Psychic Force 2012

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  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    HIGH LEVEL MATCHES!!!!!!

    I don't know if these are from tournaments, training sessions, or just freindly bouts, but I know onw thing. The players in these vids know thier shit. They do everything I mentioned. Perfect shielding, wall barrier, close wall combos, far wall combos. They use alot of dash dancing with the slide dash. They even use the light projectile in smart ways. Check out these vids.

    You won't be dissappointed.

    I found these by typing in Psychic force Gameplay into google and told it to search japanese sites only. I was able to find a website called mocovideo.jp. From their I typed in Psychic force 2012 and found these vids.

    Setsuna vs Wendy



    Emilio vs Burn



    Regina vs Patty



    Edit: I found the profile of the guy that uploaded the vids. He put them on youtube as well. So I just replaced the links with the links from youtube. I'm going to message the guy that put them up and ask him to upload more vids. I suggest everyone here do the same. He'll probably put more up if more people show an interest.

    These vids are of japanese players.

    Edit: Fixed the Emilio vs Burn link.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    dude I feel special that guy plays Regina alot like me. And that Burn v Emilio Match is hot.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • FlyMikeFlyMike Rsk Rating $$$ Joined: Posts: 3,091
    I can't believe this game actually has high level play. Lol, I'd like to see some vids but my comp's too slow....
    Flown Michaels.
  • pc1x1pc1x1 New Challenger! Joined: Posts: 1,514
    Hahaha, Cool thread, I play this game alot, Regina and Keith ftw ;), and Emilio.
    SRK, its all :lovin: + :mad: all the time.
    フィリップ 日本語をいつの日か学ぶ
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Who bumped this?

    *Looks up

    Ahh, I see.

    I'll post more strats later.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • Helter SkelterHelter Skelter DREAD GOD RED GOD BLACK GOD BLOOD GOD SEX GOD soon to be FLEX GOD Joined: Posts: 1,264
    Emblemlord, you need to put some videos up.
    UMvC3: DORMAMMU/DOCTOR DOOM/VERGIL ~ VERGIL/DOCTOR DOOM/PHOENIX

    GGXrd: RAMLETHAL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    There are vids up sir. Not of me. But of players from Japan. Scroll up on this page to check them out.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • Helter SkelterHelter Skelter DREAD GOD RED GOD BLACK GOD BLOOD GOD SEX GOD soon to be FLEX GOD Joined: Posts: 1,264
    I wanted to see, some of yours.
    UMvC3: DORMAMMU/DOCTOR DOOM/VERGIL ~ VERGIL/DOCTOR DOOM/PHOENIX

    GGXrd: RAMLETHAL
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    OH NOEZ its back!!! I still say Regina FTW....but Emilio is broke.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Hmmmm.

    I'll see what I can do Helter Skelter.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    I still play this game, its the shit (: , umm i was wondering if someone could tell me the pros and cons for patty, and any traps she might have (:
  • AbhiAbhi Best Team EVER Joined: Posts: 1,550 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    My fav charcater was this dude who had Guile type hair, I swear he was the mian character storyline wise ?

    Whats his name
    I'm like an Hadoken

    I'm like Down Right Fierce
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    TIER LIST REVISION!!!!!

    Patty went down. Everything else is the same.

    Top- Wong, Emilio (Both are tied for the rank of number one)

    Lower Top- Burn, Kieth

    High- Setsuna

    Middle- Might, Gudeath, Carlo, Genshin, Regina

    Low- Wendy, Patty

    Bottom- Gates


    I decided to move her down to low tier after chun_li1 said Gamest magazine had her there. After thinking about it I realized that I was seriously overrating Patty. Mostly because my friend uses her and does well when we face each other.

    Since HIGHDER asked for Patty strats I will do her critique.

    Here it is.

    Patty

    Pros:
    + Fast dash and fast attacker. (Light weight)

    + Decent basic projectile. Decent travel speed and start up. Sets off prelude keys, giving them the shortest travel speed and smallest size.

    + Prelude Keys are very useful. Can't be destroyed by her opponent. They last very long. About 38 seconds in game time. They can clank with enemy projectiles. They can be set off by alot of her other moves which include Holy Whisper, other Prelude Keys, Eternal Harp, Resonance, Sonic Rhapsody, Holy Purge and Saint Requiem. They can cause massive damage if an opponent gets caught in area of exploding Prelude Keys. Different moves will determine how big the keys are when they are set off and how far they travel. She can have 9 on screen at the most.

    + Eternal Harp will set off all Prelude Keys on screen. This move will cause the Prelude Keys to travel the farthest and give them the largest size.

    + Sweet Tone let's Patty throw out her sound ball so she can now make Prelude Keys farther away. Resonance will let her activate Prelude keys and cancel out projectiles. Resonance has the weakest activation for Prelude Keys, giving them the smallest size and the shortest travel speed. Sweet tone can be aimed for better control of where she wants to put Prelude keys.

    + Sonic Rhapsody can be aimed in any direction. Gives Prelude Keys medium size and medium travel distance once it set's them off. Sonic Rhapsody also bounces off walls so it's great for mindgames and being tricky. Can far wall combo with this as well.

    + Reverse Noise counters any psy move attack. Does damage equal to the damage of the attack it countered. Activates quickly. When she sends out the reverse noise to attach to her opponent it will nullify any other projectiles.

    + Holy Purge can be used to keep an opponent pinned down. Can also be used as a shield for Patty. Nullifies projectiles and will hit an opponent if they run into it. Good for when you want to keep an opponent in an area full of Prelude Keys.

    + Saint Requiem will detonate Prelude Keys giving them the largest size and second longest travel speed. Patty is invincible during this move. This attack nullifies projectiles.

    Cons:
    - Flies far from attacks. (Light weight)

    - No bread and butter combo

    - No close range game what so ever. If someone gets in her face then she only has the basic options to defend herself.

    - Reverse Noise can be blocked which really limits it's usefulness. Only when it is used at very close range or when it counters a laggy move will Patty actually get it off. She can also be hit out of it, if a move hits her after the Reverse Noise is launched.

    - Holy Purge takes 90% of Patty's Psy which is a massive amount. It also only last about 8 seconds in game time. It can hit an opponent, but won't deal damage. Still any follow up damage will do less damage due to damage scaling. Also attacks can still get past the Holy Purge because the barrier itself is made out of 5 rotating sound waves. Finally, her opponent can be knocked outside of the barrier.

    - She is a defensive character so she really has no way to take control of a match or dictate it's pace. She can only react and wait until she has an opportunity to catch an opponent off guard and score some damage.

    - You may end up setting off more Prelude Keys then you wanted too, since keys will detonate other keys. This can end up spoiling your plans. Patty doesn't have alot of control over her keys which hurts her game.


    Summary: Patty is a very interesting character. She is all about hanging back and waiting, then catching her opponent completely off guard with a detonated prelude key, which can then lead to more damage from other detonated keys, a psy attack from Patty, or a combo from Patty. If an opponent is pinned down by approaching keys then Patty may be able to dash in and go for a barrier break. She is purely a defensive/tricky character. She relies heavily on Prelude Keys and Sonic Rhapsody for mindgame purposes. She is a light weight so she is very quick, which is good since she needs to be able to keep her distance. And she has other tools to help her overall game. Sweet Tone will be used to make Prelude Keys at longer distances while Patty can remain safe. Resonance can detonate them and nullify projectiles at the same time. Sonic Rhapsody as stated before will be used for mindgames and so Patty can stay unpredictable. It can bounce off walls setting off keys as it goes so an opponent can't dash around recklessly.She can also use it in far wall combos. Holy Purge can be used to fence someone in while Patty drops more keys, or they can used to pin someone down in an area where there are already a bunch of keys and then Patty can detonate them. She can also use it as a shield. Reverse Noise augments Patty's defense allowing her to get projectile spammers off her back. Saint Requiem is fairly basic. Sets off Prelude Keys and surrounds Patty with energy that causes damage. Eternal Harp is a move that will only see use when trying to catch an unweary opponent off guard. Holy Whisper is very basic and probably won't see too much use because of Sonic Rhapsody. Although her moves are solid for the most part a couple have some problems, namely Holy Purge and Reverse Noise. Holy Purge takes alot of psy and is a little lackluster. It doesn't last long and the hits cause no damage. Plus projectiles can still sneak past the barrier. Reverse Noise is a little worse off. Even though it's a counter attack it can be blocked with a barrier. And if it counters a move that deals no damage then it will deal no damage in return. She also has little control over her keys in terms of when they detonate and which direction they travel in. Once one goes off, most likely the others will go off as well. She has some other problems as well. For one thing she has no close range game at all. Not one of her moves is even decent for close range. So she really can't do anything at that range besides the basics. And she lacks a bread and butter combo which hinders her close range game even more. But her biggest weakness of all is what really hurts her. It's not her moves or even the fact that she has no close range game. It's the fact that she is a defensive character. Patty must bide her time and pick her moments. This means for one thing, that her opponent controls the pace of the match. If her opponent is reckless Patty will catch them off guard with her keys and her tricks. But if they are patient and know when to barrier, when to rush and know to stay on her then she hits a wall that she really can't overcome. She has no answer to close range combat other then the basics. And since her game revolves around dropping keys and waiting, she really can't force her opponent to move or act rashly so she can take advantage of it. This also means she has no way to do good consistent damage on her own. She just has to wait until her opponent screws up so she can get some damage in. And it doesn't help her defensive game when her main defensive move, Reverse Noise can be blocked. Patty is a complex character that requires alot of thought and planning to play correctly. She is very mindgame/trap heavy and perfect for an advanced player. But her limitations hold her back. Her lack of a close range game, inability to do consistent damage or take control of a match, and the flaws of some of her moves regulate her to low tier.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    ^ nice, and thanks alot (:
  • Helter SkelterHelter Skelter DREAD GOD RED GOD BLACK GOD BLOOD GOD SEX GOD soon to be FLEX GOD Joined: Posts: 1,264
    EmblemLord, read you PM's.
    UMvC3: DORMAMMU/DOCTOR DOOM/VERGIL ~ VERGIL/DOCTOR DOOM/PHOENIX

    GGXrd: RAMLETHAL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    I ordered the Gamest Mook strategy guide for Psychic Force 2012 today.

    It should arrive within a few days.

    I'm very excited. Gamest always released guides for fighters in the 90's, but they wnet bankrupt I believe. Still, some of their old magazines are still floating aorund, but they are extremely hard to find.

    I'm interested in thier tier list. I know there will be some differences, but I want to see if there are any huge differences like Emilio in low tier or something.

    If someone I have in mid tier is is one or two spaces lower then thats not a big deal. Wong or Emilio any lower then 3rd or 4th at the absolute most would be a huge deal and I would really try to think hard on why they would be placed there. Gamest magazine had a reputation for being spot on in terms of advanced gameplay and tiers so more then likely thier tiers will be correct. So it's exciting to see how my tier list compares to a tier list from a prestigious fighting game magazine.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • chun_li1chun_li1 Joined: Posts: 147
    Some random stuff on Carlo :


    - I center my gameplay sometimes around the Water Bubble.


    Good stuff about Bubble :

    1. Acts like a shield against dash ins or dash like specials (sucks & traps them on contact)

    2. Negates projectile - good in projectile battles when both parties shoot at same time.


    Bubble does decent space control thanks too it moving around. Genshin is still better at it, but Bubble is hella lot easier to use.


    chun_li1
    Space Nazis Incoming : http://www.ironsky.net/
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Bubble Mine is ok, but I have serious beef with it.

    Hitting Carlo with a barrier will get rid of it. That's just really lame if you ask me.

    Carlo should use it, since using it is definitely better then not using it, but it could have been a much better move. Also the travel speed is low and it can't go from side of the screen to the other so Carlo is forced to use this thing in mid-range. It would have been so much better if the travel speed was a little faster so he could actually make the mine at long range, but he can't which sucks.

    Also if it detonates and hits someone the damage is 120, but if it actually captures someone then the damage is 240. Bubble Mine won't catch anyone the majority of the time since it's easy to avoid or get rid of. It's best use as I both I and chun_li1 have agreed is for space control and as a mid-range shield. So you will be using it for it's ability to take a hit and detonate upon recieving that hit, so you do not get the full damage potential of this move.

    I think this move would have been much better if it didn't dissappear when Carlo bounces off a barrier. That alone would have really made it more useful. Also being able to destroy with light projectiles kind of sucks for this move too, but it's not THAT big of a deal.

    Anyway I encourage people to pst what they think about certain moves or strats.

    Always fun to talk and debate.

    I'll post Gudeath's critique later.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Hi,

    Its good to see people talking about PF2012 every years, this game is so unique and have some depth and deserve attention !

    I'd like to know which version does people play here ? ( PC,PSX, DC, PS2 ) ?

    I use to play on DC for a while but since PF COMPLETE is out, I moved onto PS2 and try PF2012EX ( love the addition of PF1 characters )

    Each version have differences in term of gameplay (don t really know if its enough to change the balance in the end)

    Ok is a little Off topic but I found this link interesting ^^!
    sort of PF clone without close combat
    Rozen Maiden: Geppetto Garden

  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Shinset: Dude. WHERE.DO.YOU. LIVE!!!!!!???????

    My friend and I want competition in this game soooooooooo badly.

    On Topic: Sorry about the lack gameplay info guys. With news about Street Fighter 4 and Super Smash Brothers Brawl I just haven't had the time or the desire really to post about anything.

    Also I will just guess that most people in this thread play the DC version.

    Anyway, here is Gudeath like I promised.

    Gudeath

    Pros:
    + He doesn't fly far from attacks. (Heavy weight)

    + Fast barrier break. It comes out at 16 frames.

    + He has the strongest Bread and Butter combo in the game. Light attack, strong attack, Meteor Butcher.

    + Meteor Butcher is very powerful and comes out fast at 9 frames. Good for hyper dash mix-ups and as a hyper dash counter. It's a grab so it can cancel his hyper dash.

    + Meteor Hammer is a decent mid/long range tool. It cancels out projectiles and catches people who will dash to the side. Safe on block.

    + Asteroid Belt an be used in combos, and then ended with Meteor Butcher for awesome damage. Over half a life bar. It can also shield him from projectiles and he can shoot one or all of the pieces of debris at his opponent.

    + Gravity Bullet can be made stationary. If an opponent hits Gravity Bullet, they will fly into a random direction and Gudeath may be able to combo them if they are close enough or hit a wall.

    + Gravity Infinity is good for controlling your opponents movement and forcing them onto the defensive. It will suck in debris, as well as Gravity Bullets, and debris from Asteroid Belt. An opponent is forced to shield or else they will take alot of damage. And since Gravity Infinity sucks them in, Gudeath has an easier time rushing in while it's active.

    + Shaving wall is good for catching opponents that like to dash to the side alot. It can be aimed. Safe on block. Decent combo ender.

    Cons:
    - Slow attack speed and slow dash speed. (Heavy weight)

    - Most of his moves have slow start-up time.

    - Lacks really good pressure moves. This is a huge weakness, because it hurts his offense. And it makes it harder for him to force a reaction from his opponent without putting himself in danger.

    - Gravity Bullet is slow in execution speed and travel speed. Gudeath is also slow to recover from launching it. When it's made stationary it's not that much more useful either. Light projectiles can get rid of it and if an opponent hits it then it will only do 90 damage. Half of the normal 180 damage a regular Gravity Bullet would do and less damage then Gudeath's light projectile. And stationary bullets only last about 4 or 5 seconds. Plus only 2 can be out at one time. If a third one is made stationary then one will quickly dissappear.

    - Meteor Hammer leaves Gudeath vulnerable and can become predictable. An opponent can just hyper dash and attack him when he uses this move. Also if he is hit by anything before he can smash the meteors together, then his control over them will be broken and they will fall away harmlessly.

    - Asteroid Belt is slow to fully form around Gudeath. He is completely vulnerable while he summons the debris. It's possible for a projectile to get past the belt even when all five pieces surround Gudeath. Any hit will get rid of the belt including getting hit off a barrier.

    - Gravity Infinity is slow to start-up. Gudeath can't move for most of the time that Gravity Infinity is out. When he finally can move he only has a several seconds to take advantage of it. And Gudeath can't just rush in recklessly, because his opponent can still defend him/herself. He still has to be smart since his opponent still has options to deal with his offense. Also since Gudeath fights at mid/close range he won't get many opportunities to pull this off without putting himself in danger.

    - Shaving Wall is extremely risky outside of wall combos. Gudeath uses his body for the attack so it's very dangerous for him and leaves him vulnerable. Even in combos it's still not worth it outside of far wall combos. Meteor Butcher is more powerful and the better choice in close wall combos. So unless it's for combos where Meteor Butcher won't connect or mindgames, this move won't see much use.


    Summary: Gudeath is a close range grappler. He has powerful throw moves and strong combos. His Bread and Butter is also the strongest in the game at 327 damage. With this he can dish out alot of pain with his basic combo. His power is his strong point, but he is lacking in other areas. He has 1 great move and that is Meteor Butcher. A great combo ender, good for countering hyper dashes, and good for hyper dash mix-ups. It comes out fast and has alot of power. But this one great move isn't enough to make up for his other flaws. Plus all his other moves have problems. Meteor Hammer is safe on block, does good damage and cancels out other projectiles. Still, it gets very predictable. An opponent just has to hyper dash when Gudeath uses this and then they can pummel him. Gravity Bullet just isn't good at all. Gudeath really can't work with it since it's just slow in every way. The only use that stationary Gravity Bullets really have is for Gudeath to use as cover and so Gudeath can have a shield for when he uses Meteor Hammer. Other then that stationary bullets are extremely flawed as well since they don't last long, can easily be gotten rid of with a light projectile, and only two can be out at once. Shaving wall is ok. A good combo ender if Gudeath doesn't have the psy for Meteor Butcher or Meteor Butcher won't connect. But it's dangerous to throw out on it's own, so it can't be spammed. It's good for corner traps and mindgames, but must be used with caution since an opponent has enough time to respond to Shaving Wall on reaction. Gravity Infinity is similar to Earth Gale. It limits the movement of an opponent while sending debris at them. Unlike Earth Gale, however is the fact that Gudeath is unable to act right after executing the move. So when he is finally able to move gain he has little time to take advantage of the situation. And his opponent can still stop his approach if he isn't careful. Asteroid Belt isn't anything to write home about. Rushing someone when it's on can lead to massive damage if at least 4 pieces of debris hit and then it's ended with his bread and butter combo. He can also launch pieces of the debris one at a time or all at once. Getting the belt on in the first place is the tough part. It takes awhile for the belt to fully form and even a barrier hit will knock it off. But Gudeath's real problems are his lack of speed and his overall gameplay. He is slow which makes it harder for him to stick to his opponent and play his close range game. Plus he lacks a safe spammable move that he can fall back on. So he has nothing to apply pressure with effectively while remainaing safe. Overall he simply cannot play well at his range. He is a grappler type, but alot of his moves fall into the long-range catagory. Most of his moves are meant to be set-ups for his close range game, but the slow speed and other various weaknesses of all of the them hurt thier usefulness so Gudeath's arsenal becomes extremely limited thus increasing his predictablity. So he is forced to play carefully and more defensively, but he doesn't have the tools to play this way either so his overall effectiveness as a character is reduced. He can't really abuse any of his moves too much because they all have notable flaws save for a few and since he is a close range type, using most of his moves at that range is begging to be murdered. Gudeath must play cautiously, pick his moments to attack wisely, use Gravity Infinity to pin his opponent down, use his throws and his bread and butter in order to be successful. Gudeath has the potential to dish out alot of damage, but lacks the tools to do it consistently. He has power, but not much else beyond that. So he ends up as a decent mid-tier character.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    Damn it i wish i had ppl who play this game. The CPU gets boring. Think im going to pick up Setsuna.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • Helter SkelterHelter Skelter DREAD GOD RED GOD BLACK GOD BLOOD GOD SEX GOD soon to be FLEX GOD Joined: Posts: 1,264
    Emblemlord, how is the mook book?
    You need to scan, some of the artwork for us.
    UMvC3: DORMAMMU/DOCTOR DOOM/VERGIL ~ VERGIL/DOCTOR DOOM/PHOENIX

    GGXrd: RAMLETHAL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Yeah, the artwork alone in the guide book made it worth it.

    The detail is insane. There is a data file for all the attacks and all the basic moves for each character including damage, execution frames, duration frames, recovery frames, etc.

    There's also alot of pictures and they talk about traps and set-ups for each character.

    My friend said that everything he could read in the book was stuff that we already knew and that the guide went into extreme detail and had awesome info for each character. His exact words were,"You don't get quality guides like this in America that's for damn sure". So now he and I are more or less convinced that we are at the peak of the metagame in terms of gameplay.

    Also don't think that after I finish the commentary for all the characters that I'm done with this thread.

    After that I'll talk about match-ups and different set-ups for each character as well as other gameplay mechanics.

    BTW the site that I ordered from is gameexpress.com

    Check it out guys. It just so happens that they are located in NJ about an hour away from me I believe so it only took a day to get the guide. ^_^
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • Helter SkelterHelter Skelter DREAD GOD RED GOD BLACK GOD BLOOD GOD SEX GOD soon to be FLEX GOD Joined: Posts: 1,264
    Dude, you need to get some match videos up.
    I wanna see all your tactics.

    Also what are the guide's tiers or matchups (just interested)?
    UMvC3: DORMAMMU/DOCTOR DOOM/VERGIL ~ VERGIL/DOCTOR DOOM/PHOENIX

    GGXrd: RAMLETHAL
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    @ EmblemLord

    Im from France so New Jersey is little bit too far for me (T_T)
    Maybe there is a way to play online !? ( even if its lag...)

    I hope people will still play PF2012 even with SFIV buzz (I think the game wont show up untill mid of next year and the release date is far faraway) and even after you MUST continue to play PF2012 !
    (I play even on my psp as casual games ^^!)

    btw wich guide did you purchase ?

    I've both guides

    PSYCHIC FORCE 2012 PERFECT PROGRAM BOOK
    PSYCHIC FORCE 2012 GUIDE BOOK

    plus the perfect prog for PF2 (PSX version) here

    So If people play on DC you dont play GENMA BRAD or sonia dont you ?
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    I bought the Gamest guide book. The second one on your list.

    I already know about those 3 characters and I have a pretty good idea as to where they would be on the tier list.

    Genma would be low maybe bottom, Sonia would be high or middle, and Brad would be middle probably.

    Shinest do you have any competition where you are?

    Also lilman you said you want competition in PF2012, well pc1x1 revived this thread and said he still plays this game. And he is listed as Florida just like you so maybe you guys could play some time?
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    Wow didnt even notice that. He supposedly lives about 15 to 20 min from me. I was talking to him earlier about sticks lol.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Emilio above Keith is SOOOO wrong.
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    Emilio above Keith is SOOOO wrong.

    No....no its not. Emilio is nothing lower than top. His specials are too good along with his pressure/mixup he can pull out his ass with those damn crystals. Then again i dont play Keith so i dont know about him very much, but i do know Emilio has to be tops.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    lilman said it.

    That and the fact that Keith is just solid overall. Not really overpowered in any aspect . Emilio however IS overpowered.

    Still Kenta if you disagree then we can talk about. Debates are fun. As long as they don't get taken too seriously.

    If you have a tier list feel free to post it and why you think certain characters should be where they are.

    Also I got a little something for you guys later tonight.

    hehe.

    No not match vids, sorry. But still something nice.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    I like to debate obscure games. It's not a problem.

    Now the reason I say that is because Keith has some truly broken shit he can do with his shield rushdown shit. One fucked up light or strong shot could mean big ass bread n' butter.Also if you're confident,you can sacrifice life for power/shield rushdown/wall bounce to ice dragon to damn near kill them from full life. That's just off a mistimed shot.

    Emilio can fight him well but it's still in Keith's court because of his silly shit. Now this is only in my opinion since I have fought a REALLY good Emilio in the past couple of weeks.
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Kenta Kobashi: All characters have combos that can take about half a life bar or more. But at the highest level only Emilio and Wong really get them off consistently. This isn't taking hyper charge into account BTW. Anyone can do big damage with hyper charge.

    Shield rushdown.

    I'm going to assume that you are talking about the Frigid Shell correct? The move that makes Keith immune to psy moves correct?

    That move is very easy to get rid of. Any hit will get rid of it, even a barrier bounce. Once Keith does it just hyper dash and barrier. Problem solved. Of course it isn't that simple all the time and Keith can set-up for it. Plus the shield itself doesn't last long. And Keith can be baited into rushing and then just eat a grab or a barrier. There are alot of ways to deal with Keith's that abuse the Frigid Shell. Plus it only makes Keith invincible when it fully forms. So when the ice mist is still forming you can still hit Keith with a projectile.

    And even if Keith did have the advantage in the match-up (which I really don't think he does, I think it's pretty even), That wouldn't make him better then Emilio overall. Emilio is just a better character.

    Yes, Keith's bread and butter is better but good BnB combos don't automatically mean you will be top tier. Both Emilio and Wong have BnB's that are only just decent although Wong's is better then Emilio's. But it's the overall gameplay of Wong and Emilio that give them the number 1 spot.

    Helter Skelter: lol. Don't hype me up too much man. I'm good at psychic force but I don't have amazing uber unbeatable tactics. I don't think this is that kind of game really. Although I do have some solid strats and I love playing control characters like Setsuna and Emilio, but I can play everyone in the game well.

    Shinset: Any competition where you live or do you just play on your own. Anything to contribute to the strats or gameplay mechanics? What do you think of the tier list?

    On Topic: Well, I decided to do something that I do alot of at smashboards.

    Critique match vids and give commentary about what was done right/wrong and how well the players did overall.

    I'll critique the match vid of Setsuna vs Wendy that was posted previously.

    Here is the link to the vid.



    Here I go.

    Round 1

    00:11 - Right off the bat Wendy makes a mistake. That combo should have went all the way through with light attack, light attack, strong attack to w/e the situation called for. Judging from the distance that Setsuna was from the wall I'm guessing that he most likely would have hit it and then Wendy would have gotten a far wall combo with Air slasher or Vortex Stream.

    00:15 - Wendy screws up the wall barrier. Setsuna should not have got this off. Wendy lost health and he got some back. Because of this mistake the entire momentum of the match has shifted.

    00:18 - Setsuna got a wall hit on Wendy thanks to his barrier. He should have grabbed or ran away to reset his spacing for his long range game.

    From about 00:20 to 00:30 - Setsuna is being more rush down oriented. I really can't condone being that rush down happy. And it ended up back firing for Setsuna. Which brings me to another point. When Setsuna got caught by that single Air Slasher in that wall combo. I really don't think it should have hit him. It LOOKS like he had enough time to wall barrier. But then again maybe not. *shrugs

    00:32 - There was NO reason why Setsuna should have gotten hit by that. None. A hyper dash or even a simple barrier is all it would have taken to avoid getting hit. He had plenty of time to react.

    00:36 - Very tricky on Wendy's part. A nice Mirage Step into an Air Slasher. Very fast and smooth. Still Setsuna sees right through it and grabs her. It probably would have been better if she had just grabbed after the Mirage Step, since Air Slasher takes some extra time to cross over for the attack.

    00:40 - Wendy was foolish to try to mount an offense when she was in a corner and had so little psy. She should have tried to barrier or psy-impulse and back off so she could regain her psy. Instead she tried to attack and was punished for it. At least this time she manages to get up that wall barrier before Setsuna can combo into Negative drain like before.

    00:41 to 00:46 - We see come nice space control by Setsuna. Wendy's dashes up in reaction to the light projectile and then Setsuna responds with a Darkside soul in that direction. Wendy tried to rush Setsuna, which is a bad move. Setsuna recovers quickly from Darkside Soul so it's not wise to try to rush him after he launches one if you are far away. Setsuna could have gotten an easy grab, but opts to barrier instead. That's ok, since it resets his spacing. He then uses Daggers Shadow to stuff her attempt at a Vortex Stream.

    00:51 - No reason why Setsuna should have gotten hit. He could have hyper dashed at Wendy, did a barrier or dashed away. All of these methods would have kept him form taking damage and hyper dashing would have let him attack while she was still in her launch animation.

    00:54 - Setsuna goofed up here. A Dark Wedge could have ended it.

    00:55 to 01:04 - See some dash dancing and you can that the players are trying to feel each other out, but still play very carefully and intellgently. Setsuna took a risk going for a barrier break. Wendy read him correctly and went for a slide dash, which lets her get a free combo. She takes round 1.

    Round 2

    01:12 - Repeat of the first goof up in round 1. Wendy doesn't finish the combo. But Setsuna screws up too. He goes for a barrier instead of nailing a free grab. But then we some nice dash dancing mindgames. Setsuna hyper dashes and Wendy slide dashes in response and goes for an Air Slasher. Setsuna IMMEDIATELY responds with another hyper dash into a combo. He cancels the dash so quickly that you just barely catche a glimpse of the blue hyper flash. A good play on Setsuna's part, although a grab would have been better.

    01:20 - So a long range battle ensues. Setsuna is smart to get out a Shady Cloud, likewise Weny is smasrt to go for an Earth Gale. Too bad the debris doesn;t pin down Setsuna otherwise she could have went for a Tri-Crescent or Silpheed Dance. Setsuna is quick to take advantage of the fact that the debris won't hit him and launches some attacks. Daggers Shadow hits although Wendy could have shielded it easily. My guess is that the player panicked or didn't want to be drained by Shady Cloud.

    01:30 - Setsuna is smart to keep the pressure on. He throws out several waves of Daggers Shadow. But Wendy slowly closes the gap thanks to smasrt barrier use and hyper dashing. Then when Setsuna charges up Daggers Shadow Wendy uses the break in the action for a Mirage Step that sends her alomst right next to Setsuna! Setsuna quickly blocks Wendy's rush down, but opts for a barrier instead of a grab. Bad move since Setsuna is left in the corner.

    01:35ish - We can see some good dash dancing and defensive play. Good for when you are looking for openings. Although to be honest Setsuna shouldnt be doing that as much. He should have hung back and played the long range pressure game.

    01:39 - Setsuna gets the hit off and goes for The Darkness. Good stuff. Too bad Wendy didn't retreat barrier, otherwise he probably would have gotten that off unscatched. It was good job on her part, since she reacted quickly and was able to punish Setsuna. Still she should have been aware of the wall and went for a far wall combo. But in the end it worked out since she was able to distract Setsuna for a little while and run out a little time from The Darkness, so Setsuna had less time to take advantage of it.

    01:50 to 02:00 - Setsuna seems to get impatient and rushes Wendy. She reads him and responds with a slide dash to wall combo. Setsuna gets out of it and rushes again, but she reads him yet again. This time he eats an Air Slasher. More dash dancing ensues, and Setsuna manages to get a hit in with his barrier break. This player seems to like using it and also seems to be a little on the spammy side with it, which isn't good.

    02:01 to 02:07 - Wendy hyper dashes and Setsuna hyper dashes in response. In turn Wendy attacks and gets counter hit damage on Setsuna. He retreat barriers, but drops it as Wendy rushes again. Most likely he expected a abrrier break and was prepared to block it and retaliate. Wendy reads him and lands a grab to get past his guard. She wins round 2.

    Round 3

    02:16 - lol. This is getting silly. Wendy cuts the combo short again. But then when Setsuna gets her off, he rushes again. Eh, he had his back to the wall more or less so I don't blame him. But Wendy sees it and beats him down. But she screws up and does the L,L,L,L combo so she can't do a psy move finisher. She tries to play it smart and go for a barrier break thinking that Setsuna would do a wall barrier to save himself from a psy attack. But he reads her and does a normal guard, and then beats her down.

    02:23 to 02:38 - We see Setsuna try to keep Wendy at bay and then getting in some close range combos. Nothing too serious, just to reset spacing, get in some damage and give him some breathing room. But then when Setsuna misses his strong attack, Wendy goes for a barrier break. Again the player probably thought that Setsuna would just put up a barrier to knock her away, but things don't work out like the Wendy player planned. Setsuna blocks and Wendy eats a wall combo ending in Negative drain. That shouldn't have happened though since a wall barrier could have stopped that. This guy must be sleeping at the controls. lol

    02:41 - Setsuna eats a psy impulse that could have been blocked. Wendy hyper dashes,but honestly it just have been obvious that there was no way she could follow up in time. Instead she should have went for an Earth Gale, Silpheed Dance, or Tri-Crescent to lock Setsuna down or give herself an advantage.

    02:42 to 02:45 - Setsuna tries to rush with a barrier break yet again. Wendy gets away and pulls out an Air Slasher. Setsuna takes guard damage because he couldn't barrier in time. Still there is no reason why he couldn't have gotten it up in time. Barrier comes out fast. He was just slow with it most likely.

    02:50 to 02:58 - Wendy takes a risk with a Vortex Stream, but to no avail. Setsuna punishes her. Then he does a good job of keeping the pressure on. Wendy manages to get in though and then she makes him the feel the pain. Good job on her part getting through Setsuna's pressure game. She decides to stay close, which is good considering the fact that Setsuna is long range, but then she slide dashes into an Air Slasher which is risky business. Setsuna knocks her right out of the launch animation with a barrier break to win round 3.

    Round 4

    03:04 - Wendy doesn't waste anytime and rushes Setsuna down. Both players play it smart. Setsuna pulls of a slide dash while Wendy only does a light attack so she isn't vulenrable for too long. Setsuna opts for a Black Sun, which probably wasn't the best option for punishing Wendy. He probably should have just did a hyper dash to grab. Wendy takes a risk by floating in for a barrier but it pays off and to be honest I am very impressed by such a gutsy well executed move.

    03:09 - Setsuna gets a combo off, but he goes for the L,L,L so he can't follow-up. A blunder on his part. Then he attempts to rush with a grab. Not a bad choice per say, but shady cloud for control or a projectile for pressure might have been better. Wendy tried to get back in Setsuna's face, but he gaurds quickly, so props to him for that. Setsuna gets another combo in after Wendy tries to float in with an attack. But once again Setsuna goes for the L,L,L chain. Not good.

    03:17 - Wendy does a good job of getting inside Setsuna's range and beating him down, but yet AGAIN we see the L,L,L,L chain. Should have been L,L, S to Vortex Stream or Air Slasher. And then after Wendy gets the wall bounce she goes for a light attack? No. Should have been a grab.

    03:21 - Setsuna screws up royally here. He gets wall bounced for no reason then Wendy grabs him. He should have just went for an easy psy impulse, to get her to back off.

    03:29 - Setsuna wall barriers to get Wendy off of him. Then he shoots a light projectile for her to deal with. She takes the hit as it interrupts an Air Slasher. Setsuna rushes in and lands a grab. All in all some solid play on Setsuna's part. Although Wendy screwed up when she did Air Slasher in response to the light projectile.

    03:35 - Wendy quickly gets in Setsuna's face to keep him from mounting an offense and it looks like it catches Setsuna off guard. But she messes up her opportunity when she goes for the L,L,L,L chain for the thousandth time. lol. Still Setsuna DOES manage to get out a Shady Cloud though. But after the first combo Wendy goes for a Mirage step and then keeps the punishment coming. Nice play on her part. She does the L,L,L,L combo, but in the end it let's her net a grab by hyper dashing and grabbing Setsuna out of a slide dash. Well done, Wendy.

    03:43 to 03:49 - Setsuna stages a counterattack right away. He really tries to pour the heat on her. But she slowly closes the distance. Setsuna screws up when he does a strong attack out of slide dash when a grab or a barrier would have been the best choice. Wendy's Air Slasher cuts him down before the strong attack can connect and Wendy earns herself the victory.

    General Overview - I saw some good plays mixed in with silly mistakes and sloppy gameplay overall. For starters the players missed wall barriers which just shouldn't be happening. When you hit a wall you need to be doing the motion for the barrier, when your opponent is trying to do a close wall combo. Setsuna should NOT be comboing into Negative drain. Honestly if he could do it then he would be banned. Another thing I'm sure you all noticed was the use of all light attack strings. there is no reason to use these over strings that end with a strong hit. Strong hit enders let you cancel into psy moves which means more mindgames, more versatility, more comboability, more set-ups, and more pressure. They are better in everyway.

    Another thing that bothered me was how they played thier characters. They definitely didn't bring out the full potential of Setsuna and Wendy. Setsuna didn't use enough Darkside Souls. They are the back bone of his gameplay. He can dash after them, use them for cover, pressure with them, they are safe on block. They are his all purpose long range tool. I also didn't see Mirror Coffin or Dark Wedge. Mirror Coffin is perfect for dash dance whores and Dark Wedge os good for projectile wars, slide dash whores, and a decent mid/long range pressure move. Neither should be spammed or even used alot, but the should definitely see SOME use. Also Setsuna tried to play rush down alot whcih isn't good. Setsuna should be hanging back most of the time. Play rush down to throw opponents off, get a little damage, or set-up for your control/pressure game, but don't make the main stay of your gameplay. I also didn't see alot of shady cloud abuse. Wendy bugged me too. She didn't use Silpheed's Dance or Tri-Crescent. Earth Gale saw very little use as well. Earth Gale and Tri-Crescent are meant help pin an opponent down while Silpheed's Dance boosts her dash speed which in turn augemnts her rushdown. But this Wendy player didn't use them at all. Instead he relied on Vortex Stream and Air Slasher. Alot of Air Slasher's actually, which isn't good because Air Slasher isn't a spammable move. It can easily be shut down when used recklessly. Plus just relying ontwo moves just means that player became much more predictable.

    Still it wasn't all bad. I saw some very good exchanges and good examples of safe play with dash dancing and cutting combos short at the light attack when someone avoids your rush down. Also saw some mindgames on Wendy's part with Mirage step and some long range pressure/control with Setsuna. Overall the gameplay in this vid was about a 7 out of 10 in terms of skill. The players definitely know about high level tactics, but made alot of small mistakes, sill choices and didn't really fully maximize thier characters and all of thier good moves/tactics.



    Ok, guys what do you think. Did you guys like the vid critique? Was it helpful? Should I do it again? What are some opinions. Did anyone catch anything that I missed or they feel is worth mentioning? I'm eager to hear some feedback.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    Someone on that Youtube page said PF3 is in development. Is that true?
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Yes. It was announced by Taito back when PS3 was released.

    Edit: lol@lilman ignoring the massive post I did above him.

    Double edit: *sigh. Seems like Emilio doesn't have a "true" Bread and butter combo. His BnB won't connect if his opponent is right up on the wall when his combo starts. So this means they can wall barrier out of it. It doesn't happen too often, but it still weakens Emilio's close range offense.

    *shrugs.

    Ah,well. He is still top tier since his BnB wasn't really the main reason why he was top in the first place. Just sucks since I'm an Emilio player. lol.

    Also me and my friend played alot of Emilio vs Keith. I played like utter crap and my friend won all the matches. We played about 9, I think. But in all of those matches none of the rounds I lost were due to Frigid Shell. I lost because I did dumb crap like not shielding when Keith did Frigid Spear and running into projectile moves.

    But whenever he got Frigid Shell on I just rushed him and bounced him off my barrier or went for a combo. Or I just waited him out, since Frigid Shell doesn't last long at all. Maybe 10 seconds in real time, but I gotta go back and test that.

    My friend won all the matchs but I did win rounds and it usually went back and forth in terms of who won the rounds.

    Anyway, I think the match-up is even although Keith may have slight advantage. But still overall Emilio is better.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Sorry bout the late post. Man,I just played a couple good Emilios and I can't really see how he has to be so high on the list.Maybe these guys aren't as good as I think they are. LOL
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    Probably not. A good Emilio is a real pest. One reason cuz he doesnt even need to really use his BnB like Emblem said. He just control space TOO WELL. He can zone u or rush u down when ever the hell he feels like it. I play Emilio pretty annoying. U can form a good zone of crystals and then throw beams to control space since the trajectory is pretty random. It makes ppl afraid to attack so u can rush or if they attack u theres a good chance they be hit cuz ur not going to outprioitize a projectile. Even then his normal long range attack has a retarded about of knockback even when blocked so he can get u too a wall pretty quickly. Overall Emilio= too good.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Lilman speaking the truth yet again.

    Emilio isn't like Patty. Unlike her, he has alot of control over his traps and what he can do with them.

    I will do Emilio's critique and then Keith's.

    Emilio

    Pros:
    + He has a fast dash and quick attacks. (Light weight)

    + Has a decent close wall combo. Light attack, strong attack, Prism Seal.

    + Has the best control game out of all the characters due to his Reflector/Seeker Ray game.

    + Shining Arrow is the fastest travelling basic projectile. Emilio can combo after it, since it locks an opponent in a stun animation before exploding. Can lead to a guarunteed barrier break, so Emilio will always get extra damage from this as long as he is close enough to follow up.

    + Prism Reflectors come out fast. They can't be destroyed and they last for quite a bit of time. 25 seconds in game time. Emilio has very little lag so it's virtually impossible to punish him after he creates a reflector. He can have 5 onscreen at the most. They have the ability to reflect Seeker Rays.

    + Reflector Dash is similar to Prism Reflectors. They can't be destroyed and Emilio really can't be punished after making one unless his opponent is right in his face. It last for about 15 seconds in game time. When a Seeker Ray hits this, 9 Seeker Rays will be shot from the reflector. The rays will travel in 8 different directions and each beam will be seperated by about 45 degrees. The first and last beam will fly in the same direction of where ever Emilio's opponent was when the rays first fired from the reflector. Only one can be on-screen at a
    time.

    + Seeker Ray gains special properties when reflectors are involved. Seeker Ray will go for the farthest reflector and then the next farthest and so on. But Emilio has the ability to aim his ray at any prism of his choosing and then the ray will follow the rule of going to the farthest reflector. Also at any time Emilio can hold G for a moment and his ray will go straight for his opponent. He may also hold G to aim his ray at an opponent even when reflectors are out. A Seeker Ray that is travelling towards a reflector has the ability to phase through barriers. Meaning that if Emilio's opponent shields a ray while it is going towards a reflector then the ray will pass through the enemy and the barrier completely uninhibited. The enemy will be completely unharmed in this case, but will still suffer from shield hit stun. Seeker Rays that are travelling between reflectors can also combo an opponent, since the rays don't actually stop. They will hit Emilio's opponent, passing through them on their way to another reflector. They will continue to have the ability to phase thourgh shields and the other combatant until Emilio gives the command for the ray to fly at his opponent or there are no more reflectors to bounce off of. If an opponent is caught in a web of reflectors they will end up taking massive damage. Usually around half a life bar. Reflector Dash doesn't give rays the ability to phase nor can rays that bounce off of it be bounced off another reflector. Seeker Ray is safe on block.

    + Prism seal is his all-purpose close range move. Does 290 damage and cost 40% of his psy. Great damage for it's cost. Comes out very fast at 20 frames. Great for combos, hyper dash mix-ups, and hyper dash counters. Emilio will throw this attack in his opponents direction the moment he actually launches it, instead of throwing it in the direction his opponent was when the button commands were entered, like many other attacks.

    + Angel Halo takes away an opponents ability to barrier. If they try, the barrier will shatter. Emilio can throw this in any of the 8 directions. It is safe on block. Emilio can far wall combo into this. After an opponent is hit with this they will put in a stun animation and Emilio can follow up with an attack or runaway. Knocking Emilio off of a barrier won't get rid of this like other status effects either. Angel Halo will stay on an opponent for about 16 seconds.

    + Arch Angel is very powerful doing 390 damage. Cancels out other projectiles. Fairly safe on block. Can be comboed into after a Seeker Ray or Shining Arrow. Emilio can adjust Arch Angel once it's out.

    + Trinity Ray is Emilio's ultimate pressure move. Shoots 3 rays out. Holding G while Emilio launches the rays will cause them to shoot out in 3 directions, ignoring any reflectors. Tapping G when one of them hits a reflector will cause all of the rays to aim for Emilio's opponent. Emilio can only aim one ray towards a reflector. The rest will follow the rule of going to the farthest reflector.

    Cons:
    - Flies far from attacks (Light weight)

    - He does not have a true bread and butter combo. His light attack, strong attack, Prism Seal combo can be wall barriered out of if Emilio's opponent was extremely close to the wall when the combo started.

    - He has the second slowest barrier break in the game. It comes out in 25 frames.

    - Shining arrow isn't very safe on block. It doesn't go the length of the cube in travelling distance. It is also slow on the draw, coming out at 27 frames. Shining arrow also has fairly high recovery time so Emilio is vulnerable if it is dodged at mid/close range.

    - Seeker Ray is useless without reflectors.

    - Prism Seal is unsafe on block and has high recovery time. Since it's a move that Emilio will be relying on alot this puts him at risk. Also if Emilio takes a hit before he can blow up the prism when he catches someone with it then they will escape unharmed. Also if Emilio gets hit at the moment the prism catches his opponent then the seal will form for a split second and then disappear since Emilio got hit. From there an opponent can continue comboing him. This usually happens when an opponent hyper dashes into a light attack for a combo and Emilio's prism captures them at the exact moment that they hit him. This doesn't happen too often since prism seal comes out so fast, but it's still a flaw.

    - Angel Halo can be gotten rid of by hitting Emilio or knocking him off a wall. Even with Angel Halo, Emilio's opponent can still barrier for a split second, so perfect barriering can still be utilized to shield psy attacks.

    - Arch Angel won't see much use outside of wall combos when Emilio has alot of psy. It has long start-up time and Emilio is vulnerable while he is using it.

    - Trinity Ray doesn't have extremely slow start-up, but it is still a slow move coming out at 39 frames. Useless without at least 5 reflectors and one of them would need to be a Reflector Dash to get the most use out of Trinity Ray.


    Summary: Emilio is a character that can do well at any range, but excels at space control/pressure through his Reflector/Seeker Ray game. He is light weight so he has the usual advantages and disadvatages that go with that weight class. He has alot of great moves as well. Shining Arrow is the fastest basic projectile and will almost always lead to a garuanteed follow-up. Usually another Shining Arrow, Prism Seal or Arch Angel. Prism Seal is his go to close range move. Powerful, great for close wall combos and quick to execute, it is an extremely reliable tool and is the main reason why Emilio can hold his own at close range unlike other characters geared towards trap moves and long-range play like Patty and Setsuna. Plus Emilio aims the attack at his opponent when he throws it, making it good for slide dashers. It's only one move, but it serves Emilio well at close range. Prism Reflectors, Reflector Dashes, and Seeker Rays used on conjunction with one another is what Emilio's all about. By themselves they aren't much and do nothing for Emilio's game. But together they allow him to completely take over the battlefield. Seeker Rays aiming for Reflectors can phase through shields and continue on thier way while an opponent still gets block stun. And Emilio can just hold G for a moment at any time when a Seeker Ray is bouncing between prisms to give it the command to shoot directly at his opponent. Emilio can do this in the middle on any action. He will not enter into any special pose at all for this, although he will go into the block animation for a split second if he is doing nothing. This means that while Emilio is moving or doing any type of action, the opposing player has absolutely no way of knowing when a beam of light will go flying towards them. And since he doesn't enter into any pose for this, he is free to do whatever he wants while the ray goes after his opponent. He could barrier break, make more reflectors, use shining arrow, rush his opponent down etc. His opponent can only defend because if they try to attack him, he can just guard or shield and holding the G button will cause the ray to head straight for them. So while Emilio defends himself, his Ray will smash right into them and he can combo from there. If he gets grabbed then holding G will still cause the ray to hit his opponent and thus freeing him from the grab and THEN Emilio can combo. Emilio is in complete control and his opponent can only defend. Trinity Ray only adds to the pressure and when he uses it with alot of reflectors out, his opponent is truly at his mercy. Since he has all his options during his pressure game, he can always remain unpredictable and stay in control. There is really no risk for Emilio when he uses his reflector game. At best he does a highly damaging combo to an opponent. At worse his opponent doesn't take damage, but then Emilio can just set it up again. Angel Halo makes his reflector game that much harder to defend against, and it can be far wall comboed into. Arch Angel won't really be used much outside of Shining Arrow combos, but it does a great job when used as a combo ender. Despite his amazing control game Emilio isn't without his flaws. His Shining Arrow and Prism Seal are both unsafe on block and leave him vulnerable. Plus Prism Seal is flawed because if Emilio is hit even after the prism forms around his oppenent, it will disappear and Emilio will be vulnerable. Plus Emilio lacks a bread and butter combo and he has a very slow barrier break. So overall his close range game takes a hit. But that's ok since his main strength is his control game which is more then enough to make up for this. If his close range game didn't have some flaws then he would be completely broken. Angel Halo has the usual flaw of a "status changer" in that hitting Emilio will get rid of and Trinity Ray as well as Arch Angel suffer from slow start up time and will see limited use. But these weaknesses are negligible and have no real impact on his game or why he is such an amazing character. Ultimately it's the fact that has the best control game out of all the characters and that he can do so much with it that make him a top tier character. His weaknesses only keep him from being God Tier, but even still he is on a different level from most of the cast. Emilio is a beast that can play well at close range, but truely shines through the use of his reflectors and his Seeker Ray to pressure/control opponents and get in damage. His reputation as a "broken" character is well deserved. Emilio is top tier for sure and one of the best characters in the game.
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • EmblemLordEmblemLord Lord of all Lords Joined: Posts: 5,782
    Lilman: Any luck playing pc1x1 in some psychic force?

    Kenta Kobashi: You have competition where you live? How many of you guys play? What characters? Which characters does your group think are good according to your personal experiences?
    Play me in Ultra plz. PSN is EmblemLord. Yes I play Sagat....STOP FUCKING LAUGHING AT ME!!!!
  • LilmanLilman XBL: tootall984 Joined: Posts: 934
    No sry i havent really had the time to pursue it cuz of midterms and i tried playing again the other day against the CPU....Im so off. I couldnt even retreat Barrier correctly. I need practice.
    DarkHokage: I got fired from work.
    ME: Why you get fired?
    DarkHokage: For being black.
    ME: So you were late?
    Eish & Conan: LOL
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    I have about five other people besides myself.

    I play:Guddeth,Keith,Gates,and Might in that order.
    Everybody else has a mix of random people but all of them play Emilio as a main or secondary.

    I don't like Emilio because everybody else plays with him so much/I don't like his design at all.
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