MvCI Morrigan Thread: Come, I'll show you such pleasures!

White AngelWhite Angel Shadow Blade!Joined: Posts: 104
edited November 2 in Morrigan Aensland
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Post edited by White Angel on

Comments

  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    I'm going to main Team Darkstalkers (as is Chris G) so looking forward to how she develops. Love her in Time Stone to use the storm to bring back some of the old bullet hell goodness.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • White AngelWhite Angel Shadow Blade! Joined: Posts: 104
    edited September 20
    Post edited by White Angel on
  • MightyMarMightyMar Why you lose to me? Joined: Posts: 391
    I'm going to main Team Darkstalkers (as is Chris G) so looking forward to how she develops. Love her in Time Stone to use the storm to bring back some of the old bullet hell goodness.

    I'm going to run Team Darkstalkers too. I'm having a ton of fun messing around in the lab with them. I'm using Reality Stone and Power Stone.
    "Step back loser! Make way for the winner!"
    "That was the worst strategy ever. Buy an official book!"

    Why You Lose To Me?
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    So I've been messing around with Morrigan trying to figure out her new zoning game now that bullet hell is gone minus Time Storm. Like I figured the key is the new harmonius spear special. I'll have a video coming out soon that shows why that move is OD for her zoning.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • quicksquicks Joined: Posts: 3,297
    Lol heres me rushing down like a lunatic
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    Harmonious Spear is what lets Morrigan control space now. You can place both the LK and HK spears on screen at once. Plus have multiple spears on screen with astral.




    This is what you can do with meters and stone storm.

    g51VP3.gif


    Causes HKD so you can get full combos off a hit as well.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • White AngelWhite Angel Shadow Blade! Joined: Posts: 104
    Very vice insight video @DevilJin 01! I like the idea the use of the "Harmonious Spear" in Time Stone Infinity Storm. It definitely makes her zoning game better.
  • quicksquicks Joined: Posts: 3,297
    So how good is she actually? I honestly think she's better than Jedah but I think Jedah usage is going to drop massively
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    edited September 26
    quicks wrote: »
    So how good is she actually? I honestly think she's better than Jedah but I think Jedah usage is going to drop massively

    Why do you think she's better than Jedah? I honestly am just having a lot of fun with both of them since I play Team Darkstalkers any way.

    Jedah is definitely easier to play initially with easier bnbs, but his optimized flight pressure and mix up will take some time. Morrigan will take time to optimize in all areas so won't see her as much for a while. Think she has good potential though. One of the best ADD games, new changes to air dashes allow her to air HP you and then just go nuts with different direction ADFs and ADDs, still has strong air buttons like shell kick and j.HP and astral vision with spears allow her to cover up a good part of the neutral as well. Very versatile character.

    Mash c.LP is still really good too. Shadow blade isn't as easy to use to defend with by yourself, but still good as an escape with tag cancel. Shadow servant is still one of the best invincible supers and gives her space when she needs it as well.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • quicksquicks Joined: Posts: 3,297
    quicks wrote: »
    So how good is she actually? I honestly think she's better than Jedah but I think Jedah usage is going to drop massively

    Why do you think she's better than Jedah? I honestly am just having a lot of fun with both of them since I play Team Darkstalkers any way.

    Jedah is definitely easier to play initially with easier bnbs, but his optimized flight pressure and mix up will take some time. Morrigan will take time to optimize in all areas so won't see her as much for a while. Think she has good potential though. One of the best ADD games, new changes to air dashes allow her to air HP you and then just go nuts with different direction ADFs and ADDs, still has strong air buttons like shell kick and j.HP and astral vision with spears allow her to cover up a good part of the neutral as well. Very versatile character.

    Mash c.LP is still really good too. Shadow blade isn't as easy to use to defend with by yourself, but still good as an escape with tag cancel. Shadow servant is still one of the best invincible supers and gives her space when she needs it as well.

    Jedah has the same mobility options but he's dashes are really slow and open, he's good for a support but he has no way to deal with being put under pressure, his escape options are not good

    It would be too teir if they was one character tbh
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,142 mod
    Y'all need to be doing Spear into Time Surge on incoming.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    edited September 29
    quicks wrote: »
    quicks wrote: »
    So how good is she actually? I honestly think she's better than Jedah but I think Jedah usage is going to drop massively

    Why do you think she's better than Jedah? I honestly am just having a lot of fun with both of them since I play Team Darkstalkers any way.

    Jedah is definitely easier to play initially with easier bnbs, but his optimized flight pressure and mix up will take some time. Morrigan will take time to optimize in all areas so won't see her as much for a while. Think she has good potential though. One of the best ADD games, new changes to air dashes allow her to air HP you and then just go nuts with different direction ADFs and ADDs, still has strong air buttons like shell kick and j.HP and astral vision with spears allow her to cover up a good part of the neutral as well. Very versatile character.

    Mash c.LP is still really good too. Shadow blade isn't as easy to use to defend with by yourself, but still good as an escape with tag cancel. Shadow servant is still one of the best invincible supers and gives her space when she needs it as well.

    Jedah has the same mobility options but he's dashes are really slow and open, he's good for a support but he has no way to deal with being put under pressure, his escape options are not good

    It would be too teir if they was one character tbh

    Ah ok. Well I guess it makes sense for me to use Time Jedah any way since he's more more mobile with teleport. Can always just port tag if the oppression is getting near.

    I think his air qcb+K Turbine will also be good to improve his mobility as it's basically a super far travelling dive kick that moves him up and out of the air from most of the neutral. Then can just tag after as long as you have partner.

    d3v wrote: »
    Y'all need to be doing Spear into Time Surge on incoming.


    What can you get from that?

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,142 mod
    edited October 8
    d3v wrote: »
    Y'all need to be doing Spear into Time Surge on incoming.


    What can you get from that?

    Dirt.


    Generally, the lesson from this match is that if you should pair Morrigan with a character with good lockdown that works with Time and just RTSD.
  • DimeDime Wasting time Joined: Posts: 11,117
    edited October 8
    Watching this makes me want to pair her with ultron point. Been looking for a character with good high/low mixups to pair with him while using wongs ultron lockdown strat.
    Gettin' my derp on.
  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,142 mod
    For those who want to just watch the incoming setup.
    https://streamable.com/4rl0t

    That said, when Champ did this, he said he still hadn't tested it out against all incomings. So maybe holding forward might beat it.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    edited October 9
    Seems like attack start up is clearly more honest compared to Marvel 3. Even Morrigan's lights are no faster than 5 frame start up. If that is the fastest that's really interesting for a Capcom 2d fighter.


    Looks like her LP shadow blade is 4 frame start up. I guess that's the only way you're getting anything faster unless it's a super grab or something.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • DimeDime Wasting time Joined: Posts: 11,117
    Seems like attack start up is clearly more honest compared to Marvel 3. Even Morrigan's lights are no faster than 5 frame start up. If that is the fastest that's really interesting for a Capcom 2d fighter.


    Looks like her LP shadow blade is 4 frame start up. I guess that's the only way you're getting anything faster unless it's a super grab or something.

    Slower startup moves are the norm for rollback based games because rollbacks can be much more easily hidden in the startup frames of slower normals than faster ones.

    Skullgirls fastest startup normal is ms fortunes jab which is 5 frames of startup. Most jabs are around 7-9 frames of startup. Painwheels cr.lk is 11 frame startup for one of the slowest weak attacks in the game.
    Gettin' my derp on.
  • White AngelWhite Angel Shadow Blade! Joined: Posts: 104
    Morrigan Missions performed by me.

  • d3vd3v Coughing DAT PINK SPIT Joined: Posts: 37,142 mod
    If anyone's watching SEAM. Champo (the guy who's running Morrigan May Cry in that vid I posted) is in top 8, losers side, after falling to Eliver. At the very least, @DevilJin 01 should try to catch it.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    edited October 20
    Yeah I've already watched all of it. He did pretty good until he fought Kazunoko and ended up switching to reality stone just to get some control over his play. Still need to put together some of that tempest lockdown and corner setups off the crazy dance. The neutral of the team I'm starting to get down though.



    Oh and random thing about Morrigan. I picked this up watching Sonicfox. Now with the new air dash system it allows you to air dash earlier after doing a directional forward forward dash. Doing a forward forward dash allows Morrigan to float forward in the air without using up an air dash or going into flight. This is cool because now you can float up over someone's head to look as if you're going to cross them up, then air dash backwards and hit them back in front. Sonicfox does this with Jedah all of the time when he has people near the corner (with enough space to cross them up) or in the space box and it's pretty much a guaranteed opener.

    In Marvel 3 you couldn't really do this too well as you needed to be up way too high in the air to air dash to make a viable mix up out of it. Now it's pretty easy to do with both of the Darkstalkers.


    Which means this essentially gives you a 3 option mix up just off of a forward dash.

    1. Forward dsah in j.HP (hit in front, non cross up)
    2. Forward dash in j.HP (hit as cross up over their back)
    3. Forward dash in, air dash backwards j.HP (hits back in front, fake cross up).

    That's 3 possible scenarios to block with no low involved. If you do this right after a lockdown special tagged in from another character like Dante you get a free 3 option right after the block stun ends. Just have to make sure to wait for the block stun to end from the tagged move as left/right auto block sets in during most tagged in attacks. Morrigan can start her air dash after the forward dash a little bit faster and a bit lower to the ground than Jedah can so you can start the pressure even faster with her.

    With a button dash (2P/PP) you can still get a 3 way that involves cross up low as well.

    1. Button dash j.HP (hits in front, non cross up)
    2. Button dash j.HP (hits in back, cross up)
    3. Button dash j.MK or j.HK to whiff and land on the ground, c.LK (cross up low)

    NOTE: button dash j.MK/HK whiff requires them to be crouching to perform. You'll want to bait them with some lows to get that option to work.



    With these options you can pretty much make Morrigan near unblockable once you get in. I already have people chicken blocking and super jumping away from my Morrigan as it is, so with this stuff they'll be trying even more. These mix ups are much harder to reaction chicken block than box dash HP and make your cross up low easier than having to go up in the air and dash down. Which can be easy to screw up with the height restriction and make you just whiff in the air.
    Post edited by DevilJin 01 on

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • DimeDime Wasting time Joined: Posts: 11,117
    Yeah I've already watched all of it. He did pretty good until he fought Kazunoko and ended up switching to reality stone just to get some control over his play. Still need to put together some of that tempest lockdown and corner setups off the crazy dance. The neutral of the team I'm starting to get down though.



    Oh and random thing about Morrigan. I picked this up watching Sonicfox. Now with the new air dash system it allows you to air dash earlier after doing a directional forward forward dash. Doing a forward forward dash allows Morrigan to float forward in the air without using up an air dash or going into flight. This is cool because now you can float up over someone's head to look as if you're going to cross them up, then air dash backwards and hit them back in front. Sonicfox does this with Jedah all of the time when he has people near the corner (with enough space to cross them up) or in the space box and it's pretty much a guaranteed opener.

    In Marvel 3 you couldn't really do this too well as you needed to be up way too high in the air to air dash to make a viable mix up out of it. Now it's pretty easy to do with both of the Darkstalkers.


    Which means this essentially gives you a 3 option mix up just off of a forward dash.

    1. Forward dsah in j.HP (hit in front, non cross up)
    2. Forward dash in j.HP (hit as cross up over their back)
    3. Forward dash in, air dash backwards j.HP (hits back in front, fake cross up).

    That's 3 possible scenarios to block with no low involved. If you do this right after a lockdown special tagged in from another character like Dante you get a free 3 option right after the block stun ends. Just have to make sure to wait for the block stun to end from the tagged move as left/right auto block sets in during most tagged in attacks. Morrigan can start her air dash after the forward dash a little bit faster and a bit lower to the ground than Jedah can so you can start the pressure even faster with her.

    With a button dash (2P/PP) you can still get a 3 way that involves cross up low as well.

    1. Button dash j.HP (hits in front, non cross up)
    2. Button dash j.HP (hits in back, cross up)
    3. Button dash j.MK or j.HK to whiff and land on the ground, c.LK (cross up low)



    With these options you can pretty much make Morrigan near unblockable once you get in. I already have people chicken blocking and super jumping away from my Morrigan as it is, so with this stuff they'll be trying even more.

    Yeah, those mixups are good if your opponent isn't in lockdown, but if they are those mixups don't work :(

    And if they aren't, the opponent can just do some shit... but still decent mixups nonetheless.

    Don't forget that off of button dash crossup jhp that you can cancel into a back airdash jhp to go back to the other side. Same as an ultron that does like jhp, land> fly> box dash jhp crossup xx airbackdash jhp for another crossup back to the other side.

    Champ has used that specific mixup a few times, but it's kinda hard to setup because you need a slow flight cancel and your starting button to not be pushblocked.
    Gettin' my derp on.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    edited October 20
    Dime wrote: »

    Yeah, those mixups are good if your opponent isn't in lockdown, but if they are those mixups don't work :(

    That was something I already was theorizing when I heard about the auto guard thing before the game came out. That's also why I said this.

    If you do this right after a lockdown special tagged in from another character like Dante you get a free 3 option right after the block stun ends. Just have to make sure to wait for the block stun to end from the tagged move as left/right auto block sets in during most tagged in attacks.

    Pretty much explaining that you can do exactly what you are saying you can't do. If you want to do a left/right during a lockdown you just wait for the block stun to end and you get a free heavy advantaged left/right setup because right after the block stun ends they are free to the left right at big disadvantage. Unless they have an invincible super or frame 1 hyper armor the cross up is free to perform. Which since you're playing Morrigan you get extra way because you have high and low cross ups.


    Which if they somehow still block that your partner should be recovered in time for you to string them in afterwards for more lockdown and more shit that they can't chicken block. Sonicfox tends to do these crosses/fake crosses raw against someone in the spacebox, but with a lockdown tool you can pretty much do it anywhere right after block stun is over. Which means someone like Jedah can pretty much do it on his own once he locks you down with a wheel. Works often as people are looking at Jedah flying behind them for what would seem like a cross up overhead/low, then dashes back in front when you're most likely already holding forward.

    The only thing you'd really need to work on is figuring the timing so that you can create the crosses/fake crosses while not leaving too much of a gap to be mash anti aired. Which since Morrigan can do her set up lower to the ground with a nice j.HP hit box it should easy enough.
    Post edited by DevilJin 01 on

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • White AngelWhite Angel Shadow Blade! Joined: Posts: 104
    Shoutout to Ketsui for demonstrating how to deal Dormammu's Rose Garden for Morrigan!


  • EnDaNickofTimeEnDaNickofTime Joined: Posts: 732
    oh boy So I suck at this game coming from Marvel 3. I'm playing Sigma/Morrigan is that a good place to start? Any tricks to creating relentless pressure with morrigan? Also I think she is great with time stone, but I'm thinking power stone because you can't reflect projectiles in the surge.
  • benjidurdenbenjidurden Joined: Posts: 16
    Shoutout to Ketsui for demonstrating how to deal Dormammu's Rose Garden for Morrigan!



    This is such an awesome post, thanks for sharing! Definitely gonna try this out later on.
  • AcidicEnemaAcidicEnema Joined: Posts: 1,266 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    I remember reading somewhere that plink air dashes still work in this game. Can Morri plink dash during flight mode? Every time I try, my flight cancels the moment I do an air dash attack
    "Studio-produced hetero porn is just a joke. Either the men are actually trying to steal screen time from the actress, or the cameraman is trying to give the actor a colonoscopy." - Taito
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 57,999 mod
    edited December 6
    You can cancel air dashes into jabs to get like a funky dash cancel, but that's all I know of. Morrigan's isn't bad, but not as good as like Nova's or Iron Man's.

    zKP5Q7.gif

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


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