Cammy General Discussion: To Bee or not to Bee

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  • ShiroyashaShiroyasha The Crimson Fucker Joined: Posts: 794
    Throw can be blocked by pressing throws yourself = not unblockable
    Commandthrows like Mika and alex can be jumped out of = not unblockable
    hooligan throw setup can be jabbed out of = not unblockable

    Ryu gets a sweep crushcounter against Balrog midscreen backdash into charged normal fireball = unblockable
    Why is it unblockable?
    - He can't jump out of it = gets hit
    - He can't backdash it = gets hit
    - He can't block it because it is a guardcrush
    - Has Balrog full CA? Yes? Good he can reversal it with a CriticalArt

    So if Balrog has no V-Reversal or CA left he has to take the damage since there is literally no option out of it. Thats a true unblockable. No matter what you do you get hit.
    SSF4 AE 2012: Juri, Rose, Cammy <3

  • LockMLockM Joined: Posts: 2,623
    mobbdeep wrote: »
    LockM wrote: »
    mobbdeep wrote: »
    Throws cannot be blocked. Everything is unblockable to a dizzied fighter, or to a fighter stuck in hitstun. Cross-ups done in particular situations can come very close to seeming unblockable because of their sheer ambiguity. In previous Street Fighter games, some cross-up setups were actually unblockable. Although these kinds of unintended tactics are usually bugs, the fighting game community tends to be fairly open about allowing them; if it’s in the game, it’s in the game.

    i think i have a unblockable but can anybody tell if this definition i think it is it came from the offical e guide.
    I think you have it mostly right regarding unblockables. Regarding throws, normal throws cannot be blocked but can however be teched. Command throws which cannot be teched can still be escaped by doing things such as backdashes, jumping or (throw) invincible attacks. Cammy her hooligan throw cannot be backdashed or jumped out of but can be interrupted and the startup of this move gives enough time to the opponent to react to it.

    In SFV Cammy had something of an "unblockable" but you had multiple ways to get out. EX Divekick, st.hp xx Hooligan xx air throw. There are a few frames you are considered standing before transitioning into a crouch when wakeup or after an air reset. You could escape this by pressing a crouching normal for instance. Cammy could cancel into a divekick instead so it would beat the crouching normal, you still have to make a read. She also didn't get anything from the regular hooligan throw. To be honest it wasn't that good.

    It was removed after the latest patch, now you can simply crouch block and the hooligan throw will completely whiff, you don't even have to press a normal anymore.
    You might be unable to block it so technically it's an "unblockable" however if you can simply crouch under it then it is kinda useless. Another downside to the air hooligan after a reset or on wakeup is that you have so much time to react to it.

    *Technically you are right but in the context "unblockable" is used by people it almost always refer to inescapable unblockables(USFIV unblockables could actually be blocked by inputting a block direction 1f before the opponent tried to do it, so it was almost luck if you could block it) Doing something like a meaty command grab for instance wouldn't be considered an "unblockable", it's just a good mixup.

    *Don't get too hung up on the words "unblockable", "mixup", "reset" etc. It doesn't matter what call it, the only thing that really matters is if it's practical.

    ok so basically what u saying is is technically what im doing is unblockable but it's not a air tight situation in term of avoiding it etc.

    The Cammy setup with her hooligan is not that good, you already have the opponent knocked down but instead you are willing to spend 1 ex bar when instead you could have simply done a meaty st.lk for the exact same pressure. The hooligan throw doesn't work, you can just crouch. Even then the hooligan gives the opponent enough time to simply react to it and if they have a good reversals they can straight up punish you.

    The Mika air reset into ex command grab is good as you can't react to it and you can do meaty f.hp instead which will beat the options that escape the comamnd throw. So the opponent literally has to guess.

    What i said was that the way you use the term "unblockable" is not how the rest of the FGC uses it. Getting caught by a command grab after a setup is not referred to as an "unblockable" setup. I know what i'm saying isn't new to you as you've asked the terminology about things such as mixups, resets etc before in the past. There is no complete opr solid definition of these things unfortunately as the FGC is not some official organization and there are a ton of different FG's. Some terms slightly differ between these games.

    In short, yes, the ex hooligan setup has waaaaay too many options to counter it and it is also extremely easy to counter it as you can simply crouch to avoid it. The Mika setup is good but very common, after you reset the opponent in the air you either do a meaty, a command grab or bait the (throw/strike)invincible reversals.

    It doesn't matter how you call something, if it is a reset, mixup, unblockable etc etc these are just words to convey a situation without using too many words. The best setups are the ones where the opponent has the least amount of options to get out and they have to either guess or commit to an invincible attack.
    GGXrdR2: Jam, Baiken
    T7:  Jin
    SFV: Juri
    USFIV: Yun, Cody, Guy





  • TWINBLADESTWINBLADES OFFICIALLY THE WORST PLAYER ON SRK LEAGUE: BRONZE LP: 200 Joined: Posts: 9,816
    I just browsed around the other mu threads for other characters and if you didn't know any better you'd think cammy was the best in the game lol. Everyone says she gives them problems...that is until I got to the Geif thread and a few people agreed it was easy work :s

    This is a difficult MU for me to assess. When I started playing this game Gief was by far my worst MU. Just the thought of fighting Gief was a nightmare. Then I got together with a friend from here who has a pretty impressive Gief. I've grinded it out with this guy for months and took so many L's. Then I started beating that mother fucker and I realized the Gief MU wasn't something to be afraid of.

    Gief is still hard for Cammy because one fuck up and you're down 30%. But Cammy has the tools with the range to keep Gief out.

    I say it's in her favor hands down.


    CammyVsGief is one of my favorite MU's in SFV



    Look at that sexy ass back in forth

    *begins frothing from mouth*
    SFV: Cammy/Kolin (3 NEW OUTFITS THANK YOU ONO!!! SUCK IT A10METAL)/Karin
    CFN: TWINBLADES [The "i" in TWINBLADES is actually a uppercase L]
    PSN: CARBON465
  • SunTzu81SunTzu81 Joined: Posts: 579
    edited October 2016
    TWINBLADES wrote: »

    Gief is still hard for Cammy because one fuck up grab and you're down 30%. One fuck up and you're down 90%.

    Fixed your post. See 3:10 of that video above.

    Also this video pretty much proves pros are not hit confirming off of cr mk only. They are using other visuals. Kaz was just using cr mk to keep zangief from walking forward, but he couldn't hit confirm from it. I'm really surprised giefs cr jab does not beat out cr mk with it's huge ass hurt box and lets be real that match was close. If Itazan had not gotten tilted I think he would have won.

  • forest31forest31 No throw break! Joined: Posts: 803
    edited October 2016
    The Gief MU is boring AF. It's more of a measure of patience than anything. Reactions are important too. Punish whiffed normals like fully charged s HP or the hop knee. s MK and s HP buffered into a special move are important. His anti airs are better than people think. You might want to avoid too many jumps.

    I'm trying to switch to j HK, s LP, b+MP,HK, HCF+PP,LK, DP+LK as my stun combo, but I have some questions/observations. First, you need to be doing HCF while/before you press HK to make EX Hooligan come out in time. No need to worry since the target combo's animation cancels any unwanted actions HCF+PP might cause. Second, s LP is what you want to use, not c LP, which does 10 points less. However, when I use j HK, s LP, b+MP,HK, the b+MP often misses! Even at range 0 in the corner. So I guess there must be important tricks to prevent the b+MP whiff and combo drop. Maybe walk forward a step after the neutral j HK, like j HK, F+LP, b+MP,HK. Or, it might be that if you hit neutral j HK early you get the combo to hit. But, there is the obvious solution of using a backdash into a forward jumping HK. But I like to whiff 2 QCF+LK SAs before I do my VS stunned combo. I'd be giving up meter gain.

    I play a lot of survival. I'm trying to beat eXtreme. I just see it as combo practice.

    Going by the preview screen for Cammy's Halloween alternate costume, her butt is covered. That sucks! So I purchased her bikini swimwear outfit. Muuuch better.

    EDIT never mind I went into practice mode and found out the extra damage scaling from including s LP reduces the damage! 322 without, 317 with the s LP.

    I was playing USF4 last night for fun and messed around with USF4 Cammy. I figured out instant EX divekicks are easy to do. d,db,b,ub,u+KK. If I'd known they were that easy to do I might have used her more in USF4! LvL 3 focus into 4 EX divekicks combos into Ultra! I also found that when it comes to non EX divekicks the HK version is by far the best because of its range and how it combos into c HP or s HP for bigger damage. Do you think it was Capcom's intent to make SFV Cammy's HK divekick also the best version of non EX divekick by including the target combo? The SFV HK divekick does reach way far in SFV.

    They really nerfed EX divekick in SFV though. From a full combo or raw Ultra to 1 juggle hit max. You had 4 bars PLUS Ultra in SF4, too. A third of your meter and Ultra meter is the SFV equivalent in resources to one SF4 divekick! Her s HK was ssooo good in SF4 too. Long reach, speed and damage. What equivalent does she have of SF4 s HK in SFV? c HP has way less range and moves her forward, pretty different. I guess s HP is pretty fast and special cancellable. c MK's hurtbox sucks, it gets beat out or trades so much. s MK is long range but it's like you hit them with it twice and you have to stop using it because the damage reward is low.

    Post edited by forest31 on
    youtube.com/user/ForestTekkenVideos
  • CipherCipher Catchphraser Joined: Posts: 1,866
    Why has every Cammy forum I visit someone who is talking about her butt?
    I mean it's amazing,but we don't need to point it out,because it's to obvious.
    SteamId, leave a comment before adding!
    Street Fighter: Cammy, Rose
    Tekken: When's Jun? , Asuka
    Guilty Gear: Ramlethal, Jack-O

    My SFV Cammyguide!
  • deadxobbitdeadxobbit Joined: Posts: 51
    edited October 2016
    Dunno, I personally like the undead bride/princess look. IMO one of the best Halloween costumes alongside with Werewolf Necalli and Demonic Red Hat Juri.
  • midnight_carnivalmidnight_carnival Joined: Posts: 70
    Screw that I want the costume where she has on the sports bra and the cargo pants...that ish was sexy someone posted it but I think it was a mod. That's like the best one so far to me.
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Curious, who do you guys find the most annoying to fight against.
  • CipherCipher Catchphraser Joined: Posts: 1,866
    SteamId, leave a comment before adding!
    Street Fighter: Cammy, Rose
    Tekken: When's Jun? , Asuka
    Guilty Gear: Ramlethal, Jack-O

    My SFV Cammyguide!
  • BixHDBixHD Semi-lurker Joined: Posts: 193
    Screw that I want the costume where she has on the sports bra and the cargo pants...that ish was sexy someone posted it but I think it was a mod. That's like the best one so far to me.

    This one? http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/comment/10992627#Comment_10992627

    It was based off her outfit in Final Fight: Streetwise
    This one
    FF_Streetwise_Cammy.png

    This is how her model looked in that game, though, I like this one better
    205997_1143405278_submedium.jpg
    casually competitive I guess?
    put yang in sf5.

    Hampton Roads VA FGC info:
  • TWINBLADESTWINBLADES OFFICIALLY THE WORST PLAYER ON SRK LEAGUE: BRONZE LP: 200 Joined: Posts: 9,816
    I love the new Halloween alt.

    I find Ken the most annoying to fight.
    SFV: Cammy/Kolin (3 NEW OUTFITS THANK YOU ONO!!! SUCK IT A10METAL)/Karin
    CFN: TWINBLADES [The "i" in TWINBLADES is actually a uppercase L]
    PSN: CARBON465
  • midnight_carnivalmidnight_carnival Joined: Posts: 70
    Yes that one I'd want the red and black camo pants but it really plays to her delta red special unit past story. @cipher, and @Twinblades
  • midnight_carnivalmidnight_carnival Joined: Posts: 70
    @BMsirhc1313 Geif for me...its just not fun to me to play the way you need to play to be effective against him....I have the most fun when cammy can effectively divekick...and its really a threat...so Karin, chun, and mika...anybody that has trouble with anti-airing her are my favorite matchups. Personally I love fighting ken...hes not as neutral heavy as ryu and ken players are never as defensive as ryu players can be. So it becomes a momentum game where whoever can keep up the pressure wins...Its fun to me...I hate fighting geif..and really turtly ryu players that tech grabs and throw out a lot of cr mp to stop divekicks, and shimmy's...seriously that button is quite annoying.
  • SunTzu81SunTzu81 Joined: Posts: 579
    No one puts me on tilt more than Mika. The Gief match up is kind of boring but it's at least honest. I'm more annoyed by the players than the characters currently. It sucks going from a smart player to a scrub player and back again.
  • forest31forest31 No throw break! Joined: Posts: 803
    edited October 2016
    Turtly Guiles V Trigger me. Grapplers tend to turtle a lot at high level too. I hate being patient but it's something I need to learn. Urien's buttons have rediculous range. I think Urien might be a threat.

    What do you guys think is SFV Cammy's equivalent of SF4's s HK? What a great button it was.
    youtube.com/user/ForestTekkenVideos
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I think alex is most annoying for me. Ken can get annoying too with online tactics. Gief is boring ...much like a tag match until they get within SPD range then resets again after a knock down. Mika and karin doesn't bother me too much.
  • GreenwoodGreenwood Earth, the only true God Joined: Posts: 888
    edited October 2016
    Curious, who do you guys find the most annoying to fight against.

    Guile. Fuck Guile. Not only am I terrible against him, but he is BORING! I have so much fun holding down back and then walking a step and then blocking a Sonic Boom. If I ever hosted a tournament, I would ban anyone even looked like Guile. Blonde spiked hair? You're banned. No eyebrows? Get out.
    Injustice 2 - Wonder Woman, Joker
    Boring, stale, predictable FGs - Cammy, Kuma, whatever yawn zzzzz
  • deadxobbitdeadxobbit Joined: Posts: 51
    As a filthy scrub I can find myself in trouble against any character, so my opinion on the matchups is pretty much worthless. But one certain character always makes me say "Oh, shieeet..." as soon as I see his eyebrowless mug on the start screen.
    20_guile.jpg
    7CSAbhV.png

    ---

    By the way, I stumbled upon this old video earlier today and was curious to hear your opinions on that tech. I bet you have seen that since it was uploaded near the game's release date, but I'm not sure if I've ever seen this tech being used in real matches.



    It's pretty tricky on timing, but in my opinion it's a great way to mix up an opponent (especially those who don't have a no meter reversal) since you are safe in pretty much every scenario: Cannon Strike hits - continue pressure/start another loop; C.Strike blocked - throw/frametrap; opponent is getting ready to block the slide/C.Strike - whiff Hooligan throw and do another throw.
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Against guile if you can get within st.mk range you can literally harass him. If he's further and chucking booms you can vskill, dp or ex spiral arrow. Watch when he's in charge. If he isn't, go for dive kick.
  • TWINBLADESTWINBLADES OFFICIALLY THE WORST PLAYER ON SRK LEAGUE: BRONZE LP: 200 Joined: Posts: 9,816
    Gief

    I love this MU because it teaches me to be patient and find just the right spot to do work. I actually love the spacing and back and forth.

    Guile

    I love it because I have to actually think about what my game plan is gonna be going in. One fuck up could have Cammy back on the other end of the screen. But baiting out Flash Kicks and seeing that failed reversal when I pressure them is such a delight.

    It's frustrating but in a good way


    Sim

    Sim has always been a weird ass character and I love pushing sims buttons. I can get ahead of my self and push to hard and end up dead but it's still awesome. Plus allot of Sim's love to show off how much they can teleport till I shut that shit down.


    Nash

    By far my most favorite MU as it favors Cammy the most. Nash has so much shit that's negative on block and Cammy has the perfect buttons to counter all his misssteps.

    And when they get desperate and VT in front of me I let them have a S.HK as a gift.

    Urien

    Because aegis lmao
    SFV: Cammy/Kolin (3 NEW OUTFITS THANK YOU ONO!!! SUCK IT A10METAL)/Karin
    CFN: TWINBLADES [The "i" in TWINBLADES is actually a uppercase L]
    PSN: CARBON465
  • mobbdeepmobbdeep king of srk Joined: Posts: 424
    is walking foward and pokinglow weither it whiffs or hits to keep the opponent from walking in on you or dashing or seeing if they blocking low is a good way get counter hits or footsies.
    Beast_Mode552 capcom fight id
  • CipherCipher Catchphraser Joined: Posts: 1,866
    We talk about our favourite and least favourite MU's now?

    I like:
    Zangief
    Both stay on the ground,no jumping allowed, pokes,counterpokes,pressure. YES! YES!!!

    Juri
    Interesting Match in my opinion. Can be pretty entertaining. Oh and splitkicks

    Guile
    I started to enjoy these fights with SFV. Most Guiles changed to a different approch and this MU is no longer "just Sonic Boom it", but more a "lets see what you do and what I can do against it."

    Rashid
    Rashids can be pretty interesting to fight,once you show them,that they can't jump around the whole time.

    Karin
    It's just interesting and fun to play.

    Bison
    Because I can yell BISOOOOOOONNNNNN!!!!!!! if I lose.

    Mirror!
    Because you need ass in this MU.
    SteamId, leave a comment before adding!
    Street Fighter: Cammy, Rose
    Tekken: When's Jun? , Asuka
    Guilty Gear: Ramlethal, Jack-O

    My SFV Cammyguide!
  • SunTzu81SunTzu81 Joined: Posts: 579
    @BMsirhc1313 What is it about Alex that annoys you?
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    edited October 2016
    All of his specials (command grab, that jump grab move) and his stupid cr.mp, jab vtrigger into big damage into reset or command grab. Very gimmicky character.

    Maybe I just need more matchup experience but all Alex I play seems to just annoy me. Even if I win the match just annoys me.
  • midnight_carnivalmidnight_carnival Joined: Posts: 70
    lmao @forest31 I told you that guy could be an issue...cammy doesn't like when you can outpoke her and outdamage her....then it doesn't help that most uriens are hailmary with that invincible move right now...its not that good...but it is the only invincible move of its kind so its weird to get used to. I know he's new but experienced players don't need much time to use good pokes...abuse a solid dash..and take advantage of solid throw range. Plus he hits pretty hard. I haven't really fussed about any dlc character, but urien does seem to really annoy me at the moment. One thing I don't think is fair is that I dont think we can v-trigger arrow through his mirrors...ive gotten hit a few times for trying it.
  • midnight_carnivalmidnight_carnival Joined: Posts: 70
    I wouldn't say hes a bad matchup yet but I would say that he has some potential to annoy us or it may just be one of those geif things where you have to have a very specific gameplan...I've been playing against a pretty good/defensive urien and even when I win im not sure what Im doing right just yet.
  • midnight_carnivalmidnight_carnival Joined: Posts: 70
    @BMsirhc1313 Just dance outside of cr. mp and trust me hell elbow at somepoint...hes got the same problem as balrog where neutral jumps can blow him up.....be very patient and get that first knockdown....after that its utterly a slaughter....alex has ABSOLUTELY NO SOLID WAKE-UP option against cammy and its even worse in the corner. Hes really solid till he catches one spiral arrow combo...and remember even if he tries to counter you can thow buttons like cr. lp out safely once and not eat the counter. Honestly I think most alex players believe we are there worst matchup. lol @cipher stop making sense and complain like the rest of us.
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Ya thats usually my gameplan, stay outside of cr.mp range, fish for knock down then rape with buttons on their wake up. Thing is, when I start to focus on ground game to get the knock down, I get thrown off with his jump specials, [that head stomp move and grab], I stand there ready to anti air and get baited. After I get knocked down, its his game to command grab or press buttons. Like I said, usually I dont lose to Alex but I just find the matchup annoying.
  • GreenwoodGreenwood Earth, the only true God Joined: Posts: 888
    edited October 2016
    Cipher wrote: »
    We talk about our favourite and least favourite MU's now?
    Fortunately, I love fighting against 2 of the most popular characters. I just checked my stats on a pretty cool website: v-league.pro

    My win percentage against Ryu is 75%. (ranked)
    My win percentage against Ken is 79%. (ranked)
    I can handle Vega and Fang pretty well.

    On the other hand...

    I am straight trash against Chun, Laura, and Guile. I don't see a lot of Laura and she still confuses me a lot.
    Injustice 2 - Wonder Woman, Joker
    Boring, stale, predictable FGs - Cammy, Kuma, whatever yawn zzzzz
  • CipherCipher Catchphraser Joined: Posts: 1,866
    lol @cipher stop making sense and complain like the rest of us.

    maxresdefault.jpg


    SteamId, leave a comment before adding!
    Street Fighter: Cammy, Rose
    Tekken: When's Jun? , Asuka
    Guilty Gear: Ramlethal, Jack-O

    My SFV Cammyguide!
  • TWINBLADESTWINBLADES OFFICIALLY THE WORST PLAYER ON SRK LEAGUE: BRONZE LP: 200 Joined: Posts: 9,816
    Guile used to be hard as shit till I realized I'm Cammy and I don't have to care about what he does. I stay grounded and SK past the booms and pressure with C.MK.

    Rushing Guile down is fun

    Although getting hit by his F.HP is a bitch
    SFV: Cammy/Kolin (3 NEW OUTFITS THANK YOU ONO!!! SUCK IT A10METAL)/Karin
    CFN: TWINBLADES [The "i" in TWINBLADES is actually a uppercase L]
    PSN: CARBON465
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I love Cammys cr.hp

  • Sanada-kunSanada-kun Joined: Posts: 716
    I don't care for the Halloween costumes. That mod costume is still the best one I have seen. All I really want in a costume is that it makes sense for the character.

    MU wise Chun is probably the match I hate the most. Mostly because of her stHp. I don't really have a problem with this match but because of that I find her annoying sometimes
  • deadxobbitdeadxobbit Joined: Posts: 51
    @BMsirhc1313 Wow, looks like that charged dropkick has helluva long startup since you could completely whiff c.HP and catch her with CA.
  • mobbdeepmobbdeep king of srk Joined: Posts: 424
    anybody uses safe jumps is that still viable.
    Beast_Mode552 capcom fight id
  • HaztlanHaztlan Joined: Posts: 1,159
    edited October 2016
    Of course. Pretty much everytime I get a jab TC midscreen I go for LK SA into jiLK.
    a= ​Δt / ​Δv
  • GreenwoodGreenwood Earth, the only true God Joined: Posts: 888
    I think Cammy's halloween costume is the best thing since sliced bread. Big fan of Necalli's too.

    Injustice 2 - Wonder Woman, Joker
    Boring, stale, predictable FGs - Cammy, Kuma, whatever yawn zzzzz
  • forest31forest31 No throw break! Joined: Posts: 803
    Against guile if you can get within st.mk range you can literally harass him. If he's further and chucking booms you can vskill, dp or ex spiral arrow. Watch when he's in charge. If he isn't, go for dive kick.

    No, v skill will get blocked or hit depending on if he did his v skill. Even if you v skill before he sonic booms he recovers in time to block or flash kick. EX SA is a waste of meter. He just back techs and he's out again. 60 points is the same as a s MK. s MK loses to a projectile of course. You need to be close to use s MK. A very hard mu.


    I was thinking I would see at what range I could do a regular divekick, get it blocked, then do s LK, grab. s LK, grab is a great Cammy option. But I found myself getting beat out by 3f jab almost the whole time, trading only rarely when using c LP! If Mika gets a counter jab, she gets huge damage, even without spending meter, and most if not all 3f jab characters can get big combos too. A great strat VS Cammy. I know there must be lurkers reading this who want VS Cammy strats!

    I agree, deadxhobbit, you are a filthy scrub because you gave me bad advice. f+HK, c MP, DP has gotten way harder for me thanks to you. db+MP,d,df,d,df+HK is the right way!
    youtube.com/user/ForestTekkenVideos
  • BMsirhc1313BMsirhc1313 I'm 0ld Joined: Posts: 1,395 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I need to fight against better Guiles lol.
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