Kyo Strategies and Match ups

2

Comments

  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    The timing on far s.MP xx qcf+LP is very strict on punishing Bison's scissor kicks. I know just about the best way to hit is block standing, dunno about blocking late or early. Seems easier to block then let it go to neutral and hit MP. On occasion I've landed d.MP by accident, has to do mostly how I buffer the motions in during the animations of MP. Probably doing the down motion as soon as I hit the button.
    There's no mashing at all on that technique, and window of opportunity is very small.

    Will JD'ing the first of the two hits help in this, or must you always JD the last hit to get that extra edge?

    What are key things to watch against when fighting Bison?

    His Slide, RC Scissor kicks... When he's up close his BnB (I'm guessing it's d.LPx2, d.LK xx LK Scissor Kicks) How fast are his jabs, about the same as Kyo's shorts?
    I heard his air-to-air is good, with j.HK...

    I would imagine once Kyo gets the knockdown the game would be slightly in favor of him short of random activate slides or somesuch to beat his meaty attacks. Maybe activate slide isnt' the best option vs Kyo's d.LK, I dunno. How fast does slide come out?
    In such cases it's almost a guessing game for both players wouldn't you say?
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    K-Kyo vs A-Blanka on knockdowns

    Who has the upper hand on knockdown situations here?
    I just skimmed some later Blanka threads and it looks as if A-Blanka can fuck up Kyo's game a good deal.

    I don't know what the proper response for blocked RC Electricities, but my first instinct would be to d.MP xx lift kicks, etc. It's kinda easy to see RC electricity coming because it almost looks like he tries to get as damned close as possible to you. (It's a hella lot easier for me to JD all hits of that BS compared to JD'ing the measly 3 hits of Kaiser Wave. Gotta JD faster for that one)

    Problem is whiffed RC Electricity, throw, getting you to block without actually blocking and then throwing your ass. In addition to his short jump crossups to BnB's.

    It's like Blanka becomes just as dangerous as Kyo point blank.
    Doesn't have the kickthrow, but he doesn't need it because in the end he's top tier.

    Besides it looks like the kickthrow is too slow for up close and personal bouts with Blanka. Punch throw would be more ideal there.
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    The biggest thing I keep in mind when playing Kyo vs Blanka is to go easy on the d/f+HK moves. Blanka is a jump happy character and I'm going to eat falling j.HK combos all day and get dizzy if I brainlessly stick out my d/f+HK move like I spam it against other characters.

    Blanka d.HP limb can be whiff punished from far away with Kyo's far s.HK or d.HK.

    Random rdp+LK move also has priority over Blanka's extended limbs, and Kyo gets the knockdown too.

    DON'T let Blanka cross you up. Kyo's dp+HP sucks in that it has a bad habit of going under jump-ins when you're not careful about your distancing. Since Blanka has a nasty jumping crossup attack with his j.MK, ALWAYS be ready to hit your Kyo close s.MK or jump back fierce.

    Blanka can mash on close s.HK to cleanly go over your low shorts. Don't stop using d.LK altogether (as that move must be blocked low so it's still good), but consider using d.LP to fish for counter hits or attack out of option select situations every now and then.

    Kyo d.MP beats the slide. So hit d.MP a lot when you're not actively doing something.

    Kyo far s.HK has very high priority over Blanka's common ground attacks. Use it to go over d.LK, d.MK, and d.HK. You can stuff d.HP's cleanly as they come out too.


    It doesn't matter how slow the throw is. When the opponent guesses block, he's going to get thrown no matter what. You set up the opponent to want to block by going for counter hits low jabs repeatedly on him.

    One of Kyo's biggest damage openings is off his option select throw/low jab actually. Get point blank and make it totally look like you want to go for "block low for a split second, kick throw." Only instead of doing kick throw, wait your split second and then do low jab instead. At point blank range, Kyo's d.LP has superior priority over Blanka's slower low short, so use it!

    Kyo can also do d.LP, kick throw perfectly and it leaves the opponent in the ideal wakeup situation for you to mix him up. Throw him again! :rofl:

    The only time I ever go for the punch throw is when I want to grab a wakeup RC elec. Even in that instance, I think I might be able to grab with the kick throw also if I practiced the timing enough.

    Although this probably doesn't even apply here because command grabs are different than regular grabs, know that Buktooth is really awesome at grabbing wake-up RC elec with his Iori command grab (which is even slower than Kyo's kick throw) in case you're still worried about throw speed.


    I hope I didn't misinterpret your post (sorry if I did), but anyway...

    RC elec gives Blanka +10 on the block (you knew that right?). When Blanka times his follow up d.HK right (within a three frame window), you can let go of the stick and still be stuck in block stun.

    Most Blanka's don't do that though. They hit their d.HK so there's a gap for you to mash on something (like the d.MP I think you're talking about), and you get counter hit and forced to block RC elec again as you get up.

    Whenever I block RC elec, I either...

    1. Continue blocking and look to see if Blanka does anything other than d.HK

    or

    2. dp+LP against Blanka's limb when he tries to follow up . (won't work if he linked his d.HK within three frame window)

    I never try to jump away or let go of my low block, and I certainly never try to hit Blanka with a d.MP after blocking HP elec though. Am I even in range for d.MP after blocking anyway?

    =========

    Fighitng against RC electricity:

    If Blanka whiffs RC elec, you get a FREE far s.MP xx punch chain combo if you're in range.

    If Blanka is mashing on his elec after whiffing, you get a free dp+HP.

    If Blanka whiffs RC elec at your max far s.HK range, do Kyo far s.HK xx cloud super (counters Blanka clean even if he mashes).

    I bet you could do max range d.MP xx up kicks on Blanka mashing elec too since there's an invincible hitbox at the tip of Kyo's first. I didn't test it, but I have a feeling the MK upkicks won't reach though...

    ----

    I don't mess with trying to guess throw or dp against Blanka doing meaty RC elec on me. I just block and let him chip me as I get up because the chip damage is less than guessing wrong and eating counter hit HP elec damage (and get knocked down again) anyway.

    The only thing I keep my eye open for is when Blanka goes for whiff RC elec, throw gimmick. In that case, I immediately attempt to counter his throw with a d.LP combo.

    You can do the same thing with K-groove JD by tapping d/b for a split second as you get up, immediately hit d.LP afterwards to do option select JD RC elec/throw counter.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    epsilon_ wrote:
    crouching medium punch can be parried high or low, as opposed to standing medium punch which must be parried high.
    I'll remember that for the next time I play against P-groove. Why don't you just post and say "blah, blah, blah.. blah blah... blah"

    as for kyo vs blanka.. this match sucks, because (as kang said) blanka can mash s.HK and beat your low short game.. I like to stick to c.MP/close s.HK up close against blanka.. since it will either trade with low shorts or beat his s.HK clean if he decides to be a bitch.. walking out of close s.HK range to get far s.HK is of course great since it will beat almost all of his normals. c.MP can be good against c.HP if you time it well. whiffing c.MPs at his max c.HP range is good, buffer qcf+HP and if it counterhits you can connect a HP rekka chain. i don't like trying to AA blanka, because his fast jumps/crossups can get you whiffing dp+HP, and close s.MK seems to get beat by j.HK randomly, i would stick to jump back HP/MP/LP

    against blanka balls (this is where P/K-kyo shines):
    - block low/high reversal qcf+MP (hits blanka out of the air)
    - block low/high mistimed qcf+MP (either gets you blocked rekka, which is safe, or a full rekka chain)
    - block low/high reversal RC qcf+MP (guaranteed rekka chain)
    - block low/high mistimed RC qcf+MP (might not be as safe, but if this happens you have a better situation if he does RC ball, RC ball)
    kcxj wrote:
    If Blanka is mashing on his elec after whiffing, you get a free dp+HP.
    this makes kyo the best character at uppercutting mashed electricities.. this shit has crazy range..
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    what? lol. thats pretty useful against p groove.
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    kcxj wrote:

    Although this probably doesn't even apply here because command grabs are different than regular grabs, know that Buktooth is really awesome at grabbing wake-up RC elec with his Iori command grab (which is even slower than Kyo's kick throw) in case you're still worried about throw speed.

    Whoa. That must have something to do with the 7 frame "can't throw me on wakeup" thing and the timing on Iori's 8 frame startup scum gale...
    Add to that the 1 or 2 frames on RC electricities...Or is it since Blanka's going for wake-up RC electricity that he looses the save and Iori can throw him at any point during the gamble?

    Is it like this... "OH, Iori's trying to grab me with that gay ass Scum Gale."
    "Heheh. Bastard can't RC that." (Move continues)
    RC Electricity gets grabbed because of the properties shared with
    the roll, and looses 7 frame window too so he can be thrown.
    "WTF???"

    Or is it Buk knows lots of people might think to abuse the RC electricities on wakeup like a perfect dragonpunch if Iori's standing over them to knock his ass off, and as a result does it anyway slightly earlier than they wake up to grab their RC reversal attempts?

    Sounds cool either way.

    The only catch to that I might say(or guess as you're better with Frames), is Iori's Scum Gale vs Kyo's "Issetsu Seoi Nage" is that Kyo could only do that once Blanka got up, and it'd come out as a s.HK unless he waited those 7 frames right? Unless Blanka's reversal RC electricties came out instead, with reversal timing it looks like it'd beat the kickthrow either way.

    You're right though, get the other guy to blockin and eating counter-hits he'd be susceptible to a kickthrow here and there. The windows of opportunity here in those instances are very small anyway, fast paced. To mash on RC electricity in these instances mustn't be so easy as some said because even mashing it takes precision right?
    kcxj wrote:
    Whenever I block RC elec, I either...

    1. Continue blocking and look to see if Blanka does anything other than d.HK

    or

    2. dp+LP against Blanka's limb when he tries to follow up . (won't work if he linked his d.HK within three frame window)

    I never try to jump away or let go of my low block, and I certainly never try to hit Blanka with a d.MP after blocking HP elec though. Am I even in range for d.MP after blocking anyway?

    Actually I didn't know it was +10, alls I knew was if whiffed Electricity was certainly punishable thanks to some framedata I read on here somewheres. Actually I think that was one of your posts. Like 13 frames recovery or somesuch.

    I meant I always go for JD's if Blanka's that close, if I guessed right I keep up the rhythm and JD all the hits and punish with d.MP (Think you could s.HK too in that instance) If I guessed wrong I'd be blocking anyway and taking more guard crush and chip from this green bastard. Problem was when he mixed up and threw. Never landed d.MP after blocking but after reading this I guess there's no point. :sweat: Thx.

    SOOOO

    Of the two options you mentioned you do blocking elec. You could keep blocking, which seems like the end result would be block electricity and d.HK (in that 3 frame window) or a nicely timed reversal dp+Lp which can get stuffed by that very same d.HK?

    Sounds like a lot of options are removed if Blanka's on the offensive with that shit. You mentioned far s.HK xx cloud super, (I remember that the tip of his foot is invincible right?) could you retaliate with that after blocking the whole string?
    kcxj wrote:

    I bet you could do max range d.MP xx up kicks on Blanka mashing elec too since there's an invincible hitbox at the tip of Kyo's first. I didn't test it, but I have a feeling the MK upkicks won't reach though...

    That seems kinda cool, I'll try this out and see how that works.
    kcxj wrote:
    You can do the same thing with K-groove JD by tapping d/b for a split second as you get up, immediately hit d.LP afterwards to do option select JD RC elec/throw counter.

    Now that sounds interesting. I didn't think K-Kyo had option selects like P-Kyo did.

    Hey thanks for the input. It's rare for me to fight top-end A-groove teams now-a-days. It still looks like that in the end though point blank, Blanka effectively makes the match even..:xeye:
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    ragnafrak wrote:
    walking out of close s.HK range to get far s.HK is of course great since it will beat almost all of his normals.

    I know theory fighter could be a bitch, but couldn't RC Blanka on reaction hop through whiffed s.HK and punish with a CC?
    (Just saying he see's the startup and mashes it)

    c.MP can be good against c.HP if you time it well. whiffing c.MPs at his max c.HP range is good, buffer qcf+HP and if it counterhits you can connect a HP rekka chain.

    That's cool. APOC says he invented that years ago, the technique of buffering specials/supers on good pokes like Eagle's d.MK for counterhits.
    Never actually incorporated this into my game... Too stuck on walking d.LK's. Looks good, no risk and tip of Kyo's fist is Godly after all...

    What are some good counterhit-setups to get at c.HP max range?
    Maybe kickthrow, walk back slightly bit d.MP?
    Kickkthrow, d.LK (can one short reach at that range?) d.MP?
    Walk up d.LK x 3 *pause* d.MP?

    Or maybe just kickthrow and meaty d.MP? If Blanka wakes with electricity shouldn't this move counter-hit just because of the invincible tip? Even if he blocks it and you cancel into qcf+HP you can go into his fierce rekka mixups so its all good, especially at the closing of a match right?
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    Hellion wrote:
    Of the two options you mentioned you do blocking elec. You could keep blocking, which seems like the end result would be block electricity and d.HK (in that 3 frame window) or a nicely timed reversal dp+Lp which can get stuffed by that very same d.HK?
    If you get swept trying trying dp+LP, that means your DP didn't come out at all. You must of let go of low block by accident when you inputted your f, d, df joystick motion.

    There's no stuffing involved.

    Whenever Blanka does d.HK at the exact same time Kyo does dp+LP, Kyo will always win, period.

    What I meant was that the Blanka player doesn't always perfectly link his d.HK after a blocked HP elec within that three frame window though. That's why it's a good idea sometimes to attempt to dp+LP Blanka's anticipated d.HK or input a JD attempt.
    Hellion wrote:
    You're right though, get the other guy to blockin and eating counter-hits he'd be susceptible to a kickthrow here and there. The windows of opportunity here in those instances are very small anyway, fast paced. To mash on RC electricity in these instances mustn't be so easy as some said because even mashing it takes precision right?
    A throw is a throw. I use a throw as an attempt to do damage to people when I anticipate that they will block. Other than when you're trying to throw a wake-up RC electricity attempt, I can't think of any real significant instances where it makes a difference whether you used the punch throw or the kick throw. I DO know that kick throw has just as much range as the punch throw but leaves you in much better position than the punch throw does though.
    Hellion wrote:
    Actually I didn't know it was +10, alls I knew was if whiffed Electricity was certainly punishable thanks to some framedata I read on here somewheres. Actually I think that was one of your posts. Like 13 frames recovery or somesuch.
    The HP elec is +10 on the BLOCK. Blanka gets to move ten frames before you do while you're still stuck in block stun.

    If he whiffs the RC elec, you can punish it like you would whiff punish any other whiffed move. Just be quick about it since Blanka's whiff animation IS very short (but still punishable never the less.)
    Hellion wrote:
    Sounds like a lot of options are removed if Blanka's on the offensive with that shit. You mentioned far s.HK xx cloud super, (I remember that the tip of his foot is invincible right?) could you retaliate with that after blocking the whole string?
    Blanka is at -3 after you block his d.HK.

    You can't punish him for that.

    So no, you don't have any guaranteed retaliations after Blanka does that HP elec (blocked), d.HK string on you.

    Even when you JD the d.HK, Kyo still doesn't have a move that reaches in time to get a guaranteed hit on Blanka. If would be sweet if you could do Kyo far s.HK xx super after JDing the sweep like you can with K-Sagat's JD, four frame d.MK xx super, but you can't.

    The Kyo far s.HK is too slow at seven frame startup.

    ==========

    Blanka's RC hop move sucks and only scrubs do that, so I don't know why you're theory fightering about that move. I'm not the slightest bit afraid of that LAGGY RC command hop and neither should you be as well. I HOPE my opponent likes to do it randomly on me actually, so I can destroy him for it.

    I also don't know ANY good Blanka players that mash on s.HK at close range btw in response to the Ragnafrak post. Again, that's some useless theory fighter stuff and I was just sayin'...

    ... you never know when your opponent might go random on you though, or if you're using d.LK TOO much, he might catch on and randomly throw out a close s.HK just to keep you honest.

    I would hardly call Blanka's s.HK a move that makes this match totally suck for Kyo and "shut down" his low short game though.


    Why are you guys even responding to year old epsilon posts if you're just going to make some "blah, blah, blah" comments (literally)? :rofl:
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    kcxj wrote:

    So no, you don't have any guaranteed retaliations after Blanka does that HP elec (blocked), d.HK string on you.
    Damn. That sucks.
    So dp+LP is it?
    Would that buy Kyo enough time to go on the offensive against A-Blanka, with save fall and all?
    Or try to back away after the whole string and play the match again typical Kyo-like, careful 'til you get the knockdown?
    kcxj wrote:

    Blanka's RC hop move sucks and only scrubs do that, so I don't know why you're theory fightering about that move.

    Sorry, I don't see vids often and I've never fought good A-Blankas. Just scrub A-Blankas that abuse all his RC's. The only character I'm able to fight him with and defeat is a highly offensive Nakoruru, and I attribute that to their lack of experience fighting her.
    In my experience if my Kyo beats that A-Blanka, he usually defeats the whole team and I believe then that the guy doesn't really know how to play against Kyo when he's on the offensive and I'm not really learning anything.

    My best bet is to head to SVGL this New Years vacation (I'm stuck in Mississippi)
    And play the most games I can before I come back here and vegetate some more.
    Unless there's any competition at all within driving distance, which I doubt. Florida maybe? Texas?
    kcxj wrote:
    Why are you guys even responding to year old epsilon posts if you're just going to make some "blah, blah, blah" comments (literally)? :rofl:

    Well, I was just responding to Ragnafrak. I am starting to piece together all the posts you've done on Kyo (yeah I read them all) and understand plenty of what you can do to Blanka at range, but with Kyo's up close and personal game it looks like all A-Blanka's got to do is just RC Electricity away and hope with a smile on his ugly mug. It almost litterally looks like the only thing he needs to do to make Kyo think more.

    Actually now that I think on it JDing the electricities isn't hard, if you knock his ass down and stand over him in your experience would he be inclined to RC elec on wake up till you punish him consistently for it? Hell multiple JD's to kickthrow for instance?

    Another Angle
    I found the thread on RCing the electricity in general discussion, was wondering how good exactly Kyo can walk d.LK's (OR d.LP's) on his ass. The timing is very strict I would imagine, dealing Kyo's frame advantage vs Blanka's 2 frame jabs to RC electricities here.
    Just gotta land that first d.Lk/d.LP when Blanka's standing up.

    Sorry if I am frustrating you here with the questions and all. Just wanted to come up to speed so I'm not throwing all my money away when I do visit Cali.:wonder:
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    qcf+MK, MK

    I saw what Buk posted about this move, so I tested it against Sagat, Yamazaki, Geese, Zangief and found out some stuff.

    Sagat

    This was the most interesting of them.

    Poke wise, Kyo can tag Sagat with the second hit of this move and throw out a far s.MP or d.MP (if he's close enough) and counter-hit everything Sagat has.

    DP wise, Jab/strong DP's trade counter hits, but Fierce always beats Kyo there. Haven't tried going low with d.MK, but I would imagine the results would be worse off due to its slightly slower startup.

    Just due to the fierce DP, I imagine reversal Supers would naturally do the same.

    Geese

    Poke wise, I couldn't get his close s.LK to come out on one his of the lift kicks, so I had Kyo do it closer and go for a d.MP, and of course Geese would counterhit. Tried having Kyo do s.LP, d.LK, etc. Results were similar, but slightly sporadic. Counterhits would go either way. Timing must be on point here.

    Yamazaki

    Poke wise, I'm not too familiar with the speeds of Yamazaki's pokes, but I was almost sure he had slower moves than Kyo had. Just mashing s.LP seemed to counter-hit Kyo all the time no matter what Kyo pushed. Dunno if this has to do with the characters height vs Kyo's height or anything and he might've been simply poking Kyo's arm past the assaulting hitbox. I dunno.

    Reversal Grab super always landed.

    Zangief

    Poke wise, I didn't bother. I just went for reversal SPD's, beat Kyo every time. Maybe though I could go for a super so the flash and invincibility will have SPD whiff and punish Gief for it, seems like it'd work. What if he RC's 360+K and gets the walking grab? Dunno yet but it could best Kyo there.


    Blanka

    I know Buk said Sagat sized characters, I tried on Blanka anyway due to many people on SRK calling him a "fatty" due t to hitbox size.

    He could of course duck it. I block standing anyway.
    Responded with the d.LP, s.LP and counter-hits were in his favor of course.:bluu:

    Will try some more stuff and update the post later on.
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • Legendary GokouLegendary Gokou 210Nem Joined: Posts: 2,087 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    Honestly speaking, I wouldn't use the move on anyone other than Sagat and maybe Geese. You want to space the move out so that the first one whiffs, second doesn't.
    CFN: 210Nem
    SFV Karin
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    I don't know if it makes a serious difference or not (since the frame data isn't listed), but are you sure Buk said the qcf+MK, MK move and not the qcf+LK, LK version?

    My friend Ness does this guard pattern/trap on me whenever I have Geese or Sagat and it's really, really annoying. I don't know exactly what he presses, but I'm in the corner and he does like d.LK, d.MP xx qcf+LK, LK, far s.MP xx qcf+MK, MK, walk forward and do something into the qcf+K, K moves again. If I try to hit any button whenever he's canceling into the upkicks, I get counter hit and juggled into super. If I try to hit any button after blocking the second hit of the light upkicks, I get hit by counter hit far s.MP xx upkicks.


    I don't think Kyo can do anything after JDing HP electricity either, at least not that I know of. I don't know what the frame data is after Blanka's HP elec gets JD'd (and I don't feel like doing the math either), but just from playing experience, JD every hit, Kyo kick throw (5 frame startup) does not sound guaranteed at all. I try to do Kyo d.LP (3 frame startup) after JDing every hit and Blanka is still able to block every time. Whenever Blanka is able to block, that pretty much means he's able to counter your throw attempt with his d.LK combos. I think he's STILL in frame advantage even after you JD all the hits of his HP elec even, so he might even be able to counter hit you for attempting JD, d.LP.

    But yeah, usually go for a throw attempt after JDing Blanka's HP electricity. Either that or keep inputting JDs to hope that Blanka is mashing on sweep (which I CAN punish with d.MP xx combo at such close range).


    I actually feel that P-Kyo is the best Kyo to use now, especially against Blanka.

    P-Kyo gets GUARANTEED far s.HK xx super everytime after parrying a Blanka d.HK. He also gets a guaranteed free dp+HP after JDing two hits of the RC electricity.

    To be honest, I don't even use my supers that often with K-Kyo anyway. I feel I get more damage out of doing the punch combos when I'm raged than doing one big long combo and burning my meter all in one shot.

    The only significant advantage K-Kyo has over P-Kyo I can think of right now is that JDing the slide is a LOT easier and safer than parrying the slide. It doesn't matter whether you JD or parry either, Kyo gets a free combo both ways.


    If your friend is running through your whole team with A-Blanka, learn to beat him up right here and right now then. :badboy:

    The RC hop has serious lag at the end when Blanka lands. You get a FREE d.LP combo every single time. It's only when Blanka does the f, f dash is when it's easy to get caught by random RC electricity or counter hit d.LK.

    To counter the f, f dash, either tap on low shorts or jabs to hit Blanka out of the air every time (what OTK likes to do). Or attempt to throw Blanka after he lands (which will counter both his RC elec and his slow d.LK)

    To counter the RC command hop, stay outside the range of Blanka's crouching fierce and randomly stick out your d.MP's to counter Blanka's random slides. If Blanka jumps at you, you absolutely MUST anti-air him always. Use either your dp+HP or close s.MK if he's too close for dp+HP. What you're looking to do is to make Blanka impatient and try to get in with a RC command hop. COMBO HIS ASS once you see him do it.

    You can tell the difference between the command hops and the f, f, dashes because Blanka makes a noise whenever he does the command hop.

    If Blanka comes right at you aggressively with the RC command hop as soon as the match starts, great, you don't need to do any work.

    If he's sitting there and charging first, sticking out d.HP whenever you get close, that's when you need to play a little more patient. Some things you can do other than stick out d.MP and wait to anti-air are...

    -walk forward to poke with the max range of far s.HK (whenever you feel you can get away with it)
    -low jump regular HP (not the air d+HP move) to get in
    -low jump MK from far, rdp+LK move when you land
    -whiff Kyo s.LP, walk back to try and bait Blanka into sticking out his d.HP (and whiffing), kick Blanka's arm with your d.HK
    -Mexican Kyo special --> randomly stick out far s.MP buffered into qcf+LP. If the far s.MP whiffs, that's fine, nothing happens. If the far s.MP random HITS one of Blanka's limbs, you automatically cancel into qcf+LP and get a free combo.

    Have training mode? Good. Go, go, go!


    Don't worry about all the questions. :rofl:

    I just wouldn't answer them if they were bothering me. The discussion (without random swears and people I've never met in my life calling me a "http://dontevenreply.com";) is nice actually.


    My friend Juan (VDO) is in Alabama until December 31 for his work. He's one of the most hardcore gamers I've ever met in my life though. I don't know if you want to try and hook up with him or not (since so close to holidays), but it's worth it to play games with him. I always have a lot of fun, and P-Raiden is a damn stupid cheapass too. :tup:
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    Honestly speaking, I wouldn't use the move on anyone other than Sagat and maybe Geese. You want to space the move out so that the first one whiffs, second doesn't.

    Oh I just skimmed through all this and some complained against Yamazaki being hard and was just experimenting on different ways to get in 'tis all. It's deceptively hard to see coming because it's somewhat fast.

    Yeah I programmed Kyo to back dash twice, run forward slightly and cancelled it into qcf+MK, MK, although I read what kcxj said and feel stupid so far as misreading what Buk posted.

    At least though the counter-hit thing vs Sagat was favorable to Kyo though
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    kcxj wrote:
    I don't know if it makes a serious difference or not (since the frame data isn't listed), but are you sure Buk said the qcf+MK, MK move and not the qcf+LK, LK version?
    Yeah I made a mistake there:looney: I read Buk's post too fast. I thought it was worth the test though. I am sure the results would be different since he said LK lift kicks were safe.
    kcxj wrote:
    My friend Ness does this guard pattern/trap on me whenever I have Geese or Sagat and it's really, really annoying.
    Since it looks like the first hit of the lift kicks must whiff for this to work, his goal is to get close and play frame advantage and push him out enough so the first hit whiffs with fast jabs/shorts ending with the d.MP then? Looks cool to do it twice. It looks like a really interesting move to incorporate especially if it works against a top tier really well.
    I just thought anything vs Sagat, Geese, Yama was worth looking into. Does look risky though.
    kcxj wrote:
    I don't think Kyo can do anything after JDing HP electricity either, at least not that I know of.
    :bluu:
    kcxj wrote:
    But yeah, usually go for a throw attempt after JDing Blanka's HP electricity. Either that or keep inputting JDs to hope that Blanka is mashing on sweep (which I CAN punish with d.MP xx combo at such close range).
    :rock:
    kcxj wrote:
    I actually feel that P-Kyo is the best Kyo to use now, especially against Blanka.

    P-Kyo gets GUARANTEED far s.HK xx super everytime after parrying a Blanka d.HK. He also gets a guaranteed free dp+HP after JDing two hits of the RC electricity.
    Could Kyo parry the d.HK even with the +10 on Blanka's side due to P-groove being able to parry 1 frame before blocking? It doesn't sound like it's possible but since Blanka's got that 3 frame window thing going on I wanted to clarify. It that's the case then just Blocking the whole HP electricity andn d.HK would be cake (Just gotta get used to P-Nako:nunchuck: )
    kcxj wrote:
    To be honest, I don't even use my supers that often with K-Kyo anyway.
    It's fun doing it that way just because of the "psycological" thing going on during the rage. His mixups seemingly become slightly more effective just because.
    kcxj wrote:
    What you're looking to do is to make Blanka impatient and try to get in with a RC command hop. COMBO HIS ASS once you see him do it.

    So in short Blanka here's completely vulnerable to reprisals if he tries to RC Hop or dash. Try to keep him out and make him try to get in? Heh.
    kxcj wrote:
    -Mexican Kyo special

    Have training mode? Good. Go, go, go!
    Gotta see how the Mexican Kyo special holds up on trades with d.HP, would it trade as the poke comes out or nothing really damaging happens? Of course the trade'd be in Blanka's favor damage wise, what's the distancing they normally do this at, so Kyo's fist would tag Blanka's arm, etc. I'll find out as soon as I can and all, visiting a buddy's house and he's got me out drinking and partying for X-Mas.
    kcxj wrote:
    I just wouldn't answer them if they were bothering me. The discussion (without random swears and people I've never met in my life calling me a "http://dontevenreply.com";) is nice actually.
    Well, this is information I feel people could actually use, and Kyo's a pretty strong character in CvS2, just gotta be played differently than most other "top tiers." I feel this matchup in particular with K/P Kyo vs A-Blanka being particularly the most inportant because I don't think K-Blanka stands too much of a chance if Kyo gets his game going. (Well, of course he does being top tier and all, but so far as Kyo goes you know)

    Besides I hate flame wars and stupid posts. If no one contributes anything worthwhile in the post, why post at all except to see how pretty your avatar is?:rofl:
    kcxj wrote:
    My friend Juan (VDO) is in Alabama until December 31 for his work.
    Isn't he the "Rushdown God?":wonder: I'd be glad to play and see how far I've come along since I first picked up the game seriously like in '03. Unfortunately I won't be able to because I'm flying out of town to visit wife and family and friends in Cali... Too bad Alabama's not even on the return trip when I bring my car over:sweat: It'd be cool to try to see how I stack up.

    Hey thanks again for the info, I'll brainstorm some more scenario's between Kyo/Blanka if I can. Meantime here's to the New Years:badboy:
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    My friend taught me something which I thought was pretty cool today. To counter Blanka using RC electricity as he gets up...

    -walk back out of range, d.MP xx combo the recovery of Blanka's RC electricity

    Even if Blanka continues mashing, the tip of Kyo's d.MP is invincible and will counter hit the mashing Blanka clean.

    I find this MUCH easier than trying to time a kick throw (which also works) as Blanka gets up all the time. After landing a punch chain combo (and assuming you used the whiff hcb+LK to chase after the body), Kyo is left in just as powerful wakeup game situation as he is after landing a kick throw also.
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    I've done that on training mode before, guess it involves a little baiting before you walk back otherwise you'll be doing it too late and end up blocking...

    Suppose his back dash puts him in similar range?
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • Legendary GokouLegendary Gokou 210Nem Joined: Posts: 2,087 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    kcxj wrote:
    My friend taught me something which I thought was pretty cool today. To counter Blanka using RC electricity as he gets up...

    -walk back out of range, d.MP xx combo the recovery of Blanka's RC electricity

    Even if Blanka continues mashing, the tip of Kyo's d.MP is invincible and will counter hit the mashing Blanka clean.

    I find this MUCH easier than trying to time a kick throw (which also works) as Blanka gets up all the time. After landing a punch chain combo (and assuming you used the whiff hcb+LK to chase after the body), Kyo is left in just as powerful wakeup game situation as he is after landing a kick throw also.

    If you're using the tip, would the only combo you can do is the punch chain one? I know he could probably do qcf lk, but I think Blanka can recover in time to block cr mp xx qcf mk mk if you hit by the tip.
    CFN: 210Nem
    SFV Karin
  • HellionHellion .5 Beat Combat Joined: Posts: 888
    Think the timing's more strict. Sure as hell isn't as easy as qcf+LK.

    I was doing some thinking on and off the holidays, forgot to post this everytime I looked here. Was wondering how would rdp+LK work in that string following HP electricities? Would Kyo clear the sweep on the 1st frame and tag Blanka's sweep, thus getting his knockdown? Looks fast enough.
    "No one quits SRK. NO ONE" -wepeel
    P-Kyo(2), Guile, Cammy
    ST-Guile
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    I'm just started on K Kyo so pls don't flame me ok. I need some tips and strategies (up close, long range, aggressive and turtling players) against Vega, Chun li, shotokans, Ryo S., Blanka, Sagat and A Sakura. pls note that i'm not that hot on JDing everything and which ratio is better for K Kyo? thanks!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    My friend Ness does this guard pattern/trap on me whenever I have Geese or Sagat and it's really, really annoying. I don't know exactly what he presses, but I'm in the corner and he does like d.LK, d.MP xx qcf+LK, LK, far s.MP xx qcf+MK, MK, walk forward and do something into the qcf+K, K moves again.

    c.LKx3, c.HP xx qcf+LK,K (mashed c.LK vs thinner)
    c.MP, c.LK(or the first 2 moves reversed), c.HP xx qcf+LK,K

    i think there's also a way to set it up using far s.MP but it would probably only work on geese or something

    if you're K/P you can parry/JD the last hit and beat kyo up, or activate through, level2 etc
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    guys i need more links to makoto videos since i only saw one. I'm a recent P groove convert and I need to see more of Kyo in P groove. thanks.
  • xX_Deus_XxxX_Deus_Xx ItsCool2BeDismissive Joined: Posts: 2,579
    no asking for vids LOLZ JOIN DATE SEP 2006 LOSER!

    www.crazyasskim.com
    Have fun, and be safe with it.

    Just kidding. Fuck shit up.
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    thanks for the link. i joined in lately cuz my old username and password isn't working, so i created a new account instead. man makoto can really abuse those option selects with cammy and that match against sagat was a hoot! that sagat player was outmatched throughout the game! did you see makoto's new match videos in youtube? that was really good.
  • SonickunSonickun myspace.com/sonic_k Joined: Posts: 40
    Kyo vs Blanka

    I find that fighting Blanka can be extremely difficult. I find it very hard to get in on Blanka mainly because of his reach. It's very hard for my Kyo to create situations where I can capitalize. Whenever Kyo tries to get in on Blanka, Blanka rebuttles with a nasty c.hp :mad:

    You guys got any tips for me cuz I'm stuck when it comes to a nicely played Blanka.

    Random things I have figured out:

    - After a blocked blanka ball, do: qcf mp, qcf mp, k. This is (from what I've experimented on) the only way that Kyo can hurt Blanka over a blocked blanka ball.

    - Kyo's down forward+kick doesn't seems quite reliable on getting in on Blanka when he's just sitting their for time to run out.

    kyo's :bdp: lk or mk works on blanka becuase the blanka user is usually charging blanka:df: for a blankball or air ball, after da knockdown move in for a low jumping mix up game..but he'd had to a very slow player not see da mk one coming
    Initial D
    Wangan midnight!!
  • SystemSystem Joined: Posts: 508,676 admin
    kyo's :bdp: lk or mk works on blanka becuase the blanka user is usually charging blanka:df: for a blankball or air ball, after da knockdown move in for a low jumping mix up game..but he'd had to a very slow player not see da mk one coming

    this is an excellent strategy.

    for versions without rollcanceling.... or xbox live.
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    kyo vs chun li?

    tough match for kyo imo.

    he cant stop j.lk crossup without super super early s.mk at some ranges.

    he gets sbk trapped

    c.lp counter hit/throw games generally annoy him. 2 frame c.jab means you have to time your counter hit setups perfectly.

    her walk speed is extremely fast.

    kyo j.lk is good against her sometimes... idk this matchup is pretty hard, she is difficult to anti air, and her up close game is faster than yours.

    k groove btw, p groove is much much easier in this matchup because option select down parry makes her truly not mash on c.jab.
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • Legendary GokouLegendary Gokou 210Nem Joined: Posts: 2,087 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    kyo vs chun li?

    tough match for kyo imo.

    he cant stop j.lk crossup without super super early s.mk at some ranges.

    he gets sbk trapped

    c.lp counter hit/throw games generally annoy him. 2 frame c.jab means you have to time your counter hit setups perfectly.

    her walk speed is extremely fast.

    kyo j.lk is good against her sometimes... idk this matchup is pretty hard, she is difficult to anti air, and her up close game is faster than yours.

    k groove btw, p groove is much much easier in this matchup because option select down parry makes her truly not mash on c.jab.


    Chun li's floaty jump makes it easy to react to. I always keep an eye on the distance and try to avoid the space where Chun-li gets a deep cross up. If its not well spaced you can do hcb+p for DP cross up.

    SBK trap does suck. I think I'm going to start option selecting down+fierce in P groove. I'd much rather get hit by it then have it take away a good chunk of guard crush. Its more ideal to see st fierce xx SBK though.

    I don't really use j lk against Chun li too much. Although I have admittingly used it after doing rekkas, spacing it as a deep cross up.
    CFN: 210Nem
    SFV Karin
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    smart chuns dont jump like full screen, im talking about around just outside of kyo's max df+hk range.

    its difficult to do anything about, you cant dp it at that range, your dp will either straight up lose, or go too far forward and whiff. also at this range s.mk will usually lose, unless done really really early.
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • Legendary GokouLegendary Gokou 210Nem Joined: Posts: 2,087 ✭✭✭✭✭ OG
    If you feel you're in a bad spot, then I'd consider defensive options.

    Dash/run forward

    jump straight up (JD, parry, air block, or take the air hit to reset the situation)

    walk forward (with a fat cross up like Chuns, may force you to block)
    CFN: 210Nem
    SFV Karin
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    i dont like any of those options.

    i might try run under, but remember im talking about k kyo.

    anything involving taking a hit seems pretty gay to me.
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • scrubydanscrubydan Moetaro? Joined: Posts: 2,638
    the only ways i can think of is to zone her enough to make her jump or roll. if she gets in and try to do jab links or fierce into bird kick, uppercut
    "how dare these mother fuckers try to be on my level. i will eat your babies!" - ATM SPIDERTAO
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    yeah...i tried out some stuff today in training mode.

    first...running under doesn't work at all, you not only get hit, but running counts as a counter hit so...yeah it's a terrible "option".

    couple things.

    s.mk works as a great anti air from a distance, it will usually beat j.lk clean from that distance, but against most j.lk's won't com from there.

    at a certain timing, you can c.mp (sorta like hf guile c.mp) and it will trade (in kyo's favor). also jump back rh works at times.

    as far as attacking chun li, low jump fp is really good, if at any thing except max (or close to max) range of chun li c.rh, low jump fierce wins. (however she can anti air you for free with s.mp)

    low jump rh will beat her non super early s.mp (but she can anti air you with c.mp for free).
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • LionxLionx Do the Stun Super! Joined: Posts: 925
    Theoretically i always ran in my head that if you see the jump comming, you can dash backward and uppercut, and at worse you will just air reel backwards resetting it. But thats all theory..-_-;

    i dont know if c.hp whiffs/is quick enough or not. You can also JD => Throw maybe.

    /random
    CvS2: (C-Ryu, Terry, Rolento; K- Rolento, Geese, Kyo.) + Sagat/Cammy
    KoFXIII - Andy, Terry, Maxima ; BB: Tao >:3
    My IPlayWinner Article on CvS2: http://tinyurl.com/83dv74g
    High Level CvS2 vlog: http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=Lionx
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    c.fp will get beaten clean vs j.lk at most angles...not a move to press.
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • HeaTBlaznHeaTBlazn Rameo Joined: Posts: 897
    Ive been thinking about kyo bnb c.lk c.lk c.mp xx rekka.
    and Ive been wondering if I can just switch it up to c.lk c.lk c.hp xx fierce rekka.

    I mean why not? more damage more guard break roughly same range.

    frame data help please.
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    i dont think c.fp would reach and still combo at that range, also not sure if it would even link, the c.mp alone is a 2 frame link normally, and that move is pretty fast.
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • HeaTBlaznHeaTBlazn Rameo Joined: Posts: 897
    actually it does connect.
    I started practicing it in training mode.
    a little tougher to combo but alot mroe rewarding.
  • scrubydanscrubydan Moetaro? Joined: Posts: 2,638
    actually it does connect.
    I started practicing it in training mode.
    a little tougher to combo but alot mroe rewarding.

    lol it combos, and i thought just the same way as u do a year back, but no.

    first fierce rekka on block is not safe, ppl with fast super can hit you. like blanka super. 2nd rekka on block is not safe either, ppl can punish u too. i.e. rock's cr.mk into fierce hard edge. both of them are punishable. so stick with mp into jab rekka.

    cr.fierce has lots of lag time also if u whiff, if u try to combo into jab rekka there are several times it pushes back too much and doesn't combo. so only use cr.fierce into fierce rekka as punisher on certain things.
    "how dare these mother fuckers try to be on my level. i will eat your babies!" - ATM SPIDERTAO
  • epsilon_epsilon_ helpful Joined: Posts: 3,582
    2nd hit fierce rekka is +1

    .
    i don't care what the critics say, violence is a beauuutiful thing!
  • HeaTBlaznHeaTBlazn Rameo Joined: Posts: 897
    so its pretty much safe unless I go on something with 1 frame start up?

    I see the valid points. I might as well mix it up if I confirm the 2 shorts.

    thanks guys.
2
Sign In or Register to comment.