C.Viper Q&A: Quick questions here please!

skisonicskisonic Joined: Posts: 1,131 mod
As the title explains. Viper players, this is on you. Kunai, True_Tech, DevilJin01, etc, field it up!
Internationally known. East coast home.

I bet some people thank god for the internet and the keyboard everynight when they pray. "NOW I CAN SAY WHATEVER I WANT!" - big|dave
«134567105

Comments

  • DrumsAreNeatDrumsAreNeat Maya! Joined: Posts: 279
    Good call on this thread Skisonic!
    -Avatar by Dreamstate83-

    "Quit stalling already, would you?"
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    Thank god. Will keep the thread from turning into a mini GameFAQs.

    Ya'll know I answer questions whenever I have free time so shoot away nubs.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • ShinobiBrownShinobiBrown Joined: Posts: 583
    Excellent; hopefully this will cut back the countless amounts of silly threads being made here just to ask simple questions.

    @KADIA: Strings to keep pressure if I have it, I use c.lk,s.lk,c.mp, mp tk. If c.lk and s.lk are blocked I just go for the throw after the s.lk.

    I also use c.mp, mp tk a lot and feint the mp tk if they block the c.mp and go for throw, overhead (:r::mp:), or jump in.

    However, if they mash on DP 24/7 some of that isn't exactly going to work. :|
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    Type C.Viper in YouTube and watch what they do. Particularly look for players like FZ, Dashio, Kindevu, Joe or Kaqn. Use MP Knuckle cancels during your normals to keep the opponent locked down. Like c.MK, MP Knuckle cancel, c.MK, to Ex seismo or sjc burn kick or whatever.

    If you hit the opponent with focus attack the best combo you can do is double fierce to EX seismo to sjc burn kick. c.HP or close s.HP, HP Knuckle cancel, c.HP, EX seismo, sjc burn kick. If you have an Ultra you can tack on one at the end as well against most characters.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    thanks for that, ive looked at videos and it seems people like to Turtle (seismo cancel shinanigans) i tend to be much more agressive.

    Oh one more thing, after a cross over BK(on block) is c.MP priority? ive seen it used several times, id hate to make it a habbit just because they dont punish it...
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Hey, im new to Shoryuken, and im trying to get my C. Viper skills up. I just have a question to all the more experiences Viper vets. When I play against my friends or online, I have a serious problem with things to do after i score a knock down. I watched some vids, and i see alot of j HK or Flame Kicks, and i've tried the same, but i always catch the bad end of a cannon spike or shroyuken, etc. I get hit with alot of wake up attacks, especially online, What should I do about all this?
  • True_TechTrue_Tech dragon the body Joined: Posts: 2,742 mod
    its a matter of timing and spacing, and its also a matter of training them. if they like to keep doing uppers on wake up do an empty jump or a cross up j.rh to train them to stop that shit. the way i do the j.rh i time it so it lands on their hand right as they stand up so my knee is already in their head. so far its worked out against everyone i've played.

    for flamekicks you gotta learn the right distance/kick so you hit their upper and not the other way around. dash sj short flamekick works well after a forward throw.

    i'm sure i missed something so where the rest of you guys at?
  • nindonindo Way of the ninja Joined: Posts: 21
    You -need- to do the flame kicks with a Super Jump. It will either crossup or trade with shoryukens/cannon spikes. But you should conserve it, and only do it when you're on the attack (with block strings) The normal flame kick (off the ground) sucks and only do it (the low kick version is the fastest) when you're about to get grabbed. (Bait a grab with a TK feint, dashes, or any other stuff) In the corner it's profit.

    About wake-up attacks... if you're jumping in with HK against an opponent who's waking up, make sure it's a meaty (right jump timing AND right HK timing) It should beat most stuff cleanly or not it will trade. (except EX moves)
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    sorry for that i should rephrase. although i know c.mp does not connect after a bk crossover(on block and assuming its meaty.) can anoyone confirm that its safe. or does anyone know something more effective in that situation? (trying to apply as much pressure as possible).
  • Shin_KensouShin_Kensou Border Break! Joined: Posts: 179
    beating shoryu's with flame kicks depend on not only spacing but height at well. for instance, sagat shoryu loses to bk at the apex of her jump (apex being at the peak of a jump). this in particular is best during a back throw when you think they'll shoryu. i've tried so many different timings to stop it but i've come up short losing hp every time so i use this method to beat it and of course like mentioned, to train them to stop so i can get back to the ambiguous stuff.

    will edit later with more...

    kaida: it all depends on the version of the bk you use. so a brief rundown on all of the bk's

    LK ver = +8 on block
    MK ver = +6 on block
    HK ver = +4 on block
    EX ver = +2 on block

    so from here you can determine what to follow up with. cr. mp is just another option which when mixed up is pretty crazy.
    ~"Teachin BOyS How To BloCk"Director~
    ~1oo% reason to remember the name...~
    "You must be making tons of money, yet you go to a Denny's to eat a free meal. Ballin' outta control, son."-Javi
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Another option for Viper on wake is when your opponent tries to get chip damage with a fireball from mid range. If you time an EX burning kick it will go right through the projectile. It even beats Ryu's Ultra clean.

    When I get trapped in the corner and I'm desperate to get out I just through that move out there. It whiffs ducking opponents and puts them in the corner.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Thanks for the advice, ill put it into action.
    Another thing i have a problem with, going from a m. TK to Super.
    Is there some trick to getting this right? or am I just not fast enough.
    I dont have a stick yet either, and i suppose that doesnt help much lol
  • EkimRisEkimRis Joined: Posts: 256
    When you do the quarter circle back for the TK IMMEDIATELY start doing the first quarter circle forward for the super. I've found if there's any delay my inputs are too slow and it won't come out.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    I've found MP Knuckle to super works most consistently when I hit motion for the super slowly and hit the punch button for the super just at the point where the MP knuckle hits the opponent. So just do the motion slowly as the MP Knuckle is coming out but hit the punch button at the exact point that the MP knuckle connects. If you hit the punch button any later the super won't come out.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Discovered this while failing the trial normally. Has anyone ever landed EX hammer to super jump to lk (in air) to lk flame kick? (except for the mid-air lk, everything else is in normal trial 4 challenge 2 or 3) Having watched that vid where the guy is adding in a bunch of moves in the hardest trials I'm thinking it should hit because Dan really cant block mid-air and the flame kick goes out when both are in the air but it whiffs completely. Or would this just make SF broken in a few places since a few other shoto characters could possibly do the same? Its fine if the lk will never work, since once you land that EX hammer I see that you're pretty much guaranteed that combo/damage; I'm not against getting extra damage in though!:wgrin:
  • True_TechTrue_Tech dragon the body Joined: Posts: 2,742 mod
    no it doesn't work j.lk is a reset you can't hit them in the air after that cause they already recover.
  • reaper2507reaper2507 Joined: Posts: 1,066
    wich options does viper hafe one Wakeup (enemy) and how to execute them so faar im using
    -F+MP
    -Crouching Long into MK Knuckle
    -Seismo

    How to prform CrossoverBurningkicks? are there any normal crossovers? would realy realy love to get this question answerd is there a easy way to crosover with burningkick except of deepjumpin HK+Burningkick? instant crossover as excample?
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    LOL. You got like 9 questions. That ain't gonna be quick to answer. You need to read the threads first and see if you can answer any yourself before someone has to answer 9 questions. This isn't the give me a rundown of how Viper works cuz I don't wanna read thread. 1 or 2 specific questions at most would be best.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • ForteForte Taking Aim Joined: Posts: 269
    wich options does viper hafe one Wakeup (enemy) and how to execute them so faar im using

    -F+MP
    -Crouching Long into MK Knuckle
    -Seismo

    How to prform CrossoverBurningkicks? are there any normal crossovers? would realy realy love to get this question answerd is there a easy way to crosover with burningkick except of deepjumpin HK+Burningkick? instant crossover as excample?


    Wich options does viper hafe to poke and wath are her options for pressure game except of Burning Kick; Crouching MK into knuckle and F+MP?

    and last but not least wath to do against Wakeupreversals like Shoryukens ?

    Honestly you should, I dunno, read some of the other threads, but I'll give it a shot anyway.

    You can do a lot of stuff on their wake up, the ones you listed, cross up burn kick, etc. Meaties don't seem to be as effective in SF4 since reversals are so easy and a lot of characters have options for low risk reversals with meter, but you can still use them.

    Only the aerial burn kick can cross up, and you can do it from a normal jump or a super jump, you've just got to place it so that it hits the back of their head. There's no one way to do it, you can tiger knee it, just jump and do it, sj tiger knee, etc.

    For poking Viper has decent normals but they're somewhat slow. She has the link strings like c.lk, s.lk, c.mp, those and the feints play into the pressure game. Ex seismo is also pretty alright to toss out, to catch backdashes & counter pokes due to the invincibility. Just watch some match videos to see.

    Block wake up reversals. I don't know why you'd do anything else if you're that sure someone will reversal DP. Block & punish with c.hp -> Ex seismo, or of course fierce, feint, fierce to seismo if you're comfortable enough. Without meter She can s.hp, c.mp, tk or fierce, feint fierce, tk. Cross up burn kick can also stuff some reversals if you hit the back side of them just right.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    What is the recover time for L. TK. It goes under projectiles when timed right. im constantly being bated into alot of random ish though.
  • True_TechTrue_Tech dragon the body Joined: Posts: 2,742 mod
    -2 on block aka the only thing that i know of that could punish it is a reversal super demon.
  • MrHitsMrHits Joined: Posts: 54
    quick question: do you use different strength flame kicks to juggle from different range groundpounds? I stick to r.k flamekick for juggles to cover the distance, but wasn't sure if this is the best technique.
  • KeizionKeizion Becoming a Threat... Joined: Posts: 140
    I was reading thru Kunai's mini guide, great stuff in there, but i didn't see if Viper's F+MP was throwable or not by normal and command grabs, anyone know?

    Also...
    beating shoryu's with flame kicks depend on not only spacing but height at well. for instance, sagat shoryu loses to bk at the apex of her jump (apex being at the peak of a jump). this in particular is best during a back throw when you think they'll shoryu. i've tried so many different timings to stop it but i've come up short losing hp every time so i use this method to beat it and of course like mentioned, to train them to stop so i can get back to the ambiguous stuff.

    will edit later with more...

    kaida: it all depends on the version of the bk you use. so a brief rundown on all of the bk's

    LK ver = +8 on block
    MK ver = +6 on block
    HK ver = +4 on block
    EX ver = +2 on block

    so from here you can determine what to follow up with. cr. mp is just another option which when mixed up is pretty crazy.

    I'm not sure exactly how to say this but recently i've been able to beat wake up shoryu's with BK's that hit behind their fist, i know this is a bad description but it's 8am, if you time your jump so that you are behind themon wake up and do wk BK it should be gg against the shoryu. i'm gonna test more on it after i get home.
    Consistency is the result of Training and Wins are the result of Experience, It's time to produce results.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    ^^^^

    Depends on if she's airborne on the first frame or not. Try recording Viper doing it in training mode and see if you can throw her. If it's like HP Thunder Knuckle where it takes her a couple frames to leave the ground then people will be able to grab you. Which isn't a huge problem since you obviously wanna take to the air with the move before they can do that in the first place.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • KeizionKeizion Becoming a Threat... Joined: Posts: 140
    ^^^^

    Depends on if she's airborne on the first frame or not. Try recording Viper doing it in training mode and see if you can throw her. If it's like HP Thunder Knuckle where it takes her a couple frames to leave the ground then people will be able to grab you. Which isn't a huge problem since you obviously wanna take to the air with the move before they can do that in the first place.

    So grabs don't really have start up frames if she has to be airborne in the 1st frame of the overhead? Sorry about the questions if they seem like common knowledge but i'm tryna get all the information i can, aspiring to be tournament level ASAP.
    Consistency is the result of Training and Wins are the result of Experience, It's time to produce results.
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    Well what I'm trying to say is that there are certain moves in the game that get you off the ground pretty much at frame one or 2. Like the shotos dragon punch or Bison's devil reverse (charge down, up +P) is known for this. Meaning it's normally not possible to throw them out of it once they start it. Same goes for Fei Long's f+MK. Or at least that's the way it was in ST. Once you press f+MK he's considered airborne and no longer throwable.

    Whereas with moves like Viper's HP Thunder Knuckle...even though the move looks like she flies into the air pretty quickly there's definitely some frames you can visibly see where she hasn't left the ground yet and the game therefore allows her to be thrown in those frames. Meaning if the opponent can anticipate you'll HP knuckle on wake up they'll throw you out of the closest thing Viper has to a dragon punch. :lol:

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • KeizionKeizion Becoming a Threat... Joined: Posts: 140
    Oh ok thanks for that, I'm at work at the moment and they said i can't play video games even though nothing else is going on so i can't test it but it's on my sticky of things to do on SF4 when i get home.
    Consistency is the result of Training and Wins are the result of Experience, It's time to produce results.
  • DrumsAreNeatDrumsAreNeat Maya! Joined: Posts: 279
    Oh ok thanks for that, I'm at work at the moment and they said i can't play video games even though nothing else is going on so i can't test it but it's on my sticky of things to do on SF4 when i get home.

    they won't let me play videogames at work either. what a rough life. :lol:
    -Avatar by Dreamstate83-

    "Quit stalling already, would you?"
  • DevilJin 01DevilJin 01 Get some shill in yo system Joined: Posts: 56,831 mod
    ^^^^

    Drums I just sent you a visitor message about your avatar.

    Ain't nothin, Capcom's ruthless still producin.  Cut em a check or find yoself toothless.  Keep it shill with no confusin.  Niggas say I'm shill...they ain't hard I can prove it YEEEAH


  • KeizionKeizion Becoming a Threat... Joined: Posts: 140
    they won't let me play videogames at work either. what a rough life. :lol:

    6 hours of sitting here they could at least let me be productive at something.
    Consistency is the result of Training and Wins are the result of Experience, It's time to produce results.
  • V-DecKV-DecK Joined: Posts: 8
    Quick question about the sjc>instant fk. When I'm trying it I can't seem to get the arc of the kick right, I'm seeing it be done so that a player can pretty much go one side to the other while keeping as low to the ground as possible but anytime I try it I seem to go further up than across, the motion I'm using is :db::uf::d::db::l:

    Is there a better way of doing the input or is it just down to how fast you input the move.
  • deltabeatdeltabeat VIPER SMASH Joined: Posts: 47
    I used to think there was a trick to it, but all it really depends on is how fast you input the BK after you SJ.

    I use a stick and this is how i do it. In one smooth quick motion:

    :db::uf::hcb::k:

    Your way should work as well. It just takes practice.
    "I had a one night stand with lady luck!"
  • patmonstapatmonsta Joined: Posts: 1,052
    if u want the kick as low as possible, u have to be walking forward and do hcb to uf then kick theres no timing do that and it will work every time, btw this is instant and will cross up on grounded opponent very quickly, once again this works 100 percent if ur walking forward
    keep in touch thru Twitter patmonsta
    Facebook Patrick Ramos
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Quick question about the sjc>instant fk. When I'm trying it I can't seem to get the arc of the kick right, I'm seeing it be done so that a player can pretty much go one side to the other while keeping as low to the ground as possible but anytime I try it I seem to go further up than across, the motion I'm using is :db::uf::d::db::l:

    Is there a better way of doing the input or is it just down to how fast you input the move.

    No real humanly possible way to do the high jump then input burning kick and have it be "instant". In most cases you will probably go over their head and get punished badly.

    qcb or hcb then :uf: + k is the best way, just takes timing.
  • WonderswanWonderswan PUTTIN' QUARTERS UP Joined: Posts: 684
    A very good example of the instant burning kick cross up can be found here:

    Dashio totally rapes in the second round with it. Pretty sure he is using the QCB UF method, you can see him whiff it at one point in the match.
    "A capacity for unlimited effort will hurdle the difficulties that frustrate lukewarm enthusiasts." - Loomis
  • patmonstapatmonsta Joined: Posts: 1,052
    hcb uf then kick requires no timing, the qcb requires strict timing as much as it doesnt make sense u will c if u try the hcb method
    keep in touch thru Twitter patmonsta
    Facebook Patrick Ramos
  • MAGUS1234MAGUS1234 walk forward Joined: Posts: 3,993
    if u want the kick as low as possible, u have to be walking forward and do hcb to uf then kick theres no timing do that and it will work every time, btw this is instant and will cross up on grounded opponent very quickly, once again this works 100 percent if ur walking forward

    Yes and no, what you are describing is a insta jumping bk, it can be done anytime not just from walking. Problem is that it does not travel far.

    What people in here are asking is how to make the SJ BK go low as possible, which is a much more practicle move imo.
    I came to Keystone II and all I got was DP'd.
  • reaper2507reaper2507 Joined: Posts: 1,066
    the crossovers in the video where realy cool would love to know exactly how to do them (wich K?) wich motions? is there a way to visible verify the diffrenzce betwean a ground bk and a HJ bk? is there dust on the feed if it was a early one? i did not see dust at all in the videos..

    is it like dalsims instant airteleport? (hard to understand easy to perform??)a move every viper player want to know could someone try to write a tutorial?
  • AumniAumni C.Viper Pro wannabe Joined: Posts: 257
    RE: Backwards Burning Kicks.

    Has anyone found a reliable input to get these off? I'm referring to a burning kick that goes backwards without doing a jump or super jump backwards beforehand (visibly). It just looks like a reverse Standing Heavy Burning Kick.

    EDIT: Actually it looks like it just might be an instant BK with UB instead of UF. *Shoulda read a few posts up*


    It works great on spacing without leaving yourself vunerable for long, and against boxer it punishes dash punches safely.
    ....C.Viper for life!
  • KeizionKeizion Becoming a Threat... Joined: Posts: 140
    ^^ Yeah it's a Instant BK using ub.

    Man i love this chick i hope she's a permanent addition like all those shoto bastards.
    Consistency is the result of Training and Wins are the result of Experience, It's time to produce results.
«134567105
Sign In or Register to comment.