Cammy General Discussion: To Bee or not to Bee

1356764

Comments

  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    f+RH seemed punishable on block at close ranges. It's probably slightly negative or neutral if spaced farther out. I don't know about throw immune or how the hurt box was exactly. I believe it could go over certain lows like Ryu cr.Forward but I can't fully remember.

    I believe the frame advantage/disadvantage on Cannon Spikes were dependent on the height they blocked it. It felt like it was slightly negative on block.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    I'm sure her V-Reversal will be fixed
    Otherwise what is the point if it just gets blocked? Be patient and wait for a better option if that stays the case.
    Thanks for all those notes, I'll copy and paste them into my Cammy notes.

    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    All V-Reversals were really bad in this build of SFV. Every one of them could be blocked unless you were countering a medium or heavy normal. The throw bait and frame trap game were also really good counters against V-Reversals.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    I still prefer Combo-Breakers over V-Reversals/Alpha counters.
    PR Rog has a really good point, I don't take USF4 seriously anymore, kinda hard too considering SF5 is on my mind.
    But I'm going to adjust my play style in 4. Seriously gotta train myself to stop using FAs
    playing 3S earlier last week, I kept hitting it! LOL, muscle memory is more stuck on USF4 than a game I played most recently 2 years ago when it came back.

    I wish Alpha 2 and 3 would recognize my fight stick, I have to play on D-pad PS3 controller :/
    They are the ones you buy on PSN.
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • MaxmanMaxman Joined: Posts: 1,801
    Killey wrote: »
    SFV is going to expose SF4 frauds hard. You have little escape options and you have to play the footsie game. No more charging focus because you don't want to play the footsie game anymore. In SFV, if you get outplayed in neutral you get out played really hard.

    Please elaborate :3
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    I don't think a game without FAs will expose 'frauds'; I'll give you a lot of players use FAs as a crutch.
    Like today I had 3500pp Guy use FA non-stop right in front of my Cammy so I just HK spiral arrow, throw or cross uped the idiot and he left after that. He was obsessed with trying to get a focus crumple. Seth players seem to do this a lot as well.
    But the average player doesn't even really know how to use FAs in the footsie game anyway.
    However it does help escape certain scenarios, which by high level players you'll like just get option-selected anyway.

    I love footsie play - I mean I play Chun-Li, but SF4 doesn't reward good spacing and footsie play in my opinion. Footsie play to the average player is just mash jab. Seriously fight a Geif online with Chun-Li do two St. Mps in a row and the Geif will just start mashing green hand. That's not footsie play - its called OMG GET IN-Hit stuff-play.

    Anyway I was more referencing not using FAs to go thru fireballs, no FA-Backdash and no FA for combo extensions. This is just me personally, not suggesting everyone do the same. I'm just wanting personally to go back to basics like SF5 appears to do, just a humbling thing. Interestingly enough, I've done pretty good so far playing this way, haha.
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • MetroxylonMetroxylon Missing link? Joined: Posts: 2,627
    I had a dream you can combo Cannon Strike, to Spin Knuckle, to Spiral Arrow, to Cannon Spike. But you had to link from and into Spin Knuckle, so it wasn't just a mash-out combo. I hope she can actually do it but none of the E3 audience was coherent enough to try. At least comboing the last 3 specials seems very likely.

    Oh and off-topic, but does anybody know if there is EX V-Skill?
    Are you clutch or crutch?
    Downback saved my life.
    Stand strong, do or die.

    https://youtube.com/user/SaveReplayandQuit/videos
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    Metroxylon wrote: »
    I had a dream you can combo Cannon Strike, to Spin Knuckle, to Spiral Arrow, to Cannon Spike. But you had to link from and into Spin Knuckle, so it wasn't just a mash-out combo. I hope she can actually do it but none of the E3 audience was coherent enough to try. At least comboing the last 3 specials seems very likely.

    Oh and off-topic, but does anybody know if there is EX V-Skill?

    That entire combo is not even remotely possible to do both in and out of her V-Trigger. Her Spin Knuckle is her V-Skill (MP+MK) and is not considered a special move and it doesn't get buffed in her V-Trigger. Cannon Strike is her DP and there's no juggle properties to it on hit. If you mean her dive kick (Cannon Spike) it still won't work because Spin Knuckle has a lot of start up frames on it. Her V-Trigger Cannon Strike has too much recovery after wards and it still has no juggle properties on it. V-Trigger Cannon Spike doesn't have enough hit stun for Spin Knuckle to connect as well. At most you can only do three special moves in her V-Trigger as each special move depletes a lot of her V-Gauge. The best combo you can do is Spiral Arrow, Cannon Strike or Super.

    As for the second question, I mentioned previously that she loses access to all of her EX specials while her V-Trigger is active. I believe Combofiend said the same thing during one of the e3 streams.

    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • MetroxylonMetroxylon Missing link? Joined: Posts: 2,627
    I was hoping by now I wouldn't get spike/strike confused, but I blame Capcom 100% for this.

    Yeah I meant "dive kick" link something canceled to Spin knuckle, link out of Spin knuckle, cancel to spiral arrow, juggled to DP.
    Are you clutch or crutch?
    Downback saved my life.
    Stand strong, do or die.

    https://youtube.com/user/SaveReplayandQuit/videos
  • FengShuiEnergyFengShuiEnergy ARIA is the only answer Joined: Posts: 10,833
    Wait so is Cammy's special QSK now only V-skill?
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    As long as you can link a light off her V-skill (spin knuckle)
    you should be able to combo after it.
    comboing into it isn't likely, but I'm banking on it offering up some cool reset possibilities.
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 35,796 mod
    HiyaMaya wrote: »
    I hope you dont hate chuns because you think it's bad. Chuns will allow her to hit confirm c.MK into super most likely...
    Uhh, she doesn't need V-trigger to hitconfirm into super.

    On a related note, what exactly are the angles of her CA? Especially which one can comb off crouching normals.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    If there's anything we do best, it's breaking games and then making everyone suffer with all the cheapness.
    -PersiaXO
  • SharntSharnt Joined: Posts: 354
    edited June 2015
    Rayartz wrote: »
    comboing into it isn't likely, but I'm banking on it offering up some cool reset possibilities.

    This, with the damages normals do in this game it is likely it will be worth it. Between this and insta ex dive kick I can already see the salty tears. I just hope she is unthrowable/airborn somehow to fish that sweet counter hit.

  • HiyaMayaHiyaMaya Joined: Posts: 569
    d3v wrote: »
    HiyaMaya wrote: »
    I hope you dont hate chuns because you think it's bad. Chuns will allow her to hit confirm c.MK into super most likely...
    Uhh, she doesn't need V-trigger to hitconfirm into super.

    On a related note, what exactly are the angles of her CA? Especially which one can comb off crouching normals.

    That's not what i'm implying here. I said she can use trigger to hit confirm c.MK into super. Basically saying that without trigger she cant hit confirm from far range c.MK. She can cancel into LLegs, but those are unsafe. So most likely the double hits from c.MK in trigger should allow you to hit confirm into LLegs and then into super, or just into super straight away. Considering that c.MK is going to be her farthest reaching poke that is cancellable, making things hit confirmable at that range seems pretty important to me.

    Regarding Cammy CA, if she has say Makoto angles to her super, then would it also work like Makotos in that she might only be able to do certain hit confirms relative to her position on the screen? Might end up that going to the far end DOES take longer but might not even be a problem anyway due to larger hit stun maybe. A lot of people seem to play Cammy at E3 so maybe someone can comment if their super missed where they might have expected it to hit. Haven't heard anything like that yet though.
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    Sharnt wrote: »
    Rayartz wrote: »
    comboing into it isn't likely, but I'm banking on it offering up some cool reset possibilities.

    This, with the damages normals do in this game it is likely it will be worth it. Between this and insta ex dive kick I can already see the salty tears. I just hope she is unthrowable/airborn somehow to fish that sweet counter hit.


    Right on! The Ex Drill/Dive pops the opponent airborne. Peter kept saying that would be a good time to use the new B+Hp (the Cl. St. MP of SF4) and then I guess cancel that into CS? OR this would be kind of Juri/Sakura-ish; if we can juggle air reset with a St. jab, possibly dash under the opponent? Maybe even utilize that tricky new hooligan as well.

    I'm really hoping her Dive has a better hit box than SF4's, sucks getting DP'd trying to get in.
    Cracks me up K-Brad gets away with all those Neutral jumps on an opponents wake up. I get DP'd all day attempting that.
    I'd really like to hear more in-depth what K-Brad saw in Cammy, eventhubs little article didn't go into much.

    Anyone think Capcom Pro Talk tonight will discuss some SF5?

    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 35,796 mod
    edited June 2015
    HiyaMaya wrote: »
    d3v wrote: »
    On a related note, what exactly are the angles of her CA? Especially which one can comb off crouching normals.

    Regarding Cammy CA, if she has say Makoto angles to her super, then would it also work like Makotos in that she might only be able to do certain hit confirms relative to her position on the screen? Might end up that going to the far end DOES take longer but might not even be a problem anyway due to larger hit stun maybe. A lot of people seem to play Cammy at E3 so maybe someone can comment if their super missed where they might have expected it to hit. Haven't heard anything like that yet though.
    This has already been confirmed (in case you haven't been reading the thread. What I'm asking is what the exact angles are depending on which button.
    Rayartz wrote: »
    Sharnt wrote: »
    Rayartz wrote: »
    comboing into it isn't likely, but I'm banking on it offering up some cool reset possibilities.

    This, with the damages normals do in this game it is likely it will be worth it. Between this and insta ex dive kick I can already see the salty tears. I just hope she is unthrowable/airborn somehow to fish that sweet counter hit.


    Right on! The Ex Drill/Dive pops the opponent airborne. Peter kept saying that would be a good time to use the new B+Hp (the Cl. St. MP of SF4) and then I guess cancel that into CS? OR this would be kind of Juri/Sakura-ish; if we can juggle air reset with a St. jab, possibly dash under the opponent? Maybe even utilize that tricky new hooligan as well.

    I'm really hoping her Dive has a better hit box than SF4's, sucks getting DP'd trying to get in.
    Cracks me up K-Brad gets away with all those Neutral jumps on an opponents wake up. I get DP'd all day attempting that.
    I'd really like to hear more in-depth what K-Brad saw in Cammy, eventhubs little article didn't go into much.

    Anyone think Capcom Pro Talk tonight will discuss some SF5?

    Wasn't it already mentioned that her dive kick is worse than in SFIV.

    Pretty sure we won't be getting any buffs on it in this game (especially since it seems she's being given CvS2 good normals plus more options to get in on the ground).
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    If there's anything we do best, it's breaking games and then making everyone suffer with all the cheapness.
    -PersiaXO
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    You shouldn't be jumping too much in SFV in general. Anti-airs do good damage and everyone in the e3 build had good reliable anti-airs whether it was a DP or a specific normal. People need to get the SF4 mentality out of their heads when approaching SFV. SFV is it's own game and outside of a few links the game plays nothing like SF4. Cammy is probably the closest thing to an SF4 character, however, I suspect she'll be changed during development because she seemed incomplete to me. Certain normals will have their own separate block animations like the rest of the cast and will make some of her normals more unsafe, specifically her cr.RH.

    Cannon Spike doesn't have much frame advantage on block and you'll get thrown most of the time. She doesn't need to rely on Cannon Spike to get in at all. Her footsie game with s.Forward, cr.Forward, s.Fierce, cr.Fierce, cr.RH, and f+RH is really good in this build. If they keep that design than she just needs to play solid footsies and she'll be fine. She's one of the few characters that has built in mix ups with her Hooligan follow ups.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 35,796 mod
    Cannon Strike, not Spike.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    If there's anything we do best, it's breaking games and then making everyone suffer with all the cheapness.
    -PersiaXO
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    Sorry, my bad.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • xenwallxenwall Joined: Posts: 123
    d3v wrote: »
    Cannon Strike, not Spike.

    I really hate Cammy's specials' naming conventions.

    I will say that Cammy looks like a ton of fun so far. I'm curious as to the range of the V-Skill and whether it can be used at a distance where it become fairly ambiguous as to whether it will cross up or not. It certainly seems better than SFIV's Spin Knuckle.
    I play hitbox so I can mash buttons while I'm mashing buttons.
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    Did someone mention Cr. Hp was cancelable? Killey - did I hear that right or am I mistaken?
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    Rayartz wrote: »
    Did someone mention Cr. Hp was cancelable? Killey - did I hear that right or am I mistaken?

    As far as I can remember, cr.HP was not special or V-Trigger cancel-able.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • SharntSharnt Joined: Posts: 354
    Frankly I don't mind about the non ex dive being shit to get in. As long as it can be used to whiff punish lows/throws when up close on a hard read I'm fine with it. That is my biggest grip with SF4 cammy, "insta" dive hits my opponent doing OS crouch tech and I'm -2 or 3 WTH.
  • FengShuiEnergyFengShuiEnergy ARIA is the only answer Joined: Posts: 10,833
    Her dive kick seems to be in between SF4 and SFxT in terms of how good it is. IN 4 is was too good in SFxT it was too bad..I think they might have found the medium here.
  • Phantom AngelPhantom Angel The Divine One™ Joined: Posts: 27,140
    Sharnt wrote: »
    Frankly I don't mind about the non ex dive being shit to get in. As long as it can be used to whiff punish lows/throws when up close on a hard read I'm fine with it. That is my biggest grip with SF4 cammy, "insta" dive hits my opponent doing OS crouch tech and I'm -2 or 3 WTH.

    ...wha?
    "Old enough to know better, Young enough to not give a fuck"

    R.I.P. YusukeUrameshi aka Yusuke_The_Detective
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 PRAISED BEEF Joined: Posts: 54,654 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I just wanna throw sHP and cMK all day like CVS2 Cammy. Fugg dive kikn

    ANIME IS DA WAY.  Anime EVO Takeover 2018.  No more CAPCPOM!  There will be oki and there will be setplay


  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 35,796 mod
    Hoping her new cr.mk low profiles stuff. If it doesn't, then it should.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    If there's anything we do best, it's breaking games and then making everyone suffer with all the cheapness.
    -PersiaXO
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    Maybe someone in here can enlighten me on something. I ask this because in the general thread it'll get buried quickly.
    Possibly Killey can help me understand this since you had the opportunity to play it at E3:

    First off I know what Crouch Teching/Stand Teching is, I do it all the time in SF4.
    There are however those who "crouch tech" by mashing Cr. Lp a billion times in block stun or even if you are hitting them.
    So my question, they say crouch teching is gone - therefor Stand Teching is back to being the norm. What about those fools mashing jab if, you are hitting them in block stun and then go to throw are you going to get jabbed out of your throw? or is the throw going to catch them anyway?

    I ask this because this has always been one of my top 3 complaints with SF4 as a series. People who constantly hit buttons.
    I'm hoping and from what I am hearing it "sounds" promising, that actual blocking will be the best option - you are caught hitting buttons you'll get counter hit and get stunned fast is loosely what PR Rog says. Others have mirrored that reflection

    My biggest issues with SF4 as a whole is the mash jabbers, mash ultra, mash reversal, jumping monkey's that just go HAM and get rewarded for it.
    Peter says you have to work in this game - I love the sound of that!
    People are certainly still going to wake up Critical Art if they have it, people are still going to jump all over the place. But "IF" what everyone says is true. The scrubby SF4 tactics that are really pretty legit, because it works. If it doesn't work in SF5, it'll be my favorite fighting game ever!!
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    edited June 2015
    Rayartz wrote: »
    Maybe someone in here can enlighten me on something. I ask this because in the general thread it'll get buried quickly.
    Possibly Killey can help me understand this since you had the opportunity to play it at E3:

    First off I know what Crouch Teching/Stand Teching is, I do it all the time in SF4.
    There are however those who "crouch tech" by mashing Cr. Lp a billion times in block stun or even if you are hitting them.
    So my question, they say crouch teching is gone - therefor Stand Teching is back to being the norm. What about those fools mashing jab if, you are hitting them in block stun and then go to throw are you going to get jabbed out of your throw? or is the throw going to catch them anyway?

    I ask this because this has always been one of my top 3 complaints with SF4 as a series. People who constantly hit buttons.
    I'm hoping and from what I am hearing it "sounds" promising, that actual blocking will be the best option - you are caught hitting buttons you'll get counter hit and get stunned fast is loosely what PR Rog says. Others have mirrored that reflection

    My biggest issues with SF4 as a whole is the mash jabbers, mash ultra, mash reversal, jumping monkey's that just go HAM and get rewarded for it.
    Peter says you have to work in this game - I love the sound of that!
    People are certainly still going to wake up Critical Art if they have it, people are still going to jump all over the place. But "IF" what everyone says is true. The scrubby SF4 tactics that are really pretty legit, because it works. If it doesn't work in SF5, it'll be my favorite fighting game ever!!

    You should really be asking this in the general discussion thread and not in the Cammy thread but I'll answer your questions.

    The crouch tech option select where you get cr.short when you do down back+LP+LK simultaneously is gone. What happens when you do that sequence is a standing throw and if the opponent is not in range you get the throw whiff animation. So yes, you can still tech a throw by crouching but you're committing to the throw tech attempt.

    In regards to cr.Jab mashing to beat throws that isn't specific to SF4 that's exists in pretty much every fighting game and is apart of the meta. Blocking beats buttons, throws beats blocking, and buttons beats throws. This needs to exist otherwise throws would be too good if they could beat buttons as well. So yes, in SFV if they're mashing jab and you're going for a throw attempt you will get hit out of your throw. That's why you need to use that information, recreate the scenario for the opponent and then use frame traps instead to counter hit them into a good damage combo. If they're smart they'll learn to respect your pressure and that will open up your throw options. If they aren't smart they eat counter hit combos all day and that's even more rewarding then landing a throw.

    It's really apparent that this game doesn't cater to the below average player. There's a huge focus on the neutral game and offense. There's no focus attack to bail you out of the footsie game once in a while and there's no come back mechanics. If you're opponent is out playing you on the ground there's nothing you can do about it besides playing better. There are no checkmate situations where you can get a guaranteed chip kill victory. Defensive options are more limited but with the lack of hard knockdowns leading into set ups you can play solid defense. However, you can't down back forever since recoverable chip damage off of medium and heavy normals add up. The game is definitely tuned to keep the game fast paced.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • SharntSharnt Joined: Posts: 354
    Killey wrote: »
    That's why you need to use that information, recreate the scenario for the opponent and then use frame traps instead to counter hit them into a good damage combo. [...] If they aren't smart they eat counter hit combos all day and that's even more rewarding then landing a throw.
    The thing is, most "mashers" are doing it poorly, so if you do a standard frametrap with a say 2f gaps to prevent them to mash anything in between they will never fall to it because they aren't mashing hard enough. Thus you get to the thing that most players do. A delayed crouch tech os. And this is an entire different hell to beat.
    If you try to get them by throwing they will always tech it because of the semi infinite tech throw window in SF4.
    If you try to to frametrap them they will never mash in between if your frametraps are too tight.
    If you delay your frametrap as it is REALLY difficult to delay by a few frames (3-4) a frame trap and most character do not have a longer startup move opening on a combo as good while being also safe (or even + for most openings with mediums) you are likely to get hit.
    There is still the whiff punish but most character do not have the move speed or the divekicks enabling this game style.

    It all boils down to the result that you KNOW what your opponent does, you KNOW how to beat it, but because of the engine the results are semi random and are really frustrating to get. Well at an intermediate level at least.
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    Again that's not really an issue with SF4's game engine but more to do with the player. KoFXIII has frame traps against mash cr.B but they were pretty tight so you had to delay the frame trap to catch the mashers.

    SF4 it had a different meta with delayed crouch teching to avoid the standard frame traps people were using and then people did other things to counter act that. Tokido and Daigo delay they're normals and still catch people even though under regular circumstances if the opponent had push a button earlier they would have interrupted them. You're probably mistiming your frame trap to catch people delaying their crouch tech os. The other thing people were doing was using a slower normal to catch the delayed crouch tech. For example, Viper s.Short, cr.Strong is a frame trap but it's pretty tight and most people don't fall for it. I can either delay my cr.Strong further to catch the delay crouch tech or I could use s.Short, s.Fierce instead and use the extra start up frames of s.Fierce to catch the delayed crouch tech and believe me this works pretty well.

    In the case of SFV I don't think this will be happening but it's too early to tell. It's something you'll have to test on during the multiple beta phases.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • SharntSharnt Joined: Posts: 354
    edited June 2015
    You're probably mistiming your frame trap to catch people delaying their crouch tech os.
    Of course I am, but everyone is. Being me, my opponent mashing in a few frames window in a semi random pattern. The issue is not the solution is non existent, it is that it is far too hard to implement into my game for being just a basic mechanic in the game. You have to get to pro level to enable the necessary precision to catch these. A basic mechanic in the game is entirely defeated until you get to a relatively high level of execution just by a simple trick.

    I already evacuated the slower normals too (It looks like you missed a few words in my previous post). Not every character does have a normal being a combo starter which is also safe in guard. As Yun, I can't use my heavies to delay further than with my mediums because those are hugely superiors in terms of frame advantage, confirm and combo opportunity.

    That is one of my biggest issue with the game. In VF5 FS by example with the buffer on normals in this game if you mash you get counter hit, you take a decision and you assume the consequences. SF4 forces you to have precise timings everywhere to get even the most basic things done.
  • RagingStormXRagingStormX Team Arcade Stream Joined: Posts: 5,193 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 35,796 mod
    Really digging her new low forward.
    rysCfWd.jpg
    Here's hoping it low profiles some stuff.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    If there's anything we do best, it's breaking games and then making everyone suffer with all the cheapness.
    -PersiaXO
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    The reach and speed looks fantastic!
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • melflomilmelflomil Above Average Fighter Joined: Posts: 2,813
    edited June 2015
    d3v wrote: »
    Really digging her new low forward.
    rysCfWd.jpg
    Here's hoping it low profiles some stuff.

    The most important thing i get from this picture is that ass
    Post edited by melflomil on
    SF5 = Laura
    UMvC3= X-23, Chris Redfield & Dante
    PSN= melflomil
  • DimeDime Wasting time Joined: Posts: 10,036
    edited June 2015
    Sharnt wrote: »
    You're probably mistiming your frame trap to catch people delaying their crouch tech os.
    Of course I am, but everyone is. Being me, my opponent mashing in a few frames window in a semi random pattern. The issue is not the solution is non existent, it is that it is far too hard to implement into my game for being just a basic mechanic in the game. You have to get to pro level to enable the necessary precision to catch these. A basic mechanic in the game is entirely defeated until you get to a relatively high level of execution just by a simple trick.

    I already evacuated the slower normals too (It looks like you missed a few words in my previous post). Not every character does have a normal being a combo starter which is also safe in guard. As Yun, I can't use my heavies to delay further than with my mediums because those are hugely superiors in terms of frame advantage, confirm and combo opportunity.

    That is one of my biggest issue with the game. In VF5 FS by example with the buffer on normals in this game if you mash you get counter hit, you take a decision and you assume the consequences. SF4 forces you to have precise timings everywhere to get even the most basic things done.


    I totally agree with this and it is one of the reasons why I stopped playing sf4.

    I really didn't like that I had to guess correctly between 3 different tech timings to frame trap crouchtech (fast, regular, or delayed) and that even then I still had to also guess correctly on 3 different frame trap timings for hitting stand tech (much easier since you could hit them low, but I digress, that was rare) and then I also had to guess if they were going to reversal or jump away (yep, I actually had people jumping out of my throw attempts on occasion. It wasn't a usual thing but it did happen occasionally) it all just made sf4 feel like out and out work to me.

    And to top it all off, at the time there was no way outside of playing people, to practice the timing to hit something such as delayed crouchtech.

    You couldn't easily set it up in training mode so you had to have someone be your dummy for awhile... Never met anyone willing to do that for decent periods of time (I would have reciprocated of course) but lol funnily enough the 4 players that I found that were the best at frame trapping delayed crouch tech consistently all had had live in brothers that also played the game at high levels... Doesn't take a genius to figure out part of their training regiment or why they had an unfair advantage at the time (and yes I know about the new t-mode way to practice against crouch tech)

    The point still stands that it as a BASIC mechanic was extremely overpowered at an intermediate level of play and made the game exceptionally boring if you didn't use a divekick/srk fadc character who could frame trap very easily with those moves.

    My solution was I quit the game. Good riddance to crouch teching and shit netplay. Now I play SG as my main game..,SOOOOOO much better. When I throw people they get thrown unless they guessed right. If they teched and I went low I win 99.9% of the time. If I went for throw and they blocked low, then I usually still throw them.

    I feel like the choices I make actual,y matter and that because of that I can actually learn and that my losses are earned and so are my wins.

    But I've been playing that game for over 3 years and I'm ready to share my time with it with another game so that's why sf5 (amongst other fighting games) is being given a shot by me.

    Also, I just realised this is off topic. Sorry. Won't happen again (can't believe I posted in the cammy thread.)
    Gettin' my derp on.
  • ScallatScallat Joined: Posts: 317
    How safe/unsafe are her Cannon Drills? Are we talking like SFIV (unsafe), Super Turbo (Safe from the right range/against the right character) or HD Remix (safe except at point blank range - drill loops!)?
    : I'm like the angle opposite the hypotenuse.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 35,796 mod
    I keep wondering why exactly Cammy's Cannon Strike is now limited to her forward jump. I was watching some old CvS2 vids and John Choi was making good use her it out of a backwards jump. Yet at the same time, it wasn't exactly as strong there it was in IV.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    If there's anything we do best, it's breaking games and then making everyone suffer with all the cheapness.
    -PersiaXO
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 PRAISED BEEF Joined: Posts: 54,654 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I think it's just knee jerk reaction to the strength of dive kicks from SFIV. I was randomly playing SFIV again on PC because I felt like it, and Juri has the same thing where you have to jump forward or straight up to dive kick. It just seems tacked on.

    ANIME IS DA WAY.  Anime EVO Takeover 2018.  No more CAPCPOM!  There will be oki and there will be setplay


  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    It'd be nice if you could do non-EX cannon strike's jumping back. It is great for baits, catching people hitting buttons or just off guard in general.
    Anyone besides me think it is odd she doesn't have an Air Throw in SF5? Could be simply because she wasn't completed yet and will have an Air Throw later down the line.
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • KilleyKilley Game Over Yeeeaaaahhhhh Joined: Posts: 5,560
    Rayartz wrote: »
    It'd be nice if you could do non-EX cannon strike's jumping back. It is great for baits, catching people hitting buttons or just off guard in general.
    Anyone besides me think it is odd she doesn't have an Air Throw in SF5? Could be simply because she wasn't completed yet and will have an Air Throw later down the line.

    People, please keep in mind that she can do cannon strike from a backwards jump in V-Trigger.

    I believe Combofiend mentioned during one of the e3 streams that Cammy is incomplete at the moment and that her air throw will be added later.
    All posts made by Killey are intended for discerning readers. All views & opinions are subject to change without notice. Killey will not apologize for any misinterpretations of his posts.
  • ruthless_nashruthless_nash Joined: Posts: 2,021
    Hope cammy gets a deep red/maroon color, that would look totally hot.
  • RayartzRayartz Hosenka Reversal Yo! Joined: Posts: 1,790
    I'm curious how many colors each character will have in the end.
    of course DLC costumes will come, kinda hoping there is at least 1 costume you can unlock or something.
    That second color Blue/white is sick! I use color 6 on the original outfit it's a deep blue (kinda like Chun's original)
    I like how her eyes change color on the second slot. Hopefully they can take this further with hair color swaps etc.,
    I made a red head cammy in SFxTk (not even much of a red head fan) but she looked smoke'n' haha
    Chun Li, Juri and Laura - Loyalty for LIFE!
    SFV Goals: To be competent with every character and help others do the same!
    Overwatch: Tracer, D.Va, Junkrat, Mercy, Mei
  • Bowser-DaimaoBowser-Daimao Joined: Posts: 35
    Am I the only one who doesn't like her new face? I seriously can't be the only one.
    Mains: SSBM Marth SF3TS, Dudley. SF4, Sakura and Dudley.
  • john4pjohn4p Joined: Posts: 817
    Looks a bit unusual but heaps better than her SF4 face.
  • melflomilmelflomil Above Average Fighter Joined: Posts: 2,813
    I wonder if Cammy's crouching fierce still has ridiculous frame advantage on hit.
    SF5 = Laura
    UMvC3= X-23, Chris Redfield & Dante
    PSN= melflomil
Sign In or Register to comment.