Fantasy Strike - easy to execute fighting game

Remy77077Remy77077 futility fightingJoined: Posts: 320
edited November 2016 in Fighting Game Discussion
Nov 2016:

This is now publicly announced and shown:
SRK news post: http://shoryuken.com/2016/11/14/fantasy-strike-is-coming-to-playstation-4-and-is-playable-at-the-playstation-experience/
Official website: http://www.fantasystrike.com/


^ Their official site will have much more up to date news and information than this original post which I'll leave below to make sense of this discussion thread :-)




I thought I'd start this thread as this game seems to be a bit under the radar for many people at this point and I think it's well worth knowing about. I hope that's cool in this bit of the forum.

http://www.sirlin.net/fantasystrike
Sep 2015 - ^ This page has just been posted with some basic information about the game (most of which I've repeated here though!)

Full disclosure: I became a patreon backer of the devs because I really liked the sound of this game, that's also how I've been able to play on super-early pre-Alpha builds.

I thought it would be great for more people to know about this game even though it's really early :-)


It's only started development recently in mid-2015 so it's incredibly early days yet so a lot of things might change over time. It's intended to be a 'simple to execute' fighting game. So it only uses simple button or double-button presses plus directional inputs to do all of the moves. Note that graphics are all placeholders and unfinished so I'm not allowed to post any screens or videos until more of that gets finished as obviously it doesn't look like much at all at the moment! (it's better than the stickmen I was expecting tho, haha). Here's the characters though:

yomi___a_fighting_card_game_by_vostalgic-d7nio8l.jpg

Immediately you can compare it to Rising Thunder or Divekick in the general design space of making something easier to play than most fighting games, but still difficult to master.

Like everything else the control scheme is subject to change but currently has just 6 buttons so it's incredibly nice to play on keyboard, joystick or any kind of controller you want to use:

Left
Right
Jump
Attack
Special 1
Special 2

Pressing away from your opponent blocks. There's no dashing or crouching or up/down even.
Most buttons are modified by pressing Left or Right, so Jump changes from a neutral jump to an away/towards jump, Attack becomes a different 'side' attack when a direction is held too, and the effects of the Special buttons maybe modified depending on the character if a direction is held vs neutral Special.

Attack and Specials can also be performed mid-jump of course and this changes their effect from their ground versions.
Currently some moves can be 'charged' by holding and releasing a button too.
Throws are just a direction and Attack button when close (like SF2).

There's a super meter which is gained by hitting your opponent with attacks whether they are blocked or actually land damage.
Super's are executed by pressing Attack+Special together and like other moves have different effects in the air or on the ground.


Playing it currently feels a LOT like Street Fighter 2, with an even easier control scheme, but still all the emphasis on pokes, zoning and mindgames. There's currently only two characters built though so it's hard to tell how this might change as more different styles of play come into the game, but I really enjoy it even with just two characters already. Even with the simple moveset you can do some pretty diverse stuff, as the special moves are really well designed. For example one of the characters, Grave, has an air-hurricane kick style move as his air Special 1. Like in ST, this will follow the arc of the jump depending on when and where it's pressed in the momentum of a jump so there's a huge array of movement and attacking options, especially when he can also do his air attack which is a kind of Divekick-style divekick.

Fighting game skills really shine already. When I was playing against a much less experienced friend, and I was immediately winning the majority of matches due to the fact I had an edge with blocking, zoning, meter management, spacing, timing, combos, yomi etc. from my experience at other fighting games. But the important thing my friend liked was that he could immediately actually do all the moves! He commented when he was getting frustrated losing it was more with himself, rather than feeling like he was losing because he couldn’t get out a dragon punch or an Ultra or whatever which he feels a lot when he tries to play SF4 for example.

Combos are definitely possible and are actually really easy not long jabby-jab type of things found in most FGs these days - they really feel more like SF2, so Jump Attack, ground Attack, ground Special 1 is a combo that's possible, however you need to land the jump attack deep enough to be able to combo into the ground attack, much like in many SF2 combos.

The health bar is currently actually 6 Hit Points. So rounds can go really fast - that 3 hit combo above is actually 50% of your health... but honestly it's surprisingly impractical to even land that vs a good opponent. Some supers can do 2 hits of damage if they fully connect. Tick damage is handled by your current HP of health beginning to flash if you block moves a lot in a short space of time, and if you continue to block you will be hit anyway and lose that HP. If you don't block moves for a while, the HP will bar will return to normal.



It definitely won't be a game for everyone, especially if you really like all the complex inputs and combos of modern fighting games, but I think this will appeal to people who:

1. Enjoy Divekick but want something that feels a bit more like a "normal" fighting game. This has health and fireballs, and blocking, throwing and all of that stuff, on top of a control scheme that is not that much more complex than Divekick. Oh it also still has divekicks though! :D

2. Like the idea of Rising Thunder but maybe some of it's features aren't to their taste, like the robot character designs, the cooldowns on specials, the online-only play, the 8-button layout which isn't friendly to 6 button joysticks, forced grind (? probably?) to access loadout options, or it's lengthy combo strings that require a lot of memorisation or 1P training mode time to learn what's best to do.

3. Would like to get into fighting games but want something really accessible to them and are put off by the amount of "uncontested" skills you need to practice first before you can really feel like you're playing the real game, like motion commands and long combo strings. Fantasy Strike just seems like it will be so much fun to learn for newbies since you can literally just "learn-by-playing" almost everything in the game.

4. Folks like me that love SF2 and are missing a fighting game that really focuses on the fundamentals I find much more fun than the hit-confirm long combo strings emphasis of almost all modern fighting games. (I got some hopes for SFV though too!)


I believe it will be following a similar sales model to Rising Thunder eventually with online play and be free-to-play, but I also know that no grinding will be required at all to unlock options.
The designer's other online board games actually have amazing matchmaking and ranking & leaderboard systems so I fully expect that to be done really well here eventually too.


Extra information (links):
A New Era of Fighting Games article about it from the designer
Posts on my website related to Fantasy Strike


TL;DR - this game feels a bit like Divekick and SF2 had a baby - if that sounds like your kinda thing, then this is definitely worth keeping an eye on!
Post edited by Remy77077 on
http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
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Comments

  • luckyjimluckyjim Joined: Posts: 116
    An actual fighting game from Sirlin definitely has my interest, but too early along in development at this point for me to think much about it :) The control scheme sounds a bit weird, but at least it's not 8 buttons like Rising Thunder. I hope it will still play well on a joystick, even though it may be designed for people who would use a keyboard or gamepad, I'm sure there will still be a lot of fighting game folks who would want to try it out.
  • XthAtGAm3RGuYXXthAtGAm3RGuYX SRK's ResidentSleeper Joined: Posts: 11,221
    The art quality of the characters is good, but the character design kinda sucks. Mainly because there doesnt seem to be an overlying theme. It's just like, "this character seems cool throw em in the roster".

    Also that tan little robot dude in the bottom left corner? Redesign him before Capcom slams a Cease and Desist up your ass for looking too much like Phobos/Huitzil from Darkstalkers
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  • crotchpunchacrotchpuncha Joined: Posts: 19,641
    The art quality of the characters is good, but the character design kinda sucks. Mainly because there doesnt seem to be an overlying theme. It's just like, "this character seems cool throw em in the roster".

    Also that tan little robot dude in the bottom left corner? Redesign him before Capcom slams a Cease and Desist up your ass for looking too much like Phobos/Huitzil from Darkstalkers
    That's cuz Fantasy Strike is set in a fictional universe and the fighters come from around the world, street fighter style. These guys are fromm all kinds of locations, hence the lack of a regional theme.

    Fun card game, hope the fighter is good to.
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  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    luckyjim wrote: »
    An actual fighting game from Sirlin definitely has my interest, but too early along in development at this point for me to think much about it :) The control scheme sounds a bit weird, but at least it's not 8 buttons like Rising Thunder. I hope it will still play well on a joystick, even though it may be designed for people who would use a keyboard or gamepad, I'm sure there will still be a lot of fighting game folks who would want to try it out.

    Don't worry, I've only ever played it on a joystick and it plays great for me on that. Already supports any sticks and pads that run on Windows and Mac.

    The latest news is that a new button is being added, a 2nd special that for some characters will act like some kind of Dodge/Counterhit mechanic - I'll update when I know more and get to try it out :smile:
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    edited August 2015
    Also yeah, after the whole Data East Fighters History thing, I can't see any legal issues from Capcom. These characters have been around for years already from Sirlin's other games too.

    ...Plus Phobos was a blatant reference to the robot from Laputa in the first place anyway... Bal-Bas-Beta is definitely a reference to that, and Phobos, and also Bal Bas Bow from Virtual On.

    EDIT: Also, the actual in-game graphics are 3D.

    Oh and yeah, this is "kind of" publicly playable already if you want to back the Patreon.
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • LeontesLeontes Joined: Posts: 1
    Remy77077 wrote: »
    TL;DR - this game feels a bit like Divekick and SF2 had a baby - if that sounds like your kinda thing, then this is definitely worth keeping an eye on!

    It most definitely does! And for those asking how it feels on a stick; it is designed to be very playable on keyboard. Not having up/down as positionals makes it very comfortable to play using like, AD and JKL or something. But I still love playing it on a stick and probably always will.
  • JohnGrimmJohnGrimm A.K.A. JohnXuandou Joined: Posts: 4,255
    edited August 2015
    As someone who plays fighting games on keyboard, I wish people would stop saying these new easy games are designed to be played on keyboard.
    You lack devotion! Enduring hunger and poverty is how you find the way!
  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    Quite a lot of updates in the latest build of Fantasy Strike.

    The biggest thing is that there is now an extra button, a new special move, so you've got Special 1 and Special 2. As before they both have different effects when done with a direction pressed vs neutral when grounded, or a different effect when in the air.

    The Special 2 moves so far seem to be pretty crazy fun moves! One character has a KOF style dodge (can't be hit, but can be thrown) into a counter attack and a "Control the Wind" move which has a similar effect to Rachel Alucard's Silpheed Drive move from Blazblue, including a timer to add an extra limit on the use of it. Another character gets a dragon punch move - which, as it doesn't require meter, is extremely powerful - but she actually takes a hit of health to use it, so she can at BEST trade for damage with it. It's still a really useful tool though for positioning and lock downs, and when you have a life lead - and when she's on her last HP of health she can do it essentially for free as it won't kill her, so it has a built in comeback "last ditch move" style mechanic to it too currently.

    Characters have 6HP now, and another major change is that there is now an interesting implementation of tick damage. If you block a move a few times your HP bar will start to flash and then you will actually take a hit if you continually block. If you don't block an attack for a while though your HP bar will return to normal.

    I'll update the first post with the latest info too so as to not mislead anyone coming across this... there's a new page with some of this basic info about the game too, along with a link if anyone wants to support it with funding:
    http://www.sirlin.net/fantasystrike
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 21,400
    I think that i am gonna throw some money at sirlin to get access to the alpha/beta.
    I like the card game and i have been always interested on seeing how would translate into a fg.
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  • crotchpunchacrotchpuncha Joined: Posts: 19,641
    edited September 2015
    Eww guard break.
    It's not the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 21,400
    Ehh, i think that every mechanic should be judged between the context of each game and not based only on the poor implementations by capcom other developers.
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  • crotchpunchacrotchpuncha Joined: Posts: 19,641
    I agree, and I'm not saying it will be bad here, I just don't really like that mechanic on principle that's all. It can be used well (But not usually) but it always feels like a fluff mechanic to me. Best guard break mechanic has always been, imo, throws. That's what they where implemented for in the first place, and I have yet to see a mechanic that works better for the job. Just wish they would stop fucking over throws so much.

    Not gonna write the game off because it might have guard breaks or anything, Garou is one of my favorite fighters and it has them, it's just not a mechanic I particularly like that's all.
    It's not the end of the world, but you can see it from here.
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 21,400
    I always liked when a game has a wide array of characters that benefit from the universal mechanics on different ways, for example, you have characters with good throw range but they usually don't benefit from the guard breaks the same way than other chars with less throw range but better way to keep pressure in order to net a guard break.
    ( •_•) IT'S NOT RAPE,
    ( •_•)>⌐■-■
    IT'S SURPRISE SEX! (⌐■_■)
    YEAAAAAAAAAAHHH!!
    "Orgasm is a simile for the emotional epiphany a woman has when the shame of penetration is eclipsed by the inherent virtue of servicing a man." ~ Kromo.
    ( •_•)
    ( ಠ_ಠ)
    ( ಥ_ಥ)
  • JohnGrimmJohnGrimm A.K.A. JohnXuandou Joined: Posts: 4,255
    Guard break isn't a substitution to throws, it's an addendum. Not every character is designed with tick throws or command throws in mind and throwing isn't in their main game plan. Sure, those characters can still throw if they choose to, but maybe some characters would rather bully you with pressure and force you into that situation instead. Some characters don't have the strong normals or good offensive pressure to go for guard breaks, but they have great tick throw setups and great throws to put the fear of being thrown into you and try to get you to make mistakes. One doesn't replace the other, it's just a different means of designing and balancing characters.
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  • MuttonmanMuttonman Joined: Posts: 2,741
    Got any videos before I throw more money at Sirlin?
  • PSYCH0J0SHPSYCH0J0SH Joined: Posts: 4,653
    I always wondered how a tabletop fighting game would work. Overall the idea of Yomi just didn't appeal to me.

    I'm very intrigued to see this finally get adapted to an actual fighting game.
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  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    Guys - just to be clear there's no guard break in Fantasy Strike. Sorry if I made it sound like there was - but it doesn't work like that at all in this game, it's just a replacement for "normal" tick damage since your life bar goes down in discreet HP chunks (you can see them on the bar currently even), and you can't lose part of a chunk.

    It was mainly added to make keep-away zoning more of a viable gameplan. Forces the opponent to actually work to avoid fireballs rather than just sit there and block all day. It's more like, block 5 fireballs and you take a full HP worth of tick damage. It's not like it opens you up to be combo'd or anything.

    No videos allowed still Muttonman I'm afraid as the graphics are still really rough & posting screens and videos isn't permitted until it's got a lot more polish - but it's been steadily improving particularly the animations each build that comes out.

    The new release now has a grappler character. 2 damage throws, gains super meter while blocking, 3 damage super and has 8 HP.
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • keo-baskeo-bas Joined: Posts: 1,928
    this really difficult to follow. maybe i need visual demonstration
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  • luckyjimluckyjim Joined: Posts: 116
    Remy77077 wrote: »

    Characters have 6HP now, and another major change is that there is now an interesting implementation of tick damage. If you block a move a few times your HP bar will start to flash and then you will actually take a hit if you continually block. If you don't block an attack for a while though your HP bar will return to normal.

    http://www.sirlin.net/fantasystrike

    That's the same system already in Pocket Rumble, and from what I've played of that game it works quite well so far, especially for a game with a set amount of health points like Fantasy Strike and Pocket Rumble both seem to have.


  • doctorfedoradoctorfedora Northern Kyoto boonies Joined: Posts: 22
    edited September 2015
    Yeah, the chip damage system works very well (and again, it definitely isn't guard break) for a limited-discrete-HP fighter. Also you guys Rook is so fuuuuuuuuuun

    Basically, the way chip damage works is:

    • First of all, everyone gets a set number of discrete hit points that are represented as blocks, similar to Pocket Rumble but in smaller numbers (so the "standard" number is six, while Rook, the new grappler, gets eight), and as a general rule, each hit does 1 HP of damage.

    • If you block regular attacks (A button) then you just sort of… block them.

    • If you block special attacks (B or C) then the first one you block makes one of your HP blocks turn orange, the second one you block makes it turn red, and the third one chips it away. If you don't get hit or block attacks for a bit, it recovers like SF4 gray damage.

    So yeah, the implementation is pretty similar to Pocket Rumble, because it's basically the only real option available for limited-discrete-HP fighters, and it works well in both. You can't just sit around and block all day, but it also prevents blocked specials from being overpowering (or, at worst, equivalent to simply landing them in the first place).
  • KristophKristoph sing my lullaby Joined: Posts: 430
    this game is really fun. from what i've played, it kind of feels like "ST with some divekick juice." even with just 3 attack buttons the characters feel really meaty. well-worth putting in the patreon support imo.

    i'm really liking the big graphical update they made to Grave in the latest update too
  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    Kristoph wrote: »
    i'm really liking the big graphical update they made to Grave in the latest update too

    Yeah the graphical improvements with each build have made a few drastic leaps. Definitely a good sign the final product is going to look pretty decent if not excellent for what is essentially an 'indie' title.

    I've been struggling to get good local opponents with time to play lately though, but should get some extended games tomorrow, looking forward to seeing what they make of it - it will be a mixed crowd of varying degrees of fighting game experience.
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • KristophKristoph sing my lullaby Joined: Posts: 430
    ^ There are no vids for this game yet since (other than Grave) the graphics are a huge WIP.

    A fourth character, Valerie, has been added to the game.

    Basic summary: Two-hit rekkas (that work in the air), chicken wing (goes SUPER FAR in the air), a speedup mode that activates every 8 seconds and gives her one chance to do three-hit rekkas or cancel chicken wing into chicken wing. Air super is an even better speedup mode that lasts a while. She does have a divekick.

    In other words, she's got sort of a Fei Long-ish thing going on.
  • KomatikKomatik Card demon Joined: Posts: 2,654
    "Hey, give me money to fund this thing that plays awesome without seeing how it plays!"

    Not my kind of deal.
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  • JohnGrimmJohnGrimm A.K.A. JohnXuandou Joined: Posts: 4,255
    How dare you question David "Our Lord and Savior" Sirlin.
    You lack devotion! Enduring hunger and poverty is how you find the way!
  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 4,242
    JohnGrimm wrote: »
    How dare you question David "Our Lord and Savior" Sirlin.

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  • JohnGrimmJohnGrimm A.K.A. JohnXuandou Joined: Posts: 4,255
    JohnGrimm wrote: »
    How dare you question David "Our Lord and Savior" Sirlin.

    Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix

    Yes thank you, that was the joke.
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  • tatakitataki Non-SF4/MVC3 FG news: twitter.com/#!/novriltataki Joined: Posts: 7,616
    Komatik wrote: »
    "Hey, give me money to fund this thing that plays awesome without seeing how it plays!"

    Not my kind of deal.

    His Patreon is for everything he does, not just for this. Among them are games that people have already bought, played, and loved.
    Fighting game tutorials, matches, and funny stuff:
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  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    edited November 2015
    Yeah quite right tataki. If you're not into his other stuff then Patreon backing is definitely too big an ask for most people, but eventually there will be screens and footage and maybe a kickstarter etc for the actual game... so if you're interested in seeing where this goes, it's worth knowing about at least. Honestly I only backed the Patreon to try out this game though, cos conceptually it's exactly what I like - and I've found it so much fun I've continued to back it.

    Plus it's hard to contain the hype when you are already backing it, playing it and enjoying it y'know ;-)

    I just finally had time to write up some more stuff about the game and the SFV beta. The full article is here but not trying to link-bait nonsense, so here's the bits about Fantasy Strike that are relevant to this thread :)
    grave_rook_1024x768-tiny.jpg

    Time for a Fantasy Strike!

    Enough about SFV for now, I also need to mention that this even more interesting fighting game is coming along really well. By backing it’s creator on Patreon, I’m able to get access to updated alpha builds periodically. This is intriguing by itself to see how the game is being developed over time. The latest build now has four of the Fantasy Strike characters available – Grave, Jaina, Rook and Valerie – and there’s already an enormous amount of variety in moves and playstyles available within the simple-to-execute systems the game is using. What’s particularly interesting for me, is, given the discussion above about how my character choice in fighting games has been in good part determined by how well I could execute their moves, as well as the utility of those moves, that in Fantasy Strike I am able to execute everything. Once you realise this includes all the combos too, this is actually a completely new experience even for me in fighting games – and actually has my mind boggling about how to even pick a main. I first imagined what a Fantasy Strike fighting game could be like (and what got me into Yomi, Puzzle Strike and other Sirlin Games originally!) thanks to Sirlin’s first article about the character Onimaru from back in 2012. The concept of a no-combos fighting game character appealed to me so much as it covered one of the major weaknesses in my execution ability – I’m awful at long rapid strings of motions and presses needed to do most combos in most fighting games these days. So I loved the idea of including a character, even in a really complex fighting game, that was tailored to my execution abilities, even if not my playstyle particularly. But now that Fantasy Strike is going with it’s super-easy to execute design, it’s opened up the possibility of playing as pretty much anyone for me – and I have no idea who I’ll end up favouring when the game is finally released. Maybe I will actually prefer to play a rushdown style combo character when I’ve got the ability to execute all of their attacks? Right now, if I had to pick a main I’d probably say I enjoy Grave the most, as I really like his fireball based gameplay, his wide variety of options, and both his super moves – but it maybe just because he’s the character that I have the most experience with, as he’s been in every build since the start – or perhaps it’s just because he is the most graphically complete so he looks the best too… On the other hand I have really enjoyed playing Rook too already, who is nothing like any character I’ve ever mained before in a fighting game – so I’m really not sure, and this open world of possibilities is incredibly exciting to think about, and highlights a wonderful aspect that simplifying execution has on a game.

    At the time of writing I’ve not yet been able to play vs anyone else on the current build – and I’m too good at fighting games for playing the basic alpha AI to be that much fun for me – I don’t think I’ve ever lost a match to the AI, even whilst messing about with new moves and characters. However, on one of the previous versions with Grave, Jaina and Rook, I did get the opportunity to unleash the game on a decent sized group of fighting game fans for playing some really fun casual matches – and the result was great. I think everyone enjoyed the game, and particularly players that weren’t as adept at Street Fighter style games were loving the fact they could now access all the moves and tactics thanks to the easier execution. One newer player who struggles to do SF-esque special moves, who is more familiar with 3D fighting games, even managed to beat almost every other player in my group at one point at “winner stays on” – which proved to be lots of fun hype amongst my friends. It was really great to see someone, who wouldn’t normally get that kind of opportunity to beat players with years of execution practice, able to win a good share of matches at a new fighting game – and again, this is courtesy of the great design of Fantasy Strike.

    I think the best comment one of my friends made was: “even at this early stage, you can tell this is going to be something brilliant” – to which I agree. Dragonheart!
    Post edited by Remy77077 on
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  • PerthoPertho The Runed One Joined: Posts: 20,865 mod
    I'm hoping the game is going to be good. My cash is always tied up on stuff to buy his games (desperately wanted to buy the Fantasy Strike that came with all the decks) and haters be damned, I love me some HDR. I won't say I have high hopes because he is doing a lot of really alien things but definitely curious.

    Do wish that he'd do a small gameplay trailer so people could understand how its going to play. Jump button and one button for normals is some weird shit to have going on.
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  • Smashbro29Smashbro29 Waiting for the new Framemeister... Joined: Posts: 7,159
    edited November 2015
    JohnGrimm wrote: »
    How dare you question David "Our Lord and Savior" Sirlin.

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    I liked it. I want it for PC.
  • CanadianDstryrCanadianDstryr The Mundane Cinderella Joined: Posts: 2,071
    Sirlin wrote: »
    it would be like SF5 showing vids at a point in their development when they still had some placeholder models and animations, which would just lead to negative press about how it looks bad or whatever.

    Word to KoF.

    Love the card game, love Puzzle Strike. Been meaning to try out Codex.

    Can't wait to see the game in a presentable state.
  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    Finally something more I can share with SRK - Sirlin's made the latest alpha build notes available publically here:
    http://www.sirlin.net/posts/fantasy-strike-fighting-game-january-build-for-patreon-patrons
    Thank you to all the patrons supporting the Fantasy Strike fighting game. The $25+ patrons are getting builds of the game as we go (latest build here), as we aren’t actually ready to show the game publicly yet. In the meantime, your support is helping us keep going to the point where we can eventually get a lot more players involved. Our team is incredibly grateful.

    There’s a lot of new things in our latest build, so I thought I’d share the change list publicly so you can see the kinds of things we’re working on, even if the build itself is just for patrons (feel free to sign up!). We have worked on gameplay-related things, as well as non-gameplay things. The highlights are:

    --A new character!
    --”real” alternate costume colors for some characters
    --First steps toward new menus
    --Performance improvements

    I’ll give a list of gameplay-related stuff first, then go into the non-gameplay stuff.

    GAMEPLAY

    SETSUKI
    --New playable character!
    --Setsuki is the most difficult to play character with the highest skill ceiling right now. This is because she is based on the idea of “speed”, so to fulfill that, she can do a bunch of stuff really fast. She has the fewest hit points in the game (five), so that means to be effective, you have to actually use her tools well. See tips at the end of this section.

    --Normal moves do cancel to specials, but the specials don’t actually combo. Instead, they create mixup opportunities.
    --Normal moves DO cancel to super. Tacking on guaranteed extra damage costs her meter, in other words. (A fair exchange for her various other advantages!)
    --B special is a teleport kick. This can go through the opponent to cross them up, even in the corner. Hold the button down to instead do a special throw (wow).
    --C special is Starlight Tumbler (aka hooligan throw). When she tumbles in the air, you can press the C button again to throw them (air to air or air to ground). You also have the option to press A to divekick from this move, or even super to air super from it. This move CAN be yomi countered (that’s when the opponent lets go of all controls) in order to prevent it from being unbeatable as a meaty attack.
    --Air A is a divekick, note that holding back or forward let you change the angle of the dive.
    --Air B is a kunai projectile. Note that holding back or forward let you change the angle of the kunai. This move is very useful to throw out just before approaching the enemy.
    --Air C is “Flying Fox”. This is a floaty air dive move. Although its priority is low, it’s a very deadly move because you can cancel it to itself on hit or block. Even if you don’t hit with it, you can perform another air action after it, such as second Flying Fox (even a backwards one that runs away), an air kunai, or divekick, or a super.
    --Ground super is a very fast dashing attack. The startup is vulnerable, but the speed and distance is so great that it can punish a lot of things and extend your combos.
    --Air super is an air parry. It currently has the same implementation as Grave’s air parry, though later on Setsuki’s will work a little differently and have more of a ninja flavor to it.

    Tips:
    --Be aware of your max damage bread and butter combo. Air C (Flying Fox), air C again, normal attack when you land, super. That’s 4 damage. It takes a bit of practice to perform the Flying Fox properly to do that, but it’s not actually difficult.
    --An air kunai can cover your approach with Flying Fox.
    --Go crazy with lots of quick stuff like hooligan throw, cancel to dive kick, jump and flying fox, land and teleport kick, etc. Once you are able to actually control all that stuff you’ll be all over the place and can hit opponents with things they “should” block just because they are so confused.
    --If you land a double palm attack (forward + A), it’s often worth it to spend the super to get a guaranteed 2nd damage. But at the very least, be ready to do a mixup with either teleport kick / teleport special throw, or hooligan throw into either “really throw” or divekick or air parry super.


    GRAVE
    --His projectile now has back / neutral / forward versions that are slow / medium / fast because that’s what you expect anyway. Before he had neutral (slow) and non-neutral (fast) to make sure that all commands work even in a possible future 1p mode that had enemies on both sides of you. We’ll relax that requirement and make the commands whatever they need to be for the main mode, then slightly modify them to work in that other mode if we ever actually make it.

    JAINA
    --no change

    ROOK
    --no change

    VALERIE
    --Revised a lot of things. I’m not really happy with her previous version OR this revised version, so she will likely see several more changes in the future. The issue is that rekka punches are inherently super good in this game and so she’s a rushdown character that a) can do crazy damage and b) can get in easily, always. Also, the way characters fly when hit out of the air does not really work properly yet, and the issues with it hugely favor Valerie by making juggling with rekkas easier than it should be.
    --You can now do rekka 1, 2, 3 all the time, rather than only in manic mode.
    --Manic mode removed (it existed only for the reason of stopping you from doing rekka 3 all the time.)
    --Rekka 3 no longer combos. The animation has been replaced with Flying Rainbow Stroke (aka chicken wing), so that it’s obvious that it wouldn’t combo.
    --All three rekkas do block damage. That means if you block all 3, you’ll take 1 point of real damage but you could have done something to hit that 3rd hit probably.
    --Rekka 1 and 2 now have back / neutral / forward versions that go short / medium / far distance.
    --Walk speed slightly increased.
    --Divekick replaced with a more normal air attack. This slows her down when she’s trying to get in, but the attack itself is pretty good. Very wide, so it’s good at crossups.
    --Ground super (Chromatic Orb) now has 13 frames of invulnerable startup after the super flash.

    GEIGER
    --Flash gear (aka flash kick) startup increased by 2 frames
    --neutral kick startup increased by 4 frames
    --Time spiral (aka sonic boom) shorter hitstun. This combined with the change to the neutral kick means that point-blank time spiral no longer combos into neutral kick. This was a weird-feeling bread-and-butter combo for him, so it feels better that you don’t have to worry about doing it anymore.
    --The input detection for differentiating between “press” and “hold” on his backfist (for traveling forward vs not traveling forward) has been improved. It is less likely to make you travel forward when you didn't want to. But it STILL needs work and will likely be improved again in the future.
    --It is no longer possible to have his air special gear and ground special gear on the screen at the same time. If you have one of those on screen, and activate the other, the first one will be destroyed and your new one will appear. By allowing them to both be on at once (in the previous build) it meant you were basically forced to constantly spam them a lot, which did not feel very “Geiger-y”. I’d rather he mostly stays on the ground and does sonic booms than constantly has to jump around.
    --Air special gear is slightly buffed because of the previous change. It travels slightly faster and it will not be destroyed if Geiger blocks or gets hit. That said, its overall power level is low (somewhat intentionally). We might adjust or revise this move entirely in the future. It’s difficult because he doesn’t even need this move and we don’t want it to be a thing he does all the time, whatever it is.
    --Air super. Your super meter no longer refills while the Cycloid gears are on the screen. (Was way too good.)
    --Ground super has been completely replaced. We tried many versions of time stop, and they were always too weak or too strong. It was very hard to deal with it, so it’s been replaced with a move sort of like Charlie’s multiple sonic boom super. Geiger can throw three gears with this, and he can delay the gears too. The graphics for this super are so placeholder that it does not yet give the feel that we want. The real animation will start with a “time stop” where he fills up his gear meter 3 times, then gameplay will resume. This first pass doesn’t have that, but does have basic functionality.

    GENERAL
    --Super flash (the cinematic at the start of supers where the game is briefly paused) increased across the board for most supers. They don’t have proper animation, but this is to test the general timing to make the supers a bit more dramatic.


    NON-GAMEPLAY
    --New alternate colors! Grave, Jaina, and Rook all have 8 costume colors now. This is the first time we’ve had intentionally designed alternate colors, as opposed to just stuff for testing purposes. (Note that these are the three characters that have “real” character models. The other character models are placeholder.)
    --The placeholder character models now have different 3D shading applied to them. This is not important because their models and shading will be completely replaced anyway, but this makes them look less awful in the meantime.
    --Rook now turns into a big stone “trap” when he does his air C move that pounds the ground.
    --Jaina now has a new model for her bow. (Note that it still doesn’t correctly show her flame arrows yet).

    --Main menu revised. In the middle of the screen, the menu emphasizes the main modes where you actually play. Other features that aren’t about playing are below, and use icons so they look different from the gameplay modes. Then tertiary features are small and in the corner, to give more focus to the main modes. The “Play” menu item will lead to online play, but as a temporary measure it’s hooked up to single match vs CPU right now. Many functions shown on the main menu are not actually implemented, but I want to start getting things in place so we get a sense of how to organize it all.
    --The menus are designed to work with mouse OR gamepad. They are designed to look good on your computer screen OR tv that’s across the room. That said, this version broke mouse support in some situations and we know that. The mouse still mostly works, but we are aware of several bugs with mouse use on the main menu items in the upper right corner and on the character select screen and we will fix them in a later build.
    --Character select screen revised. It now shows 3D characters at a more reasonable size and orientation. It now also has on-screen UI for selecting costume colors.
    --There is now a smooth flow from character select -> stage select -> versus screen (the screen showing “Grave vs Jaina” before the fight starts). Various elements stay constant across these three screens so it all feels coherent. 3D character animation also works smoothly across these screens now.
    --The versus screen now stays up longer on purpose, rather than going away so quickly that it feels like a glitch. During this time, a quick pre-fight music fanfare plays, but the music itself is placeholder. (Note that all other music you hear in the game is real and finished music from OC Remix.)

    --Graphics settings completely revised, now simplified down to 4 settings (very low, low, medium, high). On setting below high, we managed to improve graphics quality AND improve performance too (nice trick!). This was possible because some of the tradeoffs on quality vs performance in our previous builds really made no sense. Lower setting disabled some graphics features that mattered a lot, in order to keep other features that don’t really matter much.
    --Screen tearing used to occur on about half our graphics levels, but now never happens, even on the lowest setting.
    --The background was rendered as blurry in some areas on about half our graphics levels, but now it’s never blurry, even on the lowest setting.
    --In previous builds, the shadows were not handled well some of the medium settings. One of those settings made shadows so transparent that it was hard to even see them, yet you were still taking the performance hit for rendering them. On another setting, the shadows were very visible, but the quality was so low that they appeared jagged to the point of being obnoxiously glitchy looking. In our current build, the top three settings have shadows at high / medium / low quality, where they still look reasonable no matter the setting. The lowest setting has no shadows at all. In future builds, we will eventually add “blob” shadows to this quality setting.

    Tip: If you’re trying to run the game on a low power computer, especially laptops, remember that in addition to changing the graphics quality from lowest / low / medium / high, you can also change the resolution. Running it in 720p rather than 1080p might help you a lot on low-spec computers.

    That’s a ton of changes in this build! We have lots more in the works too. New menu features, new character models, and even some new animations are finally in the works. Stay tuned on Patreon for more updates!
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • PSYCH0J0SHPSYCH0J0SH Joined: Posts: 4,653
    edited January 2016
    Patch notes for a game that's completely invisible and basically doesn't exist. Alright. Cool. Yeah.
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    Swag is for girls. Class is for Maidens.

    GigaMaidens on deviantART and on twitter @GigaMaidens

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  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    edited October 2016
    Here's some more patch notes just to annoy @PSYCH0J0SH ... ;-) http://www.sirlin.net/posts/fantasy-strike-patch-notes-august-2016

    But more importantly, first officially released screenshot at http://www.fantasystrike.com/



    I know they are nearing the point where more stuff can be shared publicly too, hurrah!
    Post edited by Remy77077 on
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • 3417gekko3417gekko Scrub Joined: Posts: 72
    These easy operation-type games never work out in the end.
  • PerthoPertho The Runed One Joined: Posts: 20,865 mod
    3417gekko wrote: »
    These easy operation-type games never work out in the end.

    His isn't all that far fetched. There's an inuyasha fighting game that operates on a lot of similar ways to this one and it played fairly well for what it was.

    Still waiting for some type of public beta on this.
    Ronin Chaos on Pertho:

    "Oh, Pertho. You complete me."
    jimmy1200 wrote: »
    pertho attacked me first, saying i get all my life tips from 106th and park.
  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    edited October 2016
    I disagree, I really enjoyed and still enjoy Divekick -the issue with Divekick was matchup balance was (is) terrible and the online was ultra barebones so it never really got anywhere as an online game.
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • CronopioCronopio ST Joined: Posts: 1,838
    Some execution can get in the way of things when inputs are needlessly strict or convoluted, but these attempts to remove execution as much as possible always end up in inferior products and ignores that execution is integral to the genre.

    Good luck with the project to Sirlin though, even when I consider this simplification trend to be very harmful to the genre.
  • NeverYouMindNeverYouMind Joined: Posts: 354
    edited October 2016
    Nice character designs, but without advanced movement options it would just turn out like a 1-line (as opposed to 2D plane) version of Aggressors of Dark Kombat (minus the rarely used run plus the one button inputs). The addition of movement options like dashing add a sense of freedom to the game that has made titles like Super Smash Bros. so popular. Good luck to the development team on the project regardless.

    Here is a video of the aforementioned ADK:
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 34,335 mod
    keo-bas wrote: »

    Rising thunder being mandatory 8 button fighter with no key bind over complicated controls, some of the game stuff had artificial binary for reason i still can't make sense to this day. Move set had various cool downs on top of their recovery because......?..Certain info such as move set load out, enemy's power gauge are hidden because.....?
    Hiding stuff seemed more like them experimenting with things in a game meant to be played primarily online. I mean, this was the only game to ever run GGPO 3 after all.
    You can't ask for well-thought-out changes off day 1, week 1, or mostly even month 1 play...and that's when the game is out and everyone's in the lab.
    -Mike_Z

    Everyone (should) be mindful that if there isn't a new generation after my generation, the FGC (fighting game community) will basically become extinct, so it's important to think about the future.
    -Daigo Umehara

  • PSYCH0J0SHPSYCH0J0SH Joined: Posts: 4,653
    Remy77077 wrote: »
    Here's some more patch notes just to annoy @PSYCH0J0SH ... ;-) http://www.sirlin.net/posts/fantasy-strike-patch-notes-august-2016

    I mean, I am interested in learning more about the game, but if there's not even any gameplay footage or any way for us to play or even see the game then what is the point of these patch notes?
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    Swag is for girls. Class is for Maidens.

    GigaMaidens on deviantART and on twitter @GigaMaidens

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  • Remy77077Remy77077 futility fighting Joined: Posts: 320
    edited October 2016
    PSYCH0J0SH wrote: »

    I mean, I am interested in learning more about the game, but if there's not even any gameplay footage or any way for us to play or even see the game then what is the point of these patch notes?

    That's cool, glad you didn't mind the wind-up :)

    You can still play the game via Patreon and it's a lot cheaper now (a pre-alpha build with 5 characters is for 5 dollars Patreon backing). I think the idea of making the patch notes free publicly is so that people not on Patreon can see some of the progress being made and if they are already interested in the characters etc. from Yomi, Puzzle Strike, Flash Duel or Codex, they get an idea of how they will play in a fighting game too.

    keo-bas wrote: »
    One my issue with Fantasy strike, Rising thunder, Pocket rumble is how these game claimed to be the "accessible fighter" and yet their games seem anything but accessible. Fantasy strike doesn't even seem to control like traditional fighter. If it was to be unique fighter or some simulator then I can get behind it but saying its like other fighter is contradictory imo. OMNI's game "TRAF" seem far more closer to home and yet only has 1 button.

    Fantasy's YOMI counter neutral doing both parry and grab tech seems far to rewarding, what are the mix up to compensate for this? The game says it has no high and low so how does one even go about countering this option? Their blocking meter that open up opponent but why block over YOMI counter?

    I totally agree with you regarding Rising Thunder. I didn't find that to be especially accessible at all. I can't comment on Pocket Rumble as I've not played that yet.

    However Fantasy Strike is the opposite to me, it really IS accessible. It's almost as easy to get into as Divekick, yet it does play much more like a traditional fighting game. That's exactly how it plays, and that's the whole idea behind it really. Press buttons for attacks and special moves, walk up close to throw, back to block. The fighting dynamics and the pacing of matches are familiar too. Zoner characters, rushdown characters, grappler characters. The only thing that's even slightly different to 'traditional' is having Jump be on a button. But you can map that to "up" if you want to as well, but it took me only a few fights to adjust to it being on a button - and that again mirrors Divekick's Dive/Jump button too.

    I think you've misunderstood how Yomi counter works. It doesn't parry, it's not an option select in any way. It only beats throws. If you do nothing and they do a normal attack or special move, you'll be hit as you weren't blocking (back).
    http://www.agoners.com My gaming website
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird Crack is back! Joined: Posts: 23,528
    The trailer
    PSN: Hawkingbird
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  • JohnGrimmJohnGrimm A.K.A. JohnXuandou Joined: Posts: 4,255
    Lmaoooooooooo
    You lack devotion! Enduring hunger and poverty is how you find the way!
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