eltrouble, post: 7625784, member: 50728 wrote:
I'm surprised he doesn't main dictator, considering how many dictator-related videos he's put out in recent weeks. It's all very good information, and some of it which is quite new to me. I have no idea Dictator could easily cr.forward Hawk's j.jab to beat him clean, but there must be a way for Hawk to get around that.
Also, I'm pretty sure st.fierce is useful against Hawk as well, since it usually trades in his favor, and is another useful AA tool to keep Hawk from starting his typhoon loops.
Kyouya, post: 7626556, member: 42101 wrote:
Indeed, hawk j.jab and j.short can't hit dictator if he's crouching, you can sit and do nothing and you will not get hit, i think this work with blanka and cammy too, but im not sure.
S.fierce is good against the other hawk jump ins but need spacing, it beats hawk j.fierce clean with the correct spacing if not it will trade, but is a little harder to use against hawk than gief.
Born2SPD, post: 7626670, member: 28257 wrote:
Standing jab and fierce are very risky against Gief IMO. Both moves should be used with moderation. As Zangief you can just whiff an aerial RH and grab bison with a SPD when landing. (Similar to Blanka's Standing strong as anti air)
eltrouble, post: 7627954, member: 50728 wrote:
I'd be impressed if it worked against Cammy and Blanka as well. I know very few moves that can trip guard Blanka's j.fierce or Cammy's j.strong, two of the best air-to-ground moves in the game.
So would you say the Dic v. Hawk match is even or bison favored? I still imagine that the matchup is quite a grind, considering that Hawk is still able to sako tick him few reliable ways of escaping other than his super. From what I saw of match footage, it seems difficult to lock down Dic in typhoon loops since he's somehow able to j.strong quite a lot of the time in order to escape.
Is this related to that weird glitch where sometimes you'll try to combo Dic off of a j.attack, and he'll somehow bounce out of it, even though it should've been a combo? Does he have some weird frame data to his jump, like fewer pre-jump frames?
So would a combination of using st.jab and cr.forward against a jumping Gief be effective? I would take some pretty solid reactions in order to identify whether or not Gief whiffed an air attack to go for the grab, but at least at a theoretical level, Bison should be able to defend against jump attacks fairly well.
Kyouya, post: 7628032, member: 42101 wrote:
No, hawk vs bison is bison favored i'll say 6-4, but if you ask me about ohawk vs bison, thats another history, i'll say 6-4 hawk side (some dictator players say this match is even worse).
You pointed the problem with the match, a lot of good hawk players try to sako tick dictator and thats a nono, for me thats a good thing because i can escape the set up and frustrate the hawk player, eventually he will start losing a lot more than he should, however if the hawk player just tick dictator with c.forward or c.strong you can loop him and i can't do nothing but die.
Bison has the less prejump frames of all the characters, i don't know the data exactly but i think those are 3 or 4 frames, thats why like you said, there are a lot of bison players who just hold jump backward when they are getting comboed, if you miss time your combo the next hit will hit an aerial bison and it will not combo.
Against gief i use almost everything to anti air him, s.fierce, s.jab. s.forward and roundhouse, c.forward, jump neutral roundhouse and fierce, j.strong of course and heck sometimes the slide works. It depends of the situation, like you said you need your good reactions to select the correct anti air for every situation, and don't forget that some of them only works with the correct spacing, if you screw it... well you are dead.
Hope it helps.
eltrouble, post: 7628188, member: 50728 wrote:
One last thing. The following is what I learned from talking to Zaspacer. I know Bison's j.forward or j.short (that knee thing) doesn't seem to be able to cross-up shotos. I always have to block the regular direction, and then change block directions, since he lands on the other side of me. If a Bison can space out a j.roundhouse, it will ambiguously cross-up, but it seems difficult to do this. Is this right? Is there any way to reliable way to guard against this? Uppercut? Spin kick? Or do I just have to guess and be lucky?
Kyouya, post: 7628032, member: 42101 wrote:
a lot of good hawk players try to sako tick dictator and thats a nono
Bob Sagat, post: 7630276, member: 6089 wrote:
Could you elaborate on this? At X-Mania I played against Professor Jones' Dictator a couple of times and I managed to beat him two times in a row by Sako ticking him up and down the screen. Though I did have some trouble recently trying to loop Dictator with that...
oldschool_BR, post: 7630581, member: 7169 wrote:
Can't Dictator use reversal Jab Psycho Crusher to mess up Hawk's timing and delay the moment the tick occurs?
eltrouble, post: 7630728, member: 50728 wrote:
After watching geo player Papercut, it seems like it's difficult to lock down Dic with Sako ticks. He jumped out with j.strong maybe 80% of the time when Paper went for max range Sako ticks.
I thought Psycho can be grabbed in its startup frames? Correct me if I'm wrong.
oldschool_BR, post: 7630991, member: 7169 wrote:
It has up to 3 frames of invulnerability (Jab version). After that, it stays on the ground for a few frames. The Fierce version, on the other hand, only has one frame of invulnerability. However, it has just 3 grounded frames.
The idea is to use it on wake-up, as the Hawk player has his hand waiting for you, as a meaty. For this, the Jab version is the best one, since it has more invulnerability frames - grounded frames don't matter here. It will make contact 3 frames later, so the whole 270 motion should also be delayed by 3 frames. In addition to it, Hawk's hand is only active for 4 frames. This makes it so that the Hawk player must be precise with his tick, else it will miss.
DNGR S PAPERCUT, post: 7631396, member: 25510 wrote:
I see. I've never had a problem with bisons PC messing up the tick timing. Ryu's tatsu was a bit tricky at first, but I got that timing down now.
eltrouble, post: 7631443, member: 50728 wrote:
Oh Lord, I know that to be true. All I can do to fuck up your timing is short spin kicks, and hope I catch you off guard.
Bob Sagat, post: 7631496, member: 6089 wrote:
Yeah, stop doing that please.
BurnYourEgo, post: 7642889, member: 14543 wrote:
Looking for some advice for my friend regarding the footsie game of dictator vs guile. He can't seem to find any pokes against my dictator. My best advice is to play outside dictator's poke range and whiff punish and maintain charge. I feel like he's playing too close and needs to work the 2/3 screen distance more waiting for greedy jumps. But what about when I walk up pressure him, does he have anything to combat standing forward or roundhouse?