Official SSF2T: HD Remix General Discussion Thread

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  • Hatz87Hatz87 BAN-ISM Joined: Posts: 685
    Yes.

    F that, I refuse to believe it. I've never gotten so raged at the fatman's throw in ST, and all of a sudden i move to hd and it stands out...
    If you've been referred to Hatz' signature, please select one of the following items:

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  • FreshOJFreshOJ It's the God in me.. Joined: Posts: 1,485
    F that, I refuse to believe it. I've never gotten so raged at the fatman's throw in ST, and all of a sudden i move to hd and it stands out...

    You're probably either getting stored Ochioed or just simply standing too close to Honda while being throwable.

    Otherwise, if Sirlin didn't list the change, it didn't happen...believe it or not.
    Onaje Everett
    Still in S.D., representing the Almighty.
    READ MY FAQ!!! (http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/xbox360/file/939066/56195)
  • Hatz87Hatz87 BAN-ISM Joined: Posts: 685
    Honda wake-up throw priority=ridiculous
    Honda while being hitstunned, and throwin you=ridiculous
    Honda throwing me while half the screen away=ridiculous
    If you've been referred to Hatz' signature, please select one of the following items:

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  • FreshOJFreshOJ It's the God in me.. Joined: Posts: 1,485
    Honda wake-up throw priority=ridiculous
    Honda while being hitstunned, and throwin you=ridiculous
    Honda throwing me while half the screen away=ridiculous

    Look at the game mechanics involved with these things.

    Wake-up throws: The person getting up from a knockdown gets to throw one frame before the person standing over them thanks to "reversal" throws...and can also use that reversal window to perform a special move (preferrably one with invincibility).

    Which side of the equation are you on?

    I don't really understand the second statement, but whether Honda or you are in hit-stun, the same reversal window stuff that I laid out above applies here. If he's in hit-stun and then reversal throws you, that's your fault for being too close and your combo not being tight. If you're in hit-stun and then he throws you, that's your fault for not using your reversal timing to either throw or special move him.

    The third statement...impossible. He doesn't have that kind of range. Check out this link...

    http://nki.combovideos.com/data.html#distance

    Honda's Ochio Throw only has 5 more pixels of range than his regular throws. That being said, Honda has one of the longest normal throw ranges in the game. He's a sumo wrestler, so I think that part should be about accurate. So, now that you know that, you need to be more careful when you get close. Regardless of that, the Ochio Throw is nothing compared to a Mexican Typhoon or Spinning Pile Driver.

    What I will say, though, is that stored Ochio Throws will make a lot of the above very easy to do. Honda never should've been allowed to keep that. Ever. Still, rather than complaining about that move...learn the mechanics of the game and do something about it.
    Onaje Everett
    Still in S.D., representing the Almighty.
    READ MY FAQ!!! (http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/xbox360/file/939066/56195)
  • Hatz87Hatz87 BAN-ISM Joined: Posts: 685
    I was obviously exaggerating the half screen. I know the mechanics of the game well, in fact I'd love to play a few on here who i suspect think i'm a noob >:)

    As for the complaining, i really wasn't. I twas simply asking. I know how to counter honda, but he's still a op prick. I did my complaining in the other thread, and speaking of

    Why is it....when I go and post in a thread made for bitching, i get called out for bitching. Riddle me that.
    If you've been referred to Hatz' signature, please select one of the following items:

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  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] Joined: Posts: 0
    Honda was poorlu designed, the match if fucking impossible if not entirly impossible to win with Fei. Orchio beats every offensive measure of Fei and headbutt>>>everything fei can do...there is no way to win with fei.
    "What one person sees as degrading and disgusting and bad for women might make some women feel empowered and beautiful and strong."
    - Sasha Grey
  • Hatz87Hatz87 BAN-ISM Joined: Posts: 685
    Win. My buddy who is a honda whore, says that he is ridiculously op in hd compared to ST. That his throw priority is way noticeable compared to ST. I'm gonna go drink some more beers, eat some white castle, and play some HD. Fuck you all, im out
    If you've been referred to Hatz' signature, please select one of the following items:

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  • x64x64 Fuck your SRK Joined: Posts: 3,187
    There's been a severe lack of discussion going on in the Rog thread >:|
    ST/HDR/USF2: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    Fightcade/USF2: x64
  • JizzonJizzon ...or Thenarus, whichever. Joined: Posts: 650
    The thing that really gets me about Fei's design tweaks in HDR is that they are out of flavor for the character. He's based on Bruce Lee, one of the fastest fighters in history. His footspeed and rekkas follow this very well, but now his CWs and short flame kick have added recovery time? Ugh.

    I can definitely understand some of the logic behind the CW being combo disabled (besides those sweet juggles), but that's more of a wind-up move anyway. Nerfing his jab flame kick in addition to the CWs juat allows characters he already has bad matchups with to have that much more of a chance to punish him. Why the hell should a sumo wrestler be able to outpace a recovering Fei? For someone who's so big on mindgames, Sirlin's decision to lengthen the recovery on the short flame kick seems to stifle that. You couldn't autocombo off of it like you could in ST, so it could lead to some great yomi setups. After an HDR CW, you could:

    1. Short FK and they don't block. Yay damage!

    2. Short FK and they do block. It doesn't combo anymore, so you get a little chip damage and out of harm's way. Not bad.

    3. Have them think you're going to short FK and instead go for his fwd overhead or a throw. Of course, you can do this now, but it would work so much better with the threat of almost free chip damage to play off of.

    Fei's flame kicks don't have the range nor the priority of many other DP-style attacks, so why nerf them if you couldn't combo off of it anyway? First of all, the CWs are usually fairly telegraphed, so if you can get in with them without being countered you deserve an added chip against turtles. At point-blank the short FK priority is decent, so good on you if you can catch an overly aggressive or unwary opponent who can't resist counter attacking after the now lower-priority CWs. Outside of that, though, the entire cast can react to spamming flame kicks, just like they do versus Ken's jab DP. (Who really counters Ken's jab DP with an unsafe jumping attack, btw? His head's vulnerable as a counter as to why Fei's recovery had to be increased is feeble.)

    It just really feels weird to go from ST Fei who had so little recovery after everything to HDR, where he's far less safe and has to set up everything. It's cool that CW can juggle, but playing against turtles is now just that much worse from a character who already scraped the bottom of the barrel tier-wise.

    At least his better super and rekkas are very nice tools to have. Juggling flame kicks off of CWs is possibly the most fun new thing to do in the game behind Bison's fake slide to throw (especially against jab DPs, hehe).
  • SentientProgramSentientProgram XBL:HaffDolla Joined: Posts: 141
    Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask, but does anyone know if EVO will use wide screen or 4:3? *prays for 4:3*
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    Nope, 16:9. There's a thread about it in the Evo sub-forum.
  • Coth_XCoth_X G(x) = (3/(1-3x)) - 3 - 3x - 27x^2 Joined: Posts: 4,340
    I didn't see it in the changes, so does it mean that honda's knee and hug ranges/damage weren't nerfed like ken's, blanka's, sim's, and rog's?

    In the fei section sirlin is puzzled why the community had a negative reaction to a nerf on a low tier character lol.
    "The purpose of proof is to understand, not to verify." - Arnold Ross
    http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/534416 <--- Coolest Game Ever!
  • TheloThelo Holdin' down-back Joined: Posts: 1,144 mod
    I didn't see it in the changes, so does it mean that honda's knee and hug ranges/damage weren't nerfed like ken's, blanka's, sim's, and rog's?
    Honda's hug and knee grabs are identical in ST and HD Remix. Same thing for Blanka, incidentally.

    (Ken, Dhalsim and Balrog's grabs have reduced range in HD Remix (very small difference for Ken), and Ken and Balrog's grabs do less damage on the first hit.)
    Keeping your cool is always the winning move.
  • CWheezyCWheezy Joined: Posts: 889
    That his throw priority is way noticeable compared to ST.

    Good thing your friend is wrong, and nothing was changed.

    Honda still has the largest throw range on his regular throws in the game
  • Coth_XCoth_X G(x) = (3/(1-3x)) - 3 - 3x - 27x^2 Joined: Posts: 4,340
    Honda's hug and knee grabs are identical in ST and HD Remix. Same thing for Blanka, incidentally.

    (Ken, Dhalsim and Balrog's grabs have reduced range in HD Remix (very small difference for Ken), and Ken and Balrog's grabs do less damage on the first hit.)

    They (in blanka thread) said he got nerfed too, and sims said his damaged was nerfed too. I ask because why wasn't honda's?
    "The purpose of proof is to understand, not to verify." - Arnold Ross
    http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/534416 <--- Coolest Game Ever!
  • TheloThelo Holdin' down-back Joined: Posts: 1,144 mod
    They (in blanka thread) said he got nerfed too, and sims said his damaged was nerfed too. I ask because why wasn't honda's?
    What? Nobody ever said anything about Blanka's throw range or damage being nerfed, it's the same as in ST (i.e. disgustingly powerful). If anything, his throw is even more useful now because of the easier hop and more confusing short Blanka balls that setup it better.
    Keeping your cool is always the winning move.
  • x64x64 Fuck your SRK Joined: Posts: 3,187
    I think his bite throw had its damage reduced on the first bite. Kinda like how Sim/Ken/Rog had their hold's power reduced.
    ST/HDR/USF2: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    Fightcade/USF2: x64
  • Coth_XCoth_X G(x) = (3/(1-3x)) - 3 - 3x - 27x^2 Joined: Posts: 4,340
    What? Nobody ever said anything about Blanka's throw range or damage being nerfed, it's the same as in ST (i.e. disgustingly powerful). If anything, his throw is even more useful now because of the easier hop and more confusing short Blanka balls that setup it better.

    First post in blanka thread, I'd take the word of a blanka cuz I don't play blanka, sim im not sure, ill have to confirm.
    "The purpose of proof is to understand, not to verify." - Arnold Ross
    http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/534416 <--- Coolest Game Ever!
  • MackdaddiMackdaddi The Great Dictator Joined: Posts: 754
    Sorry if this is the wrong place to ask, but does anyone know if EVO will use wide screen or 4:3? *prays for 4:3*
    Nope, 16:9. There's a thread about it in the Evo sub-forum.

    IMO this should really be 4:3, because it's the way the game was originally designed to be played. The game IS really beautiful in widescreen, but the vertical crop really makes the characters bigger and fills more of the screen with them. It's only a small advantage to me, but I'm definitely able to get more mileage out of stuff like bison's headstomp, and especially his devil's reverse because of the lessened clearance over the character's heads to the top of the screen for them to be able to see what i'm doing mid move.In HDR, if i do a devil's reverse on a close opponent, half the time bison will disappear off the top of the screen completely in a way that he doesn't do in arcade ST because of the way the screen is cropped for 16:9. I abuse that a lot, because it's really confusing for the opponent.I can cross him up or steer around in mid air while i'm off the top of the screen without him even being able to see where i'm going, and it's a guessing game what side of him i'll come down on and whether he'll get the block direction right or not. I know, but he doesn't. When the screen is 4:3 he can see part of my body at all times so he knows where i am and can react properly, just as capcom designed it.

    I'm sure there are more examples of people being able to abuse this kind of thing. I only know the ones with my main, but i bet that i'm not the only person out there that has a couple of tricks like i've discribed. I think that in a tourney of the quality of EVO, stuff like that shouldn't be left to chance.
    これはあなたの墓があります......This place shall become your grave
  • ShariShari Overestimated. Joined: Posts: 2,626
    snip

    Yay walldives ?
    Haunts: Is it lag or just impeccable footsies and spacing, I don't know.
    MiloDC: I beat YuuVega -- yes, that YuuVega -- the first time I played Claw seriously in my entire life.
  • MackdaddiMackdaddi The Great Dictator Joined: Posts: 754
    Yay walldives ?

    Oh yeah, another good example.BTW Your walldives F*ck me up WAY too much shari.The LAST thing i need is not being able to see where you are.Hahaha :bgrin:
    これはあなたの墓があります......This place shall become your grave
  • SweetJohnnyVSweetJohnnyV Streets ahead! Joined: Posts: 1,981 mod
    I've played against tons of Bisons and Vegas and I don't ever remember thinking "WTF...where did he go?". Also, this is HDR, not ST, and it's default setting is 16:9.
  • CWheezyCWheezy Joined: Posts: 889
    I think his bite throw had its damage reduced on the first bite. Kinda like how Sim/Ken/Rog had their hold's power reduced.

    Not according to the changelog
  • x64x64 Fuck your SRK Joined: Posts: 3,187
    Hrm, coulda swore it was. Thought Nohoho said it or something.
    ST/HDR/USF2: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    Fightcade/USF2: x64
  • Coth_XCoth_X G(x) = (3/(1-3x)) - 3 - 3x - 27x^2 Joined: Posts: 4,340
    The damage on first hit nerfs are barely noticeable and are actually meaning less, however ken has the worst no mash hold at about 20% where every other no mash hold hits 30%.
    "The purpose of proof is to understand, not to verify." - Arnold Ross
    http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/534416 <--- Coolest Game Ever!
  • MackdaddiMackdaddi The Great Dictator Joined: Posts: 754
    I've played against tons of Bisons and Vegas and I don't ever remember thinking "WTF...where did he go?". Also, this is HDR, not ST, and it's default setting is 16:9.

    That just means that not a lot of players use the trick, but it can still be done. I don't know about vega, but i can definitely use the 16:9 screen to my advantage with bison. For example if i activate an up or up+forward devil's reverse on an opponent who's jumping in on me with an aerial attack from mid distace or so, and get the timing right so i activate it when they're at the top of their jump, i can fly right off the top of the screen when i hit the reversal and choose which side of them i want to come down on with an attack.

    The DR trajectory is dependant on where the opponent is to an extent, as well as where bison is in relation to them. With a bit of practise you can learn to do tricky stuff like that, and the cropped screen just makes it a bit easier to get away with.
    これはあなたの墓があります......This place shall become your grave
  • SHAAAADYSHAAAADY Chessboxer. Joined: Posts: 196
    Havent been on here in awhile..

    Sup everyone. Question(s).
    (maybe Sirlin or someone who knows how the ranking system works can answer).

    So I used to be like # 7 on the leaderboard but stopped playing for awhile and my rank went down to like 28. Understandable.

    I've started playing regularly again, and I've been kicking a good amount of ass (possibly even a little moreso than I was months ago when I was in the top)..yet my rank is slowly going down. Its at like 34 or something right now.

    My numbers/records after a session are good..and I pretty consistently beat most of the people mentioned in this 'best on live' thread. http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=194521

    Is my rank just getting severely knocked down every time I scrub out to a random person with bad connection (or even just someone whos good but rarely plays on ranked).
    Would my rank receive a equally significant change (in promotion, not demotion) if I beat some or one of the top 10 players?

    If so..heres another question. Are the top ranked players on the leaderboard just not playing on ranked anymore (to preserve their records)?
    I look at the top of the leaderboard and I havent run into any of these guys since I started playing again.

    Somebody fill me in...cause I really enjoy playing on ranked..but if the people I gotta beat (to get higher rank) aren't playing..whats the point?

    Peace
    Everyone has a plan until they get hit.


    ...with random super.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    when is the price drop?
  • x64x64 Fuck your SRK Joined: Posts: 3,187
    Sup everyone. Question(s).
    (maybe Sirlin or someone who knows how the ranking system works can answer).

    So I used to be like # 7 on the leaderboard but stopped playing for awhile and my rank went down to like 28. Understandable.

    I've started playing regularly again, and I've been kicking a good amount of ass (possibly even a little moreso than I was months ago when I was in the top)..yet my rank is slowly going down. Its at like 34 or something right now.

    My numbers/records after a session are good..and I pretty consistently beat most of the people mentioned in this 'best on live' thread. http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=194521

    Is my rank just getting severely knocked down every time I scrub out to a random person with bad connection (or even just someone whos good but rarely plays on ranked).
    Would my rank receive a equally significant change (in promotion, not demotion) if I beat some or one of the top 10 players?

    If so..heres another question. Are the top ranked players on the leaderboard just not playing on ranked anymore (to preserve their records)?
    I look at the top of the leaderboard and I havent run into any of these guys since I started playing again.

    Somebody fill me in...cause I really enjoy playing on ranked..but if the people I gotta beat (to get higher rank) aren't playing..whats the point?

    Peace

    Being in the Top 50 sucks. You can win like 50 in a row and lose one and be worse off than when you started. I too find barely anyone in the top 50. You pretty much can't level up much at all unless you find someone in the top 15 I've found too.
    ST/HDR/USF2: Honda/Rog/O.Hawk | USF4: Bison | SFV: Ryu :(
    XBL: mr x64 | PSN: deadpool_zero | SFV: epistaxis64
    Fightcade/USF2: x64
  • TheloThelo Holdin' down-back Joined: Posts: 1,144 mod
    Yeah, the older the scoreboard gets, the harder it is for rankings to change. Beating a top 50 player is usually the only thing worth a reasonable amount of ranking points if you are in the top 50 yourself - beating on someone 4000 ranks below you will likely net you something like 0.2 ranking points (5000 ranking points is the theoretical maximum).

    Personally, I play ranked about half the time, and play about 2~3 evenings per week (I'm ranked about #9 currently) - I suspect many of the high ranks also do something like that so it might be hard to face a high rank. Time zone differences also mean you can miss out on a lot of players just because you live far from them.
    Keeping your cool is always the winning move.
  • ShariShari Overestimated. Joined: Posts: 2,626
    I wish there was an option for selecting which voice of a character you wanted.

    Such as girly man Guile or buff Guile.

    Or the awesome hyou the old versions of Claw has.
    Haunts: Is it lag or just impeccable footsies and spacing, I don't know.
    MiloDC: I beat YuuVega -- yes, that YuuVega -- the first time I played Claw seriously in my entire life.
  • MackdaddiMackdaddi The Great Dictator Joined: Posts: 754
    I wish there was an option for selecting which voice of a character you wanted.

    Such as girly man Guile or buff Guile.

    Or the awesome hyou the old versions of Claw has.

    or for getting big bird to be the announcer again :rofl:

    More than anything i just want to be able to turn off the new remixed ken stage music that's all over the menus....i hate it so much because i've been forced to listen to it for months.....
    これはあなたの墓があります......This place shall become your grave
  • RagingStormXRagingStormX Team Arcade Stream Joined: Posts: 5,199 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Easier hands isn't just an easier way to move forward, it's made him considerably more deadly combo wise. Have you seen EA Megaman's Honda nonsense? Dude figured out a crossup kick to crouching kick to hands combo that does like 2/3 life and leads into throw/slaps guessing game that can completely kill you (and can be done as a safe jump after fierce/roundhouse grabs). Good job to him, but the fact that that's possible is pretty retarded, and I say that even as a Honda player.

    I don't think Honda has any matchups that are too far from even, he still goes even with or has slight advantages against a third of the cast, and he still beats a third of the cast convincingly.

    I was doing that crap in training like the first week the game came out, except you can link 2 c.lk's into hands for extra damage. Or mix up if the first one is blokced to oicho or c.lk xx hands. Pretty damn retarded.
  • Cyberfrost849Cyberfrost849 kikin it like jagger Joined: Posts: 182
    Hey guys uh, i dont know where else to ask this but

    Is there an OFFICIAL SSF2THDR tier list? I tried searching on google and i cant find one anywhere as im just curious to see where my main characters are.
    XBL- Prisoner8490, say your from SRK and we'll play =)
  • RagingStormXRagingStormX Team Arcade Stream Joined: Posts: 5,199 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Hey guys uh, i dont know where else to ask this but

    Is there an OFFICIAL SSF2THDR tier list? I tried searching on google and i cant find one anywhere as im just curious to see where my main characters are.

    P.Hawk is sexy tier.
  • FreshOJFreshOJ It's the God in me.. Joined: Posts: 1,485
    Hey guys uh, i dont know where else to ask this but

    Is there an OFFICIAL SSF2THDR tier list? I tried searching on google and i cant find one anywhere as im just curious to see where my main characters are.

    The best you're gonna get right now is "The inevitable tier thread".
    Onaje Everett
    Still in S.D., representing the Almighty.
    READ MY FAQ!!! (http://www.gamefaqs.com/console/xbox360/file/939066/56195)
  • Rex0rRex0r Do smart stuff Joined: Posts: 2,731
    honda is top tier, the rest is a crapshoot, IMO.

    i dont think honda has moved up to top tier. He still has too many bad matchups, the honda mains i know almost prefer him in vanilla because at least then he has a chance to safe jump ochio you to death. But at low levels i could see how honda would be pretty godly.

    Ryu and dictator are safe bets for top tier now that those above them have been weakened. Sim is still up there. Boxer is def still realy realy good. My "top tier" would be:

    Sim, Boxer, Ryu, Dic, Sagat
  • NorieagaNorieaga FADC x ROFLCOPTER Joined: Posts: 4,220
    It goes something like this:

    Retarded: Akuma
    Very Top: Dhalsim, Vega, Balrog
    Top: M. Bison, Sagat
    Upper-Mid: Ryu

    ...and I don't wanna post the rest.

    EDIT: No way is Honda top. He can get creamed by zoning Ryu, Ken, Dee-Jay, Chun-Li, and even Blanka can give him fits. But he is very good against non-FB characters, and you can pretty much murder all low-level players with him. Really good Honda's can also struggle through FB's, but its damn hard.
  • Cyberfrost849Cyberfrost849 kikin it like jagger Joined: Posts: 182
    It goes something like this:

    Retarded: Akuma
    Very Top: Dhalsim, Vega, Balrog
    Top: M. Bison, Sagat
    Upper-Mid: Ryu

    ...and I don't wanna post the rest.

    EDIT: No way is Honda top. He can get creamed by zoning Ryu, Ken, Dee-Jay, Chun-Li, and even Blanka can give him fits. But he is very good against non-FB characters, and you can pretty much murder all low-level players with him. Really good Honda's can also struggle through FB's, but its damn hard.

    Where's Chun Li/Guile currently? eh i guess ill carry it over to the inevitable tier thread since thatd be more on topic...

    And raging i hate T.hawk no way is he sexy tier >=(
    XBL- Prisoner8490, say your from SRK and we'll play =)
  • MavrickMavrick "I Am Cold Blooded" Joined: Posts: 975
    It goes something like this:

    Retarded: Akuma
    Very Top: Dhalsim, Vega, Balrog
    Top: M. Bison, Sagat
    Upper-Mid: Ryu

    ...and I don't wanna post the rest.

    EDIT: No way is Honda top. He can get creamed by zoning Ryu, Ken, Dee-Jay, Chun-Li, and even Blanka can give him fits. But he is very good against non-FB characters, and you can pretty much murder all low-level players with him. Really good Honda's can also struggle through FB's, but its damn hard.

    I dont agree with BISON as a top fighter his to easly defeated by people that know how to poke him out with Chun,dj,guile,vega,balrogsagat,blanka,honda and so on almost the whole cast except bison and ken are the only two that cant keep him traped in the corner or out poke him
    As my dear friend Wax once said "this game is like the special olympics - even if you win you're still a retarrrd" Quotable Quotes
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