.:wgrin: It may not be the prefect strat. However, I have used it many times to save me from getting my face chewed by blanka!
    Am I hungry? Sure, I could eat...
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    question for you sim masters, how dependable and reliable is the sim teleport?, seems like it could be very useful though I can only get it out maybe half the time its called upon, any opinion on it and tips on ways of getting it out consistently would be appreciated thanks.
  • Grits'N'GravyGrits'N'Gravy I used to oicho throw people. Joined: Posts: 977
    question for you sim masters, how dependable and reliable is the sim teleport?, seems like it could be very useful though I can only get it out maybe half the time its called upon, any opinion on it and tips on ways of getting it out consistently would be appreciated thanks.

    Have you tried to straight up negative edge it? I'm assuming you mean on wakeup/as reversal. I think it would be easier to release than press most of the time, and you also won't get random as much random shit instead of the teleport.
    CFN: BatmanWithAGlock
    E. Honda is gone forever. 。・゚゚・(>д<)・゚゚・。
  • ThisGuileKillYaThisGuileKillYa SSS++++ tier at exaggeration Joined: Posts: 2,627
    One of the things that makes Dhalsim so strong is his multitude of available anti airs. but many of these don't work on certain characters or from certain distances, etc. Can anyone break down any key anti airs for certain matchups? For example, I once faced a Dhalsim who always anti-aired me with a short slide into a throw. Unfrotunately it was a LONG time ago so I don't remember which character I was using at the time.. but who can that work on? Who wont it? When is back-jab preferable to back-strong and vice versa? Who has the tricky jumps that can get over a seemingly well places stretchy-forward or roundhouse?

    This thread has a lot of great general info, but few nitty gritty specifics (tho cigarbob's vs boxer breakdown was great, nice work dude!). Can anyone do what Cigarbob did but for some other characters? I'd really like to get better with Dhalsim, but matchup theory seems especially important for him as compared to, say, Ryu, who's going to approach most of his matches similarly.

    Thanks!
    USF4: Still soul searching. Thus far... Yun, Chun, and Akuma.
    UMvC3 mains: Morrigan Doom Vergil, Magneto Doom Ammy, Morrigan Doom Magneto
    UMvC3 fer funsies: Dante Vergil-or-Dorm Magneto, Wesker Sent Hawkeye, Dante-or-Magneto Doom Vergil, Wolvie Doom-or-Sent Akuma, Nova Doom Ammy, Magneto Doom-or-Sent Dante, Wesker Dorm Magneto, Dante Strange Magneto
    MvC3: Dante Magneto Sentinel
    MvC2: Spiral Cable Sentinel ST: Chunny Bunny. 3S: Akuma, Ryu, Dudley. Vampire: Fish, BBHood
    UMK3: Kabal, H.Smoke, Jax, almost everyone. Chess: 1. c4
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    I just figured out tonight that you can combo Sim's super off of a slow fireball! I'm guessing this may be common knowledge to some people out there, but I don't recall ever seeing or hearing about this, so it's news to me :wgrin:

    Now, the downside is that it doesn't appear to be too practical. The timing is tight, the spacing is tight, and from my tests I think you need to start this when the opponent is getting up in the corner. So, it's fairly situational too.

    Anyway, here's how to do it:

    1. Get opponent into corner
    2. Position yourself just slightly out of standing LP range
    3. Knock the opponent down...ideally so that they become dizzy!
    4. Do a slow yoga fire so that it'll hit them meaty in their back as they're getting up
    5. Do a super IMMEDIATELY on the frame that you recover from the yoga fire.

    If you did this correctly, you should get a 6 hit combo that does reasonably more damage than just a super.

    Like I said, it doesn't seem to be very practical. It relies on a lot of things all coming together. And even if they do, it's a real bitch to pull off correctly. On the other hand, if you did pull this off to win the round, it'd be a pretty impressive finish! :tup:
  • Duck StrongDuck Strong Yin to all Yang Joined: Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    One of the things that makes Dhalsim so strong is his multitude of available anti airs. but many of these don't work on certain characters or from certain distances, etc. Can anyone break down any key anti airs for certain matchups? For example, I once faced a Dhalsim who always anti-aired me with a short slide into a throw. Unfrotunately it was a LONG time ago so I don't remember which character I was using at the time.. but who can that work on? Who wont it? When is back-jab preferable to back-strong and vice versa? Who has the tricky jumps that can get over a seemingly well places stretchy-forward or roundhouse?

    This thread has a lot of great general info, but few nitty gritty specifics (tho cigarbob's vs boxer breakdown was great, nice work dude!). Can anyone do what Cigarbob did but for some other characters? I'd really like to get better with Dhalsim, but matchup theory seems especially important for him as compared to, say, Ryu, who's going to approach most of his matches similarly.

    Thanks!

    Here's a brief list of characters which I know you probably shouldn't anti-air with slide.

    Boxer
    Cammy
    Sagat
    Dic
    Guile
    Blanka
    Chun-Li
    Claw(I think)
    Honda
    Gief(I think)

    Shotos, Deejay, Fei Long and Hawk are all slide bait. I don't believe they have any air attack that can beat it.

    Oddly enough I'm not sure if you can anti-air sim's drills with slide since I hardly ever play that mirror match.

    But then again it's fairly situational since not all their jump in attacks will stuff slides.

    Also be aware that although his cross up slide is nice, it's actually blockable if the opponent is onto your shenanigans(This might be strictly an AE thing, but I was surprised when this happened to me the other day).

    A big part of learning Dhalsim is learning what anti-air to use and when. They're mostly range dependent so you need a good sense of spacing.

    Cheers
    My youtube channel (various MVC3 vids etc.):

    http://www.youtube.com/user/CrouchStrong?feature=mhsn
  • jchensorjchensor Salty Chen Joined: Posts: 1,934 admin
    Actually, iirc, Sagat is primary target for anti-air slides. In fact, I don't think Sagat can hit any of the low punches either.

    - James
    http://jchensor.blogspot.com
    http://jchensor.blogspot.com

    "We don't stop playing because we get old. We get old because we stop playing." -- Doyle Brunson

    "Every time you win, it diminishes the fear a little bit. You never really cancel the fear of losing; you keep challenging it." -- Arthur Ashe

    (AV art obtained from here: http://meatbun.us/blog/?p=162)
  • UltraDavidUltraDavid commenta..ttorney?? Joined: Posts: 6,053
    Yeah, slides are bad antiairs against Gief. He can eat them up with jumping down+forward, down+short, or regular forward, depending on the distance, and once you antiair him with a slide you better make sure you combo into crouching back+forward or whatever, because otherwise you're getting spun. Not that that makes things difficult for Dhalsim, you have a plethora of good antiairs to use againt Gief even without slide.
    Your legal insider in entertainment and video games!
    www.dpgatlaw.com
    www.twitter.com/UltraDavid
    www.facebook.com/UltraDavidFB
  • NoriNori Something witty goes here Joined: Posts: 1,742
    Upon knockdown (new sim player here), is it possible to be aggressive to shotos at all? I always get reversed DP everytime, no matter what mixup I use? Any advice would be awesome, thanks
  • fatboyfatboy I beat anorexia: 10-0 Joined: Posts: 1,853
    Upon knockdown (new sim player here), is it possible to be aggressive to shotos at all? I always get reversed DP everytime, no matter what mixup I use? Any advice would be awesome, thanks

    Depends on where they are.

    Sometimes it is just better to walk up and duck just just outside of throw range right as they get up. You bait the Reversal SRK, and the you can punish.

    Other times, I do the same thing but do the yoage flame a MAX range, they get up in to it, which if in the corner is dangerous for them, or they reversal (other than super combo) they get hit by the flames, lose ~20% and get knocked down again.

    If none of this makes sense it is b/c it is late. I will edit in the AM....LOL
    Am I hungry? Sure, I could eat...
  • ShinAkuma204ShinAkuma204 The Primordial Ooze Joined: Posts: 4,524
    Upon knockdown (new sim player here), is it possible to be aggressive to shotos at all? I always get reversed DP everytime, no matter what mixup I use? Any advice would be awesome, thanks

    You can try a meaty headbutt (really frickin hard to reversal DP) when they are getting up. However if their reversal DP timing is flawless they will still hit you.
    Who's cuisine reigns supreme?!

    "Well I guess the future is rape and no one can stop it."
  • NoriNori Something witty goes here Joined: Posts: 1,742
    This is all great stuff, thanks for the feedback guys. The only game I'm playing a lot is SF2T on XBLA and there are guys who just mash the shit out of DP and I feel sometimes I can't stop it. Those strategies seem good though
  • Duck StrongDuck Strong Yin to all Yang Joined: Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Actually, iirc, Sagat is primary target for anti-air slides. In fact, I don't think Sagat can hit any of the low punches either.

    - James
    http://jchensor.blogspot.com

    I could have sworn that his jump short could beat out slides. In either case I think I'll fire up ST some time to make a thorough list for each character's jump attacks.
    My youtube channel (various MVC3 vids etc.):

    http://www.youtube.com/user/CrouchStrong?feature=mhsn
  • ShirtsShirts Former Video Game Player Joined: Posts: 519
    I could have sworn that his jump short could beat out slides. In either case I think I'll fire up ST some time to make a thorough list for each character's jump attacks.

    Sagat's jump short cannot beat Dhalsim's slide.
  • ShinAkuma204ShinAkuma204 The Primordial Ooze Joined: Posts: 4,524
    Sagat has no attack to beat out slide. His options are jump fromjust putside slide range and land with a TU or kick early to hit Sim before slide attempt.
    Who's cuisine reigns supreme?!

    "Well I guess the future is rape and no one can stop it."
  • MokuraMokura Joined: Posts: 148
    The Teleport glitch where you perform the move going Toward and end up in the same spot is avoidable; just nobody's studied the move cuz they've abandoned it for the most part. It does the same thing in the SNES version of SSF2 but I figured out why it happens in a few minutes.
  • LogosLogos Mountain Beast Joined: Posts: 754
    So how do you avoid the glitch, then?
  • MokuraMokura Joined: Posts: 148
    Y'all can figure it out; it'll be common knowledge in a couple years.

    In case y'all don't know this yet, there's a difference between Teleporting w/ punches and kicks and it's not whichever is more convenient for you: using kicks keeps a larger gap between you and your opponent, and using punches keeps a smaller gap. If you're tryna run, use kicks.
  • KyokujiKyokuji Needlessly Perverted Joined: Posts: 2,926
    In case y'all don't know this yet, there's a difference between Teleporting w/ punches and kicks and it's not whichever is more convenient for you: using kicks keeps a larger gap between you and your opponent, and using punches keeps a smaller gap. If you're tryna run, use kicks.

    Pretty sure that's common knowledge. Like "you can tell from just doing the move" common.

    Somebody explained the glitch in a topic a long time ago. If I can find it, I'll link it, since this guy wants to act like he was the first one who figured it out.
    I'm gonna do some editing to the 'Sim mini-guide I wrote up on the first page. I didn't really know the match-ups anywhere near as well as I thought I did back when I wrote it, so I'm gonna try to correct a lot of it for anyone who gives enough of a shit to read it.

    Gonna try not to write too much, since we're here to help, not play the game for people.
    "Getting herpes on your face is not a cost-saving solution."
  • MokuraMokura Joined: Posts: 148
    I doubt I'm the first to figure it out; the point is I figured it out for myself and it only took a matter of minutes. Just tryna get someone to do a little work instead of always mooching the info from someone else.
  • djfrijolesdjfrijoles First ST player to ever moon a live stream baby ! Joined: Posts: 2,054
    crouching back shorts deserves a mention!

    whats up fellow sim players?!?!
    i got a good trap not mentioned here against a ken ryu mach up!!! after you get a noogie going you can walk right up to them as they fall and time a crouching down back short so that the ass end of it is a meaty, you can go fairly easily into another noogie. obviously the key here is the timing because if u mess up the timing you can be pushed back to far and youll go into his reach for the sky back strong punch leaving you open for a crouching round house
    which = knockdown which = bad. or even worse against advanced ryu players is a crouching forward into a devastating super combo. thanks for all the other info posted and i hope my contribution helps another sim fan!!!:wgrin:
    <garyangel> ceks,cani,robbiers,yito all mexico players dont know where kyouya
    <garyangel> (((((((((((((((
    <djfrijoles> kyouya is with his gf gary
    <Random.Jab.DP.Spamer> his gf is gary ?
Sign In or Register to comment.