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Blazblue Cross Tag Battle Official Discussion

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Comments

  • CronopioCronopio ST Joined: Posts: 2,235
    I don't see how this really changes things. 20 characters for 6000 yen, of which most are recycled from other games. Then DLC to get the rest. What am I missing here?
  • FatalSeabassFatalSeabass Seabass is lethal! Joined: Posts: 1,189
    edited January 14
    tataki wrote: »
    Exactly what part of being upset that 20 characters are DLC is misinformation? That's literally half the roster. What more info do I need to know to make this situation any less bullshit than it is? Pricing? Regardless of the pricing, most of these DLC characters will be from games that already exist i.e recycled. I read the link you posted. The base game will be 6000 yen or about $54. That's for 20 characters, only TWO of which are new. The game and ALL the DLC will be 10500 yen which comes out to 94 dollars. Again, how many of these will be new characters considering what we know about the first 20 in the base roster?

    Based on the details we know of right now, there is plenty of reason to be upset and I'm glad that many people are feeling the same way.

    Stop twisting the facts.

    What facts am I twisting up?

    $56 for base
    $73 for DBZF
    $95 for BBCTB+20 DLC+Art book+blah blah blah

    Those are damn near the exact quotes I pulled up in my original post. Congrats, Novril throws in DBZF, another game from Arcsys that drew criticism for it's DLC practices to give a perspective of the game's pricing with DLC included. Again, exactly how does this change the negative reactions in regards to the 20 DLC announcement? Tell me. What ARE we missing here?
  • FatalSeabassFatalSeabass Seabass is lethal! Joined: Posts: 1,189
    Hecatom.
    Tataki.

    I get it. If you guys want to be the Cross Tag Battle stans, by all means, go for it. Know that there others who just aren't going to eat up bullshit.
  • LivewireXLivewireX Joined: Posts: 5,992
    I mean hey, why eat up other people's bullshit, when you can just create your own?
  • riburibu A Return to Form Joined: Posts: 2,764
    Really wish Arcs had laid out the pricing for this in USD as well. Game is getting a lot of backlash that isn't 100% justified yet.
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  • tatakitataki misplaced Joined: Posts: 7,706
    Tell me. What ARE we missing here?
    I gave an example for a "$60" game in Japan. Videogames cost a bit more in Japan so claiming the JPY price of BBCTB is exactly the price we'll get in dollars is dishonest. You also said 10800 is the price for the game + DLC, but it also includes the physical merchandise. You've decided in advance that the pricing is a ripoff (even though it isn't) and you seem to ignore any fact that disproves this narrative.
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  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,402 mod
    Exactly what part of being upset that 20 characters are DLC is misinformation? That's literally half the roster. What more info do I need to know to make this situation any less bullshit than it is? Pricing? Regardless of the pricing, most of these DLC characters will be from games that already exist i.e recycled. I read the link you posted. The base game will be 6000 yen or about $54. That's for 20 characters, only TWO of which are new. The game and ALL the DLC will be 10500 yen which comes out to 94 dollars. Again, how many of these will be new characters considering what we know about the first 20 in the base roster?

    Based on the details we know of right now, there is plenty of reason to be upset and I'm glad that many people are feeling the same way.

    Don't directly equate Japanese prices with US ones as they are different and not everything lines up to $60. For example, Monster Hunter World is retailing for 9000+ yen, and that's just the regular edition. The point Novril is trying to make is that the game is coming out cheaper than average in Japan, and that it'll likely be cheaper than average when it comes out in the west.
  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU RIP Mahvel 2017-2017 Joined: Posts: 11,286
    I can't believe people are actually defending ArcSys on this shit

    A bunch of reused assets isn't worth 20$ and they shouldn't be sold AFTERWARDS, not to mention splitting up Team RWBY via DLC

    The reveal basically delayed the purchase of this game for me until 2019, when it will actually be completed
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  • FatalSeabassFatalSeabass Seabass is lethal! Joined: Posts: 1,189
    tataki wrote: »
    Tell me. What ARE we missing here?
    I gave an example for a "$60" game in Japan. Videogames cost a bit more in Japan so claiming the JPY price of BBCTB is exactly the price we'll get in dollars is dishonest. You also said 10800 is the price for the game + DLC, but it also includes the physical merchandise. You've decided in advance that the pricing is a ripoff (even though it isn't) and you seem to ignore any fact that disproves this narrative.

    I didn't know that about the pricing in Japan, so that's my bad. However, the bigger picture that's being hinted here is that rice point is irrelevant. 20 DLC is half the roster. DLC, who I'm banking on a majority being recycled, which is insanity. This announcement has deflated the hype for a lot of people and rightfully so. The only other DLC practice I can think of that comes this close in the realm of fighting games is the SFxT debacle. That game had the decency of having 38 characters, 19 of which were from Tekken and 5 of which were new to SF4 and that was still a shitshow. Only reason why this didn't gain the traction that SFxT did is because it's a niche anime fighter.

    I normally don't ever want to see a company suffer but this game should tank. Because of it's target audience, it most likely will. Because of this announcement? It DEFINITELY will.
  • yah yaahh b*tch!yah yaahh b*tch! thats my b*tch Joined: Posts: 6,104
    At this point I dont see why or how you guys (some of you) cant plean to send 60-80 for a fighter including DLC.

    Half the ppl complaining dont even play snime fighters..never post in the GG or UNIB threads.

    Go figure
  • FatalSeabassFatalSeabass Seabass is lethal! Joined: Posts: 1,189
    UNIEL forums here are a barren wasteland. I say this as an Akatsuki/Enkidu main who tries to hit up the UNiB forums every chance I get to get some games in. I play GG with people on Discord from here or GG specific Discords. I don't need to post in forums related to anime fighters to talk about insane DLC practices in said anime fighters. Hell, you don't even need to play fighting games religiously to know that what's happening here is bullshit. Does Jim Sterling's video on Cross Tag Battle's disgusting DLC lose credibility because he's not a fighting game aficionado?
  • Raging_ZoroarkRaging_Zoroark Disgraceful! Joined: Posts: 1,495
    Considering that only half of the roster will be available in the base game and that most of the assets are reused, I'm not getting near this game unless the price for the base game is $20.
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  • VoltVolt The Ultra Plastic Warrior Joined: Posts: 3,473
    Ok, if (And that's a very big if, let's be honest) the price tag for the game including DLC is relatively on par with standard FG's, I'll take a look at it.

    If it's a cheap base game so people can pick it up quickly and start buying DLC as they see fit, it has a shot of being a good marketing strategy that may end up making it more popular in the long run.

    40 characters is also a pretty small roster considering how big the pool for characters is. There's going to be a lot of characters left behind, especially from Persona and Uni.

    If it's a lower-priced, but not exactly a cheap game, then the strat falls flat. People won't want to buy a game and then pay a ton of DLC.

    There's also the issue of actually getting matches. We can expect Delay-Based netcode and no Crossplay, which means you'll actively need players with the game on the same platform as yours relatively close to you.

    And we all know Ranked is a barren wasteland in anime games, with most matches happening because of forums/discord.


    Looking at it right now, Cross Tag does not sound like a good investment at all.
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  • SaandroSaandro Joined: Posts: 217
    Let's be real here. The only reason they're pulling this shit is because this game was destined to be niche to begin with. They are just banking on extracting more money from the people who will buy this game no matter what.
  • Red Rick DiasRed Rick Dias AEUG Mass Production Heavy Attack Use Mobile Suit Joined: Posts: 3,362
    Well, it's a very risky guess on their part. I'm going to be paying VERY close attention to the price points involved in all this, and if I don't like what I see then I might just walk away.

    If they're asking $60-70 grand total for the whole roster (base game plus DLC combined cost) then okay, I'm in with no real problems. $80 will be a "I'll have to think about it; how much enjoyment am I going to get out of this game" mark. Anything over that and I'm likely to walk off.
  • iminthenet2iminthenet2 Joined: Posts: 497
    I'm not going to buy BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle at launch because of this DLC controversy. I'll wait for a price drop.
  • 71M3BR34K3RR4D17Z71M3BR34K3RR4D17Z That One Guy Joined: Posts: 233
    I can't believe Yang and Blake are DLC! I was expecting Phyrra, Penny, Cinder, or (out of left field) Velvet Scarlatina (bunny girl has moveset potential).
    Such a waste!
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  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU RIP Mahvel 2017-2017 Joined: Posts: 11,286
    Volt wrote: »
    40 characters is also a pretty small roster considering how big the pool for characters is. There's going to be a lot of characters left behind, especially from Persona and Uni.
    .
    This is what bothers me the most. You'd think there would be 30+ characters AT LAUNCH given how 90% of the roster is already finished and the only work ArcSys is (supposedly) doing is adjusting the sprites to bring non-BB franchises to be more inline with BB's visual style, and tweaking the movelists (sadly to the point of straight up removing moves in favour of a simpler control system). Given that they're launching with 20, game is coming out in May, AND they're going to be releasing another 20 charas over who knows how many months (I fear it will stretch out well into 2019 if they don't release character packs on a monthly basis) - it screams that the project is rushed and underbudgeted, AND the general consensus is after all is said and then there will be a total of

    20 blazblue characters
    8 UNIEL characters
    8 Persona characters
    and 4 RWBY girls

    That just sounds like all kinds of whack to me, and it;s unknown if they have any plans beyond the upcoming DLC that are currently announced
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  • LivewireXLivewireX Joined: Posts: 5,992
    Well, the ratio there really shouldn't be all that surprising. I mean, it IS still a Blazblue game first and foremost.
  • LordxMugenLordxMugen FIGHTAN GAHMS!!! Joined: Posts: 699
    PVL_93_RU wrote: »
    I can't believe people are actually defending ArcSys on this shit

    A bunch of reused assets isn't worth 20$ and they shouldn't be sold AFTERWARDS, not to mention splitting up Team RWBY via DLC

    The reveal basically delayed the purchase of this game for me until 2019, when it will actually be completed
    oh i wont touch this game AT ALL now. The greed of Arcsys is just too much for me this time.
    At this point I dont see why or how you guys (some of you) cant plean to send 60-80 for a fighter including DLC.

    Half the ppl complaining dont even play snime fighters..never post in the GG or UNIB threads.

    Go figure
    Well im a PC player so what am i supposed to do if NOBODY plays it on my system of choice? sure as fuck not touching console versions.

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  • Evolution169Evolution169 Wake up DP is unbeatable Joined: Posts: 1,100
    So if I'm understanding this correctly, the base game only including half of the planned roster was their plan to give people the ability to only buy the characters that they want? Fine, but it already has 20 characters that they may or may not want.

    Seems like they wanted to try a new business model but got cold feet.
  • grandabxgrandabx Flameater Joined: Posts: 703 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    ribu wrote: »
    Really wish Arcs had laid out the pricing for this in USD as well. Game is getting a lot of backlash that isn't 100% justified yet.

    They should've had an American representative a LONG time ago.
    I remember when people thought Bison doing the psycho crusher back and forth across the screen in SF:CE was cheap.
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  • VoltVolt The Ultra Plastic Warrior Joined: Posts: 3,473
    So if I'm understanding this correctly, the base game only including half of the planned roster was their plan to give people the ability to only buy the characters that they want? Fine, but it already has 20 characters that they may or may not want.

    Seems like they wanted to try a new business model but got cold feet.

    Pretty much. This strat doesn't work at all unless you tell people the price upfront so they think it's a sweet deal.

    Otherwise... Well, we're seeing the reactions already, aren't we?
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  • AceKombatAceKombat (́◕◞౪◟◕‵) ”WINNERS DON’T USE ALMIGHTY.” Joined: Posts: 2,199
    edited January 18
    tataki wrote: »

    Well if misinformation isn't going to keep spreading, something would have to keep people spreading "downplay" type of information, no?... because it could pose a problem when even basic media targets don't have a full understanding:

    (to those that happen to care, beware of the eventhubs link):
    https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2018/jan/17/blazblue-cross-tag-battle-will-have-whopping-20-characters-dlc-and-its-become-quite-controversial-topic/

    SPOILER = Direct text
    The controversy of BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle's DLC announcement - Why is doubling the roster post-launch being seen as a bad thing?
    BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle has gotten into some hot water, and this will help you understand why




    Last week after the ArcSys Fighting Game Awards, the release date and full 20 character launch roster for BlazBlue Cross Tag Battle was announced.

    While this is normally something to celebrate and be happy about, there was a very dark cloud hovering above this announcement as well.

    The trailer shown was for the character Blake Belladona from RWBY, and that she'll be joining the battle... as DLC after release.

    Not only that, but it was also announced that the roster would be doubled post-release, eventually going from the 20 characters in the base roster to a large 40 character roster.

    So what's the controversy here? A lot of people will think it's obvious, but in case you don't, look no further than right below for some more insight into what's causing such a ruckus across the internet.

    Downloadable content, or DLC, is a pretty controversial subject in gaming. The point of it is to extend a game's lifespan by delivering additional content to the game after its launch, to keep players engaged.

    While that sounds like a pretty neat thing, the unfortunate reality is that many games end up taking advantage of their consumers, by withholding already completed content from the initial release and locking it behind a paywall, essentially forcing consumers to pay full price for an incomplete product, and then being asked for more money later on to unlock the full experience.

    In fighting games, the by far most famous and egregious example of this was back in 2012, when it was discovered that 12 characters that were eventually added as DLC to Capcom's Street Fighter X Tekken were already fully functional, and in fact even on the game's disc, but locked out from consumers behind a paywall.

    Since then, no scandals of the same magnitude have surfaced, although a recurring theme that has soured players on DLC is it being announced before a game's release. Just in recent memory, we've been told by developers about Season Passes and Character Packs and all sorts of things ahead of release for Injustice 2, Marvel vs. Capcom: Infinite and most recently Dragon Ball FighterZ.


    That's enough out of you, Capcom.

    Although DLC is something that is often being mishandled by developers, it's an unfortunate reality for anyone who does not like it that as long as it keeps selling, which it clearly does, it is not going to go away, so this practice is simply something everyone will have to get used to, and the best we can hope for is that companies improve their way of going about DLC.

    Unfortunately, although Arc System Works have done a stellar job in the past with their games, although they might be a bit too re-release heavy at times, they don't seem to have gotten the DLC memo for their upcoming title BlazBlue: Cross Tag Battle.

    There are a lot of missteps in their approach to DLC, based on what we can see so far, and it's no surprise that consumers are reacting with frustration.

    This actually relates back to an article I wrote a few months back about the DLC practices of companies, and how they should be kept fair for both consumers and the game development companies behind the projects.

    In my previous piece, I listed several things companies should ideally try to avoid if they want their playerbase to feel fairly treated and satisfied when purchasing DLC.

    The very first point I brought up and tried to hammer home was that for consumers to not feel duped, which is the worst thing you can make them feel, you need to produce the content post-launch, or at the very least make it seem like you have. It's business, we can't always get what we want, but at least market it in a way that players feel like you care.

    Announcing that there will be 20 DLC characters and showing gameplay footage of one of them 6 months ahead of the game's release is a perfect example of how to do the complete opposite of that.

    The following point I articulated back in November is that it's important for players to not feel that the core game, which they are paying full price for, has been cheapened, but rather that the DLC enhances an already complete game.

    From the company's perspective, it's going to be hard to argue this, because while this is an interesting crossover concept between 3 fighting game series, and newly added RWBY franchise characters, it's hard to ignore the fact that 90% of the launch roster consists of characters that have effectively been copypasted from their respective franchise.


    The value of blending popular franchises cannot be understated, but you still need to put in work for your fans.

    Crossovers are always fun, and seeing your favorite fighters engage with eachother in new ways is interesting, but the novelty can only go so far. With a roster that only has 2 new characters, Ruby and Weiss from RWBY, and a promise of doubling the roster via DLC, it's not hard to get uneasy about the game itself.

    Another worrying factor is that when you look at the DLC, it's highly likely that much of that will be brought over from the previous games as well. If you're getting charged premium rates after already having bought the game for franchise veterans like Bang, Carmine or Naoto, it's bound to leave a sour aftertaste.

    To be clear, doubling a game's roster via DLC is definitely not a bad thing at its core. It's great to engage players and bring them more of their favorites as time goes on.

    However, the handling of it has been abysmal. If Arc System Works want to keep DLC as a cornerstone for their fighting games moving forward, they need to be much smarter in how to go about it.

    DLC is a tricky subject, and one we aren't going to be rid of in the near future, but it's important as consumers to take a stand against dishonest practices.

    Hopefully Arc System Works put out an amazing game that makes it feel worth it at launch, and the DLC ends up only enhancing the game further. Even if this ideal scenario occurs, though, let's try from now on to not announce any DLC half a year before the game is even out, okay?

    For the most part, regardless if the pricing is actually lenient (which is nice and as it should be), the prices should of definitely be communicated accordingly to avoid controversy like this, especially when you have this much content to be released all in one go.
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  • Missing PersonMissing Person Quickly becoming the Sailor Moon S guy. Joined: Posts: 14,106
    At this point I dont see why or how you guys (some of you) cant plean to send 60-80 for a fighter including DLC.

    Half the ppl complaining dont even play snime fighters..never post in the GG or UNIB threads.

    Go figure

    Says the nigga who only shows up in this thread when he runs out of midol and doesn't feel like going to RiteAid.
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  • Missing PersonMissing Person Quickly becoming the Sailor Moon S guy. Joined: Posts: 14,106
    I'm still getting this game, only to play Makoto/Chie to spite the aforementioned.

    If I see a BBCTB Extend II Accent Core after this, I'm done trying with ASW.
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  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,402 mod
    edited January 19
    Fun fact, the base game of Dragon Ball FighterZ (with no DLC) costs 12,300 yen on PS4 and 17,657 yen on XBox One (on Amazon.jp), more than this game's limited edition.
  • Red Rick DiasRed Rick Dias AEUG Mass Production Heavy Attack Use Mobile Suit Joined: Posts: 3,362
    That's okay. I'm not exactly planning on buying DBFZ in any event.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,402 mod
    The point was to show how different game pricing is in Japan and how BBTag isn't exactly average price by their standards.
  • LivewireXLivewireX Joined: Posts: 5,992
    It's okay, when people are trying to prove a point or rationalize things, it's really amazing that they'll overlook just about anything and everything just to be able to feel like they're right.
  • XhominidXhominid Knight of Dizzy Joined: Posts: 625
    http://www.siliconera.com/2018/01/24/blazblue-cross-tag-battle-director-talks-dlc-pricing/

    They REALLY should have clarified that this was what they was aiming for...
    Would have REALLY helped not cultivate the image they was making for themselves.
  • King of penguinsKing of penguins Joined: Posts: 524
    Xhominid wrote: »
    http://www.siliconera.com/2018/01/24/blazblue-cross-tag-battle-director-talks-dlc-pricing/

    They REALLY should have clarified that this was what they was aiming for...
    Would have REALLY helped not cultivate the image they was making for themselves.

    Indeed that should have been announced at the same time as"20 Char are DLC".
  • LivewireXLivewireX Joined: Posts: 5,992
    Either way, I'm glad that this stuff is getting cleared up now. Of course, this won't stop people from still flipping their shit and overreacting about it, but those people would always bitch regardless of what's going on.
  • HecatomHecatom Aka Black Gorilla (・Д・)ノ Joined: Posts: 24,341
    Xhominid wrote: »
    http://www.siliconera.com/2018/01/24/blazblue-cross-tag-battle-director-talks-dlc-pricing/

    They REALLY should have clarified that this was what they was aiming for...
    Would have REALLY helped not cultivate the image they was making for themselves.

    It was pretty obvious just by seeing the price of the deluxe edition being lower than the price of a new retail game.
    People now just look at an excuse to jump the gun at the 1st chance they get.
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  • LivewireXLivewireX Joined: Posts: 5,992
    Oh totally agree. They don't even get halfway finished reading or looking into something before they're flipping tables and shouting bloody murder like somebody just started punting babies Snitsky-style.
  • PreppyPreppy act like you're used to it Joined: Posts: 14,538 admin
    Moved to the BlazBlue forum. :tup:

    i film things

  • PVL_93_RUPVL_93_RU RIP Mahvel 2017-2017 Joined: Posts: 11,286
    Just a reminder we STILL don't have an official Western pricing for the game and its DLC

    But apparently the Western branch of ArcSys is going to clarify that soon
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    - SFV - Ryu
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    - DBFZ* - Trunks/Yamcha/Gohan
    - UNI[ST]* - Enkidu
    - Tekken 7 - Hwoarang & Kazuya
    *to be purchased
  • appoappo (¬‿¬) Joined: Posts: 5,266
    edited January 26
    based on theire pricing i would guess the base game will be something around 40-50 and the "full package" 70-80€uro

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