Clarification on taking turns in fighting games

ZadawnZadawn Joined: Posts: 15
edited March 20 in Newbie Saikyo Dojo
By watching a bunch of videos and reading articles i came to understand a little bit of frame data but I'm in need of clarification regarding the subject in the title.

Let's say you're applying pressure with an attack that has a 4 frame start up and it is +2 on block,on an opponent that is blocking . Does that mean that you can keep your turn going forever assuming there's no push back on the attack and the distance factor is excluded?

Is there a general rule on applying pressure? ( Street Fighter 5 mostly) .

Comments

  • crazymasterhandcrazymasterhand LAZERS PEW PEW Joined: Posts: 282
    edited March 20
    In this theoretical situation, your opponent has a 2 frame gap in blockstun they can use to perform some kind of reversal. Realistically though there are very few moves in 2d fighters without pushback. Chipp in Guilty Gear actually has a 4 frame +2 move in close slash. He can make you block it a few times in succession, but he'll eventually have to run up to you to continue his offense which makes the gap in blockstun wider so you can mash out with normals. If he chooses to press standing kick instead of running, and you chose to mash in anticipation of the run, you'll get hit.

    One way to think about applying pressure is to present your opponent with a situation where you have multiple attack options, make a note of their response to it, and punish that response the next time the situation arises.
    Post edited by crazymasterhand on
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 36,996 mod
    They can still beat it out with a move that has 3 frames of startup.
  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,585
    edited March 21
    Zadawn wrote: »
    By watching a bunch of videos and reading articles i came to understand a little bit of frame data but I'm in need of clarification regarding the subject in the title.

    Let's say you're applying pressure with an attack that has a 4 frame start up and it is +2 on block,on an opponent that is blocking . Does that mean that you can keep your turn going forever assuming there's no push back on the attack and the distance factor is excluded?

    Is there a general rule on applying pressure? ( Street Fighter 5 mostly) .

    Assuming you follow up with a move that starts up faster than the opponents fastest option, then yes you're safe to keep pushing buttons.
    You can't just go for a +2 move and follow it up with a heavy that has a long start up time, without the opponent picking up on that and punishing that.

    But yeah for starters:
    If you're plus, it's your turn and if you're minus it's his turn.

    Generally you don't need to keep the exact numbers in your head.
    In general on defense you can hit light attacks on 0 and -1, your fastest medium on -2 and less, -4 is often but not always punishable and -5 and higher is usually fully punishable.
    On offense you obviously run into the risk of getting counter hit by your opponent when you keep pressing buttons after getting into a negative situation, unless you push them out of your range with the negative button and look to retaliate on a whiffed button of theirs.


    There's always situations that do not work that way, but those are specific.
    For example Cammy could attack you with a Knee Bullet (f+HK) which is -2 on block. You block it, thinking it is your turn and press a medium attack with 5 frames start up which makes your medium attack 3 frames startup effectively, which beats every option Cammy has except for her EX shoryuken which is invincible to any attacks from frame 1 on.
    Also to answer your question:
    If there was a button like this, you could bust out of that string with an EX shoryuken or v-reversal. If both did not exist, yes you could keep that string up forever if there was no push back.

    Add me for some Tekken 7 if you're from Europe.
    I'm not playing anything else these days:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/NaughtySenpai/
  • ZadawnZadawn Joined: Posts: 15
    Thanks for the answers.
  • ArtVandelayArtVandelay Architect Joined: Posts: 5,585
    edited March 21
    Zadawn wrote: »
    Thanks for the answers.

    There's also the priority system to consider.
    If two moves clash on the same frame, the heavier button always wins in SFV.
    Almost forgot that.

    d3v wrote: »
    They can still beat it out with a move that has 3 frames of startup.

    Not in the scenario OP described.
    Add me for some Tekken 7 if you're from Europe.
    I'm not playing anything else these days:
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/NaughtySenpai/
  • p.m novaroad pilotp.m novaroad pilot Joined: Posts: 2,603
    you would need a one frame move
    the scenario you are talking about would never happen though that move would be silly and unbalanced
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