Birdie Q&A Thread: Ask All Your Questions Here

HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art IJoined: Posts: 26,264
edited February 2016 in Birdie
Don't clog up the board with one question threads. If you have any questions regarding Birdie ask it here. Your fellow Birdie players will lend you a helping hand.
Post edited by jchensor on
PSN: Hawkingbird
FC: 0834-1564-0151
http://steamcommunity.com/id/runawayavenger
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Comments

  • Evil CanadianEvil Canadian T.Hawk is a good guy Joined: Posts: 8,336
    where do fit the big donut on birdie
  • JookeyJookey You have faced a knight, and lost! Joined: Posts: 200
    This has been asked before, but I'm just curious as to what button(s) you all use for Bull Horn, along with it's EX version?
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art I Joined: Posts: 26,264
    Jookey wrote: »
    This has been asked before, but I'm just curious as to what button(s) you all use for Bull Horn, along with it's EX version?

    I personally use lk for Bull horn. It's the button I use the least. For EX I use lk and hk.
    PSN: Hawkingbird
    FC: 0834-1564-0151
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/runawayavenger
  • Plaid_UnicornPlaid_Unicorn Camron should have won an Oscar for Paid in Full Joined: Posts: 9,931
    Jookey wrote: »
    This has been asked before, but I'm just curious as to what button(s) you all use for Bull Horn, along with it's EX version?

    I personally use lk for Bull horn. It's the button I use the least. For EX I use lk and hk.

    I agree, but I think I am going to stop. Watching other folks use Lk it as a combo starter shows how I limited my game previously.
    Just because I lost... doesn't mean I was defeated
    "Say it loud... I main Rog and I'm proud!!!!" - Plaid Unicorn
    "I'll be honest, I don't know why you hang out in Nintendo threads. You seem to hate everything they do." - Po Pimpus
  • SharinSharin Arcadia Fighters Joined: Posts: 857
    I've also noticed hagejin sweeps when he is charging EX bull horn so I don't think he is holding HK.
    Yo soy PAPITO
  • JookeyJookey You have faced a knight, and lost! Joined: Posts: 200
    Yeah, LK and HP seem to be the most popular buttons for it. Do people usually just have a button held down near constantly, or try to anticipate when they're about to need it and hold it then? The former seems like you'd be limiting yourself but the latter could provide plenty of missed opportunities.
  • tharimrattlertharimrattler Colossus Legend Joined: Posts: 3,149 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Can this move be achieved by using the 3p or 3k macro button? I've never used those but considering using them now. Still stubborn from the arcade mentality lol.
  • The MullahThe Mullah lk kara throw repeat Joined: Posts: 2,666
    Jookey wrote: »
    Yeah, LK and HP seem to be the most popular buttons for it. Do people usually just have a button held down near constantly, or try to anticipate when they're about to need it and hold it then? The former seems like you'd be limiting yourself but the latter could provide plenty of missed opportunities.


    i think it depends on how useful st.hp or st.hk is as a poke. if its no good then hold it down, the other buttons are all too useful to constantly be holding.

    what matchups do you find headbutt that useful? ryu ken chun, who else?


  • AngerusAngerus To headbutt or not to headbutt? Joined: Posts: 829
    edited February 2016
    The Mullah wrote: »
    Jookey wrote: »
    Yeah, LK and HP seem to be the most popular buttons for it. Do people usually just have a button held down near constantly, or try to anticipate when they're about to need it and hold it then? The former seems like you'd be limiting yourself but the latter could provide plenty of missed opportunities.


    i think it depends on how useful st.hp or st.hk is as a poke. if its no good then hold it down, the other buttons are all too useful to constantly be holding.

    what matchups do you find headbutt that useful? ryu ken chun, who else?


    Ryu, ken and Chun can actually all punish ex headbutt with a low forward iirc.
    Light and Medium headbutt is punishable by almost anything since it's -10 on block and hardly gives and pushback.
    Heavy headbutt in non-VT is the only one that's semi safe, since it's -5 on block.

    With that said, I don't find raw headbutt particularly useful in any matchup besides Dhalsim (to punish yoga fire) and Necalli (has trouble punish ex headbutt)
  • The MullahThe Mullah lk kara throw repeat Joined: Posts: 2,666
    Sorry i meant bullhorn, i havent got a grip on all the sfv move names yet.

    As you know vs ryu ken chun you can negate fireball poking game by blowing through fireballs and hitting for big damage with the regular bullhorn. But in what other matchups does the bullhorn come into play?

    Vs sim i find they dont yoga fire close enough to reach them with a non ex headbutt because yoga fire startup is too slow to use it as a midrange poke. qcf+ pp blows up distanced yoga fires.

    Vs rashid bullhorn isnt useful vs his fireball either.
  • Evil CanadianEvil Canadian T.Hawk is a good guy Joined: Posts: 8,336
    Vs sim bullhorn is actually quite solid if they want to use the levitate a lot, as the large arcing upward hitbox eats up all the airspace sim wants to be in.

    That said though, move is very situational, I personally barely use it. Birdie's on demand options for most things are pretty great as it stands so a TAP style move having to be planned out ahead isn't as favourable to me.
  • The MullahThe Mullah lk kara throw repeat Joined: Posts: 2,666
    Sim seems like an interesting matchup.

    Far f.hp seems pretty safe and chews up sims pokes. On hit you have frame adv to follow up with spd or normals. On cc it floats the opponent. Not sure of the optimal followup to that.

    Reversal teleports can be tagged on reaction with st.hp or ex headbutt etc.

    Naked crossup teleports are easily aa'd putting aim in a bad position. So theyre covered with either a normal fireball or ex fireball.

    If sim fireballs within fierce headbutt range you can ex headbutt and catch him if youre looking for it. You can also dash forward to negate its teleport covering use. Normally it will be used after a knockdown however so you have to block the teleport mixup. Ex fireball from neutral is more problematic. Maybe sliding it is a good option to avoid the mixup.

    Am interested to know if sim is positive neutral or negative after max range slides.
  • gilleygilley 3D Aminator Joined: Posts: 1,296 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    edited February 2016
    If the data stays the same, after blocking a max range slide, dhalsim is -1/+3/-9 on LK/MK/HK slide.

    EDIT: according to dantarion's active frames
    It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt. --Mark Twain
  • The MullahThe Mullah lk kara throw repeat Joined: Posts: 2,666
    Ahh thanks.
  • HalberdiusHalberdius mm my hugo juggles.. watch him make people soar. Joined: Posts: 228
    I know mp mk is supposed to be a parry but birdie just eats a donut and takes the hit doesnt parry am i missing something or he doesnt have a parry? Like for eating hadoukens
    Hammer mountain! O_O..... KO
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  • ILL_BILLILL_BILL Average Player. Seriously. Joined: Posts: 277
    He does not have a parry. V-skill just builds v meter.
    "About time to change my sig I reckon. Ill throw in some quotation marks at either end for dramatic effect."
  • HalberdiusHalberdius mm my hugo juggles.. watch him make people soar. Joined: Posts: 228
    ILL_BILL wrote: »
    He does not have a parry. V-skill just builds v meter.

    Yeah i learned that today. Did some research. Ryu and gief have one but i didnt know the triggers were unique to each character etc so ima just have to figure out a different strategy for that. Like jumping over baiting hadouken,chain them close gap etc since you can grab them while the projectiles shooting itll pass through you as you grab so im doing that a long with regular cross ups. Ty tho i know now he can throw a banana and roll an energy drink
    Hammer mountain! O_O..... KO
    ストリートファイタ3
    Twitch.tv/halberdius
  • CrayRavenCrayRaven Joined: Posts: 181
    What is the main use of bullhead?
  • twocoinstwocoins New account -- been around 10 years. Joined: Posts: 611
    The main use of bullhead? It's like his his main attack via bnb ender and cancels into super/vtrigger?

    Do you mean bullhorn? Hold attack? It's a solid anti air, whiff punishes normal's, and goes through fireballs.
  • CrayRavenCrayRaven Joined: Posts: 181
    twocoins wrote: »
    The main use of bullhead? It's like his his main attack via bnb ender and cancels into super/vtrigger?

    Do you mean bullhorn? Hold attack? It's a solid anti air, whiff punishes normal's, and goes through fireballs.

    Yea I mean bullhead. I was wondering if it had any use outside of being a ender?http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/207252/birdie-q-a-thread-ask-all-your-questions-here?#
  • HertogHertog Joined: Posts: 300
    What's birdie best air to air?

    I see so little use for jumping lk, lp and hp. Why are they there?
    USF4: Blanka, Hugo

    SFxT: Blanka, Jack-X, Guile, Kuma

    SFV: Birdie, Necalli
  • Tofu WarriorTofu Warrior Today is close Joined: Posts: 1,149
    I like j.MP for air-to-air because it has 6 active frames, so you're likely to stuff your opponent's attack. The angle on j.LK makes it great for air-to-air purposes as well, especially while rising. j.LP has deceptively long horizontal range and low hit/blockstun, making it ideal for ticking into command grab. I mostly use j.HP in dizzy combos for extra damage, don't use it for much else, maybe someone else can chime in with uses for j.HP.
  • TheSupaSageTheSupaSage Joined: Posts: 27
    What are birdies footie tools?
    Also how do you guys use youre lk,mk chains?
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art I Joined: Posts: 26,264
    CrayRaven wrote: »
    twocoins wrote: »
    The main use of bullhead? It's like his his main attack via bnb ender and cancels into super/vtrigger?

    Do you mean bullhorn? Hold attack? It's a solid anti air, whiff punishes normal's, and goes through fireballs.

    Yea I mean bullhead. I was wondering if it had any use outside of being a ender?http://forums.shoryuken.com/discussion/207252/birdie-q-a-thread-ask-all-your-questions-here?#

    I sometimes use HP bullhead to get in. Though only use it at max range so it can be safe-ish. It's -5 on block.
    What are birdies footie tools?
    Also how do you guys use youre lk,mk chains?

    Main pokes
    S.hp, s.mk, cr.mk, s.lk

    Counter pokes
    Cr.LP, s.mp, f.hp

    S.HK I mainly use as a meaty.
    PSN: Hawkingbird
    FC: 0834-1564-0151
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/runawayavenger
  • AngerusAngerus To headbutt or not to headbutt? Joined: Posts: 829
    edited February 2016
    @Hertog & @Tofu Warrior

    jHP (7f startup, 5f active frames) is best used as an Air to air, as a max range jumpin or as a neutral jump to control space (where only the hitboxes extend out of the hurtbox, so max range).
    If used from far, you can cover its weakness of having hurtboxes on his legs and under his arms, so only the hitboxes that extend out of the hurtbox matter. I use it a lot when playing lame and neutral jumping to fish for a sMP xx headbutt xx super hitconfirm.
    ba414463675a435be187dc331c3f18be.png

    jLP (4f startup, 5f active frames) Starts up the fastest and might just be his best jump attack. This angle and hitbox can stuff/trade some anti airs, Vega has no answer to it for example. It's also effective just throwing it out as a neutral jump to control space. Sadly the only flaw is that it can lose to some air to airs if you use it while rising and it also doesn't cause too much hitstun, meaning u can't combo out of it effectively. It's just a handy tool when u need to come in with a jump while beating some anti airs or to annoy your opponent.
    e45fbd7cb3216a76b7f77da7a1d73587.png

    jMP (7f startup, 6f active frames) is just great. It isn't the best but isn't the worst either, it has decent active frames and consistent hitboxes / hurtboxes. works well as a surprise air to air if the opponent is close or jumping over you.
    cb7075405e26a13a3342a30dffdef880.png

    jHK (9f startup, 5f active) is slower and hits the fartest (slightly farther than jHP and jLP) but is easier to anti air, depending on the opponent.
    Imo it works slightly better as an air to air thanks to the hitboxes and additional distance it has over jMP and jLK, even though it starts slower and has less active frames.
    cd2bf2e9ec8c572e91a8f8b209fff458.png

    jMK (7f startup, 4f active) This jump attack hits the deepest out of all his jump attacks. It's best used when you need to jump in or punish something without relying too much on its hitboxes. For example, if you need to punish a whiffed throw, a command throw with a fast recovery, or a projectile, then this is the normal to use.
    9d46e86467f7cce09d5c0d5280d5252b.png
  • Tofu WarriorTofu Warrior Today is close Joined: Posts: 1,149
    Thanks for the breakdown, the hitboxes in particular helped me visualize how the moves actually function vs. how they look. Nice to know that j.LP is as strong as I thought it was.
  • IPAIPA Don't jump. Joined: Posts: 20
    Hi Gents. If any of you are both bored and knowledgeable, I'd love some help on a few scrubby questions. These are in no particular order -- just things I've been wondering about.

    1. What is the best max damage option when I bait out a dp?
    2. What are the properties of Bull Revenger / EX BR? I use it often on quick risers (a la LPN) but I'm curious -- does it catch standing AND crouching? Or one and not the other?
    3. Can someone give a basic breakdown of the paper-rock-scissors nature of attack vs. throw vs. command grab? Like, when should I be using Killing Head?
    4. What are some smart options after I successfully anti-air with cr.MP? This happens often in-match but I never feel like I'm capitalizing as they land.
    5. I find myself throwing cans and peels often (and to decent effect); some Birdies I watch do this as well, and some almost entirely refrain. What are your thoughts on can / peel? Gimmicky? Essential?
    6. Can someone theorize (or just ramble a bit) on Bull Charge? A command normal that seems useful but I fear I'm not using it as well as I could.
    7. Why would anyone hold chains? I assume there are plenty of good reasons, just not sure of them at the moment.
    8. Speaking of chains, I use HK after landing c.HP; how are you using LK / MK chains in standard match flow? How does EX chains factor in for you?

    Might add some more as they come to me. Thanks for taking the time -- I've enjoyed the conversation so far.
    st.MK in the streets, cr.MP in the sheets.
    SFV: Birdie
    3S: Necro
  • IM_AmazonIM_Amazon Joined: Posts: 150
    edited February 2016
    IPA wrote: »
    Hi Gents. If any of you are both bored and knowledgeable, I'd love some help on a few scrubby questions. These are in no particular order -- just things I've been wondering about.

    1. What is the best max damage option when I bait out a dp?
    2. What are the properties of Bull Revenger / EX BR? I use it often on quick risers (a la LPN) but I'm curious -- does it catch standing AND crouching? Or one and not the other?
    3. Can someone give a basic breakdown of the paper-rock-scissors nature of attack vs. throw vs. command grab? Like, when should I be using Killing Head?
    4. What are some smart options after I successfully anti-air with cr.MP? This happens often in-match but I never feel like I'm capitalizing as they land.
    5. I find myself throwing cans and peels often (and to decent effect); some Birdies I watch do this as well, and some almost entirely refrain. What are your thoughts on can / peel? Gimmicky? Essential?
    6. Can someone theorize (or just ramble a bit) on Bull Charge? A command normal that seems useful but I fear I'm not using it as well as I could.
    7. Why would anyone hold chains? I assume there are plenty of good reasons, just not sure of them at the moment.
    8. Speaking of chains, I use HK after landing c.HP; how are you using LK / MK chains in standard match flow? How does EX chains factor in for you?

    Might add some more as they come to me. Thanks for taking the time -- I've enjoyed the conversation so far.

    1. With all your resources? I think it's something like s.HK (cc), walk, cr.MPxxEX BullhornxxVT, EX Bullhead.
    2. It's a grab, with all the ups and downs you'd expect. Folks jumping on wakeup will avoid it and punish you badly, as will reversals, but if they're inclined to block it'll snatch them.
    3. As a command throw, KH is best used when the opponent is anticipating buttons. After attacks that are plus on block (cr.LP, s.LP, s.LK), you can choose to blockstring (with a possible hit-confirm if they push buttons), block (if they have a DP and you want to bait it), or throw (if they expect the blockstring and wait it out). Normal throw lets you switch sides, KH doesn't, and KH's whiff animation is longer. On wakeup, landing something like a meaty s.HK or 6HK will disincline them from attacking, so you can use KH in this situation too (or EX Revenger, I won't judge). The threat of meaties and/or KH may lead to panic reversals and big punishes for you.
    4. You're at advantage during their air reset, so you can do something like s.HK to blow up mashing, walk in KH to dissuade blocking, or block to bait a reversal.
    5. I think it may be too early to say. Play it by ear and don't eat recklessly if the opponent likes to go in a lot, since they're easy to react to. I like the pop can the best for the situations it can cause (EX Bull Revenger ayy lmao), but experimentation is key. Donuts are really good because VT is really good, so keep that in mind.
    6. I absolutely love it, but it's risky. You can use it in anticipation of a fireball to plow through, or as the coolest counterpoke in human history. I've thought about trying it as a weird meaty, but I haven't put any time into it yet.
    7. Sort of the same reason why Ryu can delay VT fireballs--to screw up your timing. Birdie's isn't as good, but being able to delay HK chain helps make anti-airing easier to time. Straight-up bait is always on the table, too.
    8. Standard chains are basically to snatch the opponent past their projectile. They're not as useful when you're playing lame against someone without them, since you're less likely to take advantage of their oki (far Hanging Chains have more advantage). I like MK chain a bit more, but only because I haven't figured out the best way to take advantage of LK chain's positioning. I only ever find myself using EX chain for more damage after cr.HP or as a pointlessly YOLO whiff-punish.

  • HertogHertog Joined: Posts: 300
    How do you handle the Vega match-up. Can't eat anything when he has his v-trigger bar full. Learned that the hard way :)
    But any tips?
    USF4: Blanka, Hugo

    SFxT: Blanka, Jack-X, Guile, Kuma

    SFV: Birdie, Necalli
  • The MullahThe Mullah lk kara throw repeat Joined: Posts: 2,666

    Best cc punish for me without vt is st.hk> st.hk > st.lp x lp bullhead.

    As far as im aware his f.hp is safe on block when done at max range. So its something at add to your poking game. I use it vs characters like sim or karin to blow through their limbs

    Holding then cancelling chains is ok for making ur opponent freeze. Dash and spd. I dont use chains often though they may be ok used at max range. I just hate people jumping and full comboing me so i dont usually throw them out.
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art I Joined: Posts: 26,264
    Hertog wrote: »
    How do you handle the Vega match-up. Can't eat anything when he has his v-trigger bar full. Learned that the hard way :)
    But any tips?

    Vega is one of those matchups where you need to get the life lead early. You let Vega get the early advantage then he'll just hit and run. A smart Vega won't wall dive you since cr.mp completely shuts it down including EX. You can punish a blocked roll attack with killing head. Like SF4, Vega has no reversals so stay on him once your in.
    PSN: Hawkingbird
    FC: 0834-1564-0151
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/runawayavenger
  • IPAIPA Don't jump. Joined: Posts: 20
    Thanks for the response @IM_Amazon.

    Do you guys have go-to Birdie streamers you watch? Or IDs of Birdies whose replays you DL? I was watching Art's stream tonight and saw a killer Birdie but wasn't able to make a note of his handle. . .

    Most of the streamers I watch play characters I don't really care about and the Birdies seem few and far between.
    st.MK in the streets, cr.MP in the sheets.
    SFV: Birdie
    3S: Necro
  • Robo SolRobo Sol PHD in Fraudology Joined: Posts: 211
    Hey guys, I playing around making my own tech. I really like this character for whatever reason lol. This is my first time ever sharing tech too sooooooo fyi I'm not too into the lab coat frame data, I just use it as a guide and play by feel so I have no stats for ya guys.

    What I was fooling around with was his c. Mp anti-air and what mix ups to do after since I noticed many times they'll land right next to birdie. These are my premeditated go tos depending on how I wish to attack for when they land on recovery.

    If they're going to land close:

    HK crush counter fishing and into combo
    Command grab
    BnB
    Sweep
    Hold the MP and release for the up charge
    Tick throw LK into command grab.
    Jump over them into cross up
    Chain toss AA

    For when they are going to land far away in their recovery:

    Ex chains hop (to time it right to get it snare at the earliest moment is tricky, too soon and you will wiff)
    Dash in command grab
    Dash in BnB
    Chain toss/ex chain toss
    Chain toss AA

    Also did you guys consider f.HK as a anti air with reach cause it hits far out. I was playing around with it and kind of like it to use in that area where the opponent feels safe to jump.

    I uploaded this little video to show you what I mean.

    (it's been a long fucking time since I used srk so I got lazy and just uploaded it on Twitter instead of trying to embed it)


    For the video of me using it.


    And for shits I stumbled across this funky visual glitch.



    None of this is ground breaking stuff but I just wanted to discuss it or if you guys got anything better.
    XBL: Robo Sol
    SoCal area
  • reaper2507reaper2507 Joined: Posts: 1,066
    is there a place where i can see all the EX-Move properties Birdies EX-Moves have? if not what does EX do for birdies moves?
  • AngerusAngerus To headbutt or not to headbutt? Joined: Posts: 829
    edited February 2016
    Robo Sol wrote: »
    Also did you guys consider f.HK as a anti air with reach cause it hits far out. I was playing around with it and kind of like it to use in that area where the opponent feels safe to jump.
    It's been discussed a couple of times, it's his best anti air from a distance or height where cMP wouldn't reach.
    I usually use it after an opponent jumps over a fullscreen can, against Ken's Heavy Tatsu, Mika's dropkick or when they neutral jump.
  • pesserpesser Joined: Posts: 156
    can the bull slider be used to go under projectiles ?
    ssblanka

    "tiger knee is the air. if dan can do it why can't sagat? he's a million times better than dan".
  • HawkingbirdHawkingbird I am thou...thou art I Joined: Posts: 26,264
    pesser wrote: »
    can the bull slider be used to go under projectiles ?

    Yes.
    PSN: Hawkingbird
    FC: 0834-1564-0151
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/runawayavenger
  • Songo[KthX]Songo[KthX] (*_*(O-('.'Q) Joined: Posts: 2,024
    This character is OP how do you beat him?
    <Metric> songo is #1 3s player
  • CJxxxCJxxx Joined: Posts: 57
    This character is OP how do you beat him?

    Get in his face, congratulations, you won
  • odinodin is october coming? Joined: Posts: 15,463 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Can someone give me rundown of all the changes that occur with VT activated?
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