Info on the Old School SF Scene?

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  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    please....

    stop whining about the death of SF at alpha

    just because you couldn't adapt to the lack of GUILE!!!

    yeah alpha and 3s totally changed SF. Those who couldn't/wouldn't adapt were left behind.

    more like... you quit cuz you couldn't hang and random people were beating your ass!


    on another note, SF2 times were probably the "purest" SF times. Every arcade/liquor store/pizza parlor/convenience store had it cuz it was a sure fire money maker. I remember going to the liquor store almost everyday just to check it out (or check out the lastest hack of SF2:CE :P ).

    anyways, i love my sf2 roms, you get to hold on too a piece of history (like i remember the time i did chun's spinning bird kick countering a blanka roll that did like half damage). And the first time i saw someone do a sonic boom from crouch (WTF!!!!). The first big combo for us was ryu fierce into jab DP. We didn't know it was a combo tho, more like "pressing punch twice gave more damage."
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Ah yes! The only place I played SF1 at was at a laundermat...I'm glad SF1 is in one of those new Ultracade 32 cabinets man those things are the bomb, dozens of games like Legendary Wings, Higemaru, Ghouls n Ghosts and WW, Champ and Turbo.

    But at Southpark Mall back in the early 1990's I was just turning 10 years old getting over my fear of arcades (don't ask). And that night was the first time I saw all 3 editions, World Warrior Turbo and Champion editions in action. I was pretty much not a scrub but an OUTCAST for being my age while all the good SF players were high schoolers, I don't know where those guys went now, except for this one guy, who is a total BEAST with Ken, and used to get 60+ win streaks on Mortal Kombat every weekend. Ever since 3rd Strike's been out he's been coming back quite every now and then. Back then I was playing SF2, but didn't feel like waiting in that big group waiting to step up. But either way I learned the concept of what SF is about: Through the SNK Neo Geo MVS Choice machine otherwise it was Forgotten Worlds, Final Fight or Turtles in Time. But the most I played was Fatal Fury 2 when I beat alot of people I don't know how many times I won because fighting games didn't record win streaks back then. Then I went to playing SF when the crowds started to thin up a little. Still got beat but not as bad as before...I didn't even know how to do a Dragon Punch then....


    And I remember when Alpha came out also. I loved (and I still do) those Darkstalker-esque graphics, and so was X-Men: COTA.
  • MillionMillion King of Creeps Joined: Posts: 10,956 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    more like... you quit cuz you couldn't hang and random people were beating your ass!
    cheh,

    Nah, by that time people around here were barely going to arcades, so when I gave Alpha 1 a chance, I was playing the CPU. Nobody else was even near the machine, and I soon found out why:lol: It was so boring and bland...I walked away in the middle of my game....and left the arcade.:lol:

    At least the graphics looked cool.
    Personally, I thought Alpha 2 made up for it, but it was already much too late by then. The "SF Scene" here was dead, and it would never recover.:(
  • Josh-TheFunkDOCJosh-TheFunkDOC Double Dutch! Joined: Posts: 2,404 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    When I say "the death of SF", I am referring to when it stopped being on top of the videogame world. Now it's just another underground scene...for the time being anyway.

    Josh the FunkDOC
    http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-speedrunning - My live stream, mainly speedruns w/ some other stuff now and then
  • OneEyedJackOneEyedJack Representing Nova Scotia! Joined: Posts: 216
    I love this thread! Don't let it die!
    -Jon in Canada

    Remember, the game tells you who was the better player at the end of the match.
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Old Skool lore - Final Round - Part 1 (LONG)

    Back in the day, I always paged Tony with my code - 7311. This time he called me back a couple minutes later on his cell phone and explained that he was running late due to some domestic trouble.

    Me: "So what happened, dude?"

    Tony: "How do I explain it, dude? She was just tripping, you know? It's like... It's like you know when you're just playing some fool and it's all good, but out of nowhere he goes for the tap-tap-throw?"

    Me: "No doubt, dude. Did you break-out the technique?

    Tony: "Well... I had every right to cross
    her up with deep roundhouse, ducking short, standing jab to
    uppercut, you know? But if I do that, and don't give her a round, she'll take her tokens and go home."

    Me: "I hear you, dude. But after she went for the tick throw, it's all fair game, in my opinion. So what did you do?"

    Tony: "Basically, I just took it back to Remedial. I gave her a little
    fierce-forward-fireball, a little fierce-strong-flashkick, know what I'm saying? So, she knows I'm in control of the game flow but that I was merciful and gave her Second despite her transgressions."

    Me: "I hear that, dude. Good shit. But I mean, in the overall scheme of the World Warrior Tournament, what's in store? You think she'll ever compete on the next level? I mean, when two fools step up they can just sit there and throw each other all over the screen but what's the point. Why play at all, know what I'm saying?"

    Tony: "I hear you but I don't know, dude, at this point she doesn't possess the knowledge that a fist of fire can destroy. You know it's like when you're just having an off day and you lose to the computer and the timer is running down and you're out of tokens. Sometimes you go back to the token machine, sometimes you just hop up in the Ride and roll out to Dennys."

    Me: "Yeah, dude, and sometimes you hop in the Ride and travel the world to face a wider variety of opponents."

    Tony: "Exactly."

    Me: "I hear you."

    Tony: "Let's go play Turbo."

    Me: "Good shit."

    When words failed us, we put things in "Street Fighter" terms and we knew exactly what the other guy was trying to say.

    I forcibly restricted myself from playing Street Fighter because of College. I started College that Fall at a school that is not known for its academic posterity, but it is known for its hair. Yes, I'm speaking of the one, the only, Chabot College, a.k.a. "Hesperian High". No other school came close to Chabot's female student body in boasting the biggest, highest, most obnoxiously unnatractive hair-styles ever to scrape the pleather from the roof of a Honda Civic hatchback as that bastion of education in Hayward, California. But at $13 a unit, who was I to complain? Especially since I was paying my own way.

    As soon as I realized most of my classes employed some sort of a Curve, spelling my name correctly pretty much assured I would get a passing grade. Thus, after getting over the "shock" of college, I spent most of my time in the rec room.

    The Chabot rec room was a little ten-game affair next to the cafeteria. It reminded me of the old 7-11 and Two Star days because it was always crowded and hot. There were always guys that couldn't speak english. I used to listen closely and try to figure out if it was manadarin, cantonese, thai or vietnemese. I could swear like a sailor in all of those languages. Spend as much time in Bay Area arcades as I did growing up and you just picked this sort of thing up.

    There was always the lonely fat kid with headphones who never looked anyone in the face, just stared around sheepishly, played a couple games and left. There was always the really foul-smelling "fresh off the boat" kid missing a bunch of teeth and wearing acid wash jeans from the flea market. There were the anime geeks - nice guys, but other than school they just didn't seem to do anything well. They were mediocre at best on the sticks. They were such nice guys, though, I always felt bad smacking them down.

    Samurai Showdown was the big game at the time - the first fighting game that used weapons and wasn't horrendously awful. It was one of the several fighting games that we played casually, as a diversion from Street Fighter. Tony played the World Heroes series.

    Me: "Dude, what the fuck?! That fool threw a boat at me."

    Tony: "Yeah, that fool has nautical powers, dude. You'd best be on gaurd."

    Me: "This game fucking sucks."

    That was the beginning and end of my interest in World Heroes.

    Super Street Fighter got a lot of hype in the magazines and sounded impressive on paper - new graphics engine, new artwork, Q Sound, four new characters and a supposedly revamped combo system. One magazine stated "No longer will you be Dhalsim the combo-less wonder up against Captain-Combo Ken..."

    We were waiting for it. Each day we'd drive out to one or two arcades to see if they had it. We even made trips to places like Escapade in Emeryville and "The Castle" near the Oakland Coliseum - places with lousy competition, broken sticks, or both - places we typically ignored - just on the off-chance that it would be there.

    For the first time in our gaming lives we were fully able to pursue our passion. We both had cars and we both had jobs. We also got to know the guy behind the counter at Gametown so we had a say as to what games were installed. We told him to page us with '911' the moment Super arrived.

    It was like a childhood dream realized. No more digging through the couch looking for quarters. No more being kicked out of 7-11s - in fact the guys at Gametown often let us play after-hours for free. No more being told when to be home by our parents. Like all parents, of course, they didn't exactly like our fascination with video games, but luckily they had the intelligence to realize there were far worse things we could have been doing.

    Oddly enough, after all that driving around for about a month or so, the little Chabot rec room was the first place I found with a Super Street Fighter.

    The first thing I noticed was the announcer's voice. The old voice was serious, grave, and a just a bit menacing. He could have hosted matchups in Thunderdome. The designers of games like Mortal Kombat and Killer Instinct stepped that up a notch for added affect. Somehow, Capcom went the other way.

    The new announcer could cut your hair and give you a manicure. I didn't know what Capcom was thinking, or continued to think later on with other Street Fighter incarnations, as this non-threatening, non-forboding, effeminate, he-girl voice played into my disbelieving ears.

    The next thing I noticed was that Super was a lot slower than Hyper Fighting. That seemed a little odd, but it wasn't the huge turn-off to me as it was to most because I was more of a thinking player. I never had the best reflexes. But above all else, that was the most common complaint about it. It was just too damn slow for most people. It wasn't as slow as World Warrior. It was somewhere around Champion Edition speed.

    I noticed a curious phenomenon in the Chabot game room, which also had a Hyper Fighting machine. Although the popularity of Hyper Fighting had died down, when Super came out it actually had a small resurgence of interest. After a game of Super, a lot of players would shake their heads in disgust and walk over to Hyper Fighting for a few games. And when they did they played seriously. Beat a guy on Super and nobody cared. Play them again on Hyper Fighting and they immediately stepped up their game.

    I beat Super the first time I played it. The computer was easy compared to Hyper Fighting or even Champion. At the end of the day I drove home and paged Tony with the news. I should have figured it, but he demanded we go right back out there.

    When I had played Super earlier in the day the wait wasn't long. But this was no surprise because as lousy as Chabot was, a lot of kids took their educations seriously. And moreover, all the high school and grammar school kids were stuck in school during the day. But as we drove back out to Chabot I thought back on the old World Warrior and Champion Edition days when the arcades were still jammed. Sure, the crowds for Hyper Fighting had been a bit lackluster but that's because it was just Champion Edition with some added bells and whistles, I figured. This was a whole new Street Fighter. I imagined seeing some of the old faces and the old competition.

    It was about 7 o'clock, I remember, and the rec room closed at 9 so I was worried we wouldn't get any games in. I wanted this first night of Super to be perfect because we'd been waiting in anticipation for so long. I didn't want a bunch of no-skill wannabes to be in the game room wasting precious playing time, but on the other hand I didn't want the place to be packed or we might not even get to play at all. I was hoping maybe six or seven really good players would be there.

    There wasn't a single person.

    Tony: "Damn, dude, that's a sign of the times."

    Not one single person was in the game room. The silence was prophetic.
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Old Skool Lore - Final Round - Part 2 (LONG)

    Yes, the scene was starting to wind down but we kept going anyway. We made some good friends at Gametown and played almost daily. Between the five of us there was usually at least one other person to play and it made our trips out to the arcades that much more fun, going as a group. We'd play for who had to walk next door to Wendys or the Burrito shop and buy food. Like always, warez till midnight, then off to Dennys, then back to Tony's to play the consoles till four or five in the morning. This was around the time of the 3DO and a great time for console gaming in general.

    As unloved as Super was, it was during this time that I played at my peak. I dissected Guile like never before. His normal moves were given less and less priority with each succesive version. His sonic boom delay seemed to get worse and worse and his flash kick became easier to counter. That meant positioning, timing and the mental game had to be that much better. I played with all six buttons, maximizing each one. Rather than hit the buttons with one finger, I played with my three middle fingers which allowed me to hit the buttons just a few hundredths of a second faster than the other guy. With every move I figured there had to be a use for it, if only as a way to enhance the mental game.

    At the end of the night of gaming I'd talk Tony's ear off about some new realization I'd made about Guile.

    Tony: "Yeah, dude, you're taking Guile to the next level but Street Fighter is kind of on the down slope now, you know?"

    I honestly don't know why I stepped up my game like this given the scene was deteriorating. When I think back on it now I sometimes wonder. Why push so hard when there was no one to play? It was like I was trying to pump some life back into an era of gaming that I knew was heading towards an end. But that wasn't the whole of it.

    All the signs of change were there: going from high school to college, moving out of my parents house, working at a job not just for spending money but to actually live on. I was 19, almost 20. I had a girlfriend, a car and bills to pay. I'd been playing games since the 5th grade, since I was nine years old, since 1985. 10 years earlier my best friend had shown me Spy Hunter at the Round Table down the street and from that day forward each game I played, and mastered, became a sort of marking of the passage of time.

    It wasn't just the Street Fighter scene that was coming to an end. It was, in a nutshell, the end of my childhood. I was growing up. Part of me still wanted to stay a kid.

    In 1994, Super Turbo was released, hot on the heals of Super. We liked it and we played it, but it was tough to find good competition. It was tough to find any competition for that matter. Even out at the good arcades it was a treat when one of the old-skoolers would take a break from Slam Masters and play Super Turbo a few games.

    I think this was also around the time of the Street Fighter live-action movie. We gathered up all the homies and crossed our fingers because when video games get turned into movies the results are often dissastrous. Our summation: it could have been worse. Sadly, it was the last acting gig for the esteemed Raul Julia. That's akin to saying Babe Ruth's last game of baseball was in his backyard with a wiffle ball bat.

    On one of our forays to Barnes and Noble a few months before the release of the movie we were sitting in the cafe leaching the latest crop of game magazines when we noticed Ming-Na Wen was sitting at the next table.

    Me: "Dude, check this out. Isn't that the chick from The Joy Luck Club?"

    Tony: "What page is that?"

    Me: "Not in the ware-zine, you retard, at your three o'clock!"

    Tony: "Suck the corn outta my shit, dude. Oh... hmm... let me go get a napkin so I can scope the full 360 rotational view."

    Tony: "Holy shit, dude, I think that's her. You know, I heard she's supposed to play Chun Li."

    Me: "Damn, really? Hmm. That's kind of a shame. Anything Van Damme touches these days flys to the rental shelf with astonishing speed, dude. It could be career ending. Maybe I should ask for her autograph or something, and warn her to back out while she still can."

    Some of our conversation was overheard, though, we realized. When we looked over again, Ming-Na politely smiled and nodded at us and then left the cafe with the guy she was with, obviously not wanting the public attention.

    1995 was when it all ended. I'll probably take a lot of heat for saying that on a site that still preaches the gospel of Street Fighter but for myself and most of the old skoolers, that was the end of the golden age. That was the end, period. We hung on for awhle after that, but 1995 was more or less when it stopped.

    From late 1994 to early 1996 several things happened. Darkstalkers came out and I immediately hated it. The cartoonish artwork had absolutely no appeal to me. The special moves were flamboyant and ridiculous and all sense of precision seemed to be absent from it. I couldn't imagine breaking the game down with such fanatical meticulousness as I had done previously with Super and Super Turbo. But as Capcom churned out a new fighting game every couple of months, it became clear that they never expected us to.

    Then the Street Fighter Movie game was released. I played it once.

    Tony: "What'd you think? It's crap, huh?"

    In response I shoved the game away from the wall, unplugged it, and shoved it back into place.

    One after another the old skool players gave the new stuff a try, quickly realized what was up, and left. And they more or less never came back to the arcades.

    Then the anti-christ was born, except it was called Alpha. I played Alpha exactly one time while it was in the arcades. That's how much I, and a lot of others, hated it. The gameplay was clunky and simplistic. The graphics were cartoonish and silly. The music was childish. It didn't have the feel or flow of Super Turbo. Guile was replaced with Charlie.

    Me: "What the fuck is Charlie saying when he throws a sonic boom? "Chronic-Jew"? This game fucking sucks."

    Tony: "I think he's saying "wonic-foo". I don't know, dude. I think I like the voices from Street Fighter 1 better than this shit."

    Me: "And tell me this. Why is it when you hit a fool, his brains go blasting out of the back of his head?"

    Tony: "I don't know, dude. I think Capcom has lost their fucking heads for real this time."

    Tony played Alpha a bit but I just couldn't stand it.

    Tony: "It has some new shit, but NO ONE is playing seriously, you know? People just sort of play it, but there's no one like Thomas or Jay breaking it down and taking it to the next level."

    One day, I think around April or May of '96, we drove out to Playland. There really wasn't any competition any more by that time. People didn't even play Alpha much and Capcom just kept churning out more clones. Half the time we'd get out there and one of the sticks on Super Turbo would be broken. We'd end up playing Bust-a-move or really old shit like Smash TV and Heavy Barrel. It started to seem kind of pointless.

    But we'd been driving out there for the last four years, so what the hell else were we gonna do?

    On this particular day it turned out we were going to turn right around and head back home. Playland had closed up for good.

    So we spent most of our time at Gametown. One day I got a call from Tony and he said to get down to Gametown right away. I hopped in my car and got there about ten minutes later, just long enough for us to play one last game of Street Fighter as the rest of the games were being carted out. I don't even remember who won. All the friends were there and we watched them cart away Street Fighter. It had the solemnity of a funeral procession as we followed it out.

    Gametown was for Tony what 7-11 and Round Table had been to me, a fixture of his youth. That's where he had played games ever since he was tall enough to reach the sticks.

    Me: "Damn, dude, we're getting old."

    Tony: "Ha... you fool. I hear you, though."

    And then it was over.


    That's basically how I remember it. I realize that this tale of the old skool days is a somewhat sweet, sappy and perhaps somewhat-dramatic accounting, but I can't help occasionally feeling nostalgic for those days. Anyone who wasn't there, anyone who wasn't as fanatical about all of it as we were, anyone who didn't get a first hand taste of the energy and excitement... just won't quite understand.

    At best they'll smile and nod their heads politely. Like I said, we didn't play basketball or football. We weren't like those other guys. We carved out our own little niche in the world and if other people didn't get it, we didn't care.

    But the thing was, we made those old skool days what they were. It wasn't our parents telling us what to do. It wasn't some jerkoff coach kicking us in the ass to realize a dream we didn't share and didn't want. We didn't do it for girls or money or because there was some big payoff down the road waiting for us. We just did it because it was so damn fun. It was something really special that we made great, and it was all ours.

    ---


    The old man got up to leave, sighed and shook his head.

    "Yup, ain't nothin' like it these days, and probably won't be ever again."

    --end

    Shouts out to all the dead homies. Biggest props to Tony (tescoman) and the fools who made the old great memories happen.

    - jcasetnl
  • MillionMillion King of Creeps Joined: Posts: 10,956 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    So we spent most of our time at Gametown. One day I got a call from Tony and he said to get down to Gametown right away. I hopped in my car and got there about ten minutes later, just long enough for us to play one last game of Street Fighter as the rest of the games were being carted out. I don't even remember who won. All the friends were there and we watched them cart away Street Fighter. It had the solemnity of a funeral procession as we followed it out.

    Damn. ^this right here kinda got me.....it reminded me of when I went to my usual spot (the "Quartet" Mall). I got out of the car, headed straight in the usual direction, and noticed the door was locked. I finally looked up and saw an EMPTY ROOM where all the games once were.:( Not one machine was left, and even the sign on the front was gone. I just stood there in disbelief for a minute, but I should've seen it coming. As I said before, those last days were pathetic....to see even 5 or 6 people in there would be considered a crowded day.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    thankyou thankyou thankyou
  • fireballtrapfireballtrap Respect is Earned Joined: Posts: 393
    *sigh* That last one brings a tear to my eye. I experienced this last year when my local arcade closed up. Yeah, i did shead a tear that night, but i was only 14 and had only played there for about a year. So i can only imagine how bad it was for you.
    Getting 90% of the way there is a total fuck up.
  • Judgment DayJudgment Day Disrupting Da Coronation Joined: Posts: 379
    Hmm...excellent, yet sad story. Like many others, it also reminds me of my home arcade in Michigan. That place was booming when I started going up there in '93 (SSF2 was out), and it went through the roof in when MK2 was released. After Killer Instinct in 94, the crowds dwindled, and Mainstreet Video finally closed in late 1997 :( Luckily, Mainstreet Video had 2 other establishments, but none were like the original; the one where everyone would hang out beyond gaming, have a good time, and take it to the next level. The arcade that created

    --Judgment Day
    Judgment Day: PsychoBison, Rated [R]


    http://www.mayn-event.com
  • PKPK Joined: Posts: 9
    wow... some good reads.. i'll have to spend some time in here... but my first memory of SF was in Sharpstown arcade (houston, tx). by that time they had taken out the big smash 'em up buttons and replaced them with the legendary 6-button layout. I couldn't understand why no one used the hurricane kick. the scrubs like myself would wait our turn and call, "no fb and no uppercuts ok?!" hell, i was like 12 at the time. i had to skill. so the guy was like, "ok" and preceeded to whooop me with the hurricane kick. d.fierce wasn't around then. damn, that game sucked, but it looked really cool. like something out of the fly'n kung fu movie scene. very cool. then one day at Fun Plex (also Houston, TX) there were 20 guys standing around one machine. My friend Greg and I desided to check it out and that's when i first saw it, SF2. an older college age guy was on 2nd player using Z of all ppl. I loved wrestling and so i gave it a shot. when it was my turn to get up there (after a short 15 game wait), the original Z guy was still champ. was i worried? hell no!!! i was only 13. at 13, nothing scares you... so i didn't think there was that much to this game... big brawly characters and a girl... hhmm... i'll go with Z, i love wrestling.... i most i got off a couple of fierces but the guy just SPD me to death... i was amazed... so i hung out, didn't want to wasted my money losing to this guy so i just watched.... "how do u do that?" i asked... he said, "just watch my hands" all i saw was him spinning the joystick... hhmm... to think about it, that messed up my SPD abillity for a LONG time.... asshole... but that was the first move i learned... i couldn't do it... but i knew how to do it... soon i became a Dalsim master... soon as in SF time line.. it was 2 years later that started to actually realized the full potential of all the characters... Blanka's cball was the first move i pulled off... everyone was like, "wow! how did you do that?!" and "how do you do this?!" that was the first couple of years of SF2.. answering questions on how to do a move or how to pull off a combo (revolutionary at the time). i used to love beating guys with Guile's standing jab, if done fast enough you can redizzy them just with the standing jab. unballanced. bad shound. highly addictive. it saved the arcade, gave the SNES the extra boost over the competition, and started a cult.. damn, i love that game... OH BTW, you can play SF2Turbo and down at DAVE AND BUSTER'S in Houston!!! it's soo funn doing the drunk'n monkey and handcuffs again!!!
    Welcome to PK's world...
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Reading this thread makes me realize a few things....

    Fighting games, no matter how complex the engine is, no matter how feverent the fans, are a niche market and their fans will never compare in numbers to fans of other types of games.

    A lot of that has to do with the advent of Home consoles gaining popularity. No longer did you have to go into those musty, smokey-filled halls instead you could play games in the comfort of your own home.

    SF was unique in that it gave the Arcades a view into what they could become and opened the doorway for Fighting games to burst onto the scene. It also allowed other companies to literally survive and lay strong foundations.

    It forms a link from the old Ghosts N Goblins to Resident Evil: Zero and Steel Battalion.

    SF was unique and for that I don't think it will ever get enough credit.

    PS. I was one of the few people that LIKED Alpha1 when it came out. Super Turbo to me was really the last gasp if you will of a tired franchise. When I saw and played Alpha, I saw it held the promise of what SF could become, a more 'complete' version of the game that most of us spent our youths learning.

    For that I am also grateful.
  • urkangijordiurkangijordi Spelled UrkAngiJordi Joined: Posts: 90
    Wanna talk about an old school player, look no further. Maybe I am not the best player, but I do have an SF2 story.

    My first experience with Street Fighter was SF1at my then favorite arcade, the Time Out of Laurel Center Mall. This arcade, like many of the ones I am about to mention are gone and faded, as is the SF2 days. Street Fighter 1 I played once. I didn't like Street Fighter 1. I did love going to the arcade and I love Capcom games, mostly for graphics. When I use to work at the mall I went there to play other games (Out Run, Turbo Out Run, Shinobi, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles). I'd seen new games get popular and fade out. When TMNT came out, dozens of little kids would crowd around it, dumping money faster than a drunk billionaire in a casino. But for the most part, my infatuation for video games was mostly a solo experience. I had maybe 2 friends who I played Genesis games with. The John Madden Football would introduce me to my first real competitive experience. But this was at someone's house, not in the arcade. You go in to the arcade and play, and then you go home.

    It's funny, when I worked at the mall; I went to the arcade all the time. But when that job ended, I couldn't get to the mall (no car, not yet) and I missed a great deal of the games that came out around late 1990-1992 in the arcades. But I did read EGM and I did love Capcom. The first pics of SF2 in EGM (March 1991 if memory serves me) got me fired up. I wanted to see it, but I needed to find one, and get a ride. I heard there was one at another mall (Annapolis Aladdin's Castle) and convinced my best friend at the time to drive me down to Annapolis just so I could see this game (June 1991).

    I didn't like it. There were too many buttons, the cabinet was a horrible conversion (I would later realize that the game got better when converted correctly) and it was damn hard. Or maybe it was damn confusing. But I did love the trademark Capcom graphics and the floor parallaxing blew my mind. I went away disappointed and would not see SF2 again until I trekked back to Laurel later that summer.

    I went to Time Out and saw many new and different games, but the main attraction at the front of the 'cade was an SF2. I watched a guy playing it (he was an Asian guy named Thomas, I kid you not) and he was playing the game using Zangief. I saw SPD and many cool throws that really brought me into the game. I couldn't believe how much you could do with a big dopey character like Zangief. My bud looked at it but he didn't seem all that interested. So I sunk my money into the game against Thomas. I chose the one character that was destined to be my pick until ST...Ken Masters. I liked his red gi.

    I didn't like the ass kicking I got.

    I played SF2 for like $10 and lost EVERY TIME. This Thomas fellow threw me left and right. I got hammered and embarrassed. I was upset and gave up, vowing never to touch that horrible game again.

    Fate would change in December of 1991. I would get a car. Now I was a true high school senior, and more importantly... I could get back to Laurel Center Mall and play more games...Yay! My first instinct was not to go back to SF2. I remembered the brutal beating I got at it and I wanted to play something else. But when I walked into the Time Out, crowded around the SF2 machine were about 20 guys and one woman. I played other stuff, and heard the banter from the SF2 machine. My curiosity got the better of me. I watched as a Guile player systematically destroyed everyone at SF2 he fought. He was not Thomas but was still beating everyone. He had long dirty blonde hair and had a sort of laid back, rock attitude about him. He played several others who I would later get to know and befriend. As I watched, people played everyone, there were several Ryus, a Honda, a female Chun Li, and a Blanka by a blonde 12 year old named Andrew [I will call him Lil Andrew, you'll see later]. They were not only playing a game together, but also competing. The competition aspect of the SF community is what hooked me.

    I went to other arcades I knew of like the Champions of Columbia Mall, a small hole in the wall at Security Mall, and an arcade in the now gone Harundale Mall. There was comp at Columbia, but the machine was a small 13in conversion where you had to be huddling your competition to play. Security Mall was highly competitive, but I was a lamer no thrower and they threw. They also comboed much better than the Laurel crowd. In the end though, Laurel remained my place of choice.

    I began to play SF2 and take my bruises. I met many, many people who also like SF2 and I could talk strategy and tactics with. The most prominent players there was the longhaired Guile player, a Ryu player named Joshua, and Lil Andrew who eventually learned Dhalsim very well and dumped Blanka. I also ran into a player who went to high school with me previously named Jazz. He brought the flare of combos from downtown Baltimore to Laurel. I did learn a lot, like what a special move was and how to block, but by the time May 1992 came, the attention had shifted to the new SF2...

    Champion Edition

    Laurel was not very quick in getting Champion Edition. I had to drive south towards DC to University of Maryland in College Park. There was a 24-hour laundry mat with a Champion Edition in a dedicated Capcom competition cabinet. As I approached the blue machine with the double sized Champion Edition I saw lots of players. There was a crowd that I have never seen the likes of again...ever (outside a tournament). There must have been at least 30 people in line with more just trying to watch. Joshua was there as well as a few others. I got to play one time that day. I loved the changes to Ken, but lost to fast and didn't really want to wait another hour to try it again. At this time my focus changed from Laurel (due to late CE) to Columbia who had a nice Capcom dedicated cabinet. It was like vindication for all those scrunched SF2WW matches before. I finally understood combinations and crossovers. I was getting better and I also met a guy there who would eventually become a really good friend years later. Columbia was a no-throw arcade as well and many, many Guile grudges were settled within the first few weeks of CE being available.

    At the time of Champion Edition's era beginning in MD, a new mall opened called Marley Station Mall. It was another Champions Arcade like Columbia but with shiny new equipment, and 2 Champion Editions. In MD it was unheard of having 2 of a game of any kind in an arcade outside of Ocean City. Both were also big dedicated cabinets and there were all kinds of new comp for me to play. The most prominent and memorable of the new comp was a player named Andrew. He was easily the most prominent player there playing with an unorthodox 'crossed-handed' style with his controls. He played with an intelligence that I would not see surpassed for many years. He could play anybody, was very good at mixing up his patterns and reading everybody else. I also met another player who would become a good friend of mine named Lord Zor. He was simply put, extremely good at finding powerful strategies for every character. While Andy played Ken, Zor played Zangief. There was also another Zangief player who was really good (and the brother of a friend of a friend), and finally a wacky combo nut named Vince. These guys would become somewhat kindred over the years as I began realizing the wide spread popularity and diversity of SF2 at that time. Marley Station was now my home base beyond all others. I played SF there clear thru Hyper Fighter.

    During the Champion Edition era, Marley Station had a tournament. The first video game tournament I had ever been to was there. The idea of a tournament was unusual to people but many, many players came from as far as Springfield VA. This tournament was the first time I realized there were much higher levels of skills at SF. I met for the first time a notoriously good player at that time named Lance. He showed everyone the first five hit double sonic boom combo. Hailing from downtown Baltimore, a place that at the time if I had known about, I would have become MUCH better at SF. Imagine a 24 hour arcade with lines on 3 machines. It had Infinite comp, with greasy, iffy sticks. He and Jazz played there often, but Lance was clearly much better than anyone at that tournament. The Virginia players brought us the Sagat uppercut glitch (allowing Vince to learn to uppercut before the low fireball finished recovering, creating a monster). I lost so fast it wasn't funny, but I did learn a great deal for the first time since my early days in Laurel Center. I had finally mastered almost all skills except predictability. I learned of an arcade down the road in Severna Park that was open late with SF comp.

    ..more to come...
    My username is actually spelled UrkAngiJordi (Pronounced Urk-Angee-Jordee)
    Ken and Mai are my favorite characters.
    Favorite fighting game franchises. Street Fighter, Virtua Fighter, Capcom VS SNK 2
  • urkangijordiurkangijordi Spelled UrkAngiJordi Joined: Posts: 90
    ...con't

    SF comp was everywhere, and I loved it. As Hyper Fighting had made its appearance, I was in bliss with Ken's new air hurricane abilities. But at this time players were going to other fighters...namely Mortal Kombat. As the steam died down, MK rose in popularity, and my ridged loyalty for SF2 prevented me from trying MK seriously. So I watched as the comp dwindled and my games were against a few repeat players at Marley.

    During the time of Super Street Fighter 2 I had blew the engine in my car. I couldn't go anywhere and missed out on the SSF2 at Marley for quite a while. Not that I cared, Super's slow speed felt like a fatal mistake to me, and I didn't really like the slow game. I did however love Cammy. She would begin my many years of 'Goddess Worshipper' (you may have to look up some old posts in alt.games.sf2 for the definition to that one folks ^_-) and I would start to try other games like Samurai Showdown, and King of Fighters. Still nothing really compared to SF to me, and the dying comp scene depressed me somewhat. Before SF I didn't care about comp and community and such, but since then, going into an arcade and not seeing someone I knew seemed wrong now.

    Super Street Fighter 2 would also bring me up to another new arcade in Security Mall. Woolworths of all companies owned this place. However the supplier was Maryland mega distributor State Sales...so it got a constant rotation of new games, just no technical support. But still an arcade was an arcade so I went there too. But comp was thinner than ever, and SSF2 was killing my flame.

    Sometime in 1994 I think, Capcom released one more Street Fighter 2. Now up to this point I was completely naive about the world stage of SF2. This would be the SF that changed my life and showed me my goal for the future. In Annapolis of all places, where my first exposure to SF2 began, I would come across Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo. The game that is played by many, respected the most of all SF2 games, and would have the longest legs (it is now what 7-8 years old?), I played and loved it. I didn't like New Ken too much, but Cammy was really cool now. So I played Old Ken and New Cammy. As SSF2T got to Marley, the old crowd returned as well as some new faces that I am proud to call friend (Hey F2Billards =). Super pushed our skill limits and more importantly, gave me an idea.

    I tried to start a club called the Fighter's Guild (before I knew of the internet, I tried to do the club thing the old fashion way). As I met more faces and became a sort of known locally not for my skill, but my dedication to trying to create and unify the SF community in MD. I also met a man in Security Mall named Alex, who helped me learn why you don't run a game club like a boxing organization (Don King anyone). After I let go of the Fighter's Guild I began wondering something. Marley at the time of SSF2T was the best in MD at the time. I was not, but some of my friends were great, and super egotistical about it. They would talk about how cheap each other was, and how great they were. I was not convinced. I wanted to see how good people could get.

    I issued a challenge on alt.games.sf2. I just wanted to meet new players, but Jazz (who plays DeeJay and will remind you of that fact every chance he gets) figured we would get a better response if we talk some smack. I wanted the Fighter's Guild to be about community but when Jazz talked up our game on the post, we got a response from Hampton VA (Hey Kris). They came up and not only were our side not prepared for the incredible skill difference between them and us (the Horsemen of Hampton killed us so bad), but the egos of the local clan sort of died out and I began to see how far and how deep SF2 has always been. I realized that the community between SF players was global, arcade based, and very talented. Beyond anything I could ever do with my experiences. My curiosity was fueled more. I wanted to go to more places so I went down to Hampton to have my ass handed to me some more. I saw Zangief dominate Guile and all kinds of things I thought werent possible. To play a game for almost 4 years and still realize there were levels higher to achieve got me going again. I even went to New York and lost to the greats like Seth Killian, the turtling Joel and Sam, and even played Tom Cannon once (he played Chun Li), when Boardwalk was still around.

    As I grew away from SF, the Alpha came to be, and the skill and shift of comp went down to Gametime. It's amazing that when SF2 was around; there were arcades and comp everywhere. Now in Baltimore there are much fewer arcades with even less fighting games (unless you like Tekken...Bleh). I still miss it, and I wish I could go down to Gametime and compete more. The drive is like an hour and now I just want an arcade in Baltimore for competition again...

    I was there when it began, and I am still there. Some people on the boards may not remember me to much but I a great deal of memories and friends from SF and the fighting game community. I will never be the same again.
    My username is actually spelled UrkAngiJordi (Pronounced Urk-Angee-Jordee)
    Ken and Mai are my favorite characters.
    Favorite fighting game franchises. Street Fighter, Virtua Fighter, Capcom VS SNK 2
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Speaking of good SF2 players back in the day, there was this guy I used to know his name was Elika. I miss this guy to death. He died in a car accident a few years ago, when Alpha 2 was the rage. But Elika was the only player I know on the level of Thomas Osaki. He once came to our house to play some SF2:WW on SNES, and his playing was so incredible...he could successfully do combos and link special moves while your character is stunned, like if he was using Guile, he'd hit you with a Sonic Boom, and while you're stunned and the game is slowing down, he jumps at you and finishes the combo with a flash kick, I mean giving you NO chance to recover. Or other than that he could throw more than one sonic boom all at once, I mean with that charging method he was good at beating the odds the slowdown could bring.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Alright, Junior, step aside and let an old man tell you what Street Fighter was REALLY like. This story, like any good one, began in a 7-11 in Glendale, CA The local 7-11, actually, just three convenient blocks from my junior high and high school. Every day after school, I visited the 7-11 for a few hours and flexed my arcade might on the latest and greatest arcade games, and boy were there many great ones Shinobi, Double Dragon, Ninja Turtles the list goes on and on. But one of them I will never forget - the game that changed my life Street Fighter 2.

    It was an ordinary day and an ordinary game. I thought nothing of it. Six buttons? Certainly a novelty, but I had no idea how special this game was. The first character I picked was Blanka.

    Here was the reasoning:
    Ryu I never picked the default character. Status quo was for the weak.
    Ken Tempting, but a little too generic.
    E. Honda Fat guy? No thanks.
    Chun Li I aint no girl.
    Blanka Savage green animal sign me up!
    Zangief Big hulking wrestler dude, aww hell no!
    Guile Good, clean, all-american guy. Probably was the high school football captain. He would be my second choice.
    Dhalsim Interesting but what was the last game you played (remember this is 1991) where a Hindu was the best?

    I asked a friend how you did the ball, and the rest is history. I walked backwards and literally balled my way to victory against computer and human opponents alike. Most people hadnt figured out how to block, and luckily, my walking backwards technique provided a natural defense against the errant fireball that would eek out from some button mashers wild gyrations.

    In time, I grew to love the fierce and roundhouse buttons. They provided a nice bang for the buck and were obviously the weapons of choice for the adept Street Fighter player. These were the two buttons that you used, just like all the other arcade games. The other 4 buttons were gimmicks.

    Over the next few days, word spread of how to do special moves, and new ones were discovered regularly. Ken and Ryus spin kick and fireball became staples of their arsenal. Guile players now had the choice of crouching and razor kicking or walking backwards and sonic booming. These tactics were generally adequate enough to frustrate non-blocking opponents into a desperate jumping charge of futile offense. A jumping opponent is a dead opponent. Remember that, Junior.

    Then one day, I was playing the computer and the typical large crowd had gathered, hoping to get a glimpse of an ending. My walking backwards technique was sadly bested by M. Bison and his Great Roundhouse of Death. As the crowd began to disperse, a stranger approached me and put a quarter in my hand. Finish the game, he said. Id never seen him before, as he wasnt a regular among the video game crowd I was used to. But who am I to refuse an offer of free money? So I continued and the crowd returned. This time, I didnt mess around. Once I knocked M. Bison down, I was on him with my scathing Electricity of Death. Payback for the humiliation just handed to me. M. Bison succumbed to my manly button-pounding fury, and the crowd was treated to Jimmys tearjerking ending.

    As a new game started up, the stranger tried his hand at some versus competition and promptly got his ass handed to him. From the pitiful play of his Chun Li, I could tell he had never played an arcade game before, so I stepped in and avenged his death. Over the next few days, he kept coming back and getting better and better and better until he could beat me. He must have been practicing during off-peak hours when nobody was around. Here was a video game virgin who put in the time and money to get good at a game. Training, if you will, for the video game equivalent of Bloodsport.

    By now, I began to notice changes. People were not losing interest in this game, like all its other arcade predecessors. Instead of being a passing novelty, like the next Robocop/Bad Dudes/Superman game, this game is gaining in popularity over time. In fact, the crowds of spectators was growing. A pecking order also started to develop at the 7-11, as the good players gained reputations and regularly dominated for streaks of 7-10+ wins in a row.

    Myself and my newfound friend, Vahe, rose to the top of this local pecking order. We made the ideal dynamic duo. Me, the young 17-year-old with lots of free time and highly refined arcade skills. He, the much older 22, had the maturity, brains, money, and, more importantly, transportation (a car!).

    After establishing our position as the Godfather of the local 7-11, we realized that there were other arcades, 7-11s and liquor stores out there where we could prove our Street Fighter superiority. Taking Vahes car, we journeyed around town in search of Street Fighter competition (this was an absurd idea back in 1991). The next stop Pinball Plus in Burbank. This was the hangout for the local Burbank high school kids. They were pretty good too, but again, we dominated the competition.

    Eventually, we grew to know every backwoods mom and pop doughnut shop, 7-11, and arcade that had a Street Fighter machine in town. We had an imaginary map in our head of the town and the nearest Street Fighter machine, scouting each regularly for competition.

    Then one day, I was in the Video West arcade, just blocks from the Glendale Galleria. There is this asian older guy (30 something) on the machine holding center court and dominating fools like nobodys business. Hes sitting cross-legged over a stool and smoking while taking out the trash (players that I considered good). Hes playing Zangief, and he has full command of the mysterious Spinning Piledriver. Hes doing it on demand, grabbing people from 3 inches away, jumping on them, and doing it again. Id never seen anything like it.

    This is back before the Internet was big, when knowledge was power. My first introduction to the SPD was a brutal one, as he routinely demolished myself and the local Glendale competition. I tried everyone: Chun Li, Guile, Ryu, Dhalsim, E.Honda everybody. He won over 40 matches in a row before growing tired and leaving.

    My visions of the world were shattered. That was and still is the worst beating Ive ever taken in my Street Fighter career. I was not the best. No matter how good I was at the local 7-11, there was someone out there better than me. That knowledge fueled my desire for revenge and to be the best. I went back to the 7-11 to train some more and become a fine-tuned killing machine.

    By now, all the moves had been figured out, except for one: Ryus all-you-can.

    One day, I walked into Pinball Plus, and there was one guy on the machine who was kicking ass and taking names. Watching him play, my jaw dropped as he regularly threw fireballs and did the all-you-can on command!

    I asked him how he did it, but he refused to tell me. I kept watching his hands and mimicking the movement on another machine until I got my first uppercut. Eventually, I narrowed down the possibilities till I had it figured out: forward, offensive crouch, forward flip, back to forward, hit Fierce all in one quick motion. By the end of the day, I could all-you-can on command! on 1-player side only (but most people didnt know this).

    So Vahe and I took our newfound knowledge back to the 7-11 the next day and dazzled onlookers with our all-you-can prowess. If only Id had this weapon against that damned Zangief player
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Weeks later, I was going about my day, business as usual, slapping down the local competition while my mind was on autopilot I wonder how long it will take to do my homework? Should I buy that new Guns N Roses CD? My train of thought was interrupted when Vahe came in and started babbling. He was so excited, he was tripping over his words.

    Dude! I played this guy. Hes the best player Ive ever seen. He uses Guile and he demolished my Ryu. He was doing this backhand!

    The backhand? That move sucks! Youre smoking crack. How could you get hit by that?

    No no. I would throw fireballs and he would hit me while my arms were stuck out. <imitates Ryus fireball pose>

    At this point, I was still in disbelief that:
    1) There was a guy who was THAT good that he could destroy my invulnerable buddy.
    2) He was using walking-backwards-to-sonic-boom or crouching-to-razor-kick Guile to dominate like that.
    3) He could hit someone with the backhand. Who uses that?!

    But then Vahe dropped the hammer: This guy was throwing sonic booms while sitting down! This was another one of those life-changing moments in which comprehension dawned and I reached an epiphany of video game thinking. Up until this point, we had treated Street Fighter like any other arcade game out there: 4 directions 4 choices. But this was an 8 direction stick. Why not try a diagonal?

    Hands shaking, I selected Guile and held defensive crouch and tried throwing a Sonic Boom. Oh my god I tried a razor kick from the same position Hot damn! I was beginning to believe.

    So tell me more about this backhand. He does it when youre in the fireball pose?

    Yeah, and I couldnt block it.

    We proceeded to figure out, piece by piece, the ingredients for my friends public dismantling. We were part mad scientist/part mystery detective re-enacting the murder of my best friend. Vahe would fireball and I would match it with a sonic boom, then backhand.

    You couldnt block that?

    No! he said, excited with glee.

    I then grilled him for more details about his weekend trip. Apparently, he had gone to Pak-Mann arcade in Pasadena and played this kid named Tomo, who kicked his ass.

    By now, we were beginning to realize that Street Fighter was developing a community a hierarchy even. Every town was crowning local players who they deemed the best. Names were popping up and reputations were spreading. This Tomo was apparently the champion of Pasadena. I had to meet the guy.

    Like a video game bounty hunter, I tracked down the details of his playing times and habits by questioning people whod played him. There were surprisingly many.

    The Guile guy? Yeah, he plays on Friday and Saturday night at Pak-Mann. Go around after 10PM. That guy is GOOD! Vahe and I circled the next Saturday on our calendar. The anticipation was like a world championship boxing match. The showdown was set to begin.
  • UltimaUltima Retired SF Aristocrat Joined: Posts: 1,779 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    A couple things:

    Concerning the general death of Street Fighter, I think there were 3 main factors:

    1) Arcade Super SF2 - No doubt about it, this killed the interest in new SF in my country. Awful voices, the new characters were shitty, and TOO SLOW. Very few places got it, and NO ONE played it after the first week or so. Every one went back to playing HF (and I should note that people STILL play HF to this day, but that's another story).

    2) Street Fighter the Movie - This pretty much made SF a laughing stock in the general gaming community. Now you couldn't mention "SF" without thinking about this horrible, horrible movie.

    3) SNES SSF2 - The final nail in the coffin. Super Turbo had been released by this time, and there was definitely a lot of interest in it around here. However, no arcade seemed to get it (and none did until LONG afterwards), so the thought of a home version was a comfort. And while Capcom did release a home version that improved on the arcade, it just wasn't enough. SSF2 with more speed wasn't ST. Many of us saw absolutely no reason to buy this game and play it over HF, and our interest in new SF games was killed for a very long time. Alpha 1 came out in one place, and I thikn only two people played it (me and my friend). I remember the machine breaking one week when we played it, and when we came back the following week, it as exactly the same. I guess no one had played the game in that time to report that it was broken.

    Anyhow, that's my view on what ended the golden age of SF. MKII had a big hand, but I think if Capcom had made SSF2 a much better game (i.e. ST), MKII poularity (much of whic came at SF2['s expense) wouldn't have been as high (and rightfully so).

    Anyway, I have my own old school stories, but I won't repost my longass rambling tirades here. You can check them out on the following link. It's my arcade history in general, so there are some other games that are mentioned, but 90% of it centers around SF in some fashion. Since I grew up in another country, I can't name drop any of the old legends like Tomo or anything, but don't mind that. :)

    http://www.rit.edu/~jas2842/uramble/history_arcade.html

    Oh yeah, to the person that said it: The original SF2 guide from Gamepro isn't any good, but the second one that dealt with HF and preview SSF2 was - and still is - a great book. That was where I first learned the concept of deep hits and started pulling off combos for real. It may have been from Gamepro, but it as masterminded by Matt Tyler, who also orchestrated VS. Books and the SFA2 guide, the best US fighting game strategy guide ever made.
    Ultima - The Right Arm of Scrub Voltron
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Saturday afternoon, we warmed up our skills by destroying the locals at Pinball Plus. An appetizer for the main course to come. Then we got in the car and cruised down to Pasadena. This was pretty absurd if you stopped to think about it. Me, a 17-year-old kid getting in the car with some stranger I barely knew, and us going on the freeway to travel to another town in hopes of possibly meeting this reputed good player at a video game. But with Street Fighter 2, anything was possible

    When I first arrived at Pak-Mann, I was dumbfounded. Id been to the arcade before: its about a block long and filled with row up on row of arcade machines from past, present, and future. What was surprising was the row of 10 Street Fighter machines and the crowd of people surrounding them. I didnt have to see the marquee to know what game everyone was playing and excitedly talking about. There were so many people that they had to put a few of the machines in another row so the crowd wouldnt get too clumped in one area.

    I put my quarter up and waited through a line of three people. By the time I drew first blood, I knew I belonged. My Chun Li was one of the better ones out there. My Blanka wasnt too shabby either. The stream of players kept coming, a regular and steady flow of more meat for the grinder. But this isnt what I came here for. I had plenty of newbies back home to beat up. I wanted the Man himself.

    Scoping the aisles of machines, my friend pointed him out. There he is. I stood and watched as he dismantled opponent after opponent. Nobody could take a round off of him. Tomo looked like an average, unassuming Asian kid. But the way he was playing was anything but ordinary.

    He was doing combos. Jumping Forward, low Jab, Razor Kick. Dizzy. Jumping Fierce, low Strong, Razor Kick. Dead. I had no idea what combos were. I just saw people dying REALLY fast. Like 10 seconds and the round was over. It was pretty scary. I didnt know why they werent blocking the second and third hits.

    I dropped in my quarter and lost first round badly to a dizzy combo. I looked at the controller as if defensive crouch didnt work. I cant block that?

    No. He laughed. I almost won second round due to my unorthodox Chun Li play and some timely throws, but he pulled it out. I proceeded to wait in line and continually get schooled by his Guile.

    I didnt realize it at the time, but Tomo wasnt just playing the game. He was creating it as he went along. He wasnt sticking to any simple fireball-uppercut pattern. He was faking, feinting, constantly doing something to throw you off, testing new moves. While you were thinking of the next move, he was thinking three moves down the line. While I was a follower learning traps and patterns, he was creating them.

    As I was waiting in line, a guy came around and handed me a flyer. His name was Charles and he was holding a tournament at some comic book shop called Worlds Finest Comics.

    A video game tournament?! Are you serious? Never before had the idea been mentioned. But now that I thought about it, it made sense. Here was my shot at a real-life Bloodsport. Vahe and I knew we had to go to this.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    The fateful Saturday rolls around and we head down to Pico Rivera. Worlds Finest Comics, the locale where Tomo and company hung out, played, strategized, talked, and generally grew into the #1 Street Fighter community in the U.S. The tournament was about 30 people or so. The turnout was considered a success, and Charles announced that he would hold another one in 3 weeks.

    I didnt make top 10, but I didnt care. I was there to learn, and learn I did. How to combo. The latest combos. Redizzy combos. Corner traps. Fireball traps. Trap counters. How to throw. How to reverse.

    Every three weeks, Vahe and I would go to Worlds Finest for these SF tournaments. We went as much to compete as to amass knowledge like a sponge. And then bring back the latest tricks of the trade to our local arcade to whip ass on the newbies.

    Worlds Finest wasnt just the site of a video game tournament. It was a place for SF experts to gather, be accepted, and share tales of their local arcades. It was a place where the newest and most effective combos, strategies, and glitches could be displayed, analyzed, and countered. The In & Out burger restaurant across the street was the source for our daily sustenance, drinks, and a secondary hangout - our home away from home.

    Gradually, the pecking order of Worlds Finest developed. There was the Big Four and everyone else. The Big Four were Tomo Ohira, Roger Chung, Tony Tsui, and Willy (Lee?). They were in a class by themselves, playing at another level from everyone else. The reason they were grouped together like that is because the other three were the only ones who could beat Tomo, although he ended up winning most of the tournaments.

    As time progressed, people realized that not all characters were created equally. Guile emerged as the best, and the only character who could stood a chance against him was Dhalsim. Every tournament came down to Guile and Dhalsim fighting in the finals and semi-finals.

    Vahe was a real student of the game. He could sit back and watch people play, dissecting what they were doing to win. What traps worked and how to get out of them. Every move had a counter. Every technique had an answer.

    His problem was he didnt have the reflexes and coordination to pull off the latest combos as they were invented. So he took me under his wing as his student. He told me what to do and when to do it. What countered what and the latest strategies. Living vicariously through me, he was training a lean, mean, fighting machine.

    After a couple tournaments, the Guile/Dhalsim fight was expected. It became like an elaborate dance to the death, with new moves added every week. It evolved. First Dhalsim started with standing Fierce to push people back, then Fireball, standing Forward. Then people changed it to Fireball, standing Fierce to push them back and get damage when they jumped. Then people found out Fireball, low fierce had more priority. Then it became Fireball, low Roundhouse slide when they jumped, Yoga Flame as they got up, standing Fierce, repeat. Fireball, close-range standing forward. Fireball, jump back Fierce. Drill (Yoga Mummy), throw. Noogie, standing Strong, Noogie some more. Yoga Flame, throw (in the corner). The variations were endless.

    Every week changes were made to the choreography, and if you didnt keep up on the latest moves and the appropriate counter, you would succumb to them. It became like homework in Street Fighter school to memorize the latest tactics. And believe me, school was in session.

    By this time, I was becoming an elite SF player. I knew all the strategies for destroying any non-Guile/Dhalsim characters with either Guile or Dhalsim. People I didnt know, didnt scare me. I began placing top 10 at Worlds Finest, as the homework and practice began to pay off. I still couldnt beat the Big Four when it counted, but I would make them earn it.

    At this point, playing at my local 7-11 was no longer satisfying. Local scrubs were stifling my growth, dulling my skills, and providing false confidence. I only wanted to play at Worlds Finest, where the true challenge lay. Every three weeks, I would go to the tournaments and get schooled by 3 weeks worth of new ideas and strategies. It was difficult trying to improvise counter strategies on the fly, but I tried and loved every second of it.

    Between tournaments, Vahe and I would scour Los Angeles, looking for hotbeds of hidden SF talent. Searching for a backwoods pizza place with a local prodigy who might have some tricks we could use.

    I became like a talent scout. I would go to foreign arcades and just watch how the locals played. If their technology (the moves and patterns they were using) wasnt up to snuff, I wouldnt even bother wasting a quarter to beat them. When I was out with my girlfriend, we would walk by an arcade and she would know we had to go inside to see what people were doing.

    By the way, the one time I brought my girlfriend to Worlds Finest (boys, never bring your girlfriend to a video game tournament. Shell be bored out of her mind.), I won the tournament, beating Tomo in the Finals. One of the high points of my SF career.

    Eventually, we realized that we had scouted all there was to scout. There was no more hidden talent in LA. The best places to play were Pak Mann in Pasadena, College Arcade across the street from LACC (LA Community College), and Worlds Finest in Pico Rivera. By now, we knew everybody at these places on a first name basis.

    Do you believe in pre-destination? It exists in video games. If you dropped a quarter in a machine and challenged me, and I didnt know your name, you already lost. There was no doubt. Your fate was pre-determined. You just wasted 25 cents funding my gaming habit for the next minute.

    When I spent three hours a day, seven days a week presiding over the scrubs at my local arcades and doing my homework regularly at Worlds Finest for the latest tricks of the trade, there was no way a stranger could win. It just didnt happen. Ever.

    Oh there were guys that talked smack. Lots of them. You gotta play my friend at Street Fighter. Hes sooooooo good. You dont know how many times I heard that.

    But the end result was always the same. Unless I knew you and practiced against you regularly, you didnt beat me. Not even a round. The people who could beat you became like family. Your peers. Your comp. What made you better. What pushed you further. What made you innovate.

    My comrades and I played through all sorts of conditions. Walk into an arcade no defensive crouch. No problem. Ill pick Ryu and uppercut through the fireballs. Spin kick to the other side and play footsie. Broken controls werent a deterrent, they were a handicap which we overcame. Roundhouse doesnt work all the time. Time to play Dhalsim.

    Only two buttons work.
    Is one of them punch?
    Yes.
    Zangief.

    I would play matches using only one button - jab. I would play one-handed: one hand on the joystick and the same hand on buttons (and yes, you can still fireball/uppercut that way). I could literally beat people with one hand behind my back. Buddies would share rounds. Sometimes, we would play together. My friend would do joystick, I would do buttons and we could fireball trap (with fakes) and uppercut opponents without verbal communication. Great minds think alike? Sometimes I would be bored and let people take off more than half my life, then magically turn it on and demolish them without taking any damage. It was sick.

    So it was established Pico Rivera was where the best Street Fighter players in Los Angeles played. But how did LA compare to the rest of the world? We were about to find out as we took our first trip outside LA in search of the true World Warrior
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    What a gem of a thread!
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Eggo, dude, speak the lore.

    <tips his hat>

    To move forward, remember the past...

    With eternal vigilance the old skool will never die...

    - j
  • Storming FlowerStorming Flower Top player hater Joined: Posts: 617
    with this talk about og sf, im trying to learn guile. can one of you guys help me on the guile vs ryu matchup HF, the gameplan and strategy, like followups and setups after booms..im only 17 but i played this 24 year old og player and i would come so close to beating his ryu with my ryu but when i go to guile i completely lose, and his guile beats down on both my guys but i still don't really know how to play guile.
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Originally posted by Storming Flower
    with this talk about og sf, im trying to learn guile. can one of you guys help me on the guile vs ryu matchup HF, the gameplan and strategy, like followups and setups after booms..im only 17 but i played this 24 year old og player and i would come so close to beating his ryu with my ryu but when i go to guile i completely lose, and his guile beats down on both my guys but i still don't really know how to play guile.

    It's all about the mind game. I already said it, but, make that charge time dissapear. Put the pressure on. Use his thrusting knee to close the distance and keep the pressure on. Use the range of his crouching normals to your advantage. You can always counter his wiff roundhouse with a low forward. Learn the walk-unders, the wiffs, etc. to set him up and take him down. It's really quite easy when you get feel of it.

    Shotos, except the very best, are easy to contol with Guile. Just shut them down. Distance and positioning are the key. Just get in close to him, get in his face, and learn from there.

    Good luck - j
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    This is really good.
  • Storming FlowerStorming Flower Top player hater Joined: Posts: 617
    j: thanks for replying i read your post on shinakuma too when you talked about the walk unders, but im still trying to figure it out. Right its like im developing a pattern of slow boom, walk forward, down forward twice, then boom again (if they jump im screwed), or continue down jabbing before boom but if they jump while im jabbing then FK. (that gets weak but not sure what else to do)

    sometimes they jump and i walk under and throw from other side. or low boom knee boom again. i'll use the other booms like fierce to give myself room when they throw fireball so i can walk foward. that's all i basically do...(not a good sign) I mean in ST he has those new kicks so i can use him but he seems more limited in HF, , what about corner traps..i'll just keep practicing
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Back in the day... (LONG!)

    Let me begin by sending mad shouts out to jcasetnl

    It is jcasetnl's recounting of the lore tales of yesteryear that has brought me out of retirement and to my keyboard this afternoon.

    For the first time in over a decade he has called upon me to share my experiences with what I consider to be the greatest arcade game of all time. Dare I say the greatest videogame of all time...? Street Fighter II.

    "Dude...what should I say?! Whats left to add?!" I asked...

    "Damn TONY.... speak the lore already... these fools need to know about the next level!" he replied impatiently

    I sat down to read the posts to see where my SF brothers stand. Just reading through the thread brought about an influx of old skool memories

    Memories of a time before 800 page FAQs and step by step combo guides.

    Memories of a time before 'onscreen help or 'context sensitive' game menus.

    Memories of a time when games didn't have to have an end, or play fair with you...

    Memories of arguing with parents about spending too much time in the ware palace.

    Memories of adding fools to the database for future reference.

    Memories of spending my college years at SFSU in the campus arcade

    Memories of Metallica on stage with long hair ripping through Harvester of Sorrow >sigh<

    Memories of jacasetnls over the top victory celebrations

    Memories of playing the fabled Thomas and kicking his ass. (If only for a few games)

    Memories of defiling the great temple known as Dennys

    Memories of taking fools bus fare and lunch money as they tried just one more time

    Memories of sending legions of fools back to Remedial to work on their basics

    Today I share a brief moment in time which jcasetnl will never let me forget

    I do mean. never

    Oakland, CA:

    Jcase and Phil (the deadest homie of them all) are credited with introducing me to the game of SF2. Phil brought the knowledge, but stepped back as his disciples took his knowledge, disposed of it, and elevated to a new plateau. (Not to deride Phil any fool who can finish Ultima 4 has his name scribed in the Great Book of Wareplay Eternal his 8bit skillz were indeed legendary on both NES and C64 alike)


    For a brief period of time after the release of SF2, I was able to hold my own against any and all challengers. I didnt lose often and when I did lose I was able to evolve and return with higher standard. My skills, reflexes, and timing were polished to a point that I have since been unable to duplicate


    I was also quite the arrogant bastard especially where SF2 was concerned. (..and rightfully sohehe) Trash talking was a huge component of my game. To this day I am amazed that I didnt end up in a garbage can somewhere in the back alleyways of Oaklands Chinatown

    Woe to the fool who walked up to a machine with a gamepro in hand or a move list scrawled on a napkin. He would be the recipient of verbal abuse that would make the likes of a Navy Seal ring the bell of shame

    I often turned this attitude toward the homies as well as Jcase and I would often exchange pleasantries after our matcheshehe

    After a while, Jcase stepped away from challenging me and concentrated on his own game. He would often step in to trade rounds with me while I reloaded on bagel dogs and Sunkist, or made a food run to the local Wendys. In my mind, this was the white flag that I had been waiting for. I had established myself as the dominant World Warrior.

    Of course, I had no clue that he was studying my habits, patterns, techniques, tendencies I also had no clue that my style was so readily obvious. Apparently JCase had noticed my fatal flaws flaws that other opponents recognized but could do nothing about. (I had fairly quick reaction times, and the speed of the original SF2s game play gave me plenty of time to adapt to their attacks.) This coupled with the time he had been spending cross training at the OakTree was a dangerous combination

    One afternoon he cruised into GameTown, stepped up to the SF2 machine that I had been occupying for what seemed like weeks without a valid challenge, plunked in his quarter, and hit the player 2 start button.

    I believe that day I had decided to work on what we called advanced theory with Ken. (I often took breaks from playing Guile, as it was just too easy) I believe Jcase to be putting his newfound Guile devotions to the test.

    Round 1 started as I faked a fireball and dug into his airborne ass with a dragon punch. (Oh how many rounds began this way, my old friends?!hehe) While not taking the round with a perfect, I was victorious and began one of my usual verbal celebrations.

    Round 2 saw me relaxing myself a bit. In the olden days, we gave second rounds to our deserving opponents as a way of showing respect. The problem was, while I thought I was giving him second round, he actually took it from me. Toward the end of the round he began to read my every move and supply the appropriate counter for the situation. How many backfists in the mouth would it take for me to adjust my flow?? How many standing forwards or air throws would it take for me to adapt??

    Round 3 began and for the first time in recent memory I was concerned that my opponent may actually get the best of me. I became tentative I was second guessing myself. I was hesitant and cautious perhaps too cautious.

    Jcase sensed this and began the blitzkrieg. I found myself flipping around the screen in hopes of escaping the onslaught, in hopes of delaying the inevitable

    I, like countless Ken/Ryu players before me, was being dissected by the consummate Guile player. As time wore on in the round, I began to stage a brief comeback, upper cutting any limb he would even think about sending my way doing my best to keep proper distance. Faking him into coming in and getting a fistful It was truly a see-saw matchup.

    He seemed to have an answer for everything... he would take the hits, then bring the pain. The closing seconds of the round saw me in the corner, attempting to hold on for a few more seconds perhaps in hopes of being saved by Father Time.

    It had become clear to me what I needed to do: I had a tactic of walking up to crouching opponents and throwing them. Remember that? Straight up walk up to a fool and toss em before their brain even processed Jcase had this move scouted, as I had used it on him religiously. (With MUCH success)

    I made the madmans final attempt and moved in to deliver the final throw. As I rose and made my way toward my crouching nemesis, thoughts of my victory speech began streaming through my mind. "We choose to go the moon in this decade...."

    Not two steps into my attempt to throw my unsuspecting opponent, I was greeted by a roundhouse flash kick, right smack on the forehead

    eeeeeeewwwwwuuuuuhhhhhh was all I heard as Ken struck the ground lifeless and Guile began combing his ridiculous flat-top. It was the flash kick heard round the world

    I was stunned, but muttered good shit nonetheless.

    Of course, JCase being the great sport that he is proceeded to humiliate me with the greatest after match clown in recorded history.

    Elated at the sight of his victory, he ran out of the arcade, directly into the middle of college avenue with his arms raised overhead in a V and screamed MOOOOOORTAL KOOOOOOMBAT!!!! at the top of his lungs.

    All the while, staring toward the sky, spinning around in the middle of the street. MOOOOOORTAL KOOOOOOMBAT!!!!

    (For those who dont remember, the ad campaign for the 16bit renditions of Mortal Kombat featured scores of kids running through desolate streets yelling Mortal Kombat in unison)

    Cars and passers by had absolutely no idea how the balance of power had shifted that day, or the significance of his actions. In fact, most were peeved to see a young punk in the middle of the street yelling at the top of his lungs.

    He returned to the arcade to find me in a ball on the floor of the arcade tears of laughter streaming down my face

    I had been handed the fattest slice of humble pie in my game playing career.

    Big props to Jcasetnl, Jay, Frank, the crews from GameTown, OakTree, Regency, Escapade, 2 Star liquor, SShack Redemption, Big Al, all my victims, and all those here in the forums today who took the time to read about a personal piece SF history.

    Much love to the dead homies, to the Commodore Amiga, to the old skool warez scene, and to anyone who picked up a controller when it was called a joystick and had one big ass red button.

    Im OUT

    -Tesco
    "Tony"
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Is that THE Eggo from Gamefan magazine posting?!
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Old skool - mad skillz.

    First of all, you new skool fools need to read that shit twice on weekdays and three times on sunday and take notes. That was consumate old skool as it has never been told nor will ever be spoken again. You need to study that shit, pay attention and recognize.

    Damn dude, even till this day I get slapped around by your technique.

    I need to head to the ticket counter for Redemption...

    <>!!sEGa!!<>

    - jon
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    with this talk about og sf, im trying to learn guile. can one of you guys help me on the guile vs ryu matchup HF, the gameplan and strategy, like followups and setups after booms..im only 17 but i played this 24 year old og player and i would come so close to beating his ryu with my ryu but when i go to guile i completely lose, and his guile beats down on both my guys but i still don't really know how to play guile.

    This matchup is pretty hard for Guile. Good ryu players will sweep your low forward and roundhouse with a low roundhouse. They can see the move come out and react.

    Anyway, try walking backwards to start, throwing nothing but fast sonic booms in the projectile war. See if you can draw him out into jumping to come get you. If you have him jumping towards you, you'll most likely win.

    If he doesn't jump towards you, you're going to have to keep throwing sonic booms till he falls asleep, then jump with a late roundhouse to kick him once in the head. Then proceed to run away and guard the lead. This match is all about getting a lead (no matter how minor) and holding it. Time is your best friend.

    Once you've got Ryu jumping, then you can low fierce, low strong (it will whiff) then immediately throw (Ryu's jumping RH with mysteriously miss), low jab, standing RH, standing forward if he's right on top of you, air throw, low forward or RH if he's far, or jump early RH. Once in a while, you might want to block too. Basically, whenever Ryu jumps on you, do something different, so he never knows what to expect and when to RH.

    If you're losing, then you have to play close range and throw the hell out of him. This should be your second choice. Never play close range if you can avoid it. Here, throw a slow sonic boom and follow it. If he matches with a fireball, backhand or low forward (he'll have time to block), but it buys you time to setup another boom.

    A good OG trick is after doing a low forward which they block, immediately do a backhand. If they try to throw a fireball, you'll hit them clean before the fireball comes out. Your goal is to get them to block a sonic boom with you right behind it. Then you just walk in and throw. The alternate is walk in and at the last second low RH. Or you can walk in, pause, then walk forward and low RH. Walk in, standing jab, throw. Endless variations of cheese. If he spin kicks, low fierce. If he fireballs, block it, then jump towards him with a fierce, low strong, razor kick in case he throws another.

    If Ryu corner traps you with fireballs, it can get really bad. Try razor kicking out - cutting off his head like a guillotine and going through the fireball. Or else trade a backhand with the fireball just to throw off his timing. Good Ryu players will back you into the corner and make you block at least 5 fireballs every time you fall down. If you jump up, they'll alternate fireball speed till you finally fall on one. You do not want to be in the corner against a good Ryu player.
    Is that THE Eggo from Gamefan magazine posting?!

    Yes.
  • Storming FlowerStorming Flower Top player hater Joined: Posts: 617
    thx a lot man, i really appreciate it. i've beem playing a lot and sorta learning those things, yes i've found out that time is my friend. i mostly use low strong, walk stand fk, thrust knee, jump early rh, and walk under throw against jumping. however how do catch in airthrow? in a projecticle war, even though im throwing fierce booms, wouldn't i lose the war? because i end up getting guard damaged, cuz fb comes out faster than boom? i thoguht ryus game plan was to keep guile out. (unless hes way behind in life)
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Originally posted by Storming Flower
    j: thanks for replying i read your post on shinakuma too when you talked about the walk unders, but im still trying to figure it out. Right its like im developing a pattern of slow boom, walk forward, down forward twice, then boom again (if they jump im screwed), or continue down jabbing before boom but if they jump while im jabbing then FK. (that gets weak but not sure what else to do)

    sometimes they jump and i walk under and throw from other side. or low boom knee boom again. i'll use the other booms like fierce to give myself room when they throw fireball so i can walk foward. that's all i basically do...(not a good sign) I mean in ST he has those new kicks so i can use him but he seems more limited in HF, , what about corner traps..i'll just keep practicing

    When you walk under the guy, if you're directly under him do standing forward kick with the stick neutral. After you knock him out of the air a few times with this he'll roundhouse early to counter it (the roundhouse has priority I think). So in that case, when you're right under him, let the stick go neutral again and wait for the roundhouse. The moment he sticks his foot out you go into crouch - not defensive crouch - because you'll go into your block animation. Just duck under the kick, which will wiff, and when he lands you can chuck him, do a couple low strongs, etc.

    If you connect with the standing forward you have to move up so that once again you're right out of the range of his roundhouse. So basically you need to know fairly precisely where he'll land because you have to position and charge as soon as possible.

    On the corner traps it's basically the same thing. In WW Guile could corner trap like a bastard but by the time of Super Turbo they'd added some delay to the sonic boom and taken a lot of the range and priority out of the flash kick. Also, of course, his normal moves got ball-chopped. Oh yeah, and they added a slight delay after the flash kick. <sigh> Speaking of which, when you do his super flash kick, there's no delay afterwards so if you completely wiff it and the guy walks up to toss you worse, you can immediately follow with another flash kick. It won't work against the better players who are wise to it but sometimes it can turn a match around.



    Hope this helps.

    - j
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    The ONE thing I remember about the "Old Skool" S.F. scene were the Fights that occured outside the Arcade/Round the Local "Corner" after someone lost a match. It was pretty good, actually.

    ........
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    This is the greatest thread ever! :)
    Thanks to this thread , i will download every single st movie from evo which i otherwise never would`ve done..
  • Judgment DayJudgment Day Disrupting Da Coronation Joined: Posts: 379
    Back in the day... (LONG!)
    Originally posted by Tesco
    Not two steps into my attempt to throw my unsuspecting opponent, I was greeted by a roundhouse flash kick, right smack on the forehead

    eeeeeeewwwwwuuuuuhhhhhh was all I heard as Ken struck the ground lifeless and Guile began combing his ridiculous flat-top. It was the flash kick heard round the world

    I was stunned, but muttered good shit nonetheless.

    Of course, JCase being the great sport that he is proceeded to humiliate me with the greatest after match clown in recorded history.

    Elated at the sight of his victory, he ran out of the arcade, directly into the middle of college avenue with his arms raised overhead in a V and screamed MOOOOOORTAL KOOOOOOMBAT!!!! at the top of his lungs.

    All the while, staring toward the sky, spinning around in the middle of the street. MOOOOOORTAL KOOOOOOMBAT!!!!

    (For those who dont remember, the ad campaign for the 16bit renditions of Mortal Kombat featured scores of kids running through desolate streets yelling Mortal Kombat in unison)

    Cars and passers by had absolutely no idea how the balance of power had shifted that day, or the significance of his actions. In fact, most were peeved to see a young punk in the middle of the street yelling at the top of his lungs.

    He returned to the arcade to find me in a ball on the floor of the arcade tears of laughter streaming down my face

    I had been handed the fattest slice of humble pie in my game playing career.

    -Tesco
    "Tony"

    :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Oh my God, that was funny! Excellent post, my friend.

    PS: The death sound effect of Ken was to a tee. Also reminds me on how Ken and Ryu used to say "Shoryuken" (All You Can) like they meant it in those days. The true sign of old school :)

    eeeeeeewwwwwuuuuuhhhhhh
    --The Real Ken
    Judgment Day: PsychoBison, Rated [R]


    http://www.mayn-event.com
  • DanielLarussoDanielLarusso All for the glory of love Joined: Posts: 221
    As many have said before me, best thread on SRK. Good shit jcasetnl. What up Eggo, Dragonmaster Alex from the OG #gf_tavern oldschool in the heazy.
    The Karate Kid
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Originally posted by Storming Flower
    thx a lot man, i really appreciate it. i've beem playing a lot and sorta learning those things, yes i've found out that time is my friend. i mostly use low strong, walk stand fk, thrust knee, jump early rh, and walk under throw against jumping. however how do catch in airthrow? in a projecticle war, even though im throwing fierce booms, wouldn't i lose the war? because i end up getting guard damaged, cuz fb comes out faster than boom? i thoguht ryus game plan was to keep guile out. (unless hes way behind in life)

    You're right that you can't go head up against fireballs with booms. So the key is to know when the fireball is coming and already have an answer for it with a normal. And of course, you can't connect a normal unless you're close to your opponent...

    But if you use the same normal over and over you'll obviously get factored and filed away. So mix it up, but more importantly, watch what your opponent does in response to your setups. Some guys, after you shut down a fireball with a backfist, for example, will *always* jump at you as soon as he recovers. And because of the positioning I knew I could always do a walk under and either do standing forward or let the roundhouse wiff and hit him on the way down. I can also "take the hit" and throw him. In some cases I could jump and chuck him out of the air. He's expecting me to go for the wiff/low hit thing, so he holds off hitting roundhouse and leaves himself wide open.

    They jump forward and immediately realize it was a mistake, but in the heat of the match they can't adapt and overcome their "instinctive" response. My reaction time was middle-of-the-road at best so I had to know what was coming in advance. Quick players, even with often subpar gameplans, always gave me the toughest time until I took their game into the lab for analysis.

    This is all ryu/ken stuff though. Especially against good rushdown Balrogs you better have something else up your sleeve.

    - j
  • jcasetnljcasetnl nachos.posterous.com Joined: Posts: 147
    Re: Back in the day... (LONG!)
    Originally posted by Judgment Day


    :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Oh my God, that was funny! Excellent post, my friend.

    PS: The death sound effect of Ken was to a tee. Also reminds me on how Ken and Ryu used to say "Shoryuken" (All You Can) like they meant it in those days. The true sign of old school :)

    eeeeeeewwwwwuuuuuhhhhhh
    --The Real Ken


    That reminds me of when the slower kids would call Guile, "gully" and Ryu was still called "rye-you", back when kids would have half-hour long debates about what make and model car the bonus round Ride was or point to the old man with the cane on Bison's stage and claim he was Sheng Long.

    PISS-O-PISS-O-P-PISS-OFF. Who's old skool enough to remember what fighting game that comes from? Heh heh.

    Damn this thread brings back memories. Back in the Street Fighter 1 days I used to show other kids how to do the special moves in exchange for nachos and burritos...heh heh... information is power. Then they would do the same with other kids. Talk about a pyramid scheme.

    I can still beat Heavy Barrel on one quarter, though. I can usually still get at least to Stage 30 in Galaga. And it would not be wise to ever throw money down against me in Moon Patrol or Spy Hunter. All that aside, I'd go so far to claim you might be totally insane to ever challenge me on 8-bit, that is, unless you can beat Metroid from start to finish in under 20 minutes or beat Gradius without any codes... heh heh. :D :cool:

    peace - j
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Originally posted by Eggo
    "His problem was he didnt have the reflexes and coordination to pull off the latest combos"

    Sometimes I wish I had just kept that quarter in my pocket and walked.
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