talitali Realest NiggaJoined: Posts: 1,256
edited August 2014 in Poison
So I have been messing with this little gimmick i found. following a DP FADC, if you do a HK, the first hit of Cl.St.Hk juggles the opponent and both the positions flip around. The momentum is instantly swung into your favor. Considering poison has trouble getting out of the corner, and She does wicked when she has you in the corner, this might come in handy.

*These reversal tests have been done midscreen or near corner, but not with poison's back against the corner as the corner doesn't allow for the reset spacing to make the cancel into Hp FB safe unless stated otherwise. If you do this with your back against the corner don't cancle the CL.St.HK into anything as that is entirely safe.

The Set up:
Mk DP> FADC> Cl.St.Hk (1 hit) xx Hp FB

the only way she can beat the fireball is with ultra 2. And due to the side swap the charge is hard due to having to charge reversed while anticipating the side swap. Her DP is beaten outright. Her normal scambles lose. Her ex Scramble avoids the fireball and the follow ups can be blocked. her Tiger knee air spiral arrows get beat or can be blocked.

only ex DP catches you on the last hit for 60 damage. Normal dps lose. Ultra 1 and super hado win. Ultra 2 loses.

all dps lose. Ultra 1 loses. Ultra 2 beats us clean. Super sometimes trades the first hit, luckily Kens 1st hit only takes off 40 damage, which is a winning trade for us.

the side swap doesn't allow him to charge fast enough to do anything other then butt drop. The weak version loses. The medium hard and ex version get out, land behind you, but whiff both hits so you just have to whiff punish. *doing the fireball cancel on Honda with your back against the corner is fine, only difference is ex butt drop Second hit has to be blocked.

all command throws lose. All normal dps lose. All normal neckbreaker lose. All teleports lose. All normal hien (jumping kicking move that can be supered afterward) lose. Ex hien gets out but we can block the attack. All rekka kicks lose. U1 loses. Ex neckbreaker goes through fireball but you can crouch block it in time. Ex DP trades for the first hit for 40 dmg, We win that trade.slide gets under and hits us.Ultra 2 lands full.

beats everything. Her ultra 2 avoids fireball but we can block the attack. Ex command grab absorbs the fireball but whiffs us.

beats all normal DP. Loses to ex DP. Beats all short swing blow. His normal dash straight and upper can be blocked. Ex dash straight can be blocked. Ex dash upper beats us clean. Both his ultras beat us clean.

all his normal dps lose. Ex whiffs for free punish. Super can be blocked. All normal legs lose. Ex legs can be blocked. All tanden lose. Ultra 2 whiffs. Ultra 1 beats us clean.

all his dash punches lose. All his normal tatsu lose. All normal demon flip lose. His normal lp and hp counter lose. His mp and ex counter beat us clean. His ex tatsu beats us clean. His super and ultra 1 beat us clean. His ultra 2 trades in his favor. His ex demon flip gets over the fireball and we have to guess what he does.

all normal dps lose. Ex DP whiffs for free punish. All tatsu lose. All demon flips avoid fireball and we have to guess against his options. Super and ultra 1 lose. Ultra 2 beats us clean.

all up kicks lose. All wall jump attack lose. His super beats us clean on the lp and mp punch version (the one that juggles to ultra) the hp version trades 1st hit for 20 damage so it trades in our favor. His kicks super whiffs for a free punish. His forward punch ultra 1 loses. His backwards ultra 1 wins(Grey damage). His grounded ultra 2 whiffs for free punish.

beats all normal dps and all dankicks. Ex DP whiffs for a free punish. Ultra 2 loses. Super loses. Ultra 1 beats us clean.

all normal dps lose. Ex DP beats us clean. All tatsu lose. All normal otoshi lose. Ex otoshi whiffs. Her Lk super loses, and Mk and Hk super trade 1st hit for 45 damage, trades in our favor. Ultra 1 beats us clean. Both ultra 2 can be blocked.

all normal DP lose. All normal slash lose. All stomps land on fireball for free juggle. Ex slash can be blocked. Ex DP catches us on the final hit for 80 damage. Super loses. Both ultras can be blocked.

beats everything except her ultra 1, super and ex scratch wheel.

beats all lunge lunch. Beats all palm. Beats all shoulder. Beats all normal dps. Ex DP trades for 60 damage and players are knocked back full screen apart, trades in our favor. Loses to both ultras.

she can do a fireball store to block the fireball, but we can punish the store with a into rekka. Her normal pinwheels lose. Her counters absorb the fireball but we can punish her forward or vertical dashes if you are looking for it. Ex pinwheel beats us clean. Her ex fireballs lose unless she does the low one, we trade but get knocked down and take more damage in the trade. Her ultras lose. Her Lk and Mk super trade the first hit for 60 damage, trades in our favor. Hk super backs away and whiffs.

all SBK lose. All legs lose. Lk hazanchu lands on fireball and can be juggled. Mk/Hk hazanchu need to be blocked high or focused. Ex hazanchu has to be blocked high. Super and ultra 1 can't be charged fast enough. Ultra 2 beats us clean.

beats everything except teleports, ultra 1, instant ultra 2, and super. so really it beats nothing Kappa

All normal rolls lose. All normal wheel kick lose. All normal change of direction lose. All falling sky and command throw lose. Ex roll goes through fireball but can be thrown or whiff punished. Ex wheel kick must be blocked high. Ex change of direction can be blocked. Lp and Mp super lose. Hp super beats us clean. Ultra 1 beats us clean. Instant ultra 2 loses and if he delays it to absorb the fireball then shoots we can jump it.

all grounded burn kicks lose and can be juggled after. All ground pound lose. Her Mp, Hp and EX DP lose. The Lp avoids the fireball but can be blocked. Jumping burn kicks whiff. Super loses. Instant ultra 2 can be blocked. Ultra 1 beats us clean.

Bison can't charge his ultra 1, super, psycho crusher or scissor kicks in time. His ultra 2 can be blocked. His normal head stomps and devils reverse lose. The ex versions can be blocked.

All tiger knee lose. Lp and Mp DP lose. HP DP trades for 120 damage, knocks both players down at about round start distance. Trades in sagats favor. Ex DP catches us for 2 hits at 140 damage. All supers lose. Ultra 2 trades, heavily in sagats favor. Ultra 1 beats us clean.

All DP's lose. All normal spiral arrow lose. Ex spiral arrow beats us clean. All hooligan lose. Lp, Mp, and EX spin knuckle go through the fireball, but we can punish it before it hits or block. Hp spin knuckle whiffs right through us and we can punish. Ex TKCS loses. All super beat us clean. Ultra 1 beats us clean.

beats all up kicks. Beats all normal sobat kicks (timing is ridiculously hard to get the sobat kick out). Ex sobat is blockable. Beats all normal upper. Ex upper punches the fireball, then whiffs the rest. I couldn't get any supers or ultras out and even if it's a 1 frame possible it's still will get blocked. Instant forward jumping knee gets over the fireball but whiffs if you crouch and you can punish or block standing. Slide gets under the fireball but can be blocked low.

all ruffian kicks lose. All criminal uppers lose. All Bingos/zonk can be blocked. Lk super loses, Mk and Hk trade first hit for 60 damage. Trade is in our favor. Ultra 2 trades, at most will take off 104 damage. Trades in our favor. Ultra 1 beats us clean. Cody can slide under the fireball and hit us for 70 damage.
*all of these also apply with poisons back right up against the corner except now super and ultra 2 beat us clean.

Lk tatsu trades the first hit for 40, both players knocked Down and at full screen distance. Trades in our favor. Mk tatsu beats us clean. Hk and Ex tatsu lose. Normal run loses. Normal forward roll jump loses. Ex run absorbs the fireball and can be canceled into slide or overhead. Both can be blocked but it's so fast that you have to decide 50/50 either low or high. If he goes slide and you block it, it's punishable. And if you get hit with the overhead trying to block slide, he only gets the second hit for 70 damage. Better to block low. All supers lose. Ultra 1 beats us clean. Ultra 2 loses.

beats everything except all of his slides.

ultra 1 trades the 1st hit in our favor. Ex stinger can be blocked. Ultra 2 beats us clean. Super can be blocked. He can ex back roll into overhead to avoid fireball, Must be blocked high as he can combo off it. Don't know much else about this character, his normal rekkas and ex rekkas lose.

all normal fireballs lose. All normal lmt lose. Lk, Mk, Ex DP whiff and can be punished. Hk DP loses. Ex lmt gets over the fireball but can be blocked. Ex fireball trades for 100 dmg and both players pushed back to round start distance, even trade. Super loses. Ultra 1 negates the fireball but we get a free punish. Ultra 2 loses.

Evil Ryu:
All tatsu lose. All Axe kick lose. All fireballs lose. All normal DP lose. Ex DP trades the last hit for 50 damage, trades in our favor. Super loses. Ultra 1 can be blocked. Ultra 2 beats us clean.

trades with all normal flash kick in guiles favor. Ex flash kick beats us clean. I wasn't able to get super or ultras out, but I'd Imagine ultra 1 and super trades or beats us clean, and ultra 2 is blockable.

horizontal balls and rainbow balls can't be charged in time. Super and ultras can't either. Normal up balls lose. Slide loses. Ex up ball beats us clean.

all normal command throws, super, ultras lose. Ex x om Mand throws with Armour can absorb the fireball but are easily neutral jumped into a punish. Both lariats can be whiffed if you crouch and can be punished. All normal green hand lose. Ex green hand beats us clean.

all tornado and messiah kick lose. Lp snake strike lands on fireball for a juggle afterwards. Mp, Hp and Ex snakestrike whiff for free punish. All supers lose. Dive kick can be blocked. Ultra 1 first hit trades for 26 damage in our favor. Ultra 2 beats us clean.

El feurte:
both ultras beat us clean. Super loses. Chest bump loses, ex is blockable. Ex DP whiffs, lands behind. He can do ex run shenanigans.

beats everything except ultra 2.

Balrog can't charge any dash punches or super in time. All of his headbuts beat us clean and he can link ultra 1 after. He can't charge raw ultra 1 though. His ultra 2 loses. His TAP can be blocked or thrown.

Fei long:
all DP lose. All normal chicken wings lose. Ex chicken wing will whiff if you crouch. All rekkas lose. Ultra 2 loses. Ultra 1 and super beat us clean.

all command throws lose. All DP lose. All normal spire lose. Ex spire can be blocked. All condor dives can be blocked. Super and ultra 1 lose. Ultra 2 whiffs for free punish.

all normal DP's lose. Ex DP catches the last hit for 80 damage and we are knocked down. Lk and Mk jaguar tooth whiff where the fireball disappears. Hk and ex can be blocked. Lk and Mk grounded jaguar kick lose. Hk jaguar kick whiffs or can be blocked. Ex jaguar kick can be whiffed if crouched. Air born jaguar kicks whiffs. Lp and mp super trade 1 hit for 50 damage in our favor. Hp super beats us clean. Ultra 1 beats us clean. Ultra 2 loses.

all fireballs lose. All soul throw lose. All normal soul spiral lose. Ex soul spiral beats us clean. She can absorb or reflect the fireball horizontally but we can block. She gets hit trying to reflect it diagonally. She can ex reflect it back but we can block. All supers can be blocked. Ultra 2 has one orb beaten by the fireball. Ultra 1 beats us clean. Slide loses.

all rekkas lose. All palms lose. Lk DP gets beat. Mk and Hk DP can be blocked and punished. EX DP beats us clean. Dive kicks can be blocked. All normal teleport dashes lose. Ex teleport dash gets through but can be punished. Both ultras beat us clean.

Hugo always stays on the same side making this pointless on him.

*Everyone can backdash away from and avoid the HP Fireball after the air reset, but this only draws them closer to the corner as the purpose of this is to swing the momentum into your favor and put the opponent into the corner

I will always recommend going for the Ultra 1 after a Mk DP FADC considering the high damage and positioning afterwards. It also reverses just like this sometimes as well. but if you don't have Ultra 1 yet and need to get the opponent off you and land a successful DP FADC, this isn't a bad follow up considering how safe it is, reverses the position if you are closer to the corner then they are, and because everything happens so fast and unexpectedly, the momentum is swung right into your favor.
Post edited by tali on
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  • amrraedamrraed THICC- LI Joined: Posts: 5,029
    Of course it work on Cody. The poor guy seems to have the worst of luck when it comes to these setups.

    Couldn't Juri do her absorb move on wakeup and run away ?
    Street Fighter 5 : Chun-Li, R.Mika, Juri (MIA) We Kolin now.
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  • VeliusVelius Joined: Posts: 270
    you can do cross up jump hk on cody and elena off a back throw. other characters you need to walk forward a tiny tiny bit to make it ambiguous.
  • amrraedamrraed THICC- LI Joined: Posts: 5,029
    @tali‌ I have tried the EX AE into U1 setup but i couldn't get it consistently to work. It seems very range specific especially when trying to link into U1. Linking into sweep or Cr.MK rekka was much easier which still makes this a very viable setup. It is getting more damage from the overhead than we would normally would.

    PS. apparently at point blank Ex AE just passes through a crouching Ryu's without him getting hit. I don't know if this is a glitch or that the hitbox on the Ex AE starts at a further distance from Poison's or what but it looked kinda stupid.
    Street Fighter 5 : Chun-Li, R.Mika, Juri (MIA) We Kolin now.
    Marvel Infinte :Morrigan/Thor , Ultron/Zero , X/Jedah.
    Injustice 2 : Wonder Woman, Superman. haven' touched since July.
    Tekken 7 : Lars, Katarina, Master Raven. sold that shit.
    PSN ID : moraelgamed
    CFN: Thxymora
    Yes, i play T7 and I2 and i still like SF5 more than both of them, sue me.
  • GenistarGenistar Master Drayden Joined: Posts: 5,406
    Cr.hp into ex AE... the damage is wonderful....for almost 300 damage for 1 bar i think it makes poison's pressure even scarier. Since with seems to also work from HP AE you can do all sorts of stuff. Probably should look into set ups from ex AE.
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  • Wedge_AntillesWedge_Antilles I like cats. Joined: Posts: 489
    edited August 2014
    So, bizzarely CH cl. st. hk gives you the +6 lp AE on Boxer. Naturally on him you can only follow up (w/out FADC) in the corner. This works because CH cl. st. hk causes a different reel animation than non CH (specifically here).

    This made me realize the reason the combo happens in general is because some characters get the "high heavy hit" reel animation from the second hit of cl. st. hk (and combo into the lp ae in time). This is the same reel animation a far hk will always cause for example. On Boxer the extra frame advantage from the CH on the 1st hit of cl. st. hk makes the 2nd hit slightly higher and cause the high reel instead of the mid.
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  • Wedge_AntillesWedge_Antilles I like cats. Joined: Posts: 489
    Just a note on dumb DP FADC gimmicks. Doing a DP FADC and hitting them just off the ground with cr. hp xx mk/hk LMT does a reset into fully meaty LMT. Obviously it loses to any reversal, but you get + frames on block and a free full combo if they panic and get hit. Might be worth tossing out against a character with weaker reversals anyway.
    GFWL: WedgeAntilles S wedgeantilles on Steam
  • Wedge_AntillesWedge_Antilles I like cats. Joined: Posts: 489
    Some notes on cl. hk (2-hits) lp AE on Dudley. It's not 100% consistent on hitting him in the first place (works best off a jump-in or if he's crouching) however it is +7 on hit instead of +6. This means it's actually possible to link cr. mp into WoL at midscreen off this. Additionally in the corner, linking a cr. hp xx mp ae leads into another meaty fireball that is at around +5 as you can link st. mk or FADC directly into anything from this. So to summarize:

    cl. hk (2-hits) xx lp AE > cr. mp xx lp/mp WoL (anywhere)
    cl. hk (2-hits) xx lp AE > cr. hp xx mp AE > st. mk xx mp WoL (corner)

    Also cr. hp xx lp AE is +5 on crouching Dudley, but doesn't easily combo unless landed off a jump-in and only links into anything in the corner. CH cr. hp xx lp AE is +7, but still to far to link anything at midscreen. In the corner you can link two meaty cr. hp xx EX AE and finish with cr. mk xx WoL, though the second cr. hp is a tight link since it needs to wait for his reel animation to come back (you actually have time to walk forward a couple frames and land it).

    CH cr. hp xx lp AE > cr. hp xx EX AE > cr. hp xx EX AE > cr. mk xx mk WoL (corner, crouching)
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  • The-OlympianThe-Olympian 4 the Glory of Gaea Joined: Posts: 2,134
    Can someone test rekka fadc combos they seem char specific. On some characters u can end with crhp xx hp rekka. On the rest crmk xx mp rekka seems universal so far.

    Rekka fadc crlp close mp.
    Link into crhp hp rekka
    Or crmk mp rekka.

    What of the Hunting, Hunter Bold? Brother, the Watch was Long and Cold.
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  • Wedge_AntillesWedge_Antilles I like cats. Joined: Posts: 489
    edited August 2014
    Well, cr. lp > cl. mp itself is not reliable because the second hit will whiff on a lot of the cast if you try to link into it from a cr. lp.

    Cl. mp Whiff: Decapre, Shoto's, Ibuki, Gen, Dan, Sakura, Oni, Elena, Dhalsim, C. Viper, Dictator, Cammy, Guy, Rolento, El Fuerte, Adon, Rose
    Full combo Works: Honda, Makoto, Dudley, Gouken, Yun/Yang, Juri, Abel, Sagat, Dee Jay, Guile, Claw, Boxer, T. Hawk
    Cr. mk works: Seth, Chun, Cody, Hakan, Poison, Blanka, Zangief, Rufus, Fei Long

    And finally you are not in range for any close normal after a cr. lp on Hugo.

    Also any combo from a rekka is going to be very spacing dependent, and you could end up out of range for cl. mp or even cr. hp on some characters it theoretically works on.

    Also fun note, I originally recorded the combo on Dudley and accidentally linked cr. mp after cl. mp, meaning cl. mp self meaties on Dudley to be +7. Seeing my previous note he seems to make a good combo punching bag for Poison.
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  • DarthWOBBUFFETDarthWOBBUFFET Anime Lover Joined: Posts: 10
    Thanks Tali on the tips for the AAs. that really helped me out
  • Arkayne17Arkayne17 Stop it meg. Joined: Posts: 2,857
    Tali! Good shit!
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  • Sh!nStarw!nSh!nStarw!n Sakura of the Southwest Joined: Posts: 492
    edited November 2014
    Hello all, I don't really post much any more,but I thought this was useful information.

    First off, for those who didn't know you can combo Heavy Rekka midscreen after EX Rekka on some of the cast.

    So I did some more testing on HP Rekka juggles on the characters it wasn't working on and I've found if you alter the timing slightly it will work on more people than usual. So here is the current list I have right now for characters this works on:

    Normal Timing: Guy, Ibuki, Seth, Sakura, Gen, Dan, Elena, Yun, Abel, C.Viper, Sagat, Cammy, Rose, Yang
    Delayed Timing: Ryu, Decapre, Ken, Makoto, Poison, Sim, Evil Ryu, Vega

    Please let me know if you're able to connect this on any one else.

    Lastly I have a setup on Decapre that makes the match incredibly easy once she is hit by any Normal Rekka.

    After Rekka, backdash, jump forward HK. If she tries any version of Stinger it will whiff and put you on the other side. This also beats U1, EX Scramble, and AA U2. This will however lose to Ground U2, and Super, though Super usually only hits twice which will allow you to punish. While this does lose to U2 you can simply use instead to be safe on all her options except EX Scramble which will allow her to escape.You can even OS backdashes with EX Rekka or Sweep to ensure you keep your pressure. After most of her options have been taken away she will have to block the jump in and eat the pressure, you can mix up throws and empty jump shorts after you've trained her to block.

    Hope this information helps.

    Post edited by Sh!nStarw!n on
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  • mapleleafs791mapleleafs791 Joined: Posts: 866
    good shit my man. 
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