Rising Thunder - FIGHTING ROBOTS

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  • truendymiontruendymion Beer Me! Joined: Posts: 2,265
    edited August 2015
    tataki wrote: »
    I don't understand why they added more recovery frames to Edge's S1v1 but left the slide and overhead untouched...

    So that you'll learn to play against them instead of wishing to patch your problems away.

    I think you missed the point of my question. I'm trying to understand the logic of nerfing that particular move while leaving everything that people complain about untouched. Or were people complaining about S1 and I wasn't aware?

    BTW I've already learned to deal with the run into safe 50/50. I just hold up whenever I'm not in DP range since its pointless to try and block that move.
    N_paul wrote: »
    Another question:
    How do you break armor in this fucking game?

    Armor absorbs one hit, after that point you just need to hit them before they hit you like normal. (you can't "break" armor)
    Grabs break armor.
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  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
    edited August 2015
    I think you missed the point of my question. I'm trying to understand the logic of nerfing that particular move while leaving everything that people complain about untouched. Or were people complaining about S1 and I wasn't aware?

    I think the devs saw something we didn't. Consider that S1.1 was already insanely useful. Erases fireballs while charging the S2, cancels from the OH special, and on top of that +1 on block, allowing him to convert from a run to pressure. The combination of all of these together was probably too much, so they wanted to remove this aspect while keeping the run stuff intact since it's a vital part of the character.
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  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
  • owattjacobowattjacob Joined: Posts: 3,340
    edited August 2015
    tataki wrote: »

    kvH9Ag8.png?1

    I'm going in raw

    Edit:

    *installed annnd downloaded 10 mins after post*

    Any good tutorial up for Dauntless? Going to be doing some digging on her bnbs after getting a good overview on her.
    mowr wrote: »
    I love the concept behind this game.

    The robot thing is kind of turning me off though. Why did they go for robots if they want this to be a MOBA format game? Doesn't that just severely limit the kind of designs they can go for?

    You can build all kinds of (fantasy) robots though. Ones that represent any kind of animal/imaginary beast or any kind of vehicle and of course the humanoid looking ones that they're already doing. Yeah it will all still be "robots", but really for the most part that's just anything you can think of... except with a metal body.
    It really just depends on how far they want to go with it, because once you get into these other character types and attributes you drastically affect how space control will be in the game.

    They could always add non robot skins as DLC.
    Post edited by owattjacob on
  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,603
    I'm gonna give this game a couple of points here:

    I'm really learning how fighting game psychology works and how to condition people and how to read people.
    Being able to one hundred percent focus on the game itself and the "conversation" between two players, gives me a lot more insight on how to keep calm and hit-confirm combos and how to setup traps.
    I feel like that is a part of fighting games that almost completely went over my head in SF4, since my execution was so bad that I was thinking more about how I get my character to do something, than engaging in mindgames and actual gameplay.
    I still feel the execution part is too watered down but this is still a good game at its core and gets me even more hyped for SFV.

    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.
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  • MuttonmanMuttonman Joined: Posts: 2,877
    edited August 2015
    Okay, this patch was pretty awesome. The DP nerf means that you can't just slam on the button when you're knocked down and it doesn't result in free pressure on KADC. Talos is starting to feel like a complete character with the awesome armored command grab making him no longer free to jabs.
    I'm gonna give this game a couple of points here:

    I'm really learning how fighting game psychology works and how to condition people and how to read people.
    Being able to one hundred percent focus on the game itself and the "conversation" between two players, gives me a lot more insight on how to keep calm and hit-confirm combos and how to setup traps.
    I feel like that is a part of fighting games that almost completely went over my head in SF4, since my execution was so bad that I was thinking more about how I get my character to do something, than engaging in mindgames and actual gameplay.
    I still feel the execution part is too watered down but this is still a good game at its core and gets me even more hyped for SFV.

    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    I can only see her using S3.1 if you absolutely need it to punish something in a matchup (maybe spaced Talos kick?). As for S2.1, it does give you a full combo on close hit, but that lower cooldown on S2.2 is so very nice, and if you do get the combo off of S2.1 on an air hit then the cooldown doesn't really matter.

    The Edge nerfs are pretty nasty though; you can only combo out of his Run Overhead (other than a Super cancel) on a KADC, and only then into cl.L followed by either S1.1 or S2.
  • AceKombatAceKombat (́◕◞౪◟◕‵) ”WINNERS DON’T USE ALMIGHTY.” Joined: Posts: 2,108
    New patch: http://risingthunder.com/2015/08/11/patch-notes-build-1263/

    Talos is very legit now in the new patch.

    Edge fell of the edge of the bridge.
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  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    But what if I like comboing into super without kinetic meter? Both S2.1 and S3.1 can do that.
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  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,603
    edited August 2015
    tataki wrote: »
    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    But what if I like comboing into super without kinetic meter? Both S2.1 and S3.1 can do that.

    Your offense as Chel isn't your strong point anyways. You got 0 overheads, so in theory, people just blocking you are gonna fuck you up.
    So by going Tatsu 1 you basically take away your own low/high mixup and people have to worry less about your low attacks.

    Why not build on her strengths instead of her weaknesses? Aside from that you can still combo from cr.medium>fireballxxSuper from jump-ins and/or st.medium/forward heavy without any meter.
    So you already have a high/low super mixup.
    Edit: Just figured out you can also combo from grab into super with a bar. Gonna be beasting even more now :D

    Lower cd uppercut is too good to pass up imo.
    With that configuration you strengthen both your lame game and your mixup game at the expense of damage that you won't get so often against people that know your character.
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  • MuttonmanMuttonman Joined: Posts: 2,877
    tataki wrote: »
    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    But what if I like comboing into super without kinetic meter? Both S2.1 and S3.1 can do that.

    Your offense as Chel isn't your strong point anyways. You got 0 overheads, so in theory, people just blocking you are gonna fuck you up.
    So by going Tatsu 1 you basically take away your own low/high mixup and people have to worry less about your low attacks.

    Why not build on her strengths instead of her weaknesses? Aside from that you can still combo from cr.medium>fireballxxSuper from jump-ins and/or st.medium/forward heavy without any meter.
    So you already have a high/low super mixup.
    Edit: Just figured out you can also combo from grab into super with a bar. Gonna be beasting even more now :D

    Lower cd uppercut is too good to pass up imo.
    With that configuration you strengthen both your lame game and your mixup game at the expense of damage that you won't get so often against people that know your character.

    Eh, if you don't have an overhead there's not much point to being scary with lows; your offense is pure frametraps. So really, what S3.2 gives you is a way to do damage off your jabs from further away than your DP reaches.
  • AceKombatAceKombat (́◕◞౪◟◕‵) ”WINNERS DON’T USE ALMIGHTY.” Joined: Posts: 2,108
    edited August 2015
    tataki wrote: »
    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    But what if I like comboing into super without kinetic meter? Both S2.1 and S3.1 can do that.

    Your offense as Chel isn't your strong point anyways. You got 0 overheads, so in theory, people just blocking you are gonna fuck you up.
    So by going Tatsu 1 you basically take away your own low/high mixup and people have to worry less about your low attacks.

    In a way, that's why some Chel's throw a lot, due to the fact blocking is really good against her.

    Some thing people may not know is that, technically, she has a reason to make people stand blocking while in the ground. Since throws can (assuming) only be teched while standing, at some points people will attempt to stand. Crouch throw normally works only if you pressed it before opponent's throw becomes active.

    There's also p-linking Normal ~ Throw so people will stand for that as well. Visually it's not a high/low game, but more of a low/throw game where the throw can account as a high oddly enough...
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  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,603
    Muttonman wrote: »
    tataki wrote: »
    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    But what if I like comboing into super without kinetic meter? Both S2.1 and S3.1 can do that.

    Your offense as Chel isn't your strong point anyways. You got 0 overheads, so in theory, people just blocking you are gonna fuck you up.
    So by going Tatsu 1 you basically take away your own low/high mixup and people have to worry less about your low attacks.

    Why not build on her strengths instead of her weaknesses? Aside from that you can still combo from cr.medium>fireballxxSuper from jump-ins and/or st.medium/forward heavy without any meter.
    So you already have a high/low super mixup.
    Edit: Just figured out you can also combo from grab into super with a bar. Gonna be beasting even more now :D

    Lower cd uppercut is too good to pass up imo.
    With that configuration you strengthen both your lame game and your mixup game at the expense of damage that you won't get so often against people that know your character.

    Eh, if you don't have an overhead there's not much point to being scary with lows; your offense is pure frametraps. So really, what S3.2 gives you is a way to do damage off your jabs from further away than your DP reaches.

    The dealbreaker for me with S3.1 is that it misses on crouching opponents while S3.2 hits unless you're really far away.
    S3.2 also pushes the opponent a good deal giving you nice positioning.
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  • MuttonmanMuttonman Joined: Posts: 2,877
    Muttonman wrote: »
    tataki wrote: »
    Btw. to all Chel players: S2/2 and S3/2 is the way to go. S3/2 connects on crouching opponents and can be cancelled from crouching lights. The pressure you can build with it is amazing.

    But what if I like comboing into super without kinetic meter? Both S2.1 and S3.1 can do that.

    Your offense as Chel isn't your strong point anyways. You got 0 overheads, so in theory, people just blocking you are gonna fuck you up.
    So by going Tatsu 1 you basically take away your own low/high mixup and people have to worry less about your low attacks.

    Why not build on her strengths instead of her weaknesses? Aside from that you can still combo from cr.medium>fireballxxSuper from jump-ins and/or st.medium/forward heavy without any meter.
    So you already have a high/low super mixup.
    Edit: Just figured out you can also combo from grab into super with a bar. Gonna be beasting even more now :D

    Lower cd uppercut is too good to pass up imo.
    With that configuration you strengthen both your lame game and your mixup game at the expense of damage that you won't get so often against people that know your character.

    Eh, if you don't have an overhead there's not much point to being scary with lows; your offense is pure frametraps. So really, what S3.2 gives you is a way to do damage off your jabs from further away than your DP reaches.

    The dealbreaker for me with S3.1 is that it misses on crouching opponents while S3.2 hits unless you're really far away.
    S3.2 also pushes the opponent a good deal giving you nice positioning.

    Oh, don't get me wrong, I prefer S3.2 when I play her. But if you can confirm on a standing opponent then S3.1 lets you do a left/right mixup or return to zoning while S3.2 generally makes you go back to her zoning game
  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
    The dealbreaker for me with S3.1 is that it misses on crouching opponents while S3.2 hits unless you're really far away.

    I've had it go above the opponent because the 2 middle hits are the same. So you do the final hit to the other side and it's still as punishable as S3.1
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  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,603
    First hit stands them up (I think). I never had a S3.2 go over when the first hit connected. Getting the first to connect is spacing dependent though.
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  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,124 mod
    I'll vouch for S3.2 as well, especially since it's safer than 3.1 on block.

    That said S2.2 with S3.1 (FChamp's build) isn't a bad loadout either.
  • KowtowRobinsonKowtowRobinson TEBOW! TEBOW! TEBOW! Joined: Posts: 6,440
    So I read the patch notes, looks like they still think DP>KA is ok if they just shuffle some frame data around a little.

    I'm really, REALLY curious why someone who's been around as long as Seth has thinks that cancelling your unsafe reversals on block is ok to have in a game, regardless of frames.
  • Mangy_CatMangy_Cat Joined: Posts: 602
    Please make a PS3 release for this. Would also want a disc version as well.
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  • xiceman191xiceman191 Joined: Posts: 1,525
    The game is alright but I wish that throws were two attack buttons. I've been practicing and focusing on 6 buttons that I forget about the other two buttons of my stick..
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  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,124 mod
    edited August 2015
    The way KAs are handled in this game do remind me of what the old alpha builds of SFIV were supposed to be like, at least based on EGM's old writeup. For those who didn't read that old article, the way they described it there was that, instead of using focus to cancel, you could simply dash cancel out of EX attacks.
    sfiv007ev9.jpg
    I wonder if Seth is trying to replicate that somewhat with this.

    Also, to give credit where it's due, the game does address SFIV's other big issue - hard knockdown for days - by making you able to quick stand and back roll out of almost anything (throws and super seem to be the exceptions, with the former still allowing quickstand). That, plus the game doesn't have a universal anti-footsie tool (focus). Some matches probably feel SFIV-ish due to players not taking advantage of these, but things will likely change as soon as more players start learning to use these better.
  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU When's Dragon Ball? Joined: Posts: 10,997
    Side question - would SF4 be better if you could dash out of EX attacks instead of spending 2 Super gauge bars to FADC and extend the combo?
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  • truendymiontruendymion Beer Me! Joined: Posts: 2,265
    edited August 2015
    Hmm should they add some SFAlpha-style air blocking and a proper alpha counter?

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  • SkieghSkiegh I am Ryudo Unit 2R Joined: Posts: 436
    It does solve the hard-knock-life issue, yes. However, the more and more I play, the more and more I'm thinking "This is SFIV." It's not going away, only growing stronger. It's actually, in it's own way, even harder for me than SFIV, because I have so few buttons to work with. I can't make creative use of priority and come out on top, I have to play within this very limited spectrum of normals, which sometimes (and often times), don't cover the areas I need to cover. The same sort of abject feeling I had when playing SFIV is very prevalent in this game. It's sort of a 3S player's woe : I know what he's going to do, I know exactly what normal he is going to do, and I know what he'll cancel into... but I can't do anything about it. In SFIV, I had to grasp at straws and master an absolutely tedious amount of priority and counter poke knowledge and stop things before they started, which is an utterly ridiculous expectation every single time. Here, I am even more limited in options.

    I think I'm just getting really sick of games being so scared to add mechanics. Specifically defensive mechanics. It doesn't have to be some game changing mechanic, I just want my proper defense to yield me some sort of reward, yet the games releasing now adays just seem to really be hammering it in that doing a random special is a better defensive option than blocking pressure successfully for 10 seconds, finding their pattern and the proper hole and getting out the proper way. I did the same thing in SFIV, and it blew people's minds how patient I was on the defense in that game (because no else was), but the reward was non-existent. At best I would return to neutral having dealt zero damage, or evened out the chip damage I probably took during the pressure. Maybe I would have made them spend most of their meter doing their "read" uppercut, which they "coincidentally" canceled instinctively despite thinking it was a "read."

    I want to point out that my defense is only good against pressure, I don't claim to be a god-tier footsie player, I am most certainly not. I do well with my back to the wall. I actually feel more comfortable in the corner in most games than at neutral. Unless it's against Necro/Ken in 3S... then not so much.

    I dunno man, yatagarasu I felt was too similar to 3S, and this game feels too similar to SFIV. Both will probably become different from their obvious inspirations, but they are both too similar right now in base design for me. I hope Rising continues to push itself further and further away. Give me something to spend my meter on that isn't an FADC -- I don't even cancel my uppercuts, fuck that shit! Puuuunish me! I improperly read the situation, punish me 100% stun style!

    I also gotta say, haha -- the one button thing is really more a detriment to me than to most. I have pretty piss poor reaction times, I am a very anticipatory player. I'll be buffering what I need, for when I need it. Not having to do that here makes that ability very minuscule in worth. I don't even whiff punish by reaction, I just think "He's going to do a c.MK, so I'll back up a couple pixels, pause for for blah-blah frames, then do a c.MK to counterpoke" and I just do it, I don't react to it coming out, I just do it beforehand and play it out. My reaction times are piss poor for a fighting game player, haha. Still, I get by somehow, and can somehow hit-confirm moderately well.

  • SharntSharnt Joined: Posts: 354
    edited August 2015
    Yeah and Chel walking speed is making me insane, can't play a whiff punish game whatever I would like to do.

    Feel like playing a SF4 low tier.
  • TMNTempsTMNTemps brozhear Joined: Posts: 4,235
    after playing this game for a couple hundred matches ... it's pretty legit. amazing that an alpha is this playable. everyone in the cast is pretty weird and interesting in their own right, except for Chel, and she'll probably get there

    gotta say though, not being able to see the other guy's meters. I hope that experiment ends pretty soon. doesn't add any depth like I thought it would. specials on cooldown I think does some interesting things to the meta but not being able to see those cooldowns ?ehhhhhhh
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  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,603
    Chel is the best at making other players hate their life though.
    I love it.
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  • Velcro SnakeVelcro Snake Joined: Posts: 2
    xiceman191 wrote: »
    The game is alright but I wish that throws were two attack buttons. I've been practicing and focusing on 6 buttons that I forget about the other two buttons of my stick..

    I set it up this way with JoyToKey since I only had a 6-button stick, but after too many times of missing the Light+Medium input for Throw or accidentally activating Overdrive with Medium+Heavy when trying to combo, I decided to buy an 8-button stick.
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art I Joined: Posts: 26,812
    I got a few hours in of this and I'm not sure if I'm going to stick with it. A lot of things I don't like from SF4 on present here like jabs converting to big combos, the set play with knockdowns, FADC-style move to keep things safe. It's better paced than SF4 and the quick-rise as it is now is helping with knockdowns. I'm not feeling the cooldowns. That shit messed me up more than I would like.
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  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,703
    I got a few hours in of this and I'm not sure if I'm going to stick with it. A lot of things I don't like from SF4 on present here like jabs converting to big combos, the set play with knockdowns,
    Please elaborate. What big combo can you do from jabs? What "setplay" beats quick rise and DP?
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  • TSTS pbbbbbbt... Joined: Posts: 4,308 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Chel, Edge and Dauntless all have hit confirm combos off of light attacks, and these are safe on block of course. Chel and Edge especially can do pretty good damage. Kinetic Deflect/combo breaker/burst helps fight this somewhat, but it's a pretty considerable advantage to have. They also retain the option to throw and then cancel it with Kinetic Advance/FADC/roman cancel and combo afterward, and Edge can even link out of his overheads into combos.
  • MuttonmanMuttonman Joined: Posts: 2,877
    So does Talos. L xx Spartan Rush xx Super does a lot of damage
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art I Joined: Posts: 26,812
    tataki wrote: »
    I got a few hours in of this and I'm not sure if I'm going to stick with it. A lot of things I don't like from SF4 on present here like jabs converting to big combos, the set play with knockdowns,
    Please elaborate. What big combo can you do from jabs? What "setplay" beats quick rise and DP?

    I did say that quick rise helps with knockdowns. I play Talos so DP isn't gonna help me.

    Like TS said, Edge, Chel and Daughtless are the biggest culprits when it comes to converting jabs into big combos. Daughtless can go for days when she uses KA and links into super.

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  • truendymiontruendymion Beer Me! Joined: Posts: 2,265
    tataki wrote: »
    I got a few hours in of this and I'm not sure if I'm going to stick with it. A lot of things I don't like from SF4 on present here like jabs converting to big combos, the set play with knockdowns,
    Please elaborate. What big combo can you do from jabs? What "setplay" beats quick rise and DP?

    I did say that quick rise helps with knockdowns. I play Talos so DP isn't gonna help me.

    Like TS said, Edge, Chel and Daughtless are the biggest culprits when it comes to converting jabs into big combos. Daughtless can go for days when she uses KA and links into super.

    Talos doesn't need a DP with that new godlike throw variant.
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  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,603
    Might as well call it a dp. Serves the same purpose.
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  • BlizzKrutBlizzKrut Joined: Posts: 51
    So, while I wait for my real first fighting game, Street Figher V, I've been having a lot of fun with Rising Thunder since the alpha release, I'm Master IV/V (it's been floating up and down a bit) and I only play Talos, since I started, though I'd like to learn Crow.

    I think the game is really good to teach new players certain concepts like spacing, mind-games and whatnot, I'd love to see this game get big, but with time we'll see, really enjoying it, if you ever want to fight me, just tell me something since now we can have player lobbies.
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  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,124 mod
  • RampageRampage Lurkin' Joined: Posts: 4,999
    edited September 2015
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  • truendymiontruendymion Beer Me! Joined: Posts: 2,265
    I like the latest patch nerfing damage after invincible move xx KA. I feel it still doesn't go far enough. I want them to just remove the ability to KA on block, make it on hit only. But for some reason they are really reluctant to do it.
    I'm making a fighting game!
    SRK thread - Discord server.
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