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  • jae hoonjae hoon Flames of Justice Joined: Posts: 13,131 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Hog was mid tier just because you don't like it didn't make it true. He was consistently between C and D.
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  • EskillsEskills Joined: Posts: 4,198
    Symmetra might as well be the same.

    I'll give another month before shiny new tow syndrome wears off and "More buffs for symmetra Blizz, she's still too niche. "

    Tank meta is valid complaint, but the majority of nerfs/buffs being asked for and implemented don't change a damn thing about it.

    It's always "lol torb/bastion/etc suck, buff and rework plz". 99% of the things being bitched about and asked for won't solve a damn thing and are diverting attention from the true issues and balance changes that need to be addressed.
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  • EskillsEskills Joined: Posts: 4,198
    edited January 7
    jae hoon wrote: »
    Hog was mid tier just because you don't like it didn't make it true. He was consistently between C and D.

    Roadhog has been B for over a month. Go check your facts. Lmao

    Even then stop using those shit list that only use a handful of tournies for the stats.
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  • Mood4food77Mood4food77 Joined: Posts: 9,882
    Eskills wrote: »
    Symmetra might as well be the same.

    I'll give another month before shiny new tow syndrome wears off and "More buffs for symmetra Blizz, she's still too niche. "

    Tank meta is valid complaint, but the majority of nerfs/buffs being asked for and implemented don't change a damn thing about it.

    It's always "lol torb/bastion/etc suck, buff and rework plz". 99% of the things being bitched about and asked for won't solve a damn thing and are diverting attention from the true issues and balance changes that need to be addressed.

    They also made symmetra more interactive. Even if she still stays a bad character the changes made her much more enjoyable to use. A common complaint was "symmetra plays herself" and they fixed that.
  • EskillsEskills Joined: Posts: 4,198
    edited January 7
    More fun won't be enough. The game is stuck in a cycle this company is known for.

    I should've learned my damn lesson from HoTS, diablo, etc and not get sucked into Blizz trap. Smh

    Only Blizz could make the balance worse with every patch they put out and not have the balls to tell all these criers to fuck off.
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  • Mood4food77Mood4food77 Joined: Posts: 9,882
    Well looking at the roadhog, symmetra, and dva changes; they seem to be more for everyone. The "removal" of bs hooks reduces salt level. The "dva cheese" is essentially gone and i already explained symmetra. Ana was 100% a competitive meta nerf. I think they're being careful with sombra as in they want to keep her how they designed her but not make her op. I think reverting dva to her old health would be fine.

    I dont think they can change junkrat or torbjorn without a rework and there's no reason to. I also dont think blizzard wants full balance but some of these changes are weird though so we'll see. They're trying to keep all players happy though
  • ES_CurseES_Curse Get ready for emanci-PAIN SON Joined: Posts: 8,371
    Eskills wrote: »
    It's always "lol torb/bastion/etc suck, buff and rework plz". 99% of the things being bitched about and asked for won't solve a damn thing and are diverting attention from the true issues and balance changes that need to be addressed.

    Issues like... ?

    The strong characters in this game aren't nearly dominant enough to make nerfing them a serious priority. We need more characters that feel powerful, not less. I keep mentioning the characters I do because they're linear as hell and have flaws that you can't just fix with numbers short of utterly breaking them. Once everyone is at least dominant in the area they're supposed to be dominant in, we can talk about whether Soldier's bullets should do 18 or 19 damage.
    formerly just5moreminutes. I guess the clock ran out.
  • EskillsEskills Joined: Posts: 4,198
    edited January 7
    Eskills wrote: »
    It's always "lol torb/bastion/etc suck, buff and rework plz". 99% of the things being bitched about and asked for won't solve a damn thing and are diverting attention from the true issues and balance changes that need to be addressed.

    Issues like... ?

    The strong characters in this game aren't nearly dominant enough to make nerfing them a serious priority. We need more characters that feel powerful, not less. I keep mentioning the characters I do because they're linear as hell and have flaws that you can't just fix with numbers short of utterly breaking them. Once everyone is at least dominant in the area they're supposed to be dominant in, we can talk about whether Soldier's bullets should do 18 or 19 damage.

    Issues like tanks putting out dps like dps heroes. Hog and zarya needing to be changed to dps having some surviabilty taken. Defense role removed. Bastion/mei to tank, torb to tank or support, rest to dps. With them being moved they get changes to accentuate that role. More "TANKS" that are actually tanks. With Disruption, crowd control, CC. Not more dps. Nerf the shit out of Ana.

    Lastly you'll never have every single hero dominate in a role. Hoping and wishing otherwise is painfully unrealistic. If they are meant to fill the same role there will be a strongest pick, a middle ground and one that's simply weaker than the other options. That's how it works.

    Viability is what should be the community focus. Even playing field nonsense doesn't equate to what's viable.

    Pre rework symmetra and possibly junkrat are the characters that aren't viable. Junkrat isn't really all that bad he simply can't function with soldier and pharah at all.
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  • OceanMachineOceanMachine ROCKET LAUNCHER GOD Joined: Posts: 10,287
    Personally I think the hook fix goes in the right direction, but they still have to improve the way it works, because it makes no sense that I see half of a hero standing around a corner and I can't hook him for shit or that the slightest object breaking LoS will break the hook even if 90% of the character model is in my field of view.

    D.va nerf on the other hand is the result of all streamers playing McCree or Reaper that were complaining about not being able to play the hero that shows their true skillz. I hope everyone will be happy when this game will turn into a kawaii CoD.
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  • CHIEfyCHIEfy Joined: Posts: 1,186
    Yea but you don't know what you're talking about either.
    Oh hey, the Ignore List just got bigger.

    I love bold, vague responses.
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  • HollowbladeHollowblade Joined: Posts: 1,594
    Its funny when the game launched i was always saying the pug is disgustingly op due to his ability to pull a character and one shot them without that character being able to do anything about it once hookes... And he could do this every 6 seconds??? Wtf. Im not surprised they tried to fix the hook that shit was bananas sometimes but how do yoh fix hog to make him less dps and more tank? Hes not REALLY a tank since he just melts at the sight of soldier or even reaper. But hes tanky enought that his ehp is so high he can kill a ton of time from ppl shooting him. It is a weird set of events

    On the subject of reaper.. Reaper isnt bad he is the "tankbuster" the issue comes when you enter the tank meta you are either a tank or dont wana be near the tanks to fight. Reaper has to get close to potentially any combo of 3 tanks? Hes gonna get instantly singled out and forced to flee. Reaper in comp is f tier or really low tier not cus hes bad but because the meta just doesnt fit his character design, the dva nerf will allow him to come up a bit more again since killing dva as reaper was a chore and a half when it really shouldnt have been. And it usually resulted in breaking dvas mech but being so low hp that baby dva just kills you as you try to escape.
  • p.m novaroad pilotp.m novaroad pilot Joined: Posts: 2,626

    Eskills wrote: »
    Symmetra might as well be the same.

    I'll give another month before shiny new tow syndrome wears off and "More buffs for symmetra Blizz, she's still too niche. "

    Tank meta is valid complaint, but the majority of nerfs/buffs being asked for and implemented don't change a damn thing about it.

    It's always "lol torb/bastion/etc suck, buff and rework plz". 99% of the things being bitched about and asked for won't solve a damn thing and are diverting attention from the true issues and balance changes that need to be addressed.

    sym is fine now anybody that says different is a idiot
    she was always made for first point defense and maybe a choke point here and there but pc she was always fine
    only needed a change on console
    i like the rework though


    I dont have a problem with the hook going through wall
    my problem is that if you hook someone as they were boosting/running around the corner/down the steps and then they went out of the line of sight because lol momentum
    then the hook should still pull them. i dont understand why it wouldnt


    if you are peeking out of cover and cannot react to the hook you have shitty awareness period
    tank meta is yawn but here we are

    and i like you get tired of bitching and complaining getting patches
    its why console had dumb ass changes in the first place
    and it reminds me of warframe
    fuckboys getting request changes that dont know shit about balance or overviewing how all participants interact with gameplay

    thats why i have to take breaks from this game cause knee jerk reactions ruin the momentum of the meta and i miss the old days we shit was simply what it was and the meta had to evolve
  • HollowbladeHollowblade Joined: Posts: 1,594
    No hero was ever made for one task like first point defence. The devs have said many times the reason for the symmetra change is BECAUSE she was only rarely used on the first point on defence.
  • PterodactylPterodactyl drenched in sauce Joined: Posts: 7,227
    edited January 7
    Its funny when the game launched i was always saying the pug is disgustingly op due to his ability to pull a character and one shot them without that character being able to do anything about it once hookes... And he could do this every 6 seconds??? Wtf. Im not surprised they tried to fix the hook that shit was bananas sometimes but how do yoh fix hog to make him less dps and more tank? Hes not REALLY a tank since he just melts at the sight of soldier or even reaper. But hes tanky enought that his ehp is so high he can kill a ton of time from ppl shooting him. It is a weird set of events

    On the subject of reaper.. Reaper isnt bad he is the "tankbuster" the issue comes when you enter the tank meta you are either a tank or dont wana be near the tanks to fight. Reaper has to get close to potentially any combo of 3 tanks? Hes gonna get instantly singled out and forced to flee. Reaper in comp is f tier or really low tier not cus hes bad but because the meta just doesnt fit his character design, the dva nerf will allow him to come up a bit more again since killing dva as reaper was a chore and a half when it really shouldnt have been. And it usually resulted in breaking dvas mech but being so low hp that baby dva just kills you as you try to escape.

    Don't forget that fatty being all HP means that DPS characters get to pour into him and fill up that ULT meter quicker and easier than anyone else if they get the drop on him without any cover or immediate assistance.

    spread'em
  • XthAtGAm3RGuYXXthAtGAm3RGuYX SRK's ResidentSleeper Joined: Posts: 11,954
    edited January 7
    Its funny when the game launched i was always saying the pug is disgustingly op due to his ability to pull a character and one shot them without that character being able to do anything about it once hookes... And he could do this every 6 seconds??? Wtf. Im not surprised they tried to fix the hook that shit was bananas sometimes but how do yoh fix hog to make him less dps and more tank? Hes not REALLY a tank since he just melts at the sight of soldier or even reaper. But hes tanky enought that his ehp is so high he can kill a ton of time from ppl shooting him. It is a weird set of events

    On the subject of reaper.. Reaper isnt bad he is the "tankbuster" the issue comes when you enter the tank meta you are either a tank or dont wana be near the tanks to fight. Reaper has to get close to potentially any combo of 3 tanks? Hes gonna get instantly singled out and forced to flee. Reaper in comp is f tier or really low tier not cus hes bad but because the meta just doesnt fit his character design, the dva nerf will allow him to come up a bit more again since killing dva as reaper was a chore and a half when it really shouldnt have been. And it usually resulted in breaking dvas mech but being so low hp that baby dva just kills you as you try to escape.

    Roadhog is a tank because he pulls aggro lol. People usually shoot at him first

    Btw Lucio can wallride backwards in the PTR but Blizzard forgot to tell people
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  • p.m novaroad pilotp.m novaroad pilot Joined: Posts: 2,626
    the problem now is that roadhogs (though his name would say different has shit for mobility
    and if the hook can not hook and pull characters outside of a open field then it loses utility.

    hook was his mobile way to hit people
    his primary and alternate fire have shit for range

    now thats nerfed he will drop further than people thought
  • SurremiesSurremies Joined: Posts: 714
    edited January 7
    Eskills wrote: »
    Peeps believing meme garbage doesn't show balance. These are the same scrubs that base their "Balance" from usage tier and refuse to believe anything F tier isn't garbage
    "It's just game! Why you heff to be mad?" Jk.
    That wasn't my point but it might've been I didn't say it clearly. My point just was that while Torbjörn and Bastion + Symmetra are picks that can work as well as others, they aren't picked that often because of "meme / meta garbage" you are referring to.

    At my rank, people usually (and by that I mean start of the match / round) pick Torbjörn and Bastion when it's about surprising the enemy or playing those at overtime. It's mostly (95% I referred) about times where they switch from their role to Bastion / Torbjörn / Attack Symmetra from their previous role just to declare "my team sucks" and being idle / running to die. To conclude, that's about the part I mention not usually having option for pre-made team; they might just troll.

    Edit: did some editing.
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  • Citrus_monkeyCitrus_monkey Joined: Posts: 2,048
    The meta might not matter as lower or mid levels but if youre going to break it then you better have good team communication and a plan to back the comp up. The thing is in solo or duo queue its always the torb/widows/hanzos/symms that happen to never have a mic or respond to team chat. It's always a pattern with them. Even though I climb a ton today, the two games I had with trolls in them were both torbs. One who placed the turret in the spawn room and another shooting at pots in the back. At one point I had a full team where we played against this opposing team had a triple healer/rein/bastion/torb comp that they worked around REALLY well. They placed the bastion and turret on the payload, rein shielded it and then had zen with discords and mercy on damage boost + bastion.

    Shit works. You just need communication. I had a triple queue going on today for the most part with people on mics who would both call out and react to ult stacks. Shit makes the game so much easier AND fun.
  • jae hoonjae hoon Flames of Justice Joined: Posts: 13,131 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    the problem now is that roadhogs (though his name would say different has shit for mobility
    and if the hook can not hook and pull characters outside of a open field then it loses utility.

    hook was his mobile way to hit people
    his primary and alternate fire have shit for range

    now thats nerfed he will drop further than people thought

    I know Moon Moon, Shadder and Seagull flat out said if the nerf to Hog stays the same he is flat out trash. Which Shadder loves as a Genji player.
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  • PterodactylPterodactyl drenched in sauce Joined: Posts: 7,227
    Kind of getting a feel for Sombra's sorry ass.

    Stopped worrying so much about murdering folks directly and doing more hit and run and hacking. Ironically(?) seems like i've been getting more eliminations that way.

    Around how many kills do you think a Sombra player should be getting per match?
    spread'em
  • XthAtGAm3RGuYXXthAtGAm3RGuYX SRK's ResidentSleeper Joined: Posts: 11,954
    Kind of getting a feel for Sombra's sorry ass.

    Stopped worrying so much about murdering folks directly and doing more hit and run and hacking. Ironically(?) seems like i've been getting more eliminations that way.

    Around how many kills do you think a Sombra player should be getting per match?

    The absolute most I've ever seen is like 43, and that was a pro player on PC, which that is still 20-30 elims below a good day for any other DPS character.
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  • CDB2CDB2 Joined: Posts: 3,297
    Getting that instant quad kill off of a High Noon!!

    nodding_clint_eastwood.gif

    It just feels right!!

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  • ES_CurseES_Curse Get ready for emanci-PAIN SON Joined: Posts: 8,371
    I don't think kills are a good metric of how effectively you're using Sombra. You need to be hacking health packs/key targets and landing those big EMP bursts for your team to follow up on. Even if you get the lowest/near-lowest number of kills, winning a point on 2CP by ulting at the right time is where picking Sombra is justified. If your team isn't using those health packs, or the enemy lacks ability-dependent characters to shut down via hacking, you aren't going to build ult fast enough to be worthwhile.

    Also, I remember watching a video some time back (Skyline was it?) that talked about functional hero roles and the thing that stuck out to me as "initiation". It does feel like, at lower ranks, the lack of initiation (heavily caused by low communication) is why the game feels so different. People poke at choke points because they don't come in with a plan beyond getting kills/blocking damage/healing. Those 3 things are important, but since people won't initiate it becomes very easy to defend/hold. The guy specified Winston, Mei, and Roadhog as initiators because of how their abilities work, but there are a lot of more subtle ways to initiate (not counting ults)
    • Dual Flankers: Have a pair of Genji/Tracer/Reaper/Sombra storm the enemy from behind while the rest of the team pushes forward. Communication is key here, but this is a damn good way to leverage a coordination advantage over the enemy team.
    • Snipers: The one time I'll defend Hanzo/Widow mains, if you have the aim to make these key picks. Forcing a numbers disadvantage on the enemy can be enough to compensate for a bad team comp/overall weak mechanical skill, which can really help if matchmaking tries to fuck you. That said, you still need the bare minimum coordination to keep your teammates from dying first, so in some cases this simply won't work.
    • D.Va: Winston gets cited a lot for dive comps because of his barrier and cleave damage, but D.Va is really damn good at it too and can delete things like Flash Bang and Helix Rockets to stay in longer.
    • Lucio Speed Boost: This is common knowledge, but it feels like a lot of the people who think Lucio is a must-pick don't understand WHY. His area healing is solid, but if people aren't using the speed boost well you're just playing a slow-rate healer that doesn't contribute much else. Not to rant too long on this, but it's funny to watch footage from someone like DSPStanky who actually uses it right and see commenters complaining that he's not healing enough when the team already has an Ana or Mercy for raw healing. Or people who have Lucio as a solo healer since the nerf and don't understand why there isn't enough healing.
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  • XthAtGAm3RGuYXXthAtGAm3RGuYX SRK's ResidentSleeper Joined: Posts: 11,954
    Problem being that having Sombra and not having her play concentrated on elims means you essentially are running one DPS, which if you've ever been a solo DPS, you would know that it's almost as infuriating as solo healing. The team counts on DPS to kill things. That is their quota and the team expects it to be met.
    Healers heal, Tanks soak damage and run interference, DPS kills things.

    If you have a Genji that isn't killing anything you ask him to switch. You have a Sombra that isn't killing anything, and it's okay?

    Also I got the alt account to master yesterday lmao. Time to throw some games.
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  • ES_CurseES_Curse Get ready for emanci-PAIN SON Joined: Posts: 8,371
    Sombra isn't a DPS. She's an offense-oriented utility support. Her problems in most "standard" teams are:
    -Tanks need a real healer to entrench their position and can't afford to play around health packs (maybe D.Va/Winston could?)
    -That stupid delay while coming out of stealth makes surprise hacks very hard, cutting into her utility value
    -Sombra doesn't have the damage to threaten teams as a solo flanker

    Barring any major changes, I think Sombra's going to wind up as a dive comp specialist, in place of a 2nd support or the 3rd DPS/2nd tank. Pair her up with Genji for some EMP/Dragonblade shenanigans, let Winston/D.Va fuel your ult, and hack the anti-flankers to let your team run rampant. She's not the threat, just the enabler.
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  • angelpalmangelpalm Stop enjoying things Joined: Posts: 24,457 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Word I see too many assholes picking sombra and not even touching health packs, meanwhile the enemy team is tearing into us without healers.
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  • XhominidXhominid Knight of Dizzy Joined: Posts: 557
    the problem now is that roadhogs (though his name would say different has shit for mobility
    and if the hook can not hook and pull characters outside of a open field then it loses utility.

    hook was his mobile way to hit people
    his primary and alternate fire have shit for range

    now thats nerfed he will drop further than people thought

    And he should be honestly. Roadhog is part of the reason the Tank Meta was so dominant(yes, Ana's Biotic Grenade basically made it viable, but it was Roadhog that pretty much forced both sides to go Tank Meta rather than try and counter through other meas).

    Let's face it, a good Roadhog can hook anyone and everyone and do some ridiculous damage, enough to kill every squishy in the game and utterly wreck Reaper, Bastion and Mei. With an auto-stun mechanic that will still pull you even if your team kills the Roadhog before the animation even starts(I flashbang Roadhog, Roadhog hooks me, we both get stunned, I still get pulled to him, he gets unstunned and kills me before I can do anything...how is that fair?) that can stretch to 10-15m...on a SIX. SECOND. COOLDOWN.

    I don't care how much Roadhog relies on that hook, that shit is insane for any character to have and trying to pretend it didn't need to be rebalanced to actually make it harder to land honestly makes me want to laugh at you.
    This is on the same tier of thought as people asking for Winston to get a damage buff despite that never being his role.
  • OceanMachineOceanMachine ROCKET LAUNCHER GOD Joined: Posts: 10,287
    edited January 8
    Sombra not being able to put out consistent dps, neutralise the enemy's key elements, sustain enough damage or give enough healing to her team, there's no reason of picking her unless you need to combo with her ult to take the first point on hybrid/assault maps. She's like a reversed Symmetra.

    btw to switch topics, how would you rate the ults in this game from best to worst?
    I'll start:

    TOP 5
    1. Graviton Surge - no question about it. The quintessential ult in the game, turns less then average ults like D.va bomb or the spirit dragon into a team wipe.
    2. Earthshatter - the second reason why you want Rein in your team - as if his 2000 hp rectangle wasn't enough. Comes out very fast, has a deceptively big range and turns everyone into a dead body. The LoS restriction might be the only reason why it's not as good as Graviton, but on the other hand it disable every possible defense.
    3. Sound Barrier - after the nanoboost nerf, the combo of sound barrier + speed boost has imho taken back the place of the best support ult in the game. It has the advantage over Transcendence that it will actually soak the damage even from ults with massive burst damage like D.va's, Tracer's or Junkrat's on top of affecting the entire team in LoS, and while Resurrection is indeed powerful it is good only if your team gets wiped and if you want to sacrifice a healer for the entire next team fight. Only Shield Generator might compete with it on defense.
    4. Blizzard - since they buffed it it has become almost as strong as Rein's or Zarya's when it comes to winning team fights. Especially good in defense when you need to defend the point when you're losing a fight or when under the assault of a nanoboosted Genji or Rein.
    5. Dragonblade - probably the only offensive ult that is worth mentioning in this list. Even without Nanoboost, the extra Swift Strike it grants give you enough time to choose your target and dive on it, and the fact it's not projectile based means that many defensive tools like the matrix or barriers aren't as effective against it as against other ults.

    Honorable mention: Molten Core - one can meme a lot about Torb, his ult is scary AF when it pops out. Good luck facing both a 800 HP turret with 120+ dps and a dwarf that has suddenly become a tank with a significant damage output for 12 entire seconds. And the good thing is that he doesn't even need to be even close to the turret to pop it.


    BOTTOM 5
    1. Deadeye - straight garbage and one of the reasons he can't compete with Soldier even with the same dps. Easy to avoid, turns him into an extremely easy target, kills maybe one or two people if the entire enemy team is retarded or if your team manage to push everyone out of position. You'll need at least an Earthshatter or a Graviton+EMP combo to be able to wipe teams with this one.
    2. Rip-Tire - a powerful ult below gold, it becomes useless against better players since their aim is good enough to hit a giant flaming tire that announces its presence through an extremely loud noise. Only good at killing Reins that have Fire Strike on CD.
    3. Dragonstrike - long casting time, slow to reach the enemy or to deal damage, easy to see coming, doesn't cover the space right in front of him, can be absorbed by D.va or even deflected by Genji... its purpose is pretty much only to clear chokes and eventually kill the Rein since it goes through barriers. It can though lead to funny situations because of the fact that it crosses the entire map and can catch people coming out of spawn or of a teleporter.
    4. Self-Destruct - like Deadeye, this is nothing but a zoning ult that can be avoided easily by just standing behind a street sign. The only good thing is that it refreshes her health, but unlike Primal Rage it's not instant and she can get killed before getting the new mech. It's also good to clear all the annoying turrets stacked in a specific area.
    5. Rocket Barrage - has the same issue as Deadeye which is to turn the hero into a sitting duck for its entire duration, except she's in plain sight for everyone to snipe. 95% of the time she will die while ulting and often without even taking any kill. It can also make her kill herself if you put a matrix, a barrier or any other physical object in her face. On the plus side though it has the power to break shields and the rockets start coming out immediately, so she can indeed deal damage before being shut down.

    Dishonorable mention: Infravision - it's not that it's bad or anything, but Hanzo can do basically the same thing every 20s without having to charge an ult.


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  • p.m novaroad pilotp.m novaroad pilot Joined: Posts: 2,626
    edited January 8
    Xhominid wrote: »
    the problem now is that roadhogs (though his name would say different has shit for mobility
    and if the hook can not hook and pull characters outside of a open field then it loses utility.

    hook was his mobile way to hit people
    his primary and alternate fire have shit for range

    now thats nerfed he will drop further than people thought

    And he should be honestly. Roadhog is part of the reason the Tank Meta was so dominant(yes, Ana's Biotic Grenade basically made it viable, but it was Roadhog that pretty much forced both sides to go Tank Meta rather than try and counter through other meas).

    Let's face it, a good Roadhog can hook anyone and everyone and do some ridiculous damage, enough to kill every squishy in the game and utterly wreck Reaper, Bastion and Mei. With an auto-stun mechanic that will still pull you even if your team kills the Roadhog before the animation even starts(I flashbang Roadhog, Roadhog hooks me, we both get stunned, I still get pulled to him, he gets unstunned and kills me before I can do anything...how is that fair?) that can stretch to 10-15m...on a SIX. SECOND. COOLDOWN.

    I don't care how much Roadhog relies on that hook, that shit is insane for any character to have and trying to pretend it didn't need to be rebalanced to actually make it harder to land honestly makes me want to laugh at you.
    This is on the same tier of thought as people asking for Winston to get a damage buff despite that never being his role.

    He's close to useless tier now
    I was right about symmetra when they nerfed her on console and I'll be right about this
    Hook is supposed to catch people as they round the corner
    That's the fucking point
    It's supposed to kill squishes and mobile characters
    If you are out in the open and he throws the hook
    Can you not anticipate, dodge damnit!
    Roadhog gets out ranged by everyone in the cast

    And he has cooldown and when he gets
    Focused on he's fucked

    Talking about my line of thinking?
    You sound like a people that whine about being hooked when you shouldn't have put yourself in the position

    Whenever I got hooked I charged it to the game because I made a bad move and over committed
    Squishes are supposed to die when they get hooked
    He's big, lumbering and only gets a legitimate chance to kill when hook is up
    Now people can be even more brain dead with Movement as they only get caught in a grassy open field
  • twigstertwigster Joined: Posts: 586
    Sombra not being able to put out consistent dps, neutralise the enemy's key elements, sustain enough damage or give enough healing to her team, there's no reason of picking her unless you need to combo with her ult to take the first point on hybrid/assault maps. She's like a reversed Symmetra.

    btw to switch topics, how would you rate the ults in this game from best to worst?
    I'll start:

    stuff

    I'll bite.

    Good
    1) Blizzard- this ultimate is so stupid. This is actually better than Zarya's ultimate, and I think Mei gets it way faster. You -can't- contest an area when this is up. Definitely the best ultimate in the game, I think.
    2) Graviton surge- (for all the reasons you mentioned). Basically a guaranteed team wipe, and you can do some other stuff with it like prevent the enemy team from running onto a point.
    3) Earthshatter- Once again we agree, super good ultimate and guarantees 1-2 kills per use.
    4) Nanoboost- still fucking ridiculous with Reinhardt/Winston/D.Va, who basically become killing machines. Not sure why this isn't on your list. I don't even know if there would be a tank meta without this.
    5) Resurrection- resurrecting your whole team is super good. It's just that Mercy usually hides somewhere before she uses this, and then dies right after.

    Honorable mention- Transcendence. Because it's on my favorite character, and it's so appropriate.

    Bad
    1) Infrasight- I actually think this is the worst ultimate. Hanzo gets the same thing more or less for free, and she announces it to the world when she has it.
    2) Barrage- It leaves her stationary and easy to kill. Pharah BAE needs some help :( I wish she got some armor or something while this is active.
    3) Deadeye- for all the reasons you said. It also causes McRee players to take weird routes in order to get a team kill, rather than being near their team.
    4) Riptire- for all of the reasons you said. Scrubs think they're good at the game because of this ultimate.
    5) Dragonstrike- See Junkrat above. Also, anyone who gets hit with this after 1 week of playtime, who isn't otherwise incapacited, needs to git gud.

    Dis-honorable mention- EMP. Sombra's ultimate is actually great, it's just that it requires so much teamwork and she'll often die right after using it.
    2nd Dis-honorable mention- Troll teleporters. You know who you are.
  • OceanMachineOceanMachine ROCKET LAUNCHER GOD Joined: Posts: 10,287
    edited January 8
    Nanoboost would've been n.1 on my list in August, but after they removed the speed boost it is not anymore the game deciding ult that was before. It just makes some specific targets stay alive a little longer without making them chase down the entire team. If you don't have a Genji and/or a Lucio in your team it is much more anecdotical imho. It's still far from bad though.

    EMP is indeed a little like rez in that it's unstoppable and the caster will sacrifice himself while doing it. The reason why it isn't bad imho is that it charges extremely fast and disables everything around her including turrets.
    [SFV] Laura (Sakura, Cody?) [3S] Alex, Ken
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  • XhominidXhominid Knight of Dizzy Joined: Posts: 557
    Xhominid wrote: »
    the problem now is that roadhogs (though his name would say different has shit for mobility
    and if the hook can not hook and pull characters outside of a open field then it loses utility.

    hook was his mobile way to hit people
    his primary and alternate fire have shit for range

    now thats nerfed he will drop further than people thought

    And he should be honestly. Roadhog is part of the reason the Tank Meta was so dominant(yes, Ana's Biotic Grenade basically made it viable, but it was Roadhog that pretty much forced both sides to go Tank Meta rather than try and counter through other meas).

    Let's face it, a good Roadhog can hook anyone and everyone and do some ridiculous damage, enough to kill every squishy in the game and utterly wreck Reaper, Bastion and Mei. With an auto-stun mechanic that will still pull you even if your team kills the Roadhog before the animation even starts(I flashbang Roadhog, Roadhog hooks me, we both get stunned, I still get pulled to him, he gets unstunned and kills me before I can do anything...how is that fair?) that can stretch to 10-15m...on a SIX. SECOND. COOLDOWN.

    I don't care how much Roadhog relies on that hook, that shit is insane for any character to have and trying to pretend it didn't need to be rebalanced to actually make it harder to land honestly makes me want to laugh at you.
    This is on the same tier of thought as people asking for Winston to get a damage buff despite that never being his role.

    He's close to useless tier now
    I was right about symmetra when they nerfed her on console and I'll be right about this
    Hook is supposed to catch people as they round the corner
    That's the fucking point
    It's supposed to kill squishes and mobile characters
    If you are out in the open and he throws the hook
    Can you not anticipate, dodge damnit!
    Roadhog gets out ranged by everyone in the cast

    And he has cooldown and when he gets
    Focused on he's fucked

    Talking about my line of thinking?
    You sound like a people that whine about being hooked when you shouldn't have put yourself in the position

    Whenever I got hooked I charged it to the game because I made a bad move and over committed
    Squishes are supposed to die when they get hooked
    He's big, lumbering and only gets a legitimate chance to kill when hook is up
    Now people can be even more brain dead with Movement as they only get caught in a grassy open field

    Sounding real mad there, other people outright said that's nowhere near as bad as the GIFs show them out to be. You have to learn and adjust just like everyone else.
  • p.m novaroad pilotp.m novaroad pilot Joined: Posts: 2,626
    Give a minute
    They like a lot of other people are not accounting for the variety of which it becomes useless
    Tracer and other characters smile cause now they can even be more brain dead
  • BB_HoodyBB_Hoody Nice plane you have there. Be a Shame if something went wrong in flight and it crashed Joined: Posts: 5,027
    Yo I'm not expecting perfection or MLG status in Quick Play or lower levels. But it'd be nice if players played like they have A brain and some level of situational awareness. I was in one game in which I was playing as A Mercy. We were on defend. And during the course of the match while I'm healing our D.Va and enemy D.Va attacks the choke with self destruct. I hide while half of the team gets nuked of course. Our friendly D.Va is without her mech and flees back to the point with Hanzo

    Now this is the part that trips me the fuck out. The bullshit from the enemy D.Va. You would think this would be A Golden opportunity to capture our point right? No, that enemy D.Va deadass tries to chase me down along with A reaper. Now I realize this so instead of fleeing to the point for my teammates to protect me. I just strat jumping and straffing around the map. And they continue to chase! They got close to killing me but I'd evade long enough to recover some health before they start landing shots again. I make my way back towards the point with them still on me! I guess The Hanzo noticed me being chased and he One Shots the enemy reaper. Then I Angel Dash over to the team.
    '
    Enemy D.Va goes for another self destruct and wipes our team off the objective except for me and Zarya because I called for that Zarya to barrier me so I can rez the team. And he times it right this time. Us two survive and I rez. And we were able to push them off the point and win.

    I fairly certain that D.Va and Reaper going full retard and chasing me played A factor in us winning. Like it amazes me how so many players play Overwatch like it's COD Team Deathmatch. Just straight up be like fuck the objective I'm going for kills.
  • ES_CurseES_Curse Get ready for emanci-PAIN SON Joined: Posts: 8,371
    Give a minute
    They like a lot of other people are not accounting for the variety of which it becomes useless
    Tracer and other characters smile cause now they can even be more brain dead

    Mei, McCree, and Symmetra still shit on flankers though.
    formerly just5moreminutes. I guess the clock ran out.
  • PterodactylPterodactyl drenched in sauce Joined: Posts: 7,227
    edited January 8
    Sombra not being able to put out consistent dps, neutralise the enemy's key elements,

    Isn't that what she does though?
    spread'em
  • ES_CurseES_Curse Get ready for emanci-PAIN SON Joined: Posts: 8,371
    BB_Hoody wrote: »
    Yo I'm not expecting perfection or MLG status in Quick Play or lower levels. But it'd be nice if players played like they have A brain and some level of situational awareness. I was in one game in which I was playing as A Mercy. We were on defend. And during the course of the match while I'm healing our D.Va and enemy D.Va attacks the choke with self destruct. I hide while half of the team gets nuked of course. Our friendly D.Va is without her mech and flees back to the point with Hanzo

    Now this is the part that trips me the fuck out. The bullshit from the enemy D.Va. You would think this would be A Golden opportunity to capture our point right? No, that enemy D.Va deadass tries to chase me down along with A reaper. Now I realize this so instead of fleeing to the point for my teammates to protect me. I just strat jumping and straffing around the map. And they continue to chase! They got close to killing me but I'd evade long enough to recover some health before they start landing shots again. I make my way back towards the point with them still on me! I guess The Hanzo noticed me being chased and he One Shots the enemy reaper. Then I Angel Dash over to the team.
    '
    Enemy D.Va goes for another self destruct and wipes our team off the objective except for me and Zarya because I called for that Zarya to barrier me so I can rez the team. And he times it right this time. Us two survive and I rez. And we were able to push them off the point and win.

    I fairly certain that D.Va and Reaper going full retard and chasing me played A factor in us winning. Like it amazes me how so many players play Overwatch like it's COD Team Deathmatch. Just straight up be like fuck the objective I'm going for kills.

    Generally people play QP like a fragfest and hug the objective in Competitive. So much shit just works in QP because people won't counter or even think.
    formerly just5moreminutes. I guess the clock ran out.

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